A bone-snapping grappler build?

[Greywander]

I have a concept for a character who just really likes breaking things. Not necessarily because they're a violent person, but more so because he just finds the snap, crack, or crunch they make so satisfying. Actually fairly intelligent, he's studied the acoustic properties of different materials, as well as of different bones for different creatures. His reason to go adventuring is to find new and exotic materials and creatures, and then break them to see what kind of sound they make.

Naturally, this suggests a grappler build, where he can snap necks and limbs to his heart's content. I'm not really sure how best to build this, though. I can refluff unarmed strikes as snapping bones, but it won't have any effect other than dealing damage. I don't, for example, have the option to break an arm to render it unusable, or to break a leg to slow someone down. And even if I could snap a neck, there aren't really any rules for instant death attacks, so it would just do normal damage.

I kind of want to stay non-magical, but I might be able to be talked out of this. Since you can't Sneak Attack with unarmed strikes (sadly), this means probably either fighter or barbarian. I'm looking at Rune Knight, and while I'm not sure if the flavor fits the concept, it seems like it was built for grappling. Beast barbarian can handle unarmed strikes nicely without needing the fighting style, but doesn't seem to have anything that benefits grappling aside from Rage. Athletics expertise can be obtained from either a rogue dip or Skill Expert feat.

Also, I'm noticing that the Rune Knight's Giant's Might doesn't use concentration, which instantly sets it apart from Rage (which prevents concentrating on spells) and Enlarge/Reduce (which uses concentration). This would allow me to grab Hex from somewhere to impose disadvantage on my target's grapple checks, as well as boosting my damage, all while still increasing my size (up to huge!) and giving myself advantage on grapple checks. This would work particularly well on a straight fighter, as the bonus damage from Hex applies to each attack. The only problem is I'd need a BA for both Giant's Might and Hex, so I can't use them both on the same turn.

What are some other things I could do? The Grappler's Manual hasn't been updated in a while, so a lot of its info is outdated. I'm also still not sure how to get something mechanically that gives the feeling of snapping the bones of my foes. Hmm, I suppose something like Battle Master maneuvers might be able to do this, but I'm just not a big fan of Battle Master.

[ftafp]

I have a concept for a character who just really likes breaking things. Not necessarily because they're a violent person, but more so because he just finds the snap, crack, or crunch they make so satisfying. Actually fairly intelligent, he's studied the acoustic properties of different materials, as well as of different bones for different creatures. His reason to go adventuring is to find new and exotic materials and creatures, and then break them to see what kind of sound they make.

Naturally, this suggests a grappler build, where he can snap necks and limbs to his heart's content. I'm not really sure how best to build this, though. I can refluff unarmed strikes as snapping bones, but it won't have any effect other than dealing damage. I don't, for example, have the option to break an arm to render it unusable, or to break a leg to slow someone down. And even if I could snap a neck, there aren't really any rules for instant death attacks, so it would just do normal damage.

I kind of want to stay non-magical, but I might be able to be talked out of this. Since you can't Sneak Attack with unarmed strikes (sadly), this means probably either fighter or barbarian. I'm looking at Rune Knight, and while I'm not sure if the flavor fits the concept, it seems like it was built for grappling. Beast barbarian can handle unarmed strikes nicely without needing the fighting style, but doesn't seem to have anything that benefits grappling aside from Rage. Athletics expertise can be obtained from either a rogue dip or Skill Expert feat.

Also, I'm noticing that the Rune Knight's Giant's Might doesn't use concentration, which instantly sets it apart from Rage (which prevents concentrating on spells) and Enlarge/Reduce (which uses concentration). This would allow me to grab Hex from somewhere to impose disadvantage on my target's grapple checks, as well as boosting my damage, all while still increasing my size (up to huge!) and giving myself advantage on grapple checks. This would work particularly well on a straight fighter, as the bonus damage from Hex applies to each attack. The only problem is I'd need a BA for both Giant's Might and Hex, so I can't use them both on the same turn.

What are some other things I could do? The Grappler's Manual hasn't been updated in a while, so a lot of its info is outdated. I'm also still not sure how to get something mechanically that gives the feeling of snapping the bones of my foes. Hmm, I suppose something like Battle Master maneuvers might be able to do this, but I'm just not a big fan of Battle Master.


The problem is that 5e doesn't really have a robust system that supports breaking limbs. At best you can gain short-duration debuffs that wear off after like a round, but for a build like this to really work you might need a variant rule like the Lingering Injuries variant from the DMG. In that case, the solution is pretty simple, it would be a build focused on crit-fishing and grappling.

In that case, I'd suggest a Monk/Champion multiclass with feats to improve your critting and grappling like Elven Accuracy, Crusher, Skill Expert, and Grappler. The latter two you might be able to skip with a dip in Assassin, but grappler is actually serving a useful purpose in this case because combined with elven accuracy and the champion levels you'll have a 27% chance to crit on every attack against a grappled foe

[Unoriginal]

I have a concept for a character who just really likes breaking things. Not necessarily because they're a violent person, but more so because he just finds the snap, crack, or crunch they make so satisfying. Actually fairly intelligent, he's studied the acoustic properties of different materials, as well as of different bones for different creatures. His reason to go adventuring is to find new and exotic materials and creatures, and then break them to see what kind of sound they make.

Naturally, this suggests a grappler build, where he can snap necks and limbs to his heart's content. I'm not really sure how best to build this, though. I can refluff unarmed strikes as snapping bones, but it won't have any effect other than dealing damage. I don't, for example, have the option to break an arm to render it unusable, or to break a leg to slow someone down. And even if I could snap a neck, there aren't really any rules for instant death attacks, so it would just do normal damage.

I kind of want to stay non-magical, but I might be able to be talked out of this. Since you can't Sneak Attack with unarmed strikes (sadly), this means probably either fighter or barbarian. I'm looking at Rune Knight, and while I'm not sure if the flavor fits the concept, it seems like it was built for grappling. Beast barbarian can handle unarmed strikes nicely without needing the fighting style, but doesn't seem to have anything that benefits grappling aside from Rage. Athletics expertise can be obtained from either a rogue dip or Skill Expert feat.

Also, I'm noticing that the Rune Knight's Giant's Might doesn't use concentration, which instantly sets it apart from Rage (which prevents concentrating on spells) and Enlarge/Reduce (which uses concentration). This would allow me to grab Hex from somewhere to impose disadvantage on my target's grapple checks, as well as boosting my damage, all while still increasing my size (up to huge!) and giving myself advantage on grapple checks. This would work particularly well on a straight fighter, as the bonus damage from Hex applies to each attack. The only problem is I'd need a BA for both Giant's Might and Hex, so I can't use them both on the same turn.

What are some other things I could do? The Grappler's Manual hasn't been updated in a while, so a lot of its info is outdated. I'm also still not sure how to get something mechanically that gives the feeling of snapping the bones of my foes. Hmm, I suppose something like Battle Master maneuvers might be able to do this, but I'm just not a big fan of Battle Master.

The Unarmed Fighting Style allows you to deals damage over time to one creature you have grappled. Furthermore, as it is not attack damage, it bypasses all the resistances/immunities to non-magical weapon attacks (obviously it would not bypass straight resistance/immunity to all bludgeoning damage).

Main issue is that it only deals 1d4 damage, and there is no real way to improve it itself, but you could combine that with other damage over times effects. Or as you said combine it with regular Unarmed Strikes.

[JackPhoenix]

Main issue is that it only deals 1d4 damage, and there is no real way to improve it itself, but you could combine that with other damage over times effects. Or as you said combine it with regular Unarmed Strikes.

Hexblade's Curse works.

[Kane0]

Rune Knight + Beast Barbarian is a solid combo, dropping an ASI or level into Rogue for expertise.
Hell even drop the barbarian in favor of unarmed style fighter

[GeoffWatson]

Easy crippling attacks whenever you want would be too good.

You could say that when you defeat an enemy (ie reduce to 0hp) you break something serious, as nearly every enemy would be out of the fight after a broken arm/leg/neck.

[Wraith]

While posters above have suggested Hexblade for Hex and/or Hexblade's Curse, I would like to make a case for your Grapple-build to include 3 levels of Rogue for the Inquisitive subclass. The aim is to pick up the Insightful Fighting ability, which is the meat of the theme that you're going for.

Insightful Fighting allows you to make a Wisdom (Insight) check against your opponent's Charisma (Deception) skill, and if you succeed then you can always use your Sneak Attack against them so long as you aren't attacking with Disadvantage. To me this seems to fit your character very well - they know anatomy and enemies' weaknesses, and herein they are discerning their foe to determine the best way to hurt them and subsequently yank on something vital, with the Sneak Attack damage standing in for a torn ligament or broken bone.

Bolt this onto a normal Grappling chassis and I think you have a fairly straight forward route. Fighter 3/Rune Knight is excellent for this purpose, though most Fighter subclasses will work also - I personally like Eldritch Knight, though Enlarge doesn't come online until level 8 without it coming from another source. Include a race that gives you something good for purpose - Duergar for innate Enlarge (which stacks with Rune Knight as you only need to concentrate on one of them and not the other), Goliath for Powerful Build, Naga (from the Planeshift: Amonkhet .pdf) for innate auto-grappling attacks - then Grapple and 'Sneak Attack' them into oblivion every turn.

Might need to chat with your GM to make sure that Sneak Attack works with unarmed strikes, or otherwise flavour a dagger as spiked knuckles/a katar or something, but it's a minor thing that I would allow at my table so I don't foresee that it would cause any serious problems.

[Talionis]

If you are looking at variant rules, I’d see if your DM will allow unarmed strikes to use Sneak Attack. I’ve not seen a good argument why Sneak Attack on unarmed strikes is unbalanced.

[SteadyAim]

I would start by maybe thinking about how someone recovers from bone-snapping.

Does it require just regular healing, a Lesser Restoration, Greater Restoration, or Regeneration?

That will give you a sense of what level of spell effect we are talking about.

Then use spell level as the basis for when the bone snapping techniques are acquired by the character and how to simulate the effect. E.g. are these techniques basically paralysis? Speed drain? Strength drain?

[Greywander]

Insightful Fighting still requires a finesse weapon, so unarmed strikes are still a no-go. As far as breaking bones, it would probably require either variant or homebrew rules. Something like Battle Master maneuvers could be refluffed, but these don't seem to create the effects you'd expect from broken bones. There might be some other features that would create these types of effects that could be refluffed as breaking bones, so I'll have to look through the different classes and subclasses to see if I can find something.

For the concept given in the OP, barbarian probably works as a better base. I don't need to fluff Rage as, well, rage, it could be a purely mechanical effect with no associated fluff. I could go pure barbarian, and Totem (specifically bear) would probably work well. I can easily refluff it as just being really tough and good at breaking things. I can use feats to grab the fighting style and expertise, or skip the fighting style if I can get a natural weapon. It's not an optimal build, but it's pretty straightforward and perhaps the best fit for the concept.

For a multiclass build, if I intend to stay non-magical, then I'm pretty much restricted to barbarian, fighter, and rogue, which all happen to be fantastic grapplers. I'd probably want at least 5 levels in either barbarian or fighter for Extra Attack, at least 3 levels in the other of the two, and at least two levels in rogue for Cunning Action. Something like Bear barb 15/Battle Master fighter 3/rogue 2 would be fairly passable. Battle Master fighter lets me pick up the Unarmed fighting style, as well as a few maneuvers like Disarming Attack. Rogue of course gets Expertise and Cunning Action. Should be a pretty solid build. I only get three ASIs, but I think Mobile is the only feat I'd really need (Resilient (WIS) might also be handy).

I am interested in building a Rune Knight grappler, but I don't think it fits the concept so well, so I'll look into that separately. The Rune Knight's thing is being able to (basically) Enlarge yourself with only a bonus action and without using concentration. It only requires a 3 level dip into fighter, and makes small races viable grapplers. It should also stack with Enlarge/Reduce (DMs might rule otherwise, though), allowing you to become huge as early as 6th level. But you're probably better off combining it with something like Hex or Create Bonfire. I'll make a separate thread talking about the Rune Knight.