PDA

View Full Version : Optimization Spell and Meta Magic Selection Help: Storm Sorcerer - Air Genasi



KorvinStarmast
2021-01-28, 10:32 AM
I am establishing a level 6 Air Genasi Storm Sorcerer, and as usual am pulling my hair out regarding spell selection and meta magic choice. Built as a straight up Air Genasi (EE supplement) with Point buy. Narratively, in this campaign, the character's uncle is a Djinni. We have decided to adapt "pick one of two bonus spells" from a homebrew recently posted here at GiTP that expands on Tasha's bonus spells for sorcerers concept for each other sorcerous origin.

What I need help with: (1) can the spell selection be improved, and (2) which two meta magics are best for this character?
Answers that approach it from mechanical optimization and / or thematic optimization are welcome.
(Air Genasi get +2 Con and +1 Dex) - the Tasha origin was discussed but eventually decided against. {Not sure if I ought to have kept Mage Armor or not}.

Donnair. {Air Genasi (Noble) (Sorcerer; Storm Origin, clvl 6) {44 HP}. Walk: 30'}
S 8 D 16 C(p) 16 I 10 W 10 Ch(p) 16 (ASI @ Level 4 raised Ch by 2)
Sorc Skill Prof: Arcana, Insight; Noble: Skill Proficiencies: History, Persuasion; Gaming set (Dice)
Weapons Proficiency: Daggers, Darts, Slings, Quarterstaffs, light crossbow.
Languages: Common, Primordial, Draconic, Auran, Ignan (Since Genasi and Storm Sorcs both get Primordial, I threw in Auran and Ignan as additional languages. DM approved.
6' tall. 155#. Lean and fit. Hair is almost a whitish blond, but has light blue hints. Blue, blue eyes. Skin: very fair, with a bluish tinge around the lips. (Strangely, does not burn when out in the sun).

Notes before commenting:
a. The Noble background was specifically chosen for this PC for campaign reasons. He is a child of a younger daughter of a noble house who had a tendency toward scandal: mercurial in personality, she was serially unfaithful (arranged marriage ). A dalliance with a djinn resulted in this PC's birth. PC himself is a bit of a dilettante; was well educated (money from this 'mysterious uncle' always arrived on time for tuition payment) but is barely tolerated by the extended family. Tends to go off on archeological digs due to a lively curiousity, and, importantly, due to other relatives donating to the expeditions with the proviso that young Donnair be allowed to go along.
Personality:
No one could doubt by looking at my regal bearing that I am a cut above the unwashed masses.
If you do me an injury, I will crush you, ruin your name, and salt your fields.
Ideal: Independence. I must prove that I can handle myself without the coddling of my family. (Chaotic)
Bond: I will face any challenge to win the approval of my family.
Flaw: I secretly believe that everyone is beneath me.

Genasi Features:
A. Can hold breath indefinitely when not incapacitated.
B. Can cast levitate, requiring no material components, once per long rest. Spellcasting ability is CON.
Tempestuous Magic (1) As a Bonus Action: Cause Whirling gusts of elemental air to briefly surround me immediatelky before or after I cast a spell. using a spell slot. Can fly up to 10' without provoking opportunity attacks.
Storm Guide (6) Can subtly control the weather around me. If it is raining, can use an action to cause rain to stop falling within a 20' radius. End effect as a bonus action. If it is windy, can use a bonus action each round to choose the direction that the wind is blowing in a 100' radius sphere centered on me. Wind blows in that direction until end of my next turn. Does not change wind speed.
Heart of the Storm(6) Resistance to Lightning and Thunder damage. WHenver I start casting a spell with a slot that deals lightning or thunder damage, Stormy magic erupts from me. Causes creatures of my choice that I can see within 10' of me to take lightning or thunder damage (choose when activating this) equal to half of my sorcerer level.
Storm Sorcerer Bonus Spells: (free from Binder sorc origin concept)
(1) Fog Cloud, (2) Gust of Wind, (3) Call Lightning
Cantrips: Mind Sliver, Mage Hand, Light, Shocking Grasp, Ray of Frost
Spells Known: 7 (beyond the three bonus above)
(1) Thunderwave, Mage Armor; (2) Enlarge / Reduce; Hold Person, Scorching Ray (3) Hypnotic Pattern, Slow

Is there a better spell selection/suite?

Meta Magic: I'm at a loss.

The rest of the party:
Barbarian (Bear Totem)(Human); Devotion Paladin (Dragonborn, Gold); Battlemaster Fighter(Dwarf), Lore Bard(Half Elf); Drunken Master Monk (Wood Elf)

Most game sessions one of the above characters is missing.

Some blastiness, but mostly support, is what seems to be needed.

Who is this character?
Family owns land, collects taxes, and wields significant political influence but Don is viewed as a disinherited scoundrel with a disproportionate sense of entitlement. Well educated, likes to go off with archeologists on their digs. Dilettante
Is your family old and established? Yes.
How much influence do they wield, and over what area? To the east of the river some farmland, some timber holdings and a sawmill, some livestock breeding and production; also owns the local tannery.
What kind of reputation does your family have among the other aristocrats of the region? Good looking kids who tend to attract mid to low grade scandal, family is otherwise well regarded.
How do the common people regard them? "That lot are snobs, but they are honest snobs."
What’s your position in the family? Son of the Marquis' third daughter, a lady whose infidelity is an ingrained habit
Have you already inherited the title? No. Disinheireted.
How does the head of your family feel about your adventuring career? The money for school always came from "a rich uncle" who is a bit of a mysterious presence in Don's life. (A Djinni's brother is who sired this child).
Are you in your family’s good graces, or shunned by the rest of your family? Generally tolerated in limited amounts, always encouraged to go on the latest archeological dig; various relatives will contribute to fit out expeditions so that you are accepted by the team's lead.
Does your family have a coat of arms? Yes; falcon, flying, on a field azure
An insignia you might wear on a signet ring? No ring. Tatoo of a falcon on upper left arm.
Particular colors you wear all the time? Blue denim pants or blue cotton pants that a loose fitting (pirate pants). Ruffled shirts/pirate shirts: always. Fine Leather boots or sandals.
An animal you regard as a symbol of your line or even a spiritual member of the family? Falcon.

KorvinStarmast
2021-01-28, 12:35 PM
This time using a custom lineage (Djinni spawn) from Tasha's. While I was tempted to use the Archeologist Background from Tome of Annihilation, he's not actually an archeologist. He's a noble, and more of a dilettante. I can only have two meta magic: which two should I choose? (I intend to revisit this with DM over the weekend)

Feedback requested on: Feat choice(Shadow touched looked tempting, though I went skill expert) and meta magic choices.
------------------------------------
Zeb Donnair {Tasha Based Djinni-Spawn (Noble)}
Humanoid, Medium, Speed 30.
Sorcerer; Storm Origin, clvl 6 1d6+2 + 5 x 4 + 5 x 2 = 38 HP.
Point Buy. S 8 D(p) 13 (+1) C(p) 14 I 10 W 10 Ch(p) 15 (+2) Feat: Res Dex. S 8 D 14 C 14 I 10 W 10 Ch 17. ASI at 4: Feat Skill Expert. +1 Ch, Investigation, Expertise, Investigation. (The party has no rogue)

S 8 D 14 C 14 I 10 W 10 Ch 18

Saves: Dex, Con, Charisma.
Skills: {Sorc}Arcana, Insight {Noble} History, Persuasion {Feat} Investigation (Expertise); {Tashas orogin} Perception.
Tool: Thieves Tools (Traded out Game Set, per Tasha's)
Weapons: Daggers, Darts, Slings, Quarterstaffs, light crossbow.
Languages: Common, Draconic, Primordial {Storm Sorc}
6' tall. 155#. Lean and trim. Hair is a blond with light blue hints. Blue, blue eyes. Skin: fair, with a faint bluish tinge around the lips.

Tempestuous Magic (1) As a Bonus Action: Cause Whirling gusts of elemental air to briefly surround me immediatelky before or after I cast a spell. using a spell slot. Can fly up to 10' without provoking opportunity attacks.
Storm Guide (6) Can subtly control the weather around me. If it is raining, can use an action to cause rain to stop falling within a 20' radius. End effect as a bonus action. If it is windy, can use a bonus action each round to choose the direction that the wind is blowing in a 100' radius sphere centered on me. Wind blows in that direction until end of my next turn. Does not change wind speed.
Heart of the Storm(6) Resistance to Lightning and Thunder damage. WHenver I start casting a spell with a slot that deals lightning or thunder damage, Stormy magic erupts from me. Causes creatures of my choice that I can see within 10' of me to take lightning or thunder damage (choose when activating this) equal to half of my sorcerer level.
Storm Sorcerer Bonus Spells: (from Sorc Origin Homebrew Document)
(1) Fog Cloud, (2) Gust of Wind, (3) Call Lightning
Cantrips (5). Mind Sliver, Mage Hand, Light, Shocking Grasp, Ray of Frost
Spells Known: 7 (not including bonus)
(1) Thunderwave, Mage Armor; (2) Enlarge / Reduce; Hold Person, Scorching Ray (3) Hypnotic Pattern, Slow

Meta Magic: ???

Family owns land, collects taxes, and wields significant political influence but Zeb is viewed as a disinherited scoundrel with a disproportionate sense of entitlement. Well educated, likes to go off with archeologists on their digs. Dilettante.

Is your family old and established? Yes.
How much influence do they wield, and over what area? To the east of the river some farmland, some timber holdings and a sawmill, some livestock breeding and production; also owns the local tannery.
What kind of reputation does your family have among the other aristocrats of the region? Good looking kids who tend to attract mid to low grade scandal; family is otherwise well regarded.
How do the common people regard them? "That lot are snobs, but they are honest snobs."
What’s your position in the family? Son of the Marquis' third daughter (a lady whose infidelity is an ingrained habit)
Have you already inherited the title? No. Disinheireted.
How does the head of your family feel about your adventuring career? The money for school always came from "a rich uncle" who is a bit of a mysterious presence in Don's life. (A Djinni's brother is who sired this child, the Djinni is the source of the funds).
Are you in your family’s good graces, or shunned by the rest of your family? Generally tolerated in limited amounts, always encouraged to go on the latest archeological dig; various relatives will contribute to fit out expeditions so that Zeb is accepted by the team's leader.
Does your family have a coat of arms? Yes - a falcon, flying, on an azure field
An insignia you might wear on a signet ring? No ring. Tatoo of a falcon on upper left arm.
Particular colors you wear all the time? Blue denim pants or blue cotton pants that are loose fitting (pirate pants). Ruffled shirts/pirate shirts: always. Fine Leather boots or sandals. Leather vest over the shirt when in the field/at a dig
An animal you regard as a symbol of your line or even a spiritual member of the family? Falcon.

sophontteks
2021-01-29, 11:56 AM
I normally prefer to decide my metamagic first, then build my spells around them. With limited spells, it's very important that each fills a very important role and works well with your metamagics.

Lets take a look...



Storm Sorcerer Bonus Spells: (free from Binder sorc origin concept)
(1) Fog Cloud, (2) Gust of Wind, (3) Call Lightning
Cantrips: Mind Sliver, Mage Hand, Light, Shocking Grasp, Ray of Frost
Spells Known: 7 (beyond the three bonus above)
(1) Thunderwave, Mage Armor; (2) Enlarge / Reduce; Hold Person, Scorching Ray (3) Hypnotic Pattern, Slow


So this looks like your planning up to level 5. You may want to take this further and plan out each level but lets look at what we got here.

level 1 spells- Fog Cloud (c), Mage Armor, Thunderwave
Level 2 spells- Gust of wind (c), Enlarge Reduce (c), hold Person (c), Scorching Ray
Level 3 Spells- Call Lightning (c), Hypnotic Pattern (c), Slow (c)

I added a (c) to point out what spells we have that require our concentration, and right away we can tell that we have a big problem.

This problem gets bigger since many of these spells have a strong overlap in their role:

Defensive spells- Mage Armor, Gust of wind
Crowd Control Spells- Fog Cloud, Gust of Wind, Enlarge/Reduce, Hold Person, Hypnotic Pattern, Slow
Concentration Damage spells (clashes with CC)- Call Lightning
Non-Conc Damage spells- Thunderwave, scorching ray
Utility spells- Enlarge/Reduce
Social spells- Nothing

I recommend you look to expand the types of spells you have, and cut back on the concentrations spells. You have 7 concentrations spells you will want to cast at the start of combat, but you can only use one. The other 6 are wasted slots. Now, there is room for some overlap. They aren't identical, but once you cast your single concentration spell, the only thing you can cast are cantrips and thunderwave. This is espesially bad since it leaves you with only 2 spells to proc your abilities, and only 1 works with your bonus damage.

Suggestions

Get thunderbolt! That is your main non-concentration damage spell at level 3. Call Lighting looks like a great free pickup, but it doesn't actually work well for you. You only do that bonus damage when you cast it, and you are drowning in concentration options.

Blindness/Deafness is a must-have because it is one of the only multi-target (upcast) non-concentration CC spells out there.

Consider getting more defensive, social, and/or utility spells. Sorcerers with subtle spell are some of thee best social manipulators in the game, and even if you don't have the utility of a wizard, you do want some utility in your kit.

Metamagic

Before You redo your spells, decide on your metamagics....

Pure Blaster- Transmuted spell, Empowered spell - Leaves you lacking out of combat, but opens up many more spells for you to pick and use with heart of the storm, like lighting fireballs, and lightning scorching rays. Very Efficient with Metamagic. Efficient enough that you can take quickened next without worry.

Social Blaster- Subtle, Empowered/Transmuted- Bit of a hard choice between transmuted and empowered, depends on your spell picks. Subtle allows you to tear open social encounters by casting spells in plain sight. Phantasmal force, illusions, enemies abound, etc. Make for great ways to manipulate people. Very, Very efficient with metamagic.

Support Blaster- Twinned, Empowered- For this one you will be concentrating on twinned support spells like haste, greater invisibility, enlarge/reduce, etc. Then you follow it up with instant damage spells and blindness/deafness. Very ineffecient with metamagic.

Of the three, I think the pure blaster is most thematic. Once you get quickened it'll really come online, as you can use it to move around much quicker. It gives you room to use gust of wind and call lightning too. Maybe fog cloud. You'll probably want more defensive spells. I recommend absorb elements at the very least.

The Support blaster is always super strong, and it'll work amazing with your party. Be very careful about losing concentration with haste, or in general really. You might want to take shield. These twinned spells will mean losing fog cloud, gust of wind, hold person. Well, every concentration spell you'd use in combat that you don't twin on your party really. It's just that twinning support spells is insanely powerful, and those spells will become completely dwarfed in power.

Once you hit level 3 and twin enlarge on two of your martials, you'll instantly be everyone's best friend. You'll be letting your barbarian and your fighter grapple huge creatures. IT only gets better from there.

sophontteks
2021-01-29, 12:03 PM
I know that's a huge wall of text. I do love sorcerers. Once you know what metamagics you want I can help with the specific spell options more, if you want more assistance.

Unoriginal
2021-01-29, 12:11 PM
I suggest the Transmuted Spell Metamagic from the Tasha's that let you turn a good share of the damage types into lightning or thunder damage, which combo well with the Storm Sorcerer both mechanically and thematically.


Now I want to cast Wall of Thunder.

sophontteks
2021-01-29, 12:24 PM
I suggest the Transmuted Spell Metamagic from the Tasha's that let you turn a good share of the damage types into lightning or thunder damage, which combo well with the Storm Sorcerer both mechanically and thematically.


Now I want to cast Wall of Thunder.

What an unoriginal comment. Lol. I kid.

I like the idea of taking twinned with that party, but I think it may leave them too resource-starved for transmuted too. They could mulch up lower-level spells to get more metamagic. Either way empowered or transmuted would deff. be the third pick on that one.

Transmuted and empowered with quickened later is the most thematic IMO. I think it'd be the most fun.

Bobthewizard
2021-01-30, 01:38 PM
I'd also consider the metamagic adept feat. 2 extra sorcery points and 2 more metamagic options is great fun. Then you could take transmute and empowered for blasting, subtle for social and still get one of quicken or twin.

It really makes a tier 1 and 2 sorcerer feel more like a sorcerer.

sophontteks
2021-01-30, 02:45 PM
I'd also consider the metamagic adept feat. 2 extra sorcery points and 2 more metamagic options is great fun. Then you could take transmute and empowered for blasting, subtle for social and still get one of quicken or twin.

It really makes a tier 1 and 2 sorcerer feel more like a sorcerer.

Yeah I second this. I mean there are a lot of great feat options, but with subtle, all you need is one good spell and a whole lot of creativity to really showcase what a sorcerer can bring to the table.

There are a lot of options when it comes to support, and blasting. There is only one subtle spell. Spells in 5e are balanced around being immediately noticeable, and when you can cast spells without starting initiative, or making NPCs hostile, a whole new world opens up.

KorvinStarmast
2021-02-26, 04:15 PM
I know that's a huge wall of text. I do love sorcerers. Once you know what metamagics you want I can help with the specific spell options more, if you want more assistance. Man, thanks for the points, the over done concentration bit is so correct. Blindness is a fine choice I have seen it in action.

I suggest the Transmuted Spell Metamagic from the Tasha's that let you turn a good share of the damage types into lightning or thunder damage, which combo well with the Storm Sorcerer both mechanically and thematically.
Now I want to cast Wall of Thunder. Twinn and Transmuted looks like where I'll go.

I'd also consider the metamagic adept feat. 2 extra sorcery points and 2 more metamagic options is great fun. Then you could take transmute and empowered for blasting, subtle for social and still get one of quicken or twin.

It really makes a tier 1 and 2 sorcerer feel more like a sorcerer.
No feats until level 8. I picked up a boost to Charisma at 4.

Thanks to you all for the insights, I was off line for some days and then I lost track of the campaign since it can't seem to fit this guy into it yet. :smallfurious:

The Tasha's +2 and a feat option was vetoed so I am back to the Air Genasi, straight up.
Will post the rebuild anon. You guys/gals are the best. :smallsmile:
EDIT:
So here's the spell line up now:

Meta Magic: Twinn, Transmuted

level 1 spells- Fog Cloud (c), Mage Armor, Thunderwave
Level 2 spells- Blindness/Deafness, Enlarge Reduce (c), hold Person (c), Scorching Ray
Level 3 Spells- Call Lightning (c), Thunderbolt, Slow (c)

I will probably reconsider Enlarge / Reduce, but it's the kind of utility spell that I suspect will come in handy for the party.

Social Spells: party has a bard, and a Paladin. I am a back up face, if I am one at all.
Call Lightning: thematically, I just have to. :smallcool:

That said, the points on subtle spell are pretty strong.