Melee version of Eldritch Blast

[Greywander]

On a whim, I'm writing up a warlock patron (the Hunter) built entirely around Eldritch Blast. So far, I only have two first level features: get EB for free and pick one alternate damage type you can use (e.g. you can change EB to radiant damage, or piercing, or whatever fits your patron), and learn an alternate version of EB for use in melee.

I'm not really sure what to do with this "Eldritch Blade" cantrip, though. Initially, my thought was "use EB in melee without needing Crossbow Expert", but that's a bit boring. I initially gave it a 10 foot range and 1d6 damage, but the more I think about it the more it seems like the whole point is that it should be stronger than EB because you have to get in close to use it. So I might bump the damage die up to 1d12 or 2d6 or something. It benefits from all of the EB invocations, except Eldritch Spear only extends the range to 30 feet instead of 300.

Still, though, it feels kind of pointless. I mean, it's supposed to be mostly a ribbon, just a backup option should the warlock get caught in melee, but it still kind of bleh. The other feature is also mostly a ribbon, though free EB is nice at least.

Is there something I can do to make this a little more interesting? Should I make it more interesting? Should this even exist, or should melee remain a weak point for an EB focused warlock?

Some other subclass features I'm considering: extended crit range for cantrips, subbing one EB beam with a different cantrip you know (e.g. Ray of Frost, it deals cold damage and slows the target, but it still technically counts as EB so it benefits from all invocations), adding a Sneak Attack-esque mechanic for sniping, using a BA to shoot one extra beam and/or casting EB as a BA if you do something else with your action.

[LumenPlacidum]

Let's start with the last collection of questions. Is there some mental image that you have of what a melee-EB-warlock would do? If the subclass is largely about damage output, then I'd probably say that there's little need for it. Eldritch Blast is already one of the avenues to very high damage in the game, and improving it for the sake of improving it is probably not interesting.

I might suggest that you try to write a little narrative description of it. Then, you can focus your design on making that narrative image real. Plus, you'll get much better buy-in from the forum, I think.

[jaappleton]

This is giving me flashbacks of 4E when they introduced that melee version of EB that counted as a melee basic attack and every optimizer took a level of Warlock to get it.

[JNAProductions]

This is giving me flashbacks of 4E when they introduced that melee version of EB that counted as a melee basic attack and every optimizer took a level of Warlock to get it.

I... I don't think you can even do that in 4E. You can't multiclass like that, unless they radically changed the core system from the start of the edition.

[Yakk]

I buffed all 3 pacts.

Pact of thr Blade let you use any ranged spell attack as a melee one while holding a melee pact weapon. It did extra (str/2) round up; alternatively, (dex/2) round up if your pact weapon is finess.

[Chronic]

You could do this:
When the character make a melee weapon attack as part of the attack action, he can use a bonus action to cast eldritch blast.

If you are afraid of abuse (like multiclass), make the bonus action EB range 5 or 10 feat, and make it a level 7 or 8 feature. Or make it a non modified EB (no invocation applicable).

[DarknessEternal]

Why do you think making a patron whose theme is "do more damage" is appropriate?

[Greywander]

Why do you think making a patron whose theme is "do more damage" is appropriate?
Why do you think it's not? Also, Hexblade already exists.

Also, EB is about more than just damage. Repelling Blast is what makes a warlock more than just a mediocre archer.

But maybe it would be a better idea to write up some new invocations rather than a subclass. I just wanted to build an EB-focused warlock, and the only patron that seemed to give a significant boost to EB was the Hexblade, which I'm not super wild about. So I thought, "Fine, I'll make my own," but maybe it's better to be able to pick any patron I want for the other benefits.

[Avonar]

Why do you think it's not? Also, Hexblade already exists.

Also, EB is about more than just damage. Repelling Blast is what makes a warlock more than just a mediocre archer.

But maybe it would be a better idea to write up some new invocations rather than a subclass. I just wanted to build an EB-focused warlock, and the only patron that seemed to give a significant boost to EB was the Hexblade, which I'm not super wild about. So I thought, "Fine, I'll make my own," but maybe it's better to be able to pick any patron I want for the other benefits.

Might be the way to go. If you had an entire subclass as well the invocations all focued just on Elditch Blast, I think you run the risk of it being boring. Why use other spells when almost every part of your class is put into EB? The existing invocations can make it powerful enough, I would say think of the patron's theme and look at some unique mechanics for it.

[da newt]

This sounds like a powerful Patron option - perhaps not the most interesting (you sort of end up with a one trick pony), but it will certainly be effective.

Seeing as melee EB is part of the shtick, will they also get MED armor & shield proff like HexBlades?

For the melee Eldritch Blade I'd stick w/ the standard D10 damage plus the normal EB evocations BUT I think Repelling Blast would be TOO useful so I'd have it instead grapple when used w/ E-Blade. You still have control and a good one too, but it's a sticky one instead of a push. For flavor/visual I'd go Evard's like with Eldritch Tentacles, but you could also go Wonder Woman's Lasso if that fit's your theme better ...

[rlc]

I’d probably go with an invocation that removes disadvantage from being within 5 feet of your target and then something with fighting style level power on top of it.

[RSP]

I like the idea. It’s be nice to have a melee attack that at least equals all you can do with EB, rather than it being a strictly inferior option. If you could “Eldritch Blade” at 5’ but, after all attacks, add in the Repelling Blast move, I could see a nice in-game feel, like some Anime, of 2 or 3 attacks in melee followed by throwing the opponent back.

[Hael]

I like the idea. It’s be nice to have a melee attack that at least equals all you can do with EB, rather than it being a strictly inferior option. If you could “Eldritch Blade” at 5’ but, after all attacks, add in the Repelling Blast move, I could see a nice in-game feel, like some Anime, of 2 or 3 attacks in melee followed by throwing the opponent back.

Well I mean melee benefits from feats that push it well above standard EB damage. Otoh, I’d say it’s just a little too easy to stay competitive as a blastlock with minimal use of resources..

[gorfnab]

So basically revamping the Eldritch Glaive (Dragon Magic, 3.5) blast shape invocation?

[pizzamonster]

Love this idea and suggested it to my DM a couple weeks ago.
I think the standard invocations make it playable. Obviously less great than the distance blasting.
Personally I wanted to avoid a hexblade and a blaster. Instead I want to mainly charm/frighten and occasionally melee with advantage.
My idea was to use this “Eldritch blade” attack with a goolock and mc that with shadow sorc for darkness bursts. Or do a genie or UA Undead warlock and mc that with ab mind sorc.
With some complaining that the UA Undead is too powerful, this seems like a good modification to make it more like a horror movie villain who chases and stabs?

[Valmark]

So basically revamping the Eldritch Glaive (Dragon Magic, 3.5) blast shape invocation?

I thought exactly the same about this and Hideous Blow.

To make it simple, Eldritch Glaive turned your Blast into a weapon with reach that allowed you to attack ignoring the enemy's armor- you couldn't move while doing this but you could attack as many times as normally allowed.

Hideous Blow instead channeled Eldritch Blast right into your weapon- basically your melee attack (you could make only one) dealt bonus damage equivalent to the Blast (and if for some reason your attack hit without dealing weapon damage the Blast would still work).

You could make something like Hideous Blow- maybe along the lines of a cleric's Divine Strike. Having someone with Pact of the Blade be able to channel it in both attacks with Thirsting Blade could be cool too.