Vampire encounter for a 4 player party of lv7's advice on encounter.

[Throne12]

So I'm a co-DM and the main DM want to use a vampire as a mini boss when the party is around lv7. After looking through the vampire stat block I figured this should be a dangerous to deadly encounter to the party. So I was talking to the DM and said we should make two changes

First is change the bite to where you can only use the bite if the target is Restrain or unconscious. The stat block has both of those and the grappled. So I'm just taking out the grapped.

Next is the vampire can only use the bite action as one of ot legendary actions.

So what do yall think of this change.

Oh sorry here is party comp
1. Shadow elf rouge theft special ability can shoot spectral arrows the can go through walls and ect.

2. Dwarf rune knight special ability is can turn into werewolf/ this is my character I'm there DM for five years now getting to take a some what break.

3. Human scribe wizard with special ability to learn any spell from any list.

4. tiefling genie warlock special ability is once per person can grant a wish but it has a 50/50 of being a monk's paw or what they ask for. The warlock get advantage on level of Exhaustion. Something like this I can't remember.

[Gignere]

So I'm a co-DM and the main DM want to use a vampire as a mini boss when the party is around lv7. After looking through the vampire stat block I figured this should be a dangerous to deadly encounter to the party. So I was talking to the DM and said we should make two changes

First is change the bite to where you can only use the bite if the target is Restrain or unconscious. The stat block has both of those and the grappled. So I'm just taking out the grapped.

Next is the vampire can only use the bite action as one of ot legendary actions.

So what do yall think of this change.

Oh sorry here is party comp
1. Shadow elf rouge theft special ability can shoot spectral arrows the can go through walls and ect.

2. Dwarf rune knight special ability is can turn into werewolf/ this is my character I'm there DM for five years now getting to take a some what break.

3. Human scribe wizard with special ability to learn any spell from any list.

4. tiefling genie warlock special ability is once per person can grant a wish but it has a 50/50 of being a monk's paw or what they ask for. The warlock get advantage on level of Exhaustion. Something like this I can't remember.

If it’s just one vampire you should buff the vampire it going to be a walk in the park. Particularly that scribe wizard did you seriously give the wizard access to conjure animals? Conjure woodland beings? There is zero chance the vampire wins. Lmao. Spiritual weapons + conjure woodland beings. I don’t even see them breaking a sweat seriously.

The wizard can probably solo it if prepped properly.

[Unoriginal]

So I'm a co-DM and the main DM want to use a vampire as a mini boss when the party is around lv7. After looking through the vampire stat block I figured this should be a dangerous to deadly encounter to the party. So I was talking to the DM and said we should make two changes

First is change the bite to where you can only use the bite if the target is Restrain or unconscious. The stat block has both of those and the grappled. So I'm just taking out the grapped.

Next is the vampire can only use the bite action as one of ot legendary actions.

So what do yall think of this change.

Oh sorry here is party comp
1. Shadow elf rouge theft special ability can shoot spectral arrows the can go through walls and ect.

2. Dwarf rune knight special ability is can turn into werewolf/ this is my character I'm there DM for five years now getting to take a some what break.

3. Human scribe wizard with special ability to learn any spell from any list.

4. tiefling genie warlock special ability is once per person can grant a wish but it has a 50/50 of being a monk's paw or what they ask for. The warlock get advantage on level of Exhaustion. Something like this I can't remember.

4 normal lvl 7 PCs would tear a normal vampire in a couple of rounds, without the vampire being able to do anything significant.

With a weakened vampire like you and DM are planning to do and a party with powerful special abilities, that vampire is really not going to be much of a threat.

I made a tactical challenge for this subforum a bit ago, and even with 4 lvl 6 PCs and a vampire with a very rare magic item the fight was waaaaaaaay in favor of the PCs.


If it’s just one vampire you should buff the vampire it going to be a walk in the park. Particularly that scribe wizard did you seriously give the wizard access to conjure animals? Conjure woodland beings? There is zero chance the vampire wins. Lmao.

The vampire has 0 chances to do anything by themselves. Maybe if they summon the summons have a chance to do a bit of HP damage.

[MrStabby]

The most important thing is where the PCs meet the vampire and when.

Level 7 PCs might not have a source of sunlight and though they can play whackamole with the vampire, the vampire just has to get lucky once... if the vampire keeps their resting place somewhere that needs a mist form to reach then this can be a real threat.

Hit and run to sap resources can be quite nasty.

On the other hand, if the party can open the curtains and access daylight... then the whole thing is a cakewalk.

[J-H]

The only way a vampire is very dangerous to the party at that level is if he or she manages to use Charm to keep party members from attacking. If only half of them see the vampire as a valid target for battle, it's pretty different...and vampire charm is harder to break that some other charm effects.

Vampire DPS just isn't very good.

You may want to review this link:
https://www.themonstersknow.com/undead-tactics-vampires/

[Throne12]

So the wizard can't just pick spells other then wizard. For cleric and others he has to find them or have someone teach him. Also he not picking any damaging one I think he has MM.

The my lycanpthoy is a Narrative think and I'm being cautious about using it. The only time I used it so far is is the DM through a kraken priest and 3 guards at a lv3 party. So the warlock failed his third death save so I broke from the priest and pulled the warlock to full cover and bite him making him a werewolf thrall. Saving his character we just started play and got attached to.

The rogue just have the ghost arrows so he can shoot from full cover.

The warlock has that wish ability he can use his self and only works if someone say (I wish ..........). So he don't have the ability to control it. And a person only get one wish.


Oh I forgot the vampire is a Daywalker so he isn't hurt by sunlight. There is a whole story reason to why. He isn't a typical vampire. He's a living seal to keep a powerful lich imprisoned. And is Syphoning the lich necromantic energy from the lich making him a daywalker vampire.

[Unoriginal]

So the wizard can't just pick spells other then wizard. For cleric and others he has to find them or have someone teach him. Also he not picking any damaging one I think he has MM.

The my lycanpthoy is a Narrative think and I'm being cautious about using it. The only time I used it so far is is the DM through a kraken priest and 3 guards at a lv3 party. So the warlock failed his third death save so I broke from the priest and pulled the warlock to full cover and bite him making him a werewolf thrall. Saving his character we just started play and got attached to.

The rogue just have the ghost arrows so he can shoot from full cover.

The warlock has that wish ability he can use his self and only works if someone say (I wish ..........). So he don't have the ability to control it. And a person only get one wish.


Oh I forgot the vampire is a Daywalker so he isn't hurt by sunlight. There is a whole story reason to why. He isn't a typical vampire. He's a living seal to keep a powerful lich imprisoned. And is Syphoning the lich necromantic energy from the lich making him a daywalker vampire.

Throne12, even a baseline party of lvl 7 would tear down a vampire in a fight. The party can win that easily even without using any of their perks.

Being a daywalker doesn't change much to that, unless he's also immune to Radiant damage.

You just need to make the vampire stronger, or use one of the stronger variants. Nothing too bothersome.

[Catullus64]

You say the Vampire's a daywalker, but do the other Vampire weaknesses still apply, specifically Forbiddance and Harmed by Running Water?

If those are still in play, I would definitely have the fight take place in terrain with both running water and residences out of which the PCs can get some good tactical value. If those weaknesses are also gone, I would suggest building in some additional weaknesses that the players can learn about through research/subterfuge. Weaknesses and tactical options that offset difficulty are the name of the game when building deadly-difficulty encounters and still keeping them fun.

Vampire charm, if used correctly, can definitely be the source of some fun mid-combat roleplay for the charmed PCs.

[da newt]

This really depends on the tactical skill of your Players. If they are experienced / clever those 4 PC's can and should whup up on a single Vampire. If they fight basic, a Vampire can be a great challenge.

Vampires have all sorts of fun abilities to play with, but they deal weak damage. They make great hit and run, harass and escape, type foes, but they struggle to put a single PC down - especially if they can only bite restrained (how does the Vamp restrain? I don't see that capability anywhere in their stat block) or charmed PCs. And while they try to paper cut one PC to death over many turns, the rest of the party just keeps on focused attack against them.

A vampire is hard to kill - they have great defense, but surviving a vampire isn't - they don't have much offense. A BBEG who can only deal 8 damage with an unarmed strike, or bite for 17 (but only PC's who are charmed) takes forever to do any real harm and a charmed PC gets a save every time they take damage.

In order for the vampire to be a threat, they need to charm and run/hide, and repeat until all are charmed. I'd definitely charm the WIZ first.

Add 2 Vamp Spawn and it's a challenge.

[Twelvetrees]

In general, I agree with Unoriginal and don't think your changes are necessary.

With a weakened vampire like you and DM are planning to do and a party with powerful special abilities, that vampire is really not going to be much of a threat.


However, like MrStabby indicated, the vampire's tactics could change the tenor of the fight significantly.

Hit and run to sap resources can be quite nasty.
Vampires are terrifyingly good at this because of their ability to move as a legendary action without provoking opportunity attacks. Should the fight take place in a mauseleum honeycombed with tunnels for the vampire to duck in and out of, it becomes rather easy for it to briefly engage the party and then run off and heal with its regeneration.


On the other hand, if your party finds that a typical Hard encounter is a difficult fight for them, your changes would be good. The forum tends to have a high optimization baseline for what constitutes a "normal" party and your experiences may differ.

Edit: Shadow monk'd!

[Zhorn]

The most important thing is where the PCs meet the vampire and when.

Level 7 PCs might not have a source of sunlight and though they can play whackamole with the vampire, the vampire just has to get lucky once... if the vampire keeps their resting place somewhere that needs a mist form to reach then this can be a real threat.

Hit and run to sap resources can be quite nasty.

On the other hand, if the party can open the curtains and access daylight... then the whole thing is a cakewalk.

Seconding this.
I ran a solo vampire encounter for my party of 5 lv7, and the 'hit & run' tactic really put the players on edge. If I ran the encounter in a plain room as a duke to the death, the PCs would have it over in a few rounds. Instead it took them two combats to take out, and only managed the second time because they realised that had to put effort into pinning it down

Play the vampire smart.
Climb walls to keep out of easy melee, never allow it to be cornered, if more than one PC is in melee and they WANT to be there use that legendary action to move.
Shapechange the moment the PCs are clearly winning and mist/bat out. You don't need to break combat, just regroup in the next room. Lead them on a chase to a more advantageous arena. The vampire's strength isn't to duke it out in nova rounds, but wear their opponents down. Regeneration allows the vampire to play the long game so long as it doesn't get pinned down.
Children of the Night early
Run around corners for cover and break line of sight
Draw the PCs into locations that break line of sight with each other
Use Charm often, keep their heavy hitter tied up, or switch their support to aiding the vampire
Bite every opportunity, HP recovery keep this thing kicking.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Use the CR 8 "Blood Drinker Vampire" in Guildmaster's Guide to Ravnica, but add legendary actions, and enough hd/hp to make it CR 9 or 10.