How has Tasha's changed the race meta?

[Greywander]

Reading through class guides these days, I'm noticing that races seemed to be recommended or not based almost entirely on the ASIs they gave. Many guides haven't updated for Tasha's except to say, "If you're using Tasha's, then it doesn't matter, they're all good," but I don't think this is actually true.

There's the low hanging fruit like yuan-ti or satyrs getting Magic Resistance, or even the winged teifling. But I can see high elves making good melee clerics or melee rogues since you can pick up BB or GFB as your free cantrip. Mountain dwarf artificers can start with something like 7 extra tool proficiencies by converting all of their racial weapon and armor proficiencies into tools. Mountain dwarves in general for getting +2/+2 and medium armor for classes that don't get armor proficiencies.

I know there are other good combinations out there, but they've been mostly overlooked until now because the ASIs weren't right.

[diplomancer]

Reading through class guides these days, I'm noticing that races seemed to be recommended or not based almost entirely on the ASIs they gave. Many guides haven't updated for Tasha's except to say, "If you're using Tasha's, then it doesn't matter, they're all good," but I don't think this is actually true.

There's the low hanging fruit like yuan-ti or satyrs getting Magic Resistance, or even the winged teifling. But I can see high elves making good melee clerics or melee rogues since you can pick up BB or GFB as your free cantrip. Mountain dwarf artificers can start with something like 7 extra tool proficiencies by converting all of their racial weapon and armor proficiencies into tools. Mountain dwarves in general for getting +2/+2 and medium armor for classes that don't get armor proficiencies.

I know there are other good combinations out there, but they've been mostly overlooked until now because the ASIs weren't right.

First of all, you are right. This change is totally not "racially-neutral", and all Class Guides need rewriting (or there needs to be one single "Tasha's Optimizer's Racial Guide by Class", to which other Guides can refer readers)

As to the meat, you've mentioned the major ones (flight, magic resistance, mountain dwarf), here are some others:

Goblins, which were already alright for backliners like Wizards and Sorcerers, are now very good, you will make good use of the Nimble Escape feature every round.

As you've mentioned, the extra weapon proficiencies of Elves and Dwarves got a big boost if you are playing a martial character, you get to be an accomplished tool user instead. The Dwarf weapons, in particular, are much better now for more classes that don't want to use Str, since you can swap out Battle Axe and Warhammer for Rapier and Heavy Crossbow or Whip (yes, Elf weapons can do the same, but the boost is comparatively smaller, though you could get Rapier, Heavy Crossbow and Whip, as Elves have 3 martial proficiencies and Dwarves only 2).

Half-Elf is now a good choice for non-Cha classes as well, even more so if MAD.

Hobgoblins are now as good for Clockwork Sorcerers as for Abjuration Wizards.

Custom Lineage is probably top choice for SAD characters.

More generally, races with "bad" ASIs (here generally defined as either races with Int boosts- which pigeonholed them- or races without Dex or Con boosts) got a leg-up.

Swords Bards can now choose a race like Hill Dwarf, get some nice bonuses, and proficiency with Long Bow on top of that. Your flourishes (except perhaps slashing flourish) do not require you to be in melee. That's a better Archer Bard than Valor Bard. At level 14 If you have Oath Bow and have Swift Quiver on, that's 4 attacks at advantage with 4d6+d8+Dex, with +d6 to your AC and about 25' push back (or no AC bonus and about 35' push back) which is around 90DPR, and very nice control. If you crit, you get to switch one of those d6s for a d12 if you want. Yes, this particular combo is once a day only, but for the rest of the day you are still a Full Caster.

[Naanomi]

Races that have benefited in many builds post-Tashas:
~Greater than average stats Stats:
~~Mountain Dwarf
~~Half Elf

~Armor Options:
~~Loxodon
~~Mountain Dwarf
~~Tortle

~Flexible Weapon Proficiencies:
~~Elves
~~Dwarves

~Flight:
~~Winged Tiefling
~~Aaracokra

~Unique Abilities:
~~Yuan-ti Pureblood (Magic Resistance)
~~Goblin (Nimble Escape)

~Build-Specific Min/Max Options:
~~Centaur (move speed)
~~Lots of 'Mark of' Races (skills)
~~Scourge Aasimar (damage)
~~Bugbear (sneak attack)
~~Hill Dwarf (Hitpoints)

Of course, lots of builds have races that more or less still fit as supreme in some builds without modification of statlines... Kobold, Warforged, Half-Orc, Changeling...

[TigerT20]

There have always been races with excellent racial traits, and Tasha's will only highlight them. Here's a couple:

- Flight is very notorious. There lots of debate over how strong it actually is, however, and many ways to keep flying characters in check have become widespread.
- Tieflings (and Fire Genasi?) have resistance to fire damage, which can crop up quite often. Same with dwarves/stout halflings and poison damage.
- Relentless Endurance was limited to melee warlocks before. Savage attacks still incentivises weapons, but I'm not sure that's much of a limit anymore. Except for Moon Druids, I guess.
- Halflings, both Lightfoot and Stout still have good traits, especially Lucky.
- Aggressive is still great for barbarians and now it can be used on monks
- Speaking of orcs, they actually make pretty great Hunter Rangers. I recommend the Horde abilities.
- Hidden Step is amazing for support builds. Especially clerics and druids. So no change there.
- Yuan-ti, you already know this one
- Hellfire tieflings are objectively better than normal ones, and Devil's Tongue makes for better bards and possibly paladins before Tasha's. Now those spell lists can go onto any builds with ASI synergy (although will they still need Charisma, won't they?)
- In fact, tieflings are incredible with all the different spell lists you can choose from. If it weren't for Rage blocking spells, I'd be planning a Zariel barb right now.
- Hungry Jaws is another ability that improves Wild Shape. You'll have Natural Armour when you aren't WSed into a crocodile as well. Cunning Artisan and Hunter's Lore are very flavourable to druids too. However, the racial ASIs already line up - but now you can use them to improve your Bite or Natural Armour, which improves Lizardfolk quite a bit.
- Kenku Bard has 7 skill proficiencies at level 1. Go Whsipers and be the first bird to commit piracy.

So yeah. Some racial options have opened up, but the same number are still pointing towards exactly the same classes that the racial ASIs did. And others are pointing in entirely new directions altogether.

[LudicSavant]

Reading through class guides these days, I'm noticing that races seemed to be recommended or not based almost entirely on the ASIs they gave. Many guides haven't updated for Tasha's except to say, "If you're using Tasha's, then it doesn't matter, they're all good," but I don't think this is actually true.

There's the low hanging fruit like yuan-ti or satyrs getting Magic Resistance, or even the winged teifling. But I can see high elves making good melee clerics or melee rogues since you can pick up BB or GFB as your free cantrip. Mountain dwarf artificers can start with something like 7 extra tool proficiencies by converting all of their racial weapon and armor proficiencies into tools. Mountain dwarves in general for getting +2/+2 and medium armor for classes that don't get armor proficiencies.

I know there are other good combinations out there, but they've been mostly overlooked until now because the ASIs weren't right.


First of all, you are right. This change is totally not "racially-neutral", and all Class Guides need rewriting (or there needs to be one single "Tasha's Optimizer's Racial Guide by Class", to which other Guides can refer readers)

Want me to write one?

[diplomancer]

Want me to write one?

Oh yes. That would be a great resource

[Contrast]

No-one has mentioned goliath yet - they get some good racial features.

Cold res is nice as most adventurers will get hit by at least a couple of Cone of Colds in their career and the reaction damage soak is going to provide a lot of value over the course of an adventuring career (though is particularly powerful at lower levels admittedly).

Re dwarves and a billion tool profs - people bring this up a lot but I've yet to be convinced its even good, let alone something worth optimising for.

[Naanomi]

No-one has mentioned goliath yet - they get some good racial features.

Cold res is nice as most adventurers will get hit by at least a couple of Cone of Colds in their career and the reaction damage soak is going to provide a lot of value over the course of an adventuring career (though is particularly powerful at lower levels admittedly).

Re dwarves and a billion tool profs - people bring this up a lot but I've yet to be convinced its even good, let alone something worth optimising for.
Dwarven artificers may care; and the weapon proficiencies (turning into Whip, Heavy Xbow, Rapier) matters for a lot of low-level casters

[No brains]

Dwarves having a bunch of tool proficiencies can matter if you're playing a class that has Fabricate. This is particularly true of a Forge cleric that can sacrifice armor and most weapon proficiencies toward getting more tools. With proficiency in alchemist's, brewer's, poisoner's, mason's, and smith's tools, a determined Fabricator can harvest the materials of any obstacle and turn them into assets.

Another quirk of the new meta is that armor proficiency is now exceptionally valuable, nearly as much as a unique ability. There's no way to trade into armor proficiency, but it can be traded down into martial weapons or tools. I always thought it was a nice benefit, but there's apparently something really special about a bard, rogue, sorcerer, warlock, or wizard wearing medium armor.

[HolyDraconus]

But are they races? What do they win?

[Gyor]

Don't forget Tritons and Tabaxi and Leonin, they have interesting features.

And some races just get wrecked by Tasha's,, Kenku's stat bumps were all Kenkus mechanics had going for it.

[MrStabby]

Dwarves having a bunch of tool proficiencies can matter if you're playing a class that has Fabricate. This is particularly true of a Forge cleric that can sacrifice armor and most weapon proficiencies toward getting more tools. With proficiency in alchemist's, brewer's, poisoner's, mason's, and smith's tools, a determined Fabricator can harvest the materials of any obstacle and turn them into assets.

Another quirk of the new meta is that armor proficiency is now exceptionally valuable, nearly as much as a unique ability. There's no way to trade into armor proficiency, but it can be traded down into martial weapons or tools. I always thought it was a nice benefit, but there's apparently something really special about a bard, rogue, sorcerer, warlock, or wizard wearing medium armor.

I think the value of armour depends on:

a) Loot

b) Makeup of enemies

Loot that gives magic armour but either less non armoured defence or more unarmoured people in the party for it to be split between makes the proficiency better. A +2 AC from armour proficiency is nice, it is noticable but not revolutionary. If there are +2 suits of armour you might come accross then that can be a much bigger deal.

Makeup of enemies matters - a few points difference in AC will make a huge difference to survivability if you are facing 15 enemies with +5 to hit vs 2 enemies with +9 to hit.

So it can be special.

Also these clases have smaller hit dice so need to be just a little careful with HP. More importantly they are also often concetrating on spells - the loss of a wall of force or a banishment spell from a lucky hit can have much more serious consequences than the d8+4 hitpoints lost.

[Granitecosmos]

No-one has mentioned goliath yet - they get some good racial features.

Cold res is nice as most adventurers will get hit by at least a couple of Cone of Colds in their career and the reaction damage soak is going to provide a lot of value over the course of an adventuring career (though is particularly powerful at lower levels admittedly).
You think that's good? Wait until people realize Stone's Endurance can be used to decrease a concentration save DC once per short rest (at least once things start hitting for over 20). Start as Fighter 1, wear armor and never be punished by encumbrance rules ever again as a caster dumping STR because you have Powerful Build.

[Hytheter]

You think that's good? Wait until people realize Stone's Endurance can be used to decrease a concentration save DC once per short rest (at least once things start hitting for over 20). Start as Fighter 1, wear armor and never be punished by encumbrance rules ever again as a caster dumping STR because you have Powerful Build.

Powerful build doesn't remove the strength requirement of heavy armour, though, so unless you're content with a 20ft move speed you'll still probably want some STR.

[Granitecosmos]

Powerful build doesn't remove the strength requirement of heavy armour, though, so unless you're content with a 20ft move speed you'll still probably want some STR.
True but half-plate has no such problems and you can carry lots of stuff with STR 8 plus Powerful Build. Some tables use the more complex encumbrance rules, this no longer makes that an issue.

[Hytheter]

You know, for some reason I thought you had originally specified heavy armour, but upon review it looks like my brain just added the word in all on its own.

[Yakmala]

One of the best things to come out of the Tasha's racial changes is that it benefits a particular campaign style that some of us have participated in over the years, the single race party. Be it a group of Dwarfs trying to reclaim their mountain homeland, a group of Elves defending the forest, a group of Kobolds getting into shenanigans, or whatever, every player in a single race party can now be any class they like without feeling like they are at an ASI disadvantage from the start.

[CapnWildefyr]

One of the best things to come out of the Tasha's racial changes is that it benefits a particular campaign style that some of us have participated in over the years, the single race party. Be it a group of Dwarfs trying to reclaim their mountain homeland, a group of Elves defending the forest, a group of Kobolds getting into shenanigans, or whatever, every player in a single race party can now be any class they like without feeling like they are at an ASI disadvantage from the start.

Sounds right. I like that it helps you with character concepts. I dislike that it blends all the choices together. Oddly, I almost miss those tables my group never paid much attention to -- the ones where there were mins/maxes on stats by race. It would at least provide differentiation. (I mean, can a 3 foot tall halfling really be as strong as a half-orc? This is an absolute test - using strength stats is not relative, so an 18 STR has to be the same for everyone.)

to the OP: Yes, I think it did, but sorry I'm not one to be able to quantify that sort of thing.

[Snowbluff]

Satyrs are the other magic resistant race. They also get more speed, more skills.

People undervalue flight. It's the easiest way for a melee to deal with distant or flying enemies. I think it obliterates all other options if there is a remote concern for dealing with flying enemies. As a result I just ban flying PCs and make it clear it won't be necessary at my tables.

[Granitecosmos]

As a result I just ban flying PCs and make it clear it won't be necessary at my tables.
And this is exactly why people undervalue flying races but not the Fly spell. My experience so far is 9 out of 10 tables will ban anything with a fly speed at level 1.

[diplomancer]

And this is exactly why people undervalue flying races but not the Fly spell. My experience so far is 9 out of 10 tables will ban anything with a fly speed at level 1.

Exactly. It's not "undervalued" so much as it is "you probably won't be able to play it, so why bother?"

[Theodoxus]

I've never had a player ask if they could play a flying race. I have no idea if I'd have a problem with it, but I want to say no... I'd hope I'd be open to the idea and allow them to play up their strengths. Then again, I favor dungeon crawling style campaigns, so flight would be less useful than other racial traits, so that's probably the biggest reason no one has asked.

[Naanomi]

Even leaving aside combat uses, low-level resource free flight is great at overcoming a lot of basic dungeon obstacles... pits and terrain and chasms, many traps... flight and a rope solves a ton of these things

[chainer1216]

To answer the question posed by this thread: it hasnt, the best races before are still the best now, and the worst before are still the worst post-TCOE.

[Contrast]

To answer the question posed by this thread: it hasnt, the best races before are still the best now, and the worst before are still the worst post-TCOE.

While I suspect this is mostly true in general, for any given specific character it certainly isn't true.

A goliath wizard would have been questionable pre-Tashas but is now pretty optimal.

You can also now play a race that appeals to you thematically without worry that you're nerfing yourself by missing out of relevant stats - for example, a dragonborn rogue is better now than it was.

[diplomancer]

To answer the question posed by this thread: it hasnt, the best races before are still the best now, and the worst before are still the worst post-TCOE.

This is simply not true. Just for one example; Dragonmarked races were sonewhat balanced by having bonus spells line up with the stat increase; so if you've got a bonus to Wis, most of your spells will be from Cleric or Druid list, and so on. Was it enough to balance them entirely? Maybe not, but it was a factor. Now all this has been thrown out the window, and you can have your House Jorasco Wizard without even having worse Int than other options.