Arcane Trickster and Wizard spellbooks

[Grin]

Hi, new here, first post/thread.

I'm playing a dwarven arcane trickster and we came across a frozen wizard's corpse holding a spellbook.

How does this work? I know you can technically 'read' magical inscriptions and scrolls with the Arcana skill, but what if I do?

My DM seems to imply that I could tear out the pages and use them as one-time scrolls, and while I am all for that approach currently it doesn't strike me as correct.

I was wondering how people here interpret the written rules and how you rule these things in your games?

[JackPhoenix]

It works by not working. There's no interaction between Arcane Tricksters and spellbooks. You can learn rituals from it if you have ritual caster, but that's it. The spellbook itself isn't magical, and it definitely can't be used as a source of spell scrolls... otherwise, it would be way to easy and cheap for a wizard to just scribe the spells he wants to spam in the book (Let me put it this way: Crafting a scroll of level 9 spell takes 48 weeks and 250k gp per XGtE rules (whether that's reasonable or not is a different matter). Copying a level 9 spell to a spare spellbook takes 9 hours and 90 gp.)

[AttilatheYeon]

The tearing out pages was an artifact of like 1st or 2nd edition. Even then i don't think it was RAW. Prolly something from Dragon Magazine that became a popular house rule. I know i've never used it or heard of it until after 3e was a thing.

Now, if this is a house rule your DM is willing to use, go for it. As previously mentioned. A spellbook is useless to you anyways.

[Zhorn]

Hi, new here, first post/thread.
Welcome to the playground. I hope you enjoy it here.


I'm playing a dwarven arcane trickster and we came across a frozen wizard's corpse holding a spellbook.
How does this work? I know you can technically 'read' magical inscriptions and scrolls with the Arcana skill, but what if I do?
Mostly it's just like any other book, just with spells in it. Rules-wise there isn't much to go on beyond that.
Scrolls use Arcana checks to be able to read without triggering/destroying them, DC = 10+Spell Level (PHB p112), or same DC to activate/cast but with a spellcasting ability check (DMG p139)

Spellbooks have no such requirements by RAW. Having an Arcana check to understand it has spells written in it, and/or identifying what spells it contains is thematically reasonable, but entirely a house rule and not a RAW requirement.

For your Arcane Trickster there isn't really much you can do with a Wizard's Spellbook as you don't prepare spells from them, you'll learn a select number as you level up, they just happen to be from the Wizard's spell list and you use INT like a wizard, but mechanically ATs and EKs are more alike to Bards and Sorcerers with their spell learning (side detail, not overly important, they are still thematically Wizard-adjacent).


My DM seems to imply that I could tear out the pages and use them as one-time scrolls, and while I am all for that approach currently it doesn't strike me as correct.
Entirely a house rule when it comes to 5e. Not an uncommon one, but if you DM is ruling this, only they will have further information on how it is done as it is not from 5e's RAW.

Unless you take levels as a Wizard, RAW-wise the book is of little value to you beyond what you DM wants to let it be.


Copying a level 9 spell to a spare spellbook takes 9 hours and 90 gp.)
Only if it's your own spellbook you are copying, for coping from someone else's spellbook or a scroll it is 2hours and 50 gp per spell level (baring special discounts from Wizard subclasses), so a 9th level would be in the 18hours and 450 gp range.
(note for JackPhoenix; not a callout, just covering the detail since we have someone new(ish?) here asking questions and I thought it best to cover the full detail, not a sliver that might get misinterpreted as an absolute be-all-end-all detail)

[KorvinStarmast]

The tearing out pages was an artifact of like 1st or 2nd edition. Even then i don't think it was RAW. Prolly something from Dragon Magazine that became a popular house rule. That sounds vaguely familiar, but I'll check the 1e DMG since I swear my brain points me there for that cute little trick.

OK, I'll need to go with "was in Dragon Mag" because I remember seeing this done quite a bit in 1e games.

[5eNeedsDarksun]

I think I might be taking this thread a bit too far off track with this question, but... regarding ATs and scrolls I've ruled that all Wizard Scrolls that are of a level that can be cast by ATs (for example 2nd level spells for a 7th level character) can be cast automatically, even those outside of their usual schools. Only wizard scrolls above the level they could normally cast would require a roll for success. Does this jive with RAW? How have others ruled in this case?

[Anymage]

I think I might be taking this thread a bit too far off track with this question, but... regarding ATs and scrolls I've ruled that all Wizard Scrolls that are of a level that can be cast by ATs (for example 2nd level spells for a 7th level character) can be cast automatically, even those outside of their usual schools. Only wizard scrolls above the level they could normally cast would require a roll for success. Does this jive with RAW? How have others ruled in this case?

The only rule wonkiness is if you want to take a too strict reading of how spell scrolls care about if the spell is on your class's spell list, and rogues don't have a spell list. That probably isn't how anybody would read it in practice.

Both ATs and EKs do have full access to the full wizard spell list, as reflected by their any school picks. Counting them as having full access for the use of scrolls and similar magic items is fine.

[da newt]

If your AT has a INT of 13 or better, a WIZ 1 lvl dip might be handy for using a spell book, rituals, more spell slots, use of items like scrolls that require a WIZ ...

But as with all things, talk to your DM - what ever they say is allowed is good to go.