Every Attack a Touch Attack, but to what end?

[Khatoblepas]

While working on an Iron Chef entry that never panned out, I was looking through books to see what would be good for monks and found the Poison Ring in Dragon Compendium. It only deals 1 damage, but does so on a touch attack. But luckily, it's a light melee weapon, meaning if you put Morphing on a Scorpion Kama you get a touch attack that deals your unarmed damage.

And I'm not sure about this, but if you take Unorthodox Flurry (Poison Ring) you might also be able to apply your full strength bonus to your attacks instead of none?


When using weapons as part of a flurry of blows, a monk applies her Strength bonus (not Str bonus × 1½ or ×½) to her damage rolls for all successful attacks, whether she wields a weapon in one or both hands.

But I'm not sure about it. What do you all think of that part?

So now all our attacks are touch attacks, but since it's on a monk chassis, I have no idea what to do with it. You can't power attack with a light weapon, maybe you could get sneak attack, but it seems underwhelming still. Any thoughts?

[Troacctid]

My thoughts are that it never at any point made sense for poison rings to be touch attacks. How is that little needle penetrating anyone's armor? I'm calling BS on the whole weapon. It's a sham.

[gijoemike]

If you turn a kama into a poison ring you lose way more than you gain. Your example may be backwards.

One can use an unarmed strike to deliver a touch attack as part of an attack series/action. One cannot use a touch attack to deliver an unarmed strike. Also the touch attack would be the entire attack action without iterative attacks meaning that couldn't be used with a flurry anyway due to the action economy.

If you flurry with the ring on you could deal 1 pt of extra damage for each normal hit against full AC. Hardly worth it. But as a monk you would need every possible trick to be considered competent.


NOTE: I have always thought the poison ring was a standard action touch attack move, and not suddenly make your unarmed attacks be wraithstrike.

[Khatoblepas]

NOTE: I have always thought the poison ring was a standard action touch attack move, and not suddenly make your unarmed attacks be wraithstrike.

Well, it says "putting the needle in place is a standard action", not attacking with it. And a Scorpion Kama uses your unarmed strike in place of it's own damage, so you'd be dealing [your unarmed damage] instead of 1 damage on a touch attack if you morph it into a poison ring. Here's what the text says:


This large but stylish ring has a reservoir that can hold a single dose of poison (injury only). To deliver the poison, the wearer must flip down a tiny, hollow needle so that it protrudes from the palm side of the ring, then make a successful touch attack against her target. Locking the needle into place requires a standard action, but the wearer tends to look rather suspicious fussing with her ring. Alternatively, the wearer can attempt to position the needle one-handed with a DC 15 Dexterity check, but failing by 5 or more indicates that she has pricked herself with the needle and is subject to the poison. An observer can notice the needle protruding from the wearer's palm with a successful DC 30 Spot check.
The ring deals 1 point of damage on a successful touch attack, plus the poison's normal damage. The victim may have to make a DC 10 Wisdom check to recognize the source of the attack if not in combat.

[Nifft]

My thoughts are that it never at any point made sense for poison rings to be touch attacks. How is that little needle penetrating anyone's armor? I'm calling BS on the whole weapon. It's a sham.

Adamantine hypodermic?

[Unavenger]

My thoughts are that it never at any point made sense for poison rings to be touch attacks. How is that little needle penetrating anyone's armor? I'm calling BS on the whole weapon. It's a sham.

I assume the idea is that it nicks their hand or something rather than piercing - or interacting in any way with - their armour at all. No clue on how that's supposed to pan out against full plate, though.

[Saintheart]

So now all our attacks are touch attacks, but since it's on a monk chassis, I have no idea what to do with it. You can't power attack with a light weapon, maybe you could get sneak attack, but it seems underwhelming still. Any thoughts?

Critfishing for status effects rather than outright damage, maybe? Admittedly there aren't many that are too great or scale up, but Fear-blasting's doable with stuff like Death Master + Doomburst quality + Resounding Blow + Eviscerator and so on... Staggering Critical with a no-save slow effect isn't too bad.

[Troacctid]

I assume the idea is that it nicks their hand or something rather than piercing - or interacting in any way with - their armour at all. No clue on how that's supposed to pan out against full plate, though.
Last I checked, stabbing someone's hand with a sword is pretty effective too, but swords aren't touch attacks.

[PoeticallyPsyco]

Maybe use the Stone Power feat for temp. HP each turn? Doesn't matter as much that you're hurting your to-hit when it's a touch attack.

In a similar vein, it makes medium- or even low-BAB classes better at hitting, if you want their abilities without losing your hit-rate.

[Gruftzwerg]

Maybe use the Stone Power feat for temp. AC each turn? Doesn't matter as much that you're hurting your to-hit when it's a touch attack.

In a similar vein, it makes medium- or even low-BAB classes better at hitting, if you want their abilities without losing your hit-rate.

Stone Power is temporary HP! ^^

Combat Expertise is temporary AC. ;)

We have found 2 more semi optimal choices here^^.

[Saintheart]

Another rough thought: the weapon might be complementary with Stormguard Warrior's Combat Rhythm? Since it's on a monk chassis, you flurry on the first round with touch attacks for +5 bonus to damage rolls next round. Touch attack goes a long way to mitigating the -2 from the flurry. When you attack with the same Morphing weapon the next round, you're hitting with touch attacks again, but this time your damage rolls are raised by +5 or more.

[PoeticallyPsyco]

Stone Power is temporary HP! ^^

Combat Expertise is temporary AC. ;)

We have found 2 more semi optimal choices here^^.

Right you are; don't know how that slipped past me. Fixed.

[Jervis]

My thoughts are that it never at any point made sense for poison rings to be touch attacks. How is that little needle penetrating anyone's armor? I'm calling BS on the whole weapon. It's a sham.

Probably something like this

https://i.imgflip.com/4/46oai5.jpg