since V can't scry were...

[tenguro]

Haley and Belkar is, does that mean Eugene can't scry where they are? sorry if this has been discussed already, it just dawned on me.

[#Raptor]

I think so, unless Eugene has some even more powerful means of scrying than V.

But how do we even know V actually tried to scry Belkar?

Afaik high int and low wis means hes highly intelligent but has little common sense, so he might not have thought of it. Maybe hes been so focused on developing the new scrying spell that he didn't think of it so far.

I mean, for all we know, Haley might be dead.
(Sure, elans propecy sayd he'll have a happy ending and he probably wouldn't have a happy ending without Haley arround, but she could still be dead right now and get raised at a later point in the story.)

[Tre of the Wood]

I'm pretty sure that you can still scry someone if they are dead. You just see their corpse, or posibly their spirit in the afterlife, so V shouldn't have been able to scry Belkar either, assuming that he is with Haley.

[Setra]

I'm pretty sure that you can still scry someone if they are dead. You just see their corpse, or posibly their spirit in the afterlife, so V shouldn't have been able to scry Belkar either, assuming that he is with Haley.
That is a hard assumption to make at this point though, it is entirely possible they have split up now.

In any case, my opinion is that Cloister blocks almost all scrying.. maybe even from deities.

[David Argall]

Eugene's level is highly uncertain. He casts a permanent form of Programmed Image [6th level] to hide that Belkar is on the loose. In theory he can manage that at 11th with a generous DM, but demanding this be an
8th level spell [=15th+ level caster] looks entirely reasonable. So Eugene might be able to help out here.

[factotum]

But of course, we don't know what the caster level of the spell that Xykon's using to block the scrying is. It appeared to be some work of Dorukan's, and if so, Dorukan presumably designed the spell to block Xykon's own scrying attempts; therefore it can block an epic-level lich sorcerer, so Eugene doesn't have much hope of penetrating it.

Of course, there's always the possibility that Eugene's unique location (the waiting room of the afterlife) may give his scrying attempts added power that they wouldn't have had in life--guess we'll have to wait and see!

[Armond]

I mean, for all we know, Haley might be dead.
(Sure, elans propecy sayd he'll have a happy ending and he probably wouldn't have a happy ending without Haley arround, but she could still be dead right now and get raised at a later point in the story.)

Never said he'd have a happy ending with her, nor that she would have a happy ending.

[FujinAkari]

I think Eugene can, if only because of the Greenhilt Sword being with Haley. The Greenhilt Sword has already been confirmed to allow Eugene to manifest at Roy's location, and so it would hardly be surprising if it also allows Eugene to penetrate Xykon's wards.

[holywhippet]

But of course, we don't know what the caster level of the spell that Xykon's using to block the scrying is. It appeared to be some work of Dorukan's, and if so, Dorukan presumably designed the spell to block Xykon's own scrying attempts; therefore it can block an epic-level lich sorcerer, so Eugene doesn't have much hope of penetrating it.

That depends, if it's that item on Xykon's head that is producing the anti-scrying field then it could be from Dorukan. However, if it's a spell he's casting directly then it can't be. Sorcerers can't learn spells from spellbooks so it would have to be one he's taken with his spell picks.

[Setra]

I think Eugene can, if only because of the Greenhilt Sword being with Haley. The Greenhilt Sword has already been confirmed to allow Eugene to manifest at Roy's location, and so it would hardly be surprising if it also allows Eugene to penetrate Xykon's wards.
Ah, that is something I hadn't thought of before.

It could very well be possible.

[geekyhedgehog]

Or Eugene/Roy could just manifest at their location, especially seeing as how, indirectly, they are still trying to fulfill the Blood Oath of Vengance by destroying Xykon

[#Raptor]

Eugene's level is highly uncertain.
+

Of course, there's always the possibility that Eugene's unique location (the waiting room of the afterlife) may give his scrying attempts added power that they wouldn't have had in life--guess we'll have to wait and see!
+

I think Eugene can, if only because of the Greenhilt Sword being with Haley. The Greenhilt Sword has already been confirmed to allow Eugene to manifest at Roy's location, and so it would hardly be surprising if it also allows Eugene to penetrate Xykon's wards.

= (possibly) lots of plusses! :smallbiggrin:

Well... i guess we'll really have to see, but now i think Eugene might have a fairly good chance of breaking through Xyklons "cloister" spell.

[Greg]

I suppose it depends on the specifics of the "Cloister" effect. If it affects only humanoids (Do petitioners count?) or the living or is limited to the material plane, then Eugene would be able to see in.

If it only affects the living, it might explain how Xykon found Dorukan, and managed to draw him out. If not, it could be that it prevents outside scryers from seeing in, but you could scry from within to see either inside or outside.

[wumpus]

I couldn't find cloister in the SRD, any hints on what it does?

[Armond]

No one knows - it's homebrew.

[Warlord JK]

Eugene specifically said that too look at the world from the clouds, its "like scrying". Theres probably different rules for the scrying and I bet that Eugene and Roy will probably still be able to scry.

[ysp]

Even if he could scry what will it give Eugene or Roy? Satisfaction?

[factotum]

That depends, if it's that item on Xykon's head that is producing the anti-scrying field then it could be from Dorukan. However, if it's a spell he's casting directly then it can't be. Sorcerers can't learn spells from spellbooks so it would have to be one he's taken with his spell picks.

Given the yellow flare that covered Azure City as the spell was cast was exactly the same colour as the stuff coming out of the headband, AND the fact Xykon was wearing the headband at all, I think it's near 100% certain the headband was the source of the spell; we also know yellow is Dorukan's spell colour (we see it in the brief picture of their duel that appears in the online comic). Applying Occam's Razor it's a lot easier to believe that Xykon obtained the headband from Dorukan and then used it to cast the spell than any of the possible alternatives.

[Lord_Butters_I]

It's Xykon's Cloister spell that's preventing scrying, which was cast using Duroken's magic. Duroken was an epic level caster, and Eugine wasn't, so I don't predict Eugine being able to overcome the block.

[#Raptor]

Never said he'd have a happy ending with her, nor that she would have a happy ending.
I agree. However, many people read it that way, so i felt i should mention that haley being dead right now wouldn't necessary mean he doesn't get a happy ending with haley.


I'm pretty sure that you can still scry someone if they are dead. You just see their corpse, or posibly their spirit in the afterlife, so V shouldn't have been able to scry Belkar either, assuming that he is with Haley.
At least now we know that in the oots-universe this doesn't seems to be the case. (V: ...Or Miss Starshine is not able to be found as a result of her being- Elan: She is NOT dead.)

[Dunamin]

I'm pretty sure that you can still scry someone if they are dead. You just see their corpse, or posibly their spirit in the afterlife, so V shouldn't have been able to scry Belkar either, assuming that he is with Haley.
That is not the case. If you attempt to target a dead character with the Scrying spell, if simply fails.

Of couse, you might be able to find or research a non-core spell that specifically also had this power, but this seems not to be the case with V's spell (according to his/her statements in panel 4 of comic 505).