Character Builds Megathread

[Civis Mundi]

As you may have noticed, there’s been some recent discussion in the Eclectic Collection of Fun and Effective Builds (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?583957-An-Eclectic-Collection-of-Fun-and-Effective-Builds) regarding what’s supposed to go in there. And it’s a reasonable question, because the purpose of the thread has evolved over time. It began as a collection for Ludic’s builds alone, and has since expanded to include builds inspired by Ludic’s style – unusual, but meticulously optimized to use all parts of the character.

I don’t think I’m alone in feeling inspired by Ludic’s work. It’s that inspiration that led to some bloat of the original thread – but I think part of this is a lack of release valve for eccentric builds that are still in progress.

So, let’s use this thread as a place where anyone can feel free to post those builds. The community can then give their commentary to help polish them and optimize them over time. Eventually, some of those builds might get polished enough to merit inclusion in the Eclectic Collection.

I do think some ground rules might help optimize the thread itself. Feel free to suggest your own contributions, or amendments to these:


Rule 1: Begin with a thesis. What is this build designed for? This will help others optimize your concept, and also help people looking for character ideas to find what they’d like to play.
Rule 2: No double-posting. Feel free to include multiple builds in the same post, or even edit in, but use your discretion – the more you put out there at once, the harder it can be for someone to find something specific to work with.
Rule 3: Though this thread is lower pressure and not reserved for “finished works,” let’s try to remember the spirit of the Eclectic Collection in our design. I think Evaar put it nicely:


The key is in utilizing everything those classes give access to in order to accomplish a lot of things across all pillars of gameplay and preferably is viable from level 1 - 20.


Build Index

Dalinar's "The Fog and Jog (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=24978489&postcount=2)"
Stattick's "Queen of Blades (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=24978749&postcount=4)" (aka Kerrigan)
prototype00's "Baul Punyun (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=24979038&postcount=12)"
Civis Mundi's "Nettlebane (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=24979457&postcount=14)"
Renduaz's "The Nullifer (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=24979546&postcount=15)"
Jon talks a lot's "The Economy is in Shambles (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=24979673&postcount=17)"
whateew's "No more squishies! (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=24979739&postcount=20)"
Evaar's "Everyone's Best Friend (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=24976191&postcount=1004)"
RingoBongo's "Caliban (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=24980962&postcount=31)"
GeistInMachine's "The Spirit Warrior (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=24981044&postcount=34)"


I’d like to contribute some work of my own, but I have to rush off. I figured I’d put this up there to get the ball rolling, and edit in my additions later today.

EDIT: And here we go. Nothing I feel ready to post in the Eclectic Collection, but perhaps worth posting here:

Mesmer: Battlesmith/Enchanter

THESIS: A while back, someone* mentioned combining the Enchanter's Hypnotic Gaze with the sanctuary spell for a strange tank indeed. Both the ability and the spell are somewhat unimpressive apart, but they do play well together. Sanctuary could make a powerful defensive tool, but it makes it hard to participate in combat without breaking the spell. Hypnotic Gaze allows a way to lock down enemies without breaking sanctuary, or even using resources. These were the main questions I had in mind when going forward.

How do you keep the character alive? Hypnotic Gaze means melee range. Wizard means low HP.

More importantly, how do you make the build interesting to play? One trick ponies are all well and good, but using your action to lock down one target within 5' every turn and waiting for people to hit you will be incredibly boring without other stuff to do. That means things you can do with your bonus action that don't break sanctuary, and it means other tricks to keep you relevant when there aren't any nails to hammer or you just want to do something else.

*I've been combing through my post history to try and find who first tipped me off to this combo, but I can't find it. If you recognize yourself, please let me know.



RACES: I went with Rock Gnome, because Gnome Cunning is a great thing for a tank to have and it fits the whole asthetic. But with Tasha's, you can pretty much pick whatever suits you. Yuan-Ti would be a fitting choice too, and very effective.

STATS: INT is #1, CON is #2, the rest is up to you. I went with (assuming Rock Gnome): STR 8 / DEX 14 / CON 14 / INT 16 / WIS 14 / CHA 8. It would make sense to raise that Charisma, since this character will also feature a lot of social manipulation abilities. But with so many other stats competing for importance, I conceived as the character as a schemer in the shadows. Rather than using your own charisma, the brains behind the party face.

CLASSES: You definitely want to start Artificer for the CON saves and armor/shield proficiency. Guidance and mending are probably the best longterm cantrip choices, but firebolt makes those early levels a bit smoother.

We’re also going Enchanter, of course, since Hypnotic Gaze is the reason this build exists. Between Artificer and Wizard levels, that means all the rituals you could ever want, along with the standard defensive spells. Booming blade and lightning lure could be some good alternatives to your usual schtick.

As for Artificer subclass, Battlesmith is a perfect fit. At 3rd level, using INT for weapon attacks and damage will give you the ability to occasionally hit someone. At 5th level, Extra Attack makes that more effective, and you gain access to aid, great for both your tanking and your support. But the big one is the Steel Defender. It can help you tank with Deflect Attack, or stick by a backliner if they need protection. You can also use your bonus action to command your Steel Defender. Its attack doesn’t deal much damage, but it’s force damage, and it doesn’t break sanctuary.

Beyond that, I’m not sure what the best level spread would be. More Artificer levels means more HP for your Steel Defender, but its other stats scale based on proficiency bonus. More Enchanter levels mean higher level Wizard spells. It never hurts to concentrate on some other powerful control or buff while your make googly eyes at your enemies. Plus, the Enchanter gets some interesting higher level goodies with Instinctive Charm and especially Split Enchantment. But Artificer gets some good stuff too in Arcane Jolt, Flash of Genius, more Infusions, and the massively powerful Spell-Storing Item.

INFUSIONS: Enhanced Defense and Enhanced Weapon are a given, but Helm of Telepathy is my favorite infusion for this build – it’s super flavorful, with plenty of out-of-combat utility. The Cloak of Elvenkind and Hat of Disguise will help with any spylike shenanigans, and the Cloak of Protection will make you even harder to take down.

ASI/FEATS: Pretty much the usual for a caster. You’ll max your casting stat, pick up War Caster when you can (both to maintain concentration as a frontliner and to use booming blade as an opportunity attack), and do what you like otherwise. I think Alert’s a good pick.

IMPORTANT SPELLS: Sanctuary is a cornerstone, and aid is really good too. You’ll always want to be concentrating on something that doesn’t require extra actions of your own, if you intend on using Hypnotic Gaze. It’s up to you whether you want to focus on further control or on buffing your allies. You might also use haste on yourself when you’re going full frontliner and eschewing Hypnotic Gaze, making your already impressive AC even stronger.

SUMMARY: At the end of the day, I wouldn’t call this an optimized build, since the combo it’s built around simply isn’t strong enough to merit the designation. But it will create a hardy tank that plays in a unique way. It features a layered defense, various options in combat, and lots of out of combat utility, especially in social situations.


Here's another one – like Dalinar's Fog and Jog below, this one is a Genie Warlock. I'm not sure where to take it at higher levels either.

The Genie Meanie (Daolock)

THESIS: A straightforward but wacky blaster using Repelling Blast and Grasp of Hadar in conjunction with spike growth, bouncing your enemies back and forth as you drag them across the spikes.


RACES: Pretty much anything is fine. For max DPR, you might consider going Protector or Fallen Aasimar. Their CHA boost makes them a fine choice even without Tasha's rules.

STATS: Pretty much standard for Warlock. CHA is king, DEX, WIS and CON to keep you alive, STR and INT to dump.

CLASSES: Genie Warlock (Dao) is the whole deal, pretty much. By level 5, you have everything you need – eldritch blast, spike growth, Agonizing Blast, Repelling Blast, and Grasp of Hadar. You'll even have 18 CHA thanks to your ASI, maybe even 20 if you're not using point buy.

ASI/FEATS: CHA 20 is priority. You might use feats like Fey Touched, Shadow Touched, Telekinetic or Telepathic to get you there in a more interesting way. And you might pick up the usuals to keep yourself up.

SUMMARY: Concentrating on spike growth means no hex, but each hit with your eldritch blast will push or pull a target 10'. For every 5' a target travels across the spikes, they take an extra 2d4 magical piercing damage, no save. Neither Repelling Blast nor Grasp of Hadar have size restrictions, and they don't require a save either, so you can bop the Tarrasque around if that's your speed. That's some pretty decent damage, and a fun way to deliver it.

[Dalinar]

Thanks for making the thread! I almost did myself, but didn't know if I'd be stepping on the toes of some unspoken forum rule I didn't know about, or if I wanted the burden of potentially updating the OP constantly with more links to posts. (That said, seeing as this is the second post, if you need me to edit links into this post later down the line, and I'm still around, I'll gladly help make more room for the OP.)

Anyway, I'll start us off with a character inspired by this post by Sol0botmate (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=24897369&postcount=881), using the Fog Cloud + Bonus Action Hide combo in a different way than either of those builds. However, I'm having trouble figuring out how to scale it past level 5, so this is a better place for it than the Eclectic Collection, for now at least.

I present:

The Fog and Jog
Pending literally any other reasonable name

THESIS: At low levels, Fog Cloud + Bonus Action Hide is a powerful defensive combo, albeit one that depends on the notoriously confusing obscuration rules (meaning run it by your DM so they know what you're trying to accomplish and can rule on any questions you might have prior to session 1). There are a few different sources of Fog Cloud, but one I haven't seen explored very much is the Marid Genielock, so I thought I'd give it a whirl!

WHEN TO RUN THIS BUILD: Do try this build if your party is on board with tactics more careful than simply a smash-and-grab, if you're not expecting to deal with high winds very much, and if you get rests with reasonable frequency. (Expect to spend about one spell slot per encounter, and consider saving it for when you need it rather than just throwing down your obscuration immediately.) Do not run this build if you expect enemies with blindsight or tremorsense (DM dependent, you might still be okay if you have a high Stealth check), if your DM likes to break your concentration in new and creative ways, if your preferred answer to enemy martials sitting on the caster is "get the barbarian to kill them" (i.e. it's hard to get advantage on someone heavily obscured, so be careful if your party relies on it), if your DM likes to kill your familiar (spoilers, it's Chainlock), or if you don't have access to Bonus Action Hide (Goblins appear in Volo's Guide to Monsters; you could also go this road after starting as a Rogue 2, but that seems weird to me; and on that note, I should clarify that my personal DM uses a homebrew setting with a different Nimble Escape race, but for your guys' sake I'll translate what I'm thinking to Goblin). We're also not a DPR machine, so maybe look elsewhere for that. Lastly, I assume you have a fair amount of space to work with; this might play very differently in a dungeon crawler compared to an overworld war campaign or even an intrigue campaign.

RACE: As you might have guessed, we're a Goblin. Nimble Escape is a critical step to making this build work.
STATS: Assuming point buy, we max CHA, of course. If not using Tasha's ASI swaps, DEX and CON get bonuses, which is still useful to us, as our first priority is to not die.
No Tasha's: 8 STR, 16 DEX, 16 CON, 8 INT, 10 WIS, 15 CHA
Tasha's: STR/INT/WIS the same. 17 CHA. 16 DEX, 14 CON or vice-versa depending on whether you care more about Stealth checks/AC or Concentration checks/HP.
CLASSES: Marid Genielock 6 / ?? (still working this out)
ASI/FEATS: Half-feat @ 4, since our CHA is an odd number. Your priorities afterwards are maxing CHA, protecting your Concentration (Res:Con or War Caster), grabbing Skill Expert (Stealth), and then stuff like Alert/Lucky if you have any leftovers after that.
EQUIPMENT: The best light armor you can get your hands on, since that's all we're proficient in. Simple weapon of choice for when Eldritch Blast isn't an option for whatever reason. Keep it stowed, use a shield for the AC, and cast with your other hand most of the time.

LEVEL PROGRESSION:

Warlock 1: Genie (Marid) is our patron, as mentioned. The extra two damage a turn on your attack roll will make us much more consistent at damage-dealing, the free storage space is sweet, and the spells added to our spell list are great too. Pick up Eldritch Blast, shocking no one. Also get Fog Cloud, but you only have one spell slot, so blow it in an emergency when you need cover. You know one other cantrip and one other first-level spell; I'd grab your favorite utility cantrip (Mage Hand, Prestidigitation, and especially Minor Illusion come to mind), and then either another utility spell or perhaps something like Thunderwave. Armor of Agathys is another good first-level spell, especially if swarmed by weak enemies.

Warlock 2: Invocations, a second spell slot, and another first-level spell known. Another unsurprising pair of picks here: Agonizing Blast and Repelling Blast. AB is basically always good, especially with how much we're going to rely on EB, and Repelling Blast will help us quite a bit in a few levels.

Warlock 3: Tons of stuff here. We go Pact of the Chain and summon a pseudodragon, which has flight, blindsense, and limited telepathy, all of which we will make great use of later. It can't go invisible like the imp, but that's OK (we can switch 'em if we want to have an invisible imp fly us around in our vessel, as many Genielocks like doing). Its job is to spot targets for us (and our party, via its innate telepathy) that are themselves heavily obscured, probably by our own Fog Cloud, so we always know where to fire. (My DM ruled that this is isn't the same as "seeing the target" and so isn't enough to give us advantage on the roll, but it's still better than what the other guy has to put up with.)

We get a new spell known, and our slots get upgraded to second level. Lots of potentially good defensive options open up, such as Blur from the Marid list, Invisibility or Misty Step (being aware we'll get one of those at level 4 anyway), or my personal favorite, Mirror Image. It's not quite RAW, unfortunately, but I imagine shell-gaming people with three duplicates while the real Warlock goes and hides. Still, nobody wants to play the shell game in a 40-foot-radius Fog Cloud, right? Plus, it doesn't use concentration! Could also grab Hold Person or Suggestion.

Warlock 4: Cantrip known, spell known, ASI. The first two I've basically covered already; the ASI should probably go to a half-feat that gives us an even CHA score. Fey-touched (Gift of Alacrity) is my personal pick, as Misty Step into regular-Action Hide is a great way to confuse enemies further that are looking for you in your cloud, while bonuses to initiative are always welcome. If you prefer Shadow-touched, consider Disguise Self. Cast it while in hiding, make yourself look like your pursuer's buddy, hilarity ensues. Lastly, if neither of those options excite you somehow, Skill Expert (Stealth) makes you a better hider, although you may have a better chance to pick it up later if you grab Resilient: Constitution and thus need another half-feat.

Warlock 5: This one's a doozy: better cantrips, one spell known, third-level slots, +1 proficiency, and an invocation. Working backwards through that list, two invocations spring to mind: Voice of the Chain Master and Eldritch Mind. If you take the latter, you greatly lessen the importance of War Caster (although it's still good anyway if you find yourself getting chances at OAs for some reason--luckily you can swap out the invocation if you decide you prefer War Caster later). VOTCM is fantastic for long-distance scouting and communication, which basically means we ace the "exploration" pillar, and the RP opportunities from talking through your familiar are great. The +1 proficiency just makes you better at pretty much everything you do, bumping your free Genie damage by 1, letting you spend longer in your bottle, your skill checks and spell save DC all get better, etc.

Now here's the game changer: we get our first third-level spell at this level. Warlocks have some nice options, although they pale in comparison to the Wizard, but for us, we pick Sleet Storm. This is a beast of a control spell: 40ft radius cylinder--big enough to cover just about any critical area--with four main effects: heavy obscuration, difficult terrain, forced DEX saves every turn and on entry versus falling prone, and forced concentration checks every turn for casters. By comparison, Hunger of Hadar (a common Warlock 5 pick) covers half the radius (and is a sphere instead of a cylinder, which may or may not matter), heavily obscures, creates difficult terrain, and does some damage every turn. I'll let you all debate which is better, but Sleet Storm is the real reason I picked Marid--I just noticed it also got Fog Cloud after the fact and chose to build around both.

A creature that falls prone spends half of its move just picking itself back up, and a flying creature knocked prone falls (the cylinder goes up to 20 feet, so low fliers are vulnerable, but high fliers can just go over). This makes a Sleet Storm incredibly difficult to escape without magical aid. The downside is that theoretically, you can't see inside the Sleet Storm, so it's really hard to actually attack anyone there. Luckily for us, everything we've done so far comes together at this level: the pseudodragon does not only rely on sight and thus doesn't care about the obscuration, so it can spot for us (although I'd consider just having it patrol around the edges so it doesn't get proned) and for our teammates (since it's actually telepathic and not just Find Familiar-telepathic). Chekhov's Gun fires for us at this level, as the Repelling Blast invocation we took way back at level 2 gets its main purpose here: to push enemies back into the storm. And did I mention this is at the same level we get our second Eldritch Blast beam? Even our feat can help us position better to cast the spell, conceal our position, or escape its effects if we have to cast it on top of us, depending on which way you went with it.

This is the part where you really have to think about party composition. The melees will probably be happy to shred anyone that escapes, or perhaps even dive in themselves, while I'm sure the Evoker will thank you for giving them a free target range at the same level they got Fireball. On the other hand, your Elven Accuracy-packing buddies might not be so impressed, while casters that rely on "creature you can see" spells will just be flat-out annoyed with you. If you think the rest of the party wouldn't be cool with you casting Sleet Storm, don't take it; and in that case, probably don't go Marid for your Warlock, either (unless you have a different plan, like being a Bladelock with Blur and PAM or something), and reconsider your race choice as well unless you still think you'll have opportunities to Hide.

---

Now my problem is, where do I go from here? Genie 6 is a pretty powerful level, giving us no-concentration flight, cold resistance, and another spell known, but 7 gets kinda weird: Sleet Storm doesn't scale with spell level, your new Marid spell choice for fourth-level spells is Control Water (very campaign-dependent), your new Genie spell choice is Phantasmal Killer (meh), and while you could grab a lower-level spell that scales well, I'm not sure what would constitute that other than something like Hold Person (which you probably got at 3-4). Your 8 ASI is +2 CHA, which will max it given Tasha's rules are in play, but your spell list still doesn't impress me in this range. Luckily level 9 saves us with Cone of Cold, which is a pretty brutal spell, along with another invocation; and level 10 gives us a much easier way to fit short rests into the day, which will help since we're still only on two spell slots until 11.

Usually an empty level is a sign that it's a good time to multiclass, but I'm having a hard time coming up with one that's actually worth taking here. You're way behind on traditional spellcasting by this point, so I wouldn't recommend a traditional caster (imagine getting Fireball at level 11), but martials feel like a waste too--Barb is a no-go for several obvious reasons, and we don't want to waste our precious few high-level slots on Paladin smites even if we had the STR score. Swarmkeeper Ranger could, in theory, augment Sleet Storm, with the tiny problems that A) we also don't have the ability score to legally multiclass there and B) Eldritch Blast already does that for us and sometimes does it better.

Actually, let's cut down on the noise of excessive options a little. Given the stats we have, our multiclass choices are CHA classes (which we're way behind on, as I said) or DEX classes (namely Rogue and Fighter).

I think the interesting one here is Fighter, as a low-INT Eldritch Knight is still pretty decently compatible with our Warlock abilities. We get more low-level slots for Fog Cloud and the like, letting us save our big hitters for our Pact Magic slots, and we can get Blind Fighting to augment our obscuration tactics further. Action Surge is always a pleasure to have, and it synergizes with Pact Magic since both come back on a short rest (though you'll probably just use it on an extra Eldritch Blast, not that there's anything wrong with that). Shield and Absorb Elements are great for attacks we can't simply Hide from, and we already have two great any-school picks for EK anyway (that is, Find Familiar and Fog Cloud), so you can pick up something like Gift of Alacrity (if you don't have it from Fey-touched), Unseen Servant, Alarm, or whatever. Just avoid anything with a save DC or attack roll since those will use INT.

Arcane Trickster is another possibility, albeit one I'm less familiar with. They prefer enchantment and illusion spells, which I don't think are as suited to us (at least not with INT as the save DC), and we don't have a good excuse to use Sneak Attack since we're Eldritch Blasting everything. Granted, Bonus Action Dash is pretty nice (we already have Disengage and Hide).

But I'm still unsure where to go. Penny for your thoughts, GITP? Straight Genie 20? Dip into EK? Dip into another CHA class? Something else I haven't considered?

[Civis Mundi]

Thanks for making the thread! I almost did myself, but didn't know if I'd be stepping on the toes of some unspoken forum rule I didn't know about, or if I wanted the burden of potentially updating the OP constantly with more links to posts. (That said, seeing as this is the second post, if you need me to edit links into this post later down the line, and I'm still around, I'll gladly help make more room for the OP.)

You're very welcome! I figured if there were any unspoken rules to be broken, I'd be happy to shoulder the weight of the faux pas.

Also, thank you for the formatting. I've been agonizing over it myself, and I think I'm just going to follow your example.


I present:

The Fog and Jog
Pending literally any other reasonable name
...
Penny for your thoughts, GITP? Straight Genie 20? Dip into EK? Dip into another CHA class? Something else I haven't considered?

First off, you have to keep "the Fog and Jog." At least that's what I'm calling it.

I do think there's good reason to take Warlock at least to 14th. Sanctuary Vessel and Limited Wish are both really strong. After that, I like the idea of dipping Bard -- maybe Eloquence to force failure against things like sleet storm or other controls. A character in my signature is built along those lines. You might be "starting over" when multiclassing into another full caster, but those extra slots do allow your warlock slots to breathe a bit. Having other slots to use for this and that lets you save those short rest slots for maximum impact. If you're not too excited by Warlock 8-20, you might even go Bard sooner. The Fog and Jog excels at control and support, and Bard leans into that for sure. It could also add some variety to your repertoire when a situation doesn't suit your usual tricks.

[Stattick]

Queen of Blades
(open to suggestions, analysis, and commentary... needs some polish, and probably a good optimizer's eye)

A melee caster, with a fetish for blades. Does pretty well crit-fishing.

After they rescued her from a miserable existence with the Drow, she asked her rescuers to teach her Blade-Singing. Because she was half human and Drow, they said, "No." So she found a more powerful way.

https://i.pinimg.com/564x/58/f2/55/58f255cf1e0653a02fd4fc2a01bc1192.jpg

Half-Elf Drow, Drow Magic
Hexblade (2-4), Abjurer X
Progression: All Hexblade levels first, then Abjuration Wizard for all subsequent levels

Stats (Point Buy): Str 8, Dex 15, Con 13, Int 15, Wis 8, Chr 12
Origin Customization (Tasha's): +2 Dex, +1 Int, +1 Chr
Background: Golgari Agent (We want Entangle on our Wizard list. If Ravnica backgrounds aren't allowed in your game, Stealth can be useful for generating advantage)

ASIs: Elven Accuracy: Dex, Resilient: Con, +2 Int, +2 Int (Can swap a +2 Int for +2 Dex if you prefer Dex 20/Int 18)... if you opt to to Hexblade 4, you'll get another ASI, which could go into Warcaster, bump Dex AND Int to 20, or grab something else.

Hexblade

You want this as your first level. More HP means more survivability. Grab Booming Blade. You'll be using this as your main attack cantrip. Your Chr is the bare minimum, and won't be increased. Spells that rely on your Warlock casting attribute, Chr, are going to be unreliable. Therefore Eldrich Blast is a trap option.

Cantrips: Booming Blade. Minor Illusion for your second choice (or utility). (We also get Dancing Lights from Half-Elf).
Spells: By the time you leave Hexblade, you want: armor of agathys, hellish rebuke, and shield. Armor of Agathys will help fuel our Abjuration Arcane Ward. Once Elven Accuracy comes on-line you'll crit more often then most, especially when you have your Hexblade's Curse up (extends crit range). Hex - seems like a great spell. But in a few levels, you'll have better things to use your concentration on. The Hex spell might be worth having for the first few levels, but be sure to ditch it before you leave Hexblade.

Invocations: Armor of Shadows (mage armor at will), Fiendish Vigor (false life at will). Both of these spells will feed our Arcane Ward for the rest of the game. If you're awake, you should have Mage Armor up. You should always have Temp HP too, from False Life (or Armor of Agathys). It's important to point out that your Arcane Ward from Abjurer takes damage first, then your temp HP. So let's say you're a 2nd level Hexblade and 6th level Abjurer: you have 15 Faux HP from the ward. On top of that, you have at least 5 Temp HP from False Life, which you can cast at will. Some GMs are fine with saying that your Temp HP are just at 8 (max roll) if you haven't been hit, since you can cast the spell over and over until you hit 8 (no concentration required, and the THP last an hour). So that's 20-23 points of damage you're preventing. That's huge. But if you know you're going into a fight where there's lots of gribblies, cast Armor of Agathys on yourself first. Now you have the 15 Faux HP from your ward, and then 15 Temp HP from Agathys. The Faux HP gets hit first, then damage is applied to your Temp HP. And each time you get hit, the creature that hit you takes 15 points of damage until you have no more Temp HP left. The synergy between Arcane Ward and Armor of Agathys is fantastic.

DON'T stay in Hexblade to 5th, to grab Thirsting Blade - it's a trap. We don't want to further delay our Wizard spell progression. The only reason to stay in to 4th, is if you REALLY want full ASIs, and that might not be worth it; you'll loose 9th level spells - no Wish for you. Probably most useful to just take 2 levels of Hexblade, but 3 levels gets you 2nd level spell slots, an extra spell known (remember, Warlock spells can be cast with normal slots and wizard spells can be cast with Warlock slots), the ability to never be disarmed, and a weapon that can become any weapon you need right now (assuming you go Blade Pact, which is the most thematically appropriate, but nothing's stopping you from going Chain or Tome).

Abjuration Wizard

Cantrips: We already have Booming Blade, Minor Illusion, and Dancing Lights. We get three more: Sword Burst (when you get mobbed), Fire Bolt (or another ranged spell attack cantrip - we do better when we're rolling to attack if we can get advantage - use your familiar), and Prestidigitation (or a different utility if you prefer). At 4th level Wiz, ask your GM's permission to take the Sapping Sting cantrip (Explorer's Guide to Wildemount) - if so, it'll become one of your most important cantrips eventually.

Spells: First off, plan on taking most, if not all, abjuration spells - casting them feeds into Arcane Ward. I'm just going to highlight some spells for the build.

1st lvl: Catapult - throw dead enemy's swords at people with a flick of your hand like a Jedi (better yet, if they're in a line, so if you miss the first guy, hit the guy behind him). Find Familiar - owl, by taking the Help action in combat, gives you advantage, and owls are immune to reaction attacks for leaving an enemy's reach. Shield (you start w/ a respectable 18 AC w/ Mage Armor & a shield... burst for a round to AC 23 as a reaction). Fog Cloud - block line of sight. Unseen Servant - it isn't concentration, so inventive players can do all kinds of things with their invisible buddy, and it's a ritual, so you can make one whenever you want or are bored/waiting w/o expending a slot. Speaking of Ritual Spells, just grab all of them you can. You already have Entangle and Faerie Fire (Entangle for weak, dexterous enemies, Faerie Fire for strong clumsies) - these spells are concentration, but let you fire, and then get Adv to hit the effected for synergy w/ Elven Accuracy.

2nd lvl: Cloud of Daggers (not great, but thematic, if you want to slow enemies in a chokepoint). Flaming Sphere - it's nice to have something to do with your Bonus Action every turn, but this is only a goto IF you aren't in melee (reserving your Bonus for Misty Steps), which is where you should be, so might not be worth taking. Misty Step - get out of trouble, Shadow Blade - this is MUCH BETTER than your pact weapon most of the time, AND you can use Booming Blade with it, AND you get advantage to hit in dim environments, which means your Elven Accuracy comes into play once it comes online at Wiz 4 (unless you went to Hex 4). Web - to trap enemies in an area - it's obscured, difficult terrain, but it takes Str to break out, so won't slow bruisers for long.

3rd lvl: Counterspell (always useful), Fireball or Lightning Bolt, because otherwise the other wizards will make fun of you.

4th lvl: Greater Invisibility - now you have advantage, and can have your owl help the fighter. You'll hit and crit more, BUT can't have Shadow Blade up.

5th lvl: HERE IT IS: Animate Objects - all those daggers you have strapped onto your body like a crazy person, (see pic above), you animate them and send them off to kill enemies. It takes an action to cast and requires concentration, so no more Shadow Blade, you'll back to using your pact weapon when you have this active. On subsequent rounds, IT ONLY TAKES A BONUS ACTION to direct your animated daggers. Those daggers are probably going to be doing about Fireball damage to a single target each round... unless they have advantage and/or you upcast it. Give the animated daggers advantage by knocking an opponent prone with Sapping Sting as your action, and then stabbing them to death with your dagger swarm. Upcasting is worth it.

Now that swarm IS NOT going to benefit from your Elven Accuracy, unless your GM is overly generous. Also, you can cast a non-concentration spell on top of this every round; as stated above, Sapping Sting is great, but it can be Booming Blade, or you can lay down Fireballs, Shatters, Catapults, etc. Animate Objects is especially effective if your table is using the popular house rule to treat critical hits like was done in 4e: max damage, plus a roll of the dice.

There are time you don't want to use Animate Objects: if you're in an environment where everything takes damage each round, for instance. Animated Tiny Objects only have 20 hp, so they're also vulnerable to being taken out with an AoE. On the other hand, they're pretty good at breaking concentration from most creatures, especially if the objects have advantage to hit... so long as the caster's Save isn't really high. Tiny objects aren't likely to ever do more than 21 points of damage, so the caster only needs to get a 10 to maintain concentration. If they have a +6, that means that they need to roll at least a 5 on their d20. That's only a 20% chance for failure. But when you hit with six different animated objects, they need to roll at least a 5, and do that six times in a row. But if they have more than a +8 on their checks, then it's impossible for them to fail, unless the GM has instituted house rules that say that a 1 always fails or something like that.

Use a spreadsheet, so you only have to hit F9 (or some variation on that, depending on the program) to make a new attack with the dagger swarm. When you're rolling for 14 daggers with advantage ever round, you don't want to make the table wait all night. When you've upcast and have advantage, the damage can top 100 HP... as a bonus attack.

It's probably worth investing in silvered and/or adamantine daggers or spikes.

Magic Items: You want to boost Con. Amulet of Health should be your goal. A high damage finesse weapon, especially one with extra dice for the crits - flame tongue or something.

[Civis Mundi]

Queen of Blades
(open to suggestions, analysis, and commentary)

Cool concept, and I love the picture to go with it! One of the most flavorful use of animate objects I've seen.

One thing to note is that I don't think you can get access to racial feats like Elven Accuracy with a Custom Lineage. From this (https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/1367309850707849216)tweet:

"In Tasha's Cauldron of Everything, the custom lineage option is chosen in lieu of a race, such as elf or dwarf. If you choose the custom lineage, you don't qualify for things in the game that require elf, dwarf, and the like."

Crawford's contradicted himself too many times to truly be a reliable source, but that does make the RAI pretty clear. For a build that can work its magic at all tables, you might want to tweak that.

[Stattick]

Cool concept, and I love the picture to go with it! One of the most flavorful use of animate objects I've seen.

One thing to note is that I don't think you can get access to racial feats like Elven Accuracy with a Custom Lineage. From this (https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/1367309850707849216)tweet:

"In Tasha's Cauldron of Everything, the custom lineage option is chosen in lieu of a race, such as elf or dwarf. If you choose the custom lineage, you don't qualify for things in the game that require elf, dwarf, and the like."

Crawford's contradicted himself too many times to truly be a reliable source, but that does make the RAI pretty clear. For a build that can work its magic at all tables, you might want to tweak that.

It's not custom lineage, it's just customizing where the attribute bonuses go. But it wouldn't be too hard to tweak if a table didn't accept that.

[Civis Mundi]

It's not custom lineage, it's just customizing where the attribute bonuses go. But it wouldn't be too hard to tweak if a table didn't accept that.

Ohhh, sorry, I misunderstood! Note rescinded. I'd like to have another look tomorrow when my brain is refreshed and see if I have any other thoughts.

[Galithar]

Queen of Blades
(open to suggestions, analysis, and commentary)


Just a few things to point out.

You can't choose to spell Smite on crits only. The bonus action Smite spells must be cast before the attack and trigger on the next weapon hit. This also eats your concentration, so no Shadow Blade Smite, invisible Smite, or smiting while using Animated Objects.

Speaking of Animated Objects the spell gets a lot of praise but it is EXTREMELY vulnerable to AoE. Just be mindful of this. Like any summon it can be killed, and this one has particularly low health. Though still more than the Druids swarm of Wolves.

Leomund's Tiny Hut has a casting time of 1 minute, not one action. No in combat casting unless you spend the requisite 10 rounds casting. (110 rounds of you want to ritual cast it!)


Very on theme, but very sub optimal from what I see. You're extremely far behind in spell level. Though you have some short rest slots to give staying power through the day you still have a wizard's hit dice. And by making a MAD wizard that needs high Dex (they want it high, but rarely sacrifice something to boost it) high int, 13 Cha, and high Con. You're putting a lot of eggs in the amulet of health basket.

[Gignere]

Queen of Blades
(open to suggestions, analysis, and commentary... needs some polish, and probably a good optimizer's eye)

A melee caster, with a fetish for blades. Does pretty well crit-fishing.

5th lvl: HERE IT IS: Animate Objects - all those daggers you have strapped onto your body like a crazy person, (see pic above), you animate them and send them off to kill enemies. It takes an action to cast and requires concentration, so no more Shadow Blade, you'll back to using your pact weapon when you have this active. On subsequent rounds, IT ONLY TAKES A BONUS ACTION to direct your animated daggers. Those daggers are probably going to be doing about Fireball damage to a single target each round... unless they have advantage and/or you upcast it. Give the animated daggers advantage by knocking an opponent prone with Sapping Sting as your action, and then stabbing them to death with your dagger swarm. Upcasting is worth it. If your GM is using DMG prices for magic items, you'll eventually want to try to buy around 20 Moon Touched daggers for your swarm (a few to spare, and probably 100 gp or less each, so about 2,000 gp). If they're using the Sane Magic Item Prices pdf, then it's worth it to upgrade to Vicious daggers (around 350 gp ea, so about 7,000 gp). Now that swarm IS NOT going to benefit from your Elven Accuracy, unless your GM is overly generous. Also, you can cast a non-concentration spell on top of this every round; as stated above, Sapping Sting is great, but it can be Booming Blade, or you can lay down Fireballs, Shatters, Catapults, etc. Animate Objects is especially effective if your table is using the popular house rule to treat critical hits like was done in 4e: max damage, plus a roll of the dice. Especially nasty if your daggers are Vicious, to get an extra 7 damage on top of that. Use a spreadsheet, so you only have to hit F9 (or some variation on that, depending on the program) to make a new attack with the dagger swarm. When you're rolling for 14 daggers with advantage ever round, you don't want to make the table wait all night. When you've upcast and have advantage, the damage can top 100 HP... as a bonus attack.

Magic Items: You want to boost Con. Amulet of Health should be your goal. A high damage finesse weapon, especially one with extra dice for the crits - flame tongue or something.

Animate objects can only be cast on nonmagical objects. So any daggers with any type of enchant is out. However you can cast it on objects made of silver/adamantine or both to extend its effectiveness against more creatures.

[KorvinStarmast]

Queen of Blades

https://i.pinimg.com/564x/58/f2/55/58f255cf1e0653a02fd4fc2a01bc1192.jpg

Sara Kerrigan called (https://img.bhs4.com/a3/8/a38c4d10bb8dbeb531d5cdbcfcc1c1bfedc3aa6d_large.jpg ), and she'd like to have a word with you. :smallbiggrin:

Nice concept, I'd like to suggest keeping a bunch of slivered darts or silvered daggers around for your animate objects.

[Dalinar]

I can't be the only one whose mind immediately went to Kerrigan when I saw Queen of Blades. :P (EDIT: Looks like Korvin beat me to that punch!)

Anyway, here's what I'd suggest, provided you don't mind a little bit of a rework:

Start Artificer 1. This gives you CON save proficiency. Go to 3 and choose Battle Smith. You are now INT SAD for your offense, and have medium armor + shield proficiency, so your DEX is less important, and you're proficient in martial weapons. Lastly, you weaponize your bonus action much earlier than you would with the original build (and you have an option for when Animate Objects isn't a good idea). Remember that Artificer rounds up on spell slot progression, unlike other half-caster multiclass options, so you're less boned in that regard than you might think. Stop at either 3 or 5, depending on how much you want that ASI at 4 (I say 5 because you get more spell slots again; personally I'd wait until later to grab these levels, see how Artificer 3/X works out for you first).

Whenever you choose to take your Warlock levels, stop Hexblade at 2. In fact, you might be able to switch patrons, but I'm a bit rushed at the moment, so I won't look too much into it. You're really here for Armor of Agathys IMO, so grabbing the False Life one is less important, and your AC is probably about the same as what Mage Armor would give you; still grab one or the other to refill your Arcane Ward between combats. As for the other one, there are plenty of good options. Since we're a bit strapped for feats, maybe Eldritch Mind so we don't need War Caster as much? Then again, we probably want hands-free casting at some point, depending on if your DM is a stickler for such things, and Booming Blade OAs are always fun. Any of the at-will ones can be fun; probably plenty of ways to get advantage through Silent Image, but you have a ton of cantrips with this build, and Minor Illusion can be used in much the same way, so maybe a different one.

Go Abjurer the rest of the way. You'd end up with Wizard 15 (or 13-14 if you took the extra Artificer levels), meaning you have 9th-level slots but your spells known top out at 7 or 8. No Wish for you, unfortunately, but you'd have gotten it at 20 if you skipped out the Hexblade levels; campaign's probably over shortly afterwards anyway. (Isn't there an Eberron race that gets Armor of Agathys as a spell known? I think a Dwarf? You could ignore Warlock entirely if you have access to that, and just ritual-cast Alarm during your downtime for an admittedly-slower refill. You'd lose EA, though.)

Final build: Battle Smith 3 / Warlock 2 / Abjurer 15. Three ASIs, unfortunately. EA and +2 INT should max your INT, leaving you room for one of choice. Probably War Caster, or maybe Res:DEX if you're worried about that. You can sacrifice your chance to learn 8th-level spells for another one at 20, by taking the fourth Artificer level, but it's probably not worth it.

You are now *excessively* tanky, you have excellent concentration, you still get the Animate Objects shenanigans, you have more cantrips than the original build, and while you don't have incredible DPR, you do have Booming Blade to punish anyone who tries to run past you to get to your allies.

There's a channel on Youtube called D&D: Optimized which did a similar build called the Abjuration Tank, with a focus on survivability, if you want a more thorough explanation of what's going on here. The math he does is not meant to be a completely accurate combat sim, but the takeaway is that it'll be a long time before you even take damage at later levels, between upcast Armor of Agathys, Shield, and Arcane Ward.

Use the various tricks at your disposal (illusions, familiar) to gain advantage and boom on 'em.

[prototype00]

So just trying to come up with a good Grappler Rune Knight character for AL (I posted here for some brainstorming about a week ago). And was basically wondering what format of character would do best at it:

Thesis: Lets Build a Rune Knight to make the best use of grappling/shoving and really controlling the battlefield.

The obvious equipment load outs that come to mind are:

1. One weapon and one hand free (for locking down and then hitting with a good weapon when they are prone and grappled)
2. Two hand free (lock down two foes potentially, but less damage since you are depending on unarmed)
3. Shield and one hand free (access to the Shieldmaster feat, but of course less damage)

And after some noodling I came to the conclusion that 1 is super flexible as it is actually 1 and 2 combined as if you need to lockdown two foes, you can just drop your weapon and do it. 3 gives you access to Shield Master, but 1 gives you access to Tavern Brawler, that after the Shield Master errata (where you have to hit first before you can knock prone and thus you gain no advantage for it) is actually better, as grappling an enemy at the end of an attack sequence is completely fine.

So here it is Baul Punyan, the Ostaran Outdoorsman!

https://www.dropbox.com/s/3plm9ouldh4qkrm/d8236yl-b1d6111d-726e-41de-bee3-799c61370dc9.jpg?raw=1

Backstory: Baul grew up, the son of woodcutters, in the wild forests of Ostara. When his parents were killed by maurauding ogres, he was rescued and raised by his godfather, an exiled Stone Giant Runecarver who his Father and Mother had rescued from starvation in the bitter Spine of the World Mountains. From his godfather, he learnt the mystic giant Rune Magic, a gateway to the earthshaking power of Annam All Father himself!

Now, the Ordening is undone and Baul steps out to stake a place for himself and all other smallfolk in the annals of Giant History!

Race: vHuman

Stats (Point Buy):

Str: 16
Dex: 10
Con: 15 (You'll see why shortly)
Int: 8
Wis: 14
Cha: 10

Obviously the Rune Knight likes to focus on Str (for attacks and grappling) and Con (for their Runic abilities).

Since we're vHuman, we have a Feat, and for that I'll take Skill Expert from Tasha's which lets me bump up my Con to 16, gives me another skill to choose from and lets me take expertise in a skill which of course we're choosing Athletics with.

Stats (Lvl 1):

Str: 16
Dex: 10
Con: 16
Int: 8
Wis: 14
Cha: 10

As a vHuman Fighter with Skill Expert we have a whopping 6 trained skills to pick from (including background, which you can freely customize in AL, if not, pick one that is appropriate, Outlander or Folk Hero maybe?). I'd go with:

Athletics (Expertise): Naturally
Insight: You have advantage from the Stone Rune for this
Perception: Just in general good.
Deception: You have advantage on this from the Cloud Rune
Survival: Good flavour and a generally useful skill
Arcana: Why not, lol? And you have advantage on this from the Storm Rune later.

And try to pick up thieves tools proficiency, as you have advantage from the Fire Rune for it, so you're at least quite competent at using it.

So here is the lvl by lvl breakdown.

Lvl 1: Fighting Style (Blind Fighting), Second Wind

Blind Fighting is one of the better fighting styles, I feel, as you most of the time, by RAW, have a general idea of where invisible/hidden in fog or darkness foes are if they don't take the hide action. You can then just run up and when you're within 10 ft, it doesn't matter anymore if they are obscured. Just reach out and grab them. Also makes sense for a human boy raised in complete darkness by a Stone Giant.

Lvl 2: Action Surge

This is a cool level, because not only can you Action Surge to hit enemies more, but you can actually shove and grapple with it if you like. Decide as per requirements of the fight.

Lvl 3: Bonus Proficiencies (Giant and Smith's Tools), Rune Carver, Giant's Might

Whew, what a level! The Bonus profs are nice (though I'd have started with Giant, so you can pick another language at this level).

Rune Carver is Amazing. I'd pick up Cloud and Stone, just to double down on the Control and give myself 120ft darkvision. Equally valid is Cloud and Fire.

Giant's Might is also a key part of the build. You get 2 uses for now, so in tough fights, just bonus action grow large and wade into combat and grapple/knock prone something (with Action Surge if needed).

Lvl 4: Feat (Tavern Brawler)

It's a half Feat, so in AL I can re-jigger my stats so either Str or Con is at 18 now, and it has nice benefits for grappling (after the first round of using your bonus action on Giant's Might, your bonus action is free, so might as well have a good use for it.

Lvl 5: Extra Attack

Another amazing level as this lets you knock someone prone and then grapple them all in the same round after growing to giant size (that you can do three times per day now).

Lvl 6: Another ASI! I'd pick + 2 Con probably instead of a feat.

If you have access to a Belt of Hill Giant Strength around now (definitely doable in AL), you can put everything into con to boost your Runic abilities and to be a real tough MoFo.

Lvl 7: Runic Shield

There are not enough adjectives to describe how amazing this level is, not only do you get a pretty neat Runic Shield ability that lets you just deny crits. You also get access to the amazing Hill and Storm Runes that are basically the capstone of your runic abilities. I'd switch out Cloud (it's fantastic, don't get me wrong, but you will want Hill and Storm Runes, believe me, and Runic Shield can hopefully take up the slack. So the Runes you have at this level are Stone, Hill and Storm).

Strategy wise, I'd use either Hill Rune or Storm Rune depending on what the fight was like, definitely wouldn't use them both in one fight unless all the signs pointed it to do or die time. So go big first round and grapple, storm or hill second round, and then just be flexible on reaching out and crushing someone.

Lvl 8: The ASIs don't stop coming. I'd definitely take Resilient Wisdom here, just to shore that up.

Lvl 9: Indominatable

Its fine, but really this lvl nothing that directly contributed to the build happened.

Lvl 10: Great Stature

Great Stature is actually kinda disappointing, but you get another Rune (get Cloud Back).

And thats basically the build, tough as old oak, a grapple master and all sorts of ways to deny enemies their turn/attack/crits/saves e.t.c.

I'd appreciate any comments or suggestions for improvement! :)

prototype00

[Dalinar]

Here's another one – like Dalinar's Fog and Jog below, this one is a Genie Warlock. I'm not sure where to take it at higher levels either.

The Genie Meanie (Daolock)

THESIS: A straightforward but wacky blaster using Repelling Blast and Grasp of Hadar in conjunction with spike growth, bouncing your enemies back and forth as you drag them across the spikes.


RACES: Pretty much anything is fine. For max DPR, you might consider going Protector or Fallen Aasimar. Their CHA boost makes them a fine choice even without Tasha's rules.

STATS: Pretty much standard for Warlock. CHA is king, DEX, WIS and CON to keep you alive, STR and INT to dump.

CLASSES: Genie Warlock (Dao) is the whole deal, pretty much. By level 5, you have everything you need – eldritch blast, spike growth, Agonizing Blast, Repelling Blast, and Grasp of Hadar. You'll even have 18 CHA thanks to your ASI, maybe even 20 if you're not using point buy.

ASI/FEATS: CHA 20 is priority. You might use feats like Fey Touched, Shadow Touched, Telekinetic or Telepathic to get you there in a more interesting way. And you might pick up the usuals to keep yourself up.

SUMMARY: Concentrating on spike growth means no hex, but each hit with your eldritch blast will push or pull a target 10'. For every 5' a target travels across the spikes, they take an extra 2d4 magical piercing damage, no save. Neither Repelling Blast nor Grasp of Hadar have size restrictions, and they don't require a save either, so you can bop the Tarrasque around if that's your speed. That's some pretty decent damage, and a fun way to deliver it.

Let me add that you'll definitely want to take Genie 6 because flying over your Spike Growth is probably a worthwhile use of your time. Unfortunately you don't get Spike Growth and Blur on the same Genielock; I mentioned this in my post, but I saw another build while researching for the Fog and Jog that used Genie flight to attack with a glaive (taking PAM and Blade pact obviously) from out of reach while still having concentration open for a defensive spell, i.e. Blur. You're using Spike Growth with your concentration instead, so maybe you go Mirror Image for your defense buff instead? Consider also picking up the Crusher feat, which is notorious for synergizing well with both Spike Growth and the free bludgeoning damage Daolock gets from level 1. You up your battlefield control game when you get Stone Shape and Wall of Stone, the former of which doesn't even require your concentration, so might as well just go straight Daolock, as you get something good at basically every level.

For your Pact Boon, I feel like Tome is the most flavorful, since you don't need a weapon to take advantage of Crusher or anything like that. Chain is good for the same reason it's good for every Genielock, namely the ability to stuff your whole party into your vessel and have an invisible imp tote you around.

I don't have much to say about the Mesmer or Baul Punyan, unfortunately.

[Civis Mundi]

I'd appreciate any comments or suggestions for improvement! :)

prototype00

Seems like it's got everything it needs Grapple-wise between Athletics Expertise, high size, and Advantage. I see no reason not to progress to Fighter 20 for Extra Attack (3), Runic Juggernaut, and all the other goodies along the way. Shield Master might still be a good pick down the line, though not a priority. You can (https://rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/83707/can-a-fighter-use-their-shield-as-an-improvised-weapon-in-addition-to-a-regular#:~:text=Yes%2C%20you%20can%20use%20your,bo nus%2C%20without%20your%20proficiency%20bonus.)use a shield as an improvised weapon with Tavern Brawler, and add another tool to your toolkit. But it might not be worth the decrease in damage.

You might go Unarmed Fighting instead of Blindfighting to wield your shield purely defensively, whether or not you take Shield Master. That would also allow for a higher-damage two-handed style, and a bit of extra damage to grappled targets. You could also pick it up in addition to Blindfighting with Fighting Initiate, since you have feats to spare down the line.

Maybe you even grab Tough, since he's tough as oak and all.


Let me add that you'll definitely want to take Genie 6 because flying over your Spike Growth is probably a worthwhile use of your time. Unfortunately you don't get Spike Growth and Blur on the same Genielock; I mentioned this in my post, but I saw another build while researching for the Fog and Jog that used Genie flight to attack with a glaive (taking PAM and Blade pact obviously) from out of reach while still having concentration open for a defensive spell, i.e. Blur. You're using Spike Growth with your concentration instead, so maybe you go Mirror Image for your defense buff instead? Consider also picking up the Crusher feat, which is notorious for synergizing well with both Spike Growth and the free bludgeoning damage Daolock gets from level 1. You up your battlefield control game when you get Stone Shape and Wall of Stone, the former of which doesn't even require your concentration, so might as well just go straight Daolock, as you get something good at basically every level.

Great points on all fronts. To be honest, I didn't think much past the initial combo, so this is a feast for thought.

I'm a big fan of mirror image, which works best on a character like this who wants to be an unattractive target.

I can see how Crusher could work wonders with spike growth, but considering this character will be dealing force and piercing damage almost exclusively, I'm not sure how well it would gel. But my assumption here is that I'm missing something. My brain isn't at full capacity these days.

Something just occured to me as I was plugging away at the build below -- you could grab Telekinetic as another way to add extra damage on your bonus action. But it's just 5', which isn't a whole lot extra.

I had an earlier version of this combo in mind before Tasha's came out, but it comes together a lot less organically. At this point, I consider it a sister-build.

Nettlebane

THESIS: Hexblade + spike growth cheese. Starting as a Cleric, this build evolves into a potent damage dealer while retaining powerful support options. Though descended from celestial nature spirits, this once-guardian has been corrupted by an evil artifact.


RACE: Fallen Aasimar grants us STR 15 and Necrotic Shroud to up our damage. It's also very flavorful. If starting before Hexblade levels, you might ask your DM to begin as a Protector Aasimar, changing the WIS bonus to STR. Then you can become a Fallen Aasimar when you, y'know, fall.

STATS: STR 15 / DEX 8 / CON 14 / INT 9 / WIS 13 / CHA 16 (racial bonuses included). This build is pretty MAD, but it works out alright. CHA is the only truly important stat, while everything else gets exactly what it needs, and not a cent more.

CLASSES: We start Nature Cleric, which works both mechanically and storywise. If you played this character from level 1, or anytime before the Hexblade levels, you'd let the DM know your multiclassing plans and ask them to bring on the corruption.

Until you give into the Hexblade, you can really ham up being a wholesome goodie-two-shoes. You might lack the wisdom to reliably hurt things with your spells, but all of your support spells are surefire. You've got the charisma of a party face, and you can always advocate talking things out before resorting to violence. You can bonk people if necessary without resorting to shillelagh (you don't even have it), and you're clanking around in heavy armor with happy trees all over it.

At 3rd level, you get spike growth, aid, and a number of other handy Cleric spells like prayer of healing. I suggest taking Cleric to 4th before multiclassing, to get CHA up to 18.

But then the corruption takes hold. The smiles on your happy trees turn to malevolent smirks. Maybe you've had Nettlebane in your possession for some time, haunting your dreams, but at last you no longer resist. Maybe the DM puts it in front of you as you take your 5th level, and the process begins immediately.

Either way, after Cleric 4, it's on to Hexblade. I think Pact of the Chain offers a lot of options for support and utility to round out your character, and maintain your niche as both a damage dealer and a competent support.

SPELLS: In general, your Cleric slots are great for relieving pressure on your Warlock spells. This works particularly well with things like invisibility or mirror image, which normally wouldn't be on your Cleric list. Shield is the big winner here, though -- kind of a trap option with Warlock slots, but huge if you have the 1st level slots to burn.

Beyond that, you can really build the character to preference, keeping in mind that your concentration slot will usually be taken in combat. To be honest, these are my favorite kinds of builds, because they challenge me to think about my options in different ways. Personally, I like picking up animate dead, which can be very powerful cast from Warlock slots. If you're going further down Warlock (which I believe is the way to go), you can also grab stuff like dance macabre and negative energy flood, and create undead with your first Mystic Arcanum.

Crown of stars is a good pick as always for your 7th level Mystic Arcanum. Even if you already have Maddening Hex, you can save crown of stars for when you're really pulling out the nova (pun intended).

INVOCATIONS: The three most important are Agonizing Blast, Repelling Blast, and Grasp of Hadar. Maddening Hex gives you some extra damage on a bonus action, and not a bad way to do it either. I really like Gift of the Ever-Living Ones, and there's a lot of potential shenanigans with Investment of the Chain Master.

ASI/FEATS: Nothing much new here. CHA 20 is priority, then things that let you keep doing your thing. That means War Caster, Resilient (CON), et cetera. Using Telekinesis to push people around the spikes as a bonus action sounds fun, but Maddening Hex is just better, and it doesn't require an ASI. Picking up Fey Touched or Shadow Touched could be a great way to bump your WIS saves with some free spells on the side.

SUMMARY: At 11th level, with 3 eldritch blasts, Maddening Hex, Necrotic Shroud, spike growth, and Hexblade's Curse, we're looking at:

3(1d10+4d4+9) + 11 + 5 (in a 5' AoE)[/SUP] = 84.5 DPR + 5 (in a 5' AoE).

And at max level, using crown of stars instead of Maddening Hex:

4(1d10+4d4+11) + 20 + 4d12 = 154 DPR.

Is it the craziest nova I've ever seen? No, but it is quite a lot of damage. And it sounds like a blast to me.


Alright, back to the rest of the comments.


For your Pact Boon, I feel like Tome is the most flavorful, since you don't need a weapon to take advantage of Crusher or anything like that. Chain is good for the same reason it's good for every Genielock, namely the ability to stuff your whole party into your vessel and have an invisible imp tote you around.

I don't have much to say about the Mesmer or Baul Punyan, unfortunately.

I love Pact of the Chain, and I have a hard time choosing it any time I'm not reliant on Pact of the Blade. That said, Tasha's has a lot of Tome-exclusive new feats that make it a very attractive option as well. I'd leave it to personal preference, really.

As for Mesmer, don't sweat it. It's a build that only belongs here, because it's not "optimized" in relation to other optimized builds. Instead, it's an attempt to optimize a sub-optimal concept, make use of some rarely used abilities, and optimize for flavor.

[Renduaz]

The Nullifier
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/f8/65/a6/f865a6fcfaf6b44d258b3b1f8633e942.png
Race: Unrestricted, minor recommendations for Autumn Eladrin and Fallen Aasimar
Class: Divination Wizard 2, Eloquence Bard 15, Clockwork Soul Sorcerer 3. Alternatively, Divination Wizard 2/Eloquence Bard 17/Clockwork Soul 1 if you want to get the 9th level spells, or just ditch the Clockwork for a full blown Bard.
ASI: +2 Cha, +1 Cha Feat/ASI, +Feat or extra ASI
Notable Feats: Metamagic Adept, Lucky, War Caster
Notable Spells: Mind Silver, Bane, Cause Fear, Fear, Snare, Web, Bestow Curse, Counterspell, Sickening Radiance, Summon Greater Demon, Dream, Planar Binding, Magic Jar, Simulacrum

Mission Statement

To burn through a mother****er's legendary saves faster than ale in a Dwarven tavern, or just always get our way against lesser foes. Alongside a bit of Ability Check hampering and the option of doubling back as a defensive negater sometimes, though it's far from a primary objective in design.

Rundown

Race- Autumn Eladrin's Fey Ancestry and Trance are always welcome, and the Fey Step Charm agains two creatures has great value if we can often guarantee its success. Fallen Aasimar for the free Frightened condition imposing ability check disadvantage for things like Counterspell attempts or save and suck spells that require them, but honestly you'd probably be better off with a Protector Aasimar just for Flight.

Class- Divination Wizard provides the classic Portent, Eloquence Bard for Unsettling Words and buffs double role, and Clockwork Soul for Restore Balance and Flexible Casting.

Feats- Metamagic Adept provides extra 2 Metamagic choices. Lucky and War Caster can be self-evidenly fitting.

Routine

What we essentially get ftom this build is a stack of saving throw penalties, or the occasional ability check debuff, all of which can be used in a nova burst on the same turn if need be:

Action - Save or Suck spell

Portent - Any turn on the order. 2-4/LR on max level.

Unsettling Words - Bonus Action, 5-10/SR on max level.

Restore Balance - Reaction to any d20 roll, negate Magic Resistance. 6-12/LR on max level

Heightened Spell - Impose Disadvantage, up to amount of slots spent per LR at max level.

Note that it is unclear ever since the 2018 Errata whether Portent bypasses Advantage, so feel free to combined with the Clockwork negation if needed. Furthermore, you don't have to expend all of your nova abilities on a single target or turn if you feel that one or more should do the job.

You can use Flexible Casting to replenish Sorcery Points when needed, and you can grab your choice of an extra Metamagic option such as Subtle Spells for stealth saves or Twinned spell to affect another creature.

Be advised that the Notable Spells section only contains Nullifying-related spells, not the save-or-suck spells which you can select as you desire. Using the spells themselves works in a pretty straightforward fashion. We have a bunch of spells that reduce saving throw rolls and sometimes ability checks, often to be cast or concentrated initiated before the 'save or suck' attack to further weaken the target, although sometimes you might want to gradually work your way up with consecutive debuffs. For example, casting Mind Silver on a target followed by expending nova features on Bestow Curse. There are only a few spells here that merit special attention:

Summon Greater Demon + Planar Binding - Get a Babau or Glaberzu at max level to Dispel Magic at will and debuff enemies.

Dream - This one is actually pretty awesome. Its an overlooked spell capable of being a 'kill switch' on its own for targets which can't escape a plane, and it isn't even divination so anti-divination effects can't block it. It works even better with this build, whether you scry on the target and sendanother creature ( Familiar, party member ) as a messenger, you can use either Heightened Spell, Portent or both to increase your chances of the effect taking place.

If you fail, you can try again with another spell slot, and if you have Eladrin Trance, you also complete your own LR's in half the time of most other creatures. Since a successful Dream prevents LR benefits, and LR can't be taken more than once in 24 hours, creatures which sleep, are suspecitble to Exhaustion and can't flee the plane may as well eventually succumb to outright death if you continue targeting them for 5 consecutive days. Pretty neat.

Simulacrum - Enough said, and the source of all the doubled figures at max level in the beginning.

At the peak of the build's power, you can easily, with your 1d12 reductions, guaranteed disadvantage, portent and debuffs, alongside an active Simulacrum, chip away at a CR30 creature's legendary resistances in as much as a round or two with the help of another caster, or by yourself with two, and still have more than enough to spare for others.

Rejected Builds

Some schemes which were considered but ultimately rejected in case you want to modify something or find a way to incorporate elements of The Nullifer into a character:

Div Wizard 15 - Didn't feel like a good investment for the unrelated features along the way just to grab an extra Portent, and Bard magical secrets can steal the Simulacrum and other goods from additional classes. Also, getting a bigger Inspiration Dice with party buff sidegig potential is more appealing.

Sorcerer 15 - Same as above, not much synergy other than more sorcery points, but we get enough with Flexible Casting as it is.

Wild Sorcerer Bend Luck - It could work better with Portent, but a 6th level dip messes with the other classes, has no benefit as a higher level/15 main either and increasing the Bardic Inspiration dice size provides a similar utility. Its still pretty viable if you go Eloquence 14/Wild Sorc and still get access to Simulacrum and so forth, and give up on portent, but portent can be a game changer.

College of Lore Cutting Words - Its more versatile,
But doesn't work against charm immunity or creatures that can't hear you, which is very bad at mid to high level. Also takes a reaction which clashes with Restore Balance.

Stars Druid Cosmic Omen - Fickle, takes up a reaction, objectively less cost-effective as a dip than any other

[Dalinar]

I can see how Crusher could work wonders with spike growth, but considering this character will be dealing force and piercing damage almost exclusively, I'm not sure how well it would gel. But my assumption here is that I'm missing something. My brain isn't at full capacity these days.

So you don't have to do *lots* of bludgeoning damage to take advantage of Crusher--it's just "once per turn," so as long as you deal literally any other damage at all, you can use your once-per-turn Genie's Wrath to do proficiency-bonus in bludgeoning damage and activate it. Taking the feat essentially adds 2d4 damage every round to a target within range of your Spike Growth, provided you hit that target with literally anything else as well. That's basically 5 DPR--double that to 10 if the push means they have to move back through that same 5ft space to get to you--assuming no crits or full-misses, and nothing that just ignores Spike Growth like fliers.

If you can squeeze 10 DPR out of another feat choice, or some worthwhile utility, then go for it. But I understand we're not exactly strapped for 'em with this one. VHuman starting at 16 CHA/16 CON and spending two ASIs on CHA boosts has their level 1, 12, 16, and 19 feats to choose from. Crusher gives you an extra CON to work with, presumably you'd take Res:CON (18 CON!) and War Caster, then maybe Alert or Lucky? Alternatively, if you replace one of those with Fey-touched, you can change one of the CHA ASIs to Shadow-touched or Skill Expert or Telekinetic or whatever suits your fancy. Or you can take another race entirely, put +2 in CHA, spend your 4 on a half feat, 8 on CHA 20, then you still have three left.

All in all, seems like a worthwhile choice that doubles down on what you're already doing.

---

@Renduaz, I was messing with the idea of Div2/Eloq18, didn't occur to me to splash in Metamagic though! Nicely done.

[Jon talks a lot]

The Economy is in Shambles:

(This build uses Tasha's Optional Racial ability score rules)

The goal is to make the most effective summoner/conjurer possible. This attempt does so by multiclassing Conjuration Wizard and Shepherd Druid. My main question is: Is this better than taking either to level 20?

Race: Tortle
Class: Wizard 14, Druid 6
Subclass: School of Conjuration, Circle of the Shepherd
Ability Scores: 8 STR, 8 DEX, 14 CON, 15+2 INT, 12+1 WIS, 10 CHA
Progression: Wizard 8, Druid 6, Wizard 6
ASI’s: +2 INT @Wizard 4, Keen Mind @Druid 4, Tough @Wizard 8, Lucky @Wizard 12

Spells

Wizard:
Cantrips: Toll the Dead, Friends, Light, Create Bonfire, Message
1st Level: Disguise Self, Detect Magic
2nd Level: Misty Step, Continuous Flame
3rd Level: Summon Shadowspawn
4th Level: Conjure Minor Elemental, Summon Aberration
5th Level: Conjure Elemental
6th Level: Summon Fiend
7th Level: Plane Shift

Druid:
Cantrips: Shillelagh, Druidcraft, Guidance
1st Level: Goodberry, Faerie Fire, Cure Wounds
2nd Level: Summon Beast, Lesser Restoration
3rd Level: Revivify, Summon Fey

I chose Tortle for a wonderful natural ac of 17 with no investment in dexterity or strength. This is probably a better AC than most casters ever get. I chose to go farther into Wizard than Druid because the higher-level abilities of the conjurer are quite ridiculous. We are only ever going to be concentrating on conjuration spells, and the 10th level Conjuration ability states we can't lose concentration on conjuration spells, making us the most reliable caster in the party. Durable Summons makes our conjurations even more ridiculous, giving them 30 temp hp in addition to the 2 hit dice we are getting from the 6th level shepherd ability.

Is there any way in which I should improve the progression? What about the multiclass levelling? Is there another race that would let me do what I'm doing now but better?

Edit 1: The spells I chose are just guidelines. Most are not set in stone. However, I would absolutely recommend you have Summon Fiend and Conjure Minor Elementals from the wizard spell list and summon fey, revivify, and good berry from the druid spell list.

Edit 2: The above build is pretty awful. Im going to be fixing it over the course of the next couple days, taking the suggestions of Dalinar

[Dalinar]

The Economy is in Shambles:

(This build uses Tasha's Optional Racial ability score rules)

The goal is to make the most effective summoner/conjurer possible. This attempt does so by multiclassing Conjuration Wizard and Shepherd Druid. My main question is: Is this better than taking either to level 20?

Race: Tortle
Class: Wizard 14, Druid 6
Subclass: School of Conjuration, Circle of the Shepherd
Ability Scores: 8 STR, 8 DEX, 14 CON, 15+2 INT, 12+1 WIS, 10 CHA
Progression: Wizard 8, Druid 6, Wizard 6
ASI’s: +2 INT @Wizard 4, Keen Mind @Druid 4, Tough @Wizard 8, Lucky @Wizard 12

Spells

Wizard:
Cantrips: Toll the Dead, Friends, Light, Create Bonfire, Message
1st Level: Disguise Self, Detect Magic
2nd Level: Misty Step, Continuous Flame
3rd Level: Summon Shadowspawn
4th Level: Conjure Minor Elemental, Summon Aberration
5th Level: Conjure Elemental
6th Level: Summon Fiend
7th Level: Plane Shift

Druid:
Cantrips: Shillelagh, Druidcraft, Guidance
1st Level: Goodberry, Faerie Fire, Cure Wounds
2nd Level: Summon Beast, Lesser Restoration
3rd Level: Revivify, Summon Fey

I chose Tortle for a wonderful natural ac of 17 with no investment in dexterity or strength. This is probably a better AC than most casters ever get. I chose to go farther into Wizard than Druid because the higher-level abilities of the conjurer are quite ridiculous. We are only ever going to be concentrating on conjuration spells, and the 10th level Conjuration ability states we can't lose concentration on conjuration spells, making us the most reliable caster in the party. Durable Summons makes our conjurations even more ridiculous, giving them 30 temp hp in addition to the 2 hit dice we are getting from the 6th level shepherd ability.

Is there any way in which I should improve the progression? What about the multiclass levelling? Is there another race that would let me do what I'm doing now but better?

Edit 1: The spells I chose are just guidelines. Most are not set in stone. However, I would absolutely recommend you have Summon Fiend and Conjure Minor Elementals from the wizard spell list and summon fey, revivify, and good berry from the druid spell list.

Clever title. I've thought a bit about my own summoner build, actually (which dips Cleric instead), though not the whole way through.

I have a few things to pick apart:

1. The Magic Stone Druid cantrip is usually a staple for summoner builds, provided you're summoning things with hands: it's three rocks that you pass out with your bonus action that have spellcasting-mod to hit and do 1d6+spellcasting-mod damage. Functionally, that's three attacks per round *just from your bonus action*, provided you have the minions nearby to throw 'em. Best used with Animate Dead, though, which you weren't planning on taking (but perhaps should anyway). For this build, it's more of a "worth considering" especially since you're not going full WIS.

2. I'm personally not a fan of Conjuration Wizard, but if your world has grenades and the like you could probably do some serious early-game damage with that level 2 ability. The mobility at 6 is nice, but easily mimicked by everyone else now that Fey-touched exists. Focused Conjuration helps you avoid the War Caster/Res:CON tax at 10, and 14 makes your stuff tankier. I guess it's not as bad as I thought at first glance. Have you considered Abjurer instead, though? You could use Projected Ward to protect your summons, the level 10 ability makes you better at counterspelling an AOE that might take your smaller summons down, and the 14 ability makes you incredibly tanky versus magic.

3. Keen Mind, really? I did a double take. Just grab Fey-touched if you need the INT point.

4. Might be worth specializing in summoning one particular thing than just summoning anything. Shepherd 6 ability applies only to beasts and fey, for instance. If you're planning on only summoning beasts and fey, consider using the wizard spells-known to protect the summons you get from Shepherd. Hence, Abjurer. If you'd rather summon other stuff, reconsider Shepherd.

5. You're very MAD. Tortle was a good choice to mitigate that, but it's still rough out there. DEX saves will brutalize you; you're one Fireball away from eating a ton of damage and potentially losing your summon at the same time, at least until Conjurer 10 (and by then you're facing much scarier stuff). You might have to reconsider your class choices for that reason alone. Artificer / Conjurer might be better if you're set on making a Conjurer, or Cleric / Shepherd if you're set on making a Shepherd, but I don't think combining the two is wise simply because you can't be good at INT, WIS, CON, and DEX all on the same character.

[prototype00]

Seems like it's got everything it needs Grapple-wise between Athletics Expertise, high size, and Advantage. I see no reason not to progress to Fighter 20 for Extra Attack (3), Runic Juggernaut, and all the other goodies along the way. Shield Master might still be a good pick down the line, though not a priority. You can (https://rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/83707/can-a-fighter-use-their-shield-as-an-improvised-weapon-in-addition-to-a-regular#:~:text=Yes%2C%20you%20can%20use%20your,bo nus%2C%20without%20your%20proficiency%20bonus.)use a shield as an improvised weapon with Tavern Brawler, and add another tool to your toolkit. But it might not be worth the decrease in damage.

You might go Unarmed Fighting instead of Blindfighting to wield your shield purely defensively, whether or not you take Shield Master. That would also allow for a higher-damage two-handed style, and a bit of extra damage to grappled targets. You could also pick it up in addition to Blindfighting with Fighting Initiate, since you have feats to spare down the line.

Maybe you even grab Tough, since he's tough as oak and all.

Ah, excellent advice.

My main concern with the shield (and believe me the AC is tempting) is that it takes an action to doff and don too, effectively locking up that one arm.

As you mentioned the damage wise it’s a bit of a loss as well.

Also I wanted to keep a weapon because it’s a lot easier to find enchanted weapons (and Baul isn’t picky, something one handed and maybe versatile and he’s off to the races).

Unarmed runs into the issue that starting T2 there are more and more enemies resistant to non magical damage and unarmed definitely starts falling off (there are methods to make your unarmed magical, but they either involve multiclassing or rare magical equipment). So to keep the build as Catholic as possible I think one weapon, hand free is the right choice.

A couple of follow up questions:

1. Should I go heavy armor or rejigger the stats for medium? I certainly have enough feats to get Medium Armor Master but not until after lvl 10 ish.

2. What magic items should I look at, to help the concept? I’ve got the following:

- Stone of good luck (helps saves and grapple checks)
- Belt of giant strength (freeing up my other stats to also be Tall as the Tallest Trees!
- Maybe that unarmed enhancer if I can find one

Anything else and of course thank ye kindly for the comments.

[whateew]

I believe someone elsed shared some of this build in the old thread, however I feel like enough was left out for me to want to re-present it.

No more squishies!

Thesis
The idea of this build is to be bring out the supportive potential of the warlock, given appropriate rest time, combined with the mark of hospitality halfing. The core of this build is the combination of short rests + aid, coupled with obscene amounts of temporary hit-points. This build is almost completely RAW-friendly. However, in another thread there was debate over if the usage of the chef feat with the "aspect of the moon" invocation is supported RAW (I recommend we keep discussion of whether or not this is acceptable over there), so this will of course be up to your DM's discretion. Should your DM not allow this combination, you can always spend the first 8 hours of your adventuring day making treats (while the others just hang out, I guess) - possibly in your little vessel as they march onwards for you - so this build still works, but is more situational.

Ingredients
Mark of Hospitality Halfling
Pact of the tome
Aspect of the Moon invocation
Aid
Chef feat
Inspiring leader feat

Personal recommendations:
Genielock, genie of your choice
Book of Ancient Secrets invocation
Gift of the Protectors invocation
Leomund's Tiny Hut

Core idea
Being able to use aid, and then refresh your spell slots on a short rest, is well known to be a fantastic combo. However, with the some temporary hit-point, we are able to push this to the extreme, and build a fantastic support character who can reliably prepare a party for success

The build isn't very complicated, aside from the interaction with chef which I will give a short explainer for. The aim is to have as many of buffs set up at once as possible, reliably.

At the end of your adventuring day, as the party settles down for a long rest, your next day has just begun. You spend the whole night, as you need not sleep, baking your proficiency bonus treats. You can get up to 7 batches of treats made (8, actually, but the first batch is probably worthless), giving you a pool of temporary hit points to distribute with bonus actions, varying from 28 at +2 proficiency bonus, up to 63 at +3, 112 at +4, 175 at +5, and 252 at +6. While it is unlikely you will make use of all of these treats, any party member without a busy bonus actions will be able to indulge. You can also do this during the day, of course.

Once your long rest has finished, you immediately cast aid, bolstering your party members' health by 5, 10, 15, and up to 20 hit points as your spell slots scale.

You then immediately take a short rest, during which you give your party members your level + cha temp hit points, as if your massive pool from above wasn't enough. You have now given your party a significant buff going into their day - at level 8, a wizard with +3 con has 37 hit points - with 15 from aid, 11 from inspiring leader, and your pool of treats to dip into, you almost double his health without spending any resources. If you have a barbarian in the party who doesn't have a busy bonus action, your bonuses are twice as effective on them, and you get the fun image of them reaching into various pockets to cram their mouth with jam pastries.

Additions
Genielock:
Two major bonuses here - firstly, wish at 17th level is fantastic for any build, but notably our buffer can cast Heroes' Feast before a long rest / just as it finishes if you really want to push it, providing a final massive buff for your party.
The second is less important, but still neat - With a flying familiar / familiar with a burrow speed, you can very reliably take your long rest in pretty much any situation. In the middle of enemy territory? Retreat into your vessel and have your familiar take your vessel into the air / bury it underground. Once you're ready to exit the vessel, pocket your familiar, and then politely ask it to catch your vessel and take it down / dig it out of the ground. If you want to lean into the chef vibe, style the interior as a personal kitchen. Either way, you will always be able to make a large batch of treats like this. The ancient secrets lets you choose your own familiar for this.

Leomund's Tiny Hut:
Always useful to have, it will allow you to take that rest anywhere you want.

Gift of the Protectors:
As a fellow poster pointed out in the old thread, this is always a useful invocation to have.


Notes
I feel like a big advantage of this build is that while it takes a fairly hefty amount of set up to accomplish, none of it defines what your combat actually looks like - therefore, you could fairly easily combine this with any warlock build of your choosing. It feels flexible, and I like that. However, there is a fairly lengthy entry cost - two feats is not cheap. Thoughts?

[Jon talks a lot]

I believe someone elsed shared some of this build in the old thread, however I feel like enough was left out for me to want to re-present it.

No more squishies!

Thesis
The idea of this build is to be bring out the supportive potential of the warlock, given appropriate rest time, combined with the mark of hospitality halfing. The core of this build is the combination of short rests + aid, coupled with obscene amounts of temporary hit-points. This build is almost completely RAW-friendly. However, in another thread there was debate over if the usage of the chef feat with the "aspect of the moon" invocation is supported RAW (I recommend we keep discussion of whether or not this is acceptable over there), so this will of course be up to your DM's discretion. Should your DM not allow this combination, you can always spend the first 8 hours of your adventuring day making treats (while the others just hang out, I guess) - possibly in your little vessel as they march onwards for you - so this build still works, but is more situational.

Ingredients
Mark of Hospitality Halfling
Pact of the tome
Aspect of the Moon invocation
Aid
Chef feat
Inspiring leader feat

Personal recommendations:
Genielock, genie of your choice
Book of Ancient Secrets invocation
Gift of the Protectors invocation
Leomund's Tiny Hut

Core idea
Being able to use aid, and then refresh your spell slots on a short rest, is well known to be a fantastic combo. However, with the some temporary hit-point, we are able to push this to the extreme, and build a fantastic support character who can reliably prepare a party for success

The build isn't very complicated, aside from the interaction with chef which I will give a short explainer for. The aim is to have as many of buffs set up at once as possible, reliably.

At the end of your adventuring day, as the party settles down for a long rest, your next day has just begun. You spend the whole night, as you need not sleep, baking your proficiency bonus treats. You can get up to 7 batches of treats made (8, actually, but the first batch is probably worthless), giving you a pool of temporary hit points to distribute with bonus actions, varying from 28 at +2 proficiency bonus, up to 63 at +3, 112 at +4, 175 at +5, and 252 at +6. While it is unlikely you will make use of all of these treats, any party member without a busy bonus actions will be able to indulge. You can also do this during the day, of course.

Once your long rest has finished, you immediately cast aid, bolstering your party members' health by 5, 10, 15, and up to 20 hit points as your spell slots scale.

You then immediately take a short rest, during which you give your party members your level + cha temp hit points, as if your massive pool from above wasn't enough. You have now given your party a significant buff going into their day - at level 8, a wizard with +3 con has 37 hit points - with 15 from aid, 11 from inspiring leader, and your pool of treats to dip into, you almost double his health without spending any resources. If you have a barbarian in the party who doesn't have a busy bonus action, your bonuses are twice as effective on them, and you get the fun image of them reaching into various pockets to cram their mouth with jam pastries.

Additions
Genielock:
Two major bonuses here - firstly, wish at 17th level is fantastic for any build, but notably our buffer can cast Heroes' Feast before a long rest / just as it finishes if you really want to push it, providing a final massive buff for your party.
The second is less important, but still neat - With a flying familiar / familiar with a burrow speed, you can very reliably take your long rest in pretty much any situation. In the middle of enemy territory? Retreat into your vessel and have your familiar take your vessel into the air / bury it underground. Once you're ready to exit the vessel, pocket your familiar, and then politely ask it to catch your vessel and take it down / dig it out of the ground. If you want to lean into the chef vibe, style the interior as a personal kitchen. Either way, you will always be able to make a large batch of treats like this. The ancient secrets lets you choose your own familiar for this.

Leomund's Tiny Hut:
Always useful to have, it will allow you to take that rest anywhere you want.

Gift of the Protectors:
As a fellow poster pointed out in the old thread, this is always a useful invocation to have.


Notes
I feel like a big advantage of this build is that while it takes a fairly hefty amount of set up to accomplish, none of it defines what your combat actually looks like - therefore, you could fairly easily combine this with any warlock build of your choosing. It feels flexible, and I like that. However, there is a fairly lengthy entry cost - two feats is not cheap. Thoughts?

Temp. hit points don't stack.

[whateew]

Temp. hit points don't stack.

I am aware, however if you do not have a busy bonus actions, once you get into combat that pool starts being useful, especially if some members draw fire more than others

[Jon talks a lot]

Clever title. I've thought a bit about my own summoner build, actually (which dips Cleric instead), though not the whole way through.

I have a few things to pick apart:

1. The Magic Stone Druid cantrip is usually a staple for summoner builds, provided you're summoning things with hands: it's three rocks that you pass out with your bonus action that have spellcasting-mod to hit and do 1d6+spellcasting-mod damage. Functionally, that's three attacks per round *just from your bonus action*, provided you have the minions nearby to throw 'em. Best used with Animate Dead, though, which you weren't planning on taking (but perhaps should anyway). For this build, it's more of a "worth considering" especially since you're not going full WIS.

2. I'm personally not a fan of Conjuration Wizard, but if your world has grenades and the like you could probably do some serious early-game damage with that level 2 ability. The mobility at 6 is nice, but easily mimicked by everyone else now that Fey-touched exists. Focused Conjuration helps you avoid the War Caster/Res:CON tax at 10, and 14 makes your stuff tankier. I guess it's not as bad as I thought at first glance. Have you considered Abjurer instead, though? You could use Projected Ward to protect your summons, the level 10 ability makes you better at counterspelling an AOE that might take your smaller summons down, and the 14 ability makes you incredibly tanky versus magic.

3. Keen Mind, really? I did a double take. Just grab Fey-touched if you need the INT point.

4. Might be worth specializing in summoning one particular thing than just summoning anything. Shepherd 6 ability applies only to beasts and fey, for instance. If you're planning on only summoning beasts and fey, consider using the wizard spells-known to protect the summons you get from Shepherd. Hence, Abjurer. If you'd rather summon other stuff, reconsider Shepherd.

5. You're very MAD. Tortle was a good choice to mitigate that, but it's still rough out there. DEX saves will brutalize you; you're one Fireball away from eating a ton of damage and potentially losing your summon at the same time, at least until Conjurer 10 (and by then you're facing much scarier stuff). You might have to reconsider your class choices for that reason alone. Artificer / Conjurer might be better if you're set on making a Conjurer, or Cleric / Shepherd if you're set on making a Shepherd, but I don't think combining the two is wise simply because you can't be good at INT, WIS, CON, and DEX all on the same character.


1. That is a very good strategy I wasn't aware of before.
2. If I went abjurer, I think I would dip into wizard instead of being a primary wizard. Something to think about.
3. Didn't really think that one through.
4. This is probably the way to go.
5. That is the problem.

Many things to think about, but I want to start my reworking in the morning. I'm very tired right now.

[prototype00]

If I may suggest, since the thread seems popular, a linked index to the builds in the first thread (how long would we be able to edit a thread?) might be a nice convenience for people browsing. :)

[Civis Mundi]

If I may suggest, since the thread seems popular, a linked index to the builds in the first thread (how long would we be able to edit a thread?) might be a nice convenience for people browsing. :)

Done! I can't always promise punctuality, but I'll do my best.

I'm not sure how long you can edit a post, but once that time expires, we can always start a new thread, and index this one.

[prototype00]

I'm wondering if there is a worthwhile build using the following:

1. Drow (or Half Elf with Drow Heritage)
2. Mostly Shadow Monk for Darkness
3. Fighting style Blind Fighting (MC Fighter or take the feat?)
4. Elven Accuracy, Sharpshooter
5. Longbow

So the idea is you cast Darkness on a pebble and you run towards an enemy with it. When you are 15 ft away from the enemy you drop the pebble as a free action, then you step forward 5ft.

Pebble - You - Space - Enemy

This way you can see your foe, but your foe is trapped in darkness. Then you sharpshooter the heck out of them with elven accuracy, remembering to spend at least a ki point on one of your attacks for Ki Fueled Attack so that you can attack again as a bonus action. Once you're done pincoushioning them, you step back, pick up your pebble again, and remain safe in the darkness against melee and against ranged, normal.

The reason I suggest Blind Fighting is that it's easier to access than Devil's Sight either by feat or MC.

Think it has enough benefit to use?

[Dalinar]

I'm wondering if there is a worthwhile build using the following:

1. Drow (or Half Elf with Drow Heritage)
2. Mostly Shadow Monk for Darkness
3. Fighting style Blind Fighting (MC Fighter or take the feat?)
4. Elven Accuracy, Sharpshooter
5. Longbow

So the idea is you cast Darkness on a pebble and you run towards an enemy with it. When you are 15 ft away from the enemy you drop the pebble as a free action, then you step forward 5ft.

Pebble - You - Space - Enemy

This way you can see your foe, but your foe is trapped in darkness. Then you sharpshooter the heck out of them with elven accuracy, remembering to spend at least a ki point on one of your attacks for Ki Fueled Attack so that you can attack again as a bonus action. Once you're done pincoushioning them, you step back, pick up your pebble again, and remain safe in the darkness against melee and against ranged, normal.

The reason I suggest Blind Fighting is that it's easier to access than Devil's Sight either by feat or MC.

Think it has enough benefit to use?

I think the play for Darkness-based combat strategies is EK rather than Monk. Granted, you don't get it until much later, but you can do similar tactics with Fog Cloud before then, and you get Blind Fighting without a feat/multiclass tax. Your relevant feats come into play four-ish levels earlier (EA/SS by 6, then swap out Blind Fighting for Archery and pick up Eldritch Adept for Devil's Sight at 8, which is around when you switch to Darkness from Fog Cloud anyway). You don't get a bonus action attack, but you do get a third regular attack at 11. Once you get what you're there for, you can keep going EK for stuff like Fireball or possibly switch to Rogue (you'll be advantage-attacking and critting a lot so Sneak Attack is valuable, Cunning Action is great as well).

If your DM lets you play Mark of Shadow Elf, you'll get Darkness as a spell known for free when you get your second-level slots, as well as Pass Without Trace and some other goodies along the way. Otherwise, I'd stick to a Half-Drow unless you expect Sunlight Sensitivity to never come up, in which case you can go Drow instead.

[x3n0n]

I'm wondering if there is a worthwhile build using the following:

1. Drow (or Half Elf with Drow Heritage)
2. Mostly Shadow Monk for Darkness
3. Fighting style Blind Fighting (MC Fighter or take the feat?)
4. Elven Accuracy, Sharpshooter
5. Longbow

So the idea is you cast Darkness on a pebble and you run towards an enemy with it. When you are 15 ft away from the enemy you drop the pebble as a free action, then you step forward 5ft.

Pebble - You - Space - Enemy

This way you can see your foe, but your foe is trapped in darkness. Then you sharpshooter the heck out of them with elven accuracy, remembering to spend at least a ki point on one of your attacks for Ki Fueled Attack so that you can attack again as a bonus action. Once you're done pincoushioning them, you step back, pick up your pebble again, and remain safe in the darkness against melee and against ranged, normal.

The reason I suggest Blind Fighting is that it's easier to access than Devil's Sight either by feat or MC.

Think it has enough benefit to use?

I like the idea; I think there are a few issues to iron out.

Dedicated Weapons can't be heavy, so Shadow Monk would need to use smaller ranged weapons.

The progression is extremely feat-heavy (on a non-Fighter class), and you can't go v.human/custom and still get Elven Accuracy. I think that means the full combo can't come online until 9th level. (Monk 4: EA, Monk 8: SS, Fighter 1 for Blind Fighting.)

At that rate, it is just as fast (but perhaps less cool) to go Eldritch Knight, Crossbow Expert/EA/SS.

If you're willing to skip EA, then V.Human + Fighting Initiate into SS comes online at 4 (but at the cost of a Monk ASI, which is really expensive unless you rolled well).

[whateew]

I like the idea; I think there are a few issues to iron out.

Dedicated Weapons can't be heavy, so Shadow Monk would need to use smaller ranged weapons.

The progression is extremely feat-heavy (on a non-Fighter class), and you can't go v.human/custom and still get Elven Accuracy. I think that means the full combo can't come online until 9th level. (Monk 4: EA, Monk 8: SS, Fighter 1 for Blind Fighting.)

At that rate, it is just as fast (but perhaps less cool) to go Eldritch Knight, Crossbow Expert/EA/SS.

If you're willing to skip EA, then V.Human + Fighting Initiate into SS comes online at 4 (but at the cost of a Monk ASI, which is really expensive unless you rolled well).

You could do custom lineage, adding +2 to get an odd Dex score, and claiming it to be a type of weird elf (perhaps some sort of archer elf subrace I dunno) thus allowing you to the first feat and EA. Then, you can just do a 1 level dip in fighter (or 2 in ranger if u are feeling bold)

[Evaar]

I believe someone else shared some of this build in the old thread, however I feel like enough was left out for me to want to re-present it.

No more squishies!

Thesis
The idea of this build is to be bring out the supportive potential of the warlock, given appropriate rest time, combined with the mark of hospitality halfling.

I think you're referring to my build idea Everyone's Best Friend. (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=24976191&postcount=1004)

Just linking it here for my additional commentary about things that can be done with it. I tried to avoid too many sources of THP because they don't stack, but I think it's perfectly reasonable to use Inspiring Leader to start the group off with a big pool and then use the treats to refresh them as those run out. You will run a bit lower on damage as a result (since you max Cha later), but since you're primarily focused on supporting the team and making their lives easier you don't necessarily have to provide as much sustained DPR as Warlocks are usually expected to.

The only note I would have is not to sleep on Whispers of the Grave, but I've made my case for that elsewhere (there's a link to that in the original post).

Oh and I didn't comment on this in the original post, but I didn't take Aspect of the Moon because my interpretation of RAW is that you can't split your long rest into 8 short rests. And even if you can, the treats expire in 8 hours. So I only plan to have a few batches of treats per day.

[RingoBongo]

So I got buried in the other thread and was hoping for some feedback as this is my first monk build.

Cursed One or...
Caliban (a reference to "The Tempest" by none other than William Shakey)

The goal of this build is to keep good monk progression in a monk subclass that can hold it's own (I prefer mercy, I think) while adding some versitility and extra resources. We're still going get wisdom and dex up to 18 each by level 12 while slapping on extra "spell use" through: 1 level of cleric after extra attack at monk 5 (more later if desired) and racial/feat options that give some extra spell casting resources.

Race: Lotusden halfling
Class: tempest cleric 1+ / way of mercy monk 12+
Ability Scores: 8 STR, 15+2 DEX, 15 CON, 8 INT, 15+1 WIS, 8 CHA
Progression: Monk 5, Cleric 1, Monk 12

ASI's: Aberrant dragonmark (shield + mind sliver or bb) OR crusher (con), +1 dex +1 wis, fey Touched (wisdom + gift of alacrity) OR shadow touched (wisdom + silent Image). Also chef (wisdom or con) is good too, if your feeling fancy. ANYWAY YOU ORDER IT WORKS -- you just want to round out to 18 dex, 16 con, and 18 wisdom by level 12

Strategy: you got your punches, a quarter staff, a short sword, a short bow, and whatever dedicated weapon you want.... The ki can be used for a variety of useful purposes. I'm not going to get into it all but each step of way of mercy subclass is great up to 11... You'll get 18 wisdom eventually and have 4 reaction uses of tempest cleric's wrath of the storm with a decently high dc save -- also higher dc save vs stunning strike and other spells like entangle, thunderwave, bane, toll of the dead, word or radiance

Cantrips: druidcraft, Guidance, toll of the dead, word of radiance, and (if you take aberrant dragonmark -- mind sliver (con) OR booming blade)

Our first spells only come through our racial ability "children of the woods" -- druidcraft, entangle 1/LR @3, spike growth 1/LR @5. Unless we take a fey Touched, shadow touched, or Aberrant dragonmark at level 4.

And then all the sudden at level 6 we get 2 cleric spells and 3 wrath of storm uses (which is a significant powerboost compared to the 1 ki per level progression)... But we don't want to delay monk for too long; I think pushing monk through mercy's 11 subclass ability and then to 12 for the ASI is a great place to take stock of everything and decide rest of build direction.

Thoughts? Suggestions? All welcome. Thanks.

[Evaar]

So I got buried in the other thread and was hoping for some feedback as this is my first monk build.

Cursed One or...
Caliban (a reference to "The Tempest" by none other than William Shakey)

The goal of this build is to keep good monk progression in a monk subclass that can hold it's own (I prefer mercy, I think) while adding some versitility and extra resources. We're still going get wisdom and dex up to 18 each by level 12 while slapping on extra "spell use" through: 1 level of cleric after extra attack at monk 5 (more later if desired) and racial/feat options that give some extra spell casting resources.

Race: Lotusden halfling
Class: tempest cleric 1+ / way of mercy monk 12+
Ability Scores: 8 STR, 15+2 DEX, 15 CON, 8 INT, 15+1 WIS, 8 CHA
Progression: Monk 5, Cleric 1, Monk 12

ASI's: Aberrant dragonmark (shield + mind sliver or bb) OR crusher (con), +1 dex +1 wis, fey Touched (wisdom + gift of alacrity) OR shadow touched (wisdom + silent Image). Also chef (wisdom or con) is good too, if your feeling fancy. ANYWAY YOU ORDER IT WORKS -- you just want to round out to 18 dex, 16 con, and 18 wisdom by level 12

Strategy: you got your punches, a quarter staff, a short sword, a short bow, and whatever dedicated weapon you want.... The ki can be used for a variety of useful purposes. I'm not going to get into it all but each step of way of mercy subclass is great up to 11... You'll get 18 wisdom eventually and have 4 reaction uses of tempest cleric's wrath of the storm with a decently high dc save -- also higher dc save vs stunning strike and other spells like entangle, thunderwave, bane, toll of the dead, word or radiance

Cantrips: druidcraft, Guidance, toll of the dead, word of radiance, and (if you take aberrant dragonmark -- mind sliver (con) OR booming blade)

Our first spells only come through our racial ability "children of the woods" -- druidcraft, entangle 1/LR @3, spike growth 1/LR @5. Unless we take a fey Touched, shadow touched, or Aberrant dragonmark at level 4.

And then all the sudden at level 6 we get 2 cleric spells and 3 wrath of storm uses (which is a significant powerboost compared to the 1 ki per level progression)... But we don't want to delay monk for too long; I think pushing monk through mercy's 11 subclass ability and then to 12 for the ASI is a great place to take stock of everything and decide rest of build direction.

Thoughts? Suggestions? All welcome. Thanks.

I'm not sure what we're getting out of Aberrant Dragonmark that's worth the feat cost. Why do we want Mind Sliver or Booming Blade? Or are we just buying that to get access to Shield so we can use our Cleric slots on that?

If we are doing it for Shield, do we also really want Wrath of the Storm? Are we anticipating we'll need 5 reactions to attacks per day? That's not an implausible assumption, but I'm just trying to nail down what we're looking to accomplish with those choices combined.

I also generally think it's better to focus on Dexterity before Wisdom as a Monk - Wisdom is only adding to your save DCs. Dexterity is giving you everything Wisdom would, plus more accuracy, damage, and initiative. Although this build does seem to use Wisdom a touch more than the typical Monk build, maybe it's more valuable here.

I wasn't aware of the Lotusden Halfling before, I think there's a case to make for an Open Hank Monk abusing their ability to cast Spike Growth once per day. You can only pull it off daily, but the ability to drop your own spikes and then knock an enemy around it with Flurry could add up very quick - especially since you should have the movement to meet them at different sides of the Spike Growth to knock them around a couple times in a turn.

[RingoBongo]

I'm not sure what we're getting out of Aberrant Dragonmark that's worth the feat cost. Why do we want Mind Sliver or Booming Blade? Or are we just buying that to get access to Shield so we can use our Cleric slots on that?

If we are doing it for Shield, do we also really want Wrath of the Storm? Are we anticipating we'll need 5 reactions to attacks per day? That's not an implausible assumption, but I'm just trying to nail down what we're looking to accomplish with those choices combined.

I also generally think it's better to focus on Dexterity before Wisdom as a Monk - Wisdom is only adding to your save DCs. Dexterity is giving you everything Wisdom would, plus more accuracy, damage, and initiative. Although this build does seem to use Wisdom a touch more than the typical Monk build, maybe it's more valuable here.

I wasn't aware of the Lotusden Halfling before, I think there's a case to make for an Open Hank Monk abusing their ability to cast Spike Growth once per day. You can only pull it off daily, but the ability to drop your own spikes and then knock an enemy around it with Flurry could add up very quick - especially since you should have the movement to meet them at different sides of the Spike Growth to knock them around a couple times in a turn.

The idea of aberrant dragonmark is to also add spell slots without losing monk no progression, and it evens out con to 16... Though crusher could also work here as a way to even out con, but provide a different angle. A big part of the build is to add slots through other sources outside of caster levels as we push early to build a solid monk base at about level 12. Plus a cool dm might adopt the optional thing for aberrant dragonmark, which would be cool of them.

Booming blade is flavorful with tempest cleric but doesn't add much. Mind sliver otoh is useful mid range approach attack and sets up a -1d4 to save which I or a teammate could use.

And yeah spike growth + flurry of blows push means like 60 damage on average each round. That IS nasty. Definitely a strong contender (and decent flavor combination with tempest cleric). I might have to reconsider that subclass choice, thanks!

[GeistInMachine]

The Spirit Warrior

Race: Kalashtar
Classes: Ancestral Guardian Barbarian 5 or 6, Soulknife Rogue X

Ability Scores: 14 STR, 15+1 DEX, 14+2 CON, 10 INT, 10 WIS, 8 CHA
Uses Tasha's to reallocate stats

Not sure what the best progression would be, early game has a lot of features to pick up and not sure if it should start rogue or barbarian.

ASIs: +2 Str, +2 Str, Dex or Con or Feats from there

Thesis: Refine the Barb/Rogue chassis for Post-Tashas. Barb/Rogue has a lot of defensive synergy and is commonly considered a strong build. It also has excellent grappling capabilities that I wanted to incorporate. Soulknife allows the build to add the psychic die and expertise to athletics checks, making the build a very strong grappler.
The build also excels at using Ancestral Guardian's taunt at range, with the 60ft thrown psychic blades from the soulknife, which can use strength being finesse weapons. This is a longer normal range than any other thrown weapon.
In close range, this build can Shove prone with the very high athletics checks and then attack with the soulknife dual wielding. Weapons being Psychic blades means your hands are always free for grapples and shoves, and you only have a weapon when needed. This makes it versatile, you can grapple multiple enemies simultaneously. The downside is the lack of a shield, but Barb/Rogue's defenses make up for that.
Kalashtar is very thematic, but also gives advantage on wis saves which is very welcome for a martial build

The build has a few variations. Rogue first gets one more skill and dex+int saves. Barb first gets str+con saves. I'm not sure which ends up being better, it may be personal preference or depends on how you want to play the early levels.
I have the base concept, but those details like build order and if the build wants any feats over ASIs, and even if it would want to focus str or dex, are the main pieces of feedback i am looking for

[RingoBongo]

The Spirit Warrior

Race: Kalashtar
Classes: Ancestral Guardian Barbarian 5 or 6, Soulknife Rogue X

Ability Scores: 14 STR, 15+1 DEX, 14+2 CON, 10 INT, 10 WIS, 8 CHA
Uses Tasha's to reallocate stats

Not sure what the best progression would be, early game has a lot of features to pick up and not sure if it should start rogue or barbarian.

ASIs: +2 Str, +2 Str, Dex or Con or Feats from there

Thesis: Refine the Barb/Rogue chassis for Post-Tashas. Barb/Rogue has a lot of defensive synergy and is commonly considered a strong build. It also has excellent grappling capabilities that I wanted to incorporate. Soulknife allows the build to add the psychic die and expertise to athletics checks, making the build a very strong grappler.
The build also excels at using Ancestral Guardian's taunt at range, with the 60ft thrown psychic blades from the soulknife, which can use strength being finesse weapons. This is a longer normal range than any other thrown weapon.
In close range, this build can Shove prone with the very high athletics checks and then attack with the soulknife dual wielding. Weapons being Psychic blades means your hands are always free for grapples and shoves, and you only have a weapon when needed. This makes it versatile, you can grapple multiple enemies simultaneously. The downside is the lack of a shield, but Barb/Rogue's defenses make up for that.
Kalashtar is very thematic, but also gives advantage on wis saves which is very welcome for a martial build

The build has a few variations. Rogue first gets one more skill and dex+int saves. Barb first gets str+con saves. I'm not sure which ends up being better, it may be personal preference or depends on how you want to play the early levels.
I have the base concept, but those details like build order and if the build wants any feats over ASIs, and even if it would want to focus str or dex, are the main pieces of feedback i am looking for

I am playing rogue barb right now currently at level 5 (scout + .... totem wolf?)

1. No need for dex above 14. Wear half plate, be happy. Push strength as main attacking stat instead to bolster your grapple and so that your to hit and +damage modifier lines up with barbs +rage damage.

2. The progression I settled on as most satisfying is to start barb 1 or rogue 1 (skill/saves vs hp/save) doesn't really matter. All that matters is that by level 2 or 3 (if you value cunning action) you have 1 level in barbarian for rage, which sets up a knockout grapple and/or some hp buffers with that sweet resistance when it counts at low levels. THEN, stay rogue until 12 for the extra feats, other goodies like uncanny dodge, evasion, etc; the sneak attack die increases will level out comparable damage at rogue 5/ barb 1.

3. If going this route be selective at the start of battle what you are welding because you have one less attack to proc sneak attack. Shield and sword vs two light weapons both are good situationally. Side note: I have made pretty good use of steady aim with a longbow. Steady aim also works well when you are in melee and you are okay without moving (small maps, tight spaces. Bonus if you decided to wield a shield at the start of combat).

4. My feats choices and their order (+2 str, mobile, alert, dual weilder, archery fighting style (darts are cool here! Now so is bow). I'm not going to bother with maxing out strength. Feats are more fun and I feel are more effective when considering 18 vs 20 in attacking stat -- not casting stat tho).

My 2 cents. Hope feedback was helpful.

[GeistInMachine]

I am playing rogue barb right now currently at level 5 (scout + .... totem wolf?)

1. No need for dex above 14. Wear half plate, be happy. Push strength as main attacking stat instead to bolster your grapple and so that your to hit and +damage modifier lines up with barbs +rage damage.

2. The progression I settled on as most satisfying is to start barb 1 or rogue 1 (skill/saves vs hp/save) doesn't really matter. All that matters is that by level 2 or 3 (if you value cunning action) you have 1 level in barbarian for rage, which sets up a knockout grapple and/or some hp buffers with that sweet resistance when it counts at low levels. THEN, stay rogue until 12 for the extra feats, other goodies like uncanny dodge, evasion, etc; the sneak attack die increases will level out comparable damage at rogue 5/ barb 1.

3. If going this route be selective at the start of battle what you are welding. Shield and sword vs two light weapons both are good situationally. Side note: I have made pretty good use of steady aim with a longbow. Steady aim also works well when you are in melee and you are okay without moving (small maps, tight spaces. Bonus if you decided to wield a shield at the start of combat).

4. My feats choices and their order (+2 str, mobile, alert, dual weilder, archery fighting style (darts are cool here! Now so is bow). I'm not going to bother with maxing out strength. Feats are more fun and I feel are more effective when considering 18 vs 20 in attacking stat -- not casting stat tho).

My 2 cents. Hope feedback was helpful.

Going to respond to your points in order, thanks for the feedback

1. Part of the draw with the soulknife combo is the strong skill checks. Half plate is going to give stealth disadvantage, which i suppose could be mitigated with the psychic die, but i have a hard time giving up on super high stealth

2.Doesnt going only barb 1 leave our stuff like the danger sense synergy and not even touch the ancestral barb taunt? Those are both valuable to the concept, its not meant to be a damage focused build per say

3. The point of the build is to use the Soulknife's Psychic blades with the Barb kit.

4. Is mobile mainly for grapple dragging or for free disengaging? Alert i could see, but duel wielder an archery style don't work with this build's soulknife combo


I think this advice is generally useful for most Barb/Rogues, but this build uses a subclass combo i have not seen around yet, and tries to synergize to use their strengths

[RingoBongo]

Going to respond to your points in order, thanks for the feedback

1. Part of the draw with the soulknife combo is the strong skill checks. Half plate is going to give stealth disadvantage, which i suppose could be mitigated with the psychic die, but i have a hard time giving up on super high stealth

2.Doesnt going only barb 1 leave our stuff like the danger sense synergy and not even touch the ancestral barb taunt? Those are both valuable to the concept, its not meant to be a damage focused build per say

3. The point of the build is to use the Soulknife's Psychic blades with the Barb kit.

4. Is mobile mainly for grapple dragging or for free disengaging? Alert i could see, but duel wielder an archery style don't work with this build's soulknife combo


I think this advice is generally useful for most Barb/Rogues, but this build uses a subclass combo i have not seen around yet, and tries to synergize to use their strengths

You are right about stealth, but you are taking quite a tax building both str and dex. Stealth can also be mitigated through expertise which at higher levels where proficiency is 3 or greater does not hurt as much. Plus mithril half plate is a fair ask to the dm in my opinion, something you could even work towards crafting with an NPC smith.

I mainly think that rogue/barbs are wanting for extra defense before getting deep into barb where things like reckless attack and ancestral's 3rd level ability will put a big target on your back. And you want to be prepared to take it on the chin, which is why I delay barb levels (plus extra rogue feats at 8, 10, and 12 AND big damage then, big damage mitigators too in uncanny dodge, rage, evasion, and maybe mobile -- which is good for more than just free disengage defense, as you mention dragging can be nice too). I feel once I have more of these defenses, I am ready to actually use and take more advantage of reckless attack and barb 3 ability. So you could go barb 1, rogue 5, barb 5.... And I've done rogue/melee class like this before and when I did, I had strong puppy dog eyes at higher sneak attack die and the higher rogue (subclass) abilities.

I wouldn't take archery on your build. For mine, it was what I had left for whatever's at the end (probably won't see levels that high anyways).

[whateew]

I think you're referring to my build idea Everyone's Best Friend. (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=24976191&postcount=1004)

...

Oh and I didn't comment on this in the original post, but I didn't take Aspect of the Moon because my interpretation of RAW is that you can't split your long rest into 8 short rests. And even if you can, the treats expire in 8 hours. So I only plan to have a few batches of treats per day.

Yup! I was referring to yours

As for the treats, the expiry is the main issue - you would need to wake up, aid, then immediately go straight into battle to get the most out of this (or bake for 7 hours, and aid + short rest on the last, then immediately get to fighting)
However, the proficiency bonus treats are not tied to short rests, just "an hour" - the short rests relate to different feature, so you don't need to do any coffeelock type shenanigans - you simply take a long rest AND bake

[Evaar]

Yup! I was referring to yours

As for the treats, the expiry is the main issue - you would need to wake up, aid, then immediately go straight into battle to get the most out of this (or bake for 7 hours, and aid + short rest on the last, then immediately get to fighting)
However, the proficiency bonus treats are not tied to short rests, just "an hour" - the short rests relate to different feature, so you don't need to do any coffeelock type shenanigans - you simply take a long rest AND bake

You're right, I was loose with my language. It's my interpretation that 8 hours of cooking doesn't qualify as "light activity" as described in the invocation or the rules for Rests. Instead I would qualify it as "strenuous work" as defined in the rules for Rests (which lists "walking" as a strenuous activity, for comparison). I would say you can prepare one batch at the end of a long rest because the rules for rest suggest an hour of strenuous activity during a rest is right at the limit of what you can do and still get the benefits of the rest.

So I still don't think it works, even though you don't have to try to convert the long rest into 8 short rests. But you and your DM may disagree, it's not completely black and white.

[Dalinar]

You could do custom lineage, adding +2 to get an odd Dex score, and claiming it to be a type of weird elf (perhaps some sort of archer elf subrace I dunno) thus allowing you to the first feat and EA. Then, you can just do a 1 level dip in fighter (or 2 in ranger if u are feeling bold)

Custom Lineage is not intended to work with racial feats per Jeremy Crawford. That said, if your DM lets you, go for it.

[Civis Mundi]

So glad to see everyone's contributions. I've updated the index, by the way. Let me know if I've missed anything.


So you don't have to do *lots* of bludgeoning damage to take advantage of Crusher--it's just "once per turn," so as long as you deal literally any other damage at all, you can use your once-per-turn Genie's Wrath to do proficiency-bonus in bludgeoning damage and activate it. Taking the feat essentially adds 2d4 damage every round to a target within range of your Spike Growth, provided you hit that target with literally anything else as well. That's basically 5 DPR--double that to 10 if the push means they have to move back through that same 5ft space to get to you--assuming no crits or full-misses, and nothing that just ignores Spike Growth like fliers.

If you can squeeze 10 DPR out of another feat choice, or some worthwhile utility, then go for it. But I understand we're not exactly strapped for 'em with this one. VHuman starting at 16 CHA/16 CON and spending two ASIs on CHA boosts has their level 1, 12, 16, and 19 feats to choose from. Crusher gives you an extra CON to work with, presumably you'd take Res:CON (18 CON!) and War Caster, then maybe Alert or Lucky? Alternatively, if you replace one of those with Fey-touched, you can change one of the CHA ASIs to Shadow-touched or Skill Expert or Telekinetic or whatever suits your fancy. Or you can take another race entirely, put +2 in CHA, spend your 4 on a half feat, 8 on CHA 20, then you still have three left.

Sorry for taking so long to get to this!

I do like the sound of that, but it's the action tax I'm worried about more than the feat tax. It's 10 DPR in a vacuum, but I'd need my action for eldritch blast. I'm not sure of a suitable bonus action option that would do the right kind of damage, especially not at range. It would also be competing with Maddening Hex, and eventually crown of stars. So while it's great in a vacuum, it doesn't seem like the right fight for this build. A build combining Crusher, shillelagh, spike growth + Polearm Master does sound cool though.

On another note, any thoughts on Nettlebane? It's less condensed than the Daolock, but probably a stronger version of the same idea.

[Dalinar]

Sorry for taking so long to get to this!

I do like the sound of that, but it's the action tax I'm worried about more than the feat tax. It's 10 DPR in a vacuum, but I'd need my action for eldritch blast. I'm not sure of a suitable bonus action option that would do the right kind of damage, especially not at range. It would also be competing with Maddening Hex, and eventually crown of stars. So while it's great in a vacuum, it doesn't seem like the right fight for this build. A build combining Crusher, shillelagh, spike growth + Polearm Master does sound cool though.

On another note, any thoughts on Nettlebane? It's less condensed than the Daolock, but probably a stronger version of the same idea.

All good!

I was under the impression that this build was focused on EB as your primary damaging action. Otherwise, there's not really a point in taking so many invocations around it. What would you be doing instead?

That said, anything with an attack roll can trigger Genie's Wrath and therefore Crusher for Daolock, so Crown of Stars will actually do that bludgeoning damage with your bonus action when you get to it.

As for Nettlebane, I honestly am surprised to hear myself say this, but I think I like Daolock better solely because you're not multiclassing out from your 9th-level arcanum (and Genielocks get Wish for it). Usually I'm all about that early game power because most campaigns don't go to T4, haha. Plus you get concentrationless flight to compete with things that would just fly away from your Spike Growth!

[RingoBongo]

I wasn't aware of the Lotusden Halfling before, I think there's a case to make for an Open Hank Monk abusing their ability to cast Spike Growth once per day. You can only pull it off daily, but the ability to drop your own spikes and then knock an enemy around it with Flurry could add up very quick - especially since you should have the movement to meet them at different sides of the Spike Growth to knock them around a couple times in a turn.

So I was looking closer at the idea of that 1 time use spike growth + open hand monk push. Instead of cleric dip, the build could take on ranger swarmkeeper dip (little twig blights) and get an extra 15 ft push. So at level 8 (ranger 3, monk 5) after you set up a spike growth you would be looking at

(1d8 + 4) x2 -- attack + extra attack (with 1 15 ft push from swarm keeper)
(1d6 + 4) x2 -- bonus action furry of blows ( with 2 15ft pushes

Total push movement across the spike growth in one round = 45 / 5 = 9x (2d4). The real trick then becomes planning the push and your movement to be able to get on the other side to push across the spike growth again.

All in total 75 average damage per round at level 8 when using a spike growth and cheese grater pushes. This damage can be sustained round after round up to as many ki you have for flurry of blows and as long as you have spell slots for spike growth and maintain concentration. That's pretty neat!

[prototype00]

Thesis: All those buffs monks get in Tasha's sure do make for some interesting possibilities for the Kensai, and especially the Kensai Archer, who can both use them to mitigate the penalty of Sharpshooter and get a Crossbow Expert like bonus action attack.

Accuracy Without Distance

https://www.dropbox.com/s/mppwiby32wsdu1u/6595bf4a7828490b92e104319dc5a747.jpg?raw=1

Race: vHuman (once again, we need an extra feat, if you can pick custom lineage, all the better.)

Stats: (+1s in Dex and Wis)

Str: 10
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 8
Wis 16
Cha: 8

Skills (5): Nothing out of the ordinary here. Monk-like things to be good at.

Athletics
Acrobatics
Stealth
Insight
Perception


vHuman: Take the Fighting Initiate Feat (you qualify on account of the Shortsword) and select Archery Style

Lvl 1: Unarmored Defense, Martial Arts

Honestly at this level, just play like a generic monk. Run up and punch stuff. Just keep in mind that you are very accurate with your darts.

Lvl 2: Ki, Unarmored Movement, Dedicated Weapon (Tasha's)

Ah, an interesting level. Select Shortbow (you are proficient) as your dedicated weapon and all of a sudden you can run and gun like a champ.

Lvl 3: Monastic Tradition: Path of the Kensai (Kensai Weapons (Longbow, Longsword), Agile Parry, Kensai's Shot, Way of the Brush), Ki-Fueled Attack (Tasha's), Deflect Arrows

Big level, you can now use either your Longsword or your Longbow to deal more than decent ranged or melee damage. Ki Fueled Attack from Tasha's will be big later on but it is a bit of a white elephant now unfortunately. (if only there was some way to activate it reliably at this level.)

Lvl 4: Feat (we will pick up Sharpshooter), Slow Fall, Quickened Healing (Tasha's)

Why oh why did you pick up Quickened Healing, prototype00? Its no good.

1. Well it's free
2. It activates Ki Fueled attack, lol.

In any event, switch hit as necessary.

Lvl 5: Extra Attack, Stunning Strike, Focused Aim (Tasha's)

Ah, it all comes together. Now you can Sharpshooter with impunity and use Focused Aim to improve your accuracy as needed which procs Ki Fueled attack so you can sharpshooter again with the bonus action. Your damage really starts climbing here, I would think.

Lvl 6: One with the Blade (Magic Kensai Weapons, Deft Strike)

Ah, even more goodies for the playstyle. Deft strike, basically, you don't need to use Focused Aim to proc your Ki Fueled bonus action attack anymore, if you hit with it, you can deal a bit of extra damage and get the extra attack.

And thats basically it, I think? Use your next couple of ASIs to boost Dex and Wis, or pick up Mobile. You can also decide whether to stay or leave the Monk class here.

Hmm, I'd appreciate any advice as the progression doesn't seem silky smooth, though it does do what it sets out to do which is put impressive ranged damage on top of an excellent Monk Chassis (and you're still equally as good at melee and stunning things if needed, so you can switch hit.)

[Civis Mundi]

I was under the impression that this build was focused on EB as your primary damaging action. Otherwise, there's not really a point in taking so many invocations around it. What would you be doing instead?

That said, anything with an attack roll can trigger Genie's Wrath and therefore Crusher for Daolock, so Crown of Stars will actually do that bludgeoning damage with your bonus action when you get to it.

Ahhh, I wasn't factoring in Genie's Wrath! Somehow that passed by my radar. I just wasn't getting how we're getting the bludgeoning damage in there. That does definitely make it an attractive option for the Genielock, no reason not to take it really. Thanks for talking it out with me.


As for Nettlebane, I honestly am surprised to hear myself say this, but I think I like Daolock better solely because you're not multiclassing out from your 9th-level arcanum (and Genielocks get Wish for it). Usually I'm all about that early game power because most campaigns don't go to T4, haha. Plus you get concentrationless flight to compete with things that would just fly away from your Spike Growth!

You're probably right, though I too have never actually played a campaign that made it to T4, only one-shots. I'll probably keep developing them both as sister builds.

[stoutstien]

Thesis: All those buffs monks get in Tasha's sure do make for some interesting possibilities for the Kensai, and especially the Kensai Archer, who can both use them to mitigate the penalty of Sharpshooter and get a Crossbow Expert like bonus action attack.

Accuracy Without Distance

https://www.dropbox.com/s/mppwiby32wsdu1u/6595bf4a7828490b92e104319dc5a747.jpg?raw=1

Race: vHuman (once again, we need an extra feat, if you can pick custom lineage, all the better.)

Stats: (+1s in Dex and Wis)

Str: 10
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 8
Wis 16
Cha: 8

Skills (5): Nothing out of the ordinary here. Monk-like things to be good at.

Athletics
Acrobatics
Stealth
Insight
Perception


vHuman: Take the Fighting Initiate Feat (you qualify on account of the Shortsword) and select Archery Style

Lvl 1: Unarmored Defense, Martial Arts

Honestly at this level, just play like a generic monk. Run up and punch stuff. Just keep in mind that you are very accurate with your darts.

Lvl 2: Ki, Unarmored Movement, Dedicated Weapon (Tasha's)

Ah, an interesting level. Select Shortbow (you are proficient) as your dedicated weapon and all of a sudden you can run and gun like a champ.

Lvl 3: Monastic Tradition: Path of the Kensai (Kensai Weapons (Longbow, Longsword), Agile Parry, Kensai's Shot, Way of the Brush), Ki-Fueled Attack (Tasha's), Deflect Arrows

Big level, you can now use either your Longsword or your Longbow to deal more than decent ranged or melee damage. Ki Fueled Attack from Tasha's will be big later on but it is a bit of a white elephant now unfortunately. (if only there was some way to activate it reliably at this level.)

Lvl 4: Feat (we will pick up Sharpshooter), Slow Fall, Quickened Healing (Tasha's)

Why oh why did you pick up Quickened Healing, prototype00? Its no good.

1. Well it's free
2. It activates Ki Fueled attack, lol.

In any event, switch hit as necessary.

Lvl 5: Extra Attack, Stunning Strike, Focused Aim (Tasha's)

Ah, it all comes together. Now you can Sharpshooter with impunity and use Focused Aim to improve your accuracy as needed which procs Ki Fueled attack so you can sharpshooter again with the bonus action. Your damage really starts climbing here, I would think.

Lvl 6: One with the Blade (Magic Kensai Weapons, Deft Strike)

Ah, even more goodies for the playstyle. Deft strike, basically, you don't need to use Focused Aim to proc your Ki Fueled bonus action attack anymore, if you hit with it, you can deal a bit of extra damage and get the extra attack.

And thats basically it, I think? Use your next couple of ASIs to boost Dex and Wis, or pick up Mobile. You can also decide whether to stay or leave the Monk class here.

Hmm, I'd appreciate any advice as the progression doesn't seem silky smooth, though it does do what it sets out to do which is put impressive ranged damage on top of an excellent Monk Chassis (and you're still equally as good at melee and stunning things if needed, so you can switch hit.)

I appreciate the single class concept. Only thing I would probably change is switch out that level one feat for gunner and push back SS until 8 so you know you can use ki fueled attack pretty much whenever you want. Could pick up archery after you max dex as well depending on how much you value the value of dex to the flat attack bonus of archery.

Gunner will save a lot of headache when you are in the fray and if guns do pop up in a game...oh boy. Tagging a half feat right off a bad also opens up more half feat options.

[Evaar]

That said, anything with an attack roll can trigger Genie's Wrath and therefore Crusher for Daolock, so Crown of Stars will actually do that bludgeoning damage with your bonus action when you get to it.

How do we feel about the proposition that Crusher allows you to move a target 5 feet in any direction, which would therefore include "up" as an option, thereby allowing Repelling Blast to push the target further and further up and away with each hit, thereby causing falling damage at the end of the cast?

I think it's pretty obviously not intended, but does seem to align with a strict reading of RAW.

[Dalinar]

How do we feel about the proposition that Crusher allows you to move a target 5 feet in any direction, which would therefore include "up" as an option, thereby allowing Repelling Blast to push the target further and further up and away with each hit, thereby causing falling damage at the end of the cast?

I think it's pretty obviously not intended, but does seem to align with a strict reading of RAW.

Once per turn, unfortunately.

[x3n0n]

I appreciate the single class concept. Only thing I would probably change is switch out that level one feat for gunner and push back SS until 8 so you know you can use ki fueled attack pretty much whenever you want. Could pick up archery after you max dex as well depending on how much you value the value of dex to the flat attack bonus of archery.

Gunner will save a lot of headache when you are in the fray and if guns do pop up in a game...oh boy. Tagging a half feat right off a bad also opens up more half feat options.

Gunner and Piercer are both reasonable options, I think.

Gunner for point-blank firing (lack of synergy with Stunning Strike, extra synergy with Fighting Style Archery) and possible firearms in campaign; Piercer for always-on damage buff (take d8 piercing for first kensei melee weapon) that still functions with Stunning Strike; note synergy with potential Defensive Duelist in tier 3.

Both allow point-buy starting Dex 18 with Tasha's Custom Lineage.

If 18 Dex or Archery, SS at 4 *might* still be fine, but puts you behind the typical Monk AC progression curve earlier.

Given how expensive ASIs are for Monks, I would be strongly tempted to get the FS from a level of Fighter (or 2 of Ranger) after Monk 6 or Monk 8; if progression to 14th level is likely, that gets much less appealing (delaying Diamond Soul and maybe Empty Body).

[Evaar]

Once per turn, unfortunately.

Crusher is once per turn. Repelling Blast is with each hit of Eldritch Blast.

Crusher moves them up 5'.

Each hit of Eldritch Blast then moves them diagonally up and back 10'. So if you're level 11, theoretically you could send a foe 35' into the air.

[Dalinar]

Crusher is once per turn. Repelling Blast is with each hit of Eldritch Blast.

Crusher moves them up 5'.

Each hit of Eldritch Blast then moves them diagonally up and back 10'. So if you're level 11, theoretically you could send a foe 35' into the air.

Ah, that's how you meant. I think I've seen that before, but I forgot, so thank you for reminding me.

I'd double check with your DM, just in case. It certainly doesn't seem intended to me. Then again, they were smart enough to specify "horizontally" in the Swarmkeeper Ranger's ability from the same book, so maybe it was?

That said, if you get the go-ahead, this is a sneaky way to squeeze an extra d6 of damage out of each of your Eldritch Blasts. Spike Growth is better if you can cheese-grater people, though.

[ftafp]

https://i.imgur.com/A4PUqoS.jpg
The Turntech

Thesis: This is a build designed to showcase the College of Creation's fantastic abilities as a crafter due to its ability to ignore costly material components for spells that can quickly add up for other casters

Race: Human, Mark of Making
Class Split: Artificer 2/Creation Bard 18
Level Progression: Artificer 1 -> Bard 1 -> Artificer 2 -> Creation Bard 2-18
Stats: 8 Str, 14 Dex, (12+2) Con, 13 Int, 10 Wis, (15+1) Cha
Asi: Cha +2@6, Cha +2@10, Lucky@14, Warcaster@18
Infusions: Spellwrought Tattoo (1st level), Repeating Weapon

Tier 1: 1st level is artificer. As with most builds that start at level 1, this is kind of a boring place to be, particularly for classes that start with a dip level. Fret not though, level 2 will give us our bard spells and abilities which will be much more to our liking. Level 3 is where things get interesting, as we get access to our infusions. Spellwrought tattoo has a number of uses (giving your whole party a familiar seems to be the popular one), but there's plenty of amazing buffs you can cast with this like Bless or Gift of Alacrity that you should really make a top priority (Gift of Alacrity it should be noted can be cast on the whole party as the spellwrought tattoo doesnt disappear until after the spell you cast with it ends). Level 4 caps off tier 1 with jack of all trades, and then in tier 2 the fun begins.

Tier 2: At level 5 you gain your subclass. College of Creation is a fun pick with a lot of great uses, but the one I want to highlight is that your Performance of Creation can be used to create the material components for spells. This means when we get Magic Mouth at this level we can cast it for free. There are whole threads showing what you can do with this spell (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?539861-The-Arcane-Programmer-Guide-(-Official-Rules-Technique-)) but for the moment I'm going to focus on one: get yourself a pair of earmuffs and cast magic mouth on it, with the instructions to whisper "hidden creature detected" when it notices a creature in 30 feet. As long the target can be seen or heard, it will go off. Not impressed? Let's cast this a few more times on the earmuffs, as nothing prevents you from casting it multiple times on the same object: "invisible creature detected", "trap detected", "illusion detected", "liar detected", "treasure detected", "secret door detected". Want more detailed detection? cast it another time and have it add "at 12-o'-clock" if it sees the thing is right in front of you. cast it again for 1-o'-clock through 11, and then cast it a six more times to add "5 feet away", "10 feet away" and so on up to 30 feet. the spell is a ritual so don't worry about slots. At this level you can make the detailed detector for free in just 5 hours.

We finally get an ASI at level 6. You're a Cha caster so pump Cha. Level 7 will finally bring the joy of 3rd level spells. Level 8 is where we get our next big crafting break: Animating performance, allowing you to create a large or smaller object and make it fly. If you want to be cool like I do, you can take large board or something like it and animate it to make a hoverboard. If you want to be more practical you can buy an enclosed wagon like the Vistani use with a glass door. Now you can hide inside your animated wagon for full cover. Things only get better at level 9 when you get 4th level spells, among them is Fabricate from the mark of making spell list. This spell has a ton of underrated uses, including fabricating walls into rubble, but the reason we want this is what we can do with our tool proficiencies. See, Modern Rifles in the DMG don't have a price tag so we can't craft them normally, but we do know what they're made of and we do know how much of of that material is needed. so just take 5gp worth of chain and turn it into an automatic rifle and then slap your repeating shot on it so you don't have to worry about ammo. Now, it's probably better to give this to an ally, but if your DM lets you take the Flying Monkey familiar from Tomb of Annihilation, you can give your monkey a rifle and it can use the Burst Fire ability every turn as a DC 15 AoE that is conveniently not an attack RAW and conveniently won't waste ammo. Finally, we cap off tier 2 with level 10 where we max out our CHA. tier 3 is next and it's going to be a wild ride

Tier 3: At level 11 you get 5th level spells. Among them is Creation from the Mark of Making spell list. We won't need this yet, but at level 12 we get our 6th level spell slots, allowing us to use it to create a large object, such as a cannon which you can make dance. We'll need some creatures to man the cannon so get Tiny Servant as one of your magical secrets. A large number of these fellows can aim, load and fire your canon while standing in the same space. We might want to create this cannon inside our dancing wagon so you can give your servants full cover. This is the first reason why we wanted a lot of floor space. We get another magical secret at this level so grab Immovable Object. Your first priority should be casting this on the boots of your allies, allowing them to lock their feet in mid air, giving them a fly speed. Because this might break your allies ankles if they're hit with forced movement or knocked prone, your next objective should be casting it on their armor so they can't be knocked around. While you're at it, hit your wagon so it can't be pushed around, and some arrows if you have an archer friend to pin enemies in place. Next level we get 6th level spells. Lucky is a nice addition at 14, and at 15 we get 7th level spells. 16 is the real breadwinner here as our performance of creation no longer has a price limit, so you know what we can make now? Antimatter Rifles! RAW you get an hour before your long rest ends to use up any unused abilities and spell slots, so create an antimatter rifle and slap your repeating shot on it. If your party's archer dex martial has a reliable way to get cancel out disadvantage or get big, you might want to supersize that rifle and make one for a large creature, since according to the DMG a medium creature can wield a large weapon at disadvantage and such a weapon does twice as many damage dice. If they happen to be a pure rune knight, you can even make them a huge version for triple damage dice. But that's not all we get this level. We also get Hallow from magical secrets, which we can cast for free inside our wagon as many times as we like. Now, Hallow does say that the spell fails if it overlaps with another hallow spell, but that's no trouble, as the radius can be less than that 60 foot max, so choose a tiny safe space in the middle of the wagon and make some tiny hallow spells to give you resistance to everything. You might also want to throw some 5-foot radius hallows in the all four corners for auras of fear to inflict on your enemies.

Tier 4: Tier 4 isn't something most campaigns play to as it's where the rules start to break down and full casters become gods. Therefore I'll just leave you with one last crafting trick: True Polymorph is great for making armies of constructs from random objects. Personally, I like Living Spells from Eberron Rising from the last War, as you can make pretty much any potentially damage-dealing spell under 5th level spammable

[Jon talks a lot]

Level Progression: Artificer 1 -> Bard 1 -> Artificer 2 -> Creation Bard 2-18


This progression seems pretty weak. Not getting an ASI until level 6 just doesn't sit right with me. Your spell level progression is really screwed up, and you are also going to miss out on the 19th level ASI (though it doesn't matter that much).

[ftafp]

This progression seems pretty weak. Not getting an ASI until level 6 just doesn't sit right with me. Your spell level progression is really screwed up, and you are also going to miss out on the 19th level ASI (though it doesn't matter that much).

2 level dips are actually pretty normal in 5e. In exchange you get medium armor proficiency, con save proficiency, a bunch of ritual spells for free and spellwrought tattoo which I cannot stress enough is one of the more powerful second level abilities in the game

[prototype00]

I appreciate the single class concept. Only thing I would probably change is switch out that level one feat for gunner and push back SS until 8 so you know you can use ki fueled attack pretty much whenever you want. Could pick up archery after you max dex as well depending on how much you value the value of dex to the flat attack bonus of archery.

Gunner will save a lot of headache when you are in the fray and if guns do pop up in a game...oh boy. Tagging a half feat right off a bad also opens up more half feat options.

Appreciate the comments!

Didn’t go for Gunner for two reasons:

1. If this character ends up in melee, that’s... okay? Switch to two handing the Longsword and stunning fists and if you do get one to land just move away and start the ranged pain again. Mobile is useful as a later pick if you want to preserve your ranged uptime certainly.

2. At +2 Accuracy, Archery fighting style is almost equivalent having your Dex maxed by ASIs at 1st level (and breaks past that when you start applying actual ASIs), it’s a bit hard justifying taking it later.


Gunner and Piercer are both reasonable options, I think.

Gunner for point-blank firing (lack of synergy with Stunning Strike, extra synergy with Fighting Style Archery) and possible firearms in campaign; Piercer for always-on damage buff (take d8 piercing for first kensei melee weapon) that still functions with Stunning Strike; note synergy with potential Defensive Duelist in tier 3.

On the other hand.. I could take Gunner and Piercer for general damaging purposes and just sub out one of the two +2 Dex ASI picks, would be a longer term build (Fighting Initiate, Sharpshooter, Gunner, Piercer, +2 Dex ASI is lvl 16 for a vHuman or custom lineage.)

I took Sharpshooter early because you basically can already do the assisted aim Shennanigans at 5th level, so it’s worth having around by that point, I feel, if people were wondering.

[x3n0n]

At +2 Accuracy, Archery fighting style is almost equivalent having your Dex maxed by ASIs at 1st level (and breaks past that when you start applying actual ASIs), it’s a bit hard justifying taking it later.

I think Dex +4 is probably better than Dex +3 and Archery just because of all of the other stuff that comes along with Dex (AC, +1 damage/hit, initiative, skills) vs an additional +1 to hit.
(I can agree that it's close though, but nothing is taking great advantage of it until you get to SS anyway.)

I think v.human Dex/Wis 16/16 Sharpshooter is actually a reasonable start as well. (Range and cover benefits are online immediately, and you don't need to spend an ASI for SS, disrupting the curve.)
Lv4: +Dex
Lv6: Fully online (SS, Kensei Longbow, Ki-Fueled Attack, Focused Aim) except for Archery
After lv6 or lv8 (+Dex), dip 1 level of Fighter for Archery.

(Not arguing that this one is clearly better than your original; I'm just "allergic" to taking 2 full feats early in a point-buy Monk's career. Things open up a lot if you roll a 16.)

[prototype00]

I think Dex +4 is probably better than Dex +3 and Archery just because of all of the other stuff that comes along with Dex (AC, +1 damage/hit, initiative, skills) vs an additional +1 to hit.
(I can agree that it's close though, but nothing is taking great advantage of it until you get to SS anyway.)

I think v.human Dex/Wis 16/16 Sharpshooter is actually a reasonable start as well. (Range and cover benefits are online immediately, and you don't need to spend an ASI for SS, disrupting the curve.)
Lv4: +Dex
Lv6: Fully online (SS, Kensei Longbow, Ki-Fueled Attack, Focused Aim) except for Archery
After lv6 or lv8 (+Dex), dip 1 level of Fighter for Archery.

(Not arguing that this one is clearly better than your original; I'm just "allergic" to taking 2 full feats early in a point-buy Monk's career. Things open up a lot if you roll a 16.)

Yeah, you’ve hit it on the head, build is 90% online only at 5th level and 100% online only at 6th level.

Which is fine, really, that is still optimal-ish for most play. But not 100% ideal for smooth power curve.

The level of fighter is of course a possibility, but I like the simplicity of the straight monk build for this exercise, personally. Other people feel free to sprinkle it in.

There’s free retraining in AL now so it’s less of an issue to play a punchy/Quarterstaff Mobile monk at low levels (which is really effective against goblins let me tell you) and then switch to ranged death once you hit lvl 5.

[Renduaz]

The Phantom Menace
https://tabletopjoab.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/phantom-rogue-ghost-walk.png
Race: Bugbear, Tabaxi, or Hill Dwarf
Class: Phantom Rogue 13/Dao Genie Pact of the Blade Warlock 7
Progression: Warlock 1 -> Rogue 13 -> Warlock 7
ASI: Just max out CON and DEX based on race/TCE custom stats, we'll almost never be using CHA-based abilities or spells anyway.
Notable Feats: Mobile, Sentinel, Tough, Weapon Master, Ritual Caster
Eldritch Invocations: Trickster's Escape, Ghostly Gaze, Improved Pact Weapon, Thirsting Blade. Optionally Relentless Hex and Eldritch Smite.
Notable Spells: Meld Into Stone, Stone Shape, Hex, Invisibility, Shadow Blade, Fly, Summon Lesser Demons, Summon Greater Demon.

Description

The Phantom Menace may not be the greatest rogue alive....but it is certainly the greatest rogue dead ( kind of). All jokes aside, the Phantom Menace at the peak of its power has the capacity to become practically non-existent to their enemies, both in infiltration and in combat, to the point where it never even relies on stealth or hiding in stark contrast to the typical rogue, since they are impossible to discover by nearly all means regardless. However, such power tends to come with a price tag attached.

We're going to exploit Ghost Walk against common sense by ending our turns inside objects.

Races

Bugbear - Oddly enough makes for an excellent rogue thanks to Long-Limbed and Surprised attack, with the extra reach as a precaution against our cover potentially being blown off.

Tabaxi - For Feline Agility and climbing speed, possibly the best option on the list.

Hill Dwarf - For Dwarven Toughness, albeit its unclear whether the extra 20hp at max will make much of a difference.

Class Features

Genie's Gift - An incredible addition for any rogue. You can store treasure that would normally encumber you too much to carry or that must be stolen and stashed in haste, you can store various machinery or tools that can be cracked open by breaking the vessel or kept inside for your use, if you have a familiar or a party member does, you can hop in a vessel and extract yourself more safely from recon missions, the list goes on.

In this specific build, and don't worry if you can't understand what I'm referring to yet, you could use it for long-term Ghostly expeditions in order to take some short rests or a long rest to refill your HP pool whenever you find some tiny subterranean pocket or artificial nook in the construction where it can be safely placed and hidden, assuming of course it can't just be left to meld inside another object without taking damage.

Elemental Gift - We'll be mostly looking at the non-nagical, concentration-less, multi-use 10 minute flying ( hover ) speed of 30 feet, as our own speed might prove woefully inadequate when Ghostwalking.

There isn't much to say about the Phantom's features up to level 13 that aren't standard Phantom Rogue fare, other than using Tokens of the Departed to always have a soul trinket ready for Ghost Walk and keep one on your person for Con saves when using concentration spells.

Ghost Walk - The foundation of the build, and a one of its kind ability in DND. Not only is it not considered magical for the purposes of Antimagic Field, much less Dispel Magic, can be used as ma y times as you can get new soul trinkets, but it also allows passge through anything whatsoever, not just earth or stone, you still traverse the Prime rather than the Ethereal Plane, and you can still fully interact with the environment and take actions as normal without restriction.

There are two tactical approaches for which you could use it in combat:

1. Settle for disadvantage on attack rolls and passing obstacles or just flying around or hiding, which might be good enugh for a lot of players in easy fights. If there is so e kind of room on the other side of a wall or whatever you can move into at the end of your turn, you get the best of both worlds, though that is situational.

2. Perpetually or for the duration of a dangerous round finish your turn inside creatures or objects. You will be taking 1d10 force damage for doing so, but when it comes to high-level, difficult encounters, especially in harecore or optimized oriented campaigns, that could be well worth the trade, as you avoid hordes of enemies, meteor showers, aoe effects, and spellcasters just by virtue of doing so. At baseline, if we presume the extremely unlikely scenario of you taking 10 damage per turn, you could still survive about 20+ turns with maxed CON before going up for party healing or the danger lessening.

Now, with objects, it can be a floor, walls, even ceiling albeit you'll likely need some good reach, and you can either hover up to the 'surface' of the matter at the start of your turns, which does expose you to readied actions, or you could permanently stay under, which is can be a problem until level 20 as you are effectively blind while doing so. You can move through it, but can't see past the total cover afforded. But don't worry, we have feats to make it feasible. With creatures, its also hard due to the fact they can always move away on their turn leaving you exposed, but we have options.

The most important thing you need to know is that Ghost Walk enables you to attack from inside objects and creatures from total cover. You can hit them, but they can't hit you, unless they spend magic or actions trying to blast the floor off, and if you are inside them then obviously not. Assuming your equipment is equally affected by the Walk, which seems to be the case in all of those abilities rather than you just leaving all your clothes behind and turning naked when moving through a wall, you can also swing your weapons with your reach at targets one square above, to the sides, or below. It has to be with a melee weapon because ranged ammunition won't continue advancing through objects onces it leaves your person.

Our speed, by the way, is not 5 feet when moving completely through objects as if difficult terrain. Thanks to Elemental Gift, it becomes a modest 15. If we were to Bonus Action Dash, its back to 30. If we took the Mobile feat, its 25 with Gift and 55 with Dash that ignores difficult terrain. A Tabaxi can double movement to get to a target. A Fly spell would turn it into base 70 if used. With Trickster's Escape for Freedom of Movement, our speed through objects can in fact be up to 210 burst, and more conservatively with only Gift and no Dash used or Mobile feat taken, also 30.

But how to utilize that position more efficiently on the battlefield? More on that at the Feat, Invocation and Spells section, but for now lets turn our attention to the non-combat use: When it comes to infiltration, the Phantom Menace has no parallel, not even close. All the stealth and lockpicking in the world won't make up for it in other rogues, and the Phantom has it too.

The BBEG built an underground complex, or mountain fortress, or a floating city with a vault that nobody is ever getting into. Who could? The outer layers are all warded with Mordekainen's Private Sanctum to stop the haughty mages, the core is pure Adamantine, the hallways are sealed by magic doors and walls, the vault itself is a zone of a permanent anti-magic.

No one except you. The Sanctums? Not teleporting, nor moving through the Ethereal Plane. The materials? Irrelevant. The Anti-Magic? Doesn't cover your Ghost Walk, nor Elemental Gift, nor your feats or your race. You can go at 150 feet per two turns as Tabaxi even without spells, or at a decent speed without Feline. Slap some Invisibility at least up to the vault, maybe some Nondetection from a friend, and all you have to do is just zip through everything in a trajectory or zigzag your eay through walls and floors if you're unsure or want more care taken.

Someone saw you with Truesight? Too bad, you're already in the next 3 floors over by the time their Surprise wears off. Just figure something out or another direction when getting out. Of course, it could still get heated, that's part of the fun. The only things which should halt your movement are literal walls of force or taking damage from traps/readied actions if not careful and sticking to objects.

If it takes too long, you could end up taking more force damage than is to your liking ( though your party could buff you even further ), but remember Genie Vessel? That's what its for.

Feats and Invocations

Ritual Caster - Familiar vessel combo

Weapon Master - Whip for extra reach. Reach is great if you intend to hide in walls or don't want someone to use magic or damage to peel off a floor section you were under too easily.

Tough - For HP

Mobile - Speed boost, avoid AOO's.

Sentinel - This, alongside Grappling if required or Holding spells, is how you do perpetual Ghostwalking without emerging. You will have disadavantage on the attacks, but you can still attack an unseen target which your weapons can reach past the matter surrounding you. As long as you know its up there, you can keep striking at its bottom. It works inside creatures too by the way - You could keep a flying dragon anchored if you successfully attack it from inside, and it won't be able to attack back.

Improved Pact Weapon - Damage, use weapon as spell focus

Thirsting Blade - Extra Attack.

Trickster's Escape - Freedom of Movement

Ghostly Gaze - This is the Phantom Menace's combat/infiltration nova at level 20. Your biggest disadavntage is being unable to see through objects. For 1 minute, at least out to 30 feet, you can.

Spells

Meld into Stone for respite in underground Ghostwalking. Stone Shape for creating or expaning pockets for Vessel Long Rests. A bunch of obvious spells, and demon summoning because you'll never be the non-demon which they can actually see once concentration is dropped.

Summary

This is a pretty high-level, even endgame oriented build, so it might be used more often for a powerful NPC or backup character or high level campaign, but thematically and mechanically, the Dao Genie and Phantom are made for each other and offer a really cool style and role in the party, and for the job of a rogue, I think this is one of the best I could come up with.

[Stattick]

Just a few things to point out.

You can't choose to spell Smite on crits only. The bonus action Smite spells must be cast before the attack and trigger on the next weapon hit. This also eats your concentration, so no Shadow Blade Smite, invisible Smite, or smiting while using Animated Objects.

Damn, you're right. Good call. I was thinking of the paladin's Divine Smite ability. Well, that'll need to be addressed.


Speaking of Animated Objects the spell gets a lot of praise but it is EXTREMELY vulnerable to AoE. Just be mindful of this. Like any summon it can be killed, and this one has particularly low health. Though still more than the Druids swarm of Wolves.

Yep. But I can point that out. Damaging environments are bad for Animated Objects, and it's subpar if you're dealing with AoE spells/effects.


Leomund's Tiny Hut has a casting time of 1 minute, not one action. No in combat casting unless you spend the requisite 10 rounds casting. (110 rounds of you want to ritual cast it!)

Yeah. I don't know what I was thinking. *shakes head*


Very on theme, but very sub optimal from what I see. You're extremely far behind in spell level. Though you have some short rest slots to give staying power through the day you still have a wizard's hit dice. And by making a MAD wizard that needs high Dex (they want it high, but rarely sacrifice something to boost it) high int, 13 Cha, and high Con. You're putting a lot of eggs in the amulet of health basket.

It's a work in progress.


Animate objects can only be cast on nonmagical objects. So any daggers with any type of enchant is out. However you can cast it on objects made of silver/adamantine or both to extend its effectiveness against more creatures.

Yeah, good catch. Can you silver adamantine? I wouldn't see why not. Silvered Adamantine it is then. Once you can afford such. Let's see: 500 gp for adamantine weapons and 100 gp for silvered. That's 6,000 total. I think that's too much, but if you're swimming in gold, then go for it. Due to the small size and weight of daggers or darts, as a GM, I'd probably price them less then recommended, probably at about 125 gp each (both adamantine and silvered). I'd probably also make the adamantine weapons resistant to bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing damage. But GMs are going to vary, and some tables are strictly RAW (adventurer's league, for instance).


Sara Kerrigan called (https://img.bhs4.com/a3/8/a38c4d10bb8dbeb531d5cdbcfcc1c1bfedc3aa6d_large.jpg ), and she'd like to have a word with you. :smallbiggrin:

Nice concept, I'd like to suggest keeping a bunch of slivered darts or silvered daggers around for your animate objects.

Thanks, and see above - I think silvered adamantine would be the way to go, at least eventually.

Or if you want your GM to hate you, animate 10 tiny vials of holy water when facing vampires, or 10 tiny vials of acid or oil when facing trolls.

-----------

I'll go back and edit the build. I also have a redux build.

[Dalinar]

Greased Lightning
Show tunes optional.

THESIS: I really love skirmisher builds: highly mobile ranged damage dealers that avoid enemy attacks by getting out of the way. My current campaign is conducive to such builds, being a war campaign featuring lots of forest terrain; I'm playing a Sun Soul monk, and while I'm kind of feeling the low damage output and mediocre range, I love the way it plays, running in and out to harass the enemy without them having an easy response. So basically, I wanted to make something that plays tactically similarly, but outdoes the Sun Soul on damage so I'm not just pea-shooting the guys killing my friends. In the process, I came up with something with way more mobility and single-target damage* (though I don't have an idea to do comparable AOE at later levels, yet--and there's nothing in the game with flavor quite like Sun Soul, so that's arguably a sacrifice too).

WHEN TO PLAY THIS BUILD: any time you have a campaign where running and gunning is frequently a good option. You'll wish you made slightly different choices in a dungeon crawl or other indoor combat scenario, though the respectable Stealth and EA/Sharpshooter combo is still pretty good in such a situation.

RACE: High Elf for the free cantrip (pick Minor Illusion to generate places to hide), or Wood Elf for the extra movement speed and ability to hide when lightly obscured by natural phenomena. Any Elven Accuracy race works (friendly reminder that Custom Lineage is not intended to get racial feats, but is also good choice if your DM lets you). Alternatively, if you don't mind losing Elven Accuracy, pick a race with a flying speed, as it'll make you even harder to catch.

STATS: 17 DEX, at least 14 INT, rest to taste

IMPORTANT FEATS: Elven Accuracy, Sharpshooter, +2 DEX
OTHER COOL FEATS: Skulker, Mobile, Lucky, Fey-touched (Gift of Alacrity), Crossbow Expert, Gunner, Wood Elf Magic (if applicable)

FINAL CLASSES: Armorer 5/Scout 15 (optionally change that to Scout 13 / Fighter 2 for Action Surge, but I wouldn't sacrifice more Sneak Attack dice than that to grab a subclass--only one I'd reconsider for is Battle Master if you really want more riders)

CLASS PROGRESSION:

Your first goal is to reach Armorer 3/Scout 3. This gives you a pretty sizeable mobility package. I'm not 100% sure the order I've picked out is optimal, but I'm looking at Rogue 1, Artificer 3, Rogue 3.

I would start Rogue 1 over Artificer 1, depending on whether you prefer DEX or CON save proficiency, light or medium armor, and longbow proficiency (EDIT: you're an elf, you have this already). Since we won't be relying on Concentration too much I'm not as worried about losing it, and IMO Rogue 1 will probably feel more useful than Artificer 1. For the moment, you're the kind of rogue that stands back and plinks somebody with your longbow every turn. Damage per hit, assuming Sneak Attack is available: 1d8+1d6+3=11. Not a bad start.

From here, you have two choices: finish up your Rogue levels, or start going Artificer. While Cunning Action, another Sneak Attack die, and Skirmisher over two levels is a great package, getting your Artificer utility can be huge here, too--turning two of your party's weapons into +1 weapons can be a substantial boon, for instance. None of your attack cantrips are gonna be better than shooting your longbow, although Booming Blade might be nice if someone catches up to you, but other than that I'd go utility for those--Mage Hand and Prestidigitation are both excellent. For first-level spells, I like Faerie Fire, as the extra source of advantage is nice when you've got a Sneak Attack to back it up with. There are plenty of decent utility choices, though. Damage per hit, again given Sneak Attack: 1d8+1d6+4=12 (assuming you've given yourself one of the +1 weapons from your infusions). You'd be doing a little more damage with Rogue 3, although more of that is Sneak Attack damage, and your utility package is not as robust.

At 4, I'd pick up Armorer, and if you haven't guessed we're making Infiltration Armor. This ups your walking speed, gives you a ranged weapon that deals 2d6 on the first hit (only 1d6 on subsequent hits, but it'll be a while before Extra Attack yet), and gives you advantage on Stealth checks, which will go great with Cunning Action at 5. Damage per Sneak Attack at levels 4 and 5: 3d6+4=14.5, a nice little bump from 3. You've lost some range, but you also are no longer using your hands, so you're free to wield your favorite one-handed melee weapon (just in case) as well as a shield, so you're a little tankier versus the things that do attack you. You also got another spell slot at 5, although you still mostly use those situationally rather than for raw damage unless you need Catapult or Tasha's Caustic Brew or something like that.

Levels six through nine are all very precious to us; while an ASI from Armorer 4 would be a nice bump, so is the extra Sneak Attack die from Rogue 3, and our subclass choice (Scout) gives us the final piece of our mobility puzzle in the form of Skirmisher. Now if someone walks up to us, we can use our reaction to take a few steps back, which potentially means less need to Disengage and makes us even faster turn-over-turn. Damage per Sneak Attack at level 6: 4d6+4=18. By this point the single-class DPR builds have Extra Attack and their most relevant feats online, while the caster builds have level 3 spells (or both if you're buddies with a Bladesinger), so this isn't that impressive. Going off the D&D: Optimized Youtube channel, which has quite a few DPR-focused builds (albeit many use the CL/EA combo which makes them outdated), there are builds out there doing more than double our damage even accounting for the enemy AC, which we haven't.

You make up for it in range (90/300), mobility (35-40ft movement speed depending on race choice, Cunning Action, Skirmisher) and nigh-unparalleled Stealth checks (+3 DEX, expertise assuming you took that at 1 and why wouldn't you, and advantage). We have the utility from three Artificer levels as well as another expertise from our first Rogue level. We're also rocking alright AC since we have a shield, which should total around 17-19 by this point depending on your armor availability (19 requires half-plate which negates your Stealth advantage, 18 is for breastplate or scale mail--again, mind the Stealth disadvantage on scale mail--while 17 is studded leather or a chain shirt). Can use one of your infusions to bump that by 1 more, although that might not be the best use of an infusion since you're trying not to be in harm's way anyway. Give it to your melee buddy instead if that's what you want.

Your second goal is to reach Armorer 5/Scout 5. This will up your damage output substantially. I'm taking the Artificer levels first, but again, not sure how optimal that is.

In the next three levels we'll be getting two feats. The best options as I see 'em are EA/+2DEX, EA/Sharpshooter, or Sharpshooter/EA (as there's no reason to take +2DEX before EA).

Pick EA/+2 DEX to maximize your Stealth checks and AC (19 in studded leather and a shield) as well as get the most consistent chance to hit in a vacuum (+6 counting your infusion and 3 d20s).
Pick EA/Sharpshooter to maximize your burst damage potential.
Pick Sharpshooter/EA if your DM is a stickler for half- and three-quarters cover rules, or if you expect to need to hit things from more than 90 feet away, to the point where you don't feel you can delay Sharpshooter. The power attack is less useful before EA and Extra Attack (am I the only one that just noticed that's the same initialism?), but still might be called for situationally.
If you didn't go an Elf of some kind, pick up any half-feat that gives you a DEX increase and Sharpshooter, in whichever order makes sense to you based on the above.


I think EA/Sharpshooter is the play, as Sharpshooter becomes a lot better once you have both Elven Accuracy and Extra Attack.

At level 9, we are an Armorer 5/Scout 4. Our first attack that lands deals 4d6+5=19 damage, while our second attack that lands deals 1d6+5=8.5 damage. 27.5 total. That was less impressive than I'd hoped, but we are dramatically more accurate now, and we have Sharpshooter to play with, which could potentially make that a much more respectable 47.5. But now accuracy is a much greater factor; at what point do we not power-attack? I plugged in the numbers into Ludic's DPR calculator, and I'm getting that power attack becomes not worth it on an 18 AC or more. Our advantage DPR on a target of AC 10 is just shy of 30; on an AC 17 it's about 27; it's 23.44 on an AC of 20. We're still getting rocked by the top-tier DPR builds, but again, most of those are melee. At this point we're doing our thing from 300 feet away, can move 70-80 feet per round and still attack (105-120 if we Dash instead of attacking), can move another 20 feet with our reaction on top of that if someone does manage to close the gap, and we have pretty much the best possible Stealth check aside from needing one more ASI to cap DEX.

From this point on, unless you want Action Surge as a panic option or have a better idea for a dip, we're going full Rogue. We don't get a ton out of the next few Artificer levels, so there's no point in going further there.

At Armorer 5/Scout 5, and every other level after that, we gain another Sneak Attack die, capping out at 8d6 from Sneak Attack at max level. We cap our DEX at character level 13, giving us a +6 to attack and damage rolls counting the infusion. Other notable levels include Scout 9 (CL14), which gives us 10 more feet of walking speed (which we love), as well as Scout 10 and 12 which give you two more feats to play with (you have a lot of options, few of which will make a DPR difference).

Feedback always appreciated!

*Okay, on further reflection, I'll admit I don't actually know how much DPR an optimized Sun Soul would put out, but it can't be that much, right? Anyone wanna take a crack at that?

[whateew]

Warrior of the Storm Gods - or budget Thor!

Thesis:
This is my pick for fun strength based gish. The idea is a tempest cleric who is themed around making the most out of the booming blade cantrip + crusher feat combo, being in the thick of battle and being all-round annoying to deal with.
While a tempest cleric isn't necessary (a nature cleric is more SAD), they get fun features for being in the thick of battle, and it feels very thematic!

Ingredients:
A high half elf (standard high elf is also fine) with the booming blade cantrip.
Tempest cleric
At 4th level, the crusher feat.

With point buy, your cleric might look like this:
15 + 2 Str, 8 Dex, 15 + 1 Con, 8 Int, 15 + 1 Wis, 8 Cha.

Core Idea:
Armed with heavy armour and your choice of a flail, warhammer or maul, you will spend most of your actions attacking and harassing single enemies with booming blade - dealing respectable damage, and forcing enemies without reach to either take some damage or miss out on moving.

While a tortle bladesinger could also do this, the cleric gets a lot of neat concentration spells to cast on their first turn, contributing effectively to CC or buffing the party - if you're going to be up front anyway, you will get a lot of usage out of spirit guardians in particular. Not only will all enemies around you have a dramatic reduction in move speed, but your booming blade can make it very difficult for particular enemies to figure out a plan of action - assuming you hit them, you can knock them back. Now, if they don't move, they are unable to avoid spiritual guardian damage next turn, but if they do, they proc booming blade, and must choose between attacking you or escaping.

What your turn might look like at 5th level:
1st turn: you have your shield out, but no weapon. You cast spirit guardians, and you have a free bonus action (perhaps you could fit shillelagh in here!)
2nd turn: you cast spiritual weapon with a bonus action, then draw your weapon and begin your reign of thunderous terror.

Some limitations:
This, of course, comes at the cost of boosting your strength before your wisdom - however, with 1d8 + 4 + booming blade, you will be doing very respectable damage each turn, before you account for your spells - and if your crusher + BB combo causes enemies to proc the movement damage penalty, I believe you will be a respectable source of damage.

Another issue might be juggling free hands. While you could use a maul, you'll want the +2 AC from the shield, and since you only make the one attack per turn the bonus damage is less useful for you than, say, a fighter. Clerics do get the option of making their shields a focus however, and you can cast all of your spells before then drawing your weapon as a free action. If you need to recast something, you can always drop it and pick it up.

A major issue will be concentration saves, as with spirit guardians up, you will be a prime target. While your wis-uses thunderous rebuke can help to dissuade enemies, this is still not an ideal situation to be in. Perhaps keep an ASI out for res (con) or warcaster (which helps with the hands too!), but you are already quite MAD, so this might be tough.


Any thoughts? I feel like this would be a fun frontliner to play!

[whateew]

The Phantom Menace may not be the greatest rogue alive....but it is certainly the greatest rogue dead ( kind of). All jokes aside, the Phantom Menace at the peak of its power has the capacity to become practically non-existent to their enemies, both in infiltration and in combat, to the point where it never even relies on stealth or hiding in stark contrast to the typical rogue, since they are impossible to discover by nearly all means regardless. However, such power tends to come with a price tag attached.

We're going to exploit Ghost Walk against common sense by ending our turns inside objects.
...

This is a pretty high-level, even endgame oriented build, so it might be used more often for a powerful NPC or backup character or high level campaign, but thematically and mechanically, the Dao Genie and Phantom are made for each other and offer a really cool style and role in the party, and for the job of a rogue, I think this is one of the best I could come up with.

I love this! A very fun build which takes a very sneaky ability and pushes it to its extreme. A nice note might be that the brooch of shielding is a fairly low level item that lets this sneakster spend maybe twice the time inside of objects as they'd be able to otherwise. Its a shame that the ability is so high level, slowing down when things come online, but hey, its a fantastic ability.




Thesis: This is a build designed to showcase the College of Creation's fantastic abilities as a crafter due to its ability to ignore costly material components for spells that can quickly add up for other casters

I also really like this as a concept. I have always loved crafty type characters, and perhaps a cool DM would let you make use of your tools to just go wild with free time. Also, I hadn't realised that you could craft tattoos! That sounds very powerful...

[Foxhound438]

Just Because I'm Fast Doesn't Mean I'm a Monk

Thesis: I really like monks. The ability to move around at lighting speed and at later levels ignore all kinds of obstacles is just really fun to me. But, I also really like playing Paladins. Paladins don't tend to move fast at all, and I wanted a build that can scratch both my gotta go fast itch and my righteous smiting itch at the same time. So here it is:

Race (badumtss): Tabaxi
Class: Paladin

Core features:

- Feline agility: No action, no resource, doubles your movement speed for a round, and recharges if you stand in place for a round. Typically, the round you care about speed the most is the first round, and then after that you don't care as much because you're already next to a target. But even if you do find that another enemy is far away after you've killed an enemy, there's a pretty good chance that you spend a round in between standing in melee, so you might already have this back.

- Cat's claws: I don't care so much for the 1d4 unarmed strikes, as it doesn't really work with paladins, but a climbing speed is basically as good as the better half of Monk's 9th level feature.

- Cat's talent: While hiding is never a paladin's first thought in battle, this one will be dex based, and sometimes a little stealth can keep you from getting ambushed or wandering into a fight that you can't handle. Perception on top is gravy.

- Mobile: While the ability to run away after an attack might not actually be useful for you, +10' of movement certainly can be, especially when it gets doubled.

- Oath spells: Vengeance paladins get access to misty step, haste, and dimension door. All three are great, and all paladins get access to find greater steed for those pesky flying foes later on. Mounts of course don't benefit from your feline agility, but you can copy your haste to your pegasus to get a 180' fly speed. Oath of glory also gets haste, plus a bit of extra move speed at 7th, but for now I'll stick with vengeance for THIS:

- Avenging Angel: While your own fly speed here is now lower than a pegasus, you can't necessarily rely on a mount all the time. AoE damage, dispels, etc. can mess with a found greater steed, and sometimes it's hard to justify taking a mount everywhere. Into a cramped cave for instance.

- Optional: Dual Wielder. As I mentioned earlier, this is going to be a dex build, so no PAM for bonus action attacks. You can get away with using dual shortswords pretty easily, but in the late game you might find some magic rapiers or whips or anything else, so it's nice to be able to pick this up in those cases. You want to 2wf here to get the most out of improved divine smite, and of course get more crits for your smites in general. If you're using the stat reassignment rules in Tasha's, you probably would want PAM.

- Optional: Mounted Combatant. Once you have a flying steed, it might do you good to make sure it stays alive, especially when you're in the air. A lot of area damage effects are dex saves, and with your aura bonus a pegasus should be able to dodge those effects entirely a good percentage of the time. Advantage on attacks against medium creatures could be pretty good as well, depending on what kinds of enemies your DM likes.

- Optional: Magic Initiate: Expeditious Retreat. Now, you better not be using this to be the one retreating - it should be for when the enemy is retreating from you. If you aren't expecting to see 9th level in a game, or if you just don't want to wait that long, this is a pretty good substitute for Haste. Only for levels 4-8 at most, since we aren't a custom race here, but in a level 5 one shot or whatever it might be a bit better than mobile. Eldritch blast in the cantrip slot might be nice as well.

The end result is that from level 1 you have the ability to move 60' in a round without using an action or bonus action. As you get to higher levels, this only gets better; With mobile at 4th, you can move 80', no action required. Haste at 9th will allow you to double your speed and double it again, to move 160', and then attack with your haste action and get your TWF bonus action. If you need to move even farther, you can go 320' at the drop of the hat by casting haste and using the haste action to dash. At 13th level, you have a pegasus that can be hasted with you, so a fly speed of 180' into multiple Improved Divine Smite boosted attacks. Your overall armor class is 1 behind a heavily armored paladin once you max dex, and your damage is a bit behind between smaller damage dice and not having two weapon fighting style without taking another feat for it. But, I think the differences in numbers are pretty minor compared to the mobility that this build affords.

[Rihno]

- Optional: Dual Wielder. As I mentioned earlier, this is going to be a dex build, so no PAM for bonus action attacks. You can get away with using dual shortswords pretty easily, but in the late game you might find some magic rapiers or whips or anything else, so it's nice to be able to pick this up in those cases. You want to 2wf here to get the most out of improved divine smite, and of course get more crits for your smites in general. If you're using the stat reassignment rules in Tasha's, you probably would want PAM.

Revenant Blade will actually be better than Dual Wielder. No need for Two-Weapon Fighting Style + no need for two magical weapons. Instead you use Double Bladed Scimitar which has build-in extra attack on bonus action. And you get +1 DEX and +1 AC with Revenant Blade. This is my go-to feat for Dex Paladin, especially combined with Elven Accuracy and Blind-Fighting Style.

[LudicSavant]

So those comments about what goes in the Eclectic thread / talk about splitting it? Weren't from me. As far as I'm concerned everyone's builds are welcome! :smallsmile:

[Rihno]

So those comments about what goes in the Eclectic thread / talk about splitting it? Weren't from me. As far as I'm concerned everyone's builds are welcome! :smallsmile:

I think the issue some people had were UA materials used and "builds" like 20 Fighter with PAM + GWM, which some folks saw as "nothing new".

Granted most builds I see here (even if with some rulling mistakes) are neither UA, nor "nothing new" so I also don't understand the need of new thread for builds. I think many builds here are interesting and fun.

[Foxhound438]

Revenant Blade will actually be better than Dual Wielder. No need for Two-Weapon Fighting Style + no need for two magical weapons. Instead you use Double Bladed Scimitar which has build-in extra attack on bonus action. And you get +1 DEX and +1 AC with Revenant Blade. This is my go-to feat for Dex Paladin, especially combined with Elven Accuracy and Blind-Fighting Style.

Unfortunately, revenant blade is an elf only feat, so my build wouldn't be able to use it. Also, I feel like "magic double bladed scimitar" would be an even harder find than any magic polearm, since DBS is only available in ebberon to begin with.

[Dalinar]

I appreciate the positive attitude, Ludic, although I still think having a "workshop" thread separate from a "polished" thread makes some amount of sense. (Huge fan of your work BTW. Someday I'll make that Watchers Dexadin work without Eberron! :P)

The reason I say this is that there is value in having a lively discussion around builds in progress, AND there is value in having a compendium of builds polished by peer feedback for others to draw inspiration from or outright copy when they sit down to play the game. Your thread eventually became both, which I think caused confusion when a certain pair of users (you know who you are--and I say this without any sort of of judgment!) interpreted the purpose of the thread differently from each other.

That said, I'll definitely be reposting some builds in there when I'm a bit more confident that I've done what I can to make them, y'know, awesome. :smallsmile:

[Rihno]

Unfortunately, revenant blade is an elf only feat, so my build wouldn't be able to use it. Also, I feel like "magic double bladed scimitar" would be an even harder find than any magic polearm, since DBS is only available in ebberon to begin with.

I mean I don't think any normal DM allowing Revenant Blade in frist place wouldn't place some magical ones on your way considering you just commited with a feat to one kind of a weapon with his blessing. So it would be kind a D-move from DM in my book. But yeah, forgot it's elf only as I only play elf and half-elf Paladins so it's my bad for not remembering this :)

[prototype00]

I appreciate the positive attitude, Ludic, although I still think having a "workshop" thread separate from a "polished" thread makes some amount of sense. (Huge fan of your work BTW. Someday I'll make that Watchers Dexadin work without Eberron! :P)

The reason I say this is that there is value in having a lively discussion around builds in progress, AND there is value in having a compendium of builds polished by peer feedback for others to draw inspiration from or outright copy when they sit down to play the game. Your thread eventually became both, which I think caused confusion when a certain pair of users (you know who you are--and I say this without any sort of of judgment!) interpreted the purpose of the thread differently from each other.

That said, I'll definitely be reposting some builds in there when I'm a bit more confident that I've done what I can to make them, y'know, awesome. :smallsmile:

All that being said, I do think it might be time for the index of builds to be updated again. There have been a bunch of cool new submissions.

[Dalinar]

Greased Lightning
Show tunes optional.

THESIS: I really love skirmisher builds: highly mobile ranged damage dealers that avoid enemy attacks by getting out of the way. My current campaign is conducive to such builds, being a war campaign featuring lots of forest terrain; I'm playing a Sun Soul monk, and while I'm kind of feeling the low damage output and mediocre range, I love the way it plays, running in and out to harass the enemy without them having an easy response. So basically, I wanted to make something that plays tactically similarly, but outdoes the Sun Soul on damage so I'm not just pea-shooting the guys killing my friends. In the process, I came up with something with way more mobility and single-target damage* (though I don't have an idea to do comparable AOE at later levels, yet--and there's nothing in the game with flavor quite like Sun Soul, so that's arguably a sacrifice too).

WHEN TO PLAY THIS BUILD: any time you have a campaign where running and gunning is frequently a good option. You'll wish you made slightly different choices in a dungeon crawl or other indoor combat scenario, though the respectable Stealth and EA/Sharpshooter combo is still pretty good in such a situation.

RACE: High Elf for the free cantrip (pick Minor Illusion to generate places to hide), or Wood Elf for the extra movement speed and ability to hide when lightly obscured by natural phenomena. Any Elven Accuracy race works (friendly reminder that Custom Lineage is not intended to get racial feats, but is also good choice if your DM lets you). Alternatively, if you don't mind losing Elven Accuracy, pick a race with a flying speed, as it'll make you even harder to catch.

STATS: 17 DEX, at least 14 INT, rest to taste

IMPORTANT FEATS: Elven Accuracy, Sharpshooter, +2 DEX
OTHER COOL FEATS: Skulker, Mobile, Lucky, Fey-touched (Gift of Alacrity), Crossbow Expert, Gunner, Wood Elf Magic (if applicable)

FINAL CLASSES: Armorer 5/Scout 15 (optionally change that to Scout 13 / Fighter 2 for Action Surge, but I wouldn't sacrifice more Sneak Attack dice than that to grab a subclass--only one I'd reconsider for is Battle Master if you really want more riders)

CLASS PROGRESSION:

Your first goal is to reach Armorer 3/Scout 3. This gives you a pretty sizeable mobility package. I'm not 100% sure the order I've picked out is optimal, but I'm looking at Rogue 1, Artificer 3, Rogue 3.

I would start Rogue 1 over Artificer 1, depending on whether you prefer DEX or CON save proficiency, light or medium armor, and longbow proficiency (EDIT: you're an elf, you have this already). Since we won't be relying on Concentration too much I'm not as worried about losing it, and IMO Rogue 1 will probably feel more useful than Artificer 1. For the moment, you're the kind of rogue that stands back and plinks somebody with your longbow every turn. Damage per hit, assuming Sneak Attack is available: 1d8+1d6+3=11. Not a bad start.

From here, you have two choices: finish up your Rogue levels, or start going Artificer. While Cunning Action, another Sneak Attack die, and Skirmisher over two levels is a great package, getting your Artificer utility can be huge here, too--turning two of your party's weapons into +1 weapons can be a substantial boon, for instance. None of your attack cantrips are gonna be better than shooting your longbow, although Booming Blade might be nice if someone catches up to you, but other than that I'd go utility for those--Mage Hand and Prestidigitation are both excellent. For first-level spells, I like Faerie Fire, as the extra source of advantage is nice when you've got a Sneak Attack to back it up with. There are plenty of decent utility choices, though. Damage per hit, again given Sneak Attack: 1d8+1d6+4=12 (assuming you've given yourself one of the +1 weapons from your infusions). You'd be doing a little more damage with Rogue 3, although more of that is Sneak Attack damage, and your utility package is not as robust.

At 4, I'd pick up Armorer, and if you haven't guessed we're making Infiltration Armor. This ups your walking speed, gives you a ranged weapon that deals 2d6 on the first hit (only 1d6 on subsequent hits, but it'll be a while before Extra Attack yet), and gives you advantage on Stealth checks, which will go great with Cunning Action at 5. Damage per Sneak Attack at levels 4 and 5: 3d6+4=14.5, a nice little bump from 3. You've lost some range, but you also are no longer using your hands, so you're free to wield your favorite one-handed melee weapon (just in case) as well as a shield, so you're a little tankier versus the things that do attack you. You also got another spell slot at 5, although you still mostly use those situationally rather than for raw damage unless you need Catapult or Tasha's Caustic Brew or something like that.

Levels six through nine are all very precious to us; while an ASI from Armorer 4 would be a nice bump, so is the extra Sneak Attack die from Rogue 3, and our subclass choice (Scout) gives us the final piece of our mobility puzzle in the form of Skirmisher. Now if someone walks up to us, we can use our reaction to take a few steps back, which potentially means less need to Disengage and makes us even faster turn-over-turn. Damage per Sneak Attack at level 6: 4d6+4=18. By this point the single-class DPR builds have Extra Attack and their most relevant feats online, while the caster builds have level 3 spells (or both if you're buddies with a Bladesinger), so this isn't that impressive. Going off the D&D: Optimized Youtube channel, which has quite a few DPR-focused builds (albeit many use the CL/EA combo which makes them outdated), there are builds out there doing more than double our damage even accounting for the enemy AC, which we haven't.

You make up for it in range (90/300), mobility (35-40ft movement speed depending on race choice, Cunning Action, Skirmisher) and nigh-unparalleled Stealth checks (+3 DEX, expertise assuming you took that at 1 and why wouldn't you, and advantage). We have the utility from three Artificer levels as well as another expertise from our first Rogue level. We're also rocking alright AC since we have a shield, which should total around 17-19 by this point depending on your armor availability (19 requires half-plate which negates your Stealth advantage, 18 is for breastplate or scale mail--again, mind the Stealth disadvantage on scale mail--while 17 is studded leather or a chain shirt). Can use one of your infusions to bump that by 1 more, although that might not be the best use of an infusion since you're trying not to be in harm's way anyway. Give it to your melee buddy instead if that's what you want.

Your second goal is to reach Armorer 5/Scout 5. This will up your damage output substantially. I'm taking the Artificer levels first, but again, not sure how optimal that is.

In the next three levels we'll be getting two feats. The best options as I see 'em are EA/+2DEX, EA/Sharpshooter, or Sharpshooter/EA (as there's no reason to take +2DEX before EA).

Pick EA/+2 DEX to maximize your Stealth checks and AC (19 in studded leather and a shield) as well as get the most consistent chance to hit in a vacuum (+6 counting your infusion and 3 d20s).
Pick EA/Sharpshooter to maximize your burst damage potential.
Pick Sharpshooter/EA if your DM is a stickler for half- and three-quarters cover rules, or if you expect to need to hit things from more than 90 feet away, to the point where you don't feel you can delay Sharpshooter. The power attack is less useful before EA and Extra Attack (am I the only one that just noticed that's the same initialism?), but still might be called for situationally.
If you didn't go an Elf of some kind, pick up any half-feat that gives you a DEX increase and Sharpshooter, in whichever order makes sense to you based on the above.


I think EA/Sharpshooter is the play, as Sharpshooter becomes a lot better once you have both Elven Accuracy and Extra Attack.

At level 9, we are an Armorer 5/Scout 4. Our first attack that lands deals 4d6+5=19 damage, while our second attack that lands deals 1d6+5=8.5 damage. 27.5 total. That was less impressive than I'd hoped, but we are dramatically more accurate now, and we have Sharpshooter to play with, which could potentially make that a much more respectable 47.5. But now accuracy is a much greater factor; at what point do we not power-attack? I plugged in the numbers into Ludic's DPR calculator, and I'm getting that power attack becomes not worth it on an 18 AC or more. Our advantage DPR on a target of AC 10 is just shy of 30; on an AC 17 it's about 27; it's 23.44 on an AC of 20. We're still getting rocked by the top-tier DPR builds, but again, most of those are melee. At this point we're doing our thing from 300 feet away, can move 70-80 feet per round and still attack (105-120 if we Dash instead of attacking), can move another 20 feet with our reaction on top of that if someone does manage to close the gap, and we have pretty much the best possible Stealth check aside from needing one more ASI to cap DEX.

From this point on, unless you want Action Surge as a panic option or have a better idea for a dip, we're going full Rogue. We don't get a ton out of the next few Artificer levels, so there's no point in going further there.

At Armorer 5/Scout 5, and every other level after that, we gain another Sneak Attack die, capping out at 8d6 from Sneak Attack at max level. We cap our DEX at character level 13, giving us a +6 to attack and damage rolls counting the infusion. Other notable levels include Scout 9 (CL14), which gives us 10 more feet of walking speed (which we love), as well as Scout 10 and 12 which give you two more feats to play with (you have a lot of options, few of which will make a DPR difference).

Feedback always appreciated!

*Okay, on further reflection, I'll admit I don't actually know how much DPR an optimized Sun Soul would put out, but it can't be that much, right? Anyone wanna take a crack at that?

Looking for further feedback on this build, but more to the point:

How DO we fix the damage output on a Sun Soul? Doesn't get weapon dice increases except as it levels, doesn't qualify for SS/GWM, and we'd need a feat to pick up other on-hit effects like Hex or Hunter's Mark. Could weaponize the bonus action better, too, since it's not super busy (two more RSBs for a ki point can be kinda piddling). Spell Sniper helps our skirmishing but not our DPR outside of partial-cover situations, unless we pick something like Booming Blade I guess but that defeats the point. Elven Accuracy would matter more if we had a consistent way to get advantage, which I can't think of one. I'm not aware of any fighting styles or eldritch invocations we could grab with a feat that are relevant here, though I'm open to being proven wrong--and I don't see any particular other ways to boost ranged spell attack damage other than literally using something other than RSB which defeats the purpose. And I'm a bit reticent to solve the problem with multiclassing, because 1.) Searing Sunburst is actually pretty good when it comes up and 2.) Monks in general can be tough to multiclass with because of how their scaling works.

Correction, Hunter's Mark only works on weapon attacks, so that's out too. Hex is on the table, though.

I guess Swarmkeeper 3 would add 1d6 to the first attack that hits, since it doesn't specify "melee" or "weapon" on its rider, just "attack," and you'd get Favored Foe for additional bonuses. AFAIK all other Ranger subclasses specify a weapon attack on their level 3 riders (Beast Master notwithstanding ofc as it works totally differently). Maybe Sun Soul 5/Swarmkeeper 4/Sun Soul X? Keeps our ASIs almost on track, we lose the infamously terrible Sun Soul capstone and some ki/MA progression but you could max Dex by 9 and grab Hex via Fey-touched at 12 and have spell slots to use it more often with. That's probably... almost acceptable? Honestly I might go VHuman and get Fey-touched earlier just for Hex on important targets.

This is still sounding a little lackluster compared to every other ranged attacker in the game, but I guess it's something?

[Chad.e.clark]

Looking for further feedback on this build, but more to the point:

How DO we fix the damage output on a Sun Soul? Doesn't get weapon dice increases except as it levels, doesn't qualify for SS/GWM, and we'd need a feat to pick up other on-hit effects like Hex or Hunter's Mark. Could weaponize the bonus action better, too, since it's not super busy (two more RSBs for a ki point can be kinda piddling). Spell Sniper helps our skirmishing but not our DPR outside of partial-cover situations, unless we pick something like Booming Blade I guess but that defeats the point. Elven Accuracy would matter more if we had a consistent way to get advantage, which I can't think of one. I'm not aware of any fighting styles or eldritch invocations we could grab with a feat that are relevant here, though I'm open to being proven wrong--and I don't see any particular other ways to boost ranged spell attack damage other than literally using something other than RSB which defeats the purpose. And I'm a bit reticent to solve the problem with multiclassing, because 1.) Searing Sunburst is actually pretty good when it comes up and 2.) Monks in general can be tough to multiclass with because of how their scaling works.

Correction, Hunter's Mark only works on weapon attacks, so that's out too. Hex is on the table, though.

I guess Swarmkeeper 3 would add 1d6 to the first attack that hits, since it doesn't specify "melee" or "weapon" on its rider, just "attack," and you'd get Favored Foe for additional bonuses. AFAIK all other Ranger subclasses specify a weapon attack on their level 3 riders (Beast Master notwithstanding ofc as it works totally differently). Maybe Sun Soul 5/Swarmkeeper 4/Sun Soul X? Keeps our ASIs almost on track, we lose the infamously terrible Sun Soul capstone and some ki/MA progression but you could max Dex by 9 and grab Hex via Fey-touched at 12 and have spell slots to use it more often with. That's probably... almost acceptable? Honestly I might go VHuman and get Fey-touched earlier just for Hex on important targets.

This is still sounding a little lackluster compared to every other ranged attacker in the game, but I guess it's something?

Would you dip Sun Soul Monk on a Swarmkeeper Ranger 3 to boost damage? Because that seems to be what you are doing, just in reverse, and I am honestly not sure the Sun Soul Monk portion of the equation is bringing too much to the table as far as damage goes vs opportunity cost elsewhere. I dunno, just seems like more trouble than its worth.

[x3n0n]

How DO we fix the damage output on a Sun Soul?

Honestly I might go VHuman and get Fey-touched earlier just for Hex on important targets.

I might go vhuman for Fey Touched (Hex) to Monk 5 or 6, then dip War Cleric for 1 or 2 levels. That gives you several significant features for one dip:
* The spell Divine Favor (and Bless, and Guidance, and all of the normal good Cleric stuff)
* War Priest for another way to get you a ranged bonus action attack a few times a day (via Dedicated Weapon on a shortbow or light crossbow)
* Spell slots for Hex
* If 2 levels, the Channel Divinity for +10 to an attack

I think Dedicated Weapon is the real problem with Sun Soul now. If we have a dedicated sling or shortbow, what is our subclass getting us? We get radiant damage and "flurry of beams" from Sun Soul....and that's about it? (At 6 and 11 we get AoE damage, which is a real weakness of other Monks, but we could even be an Elemonk and have Burning Hands or Thunderwave online at 3rd level, Shatter at 6th, and Fireball at 11th.) Radiant damage is a real bonus in some places, but I don't think it's worth the whole subclass.

Edit: gah, Divine Favor is also limited to weapon attacks.

[javianhalt]

The Phantom Menace

This build is SO COOL. I'm really sad it takes so long to come "online" so it is almost impossible to play in normal progression campaigns.
If I ever play some higher level campaign I will definitely try this

[Stattick]

Queen of Blades, Redux
(open to suggestions, analysis, and commentary)

A melee caster, with a fetish for blades.

A half-breed embarrassment to your house, you were treated worse than a slave. Scapegoated by one of your siblings, the matriarch had you beaten and staked out as a meal for the driders. For it's own inscrutable reasons, a drider nursed you back to health. It was your companion for some time before you departed for the surface...

https://i.pinimg.com/564x/58/f2/55/58f255cf1e0653a02fd4fc2a01bc1192.jpg

Half-Elf Drow, Drow Magic
Paladin 2, Hexblade, Tome 4, Draconic Sorcerer 14
Progression: All Paladin levels first, then all Hexblade levels, finishing with Draconic Sorcerer for the rest of your levels. This keeps you closest to having standard ASI progression, but if you prefer, you could grab a level or two of Hex, then bounce over to Sorc until you hit 4, then go back for the remaining Hex levels. That'll get you metamagic faster, but delay Elven Accuracy.

Starting Stats (Point Buy): Str 14+1, Dex 11+1, Con 14, Int 8, Wis 9, Chr 15+2
Final Stats Str 15, Dex 12, Con 15, Int 8, Wis 9, Chr 20
You need Str and Chr 13 to multiclass out out of Paladin. Warlock and Sorcerer both need Chr 13. If you're already pouring 13 points into Str, might as well go the two extra points to get to 15, so you can use heavy armor without penalty - this will net you the best AC. But if you prefer medium armor, only go 13 Str, put more into Dex, and starting off, use a finesse weapon; rapier is the gold standard. You want to end up with at least an 18 in Chr. Other than that, you can customize the attributes if you wish. Perhaps dump Dex to bump Con up higher, or put points into Wis for Perception. It's up to you, but I like the moderately sneaky build, as it seems more spiderlike to be able to ambush enemies, and the character IS half drow.
Background: Golgari Agent. Nature/Survival.
Nature does us few favors, ask you GM if you can customize the background to dump Nature in favor of Perception. Golgari also gives us Survival, Poisoner's Kit, a language that can be swapped for Undercommon, and a list of spells that get added to your spell lists. You particularly want Entangle, and most of the rest would be available on one of your other spell lists. For your background feature, ask your GM if they'll allow you to alter it a little to say that your character knows the upper regions of the underdark in the area. For justification, you can call the spells "House Spells" from a Drow noble house.

If Ravnica backgrounds aren't allowed in your game, perhaps Earthspur Miner.

Paladin skills, you'll probably get the most out of Athletics & Intimidation.

ASIs: Elven Accuracy (Chr), Fighting Initiate: Blind Fighting, Resilient: Con, +2 Chr
ASI Options: Why these ASI choices?

Elven Accuracy dramatically improves your accuracy when hitting in melee or with spells that hit with a ranged spell attack. Further, it bumps up your Chr to an even level, which is both your melee and spell attacking attribute. Since we're focused on melee attacks, this feat is too valuable to pass up or delay.

Fighting Initiate gives you the ability to mitigate magical darkness, blindness, and heavily obscured areas (such as fog or web). It's only a 10' range, but since most of the damage you'll do is in melee, this is alright, though not ideal. Taking this as a feat instead of the Devil's Sight invocation, leaves you free to take the Eldritch Mind and Book of Ancient Secrets invocations, since you only get two invocations. Eldritch Mind gives you advantage on concentration saves, like the Warcaster feat, while Book of Ancient Secrets gives you access to all rituals, which adds a lot of utility to the build. It's true that Warcaster is superior to Eldritch Mind, but if you took the feat instead, you'd be delaying the crucial ability to have advantage on concentration saves until level ten at the earliest, instead of getting it at level four. Darkness and Web are both spells you'll be relying on frequently, falling back on your familiar when needed.

Resilient: Con bumps you up to an even level on Con, and lets you apply you proficiency bonus to Con Saves, which includes Concentration saves. It makes it far more likely that you'll be able to keep those duration spells up and running.

+2 Chr - a few more points of damage, a higher chance to hit, higher spell attack bonus, higher spell DC, what's not to love?

Options: Easiest option is to leave the build the same, except swap out the last ASI of +2 Chr for something else, for instance a +2 to Con, Lucky, Skill Expert (bump up Con, gain expertise in Stealth), or perhaps Slasher or Crusher - I designed with Sword and Board in mind, but the build, after level 2, works the same if your weapon is a rapier, longsword, or morningstar.

As to other options, the question is what are you willing to give up, and is the thing you want to pick up worth it? You could grab the Devil's Sight invocation, but you'll have to give up Advantage on Concentration Saves or ritual casting - none of your classes have ritual casting, and you don't qualify for the Ritual Caster feat. On the other hand, it'll open up an ASI since you probably won't want to Blind-Fighting anymore - take Skill Expert as above, or something else. Or you went Sword Pact, you grab the Devil's Sight & Improved Pact Weapon invocations, and then swap the Fighting Initiate for War Caster, at the cost of having a Familiar & ritual casting. There are a number of good alternatives; I picked what I thought would be the best in general, but you'll also want to consider your specifics: play style, party composition, and what's likely to be important in the campaign you're playing in.

Paladin

This is one of the hardiest classes at low levels. You have access to all weapons, armor, and shields.

1st: You're basically a fighter that can sense undead and fiends when you open your sense, and can do a little healing.

Lay on Hands - Your (worse, because it takes a full action to use) equivalent of the Fighter's Healing Surge. On the other hand, you can use this on allies. Probably best to use after combat, or during combat to remove debilitating diseases/poisons. You can play this for support, but that's not what your character is about. I'd treat these as 10 extra HP to give yourself between fights. Recharges on a Long Rest.

Don't forget about your Drow spells: Dancing Light cantrip to generate dim light, Faerie Fire (once per day, at 3rd level), and Darkness (once per day, at 5th level). Find out how your GM handles racial spells: some GMs allow racial spells to be cast with slots. If your GM is among them, this is ideal for you. If not, then you'll want to take Darkness as a Sorcerer spell down the road.

Attacks (updates whenever there's an improvement)
Basic Attack: 1d8 +2
Nova Attack: 1d8 +2

2nd: You can prep 4 Spells per day (this goes up when your Charisma mod improves). These can be changed on a long rest. You'll usually want to pick from these: Bless, Command, Cure Wounds, Entangle, Heroism, Protection from Evil and Good, Ray of Sickness, and Shield of Faith. You Entangle to pin down opponents, creating difficult terrain and granting you and your allies advantage to hit the entangled. Faerie Fire ALSO gives you and your allies advantage to hit the effected. Entangle is best used on dexterous opponents, while Faerie Fire is more effective on strong opponents. We're already fishing for crits here.

All of your spells are Charisma based, regardless of their source. Ease of use, plus you get to base your spell attack mod and DC on your best attribute.

Divine Smite: This can be used AFTER you've already hit your opponent. If you score a critical, you get twice the bang for your slot, so always add a smite on top of critical hits, when you have slots left. You can spend slots from other classes on Divine Smites.

Sword and Board: This gives you the best AC, and you'll need it since you don't have quite the HP of most meat shields. You're a melee front-liner, and the +2 AC from your shield will prevent a lot of hits. Treat armor like a Strength fighter, after all, you have the strength for it. Keep upgrading your armor until you're in you're in Plate. Plate plus shield puts you at 20 AC, and if you manage to snag armor or a shield with a bonus, you're even further ahead of the field. Like an Eldritch Knight, you can bump up your AC with Shield or Mirror Image.

Fighting Style: Dueling, to get that +2 on damage. Alternately, you can go Defense for even higher AC, but I think you get more bang for you buck with getting your damage output up.

Spellcasting Focus: Holy Symbol on your shield.

Attacks
Basic Attack: 1d8 +4
Nova Attack: 1d8 +4, +2d8 Smite

Warlock, Hexblade

3rd (Warlock 1): Hex Warrior: Now you can use Chr as your melee attack attribute instead of Str.

Hexblade Curse: Nova, once per short rest. Bonus action to activate, effects a chosen foe. Bonus damage equal to your Proficiency Modifier. Crit range is now 19-20. If you kill your cursed quarry, you gain HP equal to your Warlock level + Chr Mod.

You gain a single short rest/regen spell slot, two cantrips, and two spells known. Warlock slots can be used to cast any spell you know, and normal slots can cast Warlock spells.

Cantrips: Green Flame Blade (GFB - your goto attack for the rest of the game), Eldritch Blast (when you need range).
Spells: By the time you leave Hexblade, you want: Armor of Agathys, Hellish Rebuke, Hex, Shield, and Branding Smite (to mark invisible creatures for the rest of your party). It's often worth more to have a concentration spell up giving you advantage to hit than to use Hex. Once you have a familiar, you can use it generate advantage while still utilizing Hex. If you have a high priority 1st or 2nd level spell, you can postpone Shield until Sorc 1 since it's on both spell lists.

Spellcasting Focus: Sword (buy a Ruby of the War Mage, it's a common item, and lets you use your weapon as an arcane focus)

Attacks
Basic Attack: 1d8 +5; +3 rider
Nova Attack: 1d8 +5, +2 (hexblade's curse), +1d6 (hex), +2d8 (smite); +3 rider

4th (Warlock 2): You now have 2 short rest/regen spell slots.
Invocations:
Fiendish Vigor (at Warlock 3, switch to Book of Ancient Secrets: Find Familiar & Detect Magic should be your first two choices.)
Eldritch Mind: Advantage on concentration saves.

Attacks - as prior level


5th (Warlock 3): Your warlock slots bump up to 2nd level. More importantly, you get your pact boon. Grab Tome so you can pick up ritual casting (all ritual spells). This adds a ton of utility to your character, and lets you function better as the party's primary arcane caster if needed - you can cast Detect Magic, Identify, Tiny Hut, Find Familiar, Water Breathing, etc. If that's not to your liking, Blade will keep you from being disarmed (which doesn't happen often in most campaigns), or Chain to get a better than average familiar.

Attacks
Basic Attack: 2d8 +5; 1d8 +3 rider
Nova Attack: 2d8 +5, +3 curse, +1d6 (hex), +3d8 (smite); 1d8 +3 rider

6th (Warlock 4): You gain another spell and cantrip. The only reason you're still here, in Warlock, is to grab the ASI (Elven Accuracy).

Attacks - as prior level

Draconic Sorcerer

7th (Sorcerer 1): You get the equivalent of always on Mage Armor (AC 13 + dex mod + shield). When you're ambushed without your armor, grab your shield, and your AC is 15, which isn't awful. You can bump it up to AC 20 with Shield for a round, if needed, or to 17 with Shield of Faith for the fight if you have it prepared.

You also get one extra HP each level. It's the equivalent of having a d8 hit die instead of a d6.

Pick a color of dragon to be associated with your abilities. As a half-drow, Shadow Dragon (necrotic) would make the most sense, but that's not a RAW option. Poison damage is also very thematic for a spider elf, though you're probably going to run into more creatures resistant or immune to poison than to fire. Red is probably most optimized for most campaigns, but refluffing "Draconic" as "Arachnid", picking green/poison, and just maybe at 14th level, your GM will let you turn into a Drider at will instead of gaining Draconic Wings (lower body a spider, gain the drider abilities: Spider Climb and Web Walker - if your GM lets you do this, definitely take the Web spell - if you and your GM goes for the drider, maybe grab the Poison Spray cantrip at Sorcerer 1, and refluff it as a bite. If GM is still talking to you, ask if you can refluff GFB to do poison damage - it's stealthier, fits our "Arachnid" theme, you don't produce flames to foof the webs away, and the poison damage will stack with Elemental Affinity (poison), the way that GFB stacks with fire).

Spellcasting Focus: Sword

Attacks - as prior level


8th (Sorcerer 2): Font of Magic. Turn spell slots into Sorcery Points and Sorcery Points into spells.

Note that you get 2nd level slots at this level, but won't get 2nd level Sorcerer spells until next level.

Attacks - as prior level


9th (Sorcerer 3): Metamagic. You get two options at this level. You'll get one more option at 10th level Sorc.
Twinned: A must. Twin your Green Flame Blade to hit two different targets in front of you.
Quickened: A must. Cast a spell or take another action, and follow up with Green Flame Blade as a bonus action. Quicken Green Flame Blade, hit the guy in front of you as a bonus action, then Twin Green Flame Blade and hit the other two guys in front of you as your action. Smile.
Subtle: A good option, but situational, and typically better on a stealthy build. Good if your cleric drops Silence a lot. Great when casting Counterspell.
Empowered: A good option if you're doing a lot of AoE's, but that's not this build's specialty.
Transmuted: A good option to get around enemy immunities and resistances.

Attacks
Basic Attack: 2d8 +5; 1d8 +3 rider
Nova Attack: 2d8 +5, +4 curse, +1d6 (hex), +3d8 (smite); 1d8 +3 rider. Up to three times in a round *, if there are two opponents within reach.
* NOTE: GFB can be twinned, but you can't use the splash damage when you twin it. This is part of the reason Booming Blade is preferred in many optimizer's builds, since it can be twinned without loosing the rider. However, Booming Blade won't let us add the Sorcerer's Elemental Affinity damage, which comes online in three levels.


Armor: This is around the level you should be expecting to upgrade to plate armor. If you don't already have something to mitigate the Disadvantage to Stealth that Heavy Armor gives, start looking for it. Boots of Elvenkind are a great choice - they're only uncommon, and they don't need an attunement slot. Mithril armor works as well.

10th (Sorcerer 4): Your second ASI. Take Fighter Initiate: Blind-Fighting. In some ways, Blind-Fighting is superior for a melee fighter, since it allows you to fight normally if you're in a heavily obscured area, or if you've been blinded.

Attacks
Basic Attack: 2d8 +6; 1d8 +4 rider
Nova Attack: 2d8 +6, +4 curse, +1d6 (hex), +4d8 (smite); 1d8 +4 rider. Up to three times in a round


11th (Sorcerer 5): Magical Guidance: You can spend 1 sorcery point to reroll a failed ability check. This makes it slightly less likely that you'll blow a stealth or perception check, if you think it's worth spending the point.

This is around the level that you should start looking for that awesome, rare weapon to stack into your damage. If you're working at generating Advantage, you should be hitting pretty consistently, so you should go for a high damage weapon rather than a +2 weapon. A Flame Tongue is probably the best you can hope for, in terms of raw damage. But a more stealthy approach might be to grab a Serpent's Fang, which does +1d10 poison.

Attacks
Basic Attack: 3d8 +6, +1d10 weapon; 2d8 +4 rider
Nova Attack: 3d8 +6, +4 curse, +1d6 (hex), +1d10 weapon, +4d8 (smite); 2d8 +4 rider. Up to three times in a round


12th (Sorcerer 6): Elemental Affinity: You now get to add your Chr mod in damage to each spell you cast that matches your affinity's type. You can also spend a Sorcery Point at the same time to get resistance to that kind of damage. We're mostly doing Fire damage here (or poison), so, we'll be able to stack +4 on most of our attacks.

The last Metamagic option you'll get, plus another cantrip. Choose wisely.

Attacks
Basic Attack: 3d8 +6, +4 affinity, +1d10 weapon; 2d8 +4 rider
Nova Attack: 3d8 +6, +4 affinity, +4 curse, +1d6 (hex), +1d10 weapon, +5d8 (smite); 2d8 +4 rider. Up to three times in a round


13th (Sorcerer 7): 4th level spells

Attacks
Basic Attack: 3d8 +6, +4 affinity, +1d10 weapon; 2d8 +4 rider
Nova Attack: 3d8 +6, +4 affinity, +5 curse, +1d6 (hex), +1d10 weapon, +5d8 (smite); 2d8 +4 rider. Up to three times in a round


14th (Sorcerer 8): ASI. Resilient: Con

Attacks - as prior level


15th (Sorcerer 9): Animate Objects comes online. All those daggers you have strapped onto your body like a crazy person, (see pic above), you animate them and send them off to kill enemies. It takes an action to cast and requires concentration. On subsequent rounds, IT ONLY TAKES A BONUS ACTION to direct your animated daggers. As tiny objects, your daggers get a +8 to hit. That means they have a 50% to hit AC 19. They'll do a heavily weighted average of 32.5 points of damage to an AC 19 opponent, each turn, assuming that half hit. If they all hit, they'll do an average of 65 points of damage, not accounting for critical hits or upcasting. Each upcast gets you an additional 2 tiny objects, which each do an average of 6.5 damage. In other words, adding the equivalent of a d12, if they both hit. You don't have to send all the daggers after the same foe. Animate 12, and send them out in pairs to kill those pixies that are bothering you, or whatever.

There are times you don't want to use Animate Objects: if you're in an environment where everything takes damage each round, for instance. Animated Tiny Objects only have 20 hp, so they're also vulnerable to being taken out with an AoE. On the other hand, they're pretty good at breaking concentration from most creatures, especially if the objects have advantage to hit... so long as the caster's Save isn't really high. Tiny objects aren't likely to ever do more than 21 points of damage, so the caster only needs to get a 10 to maintain concentration. If they have a +5, that means that they need to roll at least a 5 on their d20. That's only a 20% chance for failure. But when you hit with six different animated objects, they need to roll at least a 5, and do that six times in a row. If they have at least a +9 on their checks, then it's impossible for them to fail, but bonuses that high aren't common.

Use a spreadsheet, so you only have to hit F9 (or some variation on that, depending on the program) to make a new attack with the dagger swarm. When you're rolling for 14 daggers with advantage ever round, you don't want to make the table wait all night. When you've upcast and have advantage, the damage can top 100 HP... as a bonus attack.

It's probably worth investing in silvered and/or adamantine daggers or spikes.

Attacks
Basic Attack: 3d8 +6, +4 affinity, +1d10 weapon; 2d8 +4 rider
Nova Attack: 3d8 +6, +4 affinity, +5 curse, +1d6 (hex), +1d10 weapon, +5d8 (smite); 2d8 +4 rider. Up to twice, Plus Animated Objects: up to 10 tiny objects: 10d4 +40


16th (Sorcerer 10): 6th level slots. Animated Objects can now animate 12 tiny objects.

Attacks - as prior level


17th (Sorcerer 11): 6th level spells.

Attacks
Basic Attack: 4d8 +6, +4 affinity, +1d10 weapon; 3d8 +4 rider
Nova Attack: 4d8 +6, +4 affinity, +6 curse, +1d6 (hex), +1d10 weapon, +5d8 (smite); 3d8 +4 rider. Up to twice, Plus Animated Objects: up to 12 tiny objects: 12d4 +48


18th (Sorcerer 12): 7th level slots.

Attacks
Basic Attack: 4d8 +7, +5 affinity, +1d10 weapon; 3d8 +4 rider
Nova Attack: 4d8 +7, +5 affinity, +6 curse, +1d6 (hex), +1d10 weapon, +5d8 (smite); 3d8 +4 rider. Up to twice, Plus Animated Objects: up to 14 tiny objects: 14d4 +56


19th (Sorcerer 13): 7th level spells.

Attacks - as prior level


20th (Sorcerer 14): 8th level slot.

Draconic Wings (or Drider legs, if you're weird, and the GM said, "Ok")

Attacks
Basic Attack: 4d8 +7, +5 affinity, +1d10 weapon; 3d8 +4 rider
Nova Attack: 4d8 +7, +5 affinity, +6 curse, +1d6 (hex), +1d10 weapon, +5d8 (smite); 3d8 +4 rider. Up to twice, Plus Animated Objects: up to 16 tiny objects: 16d4 +64


Cantrips:
Racial: Dancing Lights
Warlock: Green Flame Blade, Eldritch Blast, + Sword Burst
Tome: Sapping Sting, Shape Water, Thorn Whip
Sorcerer: Poison Spray, Prestidigitation, Minor Illusion, Control Flames, + Mending, + Mold Earth

Obviously, you get a giant pile of cantrips, some of which can be of any class. The ones most important to keep are: Green Flame Blade, Sword Burst, Sapping Sting, Mending. Feel free to swap a few of the others if you want Guidance, Spare the Dying, Light, or whatever.

Spells:
Racial: Faerie Fire, Darkness
Paladin: Variable + Entangle, Ray of Sickness
Warlock: Armor of Agathys, Hellish Rebuke, Shield

Sorcerer Spells (gained at each level)
1 Grease, Featherfall
2 Catapult or Chromatic Orb
3 Web
4 Flaming Sphere (or if your GM will allow it, a Poison Gas spell that more or less works like Flaming Sphere)
5 Misty Step
6 Counterspell (or Darkness if your GM won't let you cast Racial spells with slots)
7 Mirror Image (you can take Fireball, then swap it out at a later level increase)
8 Polymorph
9 Animate Objects
10 Synaptic Static
11 Disintegrate
12 N/A
13 Reverse Gravity
14 N/A


EDIT: According to LudicSavant's DPR calculator, this build, at level 20 against an AC of 19, when Nova attacking with advantage, should be 185 DPR, unless the 16 animated daggers are attacking with advantage, and then the DPR jumps to 207. (DPR about 7 points less on both, against AC 20.)... Those calculations do assume a 5d8 Divine Strike when you hit, not just when you crit. You'll burn through slots fast that way, but sometimes you need that thing in your face dead right now, and can't wait for a crit.

[H3R3T1CZA]

I would like to ask advice on a build...sorry new to the forums.

My friends and I, officially started our Journey into Eberron, and I rolled up a Kalashtar Fighter, House Agent (Orien) Background.
So I thought Fighter Psi Warrior 15 / Rogue Soul Knife 5.

Now I am asking for build advice here, yes I haven't added magic items etc, but I love the Psi Warrior / Soulknife concept Multiclass.

What Items or other paths to take. The best combinations and sequences for combat and exploration.

I am sorry if this question has been posted before, but I can't seem to find a decent build guide. The Psi Warrior subclass is a plot device for another character later - as Kalashtar dream to become Psi Warriors, and I specifically asked the DM to give my character a quest that might fail and then make me go Rogue until I find my enlightenment again and with developing Psychic abilities I will then learn to hone them in the Kalashtar Monastery that I will eventually come to train and control as a base of power to take on the Inspired - we also all get a free feat at the start of the game, so I took Telekinetic (Intelligence) for Mage Hand and the Force Push ability.

All advice would be welcome and to all a glorious day.

[Evaar]

Path of the Beast Barbarian has some problems as written. You have to choose with each Rage whether you're going to use the Bite, the Claw, or the Tail.

The Bite is pretty lackluster, doing mediocre damage and only offering some very limited healing in very limited circumstances; you'd probably be better off never using it.

The Claw also has some issues, because they didn't categorize it as a Light weapon. That means that to best take advantage of them mechanically, you need to either have the Dual Wielder feat, or use a Shield, or make one of your attacks with a Greatsword and the other two attacks with your Claw. That's silly. Yes you can ignore that and just make all attacks with a Claw and pretend you're clawing with both of your hands, but if you could use a Shield without any mechanical penalty why wouldn't you? If you could make a 2d6 weapon attack instead of a 1d6 weapon attack, why wouldn't you? So assuming your DM won't houserule it and you aren't going with Dual Wielder, it's not a great pick.

The Tail, on the other hand, has some potential. First, it doesn't actually replace your normal attacks. Instead, you get the option to attack at reach for a 1d8, but primarily what you're getting is access to a reaction to increase your AC by 1d8 against one attack per round. So you're still doing normal Barbarian stuff with your Greatsword or whatever, but now you have a budget Shield (the spell) that doesn't cost a spell slot. On top of that, if you want to use both your hands for grappling then the Tail gives you a weapon you can keep using with your hands full. However... this is a subclass based around lycanthropes. 5e so far as werebats, werebears, wereboars, werejaguars, wererats, wereravens, weretigers, and werewolves. So... nothing that really has a powerful, spiked tail. We can invent being a werealligator or werestegosaurus whatever, I guess, but that's probably not why we came here and it doesn't make a ton of thematic sense.

So let's change the flavor.

For our race, using the Tasha's flexible stat boosts, we're picking Tiefling. Our starting stats will be Strength 16, Dex 14, Con 15, then pick whatever you'd like for mental stats. We are no longer channeling a beast, we're channeling a Pit Fiend. Devilman style, our Rage causes all of our fiendish attributes to increase in intensity - thick scales, a whip-like spiked tail, and powerful build. Every ability we get lines up with this theme.

Infectious Fury? The sheer power of our infernal will causes psychic damage and forces our target to betray its allies.

Call the Hunt? Pit Fiends are the generals of the Hells. You inspire your allies to fight with infernal zeal.

At level 4 we take the Infernal Constitution feat. This expands our natural resistance to fire, adding poison and cold. It also rounds out our Constitution at 16. When raging, we now have 6 damage resistances. Outside of rage, we still have 3.

If your DM will allow it, take the Winged Tiefling option. Have fun grappling enemies and dropping them midair while lashing them with your tail. If your DM won't allow it, see if you can take the Zariel spell package - you can't use these while raging, but they're something you can add when you don't think a fight is worth a use of Rage.

Otherwise it's nothing too special, just do Barbarian stuff. I mostly wanted to point out how this works with flavor, but also the synergy between Tieflings (with Infernal Constitution) and Barbarians. Previously it wasn't worth the sacrifice in stats, but with Tasha's now I think they make quite a strong choice.

[Man_Over_Game]

The Eternal Sentinel

Mechanics: Using taunts, area control, and evasion, you can masterfully reposition anywhere your team needs you while you keep you and your friends safe. Taunt with your Echo, then protect it with your Ancestral Guardian powers.
Thematics: In a cruel twist of fate, the Eternal Sentinel risked using a forbidden artifact to gather pieces of himself across his timeline to save his people, only to reawaken years after their demise. Now he and his selves protect any who need it, their minds lost somewhere between this moment and the next.

Class: Fighter 3/Barbarian X
Subclass: Echo Knight/Ancestral Guardian
Race: Human Variant


Ability Scores:
STR: 16 (15+1)
CON: 15
DEX: 14 (13+1)
INT: 12
WIS: 8
CHA: 8

Selections:
Human Variant: Polearm Master
Fighting Style: Battlemaster Maneuver (TCoE) -> Tactical Assessment (TCoE) (Other options include: Goading Strike, Pushing Strike, Trip Attack, Lunging Attack)
Skills: History, Athletics
When you make an Intelligence (Investigation), an Intelligence (History), or a Wisdom (Insight) check, you can expend one superiority die and add the superiority die to the ability check.

Notes:
The combat benefits are pretty crazy. Use your Action to attack with the Echo, get a Bonus Action Attack from your position (so you can delay Extra Attack without any issues). You can flee after taunting a target to force them to chase you through your team and your Echo. Attacks against your Echo benefit from your Ancestral Guardian feature, giving it great longevity that other Echo Knights won't benefit from.

Either ASIs or standard PAM-supporting feats are acceptable, but I'm rather fond of adding more Battlemaster Maneuvers. Due to the fact that Battlemaster Maneuvers get stronger the more you have (as you get more choices any time something gives you more dice, so that 1st die you got can now be used for more things), and each one adds more utility to your strategies, there's a lot of interesting possibilities you can gain by essentially becoming a Battlemaster along with the other subclasses.

Yes, I went with Tactical Assessment. I wanted this character to be multi-faceted, not just a meatstick, so I put a few resources into History to make him interesting. As a tank that avoids being attacked, it's not like you need moar damage or moar defenses to do your job, since the utility effects, Action Surge, extra Echo Knight attacks, PAM and Reckless Attack do it for you, so you can focus on investing in things that make you more interesting. Who cares if you don't get Extra Attack until level 8, when you're already attacking an average of 3x per round with Advantage and only need to hit once for full value?

While you don't get to taunt until level 6, you do happen to have a lot of things going for you, like:

Reach on the Echo means you can keep it alive by running it in-and-out of combat and standing between it and your enemy for PAM attacks.
Rage + PAM + Action Surge + Echo Attacks + Ranged Attacks. The flat damage bonus of Rage gets a lot of mileage here.
Reckless Attack also gets a lot of value, since you can burst out a total of 4 attacks in one turn for a single penalty of Advantage to be hit. Once you've burned through your extra attacks, you can choose to stop using Reckless Attack for additional defense and just rely on PAM + Rage for damage (which is still comparable to a level 5 Barbarian).So it's not like levels 4-5 are a slog, you will rapidly gain power until it spikes at levels 6 and 8.

[Droppeddead]

The Hunter in the Dark

Here's a little build that I've been toying with for a while. It has a bit of a Witcher/Big Game hunter/Bounty Hunter vibe to it but it can also work as your classic "educated sniper" stereotype. Heck, it could even work as amore violent Batman character if you get the right gear.

What I like about ths build is that it comes online quite early. Depending on what aspects you want to focus on it starts doing what it does as early as level 4 or 5 but it is fully operational at level 7.

Mechanics: This is an excellent Ambush/Quickdraw build that also works really well as a Sniper and a skill monkey, focusing on the weird and unusual. At high enough level you will have advantage on initiative rolls and bonus form both edex and wisdom.
Thematics: Leaving a safe life in the academical world behind, this brave adventurer set out in the world to hunt the most dangerous foes around, be they humanoid or monster.

Class: Rogue 3/Ranger 4 (Going all the way to Rogue 13/Ranger 7
Subclass: Scout/Gloom Stalker
Race: Human Variant
Background: Sage for History and Arcana and two additional languages.


Ability Scores:
STR: 10
DEX: 15+1
CON: 14 (13+1)
INT: 10
WIS:14
CHA:10
(Note: You can easily dump Charisma if you want to, put those points into Int.)

Selections:
Human Variant: Crossbow Expert
Fighting Style: Archery (from Ranger 2)
Skills: Starting out as a human Rogue we get Perception from being a variant human, plus Stealth, Acrobatics, Investigation and Insight. Expertise in Stealth and Perception. We want to see people, people will not see us.

Notes:
This character starts out as a Rogue. Ask your DM nicely to allow you to have a Hand Crossbow or pick one up as soon as possible. At second level you switch over to Ranger for Athletics, Favored Enemy and Deft Explorer: Canny. This gives us three additional languages (4 if you pick two humanoid races for your favored enemies) nd Expertise in Investigation. You will find what you are looking for.

Back to Rogue for two more levels giving us Cunning Action and our Subclass which wll of course be the Scout. That gives us even more skills, Nature and Survival and what's more, we get Expertise in those two! So already we have a VERY sneaky explorer who can easily find their way through bothe the underbellies of large cities as well as find their way in most outdoors types of situations. We can attack twice on each turn and we know a lot about weird stuff like mystical beasts (Arcana, history and Nature).

We're not done yet. To really get this going we need three more levels of Rangers. Ranger 2 gives us Archery fighting style for better aim, Hunter's Mark for some extra damage and tracking and goodberries for snacking while waiting for our prey. Ranger 3 is a big one. The Gloom Stalker subclass give our puny human eyes Darkvision, we can Disguise self for shadowing bounties in the streets and most importantly, we get Dread Ambusher which pairs well with our wisdom score. On a perfect setup this would give us a hand corssbow sneak attack with hunter's mark for a total of 4D6+1D8+3 points of damage. Not bad at all. The real kicker comes at character level 7, when we pick Ranger 4 (Or Rogue 4, doesn't matter, the only difference is we roll a D10 instead of a D8 for hit points) which allows us to take the Sharpshooter feat. Now we can stay 400 feat away, aim and still roll with advantage +3, ignoring all but total cover. We have enough skills to know a lot about what we hunt, we can communicate in about 7 or 8 different languages (Thieves' cant not included) and we can track things down, find hidden stuff and most importantly, not be seen ourselves. Fun for everyone involved. :)

Where do we go from here?
Personally I would probably go for Rogue at least up until level 6 or 7 for more sneak attack damage, more Expertise (probably in Athletics and Insight or possibly Arcana) and Evasion, depending on your playing style. If you like to stay in the back sniping the enemy I would go for Ranger 5 to get Extra attack and pass without a trace instead. If you like to be up close (which you really don't need to considering you have a range of 120 with your hand crossbow) then perhaps uncanny dodge and evasion are more important. Either way, getting to Rogue 11 with Reliable Talent (and Expertise in 7 skills) makes you deadly even of the battlefield. If you're only playing to level 10, however, I would cap Ranger at 3. If playing to level 15, I'd say go Ranger 5/Rogue 11. Anything above that, Ranger7/Rogue 13. Level up in the order you feel is the most important. If you get the alert feat you will have roll for initiative with advantage and at last +10. So you got to ask yourself one question, punk. Just how quick on the draw do you think you are? :smallcool: