Other interesting pages in a Wizards spellbook.

[aglondier]

One page per spell level, blah blah blah...where is the interesting stuff, magic item crafting formulas, treatises on magical beasts, rituals, etc.

What have you come up with/found?

[Vaern]

Magic item creation is granted by feats age wouldn't be in a spellbook, though more items like golem manuals may exist in a given world, acting as consumables to create a certain type of magic item without the relevant item creation feat.
Treatises on magical beasts and such may be found in the wizard's library but, again, not necessarily in a spellbook. Such a book may act as a "masterwork tool," granting a bonus to relevant knowledge checks.

Note that most PC wizards adventure with a spellbook, while NPC wizards are likely cloistered in a tower with an entire library at their disposal.

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Vaern
Note that most PC wizards adventure with a spellbook, while NPC wizards are likely cloistered in a tower with an entire library at their disposal.

I’ve always assumed there are plenty of NPC wizards who are adventuring out in the world. This explains why wizard spellbooks are sometimes found in monster treasure.

[Feldar]

Magic item creation is granted by feats age wouldn't be in a spellbook, though more items like golem manuals may exist in a given world, acting as consumables to create a certain type of magic item without the relevant item creation feat.
Treatises on magical beasts and such may be found in the wizard's library but, again, not necessarily in a spellbook. Such a book may act as a "masterwork tool," granting a bonus to relevant knowledge checks.

Note that most PC wizards adventure with a spellbook, while NPC wizards are likely cloistered in a tower with an entire library at their disposal.

I think this is a good point, and can be accounted for by the collection of books that NPC wizards seem to have. There are probably very common formulae for common items like stat boosters, resistance items, and armor and weapon enhancements. At the same time I dislike that a 3rd level wizard who took Craft Wondrous Item automatically knows how to put together a stone of good luck.

I am toying with the idea the next time I run a 1-18 campaign of limiting recipes available for item creation feats and including recipes as treasure. With this I would add based on item complexity a number of components, some easy to get and some hard to get, and keep a list of what's required. But oh the record keeping involved...



I’ve always assumed there are plenty of NPC wizards who are adventuring out in the world. This explains why wizard spellbooks are sometimes found in monster treasure.

I always have an issue with spellbooks as treasure, since it's inevitable that the wizard will want to sell the spellbook after scribing the spell into their own spellbook because I try to keep the campaign balanced in terms of wealth, magical power, and access to spells (for classes that have to learn their spells) and the players of course are constantly trying to get an edge over the world (this is as it should be, of course -- the judge's role is to make sure that the characters don't utterly dominate their world and at the same time are not utterly dominated by it, at least for most of the campaign).

[noob]

I think this is a good point, and can be accounted for by the collection of books that NPC wizards seem to have. There are probably very common formulae for common items like stat boosters, resistance items, and armor and weapon enhancements. At the same time I dislike that a 3rd level wizard who took Craft Wondrous Item automatically knows how to put together a stone of good luck.

I am toying with the idea the next time I run a 1-18 campaign of limiting recipes available for item creation feats and including recipes as treasure. With this I would add based on item complexity a number of components, some easy to get and some hard to get, and keep a list of what's required. But oh the record keeping involved...




I always have an issue with spellbooks as treasure, since it's inevitable that the wizard will want to sell the spellbook after scribing the spell into their own spellbook because I try to keep the campaign balanced in terms of wealth, magical power, and access to spells (for classes that have to learn their spells) and the players of course are constantly trying to get an edge over the world (this is as it should be, of course -- the judge's role is to make sure that the characters don't utterly dominate their world and at the same time are not utterly dominated by it, at least for most of the campaign).
It is simple to evaluate the value of a spellbook if it contain spells you would have given due to plot or that are just not going to be used.
Ex: the adventurers fight the ice mage and get a spellbook with that frost sphere that is useful for freezing water and water breathing.
The adventurers would have needed to get water breathing anyway for going under water and freezing water is situational at best when done with a fifth level spell slot.
Since one spell is basically one that you would have handed out anyway and that the other is very situational then the actual value they get from those spells is the one of not buying them and if they copy it then they do not get much more than what they would have obtained from copying and selling any other spell.

[Zanos]

One thing I've found fun is the DM putting notes on a new custom spell in a captured spellbook, and allowing a player to conduct research based on those notes in order to complete and learn the spell, maybe even naming it after their wizard.


I always have an issue with spellbooks as treasure, since it's inevitable that the wizard will want to sell the spellbook after scribing the spell into their own spellbook because I try to keep the campaign balanced in terms of wealth, magical power, and access to spells (for classes that have to learn their spells) and the players of course are constantly trying to get an edge over the world (this is as it should be, of course -- the judge's role is to make sure that the characters don't utterly dominate their world and at the same time are not utterly dominated by it, at least for most of the campaign).
It would cost more for the character to add the spells to their spellbook than they would get for selling it. A spellbook only sells for 50gp per spell level of stored spells, and it costs 100gp per spell level to add spells to their spellbook. In this case you're just giving them a discount on getting the spells; same as you would be for providing the fighter with loot he can use instead of selling to buy something else.

The most efficient thing to do is for the wizard to decipher the spellbook with a spellcraft check, which allows them to use it as their own. Might have to haul around several spellbooks then, but that's what haversacks are for.

[aglondier]

Research and/or notes on a new spell is a good addition.

What about details covering a new/rare feat or prestige class? Something like the 3.5 Ceremonial feats?

[Kelb_Panthera]

The spellbook that an adventuring wizard carries with him: nothing but spell formulae for preparing spells in the field.

One of the books in the library back home: a couple of spells with their forumulae as well as notes about how and when to best apply them, the magical principles by which they work, and references to related or synergistic spells as well as notes on likely targets or references to bestiaries elsewhere in the library. Maybe a dozen low-level spells per book to only half as many mid-to-high level spells.

Also, technically a spellbook: architectural flourishes that can be used to prepare spells used only rarely and typically in the lab like fabricate for example. See complete arcane for details on that. Moreso of the architecture and hangings of geometrically stored spells if my wizard/ wu-jen is also a geometer. Like an art-gallery of arcane might.

[Maat Mons]

After a certain point, Wizards are highly incentivized to use Blessed Books to record their spells. It works out cheaper than buying expensive inks, in the long run. And once you're using a Blessed Book, you're highly de-incentivized from writing anything other than spells in it. Each page of the Blessed Book has high value. So why waste it on something that could just as easily be written down on inexpensive paper with inexpensive ink? And thus was created the divide between books full of spell and books full of other things.

[Particle_Man]

illusory script, explosive runes, and the various symbol spells.

Not as spells one could learn from those pages, but as spells cast on those pages to foil thieves.

[aglondier]

A page that is basically an infinite scroll. It functions like a normal spell completion scroll, except that it isn't used up and can be reused.
I normally do them as 1/day for all the utility spells that you can never be bothered to memorise, and bind them together into a kind of poor mans book of infinite spells...but there is really no reason you couldn't do an unlimited use version.

Having your 2 or 3 favourite spells available to cast at will from your spellbook would be rather handy...

Cost = caster level x spell level x 1800, with a 30% discount for being "spell completion", which means the spell has to be in your class spell list to be able to use it.

So, Magic Missile, (1 x 1 x 1800 x 0.7 = 1260), is 630gp if you make it yourself.

[Tiktakkat]

A page that is basically an infinite scroll. It functions like a normal spell completion scroll, except that it isn't used up and can be reused.

That would be a Minor Schema, from Eberron.
Price for a 1st level spell for that is 400 gp. (200 gp to craft.)
They are limited to 6th level, and have slightly different identification methods, but otherwise they are effectively eternal scrolls (cf. eternal wand), with the same caster level and ability score modifier limits.

[Silent Alarm]

Fun fact: 5 Spellshards from the Eberron Campaign Setting are more weight efficient, and more compartmentalized (in case Spellbook destruction ever comes into play) than a single spellbook. Furthermore, they can only be accessed specifically by knowing and casting Arcane Mark, essentially requiring a spell to access the spellbook which will definitely throw off anyone who isn't at least somewhat familiar with them.

[Kelb_Panthera]

...but there is really no reason you couldn't do an unlimited use version.

Except the obvious one: DM buy-in. Any custom item requires an affirmative yes, not a mere absence of veto.

Given the existence of lesser schema, I'd probably give this a hard "no." Even if I did allow a perma-scroll, I'd definitely say no to unlimited use per day at 5 times the cost of a 1/day scroll. The value of the effect is -way- greater than that.

Let's take a use-case: bestow curse.

(CL 5 X SL 3 X 1800) X 0.7 = 18,900 by the formula you've suggested.

(CL 5 X SL 3 X 750) X2 = 22,500 would be a wand with 100 charges, which the guidelines also suggest is appropriate.

(5*3*400)*5 = 30,000 for an unlimited lesser schema which is actually the closest to what we're discussing mechanically.

I could easily see a PC or a BBEG paying 30k for being able to curse their foes at will.


So, yeah, IMO a GM wouldn't just be within his right to say no to such an item, he'd be right to do so.

[Telok]

What I was fond of doing was occasionally including an old spell from a previous version. I thing they had a book with AD&D fireball, slow, and duo-dimension. Of course coming from an edition with one minute rounds of 10 segments a 3 segment spell took 3 full round to cast.

Naturally players see "3 round cast" and immedately stop thinking, just wanting to convert the books into money.

[noob]

What I was fond of doing was occasionally including an old spell from a previous version. I thing they had a book with AD&D fireball, slow, and duo-dimension. Of course coming from an edition with one minute rounds of 10 segments a 3 segment spell took 3 full round to cast.

Naturally players see "3 round cast" and immedately stop thinking, just wanting to convert the books into money.
Ad&d fireball is just crazy in terms of aoe when cast inside a building.
So a good use is sitting outside of the dungeon entrance for example and throwing the fireball as far as possible in the dungeon and seeing a bunch of monsters which took an hit from a fireball run outside terrified by the roaring wave of flame that is an ad&d fireball.
Ad&d slow is good if you can cast it with the silent spell metamagic while hidden or if you can cast it while you have a friend ready to cast teleport in the face of the opponents right when you end the spell because it is a no save spell with an huge effect(and that stacks with other slowing effects)