Homebrew Spell: Impale

[traskomancer]

Impale
1st-level conjuration
Casting time: 1 action
Range: 60 feet
Components: V, S
Duration: Instantaneous
You attempt to manifest a 10-foot length of bone, metal, or wood through a creature you can see within range. The target must make a Constitution saving throw or take 2d12 piercing damage, and the conjured object stays lodged in the target.
Spell lists: sorcerer, wizard, artificer



I gave it comparable damage to Catapult, which is a similar spell that also does normal physical damage. Does this seem balanced? I'm wondering if the range is good.

[AvvyR]

Seems kinda bad.

Sure, little resists magical piercing damage, 13 average damage is slightly less than other single target first level spells like Catapult and Chromatic Orb (13.5) which both have better range and either also do magical physical damage, or choose from so many damage types that one must be unresisted. It also has no scaling. Targeting CON save is generally significantly worse than attack roll or DEX save, as in its counterparts.

I just don't see what this spell can do that existing spells don't already do better.

[Avonar]

I think that having something lodged in your body needs to come with actual mechanical effects to it. A spell from a different system that I really liked had something similar. When the person was impaled, their abilities were hampered. Maybe reduced speed, disadvantage on attacks, things like that. However they could also choose to remove the object which restored their capabilities at the cost of a large burst of damage.

I'm not even going to try and figure out numbers for this, but I like that as a concept.

[traskomancer]

Good call about the scaling, AvvyR. I think adding 1d12 per level upcast would make it scale pretty well. I'm aware Con is a worse save to target than Dex and was thinking about upping the damage slightly because of that.

I'm really liking some of Avonar's suggestions. Maybe it does 1d12 initially but halves your speed until you pull the pole out as an action, at which point you take the other d12?

[Unoriginal]

You'd probably be better off asking in the Homebrew part of the forum.

[sophontteks]

Catapult moves in a line and each creature in that line must roll until it runs out of targets or hits something. Absent this, and other trairs, they aren't similiar spells. The only thing they share is damage.

You are manifesting a 10 foot spear inside someone? This doesn't match the damage. Being completely impaled is pretty lethal. I don't think this is going to make much sense in HP terms where you are impaling people on the reg for superficial damage.

[Pyrophilios]

Sounds like the perfect setup spell for heat metal

[traskomancer]

I did not realize there was a dedicated homebrew section, that's absolutely my bad. And sophontteks, literally all damage spells are pretty lethal. This spell doesn't necessarily conjure the object through anything vital.

[traskomancer]

Another thought: should this spell need concentration? My hunch is it doesn't need that debuff, and I really like the idea that it's a way to generate a ten-foot pole.

[sophontteks]

I did not realize there was a dedicated homebrew section, that's absolutely my bad. And sophontteks, literally all damage spells are pretty lethal. This spell doesn't necessarily conjure the object through anything vital.
All spells can be lethal, but the effects normally are not. This spell is literally impaling someone. That is definitively lethal. The damage it actually inflicts, however, will most often be superficial.

If I hurl a magic missile at he enemy, and it doesn't really hurt them. The effect would not be several magic missiles impaling them, it would be the magic missiles buffeting their armor, or leaving singe marks. A fireball may leave scorch marks. A sword may kink their armor.

You cast his spell on a dragon. You've inserted a 10 foot pole inside them to nearly zero effect. It doesn't make sense. Descriptions such as impaling are typically reserved for when the target has reached 0 hp.

[Gale]

Immediate thoughts:

- This feels like this should have a material component. Not for balance, just for thematic reasons. Maybe a small piece of bone, metal, or wood.

- Like others said, being impaled seems like a major effect that should do more than 2d12 damage. Thematically speaking, having a 10-ft long object conjured into your body seems like it would have devastating implications, especially if said object remains within them indefinitely. Keep in mind that a medium-sized creature occupies a 5-ft square, and this object is twice the length of that. I would expect a serious penalty to be imposed on whomever is effected by this spell. Moving around with such an object lodged inside you would be difficult, and likely incredibly painful. As described, I wouldn't expect this to be a 1st-Level spell. It feels like it would be more appropriate as a 2nd-level concentration spell with an additional effect.

- If I were a player trying to abuse this spell, I might try and exploit the fact that it conjures a massive 10-ft long object that sticks around indefinitely. A Warlock who obtained this spell through multiclassing, feats, etc. could conjure a massive amount of bone, metal, or wood during down time by simply targeting it at ants, or a similarly weak creature. These materials could then easily be sold for gold, used to build structures, or whatever else the player comes up with.

Honestly, there aren't many spells or abilities that allow players to create objects that persist indefinitely, as they will abuse it if they can. Even Creation, a 5th-level spell, can only create an object that last for a day at most. I would highly recommend having the object disappear when the spell ends.

- The conjured object probably shouldn't be 10-ft long. It just seems unnecessarily big for a low level spell, especially if you intend on having it persist beyond the initial casting of the spell. I would recommend reducing its size by half or more.

[traskomancer]

Good point that it maybe shouldn't last forever. I could have it stick around for an hour, maybe. I like the thought about a material component. I'll probably drop the length of the impaling object, although the reason it was ten feet is because I had this dumb idea about its secondary benefit being a free ten-foot pole after the target dies. I guess it does feel like it should be higher level/do more damage, but I'd like it to be a level 1, maybe level 2 spell for mechanics reasons. Not sure how to reconcile those things.

[sophontteks]

Good point that it maybe shouldn't last forever. I could have it stick around for an hour, maybe. I like the thought about a material component. I'll probably drop the length of the impaling object, although the reason it was ten feet is because I had this dumb idea about its secondary benefit being a free ten-foot pole after the target dies. I guess it does feel like it should be higher level/do more damage, but I'd like it to be a level 1, maybe level 2 spell for mechanics reasons. Not sure how to reconcile those things.

Alright, now that we know some ulterior motive....

What were you planning on doing with all of those 10 foot sticks?:smallbiggrin:

[neceros]

Impale
1st-level conjuration
Casting time: 1 action
Range: 60 feet
Components: V, S
Duration: Instantaneous
You attempt to manifest a 10-foot length of bone, metal, or wood through a creature you can see within range. The target must make a Constitution saving throw or take 2d12 piercing damage, and the conjured object stays lodged in the target.
Spell lists: sorcerer, wizard, artificer



I gave it comparable damage to Catapult, which is a similar spell that also does normal physical damage. Does this seem balanced? I'm wondering if the range is good.

A catapult and a spear do not compare.

[CapnWildefyr]

I don't like that it's conjuration, and conjuring something inside another creature. I don't think there are any other conjuration spells that do that (but I don't have every spell at hand either). Too much room for abuse. What if I conjure plutonium, or bismuth, or arsenic, or pure sodium, or... you get the idea (maybe I'm thinking too much basic chemistry but someone else would too).

I could see it as a higher-level version of catapult, conjuring a harpoon, automatically hits then save or suffer some effect because it's stuck in.

[Tanarii]

Impaling someone with a ten foot pole should be a 9th level spell that kills a target within 60ft provided they have 100 hit points or less.

[traskomancer]

Tanarii, should anybody with a spear or pike be able to Power Word Kill someone with it?

[Tanarii]

Tanarii, should anybody with a spear or pike be able to Power Word Kill someone with it?
If they can reduce them to 0 hps and kill them from massive damage, then yeah they could narrate it as impaling them.

[Greywander]

Here's some of my thoughts:

The spike should be produced from the ground, a wall, or other surface, and likely be made of the same material. Most of the time, this won't matter much, but it makes the spell less effective against flying enemies as long as they stay away from the ground and structures.

As such, this might fit the Transmutation school better.

The spikes should be thin and brittle, making them close to useless for alternative uses. Then there shouldn't be a problem with them lasting forever. Spikes might also be restricted to being just stone, wood, or bone, whatever is the most appropriate for the surface they're projecting from. That way you aren't creating a spike made of gemstone, for example. You could still have the spike come out of the gemstone, but it would be regular stone.

As has been mentioned, you could make the gimmick of this spell that it does damage going in, inflicts some kind of penalty until it is removed, requires an action to remove, and does damage again when coming out. 2d12 damage should be fine then, as it does the damage twice, and imposes a penalty. The spike can also be removed without causing damage with a successful Medicine check using the caster's spell save DC.