Bloodstorm Blade "thunderous throw" activation

[Raishoiken]

So say i'm a bloodstorm blade (operating under the assumption that thunderous throw allows AoO's with the extended range) who has readied a swift action to activate thunderous throw in response to an enemy crossing what would normally be the extended reach
ie: throw range 30ft, swift action is readied, enemy crosses from 25ft to 20ft

could i still make the throw?

[Elves]

Thunderous Throw lasts "for the rest of your turn" so it doesn't allow off-turn AoOs nor would it have any effect if triggered off-turn.

[Raishoiken]

Thunderous Throw lasts "for the rest of your turn" so it doesn't allow off-turn AoOs nor would it have any effect if triggered off-turn.


i figured :/

[Twurps]

You're readying the wrong action.

What you could do is spend your regular turn to ready an attack action to attack as soon as somebody moves within the 30' range. Then activate the swift action once your readied action triggers.

It takes your regular turn to set up, and thus it's much less powerful / more situational than an AoO, but at least it's something.

[Raishoiken]

You're readying the wrong action.

What you could do is spend your regular turn to ready an attack action to attack as soon as somebody moves within the 30' range. Then activate the swift action once your readied action triggers.

It takes your regular turn to set up, and thus it's much less powerful / more situational than an AoO, but at least it's something.
Are you allowed to swift action, during any action, as long as you havent swifted yet in the round?

[Twurps]

Are you allowed to swift action, during any action, as long as you havent swifted yet in the round?

Funny how I thought I gave a fully RAW answer, but it might actually be a bit more ambiguous.


Swift Action
A swift action consumes a very small amount of time, but represents a larger expenditure of effort and energy than a free action. You can perform only a single swift action per turn.

Immediate Action
An immediate action is very similar to a swift action, but can be performed at any time — even if it's not your turn.

Deducting from the immediate action text: you can only take a swift action if it's your turn. (I'm sure there's a better qoute out there somewhere, but I'm sure we can all agree on this anyway.)

So the question then is: Is it your turn?

Argument against:


Ready
The ready action lets you prepare to take an action later, after your turn is over but before your next one has begun.


Stand-alone, one might interpret this as: the action is taking place when it's not your turn. Reading on however:


Initiative Consequences of Readying
Your initiative result becomes the count on which you took the readied action.

This suggests you do actually take your turn, hence the new place in the initiative order. This is not necessarily in contrast with the first quote. As that wording is somewhat ambiguous and could easily just mean the action is taking place on a spot in the initiative order that isn't yet your turn (but becomes your spot in the order, and therefore your turn once the readied action triggers).
further (very circumstantial) evidence can be found in the fact that a 5-foot step is also allowed during your readied action.

Having re-read the whole thing I would say if the readied action triggers, it becomes 'your turn' and so you can use the swift action. in line with my initial answer. It doesn't really state outright whether it is your turn or not though, so YMMV, ask your DM, etc.

[Elves]

Don't think that reading works. "Your initiative result becomes the count on which you took the readied action" indicates this change takes place after that action.

Also, "If you come to your next [turn] and have not yet performed your readied action, you don’t get to take the readied action" -- so if readied action counts as part of your turn, you couldn't ever take a readied action.

[Twurps]

Don't think that reading works. "Your initiative result becomes the count on which you took the readied action" indicates this change takes place after that action.

Also, "If you come to your next [turn] and have not yet performed your readied action, you don’t get to take the readied action" -- so if readied action counts as part of your turn, you couldn't ever take a readied action.

Like I said: there's no clear statement either way. As I've noticed in other threads as well, we have very different ideas about how to parse rulings, and how much interpretation is needed whilst still calling something RAW (or vice versa: how much parsing a sentence can handle before it becomes total nonsense). So whilst I understand the argument, I just don't agree with it.
I'd be interested in other relevant pieces of rules text that I haven't read yet, but in absence of those, I'm going to agree to disagree.

[Gruftzwerg]

Swift Action: (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#swiftActions)

A swift action consumes a very small amount of time, but represents a larger expenditure of effort and energy than a free action. You can perform one swift action per turn without affecting your ability to perform other actions. In that regard, a swift action is like a free action. However, you can perform only a single swift action per turn, regardless of what other actions you take. You can take a swift action any time you would normally be allowed to take a free action. Swift actions usually involve spellcasting or the activation of magic items; many characters (especially those who don't cast spells) never have an opportunity to take a swift action.

Since we have rules that allows to ready free actions, we can also ready a swift action.


You can ready a standard action, a move action, or a free action.

[Darg]

Swift Action: (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#swiftActions)


Since we have rules that allows to ready free actions, we can also ready a swift action.

True.

However, the issue still stims from the fact that regardless your "turn" is over after you perform the action which auto disengages thunderous throw and the opponent continues their turn unaffected. So one can't threaten using the ability when it isn't their turn and to benefit from the threatened squares during ones turn requires hefty payment for a niche possibility.

[Gruftzwerg]

True.

However, the issue still stims from the fact that regardless your "turn" is over after you perform the action which auto disengages thunderous throw and the opponent continues their turn unaffected. So one can't threaten using the ability when it isn't their turn and to benefit from the threatened squares during ones turn requires hefty payment for a niche possibility.

Yeah, not very practicable. You could ready a swift action and a standard action for a single attack. Not much, but still an option.

[Twurps]

Yeah, not very practicable. You could ready a swift action and a standard action for a single attack. Not much, but still an option.

You could ready either action, but not both. regardless, I agree the practical uses are limited

[Elves]

Like I said: there's no clear statement either way. I'm going to agree to disagree.
Agree to disagree should be more than just ignoring the words. I do think a little bit of rigor in reading this stuff is not misplaced. And IMO, the forum has gotten better about that over time. In old threads, the rules discussions often seem more tenuous, and there's more of this trailing off into mutual disagreement thing as opposed to parsing the text and reaching an answer. There are more online 3e resources today which probably helps.

[Fouredged Sword]

You guys are using the wrong type of action for this.

You don't want to ready an action. You want to delay your turn. This is more limited in some ways, but more flexible in others.



Delay
By choosing to delay, you take no action and then act normally on whatever initiative count you decide to act. When you delay, you voluntarily reduce your own initiative result for the rest of the combat. When your new, lower initiative count comes up later in the same round, you can act normally. You can specify this new initiative result or just wait until some time later in the round and act then, thus fixing your new initiative count at that point.

You never get back the time you spend waiting to see what’s going to happen. You can’t, however, interrupt anyone else’s action (as you can with a readied action).

Initiative Consequences of Delaying
Your initiative result becomes the count on which you took the delayed action. If you come to your next action and have not yet performed an action, you don’t get to take a delayed action (though you can delay again).

If you take a delayed action in the next round, before your regular turn comes up, your initiative count rises to that new point in the order of battle, and you do not get your regular action that round.


So you can totally reach your turn and turn to the DM and say "You know what, I'm gonna delay my action". No need to specify what trigger you are delaying it for. At any time you can announce "OK, I'm taking my turn now" and you, right then and there, take your turn.

It's more flexible than readied actions because you don't need to specify a trigger nor limit your actions. You get your full turn of actions when you want it. The limit is that you can't split up your actions. You cannot take any action prior to announcing the delay.

[Darg]

A delayed turn can't interrupt another's turn. It comes before or after. Even if it were to interrupt another turn, your turn would still be over before the threatened squares meant anything.