Creation Bard Dancing Item Questions

[jojosskul]

So being inspired by another post regarding using Creation Bard with one level of genie lock for tier 2 glyph of warding cheese (looking over the Bard spell list I discovered there's not really much synergy there until at least tier 3 but still became interested in the subclass), I started looking deeper into the Creation Bard and had a couple of questions regarding the Dancing Item feature.

1. If you animate an object that is large (or medium if you're a small race) can you ride it? Seems like a nice way to squeeze some extra utility out of the "summon" since it has a fly speed. The object would need to be of an appropriate configuration to be a mount, but carry around a rolled up 10x10 carpet and I feel like you should be good.

2. Does the extra 10 foot to movement (add or subtract) at start of turn feature also apply to the dancing item? In that case it seems like it would effectively make the Dancing Item's speed 40. Which is also great if you can ride it.

Looking at the wording RAW I don't see why these uses wouldn't work, and if they do it seems like bringing back the Dancing Item with a 3rd level slot is a damn fine use of the slot since it's a concentration free summon, kind of fly spell, and longstrider plus a slow effect for your enemies which you still allows you to use your beefed up bardic inspiration when you give it a command. Thoughts?

[Dalinar]

1. Seems definitely feasible, lots of classes have similar builds where they use pets as mounts (e.g. small-race Battle Smith can do it).

2. I'm thinking yes, provided the Dancing Item counts as "any creature [that] starts its turn within 10 feet of [itself]." The fact that it even has a stat block with ability scores and whatnot implies it is a creature, it does have its own turn which it takes immediately after yours, and it will always be within 10 feet of itself. That said, the 10 feet only applies to its walking speed, so you will still only go 30 feet if you fly on it.

Feel free to contradict me.

[jojosskul]

1. Seems definitely feasible, lots of classes have similar builds where they use pets as mounts (e.g. small-race Battle Smith can do it).

2. I'm thinking yes, provided the Dancing Item counts as "any creature [that] starts its turn within 10 feet of [itself]." The fact that it even has a stat block with ability scores and whatnot implies it is a creature, it does have its own turn which it takes immediately after yours, and it will always be within 10 feet of itself. That said, the 10 feet only applies to its walking speed, so you will still only go 30 feet if you fly on it.

Feel free to contradict me.

Great catch on the speed! My eyes must have skimmed over the word 'walking.'

Overall I'm very excited about the subclass in general, the ability to partially, and eventually fully, negate the restriction of certain spells needing costly consumed material components makes so many spells much more intriguing. For late game Hero's Feast and Simulacrum jump out at me, but earlier than that Glyph of Warding, Greater Restoration, and even Magic Mouth become better. That and the ability to create almost anything non magic you can think of within the size limit...

Now if I can just stop being a forever DM, I know what I'll actually play :P

[Renduaz]

I like the way you think! Creation Bards are magnificient indeed for those who get creative with them. Before I made the Glyph of Warding thread though, I made a Creation Bard build (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?628785-The-Mechapilot-(-18-Creation-Bard-2-Genielock-Variants)) that I think you'll appreciate as it pertains to all those questions very, very strongly. And maybe this (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?629244-Truesight-proof-impersonation-of-any-creature) could give you some ideas too.

[jojosskul]

I like the way you think! Creation Bards are magnificient indeed for those who get creative with them. Before I made the Glyph of Warding thread though, I made a Creation Bard build (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?628785-The-Mechapilot-(-18-Creation-Bard-2-Genielock-Variants)) that I think you'll appreciate as it pertains to all those questions very, very strongly. And maybe this (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?629244-Truesight-proof-impersonation-of-any-creature) could give you some ideas too.

The 'mech' idea is amazing, and even if the character wouldn't know how to start with putting something together, everyone knows what a coffin looks like and it wouldn't be hard to imagine adding a small porthole for visibility.

The ability to potentially create doppelgangers is also interesting, but I the one person who commented on that post has a point about the glimmering and faint music emanating from it. Pairing it with Major Image I think can clear up a lot of that. Also a cheaper option for sound (though not temperature) is minor illusion. It doesn't even have verbal components so you may be able ot get away with renewing it each minute without issue to let your creation speak. Make something truly out of this world, show it to some Kuo Toa, have it preach to them and BAM, you just created a god on top of everything else :smallbiggrin: