10 int, 7 wis, 7 cha...too stupid to be a pirate and/or have an ideology?

[Zhentarim]

I'm playing a gnoll pirate in another game who was adopted by anarchist elves and that upbringing colors his perceptions of "how to act" somewhat. Classwise, this is a spheres of might and spheres of power gestalt between a weather-specialized incanter with the stormborn sorcerer bloodline on the spheres of power side and the "bloodletting" casting tradition so that my character casts on constitution rather than any mental stat. On the spheres of might side, I have a barbarian with the berserker archetype (the spheres of might version of berserker, not paizo) as well as the sea reaver archetype (from paizo) and they have the "pirate" martial tradition.

I'm giving them these traits:

https://www.aonprd.com/TraitDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Adopted

https://aonprd.com/TraitDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Youthful%20Mischief

https://aonprd.com/TraitDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Peg%20Leg

https://aonprd.com/TraitDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Sleepy

https://aonprd.com/TraitDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Birthmark

These are the classes, archetypes, and traditions I mentioned above:

Barbarian Class: https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/barbarian/

Spheres Berserker Archetype: http://spheresofpower.wikidot.com/barbarian-berserker

Sea Reaver Archetype: https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/barbarian/archetypes/paizo-barbarian-archetypes/sea-reaver/

Pirate Martial Tradition: http://spheresofpower.wikidot.com/martial-traditions#toc50

Incanter Class: http://spheresofpower.wikidot.com/incanter#toc46

Stormborn Bloodline: https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/sorcerer/bloodlines/bloodlines-from-paizo/stormborn-bloodline/

Bloodletting Tradition: http://spheresofpower.wikidot.com/casting-traditions#toc259

This is the flavor of anarchy I imagine my character's parents to have been, but as I haven't read as much about this philosophy as I have other philosophies, I feel like I might butcher it trying to play it, but given the stupidity of my character, maybe that's for the better: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegalism

It seemed fitting for a pirate, regardless.

These are the stats for my character (25 point buy):
17+2=19 (gnoll) str
15 dex
17+2=19 (gnoll) con
10 int
7 wis
7 cha

I don't need int or cha at all in my build, but would it be fitting to boost int slightly since my character has an ideology? Characters with ideology are more interesting to play than characters who only want power/money. I'm not sure whether to officially label this character chaotic neutral or chaotic good on the mythweavers sheet, but the GM said this is a very "grimdark" fantasy world, so too much idealism could come back around and bite me.


Question: Even though I don't need wisdom or charisma in my build, should I up them anyway for flavor?

[Particle_Man]

10 int is average. That seems to be enough for an ideology. You just might use fewer fancy words, so less “illegal acts will more swiftly overthrow an unjust society that has no right to make laws over me” and more “To heck with the rich, they got no right to tell me I can’t have that stuff just ‘coz they say it’s theirs by law. That law don’t mean a thing - the rich just made that up!”

[noob]

Do not forget you can read and write at 3 int so if that is possible then 10 int should be plenty enough for doing whatever you want and 7 wisdom is actually helpful for having any ideology: you can just not realise the inconsistencies of the ideology easier if your wisdom is lower.

[ManicOppressive]

Yeah, possession of ideology isn't tied to greater mental stats. Even "I'm gonna do whatever makes me the most money" is an ideology. Higher INT means a character more informed about similar or opposing ideologies, and who can better articulate their own ideas. Higher WIS means a character who examines their own beliefs and either shows flexibility or understands why flexibility is undesirable. Higher CHA means a character who can actually convince people, not necessarily of their ideology, but that their ideology is consistent and valid at all.

This is... hard to provide any examples of without real life controversial topics, so I'll keep it abstract and use "I'm gonna do whatever makes me the most money" from above.

At a 10 INT, that ideology is fine and can even be expanded upon. 10 is average human INT, which is (despite all jokes and whatever) pretty smart and capable of forming thoughts about how the world works and how it should work. "I'm gonna do whatever makes the most money because wealth provides advancement and my family benefits if I advance" is what I would call a bog-standard ideology for a 10 INT character. Even a 5 INT character can make it to "I want money because beer costs money" which is still an ideology.

At 7 WIS and CHA, you're likely to have a character who doesn't really self-examine ("My beliefs are correct because I believe them, and why would I believe wrong things") and can't really convince anyone else of their ideas. ("My beliefs are correct because I believe them, and why wouldn't you believe things I believe?") These don't directly affect the fervor of the ideology--except that as mentioned, having a low WIS can prevent the kind of self-examination that leads to flawed ideologies being corrected or abandoned.

Pathos and interesting character motivations are in no way dependent on high mental stats. A person who has a million thoughts, all of which are completely asinine and wrong, still has a million thoughts.

I do feel like a key Post Script reiteration here, though, is that 10 INT is in no way unintelligent and is the human average.

[False God]

You might not have written a great work of literature on the failings of the human and elven empires but that doesn't mean you can't know certain things about them, believe other things, and have formed opinions on those (possibly limited) facts and (possibly flawed) beliefs.

[Palanan]

It's also worth pointing out that most pirates weren't the brightest or most introspective people, so your character will hardly stand out in that regard.

And as others have mentioned, people of any intelligence can hold a particular ideology. I'd say your stats are appropriate for the character, and no need to change them.

[Quertus]

As others have said, having a low Wisdom is actually helpful for holding an ideology, because you are unlikely to carefully evaluate and second-guess your ideology. No problems detected.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

As others have said, having a low Wisdom is actually helpful for holding an ideology, because you are unlikely to carefully evaluate and second-guess your ideology. No problems detected.Depends entirely on the ideology. Mental stats have very little sway in having an ideology, but rather, they make certain ideologies more or less likely. For instance, low Int and Wis means you're more likely to have a self-destructive or nonsensical ideology, whereas a higher Int and Wis means you're liable to have a much more introspective and rational one. Helping others to earn their goodwill and their interest in helping you in return, especially if by helping them you help yourself (or vice versa), for instance, is a very good way to go about doing things, and a high-Int-and-Wis character would be perfectly likely to embrace it.

[noob]

Depends entirely on the ideology. Mental stats have very little sway in having an ideology, but rather, they make certain ideologies more or less likely. For instance, low Int and Wis means you're more likely to have a self-destructive or nonsensical ideology, whereas a higher Int and Wis means you're liable to have a much more introspective and rational one. Helping others to earn their goodwill and their interest in helping you in return, especially if by helping them you help yourself (or vice versa), for instance, is a very good way to go about doing things, and a high-Int-and-Wis character would be perfectly likely to embrace it.

But a low wisdom character could also embrace such ideology so by having low wisdom you increase the number of available ideologies because you are not losing opportunities and you gain some.

[Berenger]

An ideology can have proponents across a wide spectrum of mental abilities. You favorite -ism can be advocated by a political scientist (INT 17, WIS 12, CHA 07), a radical firebrand instigating riots (INT 11, WIS 09, CHA 16), a dim street thug participating in those riots (INT 08, WIS 09, CHA 06) or a completely average kid distributing flyers (INT 11, WIS 10, CHA 11). Each will have a different approach to the shared ideology, especially its finer academic points and philosophical reasoning. Each of them could be either lukewarm or completely fanatical about said ideology. Successful ideologies (read: those suitable to large masses of people) tend to have a place and a function for all of the above and nearly every other functional person within the supposed in-group.

[Calthropstu]

Here's the type of thing an evil mid int, low wis, low cha might pull:

Ok, we stole a bunch of stuff. Now imma kill my partners and take it all so I dun have to split it. And then brag about it at the pub cuz they were a coupla dumb bastards. So hey guys, I hear there's this big shipment and I need a coupla guys to help me take it...

[King of Nowhere]

As others have said, having a low Wisdom is actually helpful for holding an ideology, because you are unlikely to carefully evaluate and second-guess your ideology. No problems detected.

as soon as i saw the title, i came in to post exactly that. too bad someone preceded me


having high wisdom is good to form consistent opinions, a high int helps with having them be informed and well-rooted on facts, and a high charisma makes you more persuasive in decanting the advantages of your ideas.
but an ideology? doesn't require any of the above. nor does being a pirate, unless you aim for captain

[RexDart]

Watch a few "Sovereign Citizen" videos and you'll never again question how someone could be passionate about an ideology to the point of regularly getting arrested, while simultaneously possessing low reasoning skills and intuition, and no social skills.