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View Full Version : Smoke and Mirrors: Making an Illusionist



Darkxarth
2007-11-11, 12:14 AM
UPDATE: I've pretty much decided to play either a Wizard Illusionist with the Master Specialist PrC or a Beguiler. Thanks to everyone who posted for your help. Feel free to keep posting if you want, but I'm already decided.

I'm going to be playing in a campaign in a couple of weeks, and I think I'd like the fine people of the GitP forums to assist me with my character.

The game is a standard high-fantasy D&D game, and the DM is pretty lenient as far as races and classes go.

My request is a simple one: after much deliberation and cogitation on the mattter, I decided I wanted to play an illusionist of some sort and I'd like some help in making a good one. The other players are relatively new, and the DM is pretty lenient, so it's probably not going to be a vicious, player-killing campaign.

Anyway, I have a list of things I want and things I'd rather try to avoid.

Want: The ability to use multiple decent illusion spells at all levels.
Want: The ability to also cast other useful spells if absolutely necessary.
Want: I'd prefer to be a Wizard Illusionist, but if it would work better as another class, I could change my mind.
Want: I'd like to use the Focused Specialist feat from Complete Mage, if possible. (It seems cool.)
Want: I want to use the Illusion Mastery alternate class feature from the SRD, if possible. (Good in conjunction with Focused Specialist?)
Avoid: Bards or UMD builds.
Avoid: Batman builds, if possible. (I don't want to break the game for my friends.)
Avoid: As much as I enjoy Bards, I'd like to avoid them this game.


Whew, long list I know, but those are just rough guidelines and requests, not boundaries. If you can think of some spectacularly cool illusionist build that requires a Bard or the use of UMD or avoids School Specialization like the Plague, go for it, I'm open to options.

My book list includes:
3.5 Core
XPH
PHB II
Complete Arcane (don't have it at the moment though...)
Complete Mage
Complete Divine
Complete Champion
Complete Adventurer
Complete Scoundrel
Spell Compendium
Magic Item Compendium
Heroes of Battle
Tome of Battle
Arms and Equipment Guide (also don't have this at the moment)

Any assistance, from a one-line character concept to a full sheet is appreciated. Thank you in advanced.

- DX

Rachel Lorelei
2007-11-11, 12:16 AM
Focused Specialist is IMO a poor idea.

Try a Beguiler (PHB II)! They're a boatload of fun, great skillmonkeys, and have INT-based casting from a fixed list of largely illusions and enchantments.

Solo
2007-11-11, 12:18 AM
I suppose the Killer Gnome Build (tm) is out of the question?

Darkxarth
2007-11-11, 12:19 AM
Focused Specialist is IMO a poor idea.

Try a Beguiler (PHB II)! They're a boatload of fun, great skillmonkeys, and have INT-based casting from a fixed list of largely illusions and enchantments.

Normally I wouldn't look at it, but because Illusion Mastery makes me give up my extra Illusion spell from Specialization, I thought it might be useful. Also, I totally forgot I had the PHB II, added it to the list.

EDIT: I don't know what the Killer Gnome Build (TM) is, but I'd probably avoid it if it's cheesy or "broken."

Green Bean
2007-11-11, 12:20 AM
I'll second the Beguiler. It pretty much has a built in illusion and enchantment specialization. Plus, if you put points into bluff, you can screw with people's heads with or without magic!

Rachel Lorelei
2007-11-11, 12:23 AM
Normally I wouldn't look at it, but because Illusion Mastery makes me give up my extra Illusion spell from Specialization, I thought it might be useful. Also, I totally forgot I had the PHB II, added it to the list.

Illusion Mastery definitely isn't worth it--check out Chains of Disbelief instead. Illusion Mastery + Focused Specialist is doubly bad, because then you're giving up a whole extra school--after already having dumped the only two you can "safely" dump, Evocation and Enchantment--just for the spell mastery effect and extra spells learned. On top of that, you're reducing the number of slots you have for non-illusion spells; I guarantee you'll want to cast more than one or two non-illusion spells per spell level!

VerdugoExplode
2007-11-11, 12:24 AM
Remember that creativity is important when making an illusionist. Being able to think up clever and innovative uses for your spells makes minor image and all of those significantly more effective as they can act as distractions, disguises and anything else you can think of, the only limit is that they can't actually interact with objects.

I suggest you take a peak at the well known batman wizard guide and make sure to use the spells showing up on the illusionist school. Don't forget the reserve feat face changer from complete mage, free disguise self can be handy.

tyckspoon
2007-11-11, 12:51 AM
Batmannery is a power inherent to being a wizard; there's no specific build that enables it (although there are certain things that can seriously damage it.. you'd have a hard time pulling it off as an Evoker.) Take Illusion Mastery if you like, but it's not a good trade. You can get new spells in your spell book by copying them from scrolls or other spell books, and you always get 2 spells a level anyway; careful selection of those can go a long way without any augmentation. You should also normally have access to your spell books, which makes the Mastery aspect somewhat inconsequential, unless your DM has a serious hate-on for Wizards and insists on stripping your books all the time.

Your first three Wants are easily satisfied with a standard specialist Wizard; if you're looking for something to further concentrate on Illusions, look for alternate class features that trade out your familiar. It's the least-valuable thing a Wizard can give up, and some of the returns are both flavorful and decently effective. The next two Wants will end up hurting your mechanical effectiveness overall; it's your decision whether or not that's worthwhile.

You listed Complete Mage as an available resource; might I suggest you go with a normal Illusionist and go into Master Specialist? It's designed for early entry, the prerequisites are all things you're going to be taking anyway, and the class features are all aimed at making you better at your specialty school, but not overwhelmingly so. If your DM will allow it, there's really no reason not to.

Killer Gnome: I'm not familiar with the exact sequence, but it's a build based on stacking abilities that make Shadow spells more real. I believe it winds up casting things that are more effective when targets make the save, because the Shadow effects are more than 100% real.

Darkxarth
2007-11-11, 01:01 AM
Wow, thanks everyone.

I think, based on everyone's suggestions, I am going to go ahead and drop Illusion Mastery and Focused Specialist, since no one seems to think either of these two are good, let alone together.

I haven't played a Wizard in while, and I haven't played a Beguiler yet.

I'll talk to my DM about the Master Specialist PrC and make my decision about Beguiler or Wizard after that.

Thanks to all of you, that got resolved a lot quicker and more efficiently than I expected, I guess I underestimated the fine folks here at the Playground. My mistake. :smallbiggrin:
- DX

Rachel Lorelei
2007-11-11, 02:26 AM
Illusionist/Master Illusionist would be a great choice for a wizard. Plus, check out the picture of the Master Specialist--it's an illusionist, and she looks awesome.

netranika
2008-10-03, 12:39 AM
Hello everybody, I want to know about computer card tricks. You know those things, on the computer where it says, “Choose a card out of these 6, and think about it for 20 seconds. Next, scroll down, and your card will disappear out of the six cards that you were able to choose out of." So if you chose the "7 of Hearts" The "7 of Hearts" will disappear in the group of 6 cards at the bottom of the screen. How do that Computer Card Tricks Work? Thanking you,

Jack Zander
2008-10-03, 12:44 AM
Wow, threadomancy, a completely unrelated response, and the completely wrong forum. Nice job!

NEO|Phyte
2008-10-03, 12:51 AM
Incidently, that card trick works by having NONE of the cards from the first set repeated in the "we've removed your card" part.

Qanael
2008-10-03, 01:04 AM
I asked pretty much the same question a month ago, if that. Here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89970)'s the result. Hope it helps! :smallbiggrin: BTW, the table in there is a bit outdated; I took Shadowcraft Mage earlier so I would have all its abilities at the start of the campaign. Let me know if you want an updated version.

Edit: Please forgive me for perpetuating the thread necromancy. :smallredface:

Jack Zander
2008-10-03, 01:33 AM
I asked pretty much the same question a month ago, if that. Here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89970)'s the result. Hope it helps! :smallbiggrin: BTW, the table in there is a bit outdated; I took Shadowcraft Mage earlier so I would have all its abilities at the start of the campaign. Let me know if you want an updated version.

tl;dr I suppose? It might help for you to read all the posts and not just the first one. This topic is a year old and has just been revived as a nightmarish undead.

Qanael
2008-10-03, 01:39 AM
Ugh. What I get for reading the first few posts...and reading forums at 1 in the morning. Mods have mercy, I'll edit. :smalleek:

FoE
2008-10-03, 01:42 AM
http://www.game-warden.com/starfox/Non_SF_related_stuff/JS47/Thread_Necromancy.jpg

Grey Watcher
2008-10-03, 12:13 PM
TURN UNDEAD THREAD!