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View Full Version : D&D 5e/Next Primeval Warrior, a warrior druid half caster.



mcumoric
2021-05-18, 01:06 PM
Hey hey hey, it's me again, this time with a complete class instead of random subclasses.

I finally finished up this class, so have a look and tell me what you all think:

Primeval Warrior
Primeval warriors are druidic people who follow in the steps of spirits of nature, supplementing their combat with nature spells.

Proficiencies
Armor: Light and medium armor, shields (primeval warriors will not wear armor or shields made of metal).
Weapons: Simple weapons.
Tools: Herbalism kit, Mason’s Tools, Woodcarver’s tools.
Saving throws: Constitution, Wisdom.
Skills: Choose 2 from animal handling, Athletics, intimidation, Nature, perception, survival.

Hit die: 1d12 per level.
Hp at level 1: 12 + your constitution modifier.
Hp at higher levels: 1d12 (7) + your constitution modifier.

Primeval warrior table
Level - proficiency bonus - Features - Guardian die - Cantrips known - Spells known
1st - +2 - Ancient guardian, Natural armor, Spellcasting, Druidic - 1d4 - 2 - 2
2nd - +2 - Spirit, Guiding of nature - 1d4 - 2 - 3
3rd - +2 - Pure strikes - 1d4 - 2 - 4
4th - +2 - Ability score increase - 1d4 - 3 - 4
5th - +3 - Extra attack - 1d6 - 3 - 5
6th - +3 - Pure body - 1d6 - 3 - 5
7th - +3 - Spirit feature - 1d6 - 3 - 6
8th - +3 - Ability score increase - 1d6 - 3 - 6
9th - +4 - Magic resistance - 1d8 - 3 - 7
10th - +4 - Spirit feature - 1d8 - 3 - 7
11th - +4 - Guiding of nature (18-20) - 1d8 - 4 - 8
12th - +4 - - 1d8 - 4 - 8
13th - +5 - - 1d10 - 4 - 9
14th - +5 - - 1d10 - 4 - 9
15th - +5 - Natural selection - 1d10 - 4 - 10
16th - +5 - - 1d10 - 4 - 10
17th - +6 - Guiding of nature (17-20) - 1d10 - 4 - 11
18th - +6 - Spirit feature - 1d12 - 4 - 11
19th - +6 - - 1d12 - 4 - 12
20th - +6 - Apex predator - 2d8 - 4 - 13

Level - Proficiency bonus - 1st level - 2nd level - 3rd level - 4th level - 5th level
1st - +2 - 2
2nd - +2 - 2
3rd - +2 - 3
4th - +2 - 3
5th - +3 - 4 - 2
6th - +3 - 4 - 2
7th - +3 - 4 - 3
8th - +3 - 4 - 3
9th - +4 - 4 - 3 - 2
10th - +4 - 4 - 3 - 2
11th - +4 - 4 - 3 - 3
12th - +4 - 4 - 3 - 3 -
13th - +5 - 4 - 3 - 3 - 1
14th - +5 - 4 - 3 - 3 - 1
15th - +5 - 4 - 3 - 3 - 2
16th - +5 - 4 - 3 - 3 - 2
17th - +6 - 4 - 3 - 3 - 3 - 1
18th - +6 - 4 - 3 - 3 - 3 - 1
19th - +6 - 4 - 3 - 3 - 3 - 2
20th - +6 - 4 - 3 - 3 - 3 - 2

Natural armor
Starting at the 1st level, you gain the ability to deflect attacks with your toughened body. While unarmored, your armor class equals 10 + your proficiency bonus + your constitution modifier. You may still gain the benefit of a shield with this natural armor.

Ancient guardian
Starting at the 1st level, you gain the ability to ingrain primeval magic into your weapons. Once per turn if you make a weapon attack against a creature with a simple weapon made of a non metal and natural material (ie. wood, bone, stone), you can deal an additional 1d4 damage. This is your guardian die. It increases at certain levels as determined by the above table.

Druidic
You know Druidic, the secret language of druids. You can speak the language and use it to leave hidden messages. You and others who know this language automatically spot such a message. Others spot the message's presence with a successful DC 15 Wisdom (Perception) check but can't decipher it without magic.

Spellcasting
Starting at the 1st level, you learn how to use druidic magic. You take your spells from the druid spell list.
At the 1st level, you learn 2 cantrips and two spells of first level. You learn more spells as you level up as determined by the above table.
Wisdom is your spellcasting modifier for your spells.

Save dc: 8 + your proficiency bonus + your wisdom modifier.

Spell attack modifier: Your proficiency bonus + your wisdom modifier.

Spirit
Starting at the 2nd level, you choose a spirit you focus your magic from. This spirit takes the form of a beast or plant, which is limited to the options at the bottom of the class. You gain features at the 2nd, 7th, 10th and 18th levels.

The guiding of nature
Starting at the 2nd level, when you make a melee weapon attack, you now roll a critical hit on a 19 to 20.
Starting at the 11th level, you now roll a critical hit on a 18 to 20.
Starting at the 17th level, you now roll a critical hit on a 17 to 20.

Pure strikes
Starting at the 3rd level, when you hit a creature with a simple weapon attack and the weapon is not made of metal, and is made of a natural material (Ie. wood, bone, stone), you ignore resistance and immunity to non-magical bludgeoning piercing and slashing.

Ability score increase
When you reach 4th Level, and again at 8th, 12th, 16th, and 19th level, you can increase one ability score of your choice by 2, or you can increase two Ability Scores of your choice by 1. As normal, you can’t increase an ability score above 20 using this feature.

Extra attack
Starting at the 5th level, you can attack twice whenever you take the attack action on your turn.

Pure body
Starting at the 6th level, your body becomes tolerant to disease and poison. You become immune to disease, poison damage, the poisoned condition.

Magic resistance
Starting at the 9th level, your ties to the natural world heighten your tolerance to magic. You now have advantage on saving throws against magic and magical effects.

Brute
Starting at the 14th level, when you hit a creature with a melee weapon attack, you can choose to deal extra damage equal to your proficiency bonus. You may use this ability a number of times equal to your strength modifier before needing to take a short or long rest.

Natural selection
Starting at the 15th level, when you make an attack roll against a creature who lacks all of their hp, you gain a bonus to the attack roll equal to your wisdom modifier.

Apex predator
Starting at the 20th level, you are the peak of your kind as enemies revear you as the peak of natural perfection. Your constitution, strength and wisdom each increase by 2 as well as their maximums.
In addition you have advantage on all attack rolls against enemy creatures.

Spirits:

Spirit of the carnivore
You take your spirit from a carnivorous animal.


Carnivore spells
At the specified levels, the following spells are added to the spells you know.
Level - spells
2nd - Hunters mark, Wrathful smite.
5th - Crown of madness, Invisibility.
9th - Fear, Haste.
13th - Staggering smite, Greater invisibility.
17th - Destructive wave, Steel wind strike (XGE).

Frenzy
Starting at the 2nd level, when you make a weapon attack as an action, you can make an unarmed strike as a bonus action. This unarmed strike always deals 1d4 + your strength modifier on a hit.

Primal shout
Starting at the 7th level, you can use an action to emit a powerful cry. Each creature within 20 feet of you must make a wisdom saving throw against your spell save dc, or be frightened of your for the next minute. A creature can repeat the saving throw as an action to end the condition. A creature who succeeds the saving throw is immune to this effect for the next 24 hours.

Relentless endurance
Starting at the 10th level, you can take the dash action as a bonus action. In addition, when you gain levels of exhaustion, you can reduce the total level by half your constitution modifier (rounded up).

Rampage
Starting at the 18th level, when you reduce a creature to 0 hit points, you can immediately move up to your movement speed and make a melee attack. You may use this ability a number of times equal to your strength modifier, before needing to take a short or long rest.

Spirit of wood
You take your spirit from a type of tree.


Wood spells
At the specified levels, the following spells are added to the spells you know.
Level - spells
2nd - Shield, Shield of faith.
5th - Aid, Silence.
9th - Beacon of hope, Nondetection.
13th - Death ward, Aura of life.
17th - Wall of force, Hold monster.

Heart of the tree
Starting at the 2nd level, you gain a barky exterior for deflecting attacks. Your hit point maximum increases by 1 and increases by an additional 1 each time you level up after 2nd level.

Tree Stride
Starting at the 7th level, once on each of your turns, you can use 10 feet of your movement to step magically into one living tree within 5 feet of yourself and emerge from a second living tree within 60 feet of the first tree, appearing in an unoccupied space within 5 feet of the second tree. Both trees must be at least 1 size larger than you.

Unmoving wall
Starting at the 10th level, your weight doubles. In addition, when you are moved unwillingly, you can choose to not move.

The mighty oak
Starting at the 18th level, when you take damage, unless it is fire, necrotic or psychic, you can choose to reduce the damage by your constitution modifier.

Spirit of the winds
You take your spirit from an animal with a flying speed.


Winds spells
At the specified levels, the following spells are added to the spells you know.
Level - spells
2nd - Feather fall, Thunderous smite.
5th - Levitate, Blur.
9th - Fly, Haste.
13th - Dimension door, Storm sphere (XGE).
17th - Conjure volley, Far step (XGE).

Step of the wind
Starting at the 2nd level, you can now take the disengage and dash actions as bonus actions. In addition, when you make a running long jump, the distance increases by (your guardian die x 5) feet.

Wings of the aviator
Starting at the 7th level, as a bonus action, you can sprout wings from your back, resembling your spirit (for example, if your spirit is a bird, you’d get bird wings, if it’s a bat, you’d get bat wings, ect...). While you have these wings sprouted, you gain a flying speed of 60 feet. You may retract these wings using another bonus action.

Falcon dive
Starting at the 10th level, once on your turn if you fly at least 30 feet straight towards a creature and hit them with a melee attack, they take extra magical bludgeoning damage equal to your guardian die.

Avatar of zephyr
Starting at the 18th level, you can spend a spell slot to surround yourself in a twister of wind for the next minute. Any creature that ends their turn within 5 feet of you takes 1d8 + your guardian die, magical bludgeoning damage and is pushed 10 feet away from you. This ability deals an additional 1d8 damage for each level this spell is cast about 1st.

JNAProductions
2021-05-18, 01:16 PM
This is brutally OP. The concept (Druidic half-caster) is fine. The execution is far too strong.

sandmote
2021-05-18, 05:47 PM
This does not read so much like its own class as it seems to lift a bunch of major mechanical effects from a bunch of other classes. I'm curious what character concept you can achieve with this that can't be obtained by building a druid or ranger and dipping into the monk or barbarian classes. The only thing that doesn't feel like its taken directly from existing 5e features feels like its taken from the 4e barbarian.

Base Class

One saving throw should be chosen from dexterity, constitution, or wisdom and the other chosen from strength, intelligence, and charisma. The first three are common saves and the latter three are rare; this pattern is followed for all published classes.
Your version of natural armor is based on only one attribute, which makes it cheap and easy to get a high AC. If it wasn't part of their AC calculations the barbarian would not be very reliant on Dexterity and many monk builds wouldn't be very reliant on Wisdom. This natural armor also scales for other classes, making it tempting dip bait.
I can understand why Ancient guardian scales that way (once per turn), but I would push it back a few levels. 1d6+1d4 damage dice seems a bit much for a one handed weapon.
Pure strikes should come at 6th level, same as it does for monks.
Pure body is just the monk's "purity of body." Why are you making a class that gets 1/2 casting and a bunch of monk features early?
Apex predator is too strong by itself. it's a stronger version of the barbarian's final feature, and I'm not even going to touch on the second bullet.
I haven't double checked, but it looks like all the subclass spells are stuff that isn't on the druid spell list. It should be about half new spells and about half spells the character would be able to take anyway; the goal should be thematic spells rather than pure minmaxing.


Carnivore

Ancient guardian and frenzy is too much.
Primal shout shouldn't be spamable. You can give your allies immunity at the start of the adventuring day at which point it would be about a 2nd level spell (stronger than cause fear but weaker than fear) if you added a concentration requirement.
the name "Relentless endurance" is used one of the half orc's racial features. The feature itself isn't too bad. I'd just grant it at a higher level to because there might be some abuse with multiclassing with the beserker barbarian.
If it was a majorly strong feature for the class, rampage wouldn't be too bad; it would allow this martial character to nova like a spellcaster. If you bring the rest of the class in line I think it would be fine. Thematically though, having this and steel wind strike feels weird.


Wood

Tree Stride Should probably be pushed back to 18th level; normally its a fifth level spell that requires concentration, even if you're limiting the distance.
The rest of the subclass actually feels bland and weak: maybe add some ribbons allowing the wood primeval warrior to heal and/or talk to plants?
Give them some spells related to plants.


Wind

Wings of the aviator comes at half the level before sorcerer subclasses grant the same thing. Push it back.
Falcon dive I actually like; its very "wreak havoc behind enemy lines." If you tone down the base class it should be fine.
Avatar of zephyr is basically an at will thunder wave and would be fine if you added a save. I'm not sure how it fits getting power from a nature spirit, but you could actually probably grant it slightly earlier.

JNAProductions
2021-05-18, 09:07 PM
Off work now.

Base Stats
Armor is largely irrelevant, due to Unarmored Defense, but it has that niggling "Will not" which I hate.
Weapons are fine.
It gives three tool proficiencies-that's as many as Bard does, but they're TOOLS instead of instruments.
Saving Throws has two common saves, and the two really good common ones.
Skill list is short.
HP is as Barbarian.

So right off the bat... It's already too strong, unless its features are really mediocre.

Natural Armor
Is better Unarmored Defense than a Barbarian or Monk. Prof+Con means you can ignore Dex entirely, and it eventually hits 21 without a shield. That's unneededly good.

Ancient Guardian
At level 1, dealing 1d8+1d4 isn't very different from dealing 2d6. This feature is... Okay, to bring damage up to par. At least at level one.

Druidic
Okay.

Spellcasting
You have Artificer half-casting. Compare this to an Artificer's level one.

Guiding Of Nature
You get a Champion's Improved Crit one level earlier, Superior Critical four levels early, and eventually get a 17-20 crit range. That's not ridiculous on its own, but it's a very boring and random bonus.

Pure Strikes
Should come later, if at all.

Ability Score Increase
Usual deal. Is fine.

Extra Attack
Usual deal. Fine.

Pure Body
Like the Monk feature. Only five levels early.

Magic Resistance
Worse than Spell Resistance from a level 14 Abjurer in that you don't resist damage. Better in that it applies to more than just spells. Overall, I'd say this is stronger. It also comes five levels earlier.

Brute
This is really minor. So minor as to not be worth including. It caps at 30 extra damage per rest.

Natural Selection
Whereas this is OP as all hell. For reference, a Devotion Paladin can spend their action to gain +Cha to-hit... As an action, using a once per short rest Channel Divinity. This just applies any time you attack someone who's injured even slightly-so while mooks won't mind (being hit easily and quite possibly being one-shot) bosses will have to deal with you hitting them 25 percentage points better.

Apex Predator
This is just insane. You have a 36% chance of critting on every single attack you make, you're usually gonna be hitting at +18 (before any magic weapons) meaning that the Tarrasque is hit more than 90% of the time, you bump your save DC... Bonkers.


Carnivore

Frenzy
Martial Arts. It's fine, I guess.

Primal Shout
Bonkers. As Sandmote pointed out, it's easy to make your allies immune, so you can start every single combat by frightening a good chunk of them. And then they can't save again unless they use up their action.

Relentless Endurance
Nothing gives more than one level of Exhaustion at a time. This might as well read "You are immune to exhaustion."

Rampage
Should have an action cost.

Wood

Heart Of The Tree
Gives one less HP than it should. Nothing inherently wrong with this, save for the class it's on being OP without it.

Tree Stride
I'm actually okay with this. It's like a Shadow Monk's Shadow Step. Except that takes an action, this doesn't.

Wait A Minute
Why is Wall Of Force on the spell list? How does that make ANY SENSE?

Unmoving Wall
The weight doubling seems odd. And negating forced movement (which, as written, includes a grappler moving you) should require SOMETHING. A spell slot. A reaction.

The Mighty Oak
Fine, for a tank.

Winds

Step Of The Wind
Already a named feature, that Monks have. But fine.

Wings Of The Aviator
Pretty early for a fly speed.

Falcon Dive
Since you can disengage as a bonus action, move 30' up, then dive 30' down... Yeah, this is too easy to trigger.

Avatar Of The Zephyr
Really needs a save, at the minimum.


Overall
Compare to another class. Any other class.

GalacticAxekick
2021-05-20, 08:43 PM
Saving throws: Constitution, Wisdom.Dexterity, Constitution and Wisdom are the most common (and therefore the most useful) saves.

Strength, Intelligence and Charisma are the least common (and therefore the least useful)

Every class gets one common save and one uncommon save. Your Primeval Warrior has two common saves.

Don't make yours special.


Hit die: 1d12 per level.
Hp at level 1: 12 + your constitution modifier.
Hp at higher levels: 1d12 (7) + your constitution modifier. The Barbarian is the only class with a 1d12 hit die. This is because (thematically) the Barbarian is in superhuman physical shape and (mechanically) the Barbarian's unarmored front-line tactics require enhanced defenses.

Thematically, your Primeval Warrior is not in especially good shape. And mechanically, your Primeval Warrior is not stuck on the front line. There is no reason to use a d12 hit die. Go with the Paladin's d10 or (better yet) the Ranger's d8.


Natural armor
Starting at the 1st level, you gain the ability to deflect attacks with your toughened body. While unarmored, your armor class equals 10 + your proficiency bonus + your constitution modifier. You may still gain the benefit of a shield with this natural armor. AC should never scale with proficiency. Proficiency increases are free.

Every class with Unarmored Defense uses 10 + Dexterity + [Ability]

Don't try to make yours special.


Ancient guardian
Starting at the 1st level, you gain the ability to ingrain primeval magic into your weapons. Once per turn if you make a weapon attack against a creature with a simple weapon made of a non metal and natural material (ie. wood, bone, stone), you can deal an additional 1d4 damage. This is your guardian die. It increases at certain levels as determined by the above table. This is fine! Kinda boring (it's just damage) but it's balanced!


Druidic
You know Druidic, the secret language of druids. You can speak the language and use it to leave hidden messages. You and others who know this language automatically spot such a message. Others spot the message's presence with a successful DC 15 Wisdom (Perception) check but can't decipher it without magic. This is fine


Spellcasting
Starting at the 1st level, you learn how to use druidic magic. You take your spells from the druid spell list.
At the 1st level, you learn 2 cantrips and two spells of first level. You learn more spells as you level up as determined by the above table.
Wisdom is your spellcasting modifier for your spells.

Save dc: 8 + your proficiency bonus + your wisdom modifier.

Spell attack modifier: Your proficiency bonus + your wisdom modifier. No half caster gains spellcasting at 1st level. Paladins and Rangers both gain it at 2nd level.

Don't make yours special.


The guiding of nature
Starting at the 2nd level, when you make a melee weapon attack, you now roll a critical hit on a 19 to 20.
Starting at the 11th level, you now roll a critical hit on a 18 to 20.
Starting at the 17th level, you now roll a critical hit on a 17 to 20. Thematically, why does this feature exist? How does nature make you better at scoring critical hits? This seems like an arbitrary buff.

Mechanically, this is too early. Champion Fighters nat19 crits at 3rd level, nat18 crits at 15th level, and never gain nat17 crits. Why does the half-caster—the class that's supposed to be half as good at fighting—get this feature earlier and better?

Don't make yours special.


Pure strikes
Starting at the 3rd level, when you hit a creature with a simple weapon attack and the weapon is not made of metal, and is made of a natural material (Ie. wood, bone, stone), you ignore resistance and immunity to non-magical bludgeoning piercing and slashing. Monks gain this feature at 6th level. Why do PW's gain it at 3rd?

Don't.


Ability score increase
When you reach 4th Level, and again at 8th, 12th, 16th, and 19th level, you can increase one ability score of your choice by 2, or you can increase two Ability Scores of your choice by 1. As normal, you can’t increase an ability score above 20 using this feature. Nice


Extra attack
Starting at the 5th level, you can attack twice whenever you take the attack action on your turn. Nice


Pure body
Starting at the 6th level, your body becomes tolerant to disease and poison. You become immune to disease, poison damage, the poisoned condition. Monk's gain this feature this feature at 10th level. Why do PW's gain it at 6th?

Don't.


Magic resistance
Starting at the 9th level, your ties to the natural world heighten your tolerance to magic. You now have advantage on saving throws against magic and magical effects. Abjuration Wizards gain this feature at 14th level. Why do PW's gain it at 9th?

Don't.

Brute
Starting at the 14th level, when you hit a creature with a melee weapon attack, you can choose to deal extra damage equal to your proficiency bonus. You may use this ability a number of times equal to your strength modifier before needing to take a short or long rest. Because of the way this is limited per rest, this isn't actually too strong. That said, it's mechanically boring (just more damage) and thematically bankrupt (what does this have to do with nature?)


Natural selection
Starting at the 15th level, when you make an attack roll against a creature who lacks all of their hp, you gain a bonus to the attack roll equal to your wisdom modifier. Why would you want to be better at hitting creatures that are already at 0 hit points?


Apex predator
Starting at the 20th level, you are the peak of your kind as enemies revere you as the peak of natural perfection. Your constitution, strength and wisdom each increase by 2 as well as their maximums.
In addition you have advantage on all attack rolls against enemy creatures. Advantage on attacks forever is beyond overpowered.

Gaining higher Wisdom than the Druid makes no sense if you're a half caster (half as good at druid things).

The Strength and Con bonuses are all you could reasonably leave in, and even then, you're just cloning the Barbarian capstone. You can do something more creative.

sandmote
2021-05-21, 09:00 AM
Attention
There is a revised version of this here (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?631779-Primeval-warrior-(Revised)).


the Ranger's d8. To everyone else I assume he meant rogue's d8


No half caster gains spellcasting at 1st level. Paladins and Rangers both gain it at 2nd level. Artificers gain half casting at 1st level.

GalacticAxekick
2021-05-21, 10:05 AM
To everyone else I assume he meant rogue's d8No, I was thinking strictly of half-casters and was mistaken about the Ranger's hit die.


Artificers gain half casting at 1st level.Good catch! I don't have Tashas Couldron, and constantly forgot that the wrtifucer exists.