Subjugation Domain (Cleric)

[werescythe]

This domain is based of the idea of a cleric that uses their divine magic to restrain and paralyze their foes. The cleric is granted this magic by a deity of bondage (don't currently have a list of deities that could count for this except, maybe Hades) and not only wishes to ensnare others to please their god but also feels some extent of pleasure from it.

Subjugation Domain (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1zEuftH2468e7sSuE_vwrdJ1Q_XH-6siZCiRneEHRscw/edit?usp=sharing)

This is a VERY new subclass that I literally created just today, so constructive feedback will be greatly appreciated, especially when it comes to a list of deities that can fit this role and even how such deities might work in a setting (without necessarily being of an evil alignment).

Thank you for reading this thread. I look forward to your feedback. :smallbiggrin:

UPDATE: This class has been updated with more information, quirks and most of the abilities in question have been balanced, still if you have any constructive feedback feel free to mention it. Now I'm off to work on a Merriment/Wine themed Cleric Domain. What could possibly go wrong? :smallcool:

[werescythe]

Advice on the spell list, first level ability and the channel divinity would be greatly appreciated.

[sandmote]

Chains of Subservience looks overpowered. It refreshes on a short rest, doesn't require concentration, the target must use their action to escape and it doesn't get to add any form of proficiency bonus to their check. The limitation is also kind of weak, because your uses of Channel divinity increase a short while before your proficiency bonus become double the uses of channel divinity anyway (so half the time you need to track it and half the time you don't). Maybe have it restrain instead of paralyze and allow some sort of skill check. I'd maybe clarify how the bonds work: Acrobatics and Athletics checks are typical for physical restraints, so these seem to be something else. At least allow it to be an Insight check.

Disciplined Disciple seems a bit too strong. You're getting a lot of temporary hit points for what you probably start doing most combats anyway. I don't know, maybe not having heavy armor evens it out.

Divine Bindings seems fine mechanically, but clerics have spells prepared rather than known.

Tether of pain seems fine, in the other hand. A bit more 4e than 5e in how it works, but the 1 target limit seems good. Spells and bonus proficiencies seem fine too.

[werescythe]

Thank you so much for the feedback by the way. :smallsmile:


Chains of Subservience looks overpowered. It refreshes on a short rest, doesn't require concentration, the target must use their action to escape and it doesn't get to add any form of proficiency bonus to their check. The limitation is also kind of weak, because your uses of Channel divinity increase a short while before your proficiency bonus become double the uses of channel divinity anyway (so half the time you need to track it and half the time you don't). Maybe have it restrain instead of paralyze and allow some sort of skill check. I'd maybe clarify how the bonds work: Acrobatics and Athletics checks are typical for physical restraints, so these seem to be something else. At least allow it to be an Insight check.

The thing is there are A LOT of spells that function this way. Both Entangle and Evard's Black Tentacles only use checks.

As for the lack of concentration, I kind of wanted to give the player another tool to use since most of the spells they receive in the spell list are concentration spells. The thought with the restriction is the idea that they might be able to use the channel divinity on other creatures but only on so many at one time, if that makes sense.

I suppose I could just remove the restriction and make it that it requires concentration but that perhaps the player can cast spells from the spell list at the same time and that both the channel divinity and spell cast share concentration (if the player fails both go down). Or something like that.

[sandmote]

I missed a few things on the way Chains of Subservience works last time I read it. First, it works like hold monster rather than hold person. I think its important to note that.

Second, paralyzed creatures can't take action:

The thing is there are A LOT of spells that function this way. Both Entangle and Evard's Black Tentacles only use checks. Entangle and Black Tentacles restrain the target. You can still take actions while restrained. Chains of Subservience paralyzes, so by the rules of paralysis the creature can't use its action at all (including to make that check).

Honestly, given Entangle, Web, Black Tentacles, and most of these similar spells restrain, I'd probably change it to the restrained condition. Being able to restrain someone while Entangle/Web/ect. is already up without losing the spell is probably strong enough.

Or make it a saving throw at the start of their turn, and just say they they can't take an action the same turn they escape. That would probably the simplest way to resolve the discontinuity between Chains of Subservience rules and the paralysis rules.


I suppose I could just remove the restriction and make it that it requires concentration but that perhaps the player can cast spells from the spell list at the same time and that both the channel divinity and spell cast share concentration (if the player fails both go down). Or something like that. To be honest, I think that if you need this sort of restriction, the Chains of Subservience is probably too strong. That said, per the above I'd just scrap the restriction entirely.

I don't feel strongly about Wrath of Nature, but maybe Wall of Force or Wall of Stone (either of which would let you construct a prison around an enemy) would fit better?

Beside the mechanical notes, I should also point out I really like the concept. The concept would be really interesting even if it didn't have a combat role it was effective at (and this does).

[werescythe]

Second, paralyzed creatures can't take action:
Entangle and Black Tentacles restrain the target. You can still take actions while restrained. Chains of Subservience paralyzes, so by the rules of paralysis the creature can't use its action at all (including to make that check).

Honestly, given Entangle, Web, Black Tentacles, and most of these similar spells restrain, I'd probably change it to the restrained condition. Being able to restrain someone while Entangle/Web/ect. is already up without losing the spell is probably strong enough.

Or make it a saving throw at the start of their turn, and just say they they can't take an action the same turn they escape. That would probably the simplest way to resolve the discontinuity between Chains of Subservience rules and the paralysis rules.

Oh, I didn't realize that. I can see what you mean. I'll have them make the saving throw at the start of their turn.

[werescythe]

So should I have it that the channel divinity uses concentration but allows the cleric to also be able to concentrate on a single domain spell at the same time (so long as the targeted creature for both the channel divinity and the spell are not the same), or maybe have it that it's concentration but perhaps at certain levels the number of targets that can be selected are increased?

[werescythe]

UPDATE: This class has been updated with more information, quirks and most of the abilities in question have been balanced, still if you have any constructive feedback feel free to mention it. Now I'm off to work on a Merriment/Wine themed Cleric Domain. What could possibly go wrong? :smallcool: