Taking Class Abilities Beyond Their Listed Levels

[Crazysaneman]

Okay playground, once again I need your help finding something I should be able to find on my own.

Here's the idea, it's just a thought experiment and not set for actual use:
1) Take levels of Warlock
2) Take three levels of Hellfire Warlock to get Hellfire Blast to 6d6.
3) Take a couple levels of Legacy Champion to take advantage of +1 level of existing class features to drive Hellfire Blast BEYOND 6d6.
4) ???
5) Profit

So for some reason (most likely I'm just dumb and missed it) I can't find the rules for taking a class or prestige class ability beyond it's listed levels.

I'm not necessarily looking for other options or more optimized things to do with my time (again just a though experiment) I'm just curious where to find the rules that cover this.

Thanks guys
CSM

[Troacctid]

It's the same as if you used a prestige class to advance the spellcasting of something like trapsmith beyond 5 levels. The progression only has 3 levels, so advancing it further does nothing.

This comes up in discussions sometimes as cheese. If you squint, you might be able to convince your DM, but it doesn't actually work in the rules, and the general consensus is that it's BS.

What you actually want are bloodline levels from UA.

Include the character's bloodline level when calculating any character ability based on his class levels (such as caster level for spellcasting characters, or save DCs for characters with special abilities whose DCs are based on class level). The character doesn't gain any abilities, spells known, or spells per day from the addition of his bloodline levels, though—only the calculations of his level-based abilities are affected.

If a character has levels in two or more classes in addition to his bloodline levels, each class gains the benefit of adding the bloodline levels when calculating abilities.

For example, a 2nd-level sorcerer with a major bloodline takes a bloodline level when earns enough XP to advance in level. He is treated as a 3rd-level spellcaster for the purpose of spell durations, caster level checks, and so forth. But he doesn't gain a 3rd-level sorcerer's spells per day or spells known.

Similarly, the stunning attacks of a 3rd-level monk with one bloodline level have a save DC equal to 12 (10 + one-half class level) plus her Wisdom modifier, since the bloodline level is treated as if it were a monk class level when calculating the save DC. A 3rd-level monk/3rd-level sorcerer with two bloodline levels would be treated as a 5th-level spellcaster and a 5th-level monk for determining level-based abilities.
They give you +1 effective level to all your classes for the purpose of calculations. Hellfire warlock's "extra 2d6 points of damage per class level" counts, so 3 levels of a major bloodline would be worth another +6d6 damage for a total of +12d6.

[Maat Mons]

Sometimes the text of a class feature gives you a formula for determining the bonus as a function of class level. In those cases, you just substitute in a numerical value, and get your answer, even if the number you sub in for your level is more than the number of levels in the class, no special rules are needed.

In other cases there exist no rules for determining what the bonuses would be. Though, if I recall, Epic Level Handbook has some guidelines.

[Elves]

This is a well-worn trick and is debated.


you gain class features and an increase in effective level as if you had also gained a level in a class to which you belonged before adding the prestige class level
The objection is that you can't have gained a level in that class if there are no more levels to take. But the most literal reading doesn't care about that, so it seems to work.

The nays are reading "as if" as hypothetical and the yeas are reading it as virtual. The virtual reading is more literal, and it's supported by the use of "effective [rather than actual] class level" to describe your level in classes that have been boosted in this way.

But:
I ran across this quote in ELH (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?626592-Does-this-one-line-ruin-Legacy-Champion-Uncanny-Trickster-exploits) that could prevent this exploit, although it's 3.0 and the context is different. Despite the different context, it does work as a standalone rule. I'm not clear on whether a general rule, as opposed to specific content, from a 3.0 book is valid in 3.5. Maybe someone who knows the rules better than me can speak on this.