Player Help I've become undead but I don't want to be undead [Archive]

Albanymusicfund

2021-06-05, 07:38 PM

One Step Two

2021-06-05, 07:52 PM

For a short duration, the spell Spark of Life from spell compendium gives you back some living function, you can try and craft a magic item to make it last longer until you can get access to the ability to cast resurrection on a scroll, cause your undead body needs to be destroyed first.

Aldrakan

2021-06-05, 08:28 PM

Yeah the standard solution here is to die and get resurrected, there's probably some way involving polymorph any object, and wish of course. But I think they're pretty rare and high level.

I don't know the situation, how flexible your DM is etc., but while I understand your character definitely wants to be alive again so he can carry on the family line, are you in a hurry as a player? Potentially staying undead could generate plots as you chase rumors of a cure or scheme to deceive a suspicious noble, and generate interesting dynamics within the party.

MaxiDuRaritry

2021-06-05, 08:32 PM

Retrain your first level feat to Human Heritage or Human Blood; you keep all of the undead immunities and other benefits of being unalive, but you gain all the benefits of being humanoid (human) when it benefits you. That means you can't be turned. You could also get yourself a psychoactive skin of proteus and stay in a form with a Con score; you're technically alive at that point.

Squire Doodad

2021-06-05, 08:44 PM

Go all in on being undead, dabble in creating intelligent undead, take your next closest relative and make a homunculus in their likeness.

Otherwise, finding someone who can revive you is the way to go. Since you're an intelligent undead that is still your character, you don't need to find that high a level cleric, you can scribe a scroll of Raise Dead, give it to the local High Priest of Nonamesville and let them kill and then revive you.

There's some really cool things you can do if you're undead, but if you're not interested in that, it's not too hard to not be undead if you're in a world with a DM who can help you craft an arc to help you get around it or at least understand you don't want this to be a long-term thing.

Calthropstu

2021-06-05, 09:33 PM

It looks like your character is...

UNDEADICATED.
*ahem*
True res is the way to go. Otherwise, spark of life to make an heir then forget the line and have fun.
Otherotherwise, true res your dad/dead brother etc so they can take over.

Darg

2021-06-05, 10:01 PM

InvisibleBison

2021-06-05, 10:10 PM

How long were you dead? If you became undead fairly quickly (within a day per caster level), then all you need to do is get a contingent raise dead cast on yourself. Commit suicide and the contingent spell kicks in and you are alive. If you don't want to lose a level then get a true resurrection. A wish would work too.

Raise dead doesn't work on someone who's been made into an undead creature.

Even if that wasn't the case, contingency is a personal spell and requires you to be able to cast the spell being made contingent. So unless the OP's character happened to be a high-level mystic theurge or something, they'd be out of luck.

Particle_Man

2021-06-05, 11:18 PM

If you take 10 levels in green star adept I think your type changes to construct. If you take 10 levels in dragon disciple you might get the half-dragon template even without meeting the usual prerequisite. If so your type changes to dragon. Not sure if either of these make you stop being undead although with the first one your appearance changes enough that maybe no one will think that the immortal green moving statue is *also* undead.

Oh you would need some arcane caster levels. That may not be your thing.

Rebel7284

2021-06-06, 12:02 AM

Green Star Adept is also terrible...

What specific mechanic did the DM use to make you undead? Or was it just a houserule "your type is now undead and nothing else changes (besides things keyed off CON)"

You don't need to be an arcane caster to access contingency. Craft Contingent Spell feat is accessible to any caster and is incredible in general. Caster level 11 does mean likely taking it as your 12th level feat.

With craft contingent spell, you may be able to use the rules for cooperative item creation to put True Resurrection into a Contingent Spell by cooperating with someone who's very high level (probably for a price). However, if you're okay with losing a level, regular Resurrection works just fine.

You can also adopt. Bloodlines are overrated.

Also, Lich Loved feat and the multiple half-undead templates do seem to point to some ability for undead to create offspring if you really want.

Darg

2021-06-06, 08:54 AM

Raise dead doesn't work on someone who's been made into an undead creature.

Even if that wasn't the case, contingency is a personal spell and requires you to be able to cast the spell being made contingent. So unless the OP's character happened to be a high-level mystic theurge or something, they'd be out of luck.

As rebel said, craft contingent spell is considered a magic item. You can also use scrolls to go the spell route.

Green Star Adept is also terrible...

It's not bad for warlock who gets full progression as it's based on caster level, not spellcasting levels.

Particle_Man

2021-06-06, 09:18 AM

It's not bad for warlock who gets full progression as it's based on caster level, not spellcasting levels.

That is interesting and I would like to hear more of the warlock/green star adept. What parts advance and which do not? Eldritch Blast damage? New invocations? Access to higher tiers of invocations, like greater and dark? Warlock class abilities like dr/cold iron, fiendish resilience, energy resistance and imbue item?

And just so I can show the receipts to my DM, are there various sources of rulings I could point to on this?

Bayar

2021-06-06, 09:57 AM

Guys I just have to be real. I screwed up.

My character did a bunch of decisions that lead to him becoming an undead. I am lucky enough to be a cleric so how do I undo this affliction? Any spell across any book works. I just need to stop being undead for roleplay purposes because I am nobility and I sort of am the of my family so I have to continue the legacy lmao.

Please help me and thank you in advance lol!

What kind of an undead ? A Lich ? Vampire ? Non-specific ? Do you only have the undead type but keep your original race ? What is your original race ?

Also, you are undead now, you don't need anyone else to continue your family legacy since now you're ageless.

InvisibleBison

2021-06-06, 10:54 AM

As rebel said, craft contingent spell is considered a magic item. You can also use scrolls to go the spell route.

If you have a scroll of resurrection, why do you need to mess around with craft contingent spell at all? Just have one of the other PCs use it, or go down to the local temple and pay an NPC cleric to activate it.

Zanos

2021-06-06, 11:13 AM

My character did a bunch of decisions that lead to him becoming an undead. I am lucky enough to be a cleric so how do I undo this affliction? Any spell across any book works. I just need to stop being undead for roleplay purposes because I am nobility and I sort of am the of my family so I have to continue the legacy lmao.

You can use transmutation to turn into yourself when you were alive, so as long as your caster level gives you enough time to uh...perform the required deed, being undead shouldn't be an issue for a powerful spellcaster.

Albanymusicfund

2021-06-06, 02:56 PM

What kind of an undead ? A Lich ? Vampire ? Non-specific ? Do you only have the undead type but keep your original race ? What is your original race ?

Also, you are undead now, you don't need anyone else to continue your family legacy since now you're ageless.

I am a revenant. (I was backstabbed by my cousins who are also PCs that decided to kill my character for the one session I wasn't there for). Originally I was a human with a slight orcish heritage. I just wanted to stop being undead so that I could reproduce and for roleplay reasons.

MaxiDuRaritry

2021-06-06, 03:06 PM

I am a revenant. (I was backstabbed by my cousins who are also PCs that decided to kill my character for the one session I wasn't there for). Originally I was a human with a slight orcish heritage. I just wanted to stop being undead so that I could reproduce and for roleplay reasons.A quick way to reproduce is to shapechange into an ooze with the Split ability, then take a bit of damage. I mean, you'll be creating an oozy clone of yourself, but it technically counts. Right?

Particle_Man

2021-06-06, 03:12 PM

I am a revenant. (I was backstabbed by my cousins who are also PCs that decided to kill my character for the one session I wasn't there for). Originally I was a human with a slight orcish heritage. I just wanted to stop being undead so that I could reproduce and for roleplay reasons.

That adds a complication. Are you not consumed with the urge to kill the people that killed you? Isn’t that the revenabt’s thing?

Ettina

2021-06-06, 03:12 PM

I am a revenant. (I was backstabbed by my cousins who are also PCs that decided to kill my character for the one session I wasn't there for). Originally I was a human with a slight orcish heritage. I just wanted to stop being undead so that I could reproduce and for roleplay reasons.

I feel like having PVP kill a PC while their player isn't present is worth an out-of-character conversation about ret-conning that and setting new rules of conduct.

Darg

2021-06-06, 07:14 PM

If you have a scroll of resurrection, why do you need to mess around with craft contingent spell at all? Just have one of the other PCs use it, or go down to the local temple and pay an NPC cleric to activate it.

It's all about risk. There is a chance you could be betrayed (in character) and do you really trust people who might see you as something dangerous and vile or have a patron that might want to see you stay dead? Plus it can lead to interesting interactions and possibly a short quest that destabilizes the noble house due to the increased amount of time you are missing.

That is interesting and I would like to hear more of the warlock/green star adept. What parts advance and which do not? Eldritch Blast damage? New invocations? Access to higher tiers of invocations, like greater and dark? Warlock class abilities like dr/cold iron, fiendish resilience, energy resistance and imbue item?

And just so I can show the receipts to my DM, are there various sources of rulings I could point to on this?

Just EB damage, caster level, and invocation level/known like any other caster progression class (if you don't follow the errata then the equivalent spell level of EB). It boils down to the clarification in the parentheticals on page 18 (using combined caster level to determine progression) and the description of greenstar adept's increased caster level increasing your effective spellcaster level.

It also helps that "+1 level of spellcasting" is never used in anything so +1 level of spellcaster level is just as good as +1 level of spellcasting class thanks to the above correlation specifically to caster levels.

Jack_Simth

2021-06-06, 08:09 PM

There's an interesting clause in the undead type (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/typesSubtypes.htm#undeadType):

Not affected by raise dead and reincarnate spells or abilities. Resurrection and true resurrection can affect undead creatures. These spells turn undead creatures back into the living creatures they were before becoming undead.
Which means if you apply a Resurrection spell directly to yourself, you come back as a living creature immediately, as there's a specific clause about it in the undead type (sort of like how you can apply an Earthquake spell (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/earthquake.htm), which normally applies to an area, directly to a Clay Golem (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/golem.htm#clayGolem) for an unusual effect). No need for that pesky destruction step.

I feel like having PVP kill a PC while their player isn't present is worth an out-of-character conversation about ret-conning that and setting new rules of conduct.
Yeah, probably.

Remuko

2021-06-06, 10:51 PM

I feel like having PVP kill a PC while their player isn't present is worth an out-of-character conversation about ret-conning that and setting new rules of conduct.

gotta throw my hat in with this.

Particle_Man

2021-06-06, 11:16 PM

Just EB damage, caster level, and invocation level/known like any other caster progression class (if you don't follow the errata then the equivalent spell level of EB). It boils down to the clarification in the parentheticals on page 18 (using combined caster level to determine progression) and the description of greenstar adept's increased caster level increasing your effective spellcaster level.

It also helps that "+1 level of spellcasting" is never used in anything so +1 level of spellcaster level is just as good as +1 level of spellcasting class thanks to the above correlation specifically to caster levels.

Ah so it would be either warlock 6/green star adept 10 and have lots of lesser invocations (but not greater or dire ones) or warlock 11/green star adept to get access to the greater invocations like vitriolic blast (but not dire ones) or warlock 16/green star adept to get access to dire invocations?

Darg

2021-06-06, 11:44 PM

There's an interesting clause in the undead type (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/typesSubtypes.htm#undeadType):

Which means if you apply a Resurrection spell directly to yourself, you come back as a living creature immediately, as there's a specific clause about it in the undead type (sort of like how you can apply an Earthquake spell (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/earthquake.htm), which normally applies to an area, directly to a Clay Golem (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/golem.htm#clayGolem) for an unusual effect). No need for that pesky destruction step.

Except that Resurrection and True Resurrection specifically state that they do not affect undead creatures. I like the flavor, but we do have a contradiction in the rules. Generally, specific trumps general. So I guess it's up to the DM.

Ah so it would be either warlock 6/green star adept 10 and have lots of lesser invocations (but not greater or dire ones) or warlock 11/green star adept to get access to the greater invocations like vitriolic blast (but not dire ones) or warlock 16/green star adept to get access to dire invocations?

The warlock 6/green star adept 10 would have the selection and access to invocations of a 16th level warlock just as if they were a warlock 6/wild mage 10. So yes, you would have 3 least, 3 lesser, 3 greater, and 1 dark invocations unless you invested in some extra invocation feats. You use the combined caster level to look at table 1-1 on page 8 to determine the benefits mentioned on page 18.

Particle_Man

2021-06-07, 12:10 AM

The warlock 6/green star adept 10 would have the selection and access to invocations of a 16th level warlock just as if they were a warlock 6/wild mage 10. So yes, you would have 3 least, 3 lesser, 3 greater, and 1 dark invocations unless you invested in some extra invocation feats. You use the combined caster level to look at table 1-1 on page 8 to determine the benefits mentioned on page 18.

Interesting. Some Warlocks even have a motivation to seek the immortality of Green Star Adept 10, if they happen to be the sort of Warlocks that sold their soul (or had it sold by their parents) to Really Bad Guys in exchange for the Warlock powers they get.

MaxiDuRaritry

2021-06-07, 12:24 AM

Interesting. Some Warlocks even have a motivation to seek the immortality of Green Star Adept 10, if they happen to be the sort of Warlocks that sold their soul (or had it sold by their parents) to Really Bad Guys in exchange for the Warlock powers they get.There are tons of vastly easier ways to gain immortality than to spend half your non-epic progression on it. Heck, there are multitudes of LA 0 races that are immortal right off the bat.

Particle_Man

2021-06-07, 01:23 AM

There are tons of vastly easier ways to gain immortality than to spend half your non-epic progression on it. Heck, there are multitudes of LA 0 races that are immortal right off the bat.

For the latter that would be irrelevant though. If you happen to be born human there is no point in bemoaning that you were not a war forged or elf (the player could have chosen war forged but an already human character could not) but then you hear about a way to live forever by eating green rocks.:smallcool: It is a role playing hook, but nothing wrong with that.

Also it is neat that both classes are in the same book. Some dms are core plus one book dms.

MaxiDuRaritry

2021-06-07, 01:50 AM

For the latter that would be irrelevant though. If you happen to be born human there is no point in bemoaning that you were not a war forged or elf (the player could have chosen war forged but an already human character could not) but then you hear about a way to live forever by eating green rocks.:smallcool: It is a role playing hook, but nothing wrong with that.

Also it is neat that both classes are in the same book. Some dms are core plus one book dms.There are Core ways to become immortal. Double-polymorph any object is one of many.

Segev

2021-06-07, 01:50 AM

I will add to the recommendation to discuss boundaries of PvP with players not present.

That said, if all you're concerned about is ability to reproduce, Polymorph should suffice for long enough to father a child. If you're the mother, this is trickier, but perhaps polymorphing long enough to start the gestation followed by some daily magic potion of some special concoction could let the baby grow despite the undead womb. Cool template possibilities for the little one, like half-vampire or the like.

Particle_Man

2021-06-07, 01:56 AM

There are Core ways to become immortal. Double-polymorph any object is one of many.

Fair enough. To save time I will start a special campaign that bans that and everything else that you or anyone else has ever thought of except for becoming a green star adept. :smallcool:

Albanymusicfund

2021-06-07, 03:01 AM

That adds a complication. Are you not consumed with the urge to kill the people that killed you? Isn’t that the revenabt’s thing?

Yea I am just absolutely livid both in character and out of character about this. Luckily, my character was pretty wise before he died so he can control his rage rather than just charging straight at him.

Albanymusicfund

2021-06-07, 03:08 AM

I feel like having PVP kill a PC while their player isn't present is worth an out-of-character conversation about ret-conning that and setting new rules of conduct.

gotta throw my hat in with this.

While it won't be the most mature thing in the world my character has become a revenant and I am working just to absolutely crush the PCs who did this. I would prefer to talk about the new rules of conduct after a bit of revenge. However, you are completely correct that this is unacceptable behavior.

Jack_Simth

2021-06-07, 05:57 AM

Except that Resurrection and True Resurrection specifically state that they do not affect undead creatures. I like the flavor, but we do have a contradiction in the rules. Generally, specific trumps general. So I guess it's up to the DM.Sort of. Raise dead has:

A creature who has been turned into an undead creature or killed by a death effect can’t be raised by this spell. Constructs, elementals, outsiders, and undead creatures can’t be raised. The spell cannot bring back a creature that has died of old age. while Resurrection has:
You can resurrect someone killed by a death effect or someone who has been turned into an undead creature and then destroyed. You cannot resurrect someone who has died of old age. Constructs, elementals, outsiders, and undead creatures can’t be resurrected. And True Res has:
You can revive someone killed by a death effect or someone who has been turned into an undead creature and then destroyed. This spell can also resurrect elementals or outsiders, but it can’t resurrect constructs or undead creatures.

For me, at least, the intent of the clause is "as what they were" - (True) Resurrection doesn't bring an undead back as it was. It's no longer an undead if you do (the undead type acts as a clarification). True Res, though, can bring back outsiders or elementals - and they come back as outsiders or elementals.

Darg

2021-06-07, 08:57 AM

They aren't well written to be honest. Either way, they have to be destroyed in order to be targeted by the resurrection spells. Undead are not dead as it were.

Vaern

2021-06-07, 09:18 AM

There are Core ways to become immortal. Double-polymorph any object is one of many.

By any chance, is there a compilation thread for ways of achieving immortality? :p

Cygnia

2021-06-07, 09:42 AM

Are there some OOC problems within the group that need to be addressed? 'Cause if your GM allowed your PC to be ganked by the rest of the group WHILE YOU WEREN'T THERE there's some issues that need to be brought to light ASAP before you continue playing here.

MaxiDuRaritry

2021-06-07, 10:48 AM

By any chance, is there a compilation thread for ways of achieving immortality? :phttp://minmaxforum.com/index.php?topic=1179.0
https://rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/122510/how-would-one-go-about-becoming-immortal-without-becoming-a-lich-in-dd-3-5
https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?145990-Ways-to-become-immortal-(3-5)

Remember, that's not all of them, by any means. There are a lot more (such as double-PAO), but a lot of that will require you to start getting creative.