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View Full Version : Permanent reduce & enlarge person spell-like abilities LA? Only 1 size up or down.



eyebreaker7
2021-06-08, 12:39 PM
Would it be to powerful to have the reduce & enlarge person spell-like abilities that you can only use on yourself and it would be permanent until you changed it back? What would you say the LA should be? Originally I was thinking to be able to go up or down to the max size categories but that seems a little to much. Also you can only go ONE step at a time. So you could go from medium to small OR large or from small or large to medium and then the other step if you wanted.
There would be some other racial abilities also. Not sure what yet though except darkvision (also not sure on range).

Bayar
2021-06-08, 01:15 PM
Depends on what other racial abilities you'd have. As written, it'd be an extremely powerful ability on it's own.

Beni-Kujaku
2021-06-08, 05:27 PM
The irda can shapechange at-will into any S to L humanoid‚ gaining their special qualities‚ natural armor and natural weapons. This is extremely strong and almost always much better than what you're proposing. Plus they have a few SLAs‚ all that for LA+2. Only giving reduce/enlarge person at will would probably be a LA+1 template.

Venger
2021-06-08, 05:33 PM
This effect is replicable on any character using the permanency spell which applies no LA. Thus, no LA should be imposed if you want a large human or tiny halfling or whatever.

sreservoir
2021-06-08, 06:09 PM
This is, roughly, the ability to be Large whenever you want, for as long as you want, with while minimizing the disadvantages of being larger than Medium, and being Large generally rates at least LA+1 on that basis alone.

Vaern
2021-06-08, 07:12 PM
This effect is replicable on any character using the permanency spell which applies no LA. Thus, no LA should be imposed if you want a large human or tiny halfling or whatever.
Permanency requires a minimum caster level of 9th and 500 XP to cast, as well as the base spell itself, which would cost a considerable amount of gold for a low-level character. Most tables I've played at rule that no more than a third of your starting wealth can be spent on a single item or service, so the earliest you could reasonably come into play with a permanent enlarge or reduce person effect would be 5th. Assuming you could make both enlarge and reduce permanent at the same time you'd need to be at least 7th level to have the WBL to start with them.
The fact that you can technically achieve a permanent spell effect without a LA doesn't necessarily mean it's appropriate to make that effect a racial trait with no LA, any more than it would be appropriate to give it a +6 LA because they'd have abilities on par with what a 7th level character could afford to start with.
Also note that permanency can be dispelled, while an at-will racial ability can just be re-cast. The proposed power can also be toggled between reduced, enlarged, and normal size, which is not something that can be approximated with permanency and thus makes it much stronger and more versatile than what you can generally expect to find on the market.