College of creation vs Lorehold College hexbard

[Seekergeek]

It's me...again...

So I'm rolling up a new character to replace my poor artificer. Rolls were not bad. 17, 14, 12, 12, 11, 9 before mods. My plan is to go hexblade 1, bard 6 and I'm torn between the college of creation and the new lorehold college from the most recent UA (which is open for use at my table). Thematically they are similar enough that both work for the concept. Essentially it's boiling down, for me, to the Ancient Companion vs the Dancing Object.

I'll be going variant human or custom lineage. Plan is, for combat anyway, to use eldritch blast and use the bonus feat in conjunction with being a first level warlock to pick up agonizing blast. Bonus action will, for much of the time, be used for either pet's bonus attack. That brings me to the first upside to college of creation: you can still command the pet to attack on turns when you used your bonus action to grant bardic inspiration. Conversely, Lorehold gives an extra weapon attack when you use a cantrip so I'd get two EB attacks and a hand crossbow attack or, if in melee, a weapon cantrip attack and a rapier or longsword or whatever attack all with CHA thanks to hex warrior.

The bonus spells from lorehold are really great - especialy spirit guardians if I choose to go the gish route, but ultimately I could pick that up at bard 10 with magical secrets if I really missed it as a creation bard.

What do you guys think? Which subclass do you think you'd play with? Are there creative uses for words of creation that make it better than I can see? Is the THP/Skill boost/extra attack from Lorehold that much better than the expanded bardic inspiration effects from Creation?

I'm stumped.

[quindraco]

The bonus spells from lorehold are really great - especialy spirit guardians if I choose to go the gish route, but ultimately I could pick that up at bard 10 with magical secrets if I really missed it as a creation bard.

What do you guys think? Which subclass do you think you'd play with? Are there creative uses for words of creation that make it better than I can see? Is the THP/Skill boost/extra attack from Lorehold that much better than the expanded bardic inspiration effects from Creation?

I'm stumped.

If you really want to build around having the pet, it has to be Lorehold between the two, since Creation won't let you maintain a pet all day, not without more Warlock levels to let you respawn it every short rest, like the Lorehold pet intrinsically respawns.

[ftafp]

creation bard is typically what i recommend, but whether or not its worth taking depends almost entirely on whether your DM allows you to create material components. Lorehold in contrast is a powerful option, but i have yet to test its capabilities. bear in mind that as UA content it is likely to change, and may not stay available to bards

[Onthewayover]

Do you want to be more or less supportive?

College of Creation is thoroughly a bard subclass. It makes your Bardic Inspiration better for other people. It gives you the opportunity to have just the right item when you need it. And at level 6, it gives you a Dancing Item once per long rest or anytime you use a level 3 spell slot.

On the other hand, College of Lorehold has greater restrictions, but gives you a wider variety of spell selections and combat options. The spell options are less useful for bards, as they don't have the flexibility to prepare spells like wizards so they have to commit to learning a spell. That's one less bard spell you can have. Also, as you said already, bards get Magical Secrets. (Not that the spells aren't good! Just not AS good.) And Lorehold gives you the ability to animate a statue according to 1 of 3 possible builds once per short or long rest.

Comparing the 2 summons, Dancing Item is easier to summon or replace, is a touch tankier, and has that neat movement buff/debuff for better crowd control. As you mentioned, you can use Bardic Inspiration and command it at the same time, keeping up support while tanking. The summon also has a flying speed, so riding your Large flying carpet might be an option (check with your DM). If it dies, just spend another level-3 spell slot and it's reanimated.

On the other hand, the Ancient Companion is more customizable, can heal others, can be healed, gives some good field buffs to soft stats, and has the chance to survive a deathblow and drop to 1hp instead. If you lose it, though, that's it. You can't get it back until you take a short or long rest.

If you take your bard class up to level 14 (unlikely, but one can hope), your options really open up. You can create up to 5 Dancing Items at once (depending on your CHA stat), letting you invite enemies to be your guest (stack -10 feet speed per item until your enemies stop dead), as well as create truly spectacular items to animate if none are available. But Lorehold gives you 2 powerful but limited feature options to choose from.

As far as I can see, Creation is a more supportive tank class made to mesh with bards, whereas Lorehold is a great way to turn any mage into an adaptable spellsword without regard to bard-specific features. I'm biased toward Creation, but either has a place in the right party I think.

[LordShade]

Barring a desire to RP one or the other, I'd go Lorehold precisely because it's UA. I like playtesting things. Moreover, it's a tossup whether people allow UA or not, so if I was at a table that did allow it, I would take the opportunity.

[Seekergeek]

If you take your bard class up to level 14 (unlikely, but one can hope), your options really open up. You can create up to 5 Dancing Items at once (depending on your CHA stat), letting you invite enemies to be your guest (stack -10 feet speed per item until your enemies stop dead), as well as create truly spectacular items to animate if none are available. But Lorehold gives you 2 powerful but limited feature options to choose from.

I did end up settling on creation and it's been great. I took spirit guardians and destructive wave as my magical secrets with no regrets. Of note, while I wish you were correct on the level 14 feature, that applies to performance of creation not animating performance. It's a pretty underwhelming feature, frankly. Unless I'm missing something?