How to bind a summoned undead to you semi permanently?

[Keeganwilson]

Looking to make a strong necromancer, but I don't like the concentration for my main minion, makes me unable to do wizard things.

I think something with magic circle maybe? Thoughts ?

[luuma]

Just set aside a couple slots each day for animate dead or create undead

[Kuulvheysoon]

Now, are you talking general undead, or specifically the creature created by the summon undead spell from TCOE?

If we're talking general undead, there's animate dead.

[Keeganwilson]

Sorry should of specified it's from the Tasha's spell "summon undead"

[luuma]

Yeah I reckon animate dead/create undead should give you all you're looking for

[Keeganwilson]

Yeah I reckon animate dead/create undead should give you all you're looking for

I mean the summons from the Tasha's spell. Sorry should of been more clear

[JackPhoenix]

Animate Dead are permanent, you just need to cast the spell every day to keep them under control. You can't keep the spirit from Summon Undead around. It's a wrong type for Planar Binding, and Command Undead doesn't extend the duration of the spell.

[luuma]

I mean the summons from the Tasha's spell. Sorry should of been more clear

You specifically want to get a summon from the tasha's spell bound to you permanently?? In that case the only option is really to talk with your DM. The spell ends after an hour of concentration, and when the concentration ends, the undead creature vanishes. There's no way to get around concentration, so you can't bind it to you semi permanently in any way. So you and your DM will want to invent something together!

Magic Circle sounds as good an RP reason as any - but do bear in mind that a 2nd level Summon Undead makes something about as good as a Ghast, and, without concentration, that's about as good as a 6th level Create Undead spell!

edit: good suggestion above - I think if you asked to do this with Planar Binding, I'd say sure

[Rentirith]

If you are trying to use Summon Undead as a long term, concentration-free minion, I don't think this will work the way you want. No other spells will extend or otherwise alter the casting of this spell in order to make it into an undead lieutenant for you.

To get an undead spirit specifically in this method, you may see some success with the 9th level spell True Polymorph, if your dm is very permissive. RAW, TP only can create up to a cr 9 creature. Because Undead Spirit doesn't actually have a cr, you'd have to craft a pretty convincing argument to allow this. At a casual glance, using a 9th level spell slot to try to copy Summon Undead and gaining the full benefits of the spell at that level (i.e. a 9th level casting of Summon Undead) would have (before necromancer benefits)

90 hp
20 armor class
4 attacks per round
around a +11 to hit, disregarding potential bonuses
~16 average damage per hit


Going by the Dungeon Master's Workshop for adjusting monsters, that leaves us with a defensive cr of about 5, and an offensive cr of about 12 (someone please correct me if/when you see I'm wrong, this is literally the first time I've tried to calculate cr with these rules). This puts us with a final average cr of...9, rounded up. Huh, I didn't actually think we'd be good there.

Now, keep in mind that since TP is a transmutation spell, you don't get your necromancer bonus without dm fiat, and a dispel magic would be the primary threat against this tactic, but...I mean...If you get to this level, why not?

[Keeganwilson]

Oh I didn't even think of true poly. My dm is the goat so I don't think he'll have an issue with that. Thanks a bunch!

[Kuulvheysoon]

Oh I didn't even think of true poly. My dm is the goat so I don't think he'll have an issue with that. Thanks a bunch!

I mean, if we're talking about 9th level spells anyways, wish is right there and was kinda created for exactly these kinds of situations.

[Keeganwilson]

I mean, if we're talking about 9th level spells anyways, wish is right there and was kinda created for exactly these kinds of situations.

Haha I am very reluctant to ever use wish for not replicating a spell. Mainly because so many people see it as a monkey's paw affect when it's not, my dm would probably be fine with it, but even so the chance of losing the spell still scares me.

[Anymage]

Most good DMs will let you discuss the terms of your wish to bring it back to earth, instead of monkey pawing it as a balance measure. Your character may not be happy with their partial fulfillment, but you as the player can choose what bits you want.

Still, more relevantly, Create Undead can create ghasts or wights when cast from an eighth level slot. Eyeballing them they look about as strong as the undead spirit from a third level casting, maybe even squeezing them in as a seventh option. Your GM can probably let you use the third level version of undead spirit as an option for the spell, adjusting their relevant DCs down appropriately. Having a few will be a bit tight (they'll eat up a high level slot and can get complicated if you miss a daily casting), but it seems like the easiest way to get what you want while staying as close to the rules as you can.

[Kuulvheysoon]

Haha I am very reluctant to ever use wish for not replicating a spell. Mainly because so many people see it as a monkey's paw affect when it's not, my dm would probably be fine with it, but even so the chance of losing the spell still scares me.

Eh, it's closer to the spirit of the rules to use wish over true polymorph for this purpose. If your DM really is as great as you say, they'd probably be more than fine with it.