Has anyone ever run a Plot Points session before?

[Dalinar]

A variant rule in the DMG suggests giving each player one or more "plot points" per session. Players can use them, for instance, to invoke a plot twist ("that bandit captain was actually working with the questgiver!"), create a complication ("opening that door activated a trap that teleported us elsewhere in the dungeon"), or in the most extreme variation, actually take over for the DM.

It's this last variation I'm most interested in. My regular DM and I have been discussing the possibility of setting up a session like this--in our version, a "plot point" is actually an entire encounter that can ideally be splashed into any sort of setting. We'd have everyone roll a character, then each week establish a theme/setting (say, "desert"), have everyone generate a plot point or two for the week (with some guidance on how to make the process as quick and painless as possible, for those who aren't comfortable with it), then run a session where everyone gets a turn to DM their plot point (with the DM's PC sitting out the encounter for any contrived reason, or even no particular reason).

We'd need some ground rules: maybe one short rest mid-session with a long rest between sessions, for example, as well as some way to balance loot, and even out the three pillars a little.

It sounds like a great way to be able to hold a session with a rotating roster, as well as get newer players' feet wet DMing without the weight of an entire session falling on their shoulders.

However, I have seen literally zero discussion of the plot points optional rules in all my time lurking DnD forums, so I don't know what would be best practices for this sort of thing.

Has anyone ever run with the plot points rules? How did it go for you? What does it take to make it "work?"

[PhoenixPhyre]

I've long wanted to run with a variant of Inspiration that basically does that, kinda a mix of Inspiration, Plot Points, and Fate points. Never have, mainly just because I've always been running with new people where I like to keep it pretty stock.

The idea would be:
You start each long rest with an Inspiration point. You can use it to

* Do all the things you can normally do with inspiration (although I use it as a reroll/luck point, not an advantage source)
* Spend it to declare a fact about the scene (effectively declaring an Aspect, but subject to veto by the DM/group, it doesn't cost the point if vetoed)
* Spend it to propose a complication on someone else--if you do so and they accept, they gain the point but agree to have the consequence. Such as (on a natural 1) "he suffers <effect>". This includes the DM--the DM has one point per long rest as well and otherwise acts as a player.

You can gain points by accepting complications or by doing things that the party agrees are "totally cool and/or totally in character", especially if they cause interesting things to happen. At the end of a long rest, any accumulated ones go away and you're back to 1.

Edit: and now I reread the OP and realize they're talking about the full on DM switch version. No, I haven't done that one.

[Dalinar]

Edit: and now I reread the OP and realize they're talking about the full on DM switch version. No, I haven't done that one.

Hey, it's still good feedback! Probably the biggest flaw with DnD and similar games as a vehicle of fun, as far as I can tell, is that the burden of setup falls particularly hard on one person, so finding ways to alleviate that is kinda my goal here. The less extreme plot point variants still sort of do that, by taking some of the improv burden away from the DM and getting the PCs to think about how they can challenge other PCs.

[PhoenixPhyre]

Hey, it's still good feedback! Probably the biggest flaw with DnD and similar games as a vehicle of fun, as far as I can tell, is that the burden of setup falls particularly hard on one person, so finding ways to alleviate that is kinda my goal here. The less extreme plot point variants still sort of do that, by taking some of the improv burden away from the DM and getting the PCs to think about how they can challenge other PCs.

And giving them some points of agency, letting them set themselves (or others) up to be cool.

Personally, I don't mind doing the setup--worldbuilding is fun. But I love when players pitch in ideas that get incorporated into the world. Like when one player asked if his bard could put on a concert and another character decided to improv some special effects.

And I realize that others may struggle a bit with the setup.

[Hairfish]

I don't have a DMG and hadn't seen that option before, but I do something similar in all the games I run. I pass out a token (usually a poker chip) to each player at the start of the campaign, which can be redeemed to introduce one change to the game world - within reasonable limits, of course. I keep track of which players still have tokens at the end of the session and once everyone at the table has redeemed their tokens, I hand them out again.

In my experience, my players tend to use them to spite the other PCs. Off the top of my head, I can remember the "Everyone Steps in a Chamberpot" session and the "All Treasures are Foil-Wrapped Chocolates" session.

[Dalinar]

And giving them some points of agency, letting them set themselves (or others) up to be cool.

Personally, I don't mind doing the setup--worldbuilding is fun. But I love when players pitch in ideas that get incorporated into the world. Like when one player asked if his bard could put on a concert and another character decided to improv some special effects.

And I realize that others may struggle a bit with the setup.

Appreciate the insight! Yeah, some of the coolest things in my current DnD group have been player-driven rather than DM-driven.

Early in the campaign, our DM said "if you're interested in lore, some of the NPCs have campfire stories to tell. I'll write 'em up and post 'em later."

My response (keep in mind I had been playing for maybe 3-4 weeks at this point) was "my character also has a good campfire story, can I write it up?"

And he said "screw it, anyone who writes a campfire story gets some XP" (at the time our XP system was something of a hybrid between classic and milestone XP).

And it's been a tradition ever since that the more backstory-loving players will write short vignettes like that when their characters hit milestones. The other day I finished a story that was roughly four pages long--and some of the other players have gotten even more elaborate. It's probably my favorite thing about this group. We do it even in situations where XP is not a factor sometimes.

But I digress. You're right that a lot of people love DMing. My DM is like that. However, a lot of non-DMs are very nervous about the idea of DMing, myself included, and a lot of newly-formed groups might have trouble deciding who DMs. So part of my goal with this thread is to come up with a low-pressure way to ease people into DMing, as well as giving veteran DMs a chance to be PCs for most of a session. I like the concept, I'm just working through the details.


I don't have a DMG and hadn't seen that option before, but I do something similar in all the games I run. I pass out a token (usually a poker chip) to each player at the start of the campaign, which can be redeemed to introduce one change to the game world - within reasonable limits, of course. I keep track of which players still have tokens at the end of the session and once everyone at the table has redeemed their tokens, I hand them out again.

In my experience, my players tend to use them to spite the other PCs. Off the top of my head, I can remember the "Everyone Steps in a Chamberpot" session and the "All Treasures are Foil-Wrapped Chocolates" session.

Your group sounds like they have quite the sense of humor :smallbiggrin: I'd love to play in a session like that sometime.

[PhoenixPhyre]

slightly off topic of plot points, but on topic of player contributions...

With my current group (online with chat/text via discord and a VTT), I have a dedicated RP channel. It's...super active. Both player-player as well as inter-session "events". I've run whole inter-session sessions via chat.

Things like:
* dreams and visions
* things found in significant journals that have bering on the situation
* social encounters with people relevant to backstories
* players have sparred against each other
* players checking in with characters' loved ones back home (or taunting the lich via sending, that's always a favorite)
* downtime

I also have a song channel, where the party bard has been actually writing songs for the people and campaign (both in and out of character).

One other thing I do is run a living world--every PC and adventuring group leaves its mark for other groups. If I have multiple groups running simultaneously, they're literally in the same world and see the effects of the others. When they retire, they become NPCs that other groups (or later groups of themselves) could meet. They've done things like "start the fantasy UN" and "found a kingdom" and "open up new playable races by discovering things". My first group even blew up the world...it got better (switched from 4e to 5e, so we collaborated on a cataclysmic, world-shaking event they were part of). There's a lot about my world that I only know because the players showed that it had to be that way. And their ideas clicked better than my earlier ideas had.

Player-given pieces of the world are key, in my mind, to having a great group. If the DM's doing all the work, there's something wrong. It feels too much like railroading. The key is that the players mostly act and think in-character--they're not taking author stance (looking at what would make a good story), they're thinking in character stance (what would my character do, what would he know, where is he from, etc).