Ensnaring Grasp, Cantrip (PEACH)

[Saelethil]

Ensnaring Grasp
Conjuration Cantrip
Casting Time: 1 Action
Range: 30 feet
Components: S
Duration: Instantaneous
Classes: Druid, Warlock

You reach out towards a creature within range, sending a spectral claw flying toward them. As the claw grasps the target they must make a Strength saving throw. On a failure the target is pulled 10 feet closer to you and their speed is reduced by 10 feet until the start of your next turn.

When you reach 5th level the spell deals 1d12 slashing damage. This increases to 2d12 when you reach 11th level and 3d12 at 17th.



My initial thought was that it would deal damage from the start but I felt that it would have been too powerful at 1st level. In order for it to scale I gave it damage starting at 5th and thought that d12 wouldn't be outrageous considering that it didn't start with any damage.

Thoughts?

[sandmote]

At 11th level this deals more damage than Thorn Whip, it doesn't have a size limit of the forced movement, and it adds the effect from Ray of Frost. I think its a bit overturned, even with the initial lack of damage.

[Saelethil]

At 11th level this deals more damage than Thorn Whip, it doesn't have a size limit of the forced movement, and it adds the effect from Ray of Frost. I think its a bit overturned, even with the initial lack of damage.

Good catch, for some reason I thought Thorn Whip was d8 which this wouldn't catch up with until 17th. It should definitely have a size limit and maybe drop it down to d8 or d6 damage.
Another thought that just occurred to me is to leave it at no damage but increase the size limit and/or distance moved.

Or a combination of the two:

Ensnaring Grasp
Conjuration Cantrip
Casting Time: 1 Action
Range: 30 feet
Components: S
Duration: Instantaneous
Classes: Druid, Warlock

You reach out towards a creature of medium size or smaller within range, sending a spectral claw flying toward them. As the claw grasps the target they must make a Strength saving throw. On a failure the target takes 1d4 slashing damage, is pulled 5 feet closer to you, and their speed is reduced by 5 feet until the start of your next turn.

When you reach 5th level the spell deals an additional 1d4 damage (2d4 total), you can target large creatures, the target is pulled 10 feet, and their speed is reduced by 10 feet. At 11th level the spell deals an additional 1d4 damage (3d4 total), the target is pulled 15 feet, and their speed is reduced by 15 feet. At 17th level the spell deals an additional 1d4 damage (4d4 total) and you can target huge creatures.

[sandmote]

You reach out towards a creature of medium size or smaller ... On a failure the target takes 1d4 slashing damage, is pulled 5 feet closer to you, and their speed is reduced by 5 feet until the start of your next turn.
What about removing the size limit to target and writing the effect as follows?


On a failed save the target takes 1d4 slashing damage, has its speed reduced by 5 feet, and is pulled 5 feet closer to you. For each size category larger than small the target is the distance it is pulled is reduced by 5 feet (to a minimum of 0).

And then scale the damage and distances normally afterward.

[Saelethil]

What about removing the size limit to target and writing the effect as follows?


On a failed save the target takes 1d4 slashing damage, has its speed reduced by 5 feet, and is pulled 5 feet closer to you. For each size category larger than small the target is the distance it is pulled is reduced by 5 feet (to a minimum of 0).

And then scale the damage and distances normally afterward.

I like that a lot. My only concern is that it is moving away from the simplicity of 5e but that wouldn't be a first for my homebrew so here's the update:

Ensnaring Grasp
Conjuration Cantrip
Casting Time: 1 Action
Range: 30 feet
Components: S
Duration: Instantaneous
Classes: Druid, Warlock

You reach out towards a creature within range, sending a spectral claw flying toward them. As the claw grasps the target they must make a Strength saving throw. On a failed save the target takes 1d4 slashing damage, has its speed reduced by 5 feet until the start of your next turn, and is pulled 5 feet closer to you. For each size category larger than small the target is, the distance it is pulled is reduced by 5 feet (to a minimum of 0).

When you reach 5th level the spell deals an additional 1d4 damage (2d4 total), the target is pulled 10 feet, and their speed is reduced by 10 feet. At 11th level the spell deals an additional 1d4 damage (3d4 total), the target is pulled 15 feet, and their speed is reduced by 15 feet. At 17th level the spell deals an additional 1d4 damage (4d4 total) and the target is pulled 20 feet, and their speed is reduced by 20 feet.

[Foolwise]

Minor fluff notes:

A single spectral claw doesn't seem capable of ensnaring imo. I would change that to "spectral talons."

And the damage should be swapped to piercing instead of slashing. Whether you use claws or talons, if they are going to ensnare their target they will need to sink into the target not cut away at it.

[icefractal]

It feels now a bit underpowered. Low damage, the special effect is situational (especially at lower distances), and at 1st-4th level it doesn't even pull the majority of foes?

This is a Druid / Warlock offensive cantrip, so let's compare it to some other options:
Eldritch Blast - Agonizing Blast makes this special, but even without that it has 4x the range, and does about twice the damage. So those 1-2 squares of pull better be doing a lot of work.
Chill Touch - A better comparison. 4x the range, better damage, and (IME) preventing healing is as good a tactical effect as small amounts of movement, and not limited by size.
Poison Spray - I wouldn't take this one as a Warlock, but as a Druid: better damage, but much lower range and no other effects; a reasonable trade-off with Ensnaring Grasp.
Produce Flame - Close. If being a light source matters then it's better, but if moving foes around matters than Ensnaring Grasp is.
Shillelagh - Better, IMO, but it's melee, so may not be suitable to the character / situation.

And if you're wondering why I'm making a big deal out of range, it's because this spell is tied to having a battle mat (or other precise layout) where having an enemy be 5' closer and 5' slower makes a non-trivial difference.

As a Druid cantrip, giving it better range would immediately give it a niche. As a Warlock cantrip it's a tougher sell. My suggestions (not necessarily to all be applied at once):
* Better range
* Can pull willing targets twice the distance, without the other effects
* Increase the pull distance and make the scaling start from Medium instead of Small

Honestly I'm not even sure how much this needs to do damage, but I guess that lets it serve as a fallback option if you don't have another damaging cantrip.

[JNAProductions]

It feels now a bit underpowered. Low damage, the special effect is situational (especially at lower distances), and at 1st-4th level it doesn't even pull the majority of foes?

This is a Druid / Warlock offensive cantrip, so let's compare it to some other options:
Eldritch Blast - Agonizing Blast makes this special, but even without that it has 4x the range, and does about twice the damage. So those 1-2 squares of pull better be doing a lot of work.
Chill Touch - A better comparison. 4x the range, better damage, and (IME) preventing healing is as good a tactical effect as small amounts of movement, and not limited by size.
Poison Spray - I wouldn't take this one as a Warlock, but as a Druid: better damage, but much lower range and no other effects; a reasonable trade-off with Ensnaring Grasp.
Produce Flame - Close. If being a light source matters then it's better, but if moving foes around matters than Ensnaring Grasp is.
Shillelagh - Better, IMO, but it's melee, so may not be suitable to the character / situation.

And if you're wondering why I'm making a big deal out of range, it's because this spell is tied to having a battle mat (or other precise layout) where having an enemy be 5' closer and 5' slower makes a non-trivial difference.

As a Druid cantrip, giving it better range would immediately give it a niche. As a Warlock cantrip it's a tougher sell. My suggestions (not necessarily to all be applied at once):
* Better range
* Can pull willing targets twice the distance, without the other effects
* Increase the pull distance and make the scaling start from Medium instead of Small

Honestly I'm not even sure how much this needs to do damage, but I guess that lets it serve as a fallback option if you don't have another damaging cantrip.

I think Icefractal has some good points here. With that in mind, my suggestion would be to make it purely movement. Like so:

Ensnaring Grasp
Conjuration Cantrip
Casting Time: One Action
Range: 120'
Components: Somatic
Duration: Instantaneous

You conjure a spectral, clawed hand, dragging the target. One creature within range can choose to make a Strength saving throw. On a failure, or if the save is not attempted, you may move the target up to 10', and may reduce their speed by up to 10'. If the target is Large or larger, this is reduced to 5'.

At Higher Levels
At 5th level, you may move the target up to 20' and reduce their speed by 20'. These are reduced to 10' if the target is Huge or larger.
At 11th level, you may move the target up to 30', and reduce their speed by 30'. These are reduced to 15' if the target is Gargantuan.
At 17th level, you may move the target up to 40', and reduce their speed by 40'. There is no effect based on size anymore.