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View Full Version : D&D 5e/Next Ghost Watcher - Sorcerer Origin (PEACH)



werescythe
2021-09-05, 03:31 PM
I've been working on this sorcerer subclass that is themed around the idea of a sorcerer who can see into the Ethereal realm and serves as kind of an enforcer to ensure that creatures from that plane don't overstep their bonds when interacting with the physical.

Ghost Watcher (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1tHEKcNjhZ59VUQFz1QJuhLGQccz12l8RmBp4Re_k_ik/edit?usp=sharing)

I also wanted to experiment with the extended spell list and try some new things with it. :smallsmile:

Now I will say I have NO IDEA what would be fitting to use for the 18th level ability, so any suggestions are welcome. Maybe something connected to the Dream spell. :smallwink:

Once I'm done with this subclass, I will probably come up with some ethereal creatures as well as some items tied to the Ethereal Plane.

Any constructive feedback on this subclass would be welcome. :smallbiggrin:

sandmote
2021-09-05, 04:35 PM
Whispered Spells are neat, as are the dread/hope effects. Maybe knock off Shadow Magic's Umbral Form as a placeholder for 18th level?

Ghostly Piercing Eyes having to be turned on and off is a bit weird. If its use is unlimited, maybe just make it a passive effect and remove the 1 hour limit? It also doesn't quite seem sufficient for a 1st level sorcerer feature. Maybe add some ability to improve perception checks, or to initiative rolls? Something combat related, basically.

I'm also not sure what the first bullet point for Absorbed Aura actually does, and all benefits granted at 6th level appear to help with social activities. Add resistance to psychic damage, maybe? I'm not sure what else to suggest, but surely there should be some sort of combat benefit from the subclass before 14th level?

werescythe
2021-09-05, 05:22 PM
Ghostly Piercing Eyes having to be turned on and off is a bit weird. If its use is unlimited, maybe just make it a passive effect and remove the 1 hour limit? It also doesn't quite seem sufficient for a 1st level sorcerer feature. Maybe add some ability to improve perception checks, or to initiative rolls? Something combat related, basically.

Yeah, I decided to make it passive (I might need to go back and adjust a few abilities for that). My concern is that since Divination Wizards basically had something similar but at 10th level (The Third Eye) I wasn't sure if the ability might be broken at 1st level. However I did give them something offensive in the same ability now.

Also I've made a slight alteration to Absorb Aura.

I will say I'm wondering if I should maybe swap out the Necrotic damage associated with Dread for Force damage instead.

werescythe
2021-09-06, 09:44 AM
Well, the subclass has been updated with an 18th level ability (that hopefully fits) as well as some items and features to help DMs to use the Ethereal Plane in their setting... Hopefully.

sandmote
2021-09-09, 10:20 PM
Ghostly Piercing Eyes
should grant chill touch as a bonus spell, and probably also let you use it across the boundary of the ethereal plane (which as far as I'm aware isn't the default in 5e)? These would probably be better than the push effect and can probably replace it.

Speaking Through the Veil
Neither "spirits" nor "ethereal creatures" are mechanical terms. I would maybe specify, "undead, as well as creatures on the ethereal plane (if you are on a plane bordering the ethereal) of the nearest plane (if you are on the ethereal plane)." Maybe also specify if you need to share a language?

I would rewrite all there abilities to follow the same format. Although to be honest, none of the listed features feel strong enough to be 1/ long rest, even if there's three.


At 6th level, when you finish a Long Rest and gain either wither your dread or hope spells, you gain one set of the following benefits. You gain the following benefits based on the result of your roll:

You can spend 1 sorcery point to gain resistance to Necrotic damage (for Dread) or Psychic damage (for Hope) for 1 hour.
When you make a melee weapon attack, you deal additional damage equal to 2d8 + your Charisma modifier. The damage is Necrotic (for Dread) or Psychic (for Hope) Once you use this benefit, you cannot use it against until you finish a short rest.
You gain advantage on Charisma (Intimidation) checks (for Dread) or on Charisma (Persuasion) checks (for Hope) . Once you use this feature, you cannot use it again until you finish a short or long rest.
You gain advantage on saving throws against being frightened (for Dread) or charmed (for Hope).



Commenting on the new stuff added:

Brand of the Ethereal Guardian
Given the weakness of Speaking Through the Veil, I'd reduce the cost of refreshing the damage bonus/advantage on check abilities to 1 sorcery point. Just maintain the bonus action time requirement to do that.


thus removing their resistances and turning their immunities into resistances, and their speed is reduced by half for 1 minute (after which they return to the Ethereal Plane) or until they return to the Ethereal Plane. I don't know where this rule is from.

Soul Sight feels like it needs a cantrip added on or something. A half feat just to gain one 2nd level spell seems pretty weak.

You should probably specify converting a Beast to a Spectral Animal changes the creature type to undead.

The Girl in Red should probably deal half damage if you succeed on the saving throw. It should definitely specify how long the speed reduction lasts. Assuming her scream happens the same round the bear attacks (and the bear can be killed), she seems to be CR 3.

werescythe
2021-09-09, 11:34 PM
Ghostly Piercing Eyes
should grant chill touch as a bonus spell, and probably also let you use it across the boundary of the ethereal plane (which as far as I'm aware isn't the default in 5e)? These would probably be better than the push effect and can probably replace it.

I added it to the extended spell list, so it technically already is.


I don't know where this rule is from.

What do you mean?


Soul Sight feels like it needs a cantrip added on or something. A half feat just to gain one 2nd level spell seems pretty weak.

Yeah, I was trying to create a feat like Telekinetic/Telepathic, but I couldn't really think of anything that could fit. I am open to suggestions. :smallwink:


The Girl in Red should probably deal half damage if you succeed on the saving throw. It should definitely specify how long the speed reduction lasts. Assuming her scream happens the same round the bear attacks (and the bear can be killed), she seems to be CR 3.

You right, I think I was writing her up on my phone and I was distracted/forgot. :smallbiggrin:

I don't know too much about CR when it comes to monsters, which was why I didn't put it down.

Thank you for the feedback, you've been very helpful. :smallsmile:

sandmote
2021-09-10, 12:13 AM
I added it to the extended spell list, so it technically already is. Whoops, my bad. I see it now.


What do you mean? As far as I'm aware, creature do not gain any Resistances or Immunities from being on the Ethereal plane. Instead, you cannot target creatures on the other side of planar boundaries, even if you can see them. Therefore it is not clear to me why pushing a creature from one plane onto another would affect Resistances/Immunities.


Yeah, I was trying to create a feat like Telekinetic/Telepathic, but I couldn't really think of anything that could fit. I am open to suggestions. Ah. Uh, I don't have any good ideas either. After tinkering for a few minutes, I managed the following as an addition:



When you are holding an object weighing 10 pounds or less, you can shift it into the ethereal plane as a bonus action. The object remains where it would be if it were in your hand, and you can still carry the object. For the duration, the object cannot be perceived or touched by another creature outside the Ethereal plane. The object returns to your plane of existence when you use a bonus action to return it. If the object is taken from you by a creature on the ethereal plane, you cannot return it. If you let go of an object and it isn't taken by another creature it returns to the material plane at the start of your next turn.
If a creature on the ethereal plane attempts to place an object weighing 10 pounds or less into where your hand is on a plane adjacent to the ethereal, you learn what the object is by touch and and can bring it over to your plane of existence as a bonus action.


Intended uses include: playing fetch with spectral dogs, stealing, protecting items from being stolen, keeping an object from being seen as you throw it, and taking messages between the plane you're on and the ethereal. It feels like it would be abusable in its current state though (but I don't see what the specific abuse would be).


Thank you for the feedback, you've been very helpful. :smallsmile: Glad to hear that. :smallredface:

werescythe
2021-09-11, 02:03 PM
As far as I'm aware, creature do not gain any Resistances or Immunities from being on the Ethereal plane. Instead, you cannot target creatures on the other side of planar boundaries, even if you can see them. Therefore it is not clear to me why pushing a creature from one plane onto another would affect Resistances/Immunities.

I was thinking of it affecting just the base resistances/immunities, with the idea being that the sudden/abrupt expulsion from the Ethereal Plane is causing the debuff. Though I suppose perhaps having the creature become stunned (or make a save to avoid being stunned) instead might make a bit more sense. Just figured it would allow for the sorcerer's party members to be able to interact/defeat the creature easier.

Though, this was just an idea I had for the 18th level ability, there might be something that could be more fitting.


Ah. Uh, I don't have any good ideas either. After tinkering for a few minutes, I managed the following as an addition:



When you are holding an object weighing 10 pounds or less, you can shift it into the ethereal plane as a bonus action. The object remains where it would be if it were in your hand, and you can still carry the object. For the duration, the object cannot be perceived or touched by another creature outside the Ethereal plane. The object returns to your plane of existence when you use a bonus action to return it. If the object is taken from you by a creature on the ethereal plane, you cannot return it. If you let go of an object and it isn't taken by another creature it returns to the material plane at the start of your next turn.
If a creature on the ethereal plane attempts to place an object weighing 10 pounds or less into where your hand is on a plane adjacent to the ethereal, you learn what the object is by touch and and can bring it over to your plane of existence as a bonus action.


Intended uses include: playing fetch with spectral dogs, stealing, protecting items from being stolen, keeping an object from being seen as you throw it, and taking messages between the plane you're on and the ethereal. It feels like it would be abusable in its current state though (but I don't see what the specific abuse would be).

Glad to hear that. :smallredface:

I like it. I'm not too sure how it would fit with the sight aspect of the feat, but I like it. :smallbiggrin:

Speaking of playing fetch, as I've been pondering these ideas and a potential setting concept, I came up with an interesting race idea. The idea is they are humanoid hellhounds (well, maybe not actual hellhounds but you get the idea) that can "shift" to blend in with humans (like a reverse shifter) and they hunt/eat ethereal creatures that have snuck into the Physical Plane.

I've also been experimenting around with the idea of a more witchey feeling Druid circle that eats souls to enhance their spells. :smallsmile:

Perhaps I should make a Gdoc for all the Ethereal content I come up with. :smallbiggrin:

sandmote
2021-09-12, 12:32 AM
I was thinking of it affecting just the base resistances/immunities, with the idea being that the sudden/abrupt expulsion from the Ethereal Plane is causing the debuff. Though I suppose perhaps having the creature become stunned (or make a save to avoid being stunned) instead might make a bit more sense. Just figured it would allow for the sorcerer's party members to be able to interact/defeat the creature easier. Stunning or some other status effect is probably more fitting, especially since monsters immune to being stunned are rarer than monsters without resistances/immunities.


Speaking of playing fetch, as I've been pondering these ideas and a potential setting concept, I came up with an interesting race idea. The idea is they are humanoid hellhounds (well, maybe not actual hellhounds but you get the idea) that can "shift" to blend in with humans (like a reverse shifter) and they hunt/eat ethereal creatures that have snuck into the Physical Plane. Reminds me a lot of barghests, although those disguise themselves and goblinoids to devoir goblinoids. I'm not sure how the diet would work though and I'm not sure the shapeshifting would set the race apart enough (especially given changelings exist). Maybe some sort of race with ribbons allowing it to affect undead in special ways would work better?

In any case, I think a priority for this theme would be to write up some more "ethereal" monsters. I think the main ones from 1st party books are the Ethereal Marauder and Phase Spider, only one of which has a 1st party statblock in 5e. Also found the Ethereal dragon, Ethereal ooze, Thought Eater, Terithran, and Tween after a few minutes spent searching one of the lore sites and this (http://www.mojobob.com/roleplay/monstrousmanual/) 2e site. Presumably also undead with the Incorporeal Movement feature would qualify.


I've also been experimenting around with the idea of a more witchey feeling Druid circle that eats souls to enhance their spells. Sounds like a hybrid of the Collège of Whispers bard and Circle of Spores druid; could be really cool.

werescythe
2021-09-19, 04:34 PM
Well, I made some more updates to the subclass. I probably proceed to releasing my Circle of Soul Eating druid and Barghasi race, than I'll delve into some more ethereal monsters, items and maybe even some spells. :o