Cleric Dips for shield/absorb elements

[Frogreaver]

I'm thinking about a single classed Cleric dipping primarily for shield and absorb elements.

What class would make for the best dip and what level is ideal for this.

I'm thinking Wizard. Take those 2 spells and a slew of rituals including find familiar. Take the nicer non-combat cantrips. Still not sure what level though.

[Asmerv]

I think Divine Soul Sorcerer is good - get Con saves, Shield, Absorb Elements, backpocket Bless and Favored by the Gods in just one level.

[Corey]

Asking what other class should go with a one level dip is feels like finding a button on the street and having a shirt made to go with it.

[Foolwise]

To get Con saves, the player would need to start as a Divine Soul Sorc at 1st level at the cost of the cleric's Wis save. A bit of a tossup imo. Resilient at 4th can give you either save anyway. Going Divine Soul has the added benefit of giving you a 4th cantrip to the wizard's 3. And the only cantrip the wizard has but sorcs do not is Toll the Dead that you can grab as a cleric.

If you want both Shield and Absorb Elements, Sorcerer wins out. If you want Find Familiar, then you are taking Wizard. -edit- I see you still want both and will seek FF as a ritual... then that becomes DM dependant and you really need to discuss this with your DM on how likely scrolls will be available. And the Ritual feat is also an option (I presume since MC ia allowed).

If you go Sorc, then it becomes a matter of which subclass best fits your character. Divine Soul is the obvious choice for a cleric dip. But a Tempest Cleric may find Storm Sorc more fitting, etc. I could see every Sorc except Draconic being useful depending upon your build.

[Greywander]

Asking what other class should go with a one level dip is feels like finding a button on the street and having a shirt made to go with it.
I think it's the other way around. OP is asking about a cleric 19 / something 1, and what something would make for the best dip to get Shield and Absorb Elements.

Wizard is a good one because it gives you access to all 1st level wizard spells, including Find Familiar. Sorcerer can also be pretty good, as you get an extra cantrip and subclass features. Your only other option to get Shield on a 1 level dip is Hexblade warlock, which doesn't seem like it offers as much for a cleric. If you go to 3 levels then Artillerist or Battle Smith artificer, as well as ATs and EKs, can get Shield as well.

[Frogreaver]

Asking what other class should go with a one level dip is feels like finding a button on the street and having a shirt made to go with it.

That wasn't the question though

[Frogreaver]

I think it's the other way around. OP is asking about a cleric 19 / something 1, and what something would make for the best dip to get Shield and Absorb Elements.

Wizard is a good one because it gives you access to all 1st level wizard spells, including Find Familiar. Sorcerer can also be pretty good, as you get an extra cantrip and subclass features. Your only other option to get Shield on a 1 level dip is Hexblade warlock, which doesn't seem like it offers as much for a cleric. If you go to 3 levels then Artillerist or Battle Smith artificer, as well as ATs and EKs, can get Shield as well.

I guess we should mention artificer and druid for absorb elements - but shield is probably the more important of those 2 spells.

[Corey]

That wasn't the question though

Oh, sorry. I misread it!!

Well, the argument for sorcerer includes CON saves, so it would have to be first level.

The argument above for Wizard is a good one. One could go almost entirely utility with a wizard dip -- the spells you cited for reactions, plus rituals, plus utility cantrips. Reasons to sigh about your INT score would be limited mainly to Minor Illusion and the lack of flexibility in adding damaging Wizard cantrips to the good ones Cleric already has.

[Frogreaver]

Oh, sorry. I misread it!!

Well, the argument for sorcerer includes CON saves, so it would have to be first level.

The argument above for Wizard is a good one. One could go almost entirely utility with a wizard dip -- the spells you cited for reactions, plus rituals, plus utility cantrips. Reasons to sigh about your INT score would be limited mainly to Minor Illusion and the lack of flexibility in adding damaging Wizard cantrips to the good ones Cleric already has.

Good points. I think I'm leaning toward the wizard dip. Any suggestions on what level to do the dip? Level 6 or 7 is my first thought. But maybe earlier would be better?

[stoutstien]

Good points. I think I'm leaning toward the wizard dip. Any suggestions on what level to do the dip? Level 6 or 7 is my first thought. But maybe earlier would be better?

Depends more on how often you are using those spell than anything else. Past that maybe once you have some 3-4th lv slots so those 1st level ones start losing relative value.

[Asmerv]

I assumed starting Sorcerer is fine and the character is still in planning stage, since established characters rarely have the luxury to pick from multiple caster dips. It's rare to have 13 Int and 13 Cha on a Cleric.

I do believe Con saves are a much better starter save than Wis. Your Wis save will already be quite decent due to the Ability Score, you'll most likely have Bless on for fights that might require Wis saves, and it's not a save that comes up frequently early on. In contrast you can expect to make many more Con saves, and losing concentration is a big deal because you don't have a lot of spell slots. To each their own.

[RogueJK]

While Wizard rituals are handy (especially Find Familiar), I think Sorcerer wins by a nose. 1 extra cantrip, plus Sorcerer subclass abilities. And as already mentioned, the opportunity for CON save proficiency too if taken at 1st level.

Shadow is enticing for races without Darkvision, plus the CHA save to avoid going unconscious at 0 HP is handy on a frontline class like Cleric that's already proficient in CHA saves.

Clockwork Soul's 1st level Restore Balance ability scales with Proficiency, so doesn't rely on Sorcerer levels.

Divine Soul's Favored by the Gods can save your bacon when you fail an important save or Concentration check.

And don't forget the extra spells for certain Sorcerer subclasses (Divine Soul/Aberrant Mind/Clockwork Soul).

[Frogreaver]

While Wizard rituals are handy (especially Find Familiar), I think Sorcerer wins by a nose. 1 extra cantrip, plus Sorcerer subclass abilities. And as already mentioned, the opportunity for CON save proficiency too if taken at 1st level.

Shadow is enticing for races without Darkvision, plus the CHA save to avoid going unconscious at 0 HP is handy on a frontline class like Cleric that's already proficient in CHA saves.

Clockwork Soul's 1st level Restore Balance ability scales with Proficiency, so doesn't rely on Sorcerer levels.

Divine Soul's Favored by the Gods can save your bacon when you fail an important save or Concentration check.

And don't forget the extra spells for certain Sorcerer subclasses (Divine Soul/Aberrant Mind/Clockwork Soul).

Good call on Favored by the Gods. That does tip things a bit more toward the divine soul sorcerer.

I actually am pretty set on starting cleric for the first level. So the con save proficiency isn't a big deal. I'll just take resilient con at level 4.

In terms of combat power I'd give the divine soul a bit of an edge. Though, Find Familiar is just great all around and the 1 extra 1st level slot on a short rest from arcane recovery will feel great. Perhaps I should variant human and take Magic Initiate and Find Familiar that way. It will drop my con mod (or wisdom mod) by 1 but I think something like this is the way to go.

Allows me to use point buy and have starting stats
Str 9
Dex 14
Con 13 (will boost +1 at level 4 with resilient Con)
Int 10
Wisdom 16
Charisma 13

I'm kind of thinking light cleric for this.

Tier 1 I'll primarily use a mix of burning hands, inflict wounds, Radiance of Dawn and cantrips for offense. I'll Healing Word and shield as needed.

Tier 2 I'll trend toward Spirit Guardians, Radiance of Dawn, Spiritual Weapon. Inflict wounds may still make the occasional comeback. Level 1 slots will be for shield/absorb elements and healing word primarily. Familiar will be less involved in combat at this stage and used more solely in exploration. Favored by the Gods will change to being primarily for failed saves instead of attack rolls.

[Zuras]

Are you looking for a pure dip, or a multi-class? Also, do you have rolled stats or point buy/standard array?

Your main constraint should probably be whether you want to use Int or Cha skills, and if so, go with Wizard or Sorcerer accordingly. If you actually want to be hitting things in melee though, a 3 level multiclass into an Eldritch Knight Fighter won’t require any additional stat investment beyond what you needed for medium or heavy armor, while giving you the Defense fighting style, action surge, plus the spells you’re looking for.

Are you looking at the dip for competence in melee, making yourself impossible to hit by casting spirit guardians, then dodging, and using Shield on the few hits that do get through? Or are you looking at the dip just for a few panic buttons?

[Frogreaver]

Are you looking for a pure dip, or a multi-class? Also, do you have rolled stats or point buy/standard array?

Your main constraint should probably be whether you want to use Int or Cha skills, and if so, go with Wizard or Sorcerer accordingly. If you actually want to be hitting things in melee though, a 3 level multiclass into an Eldritch Knight Fighter won’t require any additional stat investment beyond what you needed for medium or heavy armor, while giving you the Defense fighting style, action surge, plus the spells you’re looking for.

Are you looking at the dip for competence in melee, making yourself impossible to hit by casting spirit guardians, then dodging, and using Shield on the few hits that do get through? Or are you looking at the dip just for a few panic buttons?

I plan to use cantrips not so much melee weapons. Essentially for combat I want to be a blaster cleric that likes to be up close. Shield and absorb elements are to help #1 keep me alive #2 help keep spirit guardians up. I might dodge sometimes but most often i'll be trying to cause damage.

Point Buy for stats.

[5eNeedsDarksun]

I guess we should mention artificer and druid for absorb elements - but shield is probably the more important of those 2 spells.

I was kind of thinking Druid too, just to avoid the MADness. Of course then there's the Armor restriction.

[follacchioso]

One thing to take into account is that you can't cast Shield and Absorb Elements unless you have a free hand, except if you have Warcaster. If you think about it, it makes sense - you can't effectively wield a shield and cast the shield spell, unless you forego wielding a weapon or take a feat.

As a cleric, you need your WIS proficiency as well, so the starting class does not matter much.

One Sorcerer level gives you many cantrips and two spells known. Unfortunately the cantrips will not be very useful for combat as they will be based on CHA, which will probably not be your best stat. The spells known will only be Shield and Absorb Elements, so you won't get much variety apart from these.

You will also get a class feature. There are a few nice combo: Storm Sorcercy combines well with a Tempest Domain, giving you the ability to escape grapples and constraints easily; Divine Soul has a bonus to saves once per rest; and others.


One Wizard level gives you more spells known, which you can change every long rest. Arcane Recovery will give you one spell slot back, once per day. You will get fewer cantrips, but still enough to pick up some utility.

There are some good combos in terms of Wizard Schools, if you decide to invest a second level in the class: Divination is always useful at any level, and War Magic will give you a defensive feature, which is always good on a cleric.


Druids do not get Shield, but two levels in Circle of Stars will grant you a bonus action that you can use to pass most concentration saves, or to have a BA ranged attack based on WIS.



Full clerics do not get access to shield and absorb elements, but by multi classing away you lose access to Divine Intervention, which is a quite powerful feature.


Overall, I would go with Wizard as you get access to rituals and more features, but the other options are good as well.

[Zuras]

Wizard is easily the best option unless you really don’t want to pump Int, since you can ritual cast any first level Wizard spell in your spellbook. Unless you really like the extra Divine Soul features or want to have a strong persuasion for negotiating, I’d say go with Wizard.

[Keravath]

Good call on Favored by the Gods. That does tip things a bit more toward the divine soul sorcerer.

I actually am pretty set on starting cleric for the first level. So the con save proficiency isn't a big deal. I'll just take resilient con at level 4.

In terms of combat power I'd give the divine soul a bit of an edge. Though, Find Familiar is just great all around and the 1 extra 1st level slot on a short rest from arcane recovery will feel great. Perhaps I should variant human and take Magic Initiate and Find Familiar that way. It will drop my con mod (or wisdom mod) by 1 but I think something like this is the way to go.

Allows me to use point buy and have starting stats
Str 9
Dex 14
Con 13 (will boost +1 at level 4 with resilient Con)
Int 10
Wisdom 16
Charisma 13

I'm kind of thinking light cleric for this.

Tier 1 I'll primarily use a mix of burning hands, inflict wounds, Radiance of Dawn and cantrips for offense. I'll Healing Word and shield as needed.

Tier 2 I'll trend toward Spirit Guardians, Radiance of Dawn, Spiritual Weapon. Inflict wounds may still make the occasional comeback. Level 1 slots will be for shield/absorb elements and healing word primarily. Familiar will be less involved in combat at this stage and used more solely in exploration. Favored by the Gods will change to being primarily for failed saves instead of attack rolls.

If you primarily want find familiar then I would tend to lean toward ritual caster over magic initiate. Ritual caster lets you collect all the wizard rituals as you level up and some are very useful - as opposed to magic initiate that gives you one casting/day.

[Corey]

If you primarily want find familiar then I would tend to lean toward ritual caster over magic initiate. Ritual caster lets you collect all the wizard rituals as you level up and some are very useful - as opposed to magic initiate that gives you one casting/day.

Ritual Caster + the Arcana skill should eventually allow you to get all the rituals a Cleric can cast into the spellbook, and hence off the prepared-spells list. At least, that shouldn't cost much gold or time for the Level 1/Level 2 ones.

[Keravath]

Ritual Caster + the Arcana skill should eventually allow you to get all the rituals a Cleric can cast into the spellbook, and hence off the prepared-spells list. At least, that shouldn't cost much gold or time for the Level 1/Level 2 ones.

Unfortunately, the ritual caster feat doesn't work that way. It only allows access to the rituals from one class. You can't use the arcana skill to copy non-class rituals into the book unless a DM allows it as a house rule. (However, a Tome warlock with the appropriate invocation can copy any ritual into their spellbook).

"When you choose this feat, you acquire a ritual book holding two 1st-level spells of your choice. Choose one of the following classes: bard, cleric, druid, sorcerer, warlock, or wizard. You must choose your spells from that class's spell list, and the spells you choose must have the ritual tag. The class you choose also determines your spellcasting ability for these spells: Charisma for bard, sorcerer, or warlock; Wisdom for cleric or druid; or Intelligence for wizard. If you come across a spell in written form, such as a magical spell scroll or a wizard's spellbook, you might be able to add it to your ritual book. The spell must be on the spell list for the class you chose, the spell's level can be no higher than half your level (rounded up), and it must have the ritual tag."

[Corey]

Unfortunately, the ritual caster feat doesn't work that way. It only allows access to the rituals from one class. You can't use the arcana skill to copy non-class rituals into the book unless a DM allows it as a house rule. (However, a Tome warlock with the appropriate invocation can copy any ritual into their spellbook).

"When you choose this feat, you acquire a ritual book holding two 1st-level spells of your choice. Choose one of the following classes: bard, cleric, druid, sorcerer, warlock, or wizard. You must choose your spells from that class's spell list, and the spells you choose must have the ritual tag. The class you choose also determines your spellcasting ability for these spells: Charisma for bard, sorcerer, or warlock; Wisdom for cleric or druid; or Intelligence for wizard. If you come across a spell in written form, such as a magical spell scroll or a wizard's spellbook, you might be able to add it to your ritual book. The spell must be on the spell list for the class you chose, the spell's level can be no higher than half your level (rounded up), and it must have the ritual tag."

That's a fair point. My bad.

You can still get Detect Magic, Augury, Gentle Repose, and Silence into the ritual book, but not Purify Food & Drink or Ceremony.

[Frogreaver]

I like the ritual caster idea. I’m considering that.

I also liked wizard better at the start. But favor of the gods from divine soul just seems to good to pass up.

I like both int and cha skills so either route isn’t an issue.

I suppose I could decide based on if there’s a race I want to play whose stats favor one over the other (no stat moving).

[Foolwise]

Full clerics do not get access to shield and absorb elements, but by multi classing away you lose access to Divine Intervention, which is a quite powerful feature.

Clerics get access to Divine Intervention at level 10, the only thing a multi-classed cleric loses is the automatic success of DI at level 20. Instead they'll have a 10% to 19% chance once a day for a success. If they are persistent in calling upon their diety each day, eventually their god will get fed up and answer them.

[Frogreaver]

Clerics get access to Divine Intervention at level 10, the only thing a multi-classed cleric loses is the automatic success of DI at level 20. Instead they'll have a 10% to 19% chance once a day for a success. If they are persistent in calling upon their diety each day, eventually their god will get fed up and answer them.

Yea, i just don't do the looking at level 20 thing.

Others can optimize for level 20 if they want. I'll optimize for the normally played level range and outperform them every time at the actual table.

[Greywander]

See, this is a good reason why I think every table should use the houserule that allows you to spend epic boons for more class levels (treating the extra levels like a gestalt character does so you stay stuck at 20, I've written up my own set of rules that works pretty well for this). That way, there's no reason to obsess over how your build will look at 20, because (a) the campaign will probably end before then anyway, and (b) if it doesn't, you'll have a chance to "fix" your build by spending epic boons. A single level dip no longer keeps you from getting your capstone, just delays it by 30k XP.

There's basically no downside to doing this, additional class features are almost always less powerful than epic boons, and ultimately the DM controls the flow of XP anyway. If your campaign is spending an extended amount of time at 20, you'll want some kind of progression system anyway.