Help me sell out, GitP. Please.

[jaappleton]

Hello, everyone.

I've been posting on this forum for a few years now, basically since shortly after the official WOTC forums were closed.

I've made some friends here. And met some people whose opinions I've truly come to respect, and met some people I legitimately admire.

I come to you now to ask for your assistance, and with an odd request.

Help me sell out to WOTC.

For quite a long time here on GitP, I've made provided you all with upcoming news and announcements on upcoming D&D products. I very much like to believe that those 'educated guesses' I have made on upcoming announcements and products have been pretty accurate.

And now, I'd very much like to ask you all for a favor. Please.

With each D&D book release, WOTC sends out copies to various influencers, so they can share previews and get people hyped up about the products. Typically people with a large social media presence. And rarely, occasionally, to forums.

I've noticed GitP has been left off that list. And I'm looking to change that.

I don't have much of a social media presence. So I'm asking for your assistance.

If you'd be so kind, I'd like you to respond saying you'd like my name added to the list of people that get advanced copies, so I can share them with you all here. My goal is to get this topic a lot of activity, so I might be able to send it to the proper people (I know who, believe me) at WOTC and maybe get this goal accomplished, and share with you all previews of books (Whatever WOTC is willing to let me share, of course).

I know this is a long shot. And could very well be, ultimately, a futile effort. However, I'd like to shoot my shot, as it were.

I figure its worth a chance.


Disclaimer: I am in no way affiliated or employed with Giant in the Playground, Rich Burlow, Order of the Stick, or Wizards of the Coast or any of its competitors.

[Christew]

If you'd be so kind, I'd like you to respond saying you'd like my name added to the list of people that get advanced copies, so I can share them with you all here.
I, for one, have greatly appreciated your insights.

I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies. For the good of the forum.

[KorvinStarmast]

I figure its worth a chance.


Disclaimer: I am in no way affiliated or employed with Giant in the Playground, Rich Burlow, Order of the Stick, or Wizards of the Coast or any of its competitors. It never hurts to ask. :smallsmile: Give it your best shot. I have, virtually, no on-line presence of the sort that would help you, though. :smallfrown:
(I have a twitter account, but almost never do anything but read and only very rarely respond to something).

[MoiMagnus]

I fully agree and would like jaappleton to be added to the list of D&D influencers.

GitP is the only D&D forum (and in fact the only D&D social media) I visit on a frequent basis, and where I get my D&D news from. This forum would greatly benefits from having an WotC/D&D influencer, and I think jaappleton is the most natural pick.

[Foxhound438]

I think it'd be great. It'd be a lot more fun to see things on here and have a thread discussing it right where the early info originates. Youtube comments and such are just not great for discussions like these boards are.

Plus it'd probably bring more people here to GitP.

[KorvinStarmast]

I fully agree and would like jaappleton to be added to the list of D&D influencers.

GitP is the only D&D forum (and in fact the only D&D social media) I visit on a frequent basis, and where I get my D&D news from. This forum would greatly benefits from having an WotC/D&D influencer, and I think jaappleton is the most natural pick. What he said, since I was wording badly earlier. :smallcool:

[Millstone85]

I too regard GitP as my main source of D&D news, and jaappleton's posts in particular have been most informative and insightful.

Edit: So yes, I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

[Telwar]

I enjoy your sneak preview posts and would greatly appreciate you having the opportunity to do that more in the future by getting pre-release copies!

[Unoriginal]

If you'd be so kind, I'd like you to respond saying you'd like my name added to the list of people that get advanced copies, so I can share them with you all here.

I'd like jaapleton's name added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

[Saelethil]

I, for one, have greatly appreciated your insights.

I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies. For the good of the forum.

I absolutely agree.

[Segev]

I support this motion. For formality's sake:

"I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies."


It may help if you develop a blog of your own, even just something on wordpress, where you collect your posts on these subjects. You could make your forum posts, then copy them to the blog, and link from your signature or from each post to each blog post. This would give you a second touch-point for, hopefully, not too much effort, and make it easier to demonstrate archival evidence of your presence.

A more ambitious and much more time-consuming possibility would be to start a youtube channel of jaappleton's prognostications.

[Sigreid]

I'd suggest you would need the metrics from this board. How many members, how many actively post/read. That sort of thing. Otherwise, we're just a bunch of randos.

[Imbalance]

Are you sure you want to do this? NDA's are tremendous burdens to those who thrive on being in-the-know.

[Ralanr]

"I'd like jaapleton's name added to the list of people that get advanced copies."

It would be nice to get this information off of forums I go to rather than scouring youtube videos.

[MadBear]

I'd like Jaappleton added to the list of people that get advanced copies, so they can share them with us all here

I always appreciate the news you bring.

[Osuniev]

I would very much like jaapleton to be one of those who get advanced copies !

[togapika]

If you'd be so kind, I'd like you to respond saying you'd like my name added to the list of people that get advanced copies, so I can share them with you all here. My goal is to get this topic a lot of activity, so I might be able to send it to the proper people (I know who, believe me) at WOTC and maybe get this goal accomplished, and share with you all previews of books (Whatever WOTC is willing to let me share, of course).


DO IT! PET THAT EEVEE... uh, I mean let Jaappleton continue going on their badass way by giving them sekrits

[nickl_2000]

Sure let's give it a shot. Jaappleton's opinions and predictions certainly have an influence on my knowledge and thoughts about D&D 5e.

[Forevaxp]

I get most of my D&D news from either NerdImmersion or Jaapleton here on the GiantITP forums. In my mind, both are equal in their ability to share leaks and info as well as theories and thoughts about upcoming books. When I share upcoming news with my friends, it’s from Jaapleton or NerdImmersion nearly 100% of the time.

If NerdImmersion is getting the new books early (which he is), then Jaapleton deserves them too, for the benefit of the D&D community on Giantitp

[Seekergeek]

100% add Jappleton to the list of folks who get advanced copies. I actively look out for his posts here and as a few others have said this is my go-to place for dungeons and dragons news and discourse.

Failing that, add me to the list. No one here knows me, likes me, or cares what I have to say but heck if we're out here shooting shots...

[Bobthewizard]

I agree with this! Please add jappleton to the list of people that get advanced copies.

[Keravath]

Sure. I'd support jaappleton to receive advance copies in order to provide reviews and previews on this and any other forum he participates on.

I find that there is a very limited number of D&D dedicated forums. GitP and D&D Beyond are the only ones I read regularly. D&D on Discord is very unstructured and not suitable for targeted conversations. ENWorld isn't sufficiently focused and I honestly don't know if there are any other useful forums to read for D&D content (I haven't run across any so far).

[KorvinStarmast]

I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

That's what I meant all along!

[PhantomSoul]

I don't have much of a media presence, but hang out here tons. I'd definitely support you getting advanced copies -- you'd probably the only way I'd get the hype boosts and sneak previews!

[RickAsWritten]

Response saying you'd like [jaappleton] added to the list of people that get advanced copies, so [jaappleton] can share them with you all here.

[Malaketh]

Please add jappleton to the list of people that get advanced copies. Their insights have been on point and I enjoy reading their posts!

[Kane0]

Absolutely seconded. GitP is my primary source of D&D interaction and jaapleton has my support.

[8wGremlin]

Hello WOTC

Please add jaappleton to be added to the list, I appreciated his insights, and have been playing D&D for well over five decades now.
GitP is the only place I go to get D&D information, and participate in these forums, and I would like to know more about your products and offerings through his insights.

thank you

Grem

[loki_ragnarock]

If you'd be so kind, I'd like you to respond saying you'd like my name added to the list of people that get advanced copies, so I can share them with you all here.

Living the dream, eh?

Okay. WoTC, you have my permission to send this guy advance copies. He's very good at tapping the side of his nose while telling us things. I'm sure he can find a way to talk about your products in a way that tantalizes without technically violating an NDA.

*wink*

[Cicciograna]

I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

Any time I see him starting a new thread, I know I'll be in for some interesting reads.

AND IF YOU DON'T, WOTC... I'm going to cry. In front of all your friends!

[Taevyr]

Trying won't hurt, and your posts consistently both give good information and spark interesting discussions on 5e and D&D in general. Not to mention that the Playground's forum environment is one of the better ones to have these discussions in, in my opinion.


So yeah, "I'd like jaapleton's name added to the list of people that get advanced copies." Very much so.

[RSP]

I'd like jaapleton's name added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

Appreciate all the news we get! Thanks!

[jaappleton]

I'm incredibly touched and grateful for the support. Truly, I wish I had the properly vocabulary to express how much this support means.

[EggKookoo]

I look forward to your posts, jaapleton. Count me in. I'd like jaappleton's name added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

Rock on!

[zinycor]

I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

[Battlebooze]

As I've found his posts useful and interesting, I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

GitP is the primary place I read about 5th edition, so this would be very useful to me.

[jaappleton]

I wanr you all to know I have sent the email to the powers that be.

I sent them this post, as well as a list of my previous posts in the last month which shows engagement and topic views.

At this point, if they even read it is out of my hands... But I think I went as far as I could.

Fingers crossed.

[Zhorn]

If anyone on this forum was to be considered, I'd want it to be jaappleton.

This would have been my response even if a different forum member was after the position.

edit: oh right, key phrase:

"I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies."

[Ogre Mage]

I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

[Marcloure]

WotC really needs to pay more attention to this wonderful forum.

I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

[Oramac]

I'll throw my hat in the ring and say that I'd like to see jaappleton get this opportunity to further help the community.

[Incorrect]

I exclusively get my D&D input from the GitP forum.

[MornShine]

It would be nice to get this information off of forums I go to rather than scouring youtube videos.
This. This so much.

"I'd like jaapleton's name added to the list of people that get advanced copies."

Please, WoTC?

[kingcheesepants]

For whatever it's worth, I would also like Jaappelton to be added to the list of advance copy people. I do most of my D&D news and discussions here and it would be great if we had someone like him telling us what's what. He already does in a limited capacity through his unusual insight but if he could be more official it would be cool.

[Silly Name]

For what it's worth, I also would like to see Jaappelton added to the list of people who get early copies. I know I don't post on the 5e forums a lot, but I do play 5e and read threads here for news and insights in the game, and probably get most of my news from here. Having a post I can read at my own pace and easily scan for relevant quotes is definitely an advantage over getting news from YouTube that I cannot consume at my leisure.

[BeefGood]

I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that receive advance copies.

[NRSASD]

I absolutely agree, jaappleton should be given access to advance copies.

[Argis13]

I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

Let's just hope that Belkar's luck on Listen Checks hasn't become contagious somehow.

[CheddarChampion]

I too would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

[DracoKnight]

Hello, everyone.

I've been posting on this forum for a few years now, basically since shortly after the official WOTC forums were closed.

I've made some friends here. And met some people whose opinions I've truly come to respect, and met some people I legitimately admire.

I come to you now to ask for your assistance, and with an odd request.

Help me sell out to WOTC.

For quite a long time here on GitP, I've made provided you all with upcoming news and announcements on upcoming D&D products. I very much like to believe that those 'educated guesses' I have made on upcoming announcements and products have been pretty accurate.

And now, I'd very much like to ask you all for a favor. Please.

With each D&D book release, WOTC sends out copies to various influencers, so they can share previews and get people hyped up about the products. Typically people with a large social media presence. And rarely, occasionally, to forums.

I've noticed GitP has been left off that list. And I'm looking to change that.

I don't have much of a social media presence. So I'm asking for your assistance.

If you'd be so kind, I'd like you to respond saying you'd like my name added to the list of people that get advanced copies, so I can share them with you all here. My goal is to get this topic a lot of activity, so I might be able to send it to the proper people (I know who, believe me) at WOTC and maybe get this goal accomplished, and share with you all previews of books (Whatever WOTC is willing to let me share, of course).

I know this is a long shot. And could very well be, ultimately, a futile effort. However, I'd like to shoot my shot, as it were.

I figure its worth a chance.


Disclaimer: I am in no way affiliated or employed with Giant in the Playground, Rich Burlow, Order of the Stick, or Wizards of the Coast or any of its competitors.

Heck yeah! Would love to see you get this. That would be incredible dude, and not just cuz I’d get pics from inside the book :smallbiggrin:

[Lupine]

You have my sword,
And my bow,
And my axe!

Keep up the good work, and I hope you sell out successfully.

[rlc]

i've heard at least three people say something about apples keeping doctors away, and going to the doctor is expensive, so i figure a guy like jaappleton with the word "apple" in his name must be trustworthy. i support him as my news source.

[jaappleton]

i've heard at least three people say something about apples keeping doctors away, and going to the doctor is expensive, so i figure a guy like jaappleton with the word "apple" in his name must be trustworthy. i support him as my news source.

CAN'T ARGUE WITH ANY OF THIS LOGIC! Strictly facts! :smallbiggrin:

[Arkhios]

The only internet presence I have, is most likely that most people find me irritating, a nuisance even, only because I speak up my mind instead of trying to butter-up everything.

That said, I do appreciate your insights very much. On the other hand, I despise twitter in general, and don't use facebook that much either, so what I think probably doesn't matter much in the big media. :smallbiggrin:

[Waterdeep Merch]

I choose jaappleton as my bard of choice for the kingdoms of Dungeons & Dragons, and request his name be carried into the hallowed halls of those scions chosen to receive advance copies.

Let's help put you through bard school.

[jjordan]

Hello, everyone.

I've been posting on this forum for a few years now, basically since shortly after the official WOTC forums were closed.

I've made some friends here. And met some people whose opinions I've truly come to respect, and met some people I legitimately admire.

I come to you now to ask for your assistance, and with an odd request.

Help me sell out to WOTC.

For quite a long time here on GitP, I've made provided you all with upcoming news and announcements on upcoming D&D products. I very much like to believe that those 'educated guesses' I have made on upcoming announcements and products have been pretty accurate.

And now, I'd very much like to ask you all for a favor. Please.

With each D&D book release, WOTC sends out copies to various influencers, so they can share previews and get people hyped up about the products. Typically people with a large social media presence. And rarely, occasionally, to forums.

I've noticed GitP has been left off that list. And I'm looking to change that.

I don't have much of a social media presence. So I'm asking for your assistance.

If you'd be so kind, I'd like you to respond saying you'd like my name added to the list of people that get advanced copies, so I can share them with you all here. My goal is to get this topic a lot of activity, so I might be able to send it to the proper people (I know who, believe me) at WOTC and maybe get this goal accomplished, and share with you all previews of books (Whatever WOTC is willing to let me share, of course).

I know this is a long shot. And could very well be, ultimately, a futile effort. However, I'd like to shoot my shot, as it were.

I figure its worth a chance.


Disclaimer: I am in no way affiliated or employed with Giant in the Playground, Rich Burlow, Order of the Stick, or Wizards of the Coast or any of its competitors.
I would very much like for you to be an advance reviewer of the WotC D&D content. You've been very objective in your presentation/critique of new materials and I when I see your name as a thread originator I take a look to see what the latest information is.

Good luck with this.

[strangebloke]

I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

[Luccan]

You're already my first source on a lot of D&D news anyway. You and people like you getting listed and getting advance copies would be incredibly helpful to the community, in my opinion.

[Kurt Kurageous]

It would be foolish of WOTC to not add jaappleton to the list of advance copies as a key influencer.

Really really foolish. Like 4th ed foolish. Like insisting all AL DMs follow RAW as if it was their own sports league and then add a ridiculous amount of rules and player options foolish.

Just add jaapleton, WOTC. Break the pattern.

[thoroughlyS]

I always appreciate the info jaappleton provides in his threads. He is a pillar of this community.

[jaappleton]

I HAVE RECEIVED A RESPONSE

"While we don't really send out review copies to specific forum members, I can put this in front of our community folks to see if they can support you in some way"

.....Before you say anything.

Honestly?

I didn't think I'd get a response at all.

They give copies to Morrus at ENWorld, because he runs the place. If I were the illustrious Mr. Burlow here at GitP, I'd likely receive books, no problem.

I'm just a forum user. Which is an entirely correct and fair thing to say, let's all be honest.

The fact that I got this response makes me hopeful something could be done.

Legitimately, I see some YouTubers getting books and my topic views outweigh their video views. And I showed that data in the email I sent to the person at WOTC.... which, being honest, is why I think I got a response.

So.... I'll keep everyone updated.

And to everyone... Truly. Really. Thank you. Thank you all so much. I wish I had the proper vocabulary to express how kind you've all been.

[Segev]

I HAVE RECEIVED A RESPONSE

"While we don't really send out review copies to specific forum members, I can put this in front of our community folks to see if they can support you in some way"

.....Before you say anything.

Honestly?

I didn't think I'd get a response at all.

They give copies to Morrus at ENWorld, because he runs the place. If I were the illustrious Mr. Burlow here at GitP, I'd likely receive books, no problem.

I'm just a forum user. Which is an entirely correct and fair thing to say, let's all be honest.

The fact that I got this response makes me hopeful something could be done.

Legitimately, I see some YouTubers getting books and my topic views outweigh their video views. And I showed that data in the email I sent to the person at WOTC.... which, being honest, is why I think I got a response.

So.... I'll keep everyone updated.

And to everyone... Truly. Really. Thank you. Thank you all so much. I wish I had the proper vocabulary to express how kind you've all been.
Congratulations/good luck.

I recommend, still, starting a blog (just transcribing your posts to them), or even making short youtube announcement videos, even if all they do is repeat your rumors. It will give you a format that they're used to seeing.

[jaappleton]

Congratulations/good luck.

I recommend, still, starting a blog (just transcribing your posts to them), or even making short youtube announcement videos, even if all they do is repeat your rumors. It will give you a format that they're used to seeing.

I don't disagree.

However. A small peek behind the curtain, as it were:

I have five young boys, with a sixth on the way. From eleven years old down to six months, not counting the bun in the oven. Two of which are special needs, nonverbal Autistic. I work 60 hour weeks, every week. I go to bed at 8:30pm to wake up at 5:30am, except Fridays, which is D&D night.

While I'd love to do more than I do now, I won't have the time to do anything like that for a few years, at least.

If the fine people at WOTC decide to add me to the list of people who get preview copies, they won't be sharing the books with me.

Instead, the books would be shared with this whole community. And that's what I'd love for them to understand. In between meetings at work, or while sitting on the couch holding my son, I can post here and talk about D&D. Share what I know. Happily do AMAs on things, like I did with the Ravnica book when it dropped. I can do this forum. Happily, and with dedication, like I have been for quite awhile now. I'd love to expand upon that further, and take the next step, with this forum. Not with some blog I'd have for appearances sake.

The topics I make here have more engagement that some blog users, YouTubers, and twitter influencers multiple times over. Ideally, that is what I'd love for them to recognize, and it is on that merit that I believe a member of this community should be on the list to receive review copies to share them here. If its me, or Rich Burlow, or a moderator here, or anyone.

And as my topics and posts show... I can find time for topics and posting a little more often than I should during work >_>

[BoutsofInsanity]

I'd like jaapleton's name added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

[Bacon Elemental]

I'd love to see this happen! It might b a long shot, but it's always good to include the old-standing communities in product engagement!

[Segev]

I don't disagree.

However. A small peek behind the curtain, as it were:

I have five young boys, with a sixth on the way. From eleven years old down to six months, not counting the bun in the oven. Two of which are special needs, nonverbal Autistic. I work 60 hour weeks, every week. I go to bed at 8:30pm to wake up at 5:30am, except Fridays, which is D&D night.

While I'd love to do more than I do now, I won't have the time to do anything like that for a few years, at least.

Congratulations on the kiddos, especially the new one on the way. Kids are amazing. :smallbiggrin:

And yeah, also a big time commitment. Best wishes to you and your family.

[Grod_The_Giant]

I'd like jaapleton's name added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

[TigerT20]

I'd like jaapleton's name added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

[Spriteless]

I like GitP forums specifically because there is friction that keeps only people invested in there opinion here. No twiterers or tubers posting in bad faith, hoping for rage engagement.

What I'm saying is, I would like for Jappleton to be added to the people who get advanced copies of these books to build hype.

[Evaar]

It would be useful to have a mechanically proficient perspective on advance books. This is something missing from the broader D&D community as far as I've seen, especially from the player side. That's something this forum, and jaapleton as a representative of this forum, would provide to help the optimization-focused players get interested.

Like honestly, it's pretty slim pickings for mechanically sophisticated takes on material. I've watched many of the various YouTube channels who do optimization/builds/analysis and, with a few exceptions, it ain't great! Not to mention I don't really want to watch a 45 minute video about two subclasses that just repeats watch their features are and adds "Sounds pretty cool, I'd probably play an (insert most obvious race choice) of this!" But setting aside me being a curmudgeon, forum posts are often a superior format to the YouTube video when trying to ascertain the content of an upcoming book and whether it's worth the purchase.

[Brookshw]

I have five young boys, with a sixth on the way.

You poor bastard :smallbiggrin::smalleek: I have half that number and they keep me running around like crazy.

[dafrca]

WotC;

I'd like jaapleton's name added to the list of people that get advanced copies. :smallsmile:

[jaappleton]

I have been informed that, unfortunately, they "aren't going to be able to work something out" regarding preview copies.

Its what I expected. Still very glad that I tried, and truly, I am incredibly thankful to the community for rallying as you all have. Words can't properly express how much that support has meant.

This is quite likely some bitterness and jealousy on my end, however... This is what I don't understand;

There's people with completely defunct blogs that still get preview copies, and they don't blog about it. Just post little tidbits about it on Twitter, getting next to zero engagement. And they get every book.

Here, with you all, that engagement, views and replies are 10x that amount, and I'm told nothing can be worked out.

Its disheartening. And I fully understand, market research dictates that 'influencers' and video are the most consumed formats regarding information, and that same research dictates that forums are a dead format.

To which I say, "Discord is a forum, many regard social media as a cesspool, and video format typically can't be consumed at work or while at home with the kids watching Cocomelon on every TV screen, people still want to consume text"

I asked for a criteria, some goal to shoot for to be considered further. I fully expect that I won't receive a response. Maybe its because I'm just some person on a forum wanting to showcase the books via a 'dead format', maybe they saw my posts and realized I've been giving startlingly accurate 'informed opinions' and they aren't fans of that, who knows? Couldn't tell you, because they won't tell me.

I suppose it is what it is.

.....Not going to stop trying, though.

[Segev]

I have been informed that, unfortunately, they "aren't going to be able to work something out" regarding preview copies.

Its what I expected. Still very glad that I tried, and truly, I am incredibly thankful to the community for rallying as you all have. Words can't properly express how much that support has meant.

This is quite likely some bitterness and jealousy on my end, however... This is what I don't understand;

There's people with completely defunct blogs that still get preview copies, and they don't blog about it. Just post little tidbits about it on Twitter, getting next to zero engagement. And they get every book.

Here, with you all, that engagement, views and replies are 10x that amount, and I'm told nothing can be worked out.

Its disheartening. And I fully understand, market research dictates that 'influencers' and video are the most consumed formats regarding information, and that same research dictates that forums are a dead format.

To which I say, "Discord is a forum, many regard social media as a cesspool, and video format typically can't be consumed at work or while at home with the kids watching Cocomelon on every TV screen, people still want to consume text"

I asked for a criteria, some goal to shoot for to be considered further. I fully expect that I won't receive a response. Maybe its because I'm just some person on a forum wanting to showcase the books via a 'dead format', maybe they saw my posts and realized I've been giving startlingly accurate 'informed opinions' and they aren't fans of that, who knows? Couldn't tell you, because they won't tell me.

I suppose it is what it is.

.....Not going to stop trying, though.

Given this, and noting that you've got no time to make your own videos or the like, you might look into a partner who does have that kind of time. Either somebody already doing this - and thus who has preview copies - whom you could work with, making your posts here with the arrangement that he'll get to use/reference them in his videos. Or blog, or whatever.

Another somewhat-low-extra-effort approach might be just to start a wordpress blog, and copy all of your forum posts you feel are the sort that warrant the preview copies into that blog. You don't even have to go back and put old posts in there if you don't want to; just, whenever you post here and it's the sort of post you think makes your work worthy of preview copies, copy it to that blog. Put a link to your blog in your signature, and, when you post here, link to the same post in your blog. (Might double-check with Roland St. Jude that that's not violating any "no advertising" rules, but I don't think it is.)

Anyway, just trying to offer suggestions. Good luck, sir!

And congratulations, again, on the family and especially the new little one. Any of them old enough to play RPGs with, yet?

[Cicciograna]

jaappleton, if you ever decide to open some kind of blog, Youtube channel, Discord or any other channel of communication with the world, know thee that you have my sword, my bow, my axe and your brother. Count me as one of your subscribers.

[Shadean207]

I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies.

Getting official news from this forum would be an absolute blessing; you have my full support!

[Mud Puppy]

I'd like to see your name added to the list of people that get advanced copies, so you can share them with me here. Heck yeah I would!

[Xervous]

Discord would be my preferred type of communication channel over YouTube or a blog. It’s easier to engage in discussions, it’s easier to preserve, emphasize and search information, and it’s not Brought to You By Raid Shadow Legends.

[Dork_Forge]

I have been informed that, unfortunately, they "aren't going to be able to work something out" regarding preview copies.

Its what I expected. Still very glad that I tried, and truly, I am incredibly thankful to the community for rallying as you all have. Words can't properly express how much that support has meant.

This is quite likely some bitterness and jealousy on my end, however... This is what I don't understand;

There's people with completely defunct blogs that still get preview copies, and they don't blog about it. Just post little tidbits about it on Twitter, getting next to zero engagement. And they get every book.

Here, with you all, that engagement, views and replies are 10x that amount, and I'm told nothing can be worked out.

Its disheartening. And I fully understand, market research dictates that 'influencers' and video are the most consumed formats regarding information, and that same research dictates that forums are a dead format.

To which I say, "Discord is a forum, many regard social media as a cesspool, and video format typically can't be consumed at work or while at home with the kids watching Cocomelon on every TV screen, people still want to consume text"

I asked for a criteria, some goal to shoot for to be considered further. I fully expect that I won't receive a response. Maybe its because I'm just some person on a forum wanting to showcase the books via a 'dead format', maybe they saw my posts and realized I've been giving startlingly accurate 'informed opinions' and they aren't fans of that, who knows? Couldn't tell you, because they won't tell me.

I suppose it is what it is.

.....Not going to stop trying, though.

Sorry you didn't get it, but I understand their decision somewhat:

Whilst some people regard social media as a cesspool, that obviously isn't the mainstream idea, or they'd be much smaller/die off. Just because negative things can happen on the platform doesn't mean that it isn't a massive audience, particularly one those in the industry use frequently. If you don't pay any attention to Twitter, then you're just not learning certain things when they become available, and if you are, then good chance you learned it from someone that doesn't embargo the platform.

I have no idea how forums track theses things, but at the very least YT prevents double views counting from the same viewer, and for all but the largest of channels most views don't actually come from subscribers.

They may not actually care about engagement all that much, but more eyeballs, whilst there's certainly engagement on the forum, that's typically back and forth between users and we're probably one of the most critical audiences they have.

On the whole YT thing: I more often use YT as audio than I do as a visual format, it's in another tab on the side or ripped into an mp3 file, I think you can even use it like that if you pay for the membership they have and some creators offer podcast versions of their content.

For a forum like this to get preview copies, I think there would have to be a very impressive metric, and likely actual association with the forum itself, by and large, those who get previews are some form of business, to make an exception to that would have to be extraordinary.

Separately:

When people get preview copies they tend to get posted and discussed here anyway. That talk is already happening here with no additional cost/risk on WotC's part. I'd also wager that conversation would happen a lot faster than one person being a member here getting a copy, since it's just faster to make video content than transcribe a book, and someone can post about it when they see it, rather than that one person doing it when they have the time.

You've brought valuable information to the forums, but let's be honest, that's because it was information whatever book at the time is out there. It's early access. Do you actually think that getting preview copies would be the same, when you openly state how little free time you have?

[jaappleton]

Sorry you didn't get it, but I understand their decision somewhat:

Whilst some people regard social media as a cesspool, that obviously isn't the mainstream idea, or they'd be much smaller/die off. Just because negative things can happen on the platform doesn't mean that it isn't a massive audience, particularly one those in the industry use frequently. If you don't pay any attention to Twitter, then you're just not learning certain things when they become available, and if you are, then good chance you learned it from someone that doesn't embargo the platform.

I have no idea how forums track theses things, but at the very least YT prevents double views counting from the same viewer, and for all but the largest of channels most views don't actually come from subscribers.

They may not actually care about engagement all that much, but more eyeballs, whilst there's certainly engagement on the forum, that's typically back and forth between users and we're probably one of the most critical audiences they have.

On the whole YT thing: I more often use YT as audio than I do as a visual format, it's in another tab on the side or ripped into an mp3 file, I think you can even use it like that if you pay for the membership they have and some creators offer podcast versions of their content.

For a forum like this to get preview copies, I think there would have to be a very impressive metric, and likely actual association with the forum itself, by and large, those who get previews are some form of business, to make an exception to that would have to be extraordinary.

Separately:

When people get preview copies they tend to get posted and discussed here anyway. That talk is already happening here with no additional cost/risk on WotC's part. I'd also wager that conversation would happen a lot faster than one person being a member here getting a copy, since it's just faster to make video content than transcribe a book, and someone can post about it when they see it, rather than that one person doing it when they have the time.

You've brought valuable information to the forums, but let's be honest, that's because it was information whatever book at the time is out there. It's early access. Do you actually think that getting preview copies would be the same, when you openly state how little free time you have?

I don't take issue with their decision making so much as ask, "Why not?" Why not one more? They already give out 50+ preview copies, between YTers, journalists, bloggers and twitter influencers. I don't see the harm in one more.

While I openly admit to how little free time I have, it was more a comment as to how difficult it'd be to do something regularly. A YT channel or blog that's updated twice a week, or even once a week. How often does a print book release? Think they're up to 1.25 books per quarter now, on average? That sounds approximate.

And FWIW, the information I've brought has seldom been from actual books. Its often from unreleased, unannounced products.

THAT I can certainly see them taking issue with. >_> However, I've no idea if they're even aware of that, and... I don't want to find out.

Though if I must make a choice, I'd much rather continue to get leaks from my various contacts than preview copies of print books.

[Kane0]

Though if I must make a choice, I'd much rather continue to get leaks from my various contacts than preview copies of print books.

And it's much appreciated

[Xervous]

Whilst some people regard social media as a cesspool, that obviously isn't the mainstream idea, or they'd be much smaller/die off. Just because negative things can happen on the platform doesn't mean that it isn't a massive audience, particularly one those in the industry use frequently. If you don't pay any attention to Twitter, then you're just not learning certain things when they become available, and if you are, then good chance you learned it from someone that doesn't embargo the platform.

We’ve got statistical proof it is the cesspool nature that retains people on social media. Inflammatory and sensational content gets more engagement which in turn drives the algorithms.

I mean, just look at how many massive threads Tasha’s Cauldron of Excrement spawned.

[Willie the Duck]

Buncha stuff to unpack, and do so in a nuanced way that won’t cause hard feelings.
First of all, on a personal level, sorry that you didn’t get access to preview copies. I have yet to have met the clear and obvious most brilliant mind of GitP posters, but there is clearly a group of people who definitively ‘put in the work’ and you fit solidly in that camp. If anyone here deserved this, it would be you. Whether anyone here deserves this, man do I have mixed feelings…

Its disheartening. And I fully understand, market research dictates that 'influencers' and video are the most consumed formats regarding information, and that same research dictates that forums are a dead format.
To which I say, "Discord is a forum, many regard social media as a cesspool, and video format typically can't be consumed at work or while at home with the kids watching Cocomelon on every TV screen, people still want to consume text"
This is one of those weird hair-splitting things where one has to decide whether Thing A is also Thing B because they share like traits. Are cable access shows the same as cable network programming? Should ‘movies’ that went straight to streaming be Oscar contenders? Is a blog post entering something into the public record? So on and so forth.
Discord is a forum. Reddit is effectively a huge general-purpose forum. Facebook and Twitter in many ways act very similar to forums. In some ways, they very much are forums, yet in other ways they are what replaced forums. Or perhaps have such a hegemonic relationship with other forums that they become a distinct thing simply with terms of impact, reach or scale.
One thing I think Reddit and Youtube and Facebook have is that they reach a different group of gamers than forums. Possibly those that more closely resemble their customer base as a whole. It doesn’t surprise me that WotC considers that a more fruitful venue, and is limiting their distribution to forumites to people like Morrus (especially since, were they to make an exception for jaappleton, there’d be someone else who would want an explanation as to why they didn’t get one). I think what’s really more surprising is that you say that there are bloggers who get copies moreso than that you don’t, as I think blogs are generally seen as ‘on the way out’ as well as forums.

[jaappleton]

Buncha stuff to unpack, and do so in a nuanced way that won’t cause hard feelings.
First of all, on a personal level, sorry that you didn’t get access to preview copies. I have yet to have met the clear and obvious most brilliant mind of GitP posters, but there is clearly a group of people who definitively ‘put in the work’ and you fit solidly in that camp. If anyone here deserved this, it would be you. Whether anyone here deserves this, man do I have mixed feelings…

This is one of those weird hair-splitting things where one has to decide whether Thing A is also Thing B because they share like traits. Are cable access shows the same as cable network programming? Should ‘movies’ that went straight to streaming be Oscar contenders? Is a blog post entering something into the public record? So on and so forth.
Discord is a forum. Reddit is effectively a huge general-purpose forum. Facebook and Twitter in many ways act very similar to forums. In some ways, they very much are forums, yet in other ways they are what replaced forums. Or perhaps have such a hegemonic relationship with other forums that they become a distinct thing simply with terms of impact, reach or scale.
One thing I think Reddit and Youtube and Facebook have is that they reach a different group of gamers than forums. Possibly those that more closely resemble their customer base as a whole. It doesn’t surprise me that WotC considers that a more fruitful venue, and is limiting their distribution to forumites to people like Morrus (especially since, were they to make an exception for jaappleton, there’d be someone else who would want an explanation as to why they didn’t get one). I think what’s really more surprising is that you say that there are bloggers who get copies moreso than that you don’t, as I think blogs are generally seen as ‘on the way out’ as well as forums.

I consider most non-traditional forum based content (So things like YT, Facebook, Twitter, etc) as "algorithm driven", to where it actively collects your data in an attempt to feed you new posts/videos/etc.

Traditional, 'old school' forums like GITP (Not even Reddit qualifies here, because that's algorithm driven) have the user seek out those new posts / topics.

And, for better or worse... Everything needs to 'feed the algorithm'.

Maybe this is a bit too much 'old man yells at cloud', but I'd rather not feed the algorithm, personally. I like what I like, and I don't need it crammed down my eye sockets with every link I click. I'd rather get to that new, undiscovered, similar content at my leisure.

[Dork_Forge]

I don't take issue with their decision making so much as ask, "Why not?" Why not one more? They already give out 50+ preview copies, between YTers, journalists, bloggers and twitter influencers. I don't see the harm in one more.

You don't see the harm in one more, because you're the one applying for it. I sincerely doubt you're the only person wanting preview copies and the more people that get access to preview copies the stronger the case of the remaining voices become.

And if you want a more cynical answer: It's a very real, ongoing business expense for them to hand over free copies and cover shipping. There is no evidence that you, or anyone here, having preview copies would sell more books, especially when preview content from YTers achieves the same thing: making threads that get engaged with.


While I openly admit to how little free time I have, it was more a comment as to how difficult it'd be to do something regularly. A YT channel or blog that's updated twice a week, or even once a week. How often does a print book release? Think they're up to 1.25 books per quarter now, on average? That sounds approximate.

Witchlight came out in September

Fizban's came out in October

Strixhaven will be early December

the boxset with the new Mordenkainen book will be early January

It doesn't matter what it averages to, that's pretty much a book a month right now.

I don't mean this harshly, I make my living right now writing D&D content and covering new releases has become a part of that. Just reading a book cover to cover and actually absorbing it is very, very time-consuming. Relaying or making meaningful content out of that is even more so.


And FWIW, the information I've brought has seldom been from actual books. Its often from unreleased, unannounced products.

...my point was that you give info from books before they're out, renaming it as unannounced products is the same thing. You get snippets and rumours whilst they're still in development stages.

My point was do you really think you'd be able to make timely posts that have the same amount of engagement when it's on preview books instead of unannounced? Because as soon as you get access it basically becomes a race between you doing that and someone posting a YT video here that covers it.


THAT I can certainly see them taking issue with. >_> However, I've no idea if they're even aware of that, and... I don't want to find out.

You very openly declare that you get these things and that you get them from staff members.

If didn't want the company at large knowing that, then I have no idea why you would apply for preview books and then point them to where you release that information and make those statements.


Though if I must make a choice, I'd much rather continue to get leaks from my various contacts than preview copies of print books.

And that's of much more value to the forum than 'just one more' person getting preview copies.

As long as no forum gets preview copies, they have no reason to justify their decision to anyone, just say 'we don't give forums copies' but the moment that dam breaks it becomes harder.


We’ve got statistical proof it is the cesspool nature that retains people on social media. Inflammatory and sensational content gets more engagement which in turn drives the algorithms.

I mean, just look at how many massive threads Tasha’s Cauldron of Excrement spawned.

Not touching this with a +3 ten ft pole.

[jaappleton]

You very openly declare that you get these things and that you get them from staff members.

Forge,

You've made some quite good points in that post. I hadn't realized how many books had come out recently, since I typically just focus on player options.

But I wanted to address this quoted point specifically:

I've never, not once, actually told the truth about where I get my information from.

I think you completely understand why.

[rlc]

Jaappleton is actually a traveler from the d&d multiverse

[KorvinStarmast]

jaappleton, if you ever decide to open some kind of blog, Youtube channel, Discord or any other channel of communication with the world, know thee that you have my sword, my bow, my axe and your brother.
And you have my keyboard. (But with six kids, maybe starting a blog isn't the greatest idea ever. not sure how you budget your time, but that's a handful right there! :smallsmile:

I mean, just look at how many massive threads Tasha’s Cauldron of Excrement spawned. On the mechanical side, it had a few neat additions. I am hoping to play a Watcher Oath Paladin soon ... in a game world where things dribbling in from other planes is a commonplace.

[KOLE]

Coming out of retirement to add my name to the list. I've always really appreciated your contributions to this forum.

EDIT: Well, I should have probably read the rest of the thread before coming out of retirement. Sorry Jaapleton. But I do mean it, you're a solid human being and I appreciate what you do around here. I mostly lurk, but what you and the other crew of regulars do around here is always noticed and appreciated. Keep your chin up.

[Phhase]

Blast. Uptight damned Wizards can't be arsed to curate their media preview distributions, can they? Well, here's to hope, good on ya for the effort JA.

[Quietus]

I consider most non-traditional forum based content (So things like YT, Facebook, Twitter, etc) as "algorithm driven", to where it actively collects your data in an attempt to feed you new posts/videos/etc.

Traditional, 'old school' forums like GITP (Not even Reddit qualifies here, because that's algorithm driven) have the user seek out those new posts / topics.

And, for better or worse... Everything needs to 'feed the algorithm'.

Maybe this is a bit too much 'old man yells at cloud', but I'd rather not feed the algorithm, personally. I like what I like, and I don't need it crammed down my eye sockets with every link I click. I'd rather get to that new, undiscovered, similar content at my leisure.

I would wager the algorithm is exactly why they're reticient to engage with a forum poster, unfortunately. We know that there are ways to track the chain of contact through the big channels of Youtube, Reddit, Discord, Tiktok, all that nonsense. I suspect that's more difficult to do within the realm of old school forums such as this?

[strangebloke]

I would wager the algorithm is exactly why they're reticient to engage with a forum poster, unfortunately. We know that there are ways to track the chain of contact through the big channels of Youtube, Reddit, Discord, Tiktok, all that nonsense. I suspect that's more difficult to do within the realm of old school forums such as this?

I think there's more a sense of Twitter being able to generate hype by way of getting on trending and bringing new people in.

I think this is short sighted because message boards tend to be used (at least ime) by diehard hobbyists who are very important to their local scene

[Blood of Gaea]

It would be quite nifty to have you on the list, support from me.

[Dork_Forge]

I think this is short sighted because message boards tend to be used (at least ime) by diehard hobbyists who are very important to their local scene

It's important to realise though that diehards make up the minority, a small minority, of the actual audience. Casual players aren't as fussy and are most of the pie.

There's also the point that you don't need to give anything to forumers for there to be discussion. We already have threads on new material that comes from influencers getting previews. Giving a forum preview copies wouldn't generate new conversations, just duplicates if anything.

The value of forums time isn't hype or sales, the game is far too big for that now to be a real goal, but going to the people of the forums can be a very useful mechanical tool imo

[nickl_2000]

I think there's more a sense of Twitter being able to generate hype by way of getting on trending and bringing new people in.

I think this is short sighted because message boards tend to be used (at least ime) by diehard hobbyists who are very important to their local scene

The thing is, diehards like us that are participating in forums will search out other sources if we want to know about a book coming out.

Something like Twitter or YouTube is more likely to pull in someone who is more of a casual fan.

The truth is, they really don't need to sell to us that are here, we will make up our own mind without influencers.

[Willie the Duck]

I consider most non-traditional forum based content (So things like YT, Facebook, Twitter, etc) as "algorithm driven", to where it actively collects your data in an attempt to feed you new posts/videos/etc.
Traditional, 'old school' forums like GITP (Not even Reddit qualifies here, because that's algorithm driven) have the user seek out those new posts / topics.
And, for better or worse... Everything needs to 'feed the algorithm'.
Maybe this is a bit too much 'old man yells at cloud', but I'd rather not feed the algorithm, personally. I like what I like, and I don't need it crammed down my eye sockets with every link I click. I'd rather get to that new, undiscovered, similar content at my leisure.

I have absolutely nothing against this response. I even agree with most of your reasoning. I’m simply trying to establish why I think WotC would not go to the effort (and it would be effort, and risk, as minor as they are) to do so.

My main point is… sigh, okay, I’m going to try to thread a needle here, and there’s the potential that it come off as insulting to the people here (and saying, “self included!” rarely helps). Hopefully I will do this right. Anyways, with a show of hands, how many people fit (at least mostly) the following description?: --

Middle-aged overcompensated and underchallenged STEM- or STEM-adjacent white-collar professional
Was ‘a very bright young <pronoun>’ in high school who was in debate, math league, national honors society, etc.
Got a bunch of perfect, near-perfect, or just really high (for the open ended ones) SAT, ACT, AP, IB, IQ, and or non-US equivalent scores, of which you may be a little over-proud
Regardless, whatever your own threshold for ‘having made it (intellectually)’ (be that top 10%, 1%, .1%, etc.), you were either at (or maybe just below) that threshold. Possibly also kinda bemoan how adult life doesn’t shower accolades on one quite so much simply for ‘being smart.’
Were in fencing and/or martial arts at one point (maybe even a power lifter too, to not be the stereotypical skinny or chunky nerd), watch Youtubers like Scholagladatoria, Todd’s workshop, Metatron, etc., and have very strong opinions on sword vs. spear, longbow vs. plate (and how much Agincourt proves one or the other position or not), anything katana-related, existence of studded leather, weapon/armor naming conventions in D&D, or similar.
Fascination with premodern civilizations as a whole and probably have ‘favorites’ or ‘my team’ (in a sports team-like way) amongst not just specific weapons and armors, but civilizations (Mongols, Spartans, Scottish highlanders, ____-dynasty China, etc.).
Read the Silmarillion and have very strong opinions on all things Tolkien, books vs. movies, etc. Love to jump into discussions on the matter and kinda vaguely assume that you’re going to be the subject matter expert in the discussion (despite some realization that maybe half+ of the board has the exact same experience).
Similar fervor and strong opinions on one or more of: Star Wars, Star Trek, Marvel or DC comics, or anime&manga (especially if you have strong opinions on dubbed vs. subtitles).
Have played many-to-most editions of D&D, along with several non-D&D tabletop RPGs. Can have a long-winded conversation about how edition X does A better and B worse, and non-D&D game alpha does C better than any of them (but is too crunchy or lite for your current group, that’s why you’re playing D&D).

Sound familiar? Congratulations, you might be an old-guard forumite. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with any of the above. 75-90% of my department fits 75-90% of these criteria. Point is that this is a demographic that I believe WotC considers very much to be a known entity. One that is a decreasing portion of the overall fanbase*, but (I think) much more importantly one they are probably correct in assuming already will be seeking out D&D information and whose opinions on new D&D material they have no power to influence. Giving a review copy to someone in this venue probably has very little power to influence sales – most of us already know if we’re up for more expansions to 5e or not. Giving one to a FB or Reddit or Youtube reviewer is much more likely to influence someone who is on the fence about such a purchase**.
*mostly because other groups have grown rapidly with the 5e success, along with a bit of old-schooler burnout or actual die-off
**In part because more of their audience are less fervent/established RPG fans who might consider TTRPGs a ‘hobby I’m willing to invest $___ into, but I don’t know about more’ type thing, in part because people outside our demographic are more likely to be teens or young-adults with smaller petty cash allotments

That’s why, although I definitely think you, if anybody here, should be the kind to get a review copy, I’m really not sure I think anyone here should (from a pure sales/marketing standpoint, which I think is the reason for review copies to exist).

[Joe the Rat]

The thing is, diehards like us that are participating in forums will search out other sources if we want to know about a book coming out.

Something like Twitter or YouTube is more likely to pull in someone who is more of a casual fan.

The truth is, they really don't need to sell to us that are here, we will make up our own mind without influencers.

We'll make up our own minds in spite of influencers. Besides jaappleton. He's solid.

[Xervous]

We'll make up our own minds in spite of influencers. Besides jaappleton. He's solid.

Is distrust/dislike of influencers a common thing on this board?

[jaappleton]

We'll make up our own minds in spite of influencers. Besides jaappleton. He's solid.

I'm an influencer? No need to insult me!

Sincerely, though, everybody is correct. We're here on this forum already actively engaging in discussion.

They already have our attention. They already have our curiosity.

There's (unfortunately) little reason for them to give someone like me a book. We're already deep into the hobby.

[Rafaelfras]

I would like jaappleton to be added to the list of people that get advanced copies. For the good of the forum

[nickl_2000]

Is distrust/dislike of influencers a common thing on this board?

I think it's a common thing in general. It's either someone follows them or little middle ground.

[strangebloke]

I'm an influencer? No need to insult me!

Sincerely, though, everybody is correct. We're here on this forum already actively engaging in discussion.

They already have our attention. They already have our curiosity.

There's (unfortunately) little reason for them to give someone like me a book. We're already deep into the hobby.

Don't completely agree. I don't think anyone here is going to stop playing TTRPGS, but a lot of us don't buy (or follow) every release. Some of us are probably at least considering switching systems. Generating more discussion by sending out a preview copy to a few forum members makes sense imo.

[Dork_Forge]

Don't completely agree. I don't think anyone here is going to stop playing TTRPGS, but a lot of us don't buy (or follow) every release. Some of us are probably at least considering switching systems. Generating more discussion by sending out a preview copy to a few forum members makes sense imo.

But the question is, will it generate more discussion when that discussion is already being had here? What difference does it ultimately make to the conversation if the source of information is YT videos, blogs etc. vs someone from here posting it? The threads still get made, the discussion still happens and WotC takes no additional risk or expense.

It would be different if the site had articles/reviews where something could be published that might draw offsite traffic in, but it's just not that kind of place.

[Pixel_Kitsune]

Your insights have been incredibly solid and I would love to be able to see more straight thoughts and reflections on products being offered. WotC should definitely include you on advance copies.

[jaappleton]

But the question is, will it generate more discussion when that discussion is already being had here? What difference does it ultimately make to the conversation if the source of information is YT videos, blogs etc. vs someone from here posting it? The threads still get made, the discussion still happens and WotC takes no additional risk or expense.

It would be different if the site had articles/reviews where something could be published that might draw offsite traffic in, but it's just not that kind of place.

Bi-weekly columns by forum members discussing the latest in TRRPG news?
<blue text>
Quickly everyone, to Rich Burlow!
<blue text>

.....but seriously that's a decent idea. But don't bug Rich, the man is incredibly busy.

[strangebloke]

But the question is, will it generate more discussion when that discussion is already being had here? What difference does it ultimately make to the conversation if the source of information is YT videos, blogs etc. vs someone from here posting it? The threads still get made, the discussion still happens and WotC takes no additional risk or expense.

It would be different if the site had articles/reviews where something could be published that might draw offsite traffic in, but it's just not that kind of place.

If that's the question, the answer is obvious: Jaapleton generates a lot of discussion about new content on this site, and would presumably generate a lot more if he had preview copies.

That's the whole point of this thread. Like if this forum is irrelevant for purposes of generating discussion, then why has this thread gotten to 7 pages, mostly based on us wishing Jaapleton success?

Also! The site does draw in traffic. Constantly. If you google guides for optimization, this site is usually in the top 3 results along with EnWorld. Furthermore, it may surprise you to know but there's actually a reasonably well-known webcomic attached to this forum!

And, completely aside from all this, the point is that forums in general have value, not just Giantitp. Geek and Sundry Forums, Enworld, etc.

[Kane0]

My main point is… sigh, okay, I’m going to try to thread a needle here, and there’s the potential that it come off as insulting to the people here (and saying, “self included!” rarely helps). Hopefully I will do this right. Anyways, with a show of hands, how many people fit (at least mostly) the following description?: --

-Snip-


Ugh, only got 3 points.

[EggKookoo]

Ugh, only got 3 points.

Yeah, I don't score super high on this one either.

[jaappleton]

FWIW I got one point on Willie's scale.

[Willie the Duck]

FWIW I got one point on Willie's scale.

I think what that's worth is that people can probably now psychoanalyze what Willie free associates with his fellow gamers more than anything else (and honestly in retrospect that list more closely resembles my office team than this board). My larger point is that I believe we are, by and large, not representative of the general WotC customer, being both more TTRPG-aware to begin with and more dedicated to the hobby as a major one in our lives (whereas my understanding of much of the 5e boom is casually invested individuals, who might spring for another book, or instead pick up a new board game or similar). Also that reaching us doesn't necessarily reach beyond the confines of the board (whose actual size is not clear to me, but the number of people actively posting in the 5e section does not seem huge in relation to WotC's sales figures), whereas doing so on the current in-vogue forums of the algorithmed social media probably generates 'chatter.' If they send a copy to the Nerd Immersion guy, it reaches his viewers, plus whomever they are talking to in their social media musings. If they do so to someone here, I'm less sure it benefits them (or more importantly, I'm less sure it is obvious to them that it benefits them).

Regardless, this is all in the margins. The individual books (plus the you-then-not-buying-one) are trivial. I think the biggest thing is that they don't want to pay part of a FTE for someone tasked with figuring all this out, making sure the person of influence actually is influencial, making sure they don't accedentally amplify any more toxic personalities or self-promoters or axe-grinders, and so forth.

[strangebloke]

FWIW I got one point on Willie's scale.

I got 6

get on my level, nerd.

Though I think the "constantly obsessed with pride felt in childhood" is more of a generally common thing, as is "having strong opinions on Star Wars/LotR." I know lots of 'normies' who have strong opinions on these things.

[Dork_Forge]

Only 1 point, I'll never get into the Grognard academy with these results!


Bi-weekly columns by forum members discussing the latest in TRRPG news?
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Quickly everyone, to Rich Burlow!
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.....but seriously that's a decent idea. But don't bug Rich, the man is incredibly busy.

The point is that this is not generally just not the kind of site that gives worthwhile promotion or new eyeball traffic to content.


If that's the question, the answer is obvious: Jaapleton generates a lot of discussion about new content on this site, and would presumably generate a lot more if he had preview copies.

Generally they generate discussion based around tips and leaks essentially, which is a different kettle of knuckle-headed trout entirely from preview copies. We get preview copy threads already from various sources, the discussions are already being had, how much more, if any, discussion would be raised vs what we already get?


That's the whole point of this thread. Like if this forum is irrelevant for purposes of generating discussion, then why has this thread gotten to 7 pages, mostly based on us wishing Jaapleton success?

That's not the same. You can discuss things on the forum until you turn blue in the face... and we do that, daily.

That is not the same as generating productive (read: lucrative) discussion around a new product. If anything the type of discussion we have here leads to a lot more negative tone than the casual player would see on their own, like how x got nerfed from UA or how Y is broken in Z way.


Also! The site does draw in traffic. Constantly. If you google guides for optimization, this site is usually in the top 3 results along with EnWorld. Furthermore, it may surprise you to know but there's actually a reasonably well-known webcomic attached to this forum!

I'd strongly argue that you're googling forum words and most new players would search something along the lines of 'how to play x' and a lot would probably watch a video.

And whilst there's a comic here, finding the comic does absolutely nothing to point you to this specific subforum.

I also wouldn't say that a comic based on 3.5 was a strong selling point for drawing in 5e players, I was a member here for over a year before I even looked at it. And by the time I was lurking here I was already too deep into the game to be considered a casual player.


And, completely aside from all this, the point is that forums in general have value, not just Giantitp. Geek and Sundry Forums, Enworld, etc.

Value in general yes, value for promoting new content... eh

Enworld is a TTRPG news site as well as a forum, I've gone to the forum maybe three times ever, but check the news page most days. Besides news they do product reviews and other articles, there's even a 5e release tracker on the side of the site.

That's a light year of different from gitp.

I don't mean to be a downer, you know I spend a lot of time here and enjoy the forums, but realistically I just don't think handing over free books here is worth anything to WotC.

If they ever do another setting competition, that's the kind of thing that forums would excel at.

[strangebloke]

Generally they generate discussion based around tips and leaks essentially, which is a different kettle of knuckle-headed trout entirely from preview copies. We get preview copy threads already from various sources, the discussions are already being had, how much more, if any, discussion would be raised vs what we already get?


I think that if Jaapleton were to create a "I have a preview copy, AMA" thread, it would create a pretty large discussion. Because lots of us don't watch youtube or really follow new releases that closely. I literally bought fizban's because of a thread Jaapleton made about stuff revealed in preview video, I had no idea it was already in the works because I'd been out of the loop for a bit.

[Xervous]

Strict reading I’m only getting 3 points. 4 if I actually find the time to read more Tolkien. YouTube is for repair and maintenance videos. Standardized testing felt increasingly meaningless. Praise was shoveled around too much for my liking to the point I skipped every possible ceremony and in high school. Community service was just code for unpaid minor labor.

I think too much to be in WotC’s target audience, I don’t need their products to achieve the D&D(TM) experience. They’ve got plenty of proof there’s a big crowd out there eager to consume anything with the D&D label so why should they try so hard to court my wallet?

[jaappleton]

Forge is spot on.

And no offense, Forge, but... I wish you weren't. It's one of those things that's a bit bittersweet, where I want you to be incorrect in your analysis because it helps what I'm trying to accomplish.

Simultaneously, the facts are the facts.

I'm still going to keep trying. I mean, what are they going to do? Continue to say no? Literally I can only go up from this. Maybe, eventually, I'll wear them down. Maybe. Probably not.

-----

Strangebloke,

I did do an AMA on the Ravnica book the day it was released, it's around here somewhere. Maybe I'll do more of those, schedule permitting, as the books release. Strixhaven is next, right? I'll probably do one for that.

[Sigreid]

Forge is spot on.

And no offense, Forge, but... I wish you weren't. It's one of those things that's a bit bittersweet, where I want you to be incorrect in your analysis because it helps what I'm trying to accomplish.

Simultaneously, the facts are the facts.

I'm still going to keep trying. I mean, what are they going to do? Continue to say no? Literally I can only go up from this. Maybe, eventually, I'll wear them down. Maybe. Probably not.

-----

Strangebloke,

I did do an AMA on the Ravnica book the day it was released, it's around here somewhere. Maybe I'll do more of those, schedule permitting, as the books release. Strixhaven is next, right? I'll probably do one for that.

You could always start a YouTube channel focused on 5e.

[strangebloke]

You could always start a YouTube channel focused on 5e.

He doesn't have time, its come up.

[Sigreid]

He doesn't have time, its come up.

Friends, Family, Religion, Showering! These are the 4 demons you must slay to become a YouTube Influencer and get your advanced copies!