reincarnation questions

[rediridesence]

hypothetical question: if a player was playing a centaur in 3.5, died, and then received a reincarnation spell, which brought him back as an elf what would happen with its racial hitdice, and the skill points that came with it?

-->the centaur in question has 2 levels in barbarian, in addition to his racial hitdice & LA.

-->elves have no LA and racial hitdice.

so what happens to the extra hitdice and LA (and the skill points that were tied to the racial hitdice) since they are no longer that race?

[Beni-Kujaku]

The races given in the spell are supposed to be only for humanoids. A monstrous humanoid would reincarnate as a monstrous humanoid. Obviously no RAW about what you ask, WotC never understood people could actually play anything else than a PHB humanoid, but what I'd do is keep the Monstrous Humanoid HD and simply change the LA. If he reincarnates as a kuo-toa (LA+3), it would be a kuo-toa with 4 RHD, but would not gain a level next time the party gains a level, to account for the higher LA of the kuo-toa. If he reincarnates as a LA 0, he would quickly gain 2 levels during the next two battles.

[Murg]

but what I'd do is keep the Monstrous Humanoid HD and simply change the LA.


I agree. The official table given is for humanoids, but centaurs are monstrous humanoids.

A centaur with 4 racial HD, LA+2, and 2 levels of barbarian is effective character level 8.

If they were reincarnated as an elf they'd be essentially unplayable in that campaign, due to their much lower ECL.

Reincarnate is a problematic, poorly written spell. To simplify things it would be best to, as the previous poster stated, start looking at monsters that will give you a similar ECL to what you started with.

[rediridesence]

ok, those are suggestions, but what would happen to the RHD and LA(and thus also skill points) of the entity in question that got shifted? (assume RAW) does it all just disappear?

[ShurikVch]

While not, exactly, about reincarnation - this quote from Savage Species may be relevant:

Example: Ritual Transformation that Decreases ECL
A 6th-level ogre barbarian (ECL 12) tires of the prejudices against his kind and decides to transform into an elf. A basic elf has an ECL of 1, so the minimum costs apply for all ritual transformations. A ritual of unlearning would require him to sacrifice one level. It would only take one day, and a 7th-level caster could perform it. The cost would be a mere 7,000 gp. At the end of the ritual, he would be a 5th-level elf barbarian (ECL 5).
A ritual of vitality would have the same cost in gold pieces, would also take only one day, and would require sacrificing 1,000 XP. Depending on how many experience points he already has, he might not lose a level.
If he found a 17th-level wizard willing to cast wish, it would cost him 26,530 gold pieces. Unless he is a very unusual 6th-level barbarian, he has roughly 13,000 gold pieces worth of coin and equipment, and thus cannot afford this method.
Whatever ritual he chooses, the result is that he becomes a Medium-size creature. He loses his size penalty to Armor Class and attack rolls. He loses his +5 natural armor bonus. He loses his natural reach. He loses his monster Hit Dice. He gains average elf Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution scores. That increases his initiative modifier, but does not entirely make up for other losses. He swaps darkvision for low-light vision. He gains immunity to magic sleep spells and effects, a racial bonus on Will saves against enchantment spells or effects, and a +2 bonus on Search, Spot, and Listen checks. If he merely passes within 5 feet of a secret or concealed door, he is entitled to a Search check as though actively looking for it.

[Jack_Simth]

ok, those are suggestions, but what would happen to the RHD and LA(and thus also skill points) of the entity in question that got shifted? (assume RAW) does it all just disappear?

DM's whim. Like many things, it simply isn't addressed.

[Beni-Kujaku]

ok, those are suggestions, but what would happen to the RHD and LA(and thus also skill points) of the entity in question that got shifted? (assume RAW) does it all just disappear?

I don't understand. The spell explicitly says hit points and skills (hence, number of RHD) of the creature do not change. Nothing disappears, the creature will just gain less/more xp for a while to catch up to the rest of the party.



While not, exactly, about reincarnation - this quote from Savage Species may be relevant:

Reincarnation specifically says the creature keeps its hit points and skill points, which heavily implies it keeps every single one of its HD, contrarily to SS's rituals, whose whole point is to change the number of HD of the creature.

[ShurikVch]

Reincarnation specifically says the creature keeps its hit points and skill points, which heavily implies it keeps every single one of its HD, contrarily to SS's rituals, whose whole point is to change the number of HD of the creature.
Not necessarily: hit points/skill points may be just above the usual cap