3.5 ruling

[Jweezy]

I'm in a 3.5 campaign and need to know if I am able to use a swift action and then a free action to use abilities from a prestige during a full attack

[Doctor Despair]

I'm in a 3.5 campaign and need to know if I am able to use a swift action and then a free action to use abilities from a prestige during a full attack

If you use a full-round action to attack, then you must complete the attack. Before or after attacking, you have use a swift action (as you get one per round). Before or after attacking, you may use a free action (as you have as many per round as your DM allows, but presumably at least one).

[Tzardok]

At least some types of Free Action can be done during a Full Attack in between the attacks. 5-foot-steps for example.

[Doctor Despair]

At least some types of Free Action can be done during a Full Attack in between the attacks. 5-foot-steps for example.

Well, I learned something new today. I thought you needed the specific text of Supreme Cleave to be able to do that.


Supreme Cleave: At 2nd level, the master samurai gains the ability to take a 5-foot step before making a Cleave or Great Cleave attack.


Supreme Cleave: Beginning at 3rd level, the Knight can take a 5-foot step between attacks when using the Cleave or Great Cleave feat.

As I look at it more, you're almost certainly right, even based on my limited knowledge.


If you deal a creature enough damage to make it drop (typically by dropping it to below 0 hit points or killing it), you get an immediate, extra melee attack against another creature within reach. You cannot take a 5-foot step before making this extra attack. The extra attack is with the same weapon and at the same bonus as the attack that dropped the previous creature. You can use this ability once per round.

Why would it have to specify that you can't take a 5-foot step unless being able to take one was the norm?

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Well, I learned something new today. I thought you needed the specific text of Supreme Cleave to be able to do that.

As I look at it more, you're almost certainly right, even based on my limited knowledge.

Why would it have to specify that you can't take a 5-foot step unless being able to take one was the norm?The Cleave feats are exceptions to the normal rule. You can take 5' steps between attacks, except between the attack that procs the Cleave feats and the attack that occurs because of them.

[Khedrac]

Actually you can take most if not all free and swift actions between attacks of a full attack, e.g. you can draw a weapon using the cuickdraw feat or an equivalent magic item.

I think you could even start a full attack, cast quickened truestrike and then complete the full attack (the +20 bonus being much more useful with seocndary or tertiary attacks).

As MaxiDuRaritry said, Cleave is a special circumstance - the cleave attack must be taken immediately after the attack that triggers it without supreme cleave. (Note, cleave does not require a full attack - the extra attack is, in effect, part of the first attack).

Similarly, if you have improved trip then the bonus attack for knocking an opponent prone must be taken immediately (so no free or swift actions between).

[PoeticallyPsyco]

5-ft-steps aren't actually free actions; they're "No action".

Free actions are actions taken during other actions, so you can use them during a full attack or even during opportunity attacks.


The only movement you can take during a full-round action is a 5-foot step before, during, or after the action. You can also perform free actions (see below).

Some full-round actions do not allow you to take a 5-foot step.

I thought 5-ft-steps couldn't be taken during full attacks, but rereading shows that I was wrong:


The only movement you can take during a full attack is a 5-foot step. You may take the step before, after, or between your attacks.

So yeah, unambiguously, you can use 5-ft-steps during a full attack, at pretty much any point you desire.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

So yeah, unambiguously, you can use 5-ft-steps during a full attack, at pretty much any point you desire....except when using the Cleave tree of feats.

[PoeticallyPsyco]

...except when using the Cleave tree of feats.

Except then, yes.

[loky1109]

...except when using the Cleave tree of feats.

Why do you talk about Cleave like this bonus attack is part of full attack? It isn't!
So no, not "except". This isn't exception, this is pretty different rule.

[Biggus]

Actually you can take most if not all free and swift actions between attacks of a full attack, e.g. you can draw a weapon using the cuickdraw feat or an equivalent magic item.


Quick Draw makes it clear you can use it during a full attack action, but where does it say you can use other types of free action during another action?

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Why do you talk about Cleave like this bonus attack is part of full attack? It isn't!
So no, not "except". This isn't exception, this is pretty different rule.You can use Cleave off of a full attack. Just pointing it out in case anyone later down the line gets confused on the issue.

[Fouredged Sword]

Technically nothing about cleave prevents you from taking a 5 foot step in the middle of a full attack that you get a bonus cleave attack in. All it does is create a little moment where you can't actually take that 5 foot step. You can take that 5 foot step any other time, just not that that specific moment.

[Troacctid]

Quick Draw makes it clear you can use it during a full attack action, but where does it say you can use other types of free action during another action?
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#actionTypes

You can perform one or more free actions while taking another action normally.