Question about Warlocks and Patrons

[Almus Rayne]

Hello all. So before I even pose my question I will admit that I sometimes get confused as to what information online is referencing to either 3.X or 5e.

So I want to ask about Warlocks and Patrons. I've seen it posted several times that a Warlock with a Genie patron is a fantastic build. But I just looked Warlocks up in 3.5 Complete Arcane and I didn't see anything listed in their mechanics about patrons at all. Is this a 5e only thing or am I missing something?

[Esprit15]

Hello all. So before I even pose my question I will admit that I sometimes get confused as to what information online is referencing to either 3.X or 5e.

So I want to ask about Warlocks and Patrons. I've seen it posted several times that a Warlock with a Genie patron is a fantastic build. But I just looked Warlocks up in 3.5 Complete Arcane and I didn't see anything listed in their mechanics about patrons at all. Is this a 5e only thing or am I missing something?

Yes, this is a 5e thing. Patrons are in effect how the subclasses in 5e are thematically and mechanically different.

[Psyren]

5e only. In 3.5, Warlocks were almost all Fiend, with maybe some Fey in there, and a couple of Celestial if you were going with the Enlightened Spirit PrC. (I mean, you can fluff a much wider variety than these, but mechanically those were the three types officially supported, and one needed a PrC.)

[Tzardok]

Don't forget the slaad. You should never forget the slaad.

[mabriss lethe]

While there are some feats and prestige classes that support one type of patron or another, it's not really part of the Warlock class as a whole in 3.5. All the class itself says about it boils down to "you or possibly an ancestor made a deal with something (most likely an Outsider) for power. now go spam some EBs"

[Jervis]

While there are some feats and prestige classes that support one type of patron or another, it's not really part of the Warlock class as a whole in 3.5. All the class itself says about it boils down to "you or possibly an ancestor made a deal with something (most likely an Outsider) for power. now go spam some EBs"

I made Tibbit warlock once who got warlock powers by beating a Fey in a waffle eating competition. So the Fey gave him powers but in exchange he had to promise to find the best waffles in the world and bring the recipe to the Fey lord.

[Fizban]

In 3.5, the warlock's "patron" is nothing but fluff, and optional fluff to boot. The only mechanical "effect" is that the class was written with an alignment restriction of Evil or Chaotic*, and the description explicitly allows the possibility that the character themselves has no patron but is actually just related to someone who did. In fact the first line says they're born of a supernatural bloodline, and it later says again that they're born rather than made- before immediately saying that actually some of them make dark pacts in their youth. So it's all self-contradictory, but it doesn't actually matter.

I find it best practice to take this the rest of the way and remove the alignment restriction entirely (while also adding a bunch of invocation options, most of which are less edgelordy).

*Remember also that in 3.5 Evil and Chaotic are not linked, there is Chaotic Good and Lawful Evil, which 5e removed.

[JNAProductions]

In 3.5, the warlock's "patron" is nothing but fluff, and optional fluff to boot. The only mechanical "effect" is that the class was written with an alignment restriction of Evil or Chaotic*, and the description explicitly allows the possibility that the character themselves has no patron but is actually just related to someone who did. In fact the first line says they're born of a supernatural bloodline, and it later says again that they're born rather than made- before immediately saying that actually some of them make dark pacts in their youth. So it's all self-contradictory, but it doesn't actually matter.

I find it best practice to take this the rest of the way and remove the alignment restriction entirely (while also adding a bunch of invocation options, most of which are less edgelordy).

*Remember also that in 3.5 Evil and Chaotic are not linked, there is Chaotic Good and Lawful Evil, which 5e removed.

You’re thinking of 4E.

5E has the same alignment as 3rd.

[Fizban]

You’re thinking of 4E.

5E has the same alignment as 3rd.

*Checks* I could have sworn someone was telling me that the full alignment spread stayed gone, guess not. Quite possibly heard it on a stream where the people involved weren't clear on it either. The descriptions in the 5e version are even a bit better than before, go figure.

[Naanomi]

There was at least one warlock prestige class that tied you to a specific type of patron (the lolth one)

[Particle_Man]

I think there are some draconic invocations, implying the possibility of a dragon or dragon god patron.

Genie could fluffed easily as a patron but there is no mechanical advantage to it save what gets home brewed. Maybe an enterprising dm could reverse engineer whatever 5e did with genie warlock?

[Darg]

I think there are some draconic invocations, implying the possibility of a dragon or dragon god patron.

Genie could fluffed easily as a patron but there is no mechanical advantage to it save what gets home brewed. Maybe an enterprising dm could reverse engineer whatever 5e did with genie warlock?

Draconic invocations are specifically for Dragonfire Adepts. The warlock invocations in dragon magic are described as being tuned towards the destruction of dragons due to the higher activity of dragons.