Bloodlines as point buy reduction, values?

[zlefin]

I remember reading about a system for E6, wherein things with LA would be allowed, but would reduce the point-buy you get for stats.

I want to use something similar for bloodlines. Under this system there would be no 'bloodline levels' nor xp costs. Instead, your point-buy for getting stats would be reduced by some amount for a bloodline. So how much should each of the bloodline levels cost in terms of point-buy? Let's use a 25 point buy as the base. (though if you'd rather use some other base, that's fine if you specify)


I'm also interested in other ways of handling the 'cost' of a bloodline that don't make xp complicated.

[Jervis]

I remember reading about a system for E6, wherein things with LA would be allowed, but would reduce the point-buy you get for stats.

I want to use something similar for bloodlines. Under this system there would be no 'bloodline levels' nor xp costs. Instead, your point-buy for getting stats would be reduced by some amount for a bloodline. So how much should each of the bloodline levels cost in terms of point-buy? Let's use a 25 point buy as the base. (though if you'd rather use some other base, that's fine if you specify)


I'm also interested in other ways of handling the 'cost' of a bloodline that don't make xp complicated.

Keep in mind the actual benefits of a bloodline are their weakest draw. They give a increase in CL and class level features that bypass level cap, and most importantly, increase skill rank cap. A major bloodline lets you get into Chameleon at level 3 for example. Without that I’d actually say a single bloodline isn’t that OP. I’d say 1 point for minor, 3 points for the middling one, and 5 for 3 levels of major.

[Doctor Despair]

Bloodline levels also arguably just effectively cost XP, as they explicitly don't increase your ECL, and the XP table is based on ECL. The only "silly" part of that reading is that the levels would be cheaper if you take them all at ECL 1, but arguably that's also a feature. You can pay now (when each level doubles your HP/skills/etc and is most impactful), or pay nothing now, but defer the cost (with steep interest).

Edit: There's also a reading where they are effectively free, too. Honestly, as far as variant systems go, they're pretty poorly written

[Halrax]

Another thing to remember is that point buy reductions apply from the beginning of an adventurer's career, whereas bloodlines apply over the course of it. I personally like using point buy reductions for LA, since those both apply at the beginning, but for bloodlines you want something that covers the course of an adventurers career. Otherwise you have a "worse now, better later" problem. A better solution may be that bloodlines cost feats and/or ability score increases, since those occur over time but aren't confusing and finicky like bloodline levels. Of course, you may then run into the Weapons of Legacy problem where you give up versatility for the same power level, so you want to make sure a bloodline is slightly more powerful than what you're giving up. A minor bloodline taking up feats at 6 and 12, a medium bloodline feats at 6 and 12 and ASI at 4 and 12, and a major bloodline feats at 3, 6, and 12, and all ASI seems about right.