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Dualight
2021-12-12, 03:58 PM
One of my players has their warlock set up in such a way that they will eventually end up spending time in-between patrons, and that got me thinking on how not having an Otherworldly Patron affect a warlock, since they, unlike most other classes, depend on an element of their subclass for some of the features of their class, like the Pact Boon, which is explicitly a gift from the Patron.
While it will probably be quite some time before I will be able to play-test these rules, I would like some feedback on them,so do not be afraid to be merciless, but polite and (preferably) constructive. Better to find out glaring problems with this before I subject a hapless player to them.

The rules for a warlock who cut ties with their patron:

When a warlock breaks their Pact, and is severed from their Patron, they lose some of their power. Until and unless they contract with another Patron, their class features(in as far as they have them) alter in the following ways. In addition to these restrictions, they cannot gain further levels in the Warlock class.(the rest of this document address a warlock in such an unenviable position)

• Your Pact Magic spell slots no longer recharge on a short rest. You only regain expended Pact Magic spell slots after a long rest.

• All Otherworldly Patron features are lost, and do not provide their benefits.

• The Pact Boon feature is lost, with the exact effects depending the chosen Pact Boon

◦ Pact of the Chain: The familiar dies, and cannot be re-summoned. Since the knowledge itself is not lost, the warlock can still cast find familiar, but cannot cast it as a warlock spell, nor can you cast it as a ritual unless you have a way of casting find familiar as a ritual that is not dependant on the Pact of the Chain feature. While the Pact of the Chain is inaccessible, the familiar summoned through find familiar takes a form as indicated in the spell description, and has no special features that are not specified in the spell or its stat block.

◦ Pact of the Blade: The pact weapon vanishes and cannot be re-summoned. If a magic weapon has been designated as the pact weapon, that bond breaks, behaving as in the description of a magic weapon becoming unbound in the Pact of the Blade feature.

◦ Pact of the Talisman: The talisman turns to ash and is destroyed. You cannot perform the ritual to obtain a new talisman.

◦ Pact of the Tome: You cannot cast the spells contained in your Book of Shadows as warlock spells, and you cannot cast them at all unless you know them from another source. You also cannot replace the Book if it is lost.

• Any Eldritch Invocations you have for which you no longer meet the prerequisites do not function, and you cannot replace them.

• When you cast a spell from your Mystic Arcanum feature(s), you must make an Intelligence(Arcana) check). The DC for such a check is 12+ the level of the spell. On a success, you cast the spell successfully, and do not have to make this check again if you attempt to cast the spell within seven days of the last time you succeeded on this check. On a failure, the spell fails, but the Arcanum is not completely wasted. You can attempt to cast this spell again after finishing a short or long rest. If you fail to cast a Mystic Arcanum while your most recent failure to cast that spell is less than seven days ago, you maximum hit points are reduced by your warlock level. This reduction applies even when your hit point maximum is already reduced by this effect and/or other effects. Once you cast the Mystic Arcanum spell successfully, the reduction to you hit point maximum that resulted from failing that specific spell disappears after you finish your next long rest. Any reduction to your hit point maximum you suffered as a result of failing a different Mystic Arcanum spell is not restored, unless you meet this requirement for that spell as well.

• The Eldritch Master Feature is lost.

• While you do not have an Otherworldly Patron, you can choose to sacrifice some of the remaining power you have from your previous patron, along with leveraging your experiences, to accelerate your development. When you gain a level in another class, gain an Epic Boon, or gain an equivalent measure of growth, such as a feat, you can reduce your warlock level by 1 to gain a level in your new class. If you have no levels in any class other that Warlock, you can gain a level in any class for which you meet the multi-class requirements(you ignore the multiclass requirements of the warlock class). If you already have at least one level in another class, you can only gain this additional level in a class you already have at least one level in. If the number of cantrips, spells or invocations known decreases, you choose which cantrip, spell, or invocation you lose. If reducing you warlock level would disqualify you for any of your invocations, or you would become unable to cast a warlock spell with you warlock spell slots, you must give up on those first. You replace the hit die you would lose from the warlock level with the hit die of the appropriate size for you new class. Your hit point maximum thus changes based on the difference in average hit points per level between the classes. You do not roll the hit die you gain from the level you gain as part of this exchange. This process represents you turning you back on your time as a warlock and devoting yourself to you new path in life. For example, if you replace a level in warlock with a level in barbarian, the hit die size goes from a d8(average 5) to a d12(average 7), so your hit point maximum would increase by 2. Meanwhile, if you were to replace the warlock level with a level in wizard, your hit die would change from a d8(average 5) to a d6(average 4). so your hit point maximum would decrease by 1.

Upon contracting with an Otherworldly Patron, you (re)gain the features appropriate to a warlock of your level and (new) patron, allowing you to choose different features from what you originally had, and your warlock features once again function as normal.. You can also freely replace Eldritch Invocations, spells known, cantrips, and Mystic Arcanum spells, but you do not gain any more than your features indicate. If you gained spells from a feature you chose to replace, you lose those spells, and you cannot replace the spells you gained directly from features other than your Pact Magic or Mystic Arcanum features. If you, upon contracting with a patron, still have a Book of Shadows that had been granted to you by your previous patron, you can choose to reactivate that Book of Shadows if you take the Pact of the Tome Pact Boon. You regain the ability to cast the cantrips written in that Book of Shadows, as per normal. If the Book of Shadows contains ritual spells written in there with the Book of Ancient Secrets Eldritch Invocation, you can only use those spells through it if you take the Book of Ancient Secrets Invocation again.


In addition, I had an idea for a warlock who refuses to be tied to a patron (again), resulting in a subclass that I envision as a warlock+, minimal options outside the base warlock class, but not significantly inferior to those that are supported by a patron.

Otherworldly Patron option:
The Autodidact

The Autodidact is a warlock who somehow attained and maintains their full power without the backing of a patron.
This has consequences for a few of their warlock features, in addition to granting them specific Otherworldly Patron features. You can only take this ‘Otherworldly Patron” if your DM grants you explicit permission at first level, and you cannot change to this ‘Patron’ without spending time as a Patronless warlock. If you are an Autodidact, you can change to another patron if you forge a Pact with them, replacing your Otherworldly Pact features as per normal. An Autodidact that takes another pact loses all spells, eldritch Invocations and Mystic Arcana gained through this subclass, and the modification to the Pact Boon feature is undone.

1st level: At first level, when you strike out on your own without a patron, you have a choice. If you take this patron after breaking the contract you had with a previous patron, you can choose to retain the 1st level features granted to you by that patron, as you retain a spark of their power, and refine it into your own. If you choose not to, or if you take this patron at 1st level, you instead gain the following feature:

Self-Taught Magic
At 1st level, you learn one additional warlock cantrip, which does not count against the number of warlock cantrips you know. Additionally, you learn an additional warlock spell at the following levels: 1st, 3rd, 5th, 7th, and 9th. The spell you learn must be of the following level: 1st, then 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, respectively. These spells do not count against the number of warlock spells you know, but, if you choose to replace the spells you gained through this feature upon gaining another level in the warlock class, they must be replaced with another warlock spell of the same level.

Pact Boon: Since you do not have a patron to provide you with a pact boon, each of your options has additional restrictions. If you do not meet these restrictions, you cannot choose that option for the Pact Boon feature. If you had received a specific Pact Boon from you previous patron, you can ignore the restriction on taking that pact boon again. This exception to the restriction only applies to the Pact Boon you lost when you became a patronless warlock.

Pact of the Chain: You need to know the find familiar spell from another source.

Pact of the Blade: You are only proficient with your pact weapon if it assumes a form with which you already have proficiency.(variant: 3+ pre-existing martial weapon proficiencies needed to gain this Pact Boon)

Pact of the Tome: You need to provide your own spell book to turn into a Book of Shadows. You can add warlock cantrips to your Book of Shadows, but need to have some way of scribing cantrips from another class’s spell list into the Book of Shadows in order to gain them as warlock cantrips. In order to add a cantrip to your Book of Shadows, you need to meet the same requirements as a wizard would need to add a new 1st level spell to their spell book. If you lose your Book of Shadows, you need to manually make a new one, and reinscribe the cantrips. Reinscribing a cantrip from memory is difficult. If the cantrip is not on the warlock spell list, you will need to spend time and money as if you added a 2nd level spell to a wizard’s spell book. You can still only have a total of three cantrips written in your Book of Shadows. If you have the “Book of Ancient Secrets” Eldritch Invocation, any rituals need to be copied manually from the old Book of Shadows into a new Book. This process costs half the time and gp the spell cost the first time you added it to your Book of Ancient Secrets. Likewise, adding a ritual that you had previously deciphered is easier, you halve the timeand gp cost in that case as weel.

Pact of the Talisman: You make the talisman yourself, crafting a new talisman takes 1 hour, which can be done during a short rest. You need materials worth 25 gp to craft a new talisman, including when you first gain this feature.

Improvised Defence
At 6th level, your growing power allows you to occasionally protect yourself from harm. You learn one of the following spells: shield, absorb elements, protection from evil and good, or sanctuary. That spell is a warlock spell for you, and you can cast it once without using a spell slot, regaining the ability to do so after a long rest. You can also cast this spell with your warlock spell slots.

Independent Defiance
At 10th level, your power grow to the point that you become more difficult for others to affect. When a creature or magical effect forces you to make a saving throw, you can use your reaction to give yourself advantage on the roll. If you would have succeeded on the saving throw if you had had disadvantage, you regain one use of this ability. You can use this ability a number of times per long rest equal to half you proficiency bonus. You can also expend one of your warlock spell slots to activate this ability.

Idiosyncratic Breakthrough
Starting at 14th level, your power has grown to the point that you can match warlocks who grovel and beg their masters for scraps of power. You learn an additional Eldritch Invocation, which does not count against the number of Invocation you know, and you can expend the use of a higher level Mystic Arcanum to cast one of your warlock spells, including Mystic Arcanum spells, at the level of the expended Mystic Arcanum. Additionally, you can replace one of your Mystic Arcanum spells with another valid Mystic Arcanum spell whenever you gain a warlock level. Moreover, you gain an additional Warlock spell slot, and, at 19th level, you gain a second 6th level Mystic Arcanum.

Nothing about these is currently set in stone, although I am mostly certain that I have identified all of the warlock features that directly tie to a patron. As such, my question to those who are willing to comment: Are these rules workable? The intent is that losing the Patron hurts, but won't kill the warlock while they seek a new patron/change course entirely.

As for the Autodidact, the usual subclass questions concerning balance and flavour come up.

Jervis
2021-12-12, 05:51 PM
One of my players has their warlock set up in such a way that they will eventually end up spending time in-between patrons, and that got me thinking on how not having an Otherworldly Patron affect a warlock, since they, unlike most other classes, depend on an element of their subclass for some of the features of their class, like the Pact Boon, which is explicitly a gift from the Patron.
While it will probably be quite some time before I will be able to play-test these rules, I would like some feedback on them,so do not be afraid to be merciless, but polite and (preferably) constructive. Better to find out glaring problems with this before I subject a hapless player to them.

The rules for a warlock who cut ties with their patron:

When a warlock breaks their Pact, and is severed from their Patron, they lose some of their power. Until and unless they contract with another Patron, their class features(in as far as they have them) alter in the following ways. In addition to these restrictions, they cannot gain further levels in the Warlock class.(the rest of this document address a warlock in such an unenviable position)

• Your Pact Magic spell slots no longer recharge on a short rest. You only regain expended Pact Magic spell slots after a long rest.

• All Otherworldly Patron features are lost, and do not provide their benefits.

• The Pact Boon feature is lost, with the exact effects depending the chosen Pact Boon

◦ Pact of the Chain: The familiar dies, and cannot be re-summoned. Since the knowledge itself is not lost, the warlock can still cast find familiar, but cannot cast it as a warlock spell, nor can you cast it as a ritual unless you have a way of casting find familiar as a ritual that is not dependant on the Pact of the Chain feature. While the Pact of the Chain is inaccessible, the familiar summoned through find familiar takes a form as indicated in the spell description, and has no special features that are not specified in the spell or its stat block.

◦ Pact of the Blade: The pact weapon vanishes and cannot be re-summoned. If a magic weapon has been designated as the pact weapon, that bond breaks, behaving as in the description of a magic weapon becoming unbound in the Pact of the Blade feature.

◦ Pact of the Talisman: The talisman turns to ash and is destroyed. You cannot perform the ritual to obtain a new talisman.

◦ Pact of the Tome: You cannot cast the spells contained in your Book of Shadows as warlock spells, and you cannot cast them at all unless you know them from another source. You also cannot replace the Book if it is lost.

• Any Eldritch Invocations you have for which you no longer meet the prerequisites do not function, and you cannot replace them.

• When you cast a spell from your Mystic Arcanum feature(s), you must make an Intelligence(Arcana) check). The DC for such a check is 12+ the level of the spell. On a success, you cast the spell successfully, and do not have to make this check again if you attempt to cast the spell within seven days of the last time you succeeded on this check. On a failure, the spell fails, but the Arcanum is not completely wasted. You can attempt to cast this spell again after finishing a short or long rest. If you fail to cast a Mystic Arcanum while your most recent failure to cast that spell is less than seven days ago, you maximum hit points are reduced by your warlock level. This reduction applies even when your hit point maximum is already reduced by this effect and/or other effects. Once you cast the Mystic Arcanum spell successfully, the reduction to you hit point maximum that resulted from failing that specific spell disappears after you finish your next long rest. Any reduction to your hit point maximum you suffered as a result of failing a different Mystic Arcanum spell is not restored, unless you meet this requirement for that spell as well.

• The Eldritch Master Feature is lost.

• While you do not have an Otherworldly Patron, you can choose to sacrifice some of the remaining power you have from your previous patron, along with leveraging your experiences, to accelerate your development. When you gain a level in another class, gain an Epic Boon, or gain an equivalent measure of growth, such as a feat, you can reduce your warlock level by 1 to gain a level in your new class. If you have no levels in any class other that Warlock, you can gain a level in any class for which you meet the multi-class requirements(you ignore the multiclass requirements of the warlock class). If you already have at least one level in another class, you can only gain this additional level in a class you already have at least one level in. If the number of cantrips, spells or invocations known decreases, you choose which cantrip, spell, or invocation you lose. If reducing you warlock level would disqualify you for any of your invocations, or you would become unable to cast a warlock spell with you warlock spell slots, you must give up on those first. You replace the hit die you would lose from the warlock level with the hit die of the appropriate size for you new class. Your hit point maximum thus changes based on the difference in average hit points per level between the classes. You do not roll the hit die you gain from the level you gain as part of this exchange. This process represents you turning you back on your time as a warlock and devoting yourself to you new path in life. For example, if you replace a level in warlock with a level in barbarian, the hit die size goes from a d8(average 5) to a d12(average 7), so your hit point maximum would increase by 2. Meanwhile, if you were to replace the warlock level with a level in wizard, your hit die would change from a d8(average 5) to a d6(average 4). so your hit point maximum would decrease by 1.

Upon contracting with an Otherworldly Patron, you (re)gain the features appropriate to a warlock of your level and (new) patron, allowing you to choose different features from what you originally had, and your warlock features once again function as normal.. You can also freely replace Eldritch Invocations, spells known, cantrips, and Mystic Arcanum spells, but you do not gain any more than your features indicate. If you gained spells from a feature you chose to replace, you lose those spells, and you cannot replace the spells you gained directly from features other than your Pact Magic or Mystic Arcanum features. If you, upon contracting with a patron, still have a Book of Shadows that had been granted to you by your previous patron, you can choose to reactivate that Book of Shadows if you take the Pact of the Tome Pact Boon. You regain the ability to cast the cantrips written in that Book of Shadows, as per normal. If the Book of Shadows contains ritual spells written in there with the Book of Ancient Secrets Eldritch Invocation, you can only use those spells through it if you take the Book of Ancient Secrets Invocation again.


In addition, I had an idea for a warlock who refuses to be tied to a patron (again), resulting in a subclass that I envision as a warlock+, minimal options outside the base warlock class, but not significantly inferior to those that are supported by a patron.

Otherworldly Patron option:
The Autodidact

The Autodidact is a warlock who somehow attained and maintains their full power without the backing of a patron.
This has consequences for a few of their warlock features, in addition to granting them specific Otherworldly Patron features. You can only take this ‘Otherworldly Patron” if your DM grants you explicit permission at first level, and you cannot change to this ‘Patron’ without spending time as a Patronless warlock. If you are an Autodidact, you can change to another patron if you forge a Pact with them, replacing your Otherworldly Pact features as per normal. An Autodidact that takes another pact loses all spells, eldritch Invocations and Mystic Arcana gained through this subclass, and the modification to the Pact Boon feature is undone.

1st level: At first level, when you strike out on your own without a patron, you have a choice. If you take this patron after breaking the contract you had with a previous patron, you can choose to retain the 1st level features granted to you by that patron, as you retain a spark of their power, and refine it into your own. If you choose not to, or if you take this patron at 1st level, you instead gain the following feature:

Self-Taught Magic
At 1st level, you learn one additional warlock cantrip, which does not count against the number of warlock cantrips you know. Additionally, you learn an additional warlock spell at the following levels: 1st, 3rd, 5th, 7th, and 9th. The spell you learn must be of the following level: 1st, then 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, respectively. These spells do not count against the number of warlock spells you know, but, if you choose to replace the spells you gained through this feature upon gaining another level in the warlock class, they must be replaced with another warlock spell of the same level.

Pact Boon: Since you do not have a patron to provide you with a pact boon, each of your options has additional restrictions. If you do not meet these restrictions, you cannot choose that option for the Pact Boon feature. If you had received a specific Pact Boon from you previous patron, you can ignore the restriction on taking that pact boon again. This exception to the restriction only applies to the Pact Boon you lost when you became a patronless warlock.

Pact of the Chain: You need to know the find familiar spell from another source.

Pact of the Blade: You are only proficient with your pact weapon if it assumes a form with which you already have proficiency.(variant: 3+ pre-existing martial weapon proficiencies needed to gain this Pact Boon)

Pact of the Tome: You need to provide your own spell book to turn into a Book of Shadows. You can add warlock cantrips to your Book of Shadows, but need to have some way of scribing cantrips from another class’s spell list into the Book of Shadows in order to gain them as warlock cantrips. In order to add a cantrip to your Book of Shadows, you need to meet the same requirements as a wizard would need to add a new 1st level spell to their spell book. If you lose your Book of Shadows, you need to manually make a new one, and reinscribe the cantrips. Reinscribing a cantrip from memory is difficult. If the cantrip is not on the warlock spell list, you will need to spend time and money as if you added a 2nd level spell to a wizard’s spell book. You can still only have a total of three cantrips written in your Book of Shadows. If you have the “Book of Ancient Secrets” Eldritch Invocation, any rituals need to be copied manually from the old Book of Shadows into a new Book. This process costs half the time and gp the spell cost the first time you added it to your Book of Ancient Secrets. Likewise, adding a ritual that you had previously deciphered is easier, you halve the timeand gp cost in that case as weel.

Pact of the Talisman: You make the talisman yourself, crafting a new talisman takes 1 hour, which can be done during a short rest. You need materials worth 25 gp to craft a new talisman, including when you first gain this feature.

Improvised Defence
At 6th level, your growing power allows you to occasionally protect yourself from harm. You learn one of the following spells: shield, absorb elements, protection from evil and good, or sanctuary. That spell is a warlock spell for you, and you can cast it once without using a spell slot, regaining the ability to do so after a long rest. You can also cast this spell with your warlock spell slots.

Independent Defiance
At 10th level, your power grow to the point that you become more difficult for others to affect. When a creature or magical effect forces you to make a saving throw, you can use your reaction to give yourself advantage on the roll. If you would have succeeded on the saving throw if you had had disadvantage, you regain one use of this ability. You can use this ability a number of times per long rest equal to half you proficiency bonus. You can also expend one of your warlock spell slots to activate this ability.

Idiosyncratic Breakthrough
Starting at 14th level, your power has grown to the point that you can match warlocks who grovel and beg their masters for scraps of power. You learn an additional Eldritch Invocation, which does not count against the number of Invocation you know, and you can expend the use of a higher level Mystic Arcanum to cast one of your warlock spells, including Mystic Arcanum spells, at the level of the expended Mystic Arcanum. Additionally, you can replace one of your Mystic Arcanum spells with another valid Mystic Arcanum spell whenever you gain a warlock level. Moreover, you gain an additional Warlock spell slot, and, at 19th level, you gain a second 6th level Mystic Arcanum.

Nothing about these is currently set in stone, although I am mostly certain that I have identified all of the warlock features that directly tie to a patron. As such, my question to those who are willing to comment: Are these rules workable? The intent is that losing the Patron hurts, but won't kill the warlock while they seek a new patron/change course entirely.

As for the Autodidact, the usual subclass questions concerning balance and flavour come up.

I think you’re underestimating how crippling some of these are. That aside the rules actually make mention of a warlock turning against their patron and they don’t have any conditions for falling like Paladins kinda do. General they seem to keep any class features after they’ve cut ties as if they learned their powers instead of greeting them beamed to them via the Eldritch cloud. Your table your choice but I personally am not a fan

Dualight
2021-12-12, 06:16 PM
The whole reason I posted this was to get feedback, as I fully expected that I missed something. I am aware that not all of a warlock's power is the result of their continued Pact, which is why the spells and invocations that are not tied to the patron are retained.
My reasoning for restricting the features I do is that the patron is to some extent involved in the warlock retaining it.
For example, since Eldritch Master explicitly requires the warlock to contact their patron for extra power, that feature obviously shouldn't work if the warlock does not have a patron. I extrapolated the restriction to Pact Magic spell slots from there, assuming that the rapid recharge is a consequence of the Patron supplying power.

If I may ask, which restrictions are too much, and why?
I want to improve upon this concept, so knowing what, exactly, it is that I am going overboard with is would be helpful.
I know that warlocks are supposed to be able to turn against their masters, but I feel that the warlock breaking their Pact should have consequences. For an example of a Patron-related feature that requires active involvement of the Patron: The Archfiend's Dark One's Own Luck, which calls upon the Patron to warp fate. Bit weird for that to continue functioning as-is if you have killed the devil that gave you your Pact.

Jervis
2021-12-12, 07:34 PM
The whole reason I posted this was to get feedback, as I fully expected that I missed something. I am aware that not all of a warlock's power is the result of their continued Pact, which is why the spells and invocations that are not tied to the patron are retained.
My reasoning for restricting the features I do is that the patron is to some extent involved in the warlock retaining it.
For example, since Eldritch Master explicitly requires the warlock to contact their patron for extra power, that feature obviously shouldn't work if the warlock does not have a patron. I extrapolated the restriction to Pact Magic spell slots from there, assuming that the rapid recharge is a consequence of the Patron supplying power.

If I may ask, which restrictions are too much, and why?
I want to improve upon this concept, so knowing what, exactly, it is that I am going overboard with is would be helpful.
I know that warlocks are supposed to be able to turn against their masters, but I feel that the warlock breaking their Pact should have consequences. For an example of a Patron-related feature that requires active involvement of the Patron: The Archfiend's Dark One's Own Luck, which calls upon the Patron to warp fate. Bit weird for that to continue functioning as-is if you have killed the devil that gave you your Pact.

Short rest recharge is kinda of a big deal. It’s why they don’t get many spell slots. As a example imagine if a monk recharged Ki on a long rest, that kind of breaks the class because they weren’t intended to go that long. As for consequences, I don’t think it should effect class features, it should effect story. You break a deal with a devil and now you have a CR 20ish devil with a axe to grind against you. That’s worse than anything that happens to a Paladin.

Dualight
2021-12-13, 04:22 AM
I think that I see where you are coming from. I might have been ignoring the knock-on effects of each change. While I worked on this I was only looking at which features should be impacted, and forgot to take into account how those features are intended to work.
I do think that some of the restrictions make too much sense to drop, like the Pact Boon becoming irreplaceable, but I should focus more on the mechanical effects before implementing this.

Thank you for the feedback. I was aware that I had some blind spots, but, as per their nature, I was unable to figure out what they were.

Do you have any comments on the subclass? It might never see play, but I enjoy fiddling with mechanics like this, and I would like to know if I am starting to have an idea of what is or isn't horribly over-/underpowered.