Optimization Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground CXVII [Archive]

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The Viscount

2021-12-15, 12:20 AM

Welcome to Optimization Stadium, the field of combat for our storied competition. Here the contestants will be transmuting lead into gold as we showcase the overlooked, underused, weird, wild, and wonky prestige classes.

Obscure darkness won the popular vote, so here's an ingredient I've rarely, if ever seen discussed, involving a society I never see talked about. Crack open Underdark and nurse your grudges, this time it's Imaskari Vengeance Taker

Welcome, contestants, judges, and guests to Iron Chef. Here in Optimization Colosseum, contestants will endeavor to create an optimized and flavorful character using a specified D&D 3.5 prestige class as a "Secret Ingredient".

Contestants: You will need to present a full 20-level build for your entry. Also required is a rundown of how your build works at lower levels, to demonstrate that it is a functional character that could be played from 1-20 in a real game. Traditionally contestants give "snapshots" of tactics and abilities at levels 5, 10, 15, and 20. The purpose of these snapshots is not just to showcase your use of the SI, it is to demonstrate that your character is playable at every level. For this reason, it's still worth giving a snapshot before you have entered the SI.

Menu: The "special ingredient" can be drawn from any legal source. Originally, the plan was to mostly use Core and Completes, but that was a long time ago, and we've started running out of interesting classes to use if we restrict ourselves to those.

32 point-buy is the presumed creation method.
If you do use a different point-buy, please make your case for its necessity in your entry. Keep in mind that for using exceptionally large or small point-buys may warrant deductions in elegance and/or power.

Kitchen: Competitors will be free to use any official 3.5 rulebook in constructing their builds. Dragon magazine is disallowed, and Unearthed Arcana is allowed; but see Elegance below. Web-exclusive 3.0 or 3.5 materials by WotC are expressly allowed, but take care to verify that an updated version did not appear in print elsewhere, as this may cause an Elegance deduction at the judges' discretion. Here's a guide to most of what has and hasn't been updated. (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/20050110x) Alternate rule systems from UA such as gestalt or Generic Classes are not allowed, as they create a different playing field. Also, item familiars are forbidden. Please refrain from using Taint unless it's necessary for the Secret Ingredient.
NB: Official Errata and 3.5 updates to 3.0 content are considered valid regardless of whether their sources would otherwise be legal. This includes the 3.5 update of Oriental Adventures given in Dragon Magazine, and the 3.5 updates of Dragonlance Campaign Setting content given in later third party Dragonlance books.

Cooking Time: Contestants will have until 13:59 GMT on Sunday January 9th, 2022 to create their builds and PM them to the Chairman, The Viscount. You may submit build by email if it is too large for a single PM. Please put the name of your build in the subject line of your PM. Builds will then be posted simultaneously, to avoid copying. Judges will have until 13:59 GMT on Sunday January 23rd, 2022 to judge the builds and submit their scores. If no judges have scored by that point, only the scores of the first judge to submit will be counted.

Judging: Judging will be based on the following criteria, with each build rated on a scale from 1 (very poor) to 5 (exemplary) in each area: Originality, Power, Elegance, Use of Secret Ingredient.

Power level is up to you. Cheese is acceptable, but should be kept to a sane level unless you're showcasing a new TO build you've discovered. In the words of one of my predecessors, a little cheddar can be nice, but avoid the mature Gruyere unless you're making a cheese fondue.
Elegance could bear a little elaboration. It basically measures how skillfully you put your build together, and whether you sacrificed flavor for power. We're cooking here - if your dish doesn't taste good, it doesn't matter how well-presented it is. Use of flaws is considered in poor taste, and judges are asked to take a dim view of this option, taking it into account while grading. Other things that will cause penalties here are excessive multi-classing, and classes that don't fit the concept.Please note the following: a legal source's relative obscurity should not be considered as penalizing Elegance, excepting the aforementioned issues with Unearthed Arcana. Using conflicting setting material may result in a penalty to Elegance at the judges' discretion, but a book's relative obscurity may not. In that same vein, drawing solely from the Core 3 (and the d20 SRD) should not be punished for lacking Originality.
Presentation: Builds will be posted anonymously, in order to avoid the potential of bias towards a particular competitor. For this reason, please don't put your name in the build, as I'm likely to miss it when reviewing the entries!

Due to concerns about standardizing entry format, I'd like everyone to try to use the following table for their entry. (A fillable, pre-formatted version found here (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1BG0-5sq4dL9Ooh7-QfXuyHzO4rXSz-CRcj29t6BeUVE/edit#gid=0))NAME OF ENTRY

Level
Class
Base Attack Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Skills
Feats
Class Features

1st
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

2nd
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

3rd
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

4th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

5th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

6th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

7th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

8th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

9th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

10th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

11th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

12th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

13th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

14th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

15th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

16th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

17th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

18th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

19th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

20th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

Code immediately below (spoiler).

Level
Class
Base Attack Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Skills
Feats
Class Features

1st
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

2nd
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

3rd
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

4th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

5th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

6th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

7th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

8th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

9th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

10th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

11th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

12th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

13th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

14th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

15th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

16th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

17th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

18th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

19th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

20th
New Class Level
+x
+x
+x
+x
Skills
Feats
New Class Abilities

For entries with spellcasting, use the following table for Spells per day and Spells Known. (Spells Known only if necessary, i.e. Sorcerer or Bard, but not Wizard or Warmage)Spells per Day/Spells Known

Level
0lvl
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
7th
8th
9th

1st
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

2nd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

3rd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

4th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

5th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

6th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

7th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

8th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

9th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

10th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

11th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

12th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

13th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

14th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

15th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

16th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

17th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

18th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

19th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

20th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

Code immediately below (spoiler)Spells per Day/Spells Known

Level
0lvl
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
7th
8th
9th

1st
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

2nd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

3rd
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

4th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

5th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

6th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

7th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

8th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

9th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

10th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

11th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

12th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

13th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

14th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

15th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

16th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

17th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

18th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

19th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

20th
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

For other systems (Psionics, ToB, Incarnum, etc.) keep track of PP/maneuvers/essentia separately, preferably in a nice neat list.
Speculation: Please don't post or speculate on possible builds until the "reveal," in order to avoid spoiling the surprise if a particular competitor is producing a build along those lines.

Leadership is banned; we're producing a meal, not a seven-course banquet for a hundred diners. If your entry includes a prestige class or ACF that grants Leadership or a Leadership-like ability as a bonus feat, the feat should be ignored and is not eligible to be traded away for another feat or ACF through any means.

So! Who wants to sign up as a contestant, and who wants to sign up as a judge? Looking for as many contestants and judges as feel like playing!

We will award 1st through 3rd places, as well as a shout-out for honorable mention. The honorable mention prize is given to the most daring or unexpected build. Judges, contestants and guests alike are invited to vote for honorable mention via PM. If there are no votes, Honorable Mention will go to the chairman's favorite build.

Past Competitions

Courtesy of some wonderful volunteers, there is a handy-dandy spreadsheet guide to all previous builds here (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oyjVU5JmeCnC8YTMqDArDqE5PszHl0Ysadz630kuTGk/edit?ts=59a4835f#gid=0). PM if you'd like to contribute to the spreadsheet for access.

Iron Chef I: Entropomancer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=142470)
Iron Chef II: Psibond Agent (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=146583)
Iron Chef III: Cancer Mage (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=148584)
Iron Chef IV: Stonelord (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150595)
Iron Chef V: War Chanter (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=152543)
Iron Chef VI: Master of Masks (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=156876)
Iron Chef VII: Green Star Adept (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=158633)
Iron Chef VIII: Pyrokineticist (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=160266)
Iron Chef IX: Animal Lord (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=162702)
Iron Chef X: Mythic Exemplar (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=164381)
Iron Chef XI: Blade Bravo (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=166539)
Iron Chef XII: War Mind (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9426386)
Iron Chef XIII: Vigilante (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=172233)
Iron Chef XIV: Seeker of the Song (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=174434)
Iron Chef XV: Drunken Master (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=176049)
Iron Chef XVI: Assassin (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=178202)
Iron Chef XVII: Ardent Dilettante (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=182492)
Iron Chef XVIII: Unseelie Dark Hunter (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=186097)
Iron Chef XIX: Dread Pirate (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=190607)
Iron Chef XX: Incandescent Champion (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10976416)
Iron Chef XXI: Ghostwalker (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=198921)
Iron Chef XXII: Dervish (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=206576)
Iron Chef XXIII: Divine Crusader (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=210071)
Iron Chef XXIV: Tactical Soldier (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=214198)
Iron Chef XXV: Scion of Tem-Et-Nu (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=217441)
Iron Chef XXVI: Shadowdancer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=220956)
Iron Chef XXVII: Mindbender (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=224008)
Iron Chef XXVIII: Cryokineticist (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=227304)
Iron Chef XXIX: Consecrated Harrier (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=229688)
Iron Chef XXX: Initiate of Pistis Sophia (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=233346)
Iron Chef XXXI: Shadow Sentinel (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=236908)
Iron Chef XXXII: Temple Raider of Olidammara (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=239786)
Iron Chef XXXIII: Drow Judicator (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=243052)
Iron Chef XXXIV: Dragon Disciple (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=246072)
Iron Chef XXXV: Death Delver (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=249542)
Iron Chef XXXVI: Acolyte of the Skin (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=252923)
Iron Chef XXXVII: Justiciar (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?255215-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-XXXVII)
Iron Chef XXXVIII: Hand of the Winged Master (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=255215)
Iron Chef XXXIX: Renegade Mastermaker (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=260333)
Iron Chef XL: Nightsong Infiltrator (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=263173)
Iron Chef XLI: Geomancer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=266709)
Iron Chef XLII: Shadowblade (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=270196)
Iron Chef XLIII: Bladesinger (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=274122)
Iron Chef XLIV: Urban Soul (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=279116)
Iron Chef XLV: Talon of Tiamat (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=15216595)
Iron Chef XLVI: Cipher Adept (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=287314)
Iron Chef XLVII: Cold Iron Warrior (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=291294)
Iron Chef XLVIII: Shadow Sun Ninja (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=297327)
Iron Chef XLIX: Thrall of Orcus (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=302487)
Iron Chef L: Corrupt Avenger (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=307823)
Iron Chef LI: Black Flame Zealot (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=312773)
Iron Chef LII: Anointed Knight (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=317934)
Iron Chef LIII: Zerth Cenobite (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=325164)
Iron Chef LIV: Osteomancer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=330890)
Iron Chef LV: Mountebank (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?336373-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LV)
Iron Chef LVI: Dwarven Defender (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?342807-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LVI)
Iron Chef LVII: Darkrunner (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?349040-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LVII)
Iron Chef LVIII: Spellsword (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?357412-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LVIII)
Iron Chef LIX: Fleet Runner of Ehlonna (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?364667-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LIX)
Iron Chef LX: Lasher (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?371835-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LX)
Iron Chef LX(II): Acolyte of the Ego (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?372145-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LX)
Iron Chef LXII: Dungeon Lord (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?376810-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXII)
Iron Chef LXIII: Witchborn Binder (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?382632-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXIII)
Iron Chef LXIV: Slime Lord (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?387166-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXIV)
Iron Chef LXV: Thunder Guide (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?394981-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXV)
Iron Chef LXVI: Dwarven Chanter (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?400810-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXVI)
Irogn Chef LXVII: Gnome Giant Slayer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?406613-Irogn-Chef-Optimisatiogn-Challegnge-ign-the-Playgrougnd-LXVII)
Iron Chef LXVIII: Fang of Lolth (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?412530-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXVIII)
Iron Chef LXIX: Shiba Protector (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?420165-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXIX)
Iron Chef LXX: Order of the Bow Initiate (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?425634-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXX)
Iron Chef LXXI: Silver Key (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?431484-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXI)
Iron Chef LXXII: Spellfire Channeler (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?439020-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXII)
Iron Chef LXXIII: Flux Adept (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?448596-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXIII)
Iron Chef LXXIV: Crinti Shadow Marauder (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?458711-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXIV)
Iron Chef LXXV: Thief of Life (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?472831-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXV)
Iron Chef LXXVI: Legacy Champion (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?477153-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXVI)
Iron Chef LXXVII: Great Rift Skyguard (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?482249-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXVII)
Iron Chef LXVIII: Risen Martyr (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?487560-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXVIII)
Iron Chef LXXIX: Black Blood Hunter (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?492923-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXIX)
Iron Chef LXXX: Master of Many Forms (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?498359-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXX)
Iron Chef LXXXI: Serene Guardian (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?502666-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXXI)
Iron Chef LXXXII: Elocator (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?505762-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXXII)
Iron Chef LXXXIII: Winterhaunt of Iboorighu (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?510581-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXXIII)
Iron Chef LXXXIV: Waverider (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?514631-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXXIV)
Iron Chef LXXXV: Astral Dancer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?519296-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXXV)
Iron Chef LXXXVI: Twisted Lord (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?525401-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXXVI)
Iron Chef LXXXVII: Shadowsmith (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?528361-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXXVII)
Iron Chef LXXXVIII: Arboreal Guardian (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?533367-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXXVIII)
Iron Chef LXXXIX: Thrall of Demogorgon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?536247-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-LXXXIX)
Iron Chef XC: Bloodstorm Blade (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?542380-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-XC)
Iron Chef XCI: Fatemaker (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?550203-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-XCI)
Iron Chef XCII: Eye of the Xanathar (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?556092-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-XCII)
Iron Chef XCIII: Hoardstealer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?560330-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-XCIII)
Iron Chef XCIV: Doomlord (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?564804-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-XCIV)
Iron Chef XCV: Gnomish Artificer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?571065-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-XCV)
Iron Chef XCVI: Oozemaster (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?576075-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-XCVI)
Iron Chef XCVII: Aerial Avenger (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?579553-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-XCVII)
Iron Chef XCVIII: Visionary Seeker (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?583331-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-XCVIII)
Iron Chef XCIX: Life Eater (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?589964-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-XCIX)
Iron Chef C: Swiftblade (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?601292-Iron-Chef-Optimisation-Challenge-in-the-Playground-C)

Iron Chef CI: Night Mask Deathbringer (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?610308-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CI)
Iron Chef CII: Blade Dancer (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?613031-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CII)
Iron Chef CIII: Psion Uncarnate (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?614461-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CIII)
Iron Chef CIV: Atavist (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?615697-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CIV)
Iron Chev CV: Primeval (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?618136-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CV)
Iron Chef CVI: Disciple of Mammon (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?620730-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CVI)
Iron Chef CVII: Insidious Corruptor (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?622560-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CVII)
Iron Chef CVIII: Crimson Scourge (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?624099-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CVIII)
Iron Chef CIX: Tattooed Monk (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?626458-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CIX)
Iron Chef CX: Rage Mage (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?628809-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CX)
Iron Chef CXI: Watch Detective (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?630421-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CXI)
Iron Chef CXII: Spinemeld Warrior (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?632291-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CXII)
Iron Chef CXIII: Celebrant of Sharess (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?633637-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CXIII)
Iron Chef CXIV: Thayan Gladiator (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?635212-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CXIV)
Iron Chef CXV: Shining Blade of Heironeous (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?637097-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CXV)
Iron Chef CXVI: Peregrine Runner (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?638522-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-in-the-Playground-CXVI)

The Viscount

2021-12-15, 12:21 AM

FAQ:
Q: What's this even about?
A: I'm glad you asked, actually... (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=15415117&postcount=1)

Q: Is Dragon Compendium Allowed?
A: Yes (as well as its Errata), but individual issues of Dragon Magazine are not.

Q: What about 3.0 materials?
A: 3.0 materials, whether online or in printed form, are allowed unless they've been officially updated to a 3.5 edition.

Q: Are Dragonlance, Ravenloft, Planescape, Dark Sun, or Kingdoms of Kalamar allowable sources?
A: The Dragonlance Campaign Setting is allowed, but the subsequent books for Dragonlance are considered 3rd party, and are therefore not eligible, despite the "WotC approved" status of those books. The same holds for Oriental Adventures (1st party) and the subsequent Rokugan books (3rd party). Materials from Ravenloft, Planescape, Dark Sun, and Kingdoms of Kalamar are considered 3rd party for purposes of this contest, and are therefore not allowed.

Q: What about online sources in general?
A: If the online source is a) published by WotC, and b) not replaced by an updated version at a later time, it is eligible. Use it, link it.

Q: Where's the line drawn with "acceptable/unacceptable" for Unearthed Arcana? This will likely vary a bit from Chairman to Chairman. Item Familiars and Gestalt have always been verboten, since before IC migrated to GitP; don't expect that to change. Flaws have similarly always been noted as warranting a deduction; while I am Chairman, I'm extending that to Traits, though they warrant 1/2 the penalty in Elegance that a Flaw would because they're roughly 1/2 as useful. Alternate spell systems, alternate skill systems and alternate crafting rules all create an uneven playing field, and as such, will be disallowed for as long as I am Chairman. In a similar vein, LA buyoff and fractional BAB are also disallowed. Bloodlines and the Retraining options presented in the PHB2 are ripe for abuse, and will be strongly discouraged as long as I am Chairman. Note that judges are allowed to look askance at any use of Unearthed Arcana not specifically mentioned above, at their discretion, and otherwise penalize Elegance according to their preference.

Q: What, exactly, does the ban on Leadership mean?
A: As folks have started to try to work around the edges of this one, I'm forced to spell it out more plainly. No Leadership, Draconic Cohort, or Feats that grant a similar ability are allowed EXCEPT Wild Cohort. Any PrC you choose with Leadership or a Leadership-analog has that ability entirely ignored for this contest, as it may neither be used nor traded away via any means whatsoever.

Q: What's the minimum score in a category?
A: Assuming an entry is legal, the minimum score in any category is 1. If a judge is convinced that an entry is mechanically illegal by the RAW, the judge may give the build a score of 0 in Elegance, and proceed to judge the entry as if the offending material was not included. Failing to meet a special requirement for a prestige class does not merit a 0, but may qualify for a penalty, at the judge's discretion. Because this contest focuses on Player Characters, an entry that is not technically allowed for a PC, but is viable as an NPC, counts as a legal entry, but may receive a minimum score at the judges' discretion.

Q: Creatures and templates with no listed LA are playable, right?
A: No. No listed LA is equivalent to LA: -. It is not suitable for PCs. If you use it, expect judges to look extremely disfavorably on it.

Q: So what's the deal with equipment, anyway?
A: There is no official policy on how much equipment you should list. Historically, judges have frowned upon "item dependent" builds, but unfortunately the definition of that has been applied to mean anything from builds that don't function if you remove one very specific item, to builds that so much as mention a particular weapon. Builds that don't list gear should be assumed to buy useful generics - items to boost their primary stats, cloaks of resistance, appropriate magical weapons and armor, and so forth. If a build would find particular items useful, they should be listed, but experience suggests that the more generic you keep them, the more favorably judges are likely to look upon them, as a build being shut down because the Thundering Bagpipes of Urist McTrumpetbritches were unavailable is considered a weakness. Similarly, requiring items in order to be able to qualify for things tends to be frowned upon.

Q: Do you have any other rules and guidelines on how to judge?
A: We do, actually, designed to try and avoid unpleasantness we've encountered in past contests. The things we've come up with to avoid repeating this are given below.

One Mistake, One Penalty

Judges are only allowed to penalise once for a given mistake. If someone messes up their skills and doesn't qualify for a PrC, ding them as hard as you like. Once. In one category. You don't then get to declare that because they didn't qualify for that PrC, they don't get those levels, and thus don't qualify for anything else. If Ranger is a common ingredient, ding them for Originality. Once. Don't also take off points for Two-Weapon-Fighting being a common ingredient.

Non-exhaustive list of examples:

Skills

Allowed:

Giving a penalty for miscalculating the number of skill points gained
Giving a penalty for not having enough ranks to meet a prerequisite
Increasing the harshness of a skill miscalculation penalty if it affects critical skills including prereqs

Not allowed:

Giving separate penalties for miscalculating skill points and for non-qualification where the non-qualification is solely caused by the miscalculation

Prereqs

Allowed:

Giving a penalty for not meeting prereqs
Scaling the penalty depending on how important the item that the build failed to qualify for is
Giving minimum score in UotSI for not qualifying for the SI
Not giving credit for (note: not the same as penalising for) tactics using feats or classes other than the SI that were not qualified for (but see below)

Not Allowed:

"Cascading" failures to qualify - declaring that because a build doesn't qualify for a feat, for example, it also doesn't qualify for anything using that feat as a prereq
Treating a build as having fewer levels than it does because of FtQ for classes

Other general things that are no longer allowed:

Penalizing because someone has chosen to build a tribute to an existing creative work
Deciding that a backstory has not met a fluff prerequisite well enough, or because its method of meeting it is "unrealistic". You may penalize if a fluff prereq is not addressed at all, but not for how well it is addressed.
Please don't base your scores off the scores of another judge.

Note that these are protections, not licenses. Deliberately taking a feat that you know you don't qualify for hoping to just suck up the judging penalty for a feat that you couldn't normally take is not okay, and may lead to your build being disqualified.

Q: Do you have any contest house rules or clarifications to ambiguous rules?
A: Some that have come up in previous contests and needed answers to:

All creatures are proficient with any natural weapons they may have or acquire.
Bonus feats that are granted even if you do not meet the prerequisites do not require you to meet the prerequisites in order to use.
Able Learner's benefit applies to the level you take it.
Weapons from soulmelds are considered to be magic weapons for the purpose of overcoming DR.
Unarmed Swordsage grants Improved Unarmed Strike at level 1.
Not finishing Savage Progression is subject to a penalty to Elegance
One dispute per entry. Submit disputes by PM to the Chair.
Ghostwalk ghost is banned
Gold, silver, and bronze are awarded regardless of ties (e.g., 2 silvers does not preclude bronze)
Spelltouched feats are legal and can be taken just like any other feat when you meet the prerequisites and have the feat slot available.

Q: Can I submit more than one entry?
A: You may submit up to two entries into a given competition.

Q: What's with the deadline?
A: For ingredients around the holiday season, we usually give extra cooking time because people are so busy. If chefs need additional time, I'd be happy to extend additionally.

Q: What does the line about Target of Vengeance and Favored Enemy mean?
A: See here. (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25306289&postcount=9)

H_H_F_F

2021-12-15, 05:29 AM

Ugh, arcane caster round.

I don't know whether it's me or the ingredients, but I've been feeling consistently stumped since Thayan Gladiator. Probably me, given how many wonderful entries we've had since then.

My first idea fell apart within a few seconds. My second idea has strong "Why am I even in this class" vibes. I'll try to pull something off.

AvatarVecna

2021-12-15, 06:34 AM

Reasons to not take this class:
Unseen Seer exists

Wildstag

2021-12-15, 12:52 PM

Oh boy, I'm not sure I have enough teenage edge to channel for a prestige class like this. It looks interesting though.

Wolfem

2021-12-15, 01:13 PM

Added placeholder in Iron Chef Optimization (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oyjVU5JmeCnC8YTMqDArDqE5PszHl0Ysadz630kuTGk/edit#gid=0&range=A1224) spreadsheet for this cook.

Zaq

2021-12-17, 11:28 AM

H_H_F_F

2021-12-17, 02:55 PM

I took it to mean you'd take +6 - the full 4 from favored enemy and half from the SI, which would absolutely suck in later levels.

The Viscount

2021-12-17, 11:00 PM

Interesting. My initial idea is a little tame, but I bet if I lean in hard enough then something will pop out the other side.

Request for a Chair ruling! "An Imaskari vengeance taker who has levels in the ranger class may add one-half the bonus noted above (rounded down) to her favored enemy bonus when attacking or using the indicated skills against a target of vengeance that is also one of her favored enemies." Does this replace or augment the ToV bonus? My sincere hope is that it stacks because otherwise it's effectively saying that ranger IVTs are only half as good as non-ranger IVTs, and while that's in-character for WotC (seriously, any opportunity they had to make the ranger worse, they jumped on), I really want to believe that that's not intentional.

So like, if you've got a ranger with favored enemy (animals) at +4 and you've got 4 levels in IVT, if you swear revenge against the white whale, do you get to add a total of +4 or +10 (i.e., +4 from ToV, +4 from FE, +2 from half of ToV added to FE) against the white whale?

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/647393639886094337/920560268151500820/unknown.png

Practice safe optimization. Nobody wants a hernia.

This is troubling text. I agree with you that this does not make sense, but I can't see much else in the way of readings of this text. We can make that "may" do some work.
You may add one-half your ToV bonus to Favored Enemy bonus, treating the sum as your effective favored enemy bonus when dealing with a target of vengeance that is also a favored enemy.
You may elect not to do this, in which case you follow normal rules, gaining full ToV bonus and full Favored Enemy Bonus against a target of vengeance that is also a favored enemy.

Venger

2021-12-17, 11:06 PM

What a terrible class. In to cook.

Gruftzwerg

2021-12-18, 08:59 AM

Dunno if I will enter this round. But I'm curious how poison use will be handled?

poison use = evil?

I mean, the prc gives poison use as an ability but doesn't require you to be evil. On the other hand, IIRC poison use is considered an evil act (by RAW..). It would be nice to clarify this topic before anybody ends up with the wrong alignment here.

So, for the purpose of this contest:
"Does the use of poison automatically make you evil?"

And to further extend the question:
"Can good characters with special codes (e.g. Paladin), or even exalted characters use poison without causing issues?"

The Viscount

2021-12-18, 10:14 AM

Poison use does not automatically change your alignment to Evil. Like other evil acts, it can be balanced out or overcome by good acts.

Paladin specifically cannot use poison, as it is called out in their code of conduct. For other characters, it depends on the specific rules laid out in their class/feat/etc. If it isn't specifically prohibited, I don't see why not.

loky1109

2021-12-18, 10:19 AM

BoED said that only poisons which do ability damage/drain or death is Evil.

Akal Saris

2021-12-18, 12:43 PM

I've played a death attack character before (black flame zealot), and it was actually quite fun to stay hidden for a few rounds and then launch an attack. Reminded me of playing a 2e thief where your first attack out of Hide was the only one that mattered.

Fun fact: Just now I went searching to see if there were some interesting threads on death attacks on the forums, and realized that I was one of the main participants in a thread from 11 years ago :P Yeesh!

Malphegor

2021-12-18, 01:17 PM

It’s weird that this doesn’t demand you be Deep Imaskari when one thinks about it. Maybe the Imaskari hire outsiders to do their dirty work sometimes?

Akal Saris

2021-12-18, 01:29 PM

It’s weird that this doesn’t demand you be Deep Imaskari when one thinks about it. Maybe the Imaskari hire outsiders to do their dirty work sometimes?

They probably have enough trouble recruiting people for this PrC as it is.... ;)

Gruftzwerg

2021-12-18, 02:18 PM

It’s weird that this doesn’t demand you be Deep Imaskari when one thinks about it. Maybe the Imaskari hire outsiders to do their dirty work sometimes?

The recruit from everywhere. As long as a character has the will of vengeance , he is a possible target for the requiting agents of the lodge..^^

The Lodge of the Retributive Masters recruits from everywhere in the Upperdark, and even from the surface, though its recruiters travel there only by night.

The Viscount

2021-12-18, 05:51 PM

BoED said that only poisons which do ability damage/drain or death is Evil.

Yes, this is the more accurate statement.

Gruftzwerg

2021-12-18, 11:43 PM

BoED said that only poisons which do ability damage/drain or death is Evil.

Yes, this is the more accurate statement.

I'm aware of that, but that doesn't solve the contradicting state of the rules.

A)
3.0 BoED says:
"Using poison that deals ability damage is an evil act because it causes undue suffering in the process of incapacitating or killing an opponent. Of the poisons described in the Dungeon Master’s Guide, only one is acceptable for good characters to use: oil of taggit, which deals no damage but causes unconsciousness."

B)
3.5 DMG says:
"The purchase and possession of poison is always illegal, and even in big cities it can be obtained only from specialized, less than reputable sources."

The primary source is the DMG Poison section. Thus the BoED "Ravages and Afflictions" section has no right to change these rules. It's the "ravages and affliction" paragraph and not a poison paragraph in BoED. The Primary Source Rule demands that we follow the DMG. BoED doesn't show any intent to change the Poison rules, but also has no right to add to the rules. So by RAW, BoED is to be ignored.

Which leaves us with the problem that Imaskari Vengeance Taker need to be lawful, while they get the poison use ability...

____

so.. let me ask you gently again.

Do we want this mess to influence the judges?

Bearing the risk that the judges may have different interpretations and views that may automatically disqualify multiple builds. And while one judge maybe has problems with A), the other judge maybe have problems with B).

Imho this will just kill the fun in the competition. So we would be best advised to settle this before everybody invest time into builds who would face harsh judgements because of this..

edit: and the rabbit hole goes even deeper...
Normally, if you want to stay "lawful" and use illegal items you need 2 feats (!) to accomplish that. Do we want to force all builds who wanna stay "lawful" to invest into those otherwise useless feats? Or do we wanna accept that all Imaskari Vengeance taker need to be "lawful" to enter, while becoming "non lawful" by their use of their given abilities? Note that the DMG makes no difference between poison that does ability dmg/death and those those with other effects. All poisons are illegal if we follow the DMG (even Drow wine...and if you really go to full extend all alcoholic drinks could be illegal..)..

Really, I hope that we can ignore this ballast.. Otherwise we will be left with really poor looking builds who are afraid of using their class skills or have so much invested into untold requirements that most builds will feel/look the same.

Rebel7284

2021-12-19, 03:39 AM

loky1109

2021-12-19, 05:58 AM

The purchase and possession of poison is always illegal
First. Legality doesn't have direct connection with lawfulness.
Second. "Always illegal"? Really? In Menzoberranzan, too?

The primary source is the DMG Poison section. Thus the BoED "Ravages and Afflictions" section has no right to change these rules.
I don't see how DMG and BoED contradict each other. Illegal doesn't means Evil.

Gruftzwerg

2021-12-19, 07:43 AM

I probably won't have the spoons to post a build, but in my opinion, we can accept that it's likely that:
1. A given Imaskari Vengeance Taker is likely to perform chaotic actions and possibly even evil actions at some point in their career.
2. Neither of those types of actions are guaranteed to shift the alignment for any particular Imaskari Vengeance Taker.

For example, if a Retributive Master asks the PC to use poison on a particular quest, obeying your code of obedience is lawful, using poison is chaotic. Overall, the effect on alignment may very well be 0.
I would be happy if we could agree on this, since this is not what RAW would dictate.
We have feats that accomplish this, so one would expect that a prc who wants the same fiat, would need to either have those feats or an ability that grants the same.
So, we either live with the mess (not a fan of this option) or we assume these things for the Imakari Vengeance Taker as general DM fiat for this contest (imho the better option for more build diversity and less judging problems).

First. Legality doesn't have direct connection with lawfulness.
Second. "Always illegal"? Really? In Menzoberranzan, too?
This is why I'm so offended by this rule. If we follow the DMG, all poisons are illegal. This includes even such simple things as Drow Wine in Menzoberranzan (unless you can find a rule that calls out an exception, dunno if we have one). And any character that wants to stay on the lawful side, would need to take 2 feats to not get problems with the authority (and imho his alignment). Heck, even antitoxins would be illegal since you need poisons to create most of em.

I don't see how DMG and BoED contradict each other. Illegal doesn't means Evil.

1. Before they even might cause a conflict, BoED lacks the permission to provide new rules for this topic. BoED is the primary source for for extreme "good" things. If the said quote would have been in the BoVD, we could argue that the book is the primary source for being evil. You can't throw rules about being "evil" into a book that claims that it provides rules for being "good". From a RAW standpoint, this doesn't work. The same goes for putting new poison rules into the "Ravages and Afflictions" section of a book that doesn't deal with poisons in the first place.

2. Anything that doesn't quote the primary source rules correctly, contradicts em. Even just trying to add rules is a contradiction. You would need to create a specific niche exception or call out that you are going to change rules.
The "Ravages and Afflictions" section is not a specific exception/niche of poisons. Nor do they call out that they wanna change/add rules.

loky1109

2021-12-19, 08:11 AM

I can't understand why you think lawful character can't do illegal things.

BoED lacks the permission to provide new rules for this topic. BoED is the primary source for for extreme "good" things.
Can't agree with it.

You can't throw rules about being "evil" into a book that claims that it provides rules for being "good".
Of course I can and should. Or we should agree that good character can't fall via evil doings. Evil and Good aren't separate themes, it is single theme.

From a RAW standpoint, this doesn't work.
Your reading of RAW mostly doesn't work at all. It is very weird in most cases.
Plus, this challenge isn't about TO, more about PO, so your totally unworkable in any real game RAW readings don't matter. Even if them work.

Anything that doesn't quote the primary source rules correctly, contradicts em.
Wat???

I read your post to very end and... I don't want to discuss with you. Your rules reading is so... strange, so obviously wrong, and uncomfortable, but you defend it so stubborny... I even want add you in ignore list to not to see your posts. This is kinda achievement.

WhamBamSam

2021-12-19, 08:45 AM

I have at least one idea for this that I quite like. In to cook.

Gruftzwerg

2021-12-19, 09:49 AM

I can't understand why you think lawful character can't do illegal things.

Can't agree with it.

Of course I can and should. Or we should agree that good character can't fall via evil doings. Evil and Good aren't separate themes, it is single theme.

Your reading of RAW mostly doesn't work at all. It is very weird in most cases.
Plus, this challenge isn't about TO, more about PO, so your totally unworkable in any real game RAW readings don't matter. Even if them work.

Wat???

I read your post to very end and... I don't want to discuss with you. You rules reading is so... strange, so obviously wrong, and uncomfortable, but you defend it so stubborny... I even want add you in ignore list to not to see your posts. This is kinda achievement.

Sorry if you have a hard time to differentiate what RAW is and how the PSR affects this.
BoED can at best only create rules for "evil" in context of "exalted" characters (which would be a specific exception), cause that's the topic of the book. Exalted, not evil. The PSR creates structures with books and topics. If you ignore this, than your interpretation becomes RAI at best and ain't RAW anymore.

So, if you want to know if poisons are evil, the sources to consult should be:

1. general alignment rules (the primary source for alignments in the PHB)
2. possible specific "evil" rules (anything mentioned in the BoVD)
3. possible even more specific poison rules regarding alignment (anything mentioned in the DMG Poison section)

What buffs me the most in our discussions between the two of us here is, how you are sole presenting your opinion without any logical argument (e.g. "I can't agree with this", so yeah what is your interpretation of the situation then??). That doesn't help in a conversation. So, if your desire is to ignore my posts, you just lose the opportunity that one of us (either me or you) might understand the position of the other. And that is sad. Ignoring people with different opinions is counterproductive if you want to discuss something (that's what the forum is about: discussion things).

And btw, while most judges favor PO, doesn't mean that TO is forbidden in these contests. It's in the opening posts.

_____________________

I have 2 possible build ideas, but unless this topic is settled I dunno if I will invest the time into them.

loky1109

2021-12-19, 10:01 AM

Troacctid

2021-12-19, 10:19 AM

I'm with loky here. Your reading is nonsensical, Gruftzwerg. You're arguing that general rules supersede specific ones. That's not how this works. That's not how any of this works.

Gruftzwerg

2021-12-19, 10:52 AM

Different opinion isn't thing.
I just taking mind pain when reading your arguments. Even in rare cases when I agree with you.
_________
I'm very sorry for off topic.
I have some ideas, but don't like them.

It's not that I don't like to hear opinions. I love to hear different opinions on a topic. But if you don't provide any argument with your opinion, all I can say is: "yeah, that is your opinion". If you provide an argument, I could think about it if I was wrong or tell why I don't think your argument applies.
And I'm sorry if this causes headaches for you, but you are not alone. We all share the pain of rules even without discussion. The problem is the bad editing of 3.5 here and not the people discussing. I can just wish that you find a way to take these discussions less stressful. Believe me that I bear no ill intentions here, cause I have been there myself (stressed by rules and rule discussions). But if we can leave negative emotions aside, rule discussion can be very fun too (the sometimes silly conclusions/consequences that a RAW interpretation would have... like "poison = always illegal..= drow wine in menzob. also illegal :smallbiggrin: ).

I'm with loky here. Your reading is nonsensical, Gruftzwerg. You're arguing that general rules supersede specific ones. That's not how this works. That's not how any of this works.

No, i'm arguing that BoED has neither topic supremacy over poisons, nor for evil.
Further, I'm arguing that the sole specific exception it may create is for "exalted characters", the topic where the book has supremacy.

Conclusion: BoED creates a niche for exalted characters that poisons with ability dmg/death are evil. But sole for exalted characters, not for characters overall. It's "Specific Trumps General", and not "Specific becomes General".

Rebel7284

2021-12-19, 11:57 AM

No, i'm arguing that BoED has neither topic supremacy over poisons, nor for evil.
Further, I'm arguing that the sole specific exception it may create is for "exalted characters", the topic where the book has supremacy.

Conclusion: BoED creates a niche for exalted characters that poisons with ability dmg/death are evil. But sole for exalted characters, not for characters overall. It's "Specific Trumps General", and not "Specific becomes General".

You don't get to just ignore rules because in your opinion they aren't on-topic enough. The primary source rules are very poorly defined, but no matter how you define them, they only apply if there is a contradiction. Both DMG and BoED rules can be applied together without a conflict.

As for your assertion that evil and chaotic acts MUST shift alignment, that is simply wrong. Looking at the rules for alignment in the DMG p. 134, you three things:

1. Alignment Change Is Gradual
2. Time Requirements: Changing alignment usually takes time.
3. The example of Garret clearly has the player performing a pattern of behavior over multiple sessions in order to cause alignment to change.

and most importantly:
4. You’re in Control: You control alignment changes, not the
players.

So, clearly, the DMG expects the DMs to look at a pattern of behavior over time and make a judgement call. Again, this is overall pattern of behavior, including context and such!

Gruftzwerg

2021-12-19, 12:22 PM

You don't get to just ignore rules because in your opinion they aren't on-topic enough. The primary source rules are very poorly defined, but no matter how you define them, they only apply if there is a contradiction. Both DMG and BoED rules can be applied together without a conflict.
Let me try to give a real life example:
If you wanna look up your consumer rights regarding a situation, would you search for em in the traffic laws? I assume, you would start with the laws regarding consumer rights. Unless your situation ain't traffic specific, the traffic laws won't help.

Now, if you wanna know if poison use in 3.5 is evil, we have two sources regarding the situation:
1. BoVD provides rules for the topic "evil"
2. DMG Poison section provides rules for the topic "poisons"
3. BoED can at best create specific rules for "exalted characters". It can't provide new global rules for "evil" nor for "poisons".

As for your assertion that evil and chaotic acts MUST shift alignment, that is simply wrong. Looking at the rules for alignment in the DMG p. 134, you three things:

1. Alignment Change Is Gradual
2. Time Requirements: Changing alignment usually takes time.
3. The example of Garret clearly has the player performing a pattern of behavior over multiple sessions in order to cause alignment to change.

and most importantly:
4. You’re in Control: You control alignment changes, not the
players.

So, clearly, the DMG expects the DMs to look at a pattern of behavior over time and make a judgement call. Again, this is overall pattern of behavior, including context and such!

Sure, the change doesn't happen overnight. But we can't deny that the prc gives "poison use". And if the character is going to use that ability on a regular base (which is the normal chase when you get an ability) he will have the alignment shift. And lets better not question how you obtained the ability to safely apply poison (trough training I would assume, which would be a pattern of behavior..).

The rule situation ain't that simple as it might look like on first impression here.

loky1109

2021-12-19, 01:30 PM

It's not that I don't like to hear opinions. I love to hear different opinions on a topic. But if you don't provide any argument with your opinion, all I can say is: "yeah, that is your opinion". If you provide an argument, I could think about it if I was wrong or tell why I don't think your argument applies.
And I'm sorry if this causes headaches for you, but you are not alone. We all share the pain of rules even without discussion. The problem is the bad editing of 3.5 here and not the people discussing. I can just wish that you find a way to take these discussions less stressful. Believe me that I bear no ill intentions here, cause I have been there myself (stressed by rules and rule discussions). But if we can leave negative emotions aside, rule discussion can be very fun too (the sometimes silly conclusions/consequences that a RAW interpretation would have... like "poison = always illegal..= drow wine in menzob. also illegal :smallbiggrin: ).

No, i'm arguing that BoED has neither topic supremacy over poisons, nor for evil.
Further, I'm arguing that the sole specific exception it may create is for "exalted characters", the topic where the book has supremacy.

Conclusion: BoED creates a niche for exalted characters that poisons with ability dmg/death are evil. But sole for exalted characters, not for characters overall. It's "Specific Trumps General", and not "Specific becomes General".

Ok. I try. I think I understood something.
Your mindset looks very GURPSy. There is book about spaceships and it is only for spaceships. Rules from it don't work for seaships or aircrafts, only for spaceships. There is book about ninja and rules work only for ninjas. Assassins, theifs etc. go further.
By default works only core rules and GM can add some splatbooks if think they need.

D&D 3.5 is different story. By default works all rules together. DM can turn some books off, but if he didn't they create single rulefield. All rules work for all creatures/characters in the same manner. There are no different poison rules for regular and for exalted persons. As like as different alignment rules for Evil, not so evil, Good, and Exalted Good characters.

If all be as you tell... Well, when I was exalted person, I can use drow poison and didn't afraid to fall, but since I broke one rule I can't do this. I still Good, but now if I use any poison, even drow I'll fall toward Evil... This is as stupid as it sounds!

H_H_F_F

2021-12-19, 02:06 PM

Rebel7284

2021-12-19, 02:10 PM

Let me try to give a real life example:
If you wanna look up your consumer rights regarding a situation, would you search for em in the traffic laws? I assume, you would start with the laws regarding consumer rights. Unless your situation ain't traffic specific, the traffic laws won't help.

The idea that D&D is as well organized as the legal system is laughable. In addition, unless your situation is REAL basic, there are often multiple laws that are tangentially related to a single situation. That's why people hire lawyers in the first place!

Now, if you wanna know if poison use in 3.5 is evil, we have two sources regarding the situation:
1. BoVD provides rules for the topic "evil"

BOVD does no such thing. It provides a bunch of rules text and fluff on a ton of different topics. The book is thematically organized around the idea of evil, sure, but I don't see how that's remotely relevant.

2. DMG Poison section provides rules for the topic "poisons"

Correct, and does not forbid these rules from being expanded in other books later as long as there aren't any contradictions.

3. BoED can at best create specific rules for "exalted characters". It can't provide new global rules for "evil" nor for "poisons".

Writers can and do put whatever rules they want into whatever book they want. We all know that 3.5 is poorly organized, but you are clearly in the minority here in your belief that poorly placed rules don't apply. In addition, if you apply your logic more universally, it falls apart very quickly. How can other books add base classes when there is an explicit exhaustive list of all base classes in the PHB!? PHB is clearly the primary source for base classes! Other base classes must not exist!

The rule situation ain't that simple as it might look like on first impression here.

Exactly! When you have complex, context-dependent situations, it's up for the DM to make the final ruling!

It's certainly fair to point out game elements that can nudge the decision in a particular direction, but when you are dealing with something as complex as D&D alignment that asks the DM to use a combination of common sense and some objective alignment rules that often don't make sense to come to a particular decision, trying to claim a particular result is guaranteed feels disingenuous, especially when the rest of your argument is "by the way, I can ignore poorly places rules."

Gruftzwerg

2021-12-19, 03:13 PM

May I suggest one of you guys starts a new thread to discuss this issue? This has come out of the realm of discussing poison use for the SI, and has become a general discussion about the ways rules should be read.
Normally ambiguous rules regarding the SI are solved directly in this thread or via PM to "The Viscount" if it is build specific (and thus would reveal to much of the build).
Since "poison use" is part of the SI I think this is the intended way to solve this.

(Nobody forces you to take part in the discussion if you don't want, and nobody stops you from making your regular posts about the challenge).

Ok. I try. I think I understood something.
Your mindset looks very GURPSy. There is book about spaceships and it is only for spaceships. Rules from it don't work for seaships or aircrafts, only for spaceships. There is book about ninja and rules work only for ninjas. Assassins, theifs etc. go further.
By default works only core rules and GM can add some splatbooks if think they need.

D&D 3.5 is different story. By default works all rules together. DM can turn some books off, but if he didn't they create single rulefield. All rules work for all creatures/characters in the same manner. There are no different poison rules for regular and for exalted persons. As like as different alignment rules for Evil, not so evil, Good, and Exalted Good characters.

If all be as you tell... Well, when I was exalted person, I can use drow poison and didn't afraid to fall, but since I broke one rule I can't do this. I still Good, but now if I use any poison, even drow I'll fall toward Evil... This is as stupid as it sounds!
3.5 structures rules. It provides a primary source for each topic and than allows specific exceptions to trump those general rules for their niche. These exceptions have supremacy for their niche and not for the overall topic. It's "Specific Trumps General" not "Specific becomes General". Pls stop ignoring this.

The idea that D&D is as well organized as the legal system is laughable. In addition, unless your situation is REAL basic, there are often multiple laws that are tangentially related to a single situation. That's why people hire lawyers in the first place!

BOVD does no such thing. It provides a bunch of rules text and fluff on a ton of different topics. The book is thematically organized around the idea of evil, sure, but I don't see how that's remotely relevant.
Really? Have a look at the very first sentence in the BoVD pls:

Book of Vile Darkness is a sourcebook of evil.
and while we are at it, for the sake of completeness:

While the Book of Vile Darkness concerns itself with all things evil, dealing with the most reprehensible subjects ever covered in the DUNGEONS & DRAGONS game, this book tackles the opposite subject.
I assume that we can agree that the opposite of "evil" is "good" and thus the BoED has supremacy over the topic "good" and not "evil".

Correct, and does not forbid these rules from being expanded in other books later as long as there aren't any contradictions.
That would be a specific exception for a niche (as said) and not a new general rule.

Writers can and do put whatever rules they want into whatever book they want.
Contradicts the book and topic supremacy mentioned in the PSR. No, the PSR penalizes any rules not in the right place. Otherwise you ignore book and topic supremacy.

We all know that 3.5 is poorly organized, but you are clearly in the minority here in your belief that poorly placed rules don't apply. In addition, if you apply your logic more universally, it falls apart very quickly. How can other books add base classes when there is an explicit exhaustive list of all base classes in the PHB!? PHB is clearly the primary source for base classes! Other base classes must not exist!
At the beginning you said that most people (majority) rely on lawyers to understand/interpret laws. Now you wanna decide what is RAW (similar to laws) by majority? Sorry but there is no guaranty that the majority is right when it comes to RAW. RAW is decided by applying the PSR to the rule texts.

Exactly! When you have complex, context-dependent situations, it's up for the DM to make the final ruling!

It's certainly fair to point out game elements that can nudge the decision in a particular direction, but when you are dealing with something as complex as D&D alignment that asks the DM to use a combination of common sense and some objective alignment rules that often don't make sense to come to a particular decision, trying to claim a particular result is guaranteed feels disingenuous, especially when the rest of your argument is "by the way, I can ignore poorly places rules."
Let us revert to my original statement:

Do we want this mess to influence the judges?
Are you really fine that each judge should decide this for himself?
While those who cook the builds have to blindly hope that the majority of the judges favors the chef's point of view.
Keep in mind that someone with my point of view could also end up on a judge spot.
I don't think that it would be healthy to ignore this issue and would love to solve this for sake the contest itself.
This is why I would like to have a reliable guideline how the contest sets the rules and not having each judge decide for themselves.

mattie_p

2021-12-19, 03:43 PM

There's been plenty of discussion, I would love to hear from the chair at this point. In the absence of a ruling, it will be in the judges hands, as it so often is.

H_H_F_F

2021-12-19, 04:38 PM

Normally ambiguous rules regarding the SI are solved directly in this thread or via PM to "The Viscount" if it is build specific (and thus would reveal to much of the build).
Since "poison use" is part of the SI I think this is the intended way to solve this.

My point was that it seemed to me at the time of posting that the discussion was getting away from "the SI's poison use" and into territory of "how does the primary source rule interact with the specific trumps general rule", which seems outside the scope of this thread. I felt that perhaps that discussion, despite having implications for this contest, would be better placed in a new thread.

(Nobody forces you to take part in the discussion if you don't want, and nobody stops you from making your regular posts about the challenge).

Of course. Never implied otherwise.

The Viscount

2021-12-19, 11:08 PM

Please make a separate thread if anyone wishes to continue this discussion about sourcebooks and primacy.

As for the original question posed.
The DMG's line about poisons simply isn't accurate. For example, drink-and-tell mead is a poison with provided stats in page 59 of Races of Stone, and is clearly not illegal as it is common and openly used in Goliath society.

More importantly, as has been pointed out, Lawful alignment isn't just about following the rules set by the local government. A lawful character need not always follow the local laws at all time, provided they have some consistent credo or ruleset for governing their behavior, such as the code of conduct followed by Imaskari Vengeance Takers.

If it'll make you feel better I'll say it with authority.
Imaskari Vengeance Takers are not considered to be at risk for becoming nonlawful simply for using poison.

Are we good?

Wildstag

2021-12-19, 11:34 PM

As for the original question posed.
The DMG's line about poisons simply isn't accurate. For example, drink-and-tell mead is a poison with provided stats in page 59 of Races of Stone, and is clearly not illegal as it is common and openly used in Goliath society.

Ackshually... Goliaths are typically Chaotic Neutral, so it could be an unlawful thing to do...

AvatarVecna

2021-12-19, 11:48 PM

Personally if I was going to point to a reason this class is stupid if "lawful=follows the law", I'd point out you're essentially joining a vigilante organization. You're not even doing the Batman thing where you hurt people who did bad things to others - entering the class requires you to pay back somebody who hurt you. The class isn't called "justice taker", it's called "vengeance taker". You're not Batman, you're not even The Punisher, you're just as *******.

...speaking of Punisher, I feel like discussing the lawfulness of vigilante vengeance might be a bit too spicy for this forum.

Gruftzwerg

2021-12-20, 12:06 AM

My point was that it seemed to me at the time of posting that the discussion was getting away from "the SI's poison use" and into territory of "how does the primary source rule interact with the specific trumps general rule", which seems outside the scope of this thread. I felt that perhaps that discussion, despite having implications for this contest, would be better placed in a new thread.

I get what you are saying. But try to see it from my point of view. I#m one of the few people here on the forum that include the PSR in their thoughts and explanations. Most people aren't either aware of the rule or don't bother to much with it since they don't get the full extend of the rule. If I would do that every time (open a new thread for the PSR) we would have multiple threads for it in a month...

But what saddens me the most is, that while multiple people get offended and jump into the discussion, we all seem to have missed that "Poisons" have their own section in the BoVD. I know that I skimmed over the index last night and it looks that I have missed it somehow. The question is, did everybody miss it? Imho this seems unrealistic. So, people start to argue without consulting the sources first. And that is a problem. Due to the scattered rules in 3.5 we rely on the hive mind of the forum to not miss any relevant text passages. Last night, we all have managed to miss it somehow. The discussion could have been shortened if people (including me, since I let myself drag into these discussion) would be more focused on the outcome of the discussion instead to just argue.

____________

So, the updated status of "Poison Use":

1. DMG - Poison section calls out that poisons are illegal everywhere.

2. BoVD - calls itself out as sourcebook for "evil" and has a "poison" section.

3. Funny enough is that the "Harvesting Venom" paragraph from BoVD has a less restrictive view on legality:

"There is no open market for poison raw materials, because the use of poison is often illegal, or at least rarely admitted to."
The problem here is that by RAW at least, this contradicts the DMG. And since "law" ain't the topic of BoVD, it has no permission to change rules regarding the legality. But this could be seen as indicator for RAI!

4. BoVD doesn't differentiate between evil and non evil poisons use.

5. BoED does differentiate between evil and non-evil poisons use.
Here we have a similar problem as with (3). BoED has supremacy over "good" and not "evil". Thus, it has no permission to alter any general rules (found in BoVD) for "evil". BoED would have the permission to call some poisons out as good, but that is not the chase here. Again, RAW says "nope", but it is a good indicator for RAI.

my conclusion so far (unless we are still missing relevant rules..?): we have 3 options

A) By RAW, "Poison Use" is always illegal and always evil. The most restrictive interpretation with the least build diversity.

B) By RAI, "Poison Use" can be evil or not depending on the poison type and is in most areas illegal. A bit less restrive for builds.

C) Ignore all the alignment stuff for "Poison Use" and sole focus on the "lawful" requirement for the SI. This would increase build diversity the most but would rely on "DM fiat".

As said, for the sake of the chefs in the contest, it would be nice to settle this before people invest times into build who might end up with the wrong alignment. Leaving it open for each judge ( virtually multiple DMs ) is just an unnecessary risk for the chefs. Normally (in real games) you deal with one DM. Here we are dealing with multiple judges who all might have different opinions on this SI relevant topic since RAW and RAI differ so much.

edit:

Personally if I was going to point to a reason this class is stupid if "lawful=follows the law", I'd point out you're essentially joining a vigilante organization. You're not even doing the Batman thing where you hurt people who did bad things to others - entering the class requires you to pay back somebody who hurt you. The class isn't called "justice taker", it's called "vengeance taker". You're not Batman, you're not even The Punisher, you're just as *******.

...speaking of Punisher, I feel like discussing the lawfulness of vigilante vengeance might be a bit too spicy for this forum.

I agree with both points.
Which pushes me slightly towards option (C). Just have the required alignment (lawful) and don't bother with the rest.

edit 2:

Please make a separate thread if anyone wishes to continue this discussion about sourcebooks and primacy.

As for the original question posed.
The DMG's line about poisons simply isn't accurate. For example, drink-and-tell mead is a poison with provided stats in page 59 of Races of Stone, and is clearly not illegal as it is common and openly used in Goliath society.

More importantly, as has been pointed out, Lawful alignment isn't just about following the rules set by the local government. A lawful character need not always follow the local laws at all time, provided they have some consistent credo or ruleset for governing their behavior, such as the code of conduct followed by Imaskari Vengeance Takers.

If it'll make you feel better I'll say it with authority.
Imaskari Vengeance Takers are not considered to be at risk for becoming nonlawful simply for using poison.

Are we good?
thx, and sorry for the post. I had the tap open for over an hours and didn't notice that you answered in the meanwhile..
Could you also settle the "evil" thing as final request? Do we follow BoVD (RAW) or BoED (RAI). Or do we completely ignore it (c).

The Viscount

2021-12-20, 12:52 AM

I don't know that judges would make a big deal of it, but if you must know:

Poison use always being illegal A doesn't make any sense and B obviously isn't true. Ignore this part. As mentioned, legality is immaterial since Lawful alignment isn't just about doing what local laws say.

Poison use by strictest RAW is an evil act. However, as said before, using poison does not automatically change a creature's alignment towards evil. There are a wide array of magical beasts and animals with poison who are neutral, so clearly liberal use does not by itself push you over. The pseudodragon is an Int 10 creature that's always neutral good, so clearly it can be done. There are various actions that can overcome or balance out its use.

Short answer: B, but with some refinement.

Any further questions on this front should be via PM.

Gruftzwerg

2021-12-20, 01:03 AM

Seward

2021-12-20, 08:59 PM

Ok, I'm in. I see one thing in the ingredient it'll be fun to play with, a way to try to pull in the other class features into character behavior and can try to improve in areas where I didn't do as well last time, including actually cooking long enough to avoid using salt instead of sugar at a key moment.

Something I'm stuck on. Poison crafting rules, both from "scratch" or by harvesting from animals.

AEG has some stuff, but it is really old and I don't know if it was superseded, clarified or what. I assume from dmg, it is just a "Craft Poison" check with usual rules (including xxx creation and fabricate rules since we are talking arcane casters here) with dc's similar to those in the AEG tables (15-25 for most, a few more rare taking more and maybe some things like drow sleep poison not normally craftable) but as the whole prior discussion goes, there are some sources I have never read (BOED and LM among them) so if the consensus is that the final ruleset for 3.5 indicated something else, I'd like to know before I get too deep into cooking with craft poison and ancillary spells (simply buying poisons still works assuming appropriate social skills/background fluff but you can go broke quickly that way if you have alternatives)

The Viscount

2021-12-20, 11:16 PM

The most up to date version of poisonmaking rules is found in Complete Adventurer under Craft, to the best of my knowledge.

Seward

2021-12-22, 12:52 PM

CA rules are pretty much the same as AEG with a different poison table, so I'm good to go on that front.

Thanks.

H_H_F_F

2021-12-30, 07:57 AM

I finally have something for this round.

It's not a winner by any stretch of the imagination, but it's something.

Zaq

2021-12-30, 11:17 AM

My idea's finally coming together. Now I just have to actually write it. But at least I think I know what I'm trying to do...

This is not technically a protest build.

Seward

2021-12-30, 11:57 AM

I got snowed in for a week, so spent a lot of time cooking (both real world and this project). I got to last night where I was bumping up against the maximum character count and just tinkering a few words here and there and decided to send it in before I messed up and broke the formatting or somehow deleted something beyond recall.

The weather's probably going to break a bit over the next couple days, and I need to think about other stuff. Today it's just shoveling the snow off my and my sister's car. Again. And continuing the seige of Fort Box (all the moving boxes packed into our spare bedroom that need to be unpacked and sorted)

I already miss California. (cue California Dreaming https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-aK6JnyFmk by the Mommas and Poppas)

loky1109

2021-12-30, 12:05 PM

I have idea. I'll try to build it.

WhamBamSam

2021-12-30, 12:37 PM

My idea's finally coming together. Now I just have to actually write it. But at least I think I know what I'm trying to do...

This is not technically a protest build."It's not a protest build... It's a VENGEANCE build!"

H_H_F_F

2021-12-30, 12:51 PM

Seward

2021-12-30, 01:26 PM

"It's not a protest build... It's a VENGEANCE build!"

Yeah.

This organization....

A secret society dedicated to righting wrongs

pretty much only by assassination.

Interfere with righting a wrong? You go on the list too.

take vengeance on those who deserve justice, on those who commit crimes against creatures protected by the Retributive Masters, and on those who impede the vengeance taker in her task

I don't imagine many of these characters will be very nice people, or especially popular with other party members.

"Hey guys, lets have some downtime. 2 days in the city!"

"Yeah. Last time we did that you hid in the tavern for 32 hours, prepared spells for an hour then vanished for an hour and the gate guard that disrespected you ended up dead."

"Coincidence!" (bluff is an IVT class skill after all)

God I miss snow.

It is considerably less enticing (although it is pretty) when you spent the week you should have spent buying everything socializing with family members that hadn't seen you in 2 years, had a storm blow in and barely made it back with nothing but travel snacks and a few bricks of cheese because your car was too packed with moving stuff to fit anything more than "whatever fits in my wife's lap". We did manage one shopping spree at a local grocery store after 8" of snow but before it all iced over, and have food but no boots, waterproof gloves, etc, and we're sharing a $3.99 combination brush and ice scraper bought on that trip with my sister who moved in during the summer and isn't used to snow yet either that is doing all the work we should be using snow shovels, brooms etc for.

We formerly lived 30 years in the Bay Area and figured it would be smarter to buy the cold weather stuff up here than to buy a crappy, inadequate version there. We were both right and wrong. Once we stop being iced-in and manage a day of shopping (our new Subaru can handle snow and torrential rain, and has proved it already) this will get a lot better. At least we're learning the hard way what we need. And our elderly dog turns out to love snow. We think he experienced it as a puppy.

We had compelling reasons to make the move and to do it when we did, in spite of the risks of travel etc in winter. We were rolling hot dice until the last week, mostly getting away with it. Something like this was bound to happen, and it could have been worse.

H_H_F_F

2021-12-30, 02:08 PM

It is considerably less enticing (although it is pretty) when you spent the week you should have spent buying everything socializing with family members that hadn't seen you in 2 years, had a storm blow in and barely made it back with nothing but travel snacks and a few bricks of cheese because your car was too packed with moving stuff to fit anything more than "whatever fits in my wife's lap". We did manage one shopping spree at a local grocery store after 8" of snow but before it all iced over, and have food but no boots, waterproof gloves, etc, and we're sharing a $3.99 combination brush and ice scraper bought on that trip with my sister who moved in during the summer and isn't used to snow yet either that is doing all the work we should be using snow shovels, brooms etc for.

We formerly lived 30 years in the Bay Area and figured it would be smarter to buy the cold weather stuff up here than to buy a crappy, inadequate version there. We were both right and wrong. Once we stop being iced-in and manage a day of shopping (our new Subaru can handle snow and torrential rain, and has proved it already) this will get a lot better. At least we're learning the hard way what we need. And our elderly dog turns out to love snow. We think he experienced it as a puppy.

We had compelling reasons to make the move and to do it when we did, in spite of the risks of travel etc in winter. We were rolling hot dice until the last week, mostly getting away with it. Something like this was bound to happen, and it could have been worse.

Oh man, that sounds like an experience.

I still envy you though. I got lost in the mountains above Bergen once in the middle of winter. Made it out with blue fingertips and the shakes. Didn't make me love snow any less.

I may be a kindred spirit with your dog.

loky1109

2022-01-02, 04:25 AM

I sent my entry.
It's very weird, as I can see.

H_H_F_F

2022-01-02, 07:08 AM

I have two entries I'm working on. I'm not in love with either, but I think they will be worth the judges' time.

Speaking of which, do we have any confirmed judges this round?

loky1109

2022-01-05, 06:47 PM

I have two more ideas and... How bad is this SI... It comes with big price and gives a few much than nothing. (((

H_H_F_F

2022-01-05, 06:50 PM

I'm pretty settled on one entry, I'm debating whether or not the other one is worth submitting.

The Viscount

2022-01-05, 08:52 PM

Probably, time permitting. I'm not sitting on many entries at this moment, so unless a lot of people are holding on to their entries, it won't be a large round.

Gruftzwerg

2022-01-05, 08:58 PM

Probably, time permitting. I'm not sitting on many entries at this moment, so unless a lot of people are holding on to their entries, it won't be a large round.

Still don't know If I have the time to make it till the deadline. I'm trying to find some time...

1-2 builds possible

Seward

2022-01-05, 10:02 PM

Still snowed in and kinda got an idea for another entry. If the rain that we're supposed to get tonight is snow instead maybe I'll have time to do a second.

SO many things I should be doing....but can't.

I have two more ideas and... How bad is this SI... It comes with big price and gives a few much than nothing. (((

What? You don't think Sneak Attack AND Favored Enemy is worth a caster level? Plus a good skill list but with only 4 skill points a level?

Plus POISON use, which is so good that we took away that first sneak attack die we were gonna give.

The strange thing is, I actually think a party with 4 of these guys could actually be pretty dangerous if they did their adventures in a kinda nonstandard way. I did a D&D-like game where half the party were assassin-types and wow, it didn't go at all like your typical murderhobo-gatecrasher party.

loky1109

2022-01-06, 03:12 AM

What? You don't think Sneak Attack AND Favored Enemy is worth a caster level? Plus a good skill list but with only 4 skill points a level?

Plus POISON use, which is so good that we took away that first sneak attack die we were gonna give.

Sarcasm?

I mean it is bad for my ideas. Not at all. And there is Unseen Seer.

WhamBamSam

2022-01-06, 06:54 AM

I'm done with everything but fluff, which I'll try to knock out when I have time on Saturday morning.

H_H_F_F

2022-01-06, 07:25 AM

I'm done with everything but fluff, which I'll try to knock out when I have time on Saturday morning.

I've got 1 table fully formed and 1 that still needs skills. I wrote down the fluff for the entry I'm not sure I'll submit, but I still need to finish the fluff for the entry I'm sure about, and I haven't written extensive snapshots for either.

Seward

2022-01-06, 03:38 PM

Sarcasm?

I mean it is bad for my ideas. Not at all. And there is Unseen Seer.

Yes Sarcasm.

Weirdly the one I submitted I thought I couldn't do because of how the class worked. I kept coming up short on spell slots or feats or skills or something.

Then I found a way that was both obvious and, for me, unusual, because it went against the grain of how I usually design a character.

This class has some unusual stuff that an Unseen Seer can't do. US is a better arcane rogue, no question. But if you just wanna kill one particular guy this class is actually kind of interesting.

Which is what lead me to my second idea, but I'm not sure I can get it together in time, as rain did in fact happen and things are slowly lurching into motion over here.

Edit - ok, the character got into my head last night and insisted on being finished, and we got enough done yesterday a rest day was in order. So second one submitted.

Zaq

2022-01-08, 05:34 PM

Build's finally in. That took way longer than I anticipated, but to be fair, the build matured a lot as I was working on it, and I feel much better about it now than I did when I first started.

Can't wait to see the others!

Seward

2022-01-08, 10:25 PM

Gruftzwerg

2022-01-08, 11:45 PM

This class has been growing on me. A Gish Assassin is actually kinda cool, at least in a party ok with that. Of course in a lot of games I've played it would be very much a late bloomer, kinda like arcane archer. Takes a long time to get into and a long time for the class features to be dangerous enough for what it costs.
Agree, this prc turned out more fun as expected imho.

Plus it's mostly only incredibly dangerous to one single individual a day, with 24 hour+spell memorization between victims.

nah, you are doing it wrong!^^

I think you are missing out a lot of potential here. Just wait for the revel ;)

______________________________________

edit: I've managed to complete a build and have sent it in. I've another one that still needs to be written up, but unless someone else needs extra time too, I'm leaning more towards abandoning it and just posting it as non-entry after the reveal.

Seward

2022-01-09, 11:11 AM

I think you are missing out a lot of potential here. Just wait for the revel ;)

After last time where like 3 entries weaponized slow fall, I'm pretty sure there will be a lot of fun surprises.

NinjaGuy

2022-01-09, 05:28 PM

Hello all! Long time lurker and fan. Looooong time. Love these competitions, and seeing what you all come up with.

Given the 2 weeks of judging time, any chance I could get a day's worth of leeway? I had been working on another build and deemed it unworthy ultimately, but I'd like to try my hand at my first competition and inspiration struck a bit late. If not, no problem, deadlines are there for a reason. Either way, hope this one is as interesting as the previous ones have been!

The Viscount

2022-01-09, 06:09 PM

I've received a number of messages asking for an extension already. You have your day.

H_H_F_F

2022-01-10, 12:01 PM

I won't be submitting my second entry after all, though I will share it after the reveal. It just ended up... boring.

Thanks, Viscount!

Gruftzwerg

2022-01-10, 01:23 PM

I managed to quickly write up the second build. But I don't have high expectations for this one. But who knows..
I liked the fluff here and thus wanted to share it anyway xD

Wildstag

2022-01-10, 04:03 PM

I'll share an idea after the reveal, but really I don't think it would have worked or done well regardless, since it's not really so much optimal as it is the kinda gimmick I'd like playing. But it'll be fun to see the idea compared to what people actually submit.

NinjaGuy

2022-01-11, 02:51 AM

Just submitted! Had a rough go at the formatting, but I think I ended up pulling it off. Thanks for the extension, and I can't wait to see the other (winning) submissions. heheheh

I won't be submitting my second entry after all, though I will share it after the reveal. It just ended up... boring.

Thanks, Viscount!

I know the feeling, that's exactly why I scrapped my initial build. Can't bring a masterwork spork to a fancy knife fight!

I managed to quickly write up the second build. But I don't have high expectations for this one. But who knows..
I liked the fluff here and thus wanted to share it anyway xD

And that's how I feel about my second build!

I'll share an idea after the reveal, but really I don't think it would have worked or done well regardless, since it's not really so much optimal as it is the kinda gimmick I'd like playing. But it'll be fun to see the idea compared to what people actually submit.

That's the exact type of knife to bring to the fight!

Anyway, good luck to all!

Gruftzwerg

2022-01-11, 04:14 AM

I'm getting exited what builds everybody did come up with. And I'm curios if others tried something similar as me with my two build.

Seward

2022-01-11, 10:23 AM

since it's not really so much optimal as it is the kinda gimmick I'd like playing.

I tend to try for something I'd want to actually play in these builds. Which means any gimmicks have to be the sort that a GM and/or table might appreciate. That could impact my scoring, but that's not the main point of this for me. The fun is in seeing what happens during the build when the character starts to come to life for me and also what everybody else comes up with.

The scoring is more - it lets me see how it looks to somebody else outside the gaming experience I've had. Which is a different kind of fun.

Regardless, my first metric is "don't be useless". Because that's rarely fun for anybody at the table, including me.

loky1109

2022-01-12, 04:07 AM

Are we waiting for somebody building or for
The Viscount only?

H_H_F_F

2022-01-12, 10:20 AM

While we're waiting for the reveal and the judgement to follow: I'll plug this round of the Villainous Competition (found in my signature). It has a bit more than a week to go. Anyone interested in cooking or judging is welcome to take a look!

Thurbane

2022-01-12, 05:45 PM

Couldn't find the time to work on this, and my build stub was pretty...meh. Best of luck to all competitors!

The Viscount

2022-01-12, 09:20 PM

Are we waiting for somebody building or for
The Viscount only?

Just waiting on me to get back from work. Now that I have, it's time for the reveal! (Please hold off on posting until the all clear.)

The Viscount

2022-01-12, 09:21 PM

A much better suit than clubs.

Queen of Swords

Images from https://www.sacred-texts.com/tarot/index.htm public domain info at bottom of linked page

https://www.sacred-texts.com/tarot/pkt/img/swqu.jpg

Ruled by intellect, she sees clearly through deception and her justice is fair but without mercy, to others or herself.

The name started as a slur. Pretty much my entire race is from the royal line of our old Empire so it was Princess Sword once the Elves taught me how to use a sword and it became a regular part of my spellcasting when carrying out vengeance kills. Why swords? Everything in the Underdark has spell resistance and usually quite effective saving throws. I wasn't gifted with a strong body but I'd pit my mind's ability to focus arcane power against anybody's thews. Swords are just one of the more effective ways to project that power.

LN Imiskari Wizard5/Ruathar1/Imiskari Vengeance Taker10/Master of The Unseen Hand4.

Plan for Int/Con up to +6 enh by L15, Tome clear thought+5 for Int 36 at L20
Reflex and Fort saves tend to be about the same due to ability differences

_8 Str
_6 Dex (-2 Imiskari)
16 Con (10 points)
20 Int (16 points, +2 Imiskari) +1 every 4 levels, 25 at L20
_8 Wis
14 Cha (6 points)

Kn Other* is 1 skill rank in each of Knowledge
Architecture & Engineering, Geography, History, Local (Underdark), Nobility & Royalty, Planes, Religion.
LevelClass Base Attack BonusFort SaveReflex SaveWill Save SkillsFeatsClass Features
1stWizard1 0 0 0 228: {+2 CC} Disable Device: 1; {+3} Kn Arcane: 3; {+4} Kn Dungeon: 4; {+4} Kn Nature: 4; {+7} Kn Other*: 7; {+4} Spellcraft: 4; {+4 CC} Survival: 2; Scribe Spell, Track Focused Specialist Transmuter, Viper Familiar (Bluff+3)
2ndWizard210037: Disable Device: 1; {+2} Kn Arcane: 5; {+1} Kn Dungeon: 5; {+1} Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; {+1} Spellcraft: 5; Survival: 2; {+2} Collector of Stories;
3rdWizard311137: {+6} Concentration: 6; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 5; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; {+1} Spellcraft: 6; Survival: 2; Collector of Stories; Metamagic School Focus Transmutation
4thWizard421147: {+1} Concentration: 7; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 5; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; {+6 CC} Sense Motive: 3; Spellcraft: 6; Survival: 2; Collector of Stories;
5thWizard521147: {+1} Concentration: 8; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 5; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; {+2 CC} Move Silently: 1; {+2 CC} Sense Motive: 4; Spellcraft: 6; Survival: 2; {+2} Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories;Quicken Spell
6thRuathar12136 9: Concentration: 8; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 5; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; {+4} Hide: 4; {+4} Move Silently: 5; {+1} Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; Survival: 2; Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories; Twin Spell Word of Friendship, Gift of the Elves (+1 Longsword), Wizard CL=6
7thImiskari Vengeance Taker121589: {+5} Bluff: 5; Concentration: 8; Disable Device: 1; {+4} Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; Survival: 2; Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories;Target of Vengeance(ToV)+2
8thImiskari Vengeance Taker2316910: Bluff: 5; Concentration: 8; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; {+5} Listen: 5; Move Silently: 5; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; {+5} Spot: 5; Survival: 2; Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories;ToV+3, Poison Use, Wizard CL=7
9thImiskari Vengeance Taker3426910: {+1} Bluff: 6; {+4} Concentration: 12; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; Listen: 5; Move Silently: 5; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; Spot: 5; {+3} Survival: 5; {+2} Swift Concentration, Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories;Arcane Thesis Whirling BladeToV+4, Sneak Attack +1d6
10thImiskari Vengeance Taker45271010: {+3} Bluff: 9; {+1} Concentration: 13; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; {+2} Listen: 7; Move Silently: 5; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; {+2} Spot: 7; {+2} Survival: 7; Swift Concentration, Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories; ToV+5, Far Sense, Wizard CL=8
11thImiskari Vengeance Taker5527 1010: {+3} Bluff: 12; {+1} Concentration: 14; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; {+2} Listen: 9; Move Silently: 5; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; {+2} Spot: 9; {+2} Survival: 9; Swift Concentration, Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories; ToV+6, Sneak Attack +2d6
12thImiskari Vengeance Taker66381110: {+3} Bluff: 15; {+1} Concentration: 15; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; {+2} Listen: 11; Move Silently: 5; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; {+2} Spot: 11; {+2} Survival: 11; Swift Concentration, Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories;Practiced SpellcasterToV+7, Seeker, Wizard SL=9 CL=12
13thMaster of the Unseen Hand1738 138: {+2 CC} Bluff: 16; Concentration: 15; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; Listen: 11; Move Silently: 5; {+2 CC} Sense Motive: 6; {+2} Spellcraft: 8; Spot: 11; Survival: 11; {+2} Distracting Taunt, Swift Concentration, Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories;Wizard CL=13 (from Practiced Spellcaster)Versatile Telekinesis
14thMaster of the Unseen Hand2838148: {+2 CC} Bluff: 17; Concentration: 15; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; Listen: 11; Move Silently: 5; {+4 CC} Sense Motive: 8; Spellcraft: 8; Spot: 11; Survival: 11; {+2} False Theurgy, Distracting Taunt, Swift Concentration, Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories; Sustained Concentration, Telekinetic Wielder, Telekinesis CL=14 (From MotUH)
15thMaster of the Unseen Hand3949148: {+2 CC} Bluff: 18; Concentration: 15; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; Listen: 11; Move Silently: 5; {+6 CC} Sense Motive: 11; Spellcraft: 8; Spot: 11; Survival: 11; False Theurgy, Distracting Taunt, Swift Concentration, Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories;Craft RodFull Attack Telekinesis, TK CL=15
16thMaster of the Unseen Hand41049159: {+2 CC} Bluff: 19; {+4} Concentration: 19; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; Listen: 11; Move Silently: 5; Sense Motive: 11; {+3} Spellcraft: 11; Spot: 11; Survival: 11; False Theurgy, Distracting Taunt, Swift Concentration, Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories;Improved Violent Thrust, Telekinetic Flight, TK CL=16
17thImiskari Vengeance Taker711491511: {+1} Bluff: 20; {+1} Concentration: 20; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; Listen: 11; Move Silently: 5; Sense Motive: 11; {+7} Sleight of Hand: 7; Spellcraft: 11; Spot: 11; Survival: 11; {+2} Conceal Spellcasting, False Theurgy, Distracting Taunt, Swift Concentration, Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories;ToV+8, Sneak Attack +3d6
18thImiskari Vengeance Taker812 41016 11: {+1} Bluff: 21; {+1} Concentration: 21; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; Listen: 11; Move Silently: 5; Sense Motive: 11; {+9} Sleight of Hand: 16; Spellcraft: 11; Spot: 11; Survival: 11; Conceal Spellcasting, False Theurgy, Distracting Taunt, Swift Concentration, Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories;Somatic WeaponryToV+9, Scry Target, Wizard SL=10 CL=14, TK CL=18
19thImiskari Vengeance Taker91251016 11: {+1} Bluff: 22; Concentration: 21; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; Listen: 11; Move Silently: 5; Sense Motive: 11; {+6} Sleight of Hand: 22; Spellcraft: 11; Spot: 11; Survival: 11; {+4 CC} Disguise: 2; Conceal Spellcasting, False Theurgy, Distracting Taunt, Swift Concentration, Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories; ToV+10, Sneak Attack +4d6
20thImiskari Vengeance Taker10135111711: {+1} Bluff: 23; {+2} Concentration: 23; Disable Device: 1; Kn Arcane: 9; Kn Dungeon: 5; Kn Nature: 5; Kn Other*: 7; Hide: 4; Listen: 11; Move Silently: 5; Sense Motive: 11; Sleight of Hand: 22; Spellcraft: 11; Spot: 11; Survival: 11; {+6 CC} Disguise: 5; {+2} Second Impression, Conceal Spellcasting, False Theurgy, Distracting Taunt, Swift Concentration, Ecstatic Fervor, Collector of Stories; ToV+11, Death Attack, Wizard SL=11 CL=15, TK CL=19

Spells per Day
As a focused specialist, 3 of the spells prepared at each level must be transmutations
Abjuration, Enchantment and Necromancy are banned. Past L5 gear will add a few more slots.

Level
0lvl
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th

1st
5
5
-
-
-
-
-

2nd
6
6
-
-
-
-
-

3rd
6
6
4
-
-
-
-

4th
6
7
5
-
-
-
-

5th
6
7
5
4
-
-
-

6-7
6
7
6
5
-
-
-

8-9
6
8
7
5
4
-
-

10-11
6
8
7
6
5
-
-

12-15
6
8
8
6
5
4
-]

16-17
6
8
8
7
5
4
-

18-19
6
8
8
7
6
5
-

20
6
8
8
8
6
5
4

Complete Arcane
..Twin Spell
Complete Divine
..Practiced Spellcaster
Complete Mage
..Focused Specialist
..Metamagic School Focus
..Somatic Weaponry
Complete Scoundrel
..Skill Tricks
Complete Warrior
..Master of the Unseen Hand
Races of the Wild
..Ruathar
Underdark
..Imiskari Vengeance Taker
..Imiskari Human Subrace

I started as an explorer, sure that my book learning, magical talent and affable nature would help me survive the newly opened world beyond the Seal. As it turns out, "Friendly Face" isn't much help when the nice merchant decides you'd be a more useful slave than tinker or trading partner. Although I'm pretty sure by now the Drow regret that one of theirs made that choice. It didn't end well for the merchant and I always have a bit of extra enthusiasm for any mission involving Drow. I credit my viper with surviving that first encounter. Being able to lie convincingly was necessary for engineering the escape, and Ssthr actually got the coup de grace on the merchant, a fact which he never let me forget once he could speak to me.

She is young and confident with broad training in all the arts, ready to engage with the world.
https://www.sacred-texts.com/tarot/pkt/img/ar01.jpg

Starting skills are focused around her not getting lost and dying of starvation in the underdark or aboveground wilderness. A broad education with basic survival and her familiar picking up the slack. The skills don't come together well until L2, when synergy bonuses give her viper a +5 to survival and her a +3 on tracking, +5 if the viper can aid another with scent tracking. Also at L2, she gets significantly better at monster identification. After that, skill growth is focused on feat and class prerequisites while growing basic competence as a spellcaster.

In this period she's a primary arcane caster with a utility/buffing focus. Her early experience with Drow made her deeply skeptical of spells that let the opponent save or resist. She was inclined in L1-2 to leverage crafting skills (+5 at anything with proper tools), disable device and cantrips to set up traps, even going so far as to milk her viper for poison, although it was rarely decisive. Her obsession with complex tactics lead her to scribe scrolls for basic party buffs (enlarge, magic weapon, similar) to free spell slots for her plan-of-the-day. With Friendly Face (RoD) and her viper's bluff bonus she also did most interpersonal stuff for her party (underdark races other than drow tend to get cha hits).

At Lvl3 she fell in love with Whirling Blade. Int to attack and damage, no SR no save, affecting a small area. With Blade of Fire (SPC) and later triple weapon capsule retainers with fire/frost/spark capsules (CV) she would eventually acquire masterwork cold iron, mithril and adamantine daggers to back it up, a potion of bless weapon for magic resistant or dr-good and sometimes guild the lily with sonic weapon(SPC) and magic weapon if she had time to buff. Elaborate tactics to set up whirling blade ambushes became the focus of spellcasting, with boring fights managed with scrolls of L1 spells or the occasional grudging spell slot. She also began a long progression of feats that would turn her into a whirling blade goddess...in 6 levels or so.

Level 5 was another significant shift, but this time the spell was Deeper Darkness. Her earlier encounters with Drow got her access to Ebon Eyes(SPC) from a dead wizard's spellbook, and her teammates all having native darkvision encouraged her to research that spell back at lvl3. It turns out that most underdark critters, Grimlocks and devils excluded, don't have a plan for total darkness when your team can see. Her team now looks like a blob of darkness that washes over an area leaving a bunch of dead bodies behind, carved up or smashed or clawed depending on who is doing the killing. For her, the radius is the same as her whirling blade range, so her enemies are always blinded and flatfooted, although spell slots do limit just how many times she can contribute to the offense.

The most consequential decision I made early in my career was to pursue the last survivor of the Drow merchant band that enslaved me. It took years, and by the time I found him again, I'd progressed to using Deeper Darkness and Ebon Eyes to shield my party and give us a massive advantage. I pursued him to a religious outpost, planned and executed an assault with my team and, while mildly disappointed that he died in the outer defenses, followed through and discovered we'd also rescued a group of high ranking surface elves. Not being an idiot, when they suggested we'd risked our lives to rescue them I let them believe it and didn't mention the actual reason we were there. They offered Ruathar training to me, mostly because my lack of stealth even as an unarmored person made them kind of embarrassed for me. I took the training because they also would teach me how to use a better blade.

What I didn't know though, is that my dedication to the death of that guard brought me to the attention of the Imiskari Vengeance Takers, and my Ruathar training is what qualified me to actually join their ranks, as they put an inordinate emphasis on stealth training when anybody who qualifies can just cast invisibility or darkness or disguise themselves or something instead.

Always looking over her shoulder, she thrives in an environment of chaos, gossip, innuendo and backbiting. While retaining the uncertainty of youth, she is developing the instincts to pick just the right moment to strike and is developing the clarity to cut through deception and rumor.
https://www.sacred-texts.com/tarot/pkt/img/swpa.jpg

In this period skills improved by Target of Vengeance get the focus, as she starts to get famous enough that her victims begin to take precautions or strike back.

This period is transitional, as she adapts her IVT training to her preferences and starts shifting out of primary caster role to a gish-assassin. She calculates early that the maximum benefit of the training is tied to launching as many attacks as possible and plans for that. Her mastery of whirling blade is designed to let her quicken and twin whirling blade at level 9, giving her a devastating first strike nova, especially combined with ToV and sneak attack bonuses. Clairvoyance and Divination on her target help with her elaborate plans.

At level 8, she can cast Minor Creation and craft some of the easier plant based poisons (her take 10 with Fox Cunning cast is 18), in vast quantities. Enough so her whole party can go in with poisoned weapons and ammunition, although the divine caster typically uses slow poison on other party members to prevent accidents. She prefers incapacitating poisons when she can get them and greatly prizes drow venom, but against her specific vengeance victim will sometimes use viper poison, to let her familiar help out.

The +1 ruathar longsword she is provided gets equipped with ghostblight capsule retainers (CV), giving her a potent if brief option vs incorporals. As she gets better known and counters to her darkness start appearing she mixes it up with circle of invisibility, disguise self/alter self/bluff and other approaches to set up her devastating first strike.

At lvl 10 with +4 headband, +1 longsword and no other spell support is 3 attacks at +13 to hit against a typically flatfooted and often blind enemy, doing d8+9 (or just shy of 40 damage) vs most enemies and doing d8+d6sneak+9+5Tov=24/attack or 72 damage. Buffs typically boost both more (eg, GMW, sonic weapon, maybe something like prayer, etc)

Telekinesis changed everything of course. Only one precision attack but a dozen main attacks is devastating against my sworn enemies. Although ironically right after I crafted my quicken rod, my target wouldn't come out of hiding unless I agreed to a "fair duel". No spells during, only effects running when we arrive, no flying out of reach, no blocking his vision. Well, he got a lesson in what a mage can do instead of platemail on defense, and what maintaining two TK effects do on offense. I'd fabricated a Kama just in case neither spell beat his spell resistance and when the first failed I cut him up a bit and tripped him with the weapon, stepping back, then stuck the second spell and it ended with him pinned, prone and being sliced up while I watched calmly from out of reach. He got two attacks. One missed, the other didn't do enough damage to break concentration.

Survivors of her attack not on her target list as she gathers up swords. The person in the image is the master of the field, resistance is hopeless.
https://www.sacred-texts.com/tarot/pkt/img/sw05.jpg

In this period sense motive catches up to other ToV skills (+10 before ToV bonus), and skill tricks enhancing MotUH and IVT roles are the focus.

At first TK lets her get away with all kinds of shenanigans, like having captured drow crossbow bolts ambush a victim and get the ire pointed at them. Eventually hubris won out. With Fabricate, she can craft and launch 1 size large greatsword per CL (max 15, just under weight limit) or even a massive 300lb sword for the coup de grace. With a lesser rod of chain spell (MIC, 14k), she can GMW all of them (in 2 castings which also buffs party weapons) +3. With shrink item she can keep them around as the size of a size-small dagger (1d3) and with a word have them all burst their sheaths and fall to ground ready to use. She's not above using flame arrow+poison on dr-penetrating ammunition to punch it up. Attack mod for GMW3 at L15 is only a moderate +21(x15 attacks)+whirling bladex1 attack

Defensively she has alter self troglodyte, dragon skin (SPC), greater mage armor(CA)+mithril buckler/ring protection likely around30ish total at lvl15. She can cast two versions of TK ahead of time and maintain them (if using a mount to move), using one for a violent thrust opener and the other for combat maneuvers and weapon attacks with MOTU class features. Her attack mods using combat maneuvers are decent, at L15 she's got +25/20/15/10(with orange ioun stone for CL+1 and headband+6) and her bull rush/trip number is +9, enough for humanoid targets especially with haste for more attempts. Against a ToV target she can try for iteratives to set up sneak attack damage and a moderate attack mix or just use TK, get sneak only 1 time but 15xToV bonus on overall damage

In the story "Master's Touch" (CV) spell made her proficient with the kama.

These days my enemies are so afraid of my swords that they forget to check other approaches such as impersonating the bodyguard. I can kill easily with a typical weapon or quiver of ammo.

A typical ToV victim after a TK violent thrust of size large greatswords. The card is one of endings. Very thorough endings.
https://www.sacred-texts.com/tarot/pkt/img/sw10.jpg

Added a conceal magic trick and slight of hand, which took a lot of points to make useful, while keeping up with bluff and concentration. Bluff +35 vs ToV unbuffed, +25 vs all others.

L16 gives her caster level for bab on violent thrust and intelligence added to damage. It is a massive boost to that effect. 17-20 boost caster levels and IVT abilities. Somatic Weaponry lets her two-hand whirling blades or combine with a lesser quicken rod+twin spell, when she's doing area control. By level 20 the overkill on a ToV is incredible. (15 attacks at +36 to hit, damage (3d6+4gmw+13int+11ToV)x15+4d6 sneak= roughly 525 damage, -75 per 5 dr.

She can execute scry and die with quicken-rod+teleport+command word to unshrink swords+violent thrust. Or infiltrate and set up a death attack with a quickened cantrip and see if it works before unleashing the pain.

The Viscount

2022-01-12, 09:22 PM

Spelled just like it sounds, naturally.

https://64.media.tumblr.com/bca05a283f45c58458f48a6188418ebe/tumblr_mzfbmsmL5n1s6tw7do4_640.jpg
https://www.virginieropars.com/

Formerly Dril’jhael Vralice had another name and another appearance. She was a drow. But now she is a drider. Horrific hybrid, cursed and jilted. She was betrayed by her sister, framed to Lolth’s rage. She was a priestess, young but promising. Once she was entrusted to make a sacrifice. And her sister did something with the victim. Something very, very wrong. Full Lolth’s wrath fell on Dril’jhael. And now all that she has is her burning thirst for revenge! It has to happen today. Her sister, curse her name, is outside the city, alone. Best opportunity!
But wait! Who is it? Some… human? Attack the sister and almost kill her? That is never going to happen! Two venomous spits and a failed assassin fall near his prey.
- What?.. Sis? Is it you? You saved me…
- Of course I saved you. After all we are sisters, I couldn't let some human kill you. I’ll do it myself!!!
- What? Wait!...
Achievement of the goal knocked Dril’jhael out. She doesn't know how long she's been sitting near sisters dead body, until heard human’s voice.
- It was some… unexpected. I see you both had some story behind. Let me hear it.
And Dril’jhael suddenly told him all. All her anger and pain, all current happiness and voidness. When she ended, the assassin answered.
- I should introduce you to the Retributive Masters, our Lodge is just what you need now.
- You should what? I’ll kill you now and you can’t prevent this.
- Of course you can do this. And you're gonna lose the best opportunity you can get. Your choice.

Abilities Initial Race / Template 8th 12th 16th Total
STR 8 4 12
DEX 14 4 18
CON 18 6 1 1 1 27
INT 12 4 16
WIS 8 6 14
CHA 14 6 20

Level Class Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Reflex Save Will Save Skills Feats Class Features
1st Drider-1 0 0 0 2 20: {+4} Concentration: 4; {+4} Hide: 4; {+2} Listen: 2; {+4} Move Silently: 4; {+2} Spot: 2; {+4 CC} Survival: 2; Track Poison, Spell-Like Abilities, Darkvision 60 ft., spell resistance 17, Spells (Sorcerer)
2nd Drider-2 1 0 0 3 5: {+1} Concentration: 5; {+1} Hide: 5; {+1} Listen: 3; {+1} Move Silently: 5; {+1} Spot: 3; Survival: 2;
3rd Drider-3 2 1 1 3 5: {+1} Concentration: 6; {+1} Hide: 6; {+1} Listen: 4; {+1} Move Silently: 6; {+1} Spot: 4; Survival: 2; Spit Venom
4th Drider-4 3 1 1 4 5: {+1} Concentration: 7; {+1} Hide: 7; {+1} Listen: 5; {+1} Move Silently: 7; {+1} Spot: 5; Survival: 2;
5th Drider-5 3 1 1 4 5: {+1} Concentration: 8; {+1} Hide: 8; {+1} Listen: 6; {+1} Move Silently: 8; {+1} Spot: 6; Survival: 2;
6th Drider-6 4 2 2 5 5: {+1} Concentration: 9; {+1} Hide: 9; {+1} Listen: 7; {+1} Move Silently: 9; {+1} Spot: 7; Survival: 2; Extend Spell
7th Imaskari Vengeance Taker-1 4 2 4 7 7: {+1} Concentration: 10; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 1; {+1} Hide: 10; Listen: 7; {+1} Move Silently: 10; {+1} Sleight of Hand: 1; {+1} Spellcraft: 1; Spot: 7; {+1} Survival: 3; Target of vengeance
8th Imaskari Vengeance Taker-2 5 2 5 8 7: {+1} Concentration: 11; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 2; {+1} Hide: 11; Listen: 7; {+1} Move Silently: 11; {+1} Sleight of Hand: 2; {+1} Spellcraft: 2; Spot: 7; {+1} Survival: 4; Poison use
9th Imaskari Vengeance Taker-3 6 3 5 8 7: {+1} Concentration: 12; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 3; {+1} Hide: 12; Listen: 7; {+1} Move Silently: 12; {+1} Sleight of Hand: 3; {+1} Spellcraft: 3; Spot: 7; {+1} Survival: 5; Poison Spell Sneak attack +1d6
10th Imaskari Vengeance Taker-4 7 3 6 9 7: {+1} Concentration: 13; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 4; {+1} Hide: 13; Listen: 7; {+1} Move Silently: 13; {+1} Sleight of Hand: 4; {+1} Spellcraft: 4; Spot: 7; {+1} Survival: 6; Far sense
11th Imaskari Vengeance Taker-5 7 3 6 9 7: {+1} Concentration: 14; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 5; {+1} Hide: 14; Listen: 7; {+1} Move Silently: 14; {+1} Sleight of Hand: 5; {+1} Spellcraft: 5; Spot: 7; {+1} Survival: 7; Sneak attack +2d6
12th Imaskari Vengeance Taker-6 8 4 7 10 7: {+1} Concentration: 15; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 6; {+1} Hide: 15; Listen: 7; {+1} Move Silently: 15; {+1} Sleight of Hand: 6; {+1} Spellcraft: 6; Spot: 7; {+1} Survival: 8; Invisible Spell Seeker
13th Imaskari Vengeance Taker-7 9 4 7 10 7: {+1} Concentration: 16; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 7; {+1} Hide: 16; Listen: 7; {+1} Move Silently: 16; {+1} Sleight of Hand: 7; {+1} Spellcraft: 7; Spot: 7; {+1} Survival: 9; Sneak attack +3d6
14th Imaskari Vengeance Taker-8 10 4 8 11 7: {+1} Concentration: 17; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 8; {+1} Hide: 17; Listen: 7; {+1} Move Silently: 17; {+1} Sleight of Hand: 8; {+1} Spellcraft: 8; Spot: 7; {+1} Survival: 10; Scry target
15th Imaskari Vengeance Taker-9 10 5 8 11 7: {+1} Concentration: 18; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 9; {+1} Hide: 18; Listen: 7; {+1} Move Silently: 18; {+1} Sleight of Hand: 9; {+1} Spellcraft: 9; Spot: 7; {+1} Survival: 11; Venomous Strike Sneak attack +4d6
16th Imaskari Vengeance Taker-10 11 5 9 12 7: {+1} Concentration: 19; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 10; {+1} Hide: 19; Listen: 7; {+1} Move Silently: 19; {+1} Sleight of Hand: 10; {+1} Spellcraft: 10; Spot: 7; {+1} Survival: 12; Death attack

Level Class 0th 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th
1st Sorcerer 5 (4) Launch Bolt, Detect Magic, Touch of Fatigue, Detect Poison 3 (2) Chill Touch, Spell Flower
2nd Sorcerer 6 (5) Prestidigitation 4 (2)
3rd Sorcerer 6 (5) 5 (3) Corrosive Grasp
4th Sorcerer 6 (6) Silent Portal 6 (3) 3 (1) Spectral Hand
5th Sorcerer 6 (6) 6 (4) True Casting 4 (2) Combust
6th Sorcerer 6 (7) Arcane Mark 6 (4) 5 (2) 3 (1) Girallon’s Blessing
8th Sorcerer 6 (7) 6 (5) Remove Scent 6 (3) Heroics 4 (2) Shivering Touch
10th Sorcerer 6 (8) Disrupt Undead 6 (5) 6 (3) 5 (2) 3 (1) Invisibility, Greater
12th Sorcerer 6 (8) 6 (5) 6 (4) Belker Claws 6 (3) Mind Poison 4 (2) Know Vulnerabilities
14th Sorcerer 6 (9) Electric Jolt 6 (5) 6 (4) 6 (3) 5 (2) 3 (1) Night’s Caress
16th Sorcerer 6 (9) 6 (5) 6 (5) Wracking Touch 6 (4) Spider Poison 6 (3) Minor Creation 4 (2) Teleport
Spell slots* (Spell known)
* Not included bonus spells from high Cha.

Dril’jhael Vralice is almost regular drider. But somehow she didn't fell into chaos. Instead her thirst for revenge upped her discipline on another level. She like her poison and touch spells.
With Spectral Hand spell she can touch somebody far of herself. Even around the corner if using clairvoyance.
Spell Flower and Girallon’s Blessing together allow to have selection between up to four touch spell at once. With liberal reading of Spectral Hand it can be used to deliver all four in one round. With appropriate penalties for multiweapon fighting of course.
If she need, she can deliver her poison via spit or, if target is too far, via Launch Bolt cantrip.

Dril’jhael Vralice is Vengeance Taker now. She no longer afraid of poisoning herself and now can deliver poison via every damaging touch spell. Plus, she has Heroics spell. With it she can get Two-Weapon Fighting feat before casting Girallon’s Blessing. This should give her Multi-Weapon Fighting feat after. Also she has Greater Invisibility and Remove Scent for more stealth and Shivering Touch as new option for touch attacks.

Look how many all Dril’jhael has now. Invisible Spell for Spectral Hand and touch spell if need lets her take full advantage of her sneak attack, Venomous Strike, and Death attack.
More touch spells to do Dril’jhael's job. Know Vulnerabilities for study her target. Teleport for Scry and Die tactics. Minor Creation for more different poisons. Yes, them shouldn't work with Poison Spell, but Launch Bolt still is with Dril’jhael.

I remind you that 30 ft distance limit apply only on ranged attacks, but Spectral Hand touch spell attacks are melee and can be Sneak at any distance.

Invisible Spectral Hand should always attack as sneak attack.

Spell Flower should always be casted with Extend Spell.
Dril’jhael's poison due Spit Venom is contact, too. And she apply it to her spiked gauntlets or similar weapon. Or can spit in target's drink or meal.
Chill Touch is most useable spell. It allow multiple touches with single cast and does Str damage. This is good addition to Str-damage poison.
Night’s Caress in most cases is anti-undead tool. Yes, it works well against living, too, but for them are other methods.

Poison Spell and ability damaging spells. They do or don't work together? I don't know. I can find both pro and contra. So I don't rely on this, but should mention.

Drider - SRD, MM1
Imaskari Vengeance Taker - Secret Ingredient
Track - PHB
Extend Spell - PHB
Spit Venom - Serpent Kingdoms
Poison Spell - Drow of the Underdark
Venomous Strike - DotU
Invisible Spell - CityScape
Night's Caress - Spell Compendium
Know Vulnerabilities - SC
Mind Poison - SC
Girallon’s Blessing - SC
Heroics - SC
Belker Claw - SC
Combust - SC
Remove Scent - SC
Corrosive Grasp - SC
Spell Flower - SC
Launch Bolt - SC
Electric Jolt - SC
Wracking Touch - SC
Spider Poison - Magic of Faerun
Shivering Touch - Frostburn
True Casting - Complete Mage
other spells - PHB

The Viscount

2022-01-12, 09:27 PM

Goblins and dragons, like peanut butter and jelly.

LuckLuck

https://s.clipartkey.com/mpngs/s/75-753109_clip-art-goblin-characters-goblin-png.png

The Chosen of Tiamat.

That was the name given to his litter of goblins. He and his brother came out big, strong, fast to learn pushing out all but his sister, who they both liked too well to starve. Dragonrider they said. Two to be chosen, for the black and the green.

But...he just didn't hate elves enough. Lagged his brother at tracking and stealth and was hopeless at scouting enemies. Strong in arms and a good rider, he also failed the tests of faith and magnetism. They even taught him to read hoping he'd be a wizard, as one dragonrider was supposed to have arcane might and it sure wasn't his brother. But the magical writings made no sense. "Just a warrior" they said. Send him to the Worg Riders. Maybe his sister will cast spells eventually.

Worg Riders are scouts, and he was still terrible at that. But he was dangerous in melee, could draw a stronger bow than his peers and could sometimes make just impossible shots. His squad found a use for him, he was the point of the spear and the one to kill enemy scouts once spotted. And a poor tracker is better than no tracker. Asked to explain those impossible shots "Just lucky. I have a lucky target, and I shout the lucky word and I never miss. But calling on so much luck is slow. I learned how to whisper to my lance and bow too, and they are lucky too. But not very long."

So his war name became LuckLuck. And while he wasn't well liked, his squad also admitted he had good ideas sometimes, if strange. Also while he wasn't a great tracker, any tracker is better than no tracker, so he earned his food.

LuckLuck is at this stage a goblin Worg Rider (or Riding Dog or Wolf rider if not part of a warband, but a normal party), who has strength instead of wisdom and tracking instead of spot and listen.

He uses his magic to enhance his weapons and his shots, mostly. He hits decently hard, quite hard for a goblin, but his mount is as dangerous as he is.

He knows he's something more, the cantrips he casts when he's supposed to be scouting tells him so. But he can't muster proper dragon breath, just little blobs of acid or rays of cold or a little light. By the time he realizes he can make those little zaps not hurt him, the Tiamat priests no longer think he's interesting and he's tired of failing their tests.

His sister failed the tests and some stupid bugbear got teamed with the green dragon. His perfect brother of course is now a dragonrider and doing important work against elves in a swamp. LuckLuck thought maybe he could become a Blademaster, as nobody cared if they got distracted and didn't notice Human cavalry or whatever. But they laughed at him as too small, even though he had no trouble figuring out how to stab with both hands, although spiky armor works better for close combat when you are also using a bow and lance.

He is getting a bit worried though. His last lance charge shot lightning through his enemy. But he still can't breathe lightning. What is going in? Cold, Acid, Lightning. How many dragons did his ancestors sleep with? And why is it all coming out of fingers or weapons, not properly from his mouth?

With both TWF and channeling shocking grasp (especially with a lance charge) his offense is getting more potent. In a real party he might take obscuring mist before dimension hop, depending on what it needed. As a Red Hand of Doom goblin, his higher level spells don't come out until the crisis at L5

A major inflection point in his power is when he can quicken a dimension hop to get into TWF position, but that will matter more at level 6, when his attacks double.

The Green Dragon is Dead and so is the stupid Bugbear who was too big to ride it, even if he could fire lightning bolts. He's pretty sure he was supposed to be that dragonrider, with his lightning lance, but with the dragon dead it hardly matters anymore.

Stupid humans broke the bridge, so his squad was sent through the mountains to raid and burn, till the big army could make a new one. Then it happened. They rode their grass-eating giant critters at shocking speed and a blast of flame seared his squad, followed by arrows aimed at the wolves. LuckLuck wasn't badly hurt - goblin burning parties are frequently careless so he had cast a luck charm against fire, but all the wolves were dead, his squad was dead or dying and the stupid dragon-sorcerer-jerk was out of position with her stupid hobgoblins and we are all going to die before we get out of here.

Tiamat Fry That. Waving his arms in rage and screaming incoherently, a cloud of smoke surrounded himself and his poor squad mates. He yelped in surprise and found himself in a dark alleyway out of line of fire of everything.

Doing what goblins do best, he hid, and watched as the humans were seared with lightning and peppered with arrows from the other squad. And watched in horror as they healed, and destroyed the sorcerer and her minions. Two of his squad mates survived though. They crawled out through the smoke and confusion to join him. When they reported back days later, their Captain was shocked that they'd survived. "Those are the humans and elves that killed the dragon. You are well named". His squad mates kept their mouths shut, just nodding in agreement.

In this period, his duskblade spells increasingly either support setting up ambushes or making his attacks more deadly. He moves away from archery and more into lance charge followed by TWF, mostly with armor spikes as secondary and sometimes primary weapon. He usually doesn't fill both hands with a weapons, wanting one free for spellcasting, but a 2-handed weapon like a lance is fine, as he can grip or release grip with one hand as a free action.

Another major power inflection point comes at level 9 with arcane strike and Greater Magic Weapon. His quick spells are still usually used with dimension hop to set up full attack actions, or for emergency escapes followed by swift expeditious retreat and raw stealth from a new position, with swift invisibility as a backup if he's already used his quick casting for the day.

In this tier he can cast defensively or while riding a Worg pretty reliably.

A note on Blade of Blood. You can't channel that spell but you can cast it on a weapon before a fight and that first surprise round attack that you're adding Shocking Grasp or Vampiric Touch to with a channel can also do an extra 3d6 damage, and if using vampiric touch, the -5hp isn't a bother. Any time you can cast a damage buff before a fight that will apply in surprise round is gold for an assassin.

His brother is dead. For all his training against elves and humans, it was that half-orc with the gigantic bow that took him down, the same one that killed LuckLuck's Worg, the only creature who ever really seemed to like him.

LuckLuck spent the approach to Brindle chasing down slaves, breaking up pockets of resistance. His old squad mates are all dead but he's gathered odds and sods of Red Hand stragglers with him and his unit had some impressive wins. When asked for a reward, he said "I want to hunt and kill the Halforc, who slew my dragonrider brother and helped kill the Black and the Green. Let me go into that city when we breach the walls, and I will kill him for you."

The Wyrmlord shrugged. LuckLuck wasn't important, and he might even succeed. "Granted".

Two days later.....

The Red Hand host was defeated, the Wyrmlord and the Red Dragon dead. His squad was dead again. LuckLuck doesn't think much of Tiamat these days, she seems like a bad planner. But that halforc is not just dead, his head is in LuckLuck's bag. Lets see that stupid sun priest heal THAT.

As he settled the head to cook in the fire, hoping to make a brain stew of his foe, a Human snuck up on him. LuckLuck sighed, this just keeps happening. But he didn't get stabbed, or shot. The Human just tossed light balls in front of him to dance and get his attention, while staying under what LuckLuck had to admit was very good cover, and in a thicket it would be risky to dimension hop into. The Human spoke strangely, even for a human, but what it had to say was of interest.

"We couldn't help but notice your excellent revenge against the slayer of your brother. You were wasted in the Red Hand. Would you be interested in learning how to do that sort of thing better? All we ask is you kill people who need killing from time to time, but you are free to choose your own vendettas most days."

IVT has significant synergy with a TWF attacker who has 7 attacks (with haste boots) by level 12, plus a quickened dimension hop to get all of those attacks after sneaking to close enough range with quite respectable stealth skills and/or swift invisibility and/or a normal dimension hop.

He can't force the sneak attack barring going first in initiative but has a solid dexterity, pretty good odds of setting up an ambush, his weapons can be poisoned for the first two strikes and arcane strike+Target of Vengeance is no joke even without sneak attack.

With two quickened dimension hops a day, he can ambush a single guy, even surrounded by allies, and has a fair chance of getting a kill and getting away, although obviously he's not averse to just poisoning a bedtime drink with his talents rather than going full blender if the odds don't seem good. He doesn't fight with a mount anymore, but might have one moderately nearby to speed a getaway once he's broken contact.

In this tier his concentration, with level appropriate constitution item, is sufficient to cast in a grapple.

At level 15 he gets enough experience going after hard targets to learn how to stealth around scent, blindsense and similar.

He does sometimes work with others, and can set up an even more nasty ambush with a quick dimension hop followed by regroup if the range isn't too long, relying on his party members to do the work. Not a tactic vs his ToV target, but good on other days.

LuckLuck finds it strange to be part of a society where he is actually respected. He doesn't really understand the concept of "righting wrongs" but he does understand "needs killing" and they don't seem to get too upset as his interpretations of that. They have room for people like him in their organization, and they aren't stupid enough to do things that get a party of adventurers crashing into their home. Unlike Tiamat's dumb priests.

In this tear, LuckLuck builds in long range assassination into his toolkit, which is why he finally starts raising his spot skill, and likely backs it up with magic items.

At first, it is quick invisible/dimension door next to a victim in surprise round, then blender full attack+quick dimension door out. But he also starts working in long range archery, for enemies that have obnoxious things like anticipate teleport or dimensional lock operating. 4 iterative attacks + haste attack + ToV + GMW + keen + oils of whatever will do the most damage (flame arrow align weapon, poison, whatever) are still pretty dangerous. At level 20 he adds the following sequence.

Surprise round quick acid arrow, acid arrow. Round 1 quick acid arrow, full attack from bow. Odds are enemy dies, and has a bunch of rounds of acid destroying his body as his retainers look on in horror. For this sort of thing he would add a mount back in, using it to move out of cover to shoot and end under cover.

Retributive Master. LuckLuck likes the sound of that. His mentor finally retired and now LuckLuck gets to give orders. Sure the others will likely overrule him sometimes. He still doesn't understand what motivates those strange humans and their allies. But LuckLuck knows killing and vengeance pretty good.

So - I thought it would be fun to write up an IVT who knows nothing about magic or really anything else (spellcraft, kn skills blah blah) but actually makes use of the required entry skills. I also thought a full bab casting class with TWF tree as soon as possible would have some good synergy when IVT levels kick in.

The whole RHOD Goblin....that came later. I kept trying to do Strongheart Halfling or maybe that Laika dog race but "Goblin Goblin Gobbbbblinnnn" kept intruding in my head. So that is what I did.

LE Goblin Duskblade10/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10

Abilities Initial Race (Goblin) 4th 8th 12th 16th 20th
STR 16 -2 1 1 1 1
DEX 16 2 1
CON 14
INT 14
WIS 8
CHA 8 -2

Level \ Abilities STR DEX CON INT WIS CHA
1st 14 18 14 14 8 6
2nd 14 18 14 14 8 6
3rd 14 18 14 14 8 6
4th 15 18 14 14 8 6
5th 15 18 14 14 8 6
6th 15 18 14 14 8 6
7th 15 18 14 14 8 6
8th 16 18 14 14 8 6
9th 16 18 14 14 8 6
10th 16 18 14 14 8 6
11th 16 18 14 14 8 6
12th 16 19 14 14 8 6
13th 16 19 14 14 8 6
14th 16 19 14 14 8 6
15th 16 19 14 14 8 6
16th 17 19 14 14 8 6
17th 17 19 14 14 8 6
18th 17 19 14 14 8 6
19th 17 19 14 14 8 6
20th 18 19 14 14 8 6

Goblin Move 30' Darkvision, Size Small (Hide+4, Attack+1, AC+1, Combat Maneuver-4), Move Silently+4, Speak Goblin, Common, Draconic, Elvish

Level Class Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Reflex Save Will Save Skills Feats Class Features
1st Duskblade 1 1 2 0 2 16: {+4 CC} Hide: 2; {+4 CC} Move Silently: 2; {+4} Ride: 4; {+4 CC} Survival: 2; Tracking Arcane Attunement, Armored Mage (Light)
2nd Duskblade 2 2 3 0 3 4: {+4} Concentration: 4; Hide: 2; Move Silently: 2; Ride: 4; Survival: 2; Combat Casting (bonus)
3rd Duskblade 3 3 3 1 3 4: Concentration: 4; {+2 CC} Hide: 3; {+2 CC} Move Silently: 3; Ride: 4; Survival: 2; Two Weapon Fighting Arcane Channeling
4th Duskblade 4 4 4 1 4 4: {+2} Concentration: 6; Hide: 3; Move Silently: 3; Ride: 4; {+2 CC} Survival: 3; Armored Mage (Medium)
5th Duskblade 5 5 4 1 4 4: Concentration: 6; {+2 CC} Hide: 4; {+2 CC} Move Silently: 4; Ride: 4; Survival: 3; Quick Cast 1/d
6th Duskblade 6 6 5 2 5 4: {+2} Concentration: 8; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 4; Ride: 4; {+2 CC} Survival: 4; Improved Two Weapon Fighting Spell Power+2
7th Duskblade 7 7 5 2 5 4: Concentration: 8; {+2 CC} Hide: 5; {+2 CC} Move Silently: 5; Ride: 4; Survival: 4; Armored Mage (Hvy Shield)
8th Duskblade 8 8 6 2 6 4: {+2} Concentration: 10; Hide: 5; Move Silently: 5; Ride: 4; {+2 CC} Survival: 5;
9th Duskblade 9 9 6 3 6 4: Concentration: 10; {+2 CC} Hide: 6; {+2 CC} Move Silently: 6; Ride: 4; Survival: 5; Arcane Strike
10th Duskblade 10 10 7 3 7 4: {+2} Concentration: 12; Hide: 6; Move Silently: 6; Ride: 4; {+2 CC} Survival: 6; Quick Cast 2/d
11th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 1 10 7 5 9 6: Concentration: 12; {+2} Hide: 8; {+2} Move Silently: 8; Ride: 4; Survival: 6; {+2} Ecstatic Fervor; Target of Vengeance 3
12th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 2 11 7 6 10 6: Concentration: 12; Hide: 8; Move Silently: 8; Ride: 4; {+6 CC} Perform (Dance): 3; Survival: 6; Ecstatic Fervor; Greater Two Weapon Fighting ToV4 Poison Use Duskblade Casting 11
13th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 3 12 8 6 10 6: Concentration: 12; Hide: 8; Move Silently: 8; Ride: 4; {+4 CC} Perform (Dance): 5; Survival: 6; {+2} Shrouded Dance, Ecstatic Fervor; ToV5 Sneak Attack 1d6
14th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 4 13 8 7 11 6: Concentration: 12; {+3} Hide: 11; {+3} Move Silently: 11; Ride: 4; Perform (Dance): 5; Survival: 6; Shrouded Dance, Ecstatic Fervor; ToV6 Far Sense Duskblade Casting 12
15th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 5 13 8 7 11 6: Concentration: 12; {+3} Hide: 14; {+3} Move Silently: 14; Ride: 4; Perform (Dance): 5; Survival: 6; Shrouded Dance, Ecstatic Fervor; Darkstalker ToV7 Sneak Attack 2d6
16th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 6 14 9 8 12 6: {+2} Concentration: 14; {+2} Hide: 16; {+2} Move Silently: 16; Ride: 4; Perform (Dance): 5; Survival: 6; Shrouded Dance, Ecstatic Fervor; ToV8 Seeker Duskblade Casting 13
17th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 7 15 9 8 12 6: Concentration: 14; {+3} Hide: 19; {+3} Move Silently: 19; Ride: 4; Perform (Dance): 5; Survival: 6; Shrouded Dance, Ecstatic Fervor; ToV9 Sneak Attack 3d6
18th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 8 16 9 9 13 6: Concentration: 14; {+2} Hide: 21; {+2} Move Silently: 21; Ride: 4; Perform (Dance): 5; {+2} Spot: 2; Survival: 6; Shrouded Dance, Ecstatic Fervor; Versatile Spellcaster ToV10 Scry Target Duskblade Casting 14
19th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 9 16 10 9 13 6: Concentration: 14; {+1} Hide: 22; {+1} Move Silently: 22; Ride: 4; Perform (Dance): 5; {+4} Spot: 6; Survival: 6; Shrouded Dance, Ecstatic Fervor; ToV11 Sneak Attack 5d6
20th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 17 10 10 14 6: Concentration: 14; {+1} Hide: 23; {+1} Move Silently: 23; Ride: 4; Perform (Dance): 5; {+4} Spot: 10; Survival: 6; Shrouded Dance, Ecstatic Fervor; ToV12 Death Attack Duskblade Casting 15

Note: Arcane Attunement adds 5 uses/day (total) of Dancing Lights, Detect Magic, Flare or Ghost Sound as a SLA, save DC=9 (based on cha, not int)

Note: There are only 4 duskblade cantrips (Acid Splash, Disrupt Undead, Ray of Frost and Touch of Fatigue) All 4 are known at Level 1.
Level Attunements 0lvl 1st 2nd 3rd 4th Spells Known
1st 5 3 3 0 0 0 Magic Weapon,Stand (PH2), Swift Expeditious Retreat(SC), Truestrike
2nd 5 4 4 0 0 0 Resist Energy
3rd 5 5 5 0 0 0 Shocking Grasp
4th 5 6 6 0 0 0 Obscuring Mist
5th 5 6 6 3 0 0 Dimension Hop (PH2)
6th 5 6 7 4 0 0 Swift Invisiblity (SC)
7th 5 6 7 6 0 0 See Invisible
8th 5 6 8 7 0 0 Swift Fly(SC)
9th 5 6 8 7 2 0 Gr Magic Weapon swap Magic Weapon for Blade of Blood
10-11 5 6 9 8 3 0 Vampiric Touch
12-13 5 6 9 8 5 0 Regroup (PH2)
14-15 5 6 9 9 6 0 Keen Edge
16-17 5 6 10 9 6 2 Dimension Door
18-19 5 6 10 9 7 3 Dispel Magic
20th 5 6 10 9 7 5 Acid Arrow

Duskblade: Players Handbook II
Imaskari Vengeance Taker: Underdark

Arcane Strike: Complete Warrior
Skill Tricks: Complete Scoundrel
Darkstalker: Lords of Madness
Versatile Spellcaster: Races of the Dragon

Noncore Spells: Players Handbook II or Spell Compendium, as noted

The Viscount

2022-01-12, 09:29 PM

Which hit song by the band James does this make you think of?

Good morn to our sorcerer, James,
Whose trust was seduced by some claims:
The good old Assembly
Made him feel all trembly
With hopes of the power of names.

However, the names that are true
Are ridiculous, leaving him blue.
Although out of spite
He would still seek their might,
Ne'er utterance would young James do.

The truenaming left him disjointed
Despondent and so disappointed
This e'er-vengeful creature
Laid low his first teacher
And then his next target appointed.

As it turns out, the Masters Retributive
Found the efforts of young James contributive.
This backstory tragic
Fueled study of magic
And to him more justice attributive.

And so, like a wily old fox,
James learned to think out of the box.
He would learn in a dream
Of the target supreme
After which his foe's truename he'd dox.

"Alright, now you listen here, Bob!
I will turn your ass into a blob!
The sins of your past
Make this easy to cast
And you'll vanish with nary a sob!"

Good morn to our sorcerer, James,
So awash with the power of names.
Should you draw his ire
Go build your own pyre
And gently consent to the flames.

James
Lawful evil human
Human paragon 1 / Sorcerer 1 / Imaskari vengeance taker 10 / Virtuoso 1 / Sublime chord 1 / Keeper of the cerulean sign 6
Member of the Paragnostic Assembly

Abilities Initial Race / Template 4th 8th 12th 16th 20th
STR 12
DEX 12
CON 14
INT 16
WIS 8
CHA 16 1 1 1 1 1

Level Class Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Reflex Save Will Save Skills Feats Class Features
1st Human paragon 1 0 0 0 2 32: {+4} Truespeak: 4; {+4} Perform (Limerick): 4; {+4} Knowledge (dungeoneering): 4; {+4} Knowledge (planes): 4; {+4} Listen: 4; {+4} Hide: 4; {+4} Move Silently: 4; {+2} Diplomacy: 2; {+2} Survival: 2; Track, Primitive Caster Adaptive learning (Truespeak as permanent class skill)
2nd Sorcerer 1 0 0 0 4 6: Truespeak: 4; Perform (Limerick): 4; {+4} Knowledge (arcana): 4; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 4; Knowledge (planes): 4; Listen: 4; Hide: 4; {+2 CC} Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 2; Survival: 2; Divine companion, spells, eff sorc level 1
3rd Imaskari vengeance taker 1 0 0 2 6 8: {+2} Truespeak: 6; {+2 CC} Perform (Limerick): 5; Knowledge (arcana): 4; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 4; Knowledge (planes): 4; Listen: 4; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; {+4 CC} Diplomacy: 4; Survival: 2; Sudden Extend Target of vengeance
4th Imaskari vengeance taker 2 1 0 3 7 8: {+1} Truespeak: 7; {+2 CC} Perform (Limerick): 6; {+1} Knowledge (arcana): 5; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 4; Knowledge (planes): 4; Listen: 4; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; {+4 CC} Intimidate: 2; Survival: 2; Poison use, eff sorc level 2
5th Imaskari vengeance taker 3 2 1 3 7 8: {+1} Truespeak: 8; {+2 CC} Perform (Limerick): 7; {+1} Knowledge (arcana): 6; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 4; Knowledge (planes): 4; Listen: 4; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; {+4 CC} Intimidate: 4; Survival: 2; Sneak attack +1d6
6th Imaskari vengeance taker 4 3 1 4 8 8: {+1} Truespeak: 9; {+2 CC} Perform (Limerick): 8; Knowledge (arcana): 6; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 4; Knowledge (planes): 4; {+5} Listen: 9; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; Survival: 2; Dreamtelling Far sense, eff sorc level 3
7th Imaskari vengeance taker 5 3 1 4 8 8: {+1} Truespeak: 10; {+4 CC} Perform (Limerick): 10; Knowledge (arcana): 6; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 4; Knowledge (planes): 4; {+1} Listen: 10; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; {+2} Profession (astrologer): 2; Survival: 2; Sneak attack +2d6
8th Imaskari vengeance taker 6 4 2 5 9 8: {+1} Truespeak: 11; Perform (Limerick): 10; {+5} Knowledge (arcana): 11; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 4; Knowledge (planes): 4; {+1} Listen: 11; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; {+1} Profession (astrologer): 3; Survival: 2; Seeker, eff sorc level 4
9th Imaskari vengeance taker 7 5 2 5 9 8: {+1} Truespeak: 12; Perform (Limerick): 10; {+1} Knowledge (arcana): 12; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 4; Knowledge (planes): 4; {+1} Listen: 12; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; {+2} Spellcraft: 2; {+3} Profession (astrologer): 6; Survival: 2; Craft Wondrous Item Sneak attack +3d6
10th Virtuoso 1 5 2 5 11 10: Truespeak: 12; Perform (Limerick): 10; {+2 CC} Knowledge (arcana): 13; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 4; Knowledge (planes): 4; {+2 CC} Listen: 13; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; {+2} Sense Motive: 2; {+4} Spellcraft: 6; Profession (astrologer): 6; Survival: 2; Bardic music (fascinate), virtuoso performance (persuasive song)
11th Sublime chord 1 5 2 5 13 8: Truespeak: 12; Perform (Limerick): 10; Knowledge (arcana): 13; {+4} Knowledge (dungeoneering): 8; Knowledge (planes): 4; Listen: 13; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; {+4 CC} Sense Motive: 4; Spellcraft: 6; Profession (astrologer): 6; Survival: 2; Bardic lore, bardic music, spells, eff SC level 1 (CL 5)
12th Imaskari vengeance taker 8 6 2 6 14 8: {+1} Truespeak: 13; Perform (Limerick): 10; Knowledge (arcana): 13; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 8; Knowledge (planes): 4; Listen: 13; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; {+2 CC} Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; Profession (astrologer): 6; {+5} Gather Information: 5; Survival: 2; Aberration Banemagic Scry target, eff SC level 2 (CL 6)
13th Imaskari vengeance taker 9 6 3 6 14 8: {+1} Truespeak: 14; Perform (Limerick): 10; Knowledge (arcana): 13; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 8; {+4 CC} Knowledge (planes): 6; Listen: 13; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; Profession (astrologer): 6; Gather Information: 5; Survival: 2; {+1} Concentration: 1; {+2 CC} Knowledge (local): 1; Sneak attack +4d6
14th Imaskari vengeance taker 10 7 3 7 15 8: {+1} Truespeak: 15; Perform (Limerick): 10; Knowledge (arcana): 13; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 8; {+4 CC} Knowledge (planes): 8; Listen: 13; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; Profession (astrologer): 6; Gather Information: 5; Survival: 2; {+1} Concentration: 2; Knowledge (local): 1; {+2 CC} Knowledge (nature): 1; Death attack, eff SC level 3 (CL 7)
15th Keeper of the cerulean sign 1 7 3 7 17 10: {+3} Truespeak: 18; Perform (Limerick): 10; Knowledge (arcana): 13; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 8; {+7} Knowledge (planes): 15; Listen: 13; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; Profession (astrologer): 6; Gather Information: 5; Survival: 2; Concentration: 2; Knowledge (local): 1; Knowledge (nature): 1; Venomous Strike Cerulean focus, detect aberrant taint, eff SC level 4 (CL 8)
16th Keeper of the cerulean sign 2 8 3 7 18 10: {+1} Truespeak: 19; Perform (Limerick): 10; Knowledge (arcana): 13; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 8; {+4} Knowledge (planes): 19; Listen: 13; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; Profession (astrologer): 6; Gather Information: 5; Survival: 2; {+5} Concentration: 7; Knowledge (local): 1; Knowledge (nature): 1; Greater banemagic 1/day, eff SC level 5 (CL 9)
17th Keeper of the cerulean sign 3 8 4 8 18 10: {+1} Truespeak: 20; Perform (Limerick): 10; Knowledge (arcana): 13; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 8; {+1} Knowledge (planes): 20; Listen: 13; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; Profession (astrologer): 6; Gather Information: 5; Survival: 2; {+8} Concentration: 15; Knowledge (local): 1; Knowledge (nature): 1; Word of revelation, eff SC level 6 (CL 10)
18th Keeper of the cerulean sign 4 9 4 8 19 10: {+1} Truespeak: 21; Perform (Limerick): 10; Knowledge (arcana): 13; {+2} Knowledge (dungeoneering): 10; {+1} Knowledge (planes): 21; Listen: 13; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; Profession (astrologer): 6; Gather Information: 5; Survival: 2; {+4} Concentration: 19; Knowledge (local): 1; Knowledge (nature): 1; {+2} Collector of Stories; Sculpt Spell Greater banemagic 2/day, eff SC level 7 (CL 11)
19th Keeper of the cerulean sign 5 9 4 8 19 10: {+1} Truespeak: 22; Perform (Limerick): 10; Knowledge (arcana): 13; Knowledge (dungeoneering): 10; {+1} Knowledge (planes): 22; Listen: 13; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; Profession (astrologer): 6; Gather Information: 5; Survival: 2; {+3} Concentration: 22; {+5} Knowledge (local): 6; Knowledge (nature): 1; Collector of Stories; Portal warding, eff SC level 8 (CL 12)
20th Keeper of the cerulean sign 6 10 5 9 20 10: {+1} Truespeak: 23; Perform (Limerick): 10; Knowledge (arcana): 13; {+3} Knowledge (dungeoneering): 13; {+1} Knowledge (planes): 23; Listen: 13; Hide: 4; Move Silently: 5; Diplomacy: 4; Intimidate: 4; Sense Motive: 5; Spellcraft: 6; Profession (astrologer): 6; Gather Information: 5; Survival: 2; {+1} Concentration: 23; {+4} Knowledge (local): 10; Knowledge (nature): 1; Collector of Stories; Greater banemagic 3/day, eff SC level 9 (CL 13)

Eff sorcerer level ECL 0th 1st 2nd
1st 2 5 3 —
2nd 4 6 4 —
3rd 6 6 5 —
4th 8 6 6 3

Eff Sublime chord level ECL 4th 5th 6th 7th 8th 9th
1st 11 2 1 — — — —
2nd 12 2 2 — — — —
3rd 14 3 2 1 — — —
4th 15 3 3 2 — — —
5th 16 3 3 2 1 — —
6th 17 4 3 3 2 — —
7th 18 4 4 3 2 1 —
8th 19 4 4 3 3 2 —
9th 20 4 4 4 3 2 1

Eff sorcerer level ECL 0th 1st 2nd
1st 2 Detect magic, sonic snap, prestidigitation, mending Power word pain, ancient knowledge
2nd 4 Mage hand
3rd 6 Scramble true position
4th 8 Ghost sound Cloud of knives

Eff Sublime chord level ECL 4th 5th 6th 7th 8th 9th
1st 11 Warp truename, legion of sentinels, invoke the cerulean sign Storm touch
2nd 12 Beckon monster Mislead
3rd 14 Greater anticipate teleportation
4th 15 Overland flight Otto's irresistible dance
5th 16 Arcane spellsurge
6th 17 Toxic weapon Lesser dragonshape Greater teleport
7th 18 Superior invisibility
8th 19 Disintegrate Finger of death Mind blank
9th 20 Unname

Spell Source/page Why's it cool?
Cantrips Varies They're cantrips, whatever, don't waste my time.
Power word pain Races of the Dragon pg 116 This is important for two reasons. First, it's just a very powerful spell for a very long time. It's nearly unavoidable damage for the first large portion of the game, and it's repeatable (so it triggers Aberrant Banemagic multiple times, once that matters). Second, it has no somatic or material component, so it can be given +2 CL via Primitive Caster. This allows for CL 3 right away, letting us put three copies of it (and thus three spell levels) into the divine companion, thereby meeting the requirement for 3rd level spells early on.
Ancient knowledge Magic of Eberron pg 94 Researching personal truenames requires Knowledge checks, and this is a nice easy +5 bonus to that! Also helps with Dreamtelling.
Scramble true position Tome of Magic pg 258 To be blunt, this spell is simply entertaining. Break up formations, knock people prone, maybe get lucky and shunt them somewhere hazardous… it's simply fun! It's also a great Sculpt candidate later on. Oh, and I'm going to leave you in anticipation, but there's more coming.
Cloud of knives PHB2 pg 107 This spell involves making multiple attack rolls on multiple rounds with a relatively minor investment of actions up front. That means triggering Target of Vengeance bonus damage and sneak attack multiple times (and potentially triggering Banemagic multiple times) for just a single action invested. Remember that since this spell makes an attack roll, it's a weaponlike spell.
Warp truename Tome of Magic pg 261 This is kind of key to one of our core tricks against a chosen target. Not only is it a really nasty debuff, but forcing the target to be an aberration means that Banemagic (and, eventually, Greater Banemagic) will apply, thereby ramping up damage and save DCs. What delightful vengeance!
Legion of sentinels PHB2 pg 116 plus errata (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/errata) I love this dang spell. It's strong enough that I don't mind one bit giving up a 4th for it despite it being a 3rd. Note that the errata gives some key numbers. The spell's making attack rolls, so it's a weaponlike spell and the weaponlike spell rules apply. The spell explicitly gives flanking, so that's a good sneak attack trigger. Sculpt Spell means a bigger (and more advantageous) area, and that means more attacks from this spell. Beckon monster will force targets to come closer and provoke from this spell. It's just great start to finish. Oh, and don't forget that spells exist in three dimensions! Nothing says that the sentinels have to be on solid ground, so (assuming a Medium foe), the squares 5' above ground level will also contain sentinels that can get in their swings.
Invoke the cerulean sign Lords of Madness pg 211 The primary purpose of this spell is to allow us to meet the prereq for keeper of the cerulean sign (since this spell is needed in crafting the cerulean sign item, and keeper of the cerulean sign requires that we be able to do that unaided). Of course, since warp truename forces a target to become an aberration, that also forces them to be affected by this spell, if you feel like it. Not a primary strategy, but an option nonetheless. Since it has no verbal component, Primitive Caster gives an easy +1 CL (or even +2 if you feel like messing around with the rare herbs, but that's kind of annoying).
Beckon monster Tome of Magic pg 256 Forced movement is rare in this edition, so that's already fun before we even start on any combos. Forced movement that eats the target's actions is even more fun. And when you've got up a legion of sentinels around the target and any movement is going to trigger all sorts of counterattacks? Well that's about as nice as it gets! Note that this doesn't require a personal truename, so it even works against folks other than your chosen target.
Storm touch Magic of Eberron pg 103 "Quite simply, this is a damage spell. It's a nice easy touch attack, so it's a weaponlike spell (and by now, that should lead to a familiar mantra: sneak attack, Target of Vengeance, and maybe Banemagic all triggering over and over). As a melee touch attack, it means you can get sneak attack just from flanking without necessarily going invisible. The stun effect is great if they happen to fail a save. Rules Compendium pg. 136 says ""Casting time takes precedence over normal rules for attacks, unless a spell’s description says otherwise. If a spell allows its caster to make multiple attacks and has
a casting time of 1 standard action, all those attacks occur during that standard action. The caster uses the highest applicable attack bonus for each attack in such a case."" Which would indicate that you get a whole bunch of touch attacks all as a single action. I personally think that's a little bit abusive and isn't the intent of that rule, so I'm assuming that you just get one attack per round (maybe two, with BAB?) and therefore the sneak attack triggers on multiple rounds, but if you want to accept the more powerful reading that allows for a massive spike of damage all at once, be my guest!"
Mislead PHB pg 255 Note that this is a 5th level spell for bards, and as sublime chord says, when a spell is a different level for bards and for sorcerers, learn it as a bard. Anyway, improved invisibility is a good time (sneak attack or even death attack!), and doing it with an illusory double causing havoc is excellent for getting into or getting out of trouble.
Overland flight PHB pg 259 Does this really require an introduction? All-day flight is valuable, period.
Toxic weapon PHB2 pg 126 Since the SI gives poison use, we may as well use it! This is also a good chance to use Venomous Strike and make the DC even nastier. A bit less sketchy than the tired old "minor creation for black lotus extract" trick, and easier on our poor overstretched skill points, too.
Greater anticipate teleportation Spell Compendium pg 13 We… got a big combo here. So this spell lasts 24 hours and we can assume to have it up all day every day without spending time in combat. It's useful on its own, but it really shines when combined with scramble true position, which doesn't allow a save (against the teleport), doesn't require a personal truename, and only costs a 1st level slot. James can simply make a battlefield disappear for three rounds (and they're none the wiser) before rearranging it randomly! As the spell indicates, this is a great chance to set up a readied action or another really nasty situation. Against the sworn target of vengeance, though, this gets even more fun. Since IVT gives the scry target ability as a SLA, it has only a standard action casting time. With arcane spellsurge (see below), Jack can use a swift action on scramble true position and then a standard on scry target, at which point he can observe the target (wherever it is) for three rounds before it poofs back onto the field. Since the target is unaware of the delay, they're not aware that they're being observed. Three rounds just so happens to be the amount of time it takes to set up a death attack! So against normal enemies, this lets you really disadvantage them and basically just not worry about them for a few rounds; against your special target, this can be a free death attack.
Lesser dragonshape Dragon Magic pg 66 This isn't technically a weaponlike spell per se, but it is a spell that lets you make a whole lot of attack rolls, which will all trigger sneak attack and Target of Vengeance multiple times (when applicable). I love that it's natively a swift action, too.
Otto's irresistible dance PHB pg 259 May as well take advantage of having access to the bard list too. No-save-just-suck is fun times even if it's mind-affecting. Are you immune? No? Then you lose, good day sir. Note that this forces the target to provoke, which is lovely with legion of sentinels. This is one of the best spells to ready for when someone comes back from
Disintegrate PHB pg 222 Also cheekily known as greater open or as make hole. Terraforming the world around you is a good fun caster thing to do. If you choose to use it offensively, since it's a ray, it's weaponlike and therefore you get to use your bonuses!
Arcane spellsurge Dragon Magic pg 64 Action economy: the spell! Want to make sneak attacks AND cast spells at the same time? Look no farther! If you want to get off multiple spells per round, just haul in Sculpt Spell, since the spontaneous metamagic rules work in your favor when arcane spellsurge is up. Notice that this also lets a true scry-and-die happen: observe the target remotely for three rounds (IVT's far sense is ideal), teleport in as a swift, then make a nice death attack as a standard before they've even rolled initiative.
Greater teleport PHB pg 293 The utility is self-evident. You can go wherever the heck you want with no difficulty, and that's awesome. And of course, since the SI gives a nice scrying ability, who doesn't love a classic scry-and-die setup? Find a target, teleport in, and unload for all you're worth before they can react. Timeless. Note that there's no concern with your own greater anticipate teleportation; you can teleport out no problem, and your destination square at the time you cast the spell is not in your aura, so you won't be delayed.
Finger of death PHB pg 230 A simple, no-nonsense save-or-die. They might be a little annoying as game design, but they're certainly powerful. (Especially with, say, Greater Banemagic amping up the DC by +6…)
Superior invisibility Spell Compendium pg 125 Does just what you think. Great for sneak attacks, death attacks, observations, escapes, heists, offense, defense, whatever you want.
Mind blank PHB pg 253 The eternal defensive classic. Immunity to mind-affecting and to divination? All day? Yeah, that's worth a spell known!
Unname Tome of Magic pg 260 Here it is, the capstone! If you hate someone so much that you're willing to spend an entire day swearing vengeance against them, well, you may as well research their truename so that you can utterly remove them from the cosmos! I firmly believe that no one but an Imaskari vengeance taker would even bother trying to learn or cast this spell, but it seems entirely in keeping with what IVT is all about. Naturally, if you want to soften them up with warp truename first (I mean, you already have their personal truename), then you should absolutely use Greater Banemagic here for a +6 on the save DC, but maybe you don't even need that.

This build started from the premise that spending an entire day (or three entire days if someone else happens to kill the bastard) swearing vengeance against a target is kind of a long time. And if you're going to spend that much time and effort hating on one specific person, then you might as well spend a little bit more time and avail yourself of another kind of really specific tool that only works against certain people you've researched in advance: personal truenames, as described on Tome of Magic pg. 197.

Now, if you aren't a truenamer (and who wants to be a truenamer?), the main appeal of personal truenames is that certain spells require that you say the target's personal truename in order for the spell to work. And hey, spells? IVT advances casting, so that seems like a good thing!

What's more, IVT's divination ability actually makes it easier to research personal truenames. So really, this is in keeping with the whole premise. The IVT gets mad at someone, spends a really long time fuming about it and looking up every possible sin that the target ever committed, and comes after them with a single-minded purpose and fury rarely seen outside of, like, weird fanboys on the internet.

Now, once personal truename spells are on the table, there's an obvious tantalizing semi-forbidden fruit at the apex: unname, that really cool-looking spell with the neat picture of the mind flayer being erased from reality. I want that. Don't we all want that? We all want that! That's like the essence of what IVT is all about: research the hell out of a very specific target and then end them with, as is said, extreme prejudice. But it's a ninth, so that's a bummer. Since IVT loses five levels of casting, there's no way to get a ninth with it if you're starting with a regular base class for your spells.

I know, I know, you're rolling your eyes at sublime chord, but hear me out, okay? Sublime chord is basically the best way to get sor/wiz ninths while still accommodating a bunch of missing caster levels, since you only need nine levels of advancement to get it. I'm not going for sublime chord because "lol casting strong;" I'm going for sublime chord because it's the only way to get what is possibly the most thematic spell imaginable for IVT. Only IVT would bother looking up someone's name for this, so to give it up just because a plain ol' wizard can't get it in time feels like quitter talk.

But… well, let's say that I enter the SI at ECL 6, with five levels of whatever else first to get my spells. Can't get into sublime chord before ECL 11 because it's got multiple skill gates. But if I have, for example, five levels of IVT after I start advancing sublime chord, well, that's just not going to work, because then I'd lose out on ninths, and that's literally the entire point of why I'm not just being a plain ol' wizard or whatever. So that means that I need to get into IVT early. But how?

So as I'm sure will be seen several times this round, the SI's low skill gate simply begs for an early-entry trick, since it's a lot easier to get around spell level requirements than around skill requirements. I believe that this particular trick I intend to show off is new, or at least new-ish; I don't recall personally seeing anyone else use it before.

The sorcerer's "divine companion" alternate class feature in Complete Champion allows the sorcerer to give up their familiar in exchange for a nebulous not-a-creature that can hold arcane spell energy and then spit it back out for healing or defensive effects. It's cute enough. But the wording is… particular. I'm going to highlight a few bits (Complete Champion pgs 51-2):

The divine companion stores arcane energy and redirects it to you according to your level and your needs. To fill this reservoir, you must cast one or more targeted spells at this creature. A spell so cast does not produce its normal effect; the companion simply absorbs the spell's energy. It can store a number of spell levels equal to your arcane caster level.

[. . .]

It uses your caster level for any checks required, and when it releases arcane energy, the level of the effect created equals the number of spell levels released.

[. . .]

As a standard action, you can order your divine companion to convert the energy it has stored into healing power. This is the equivalent of a conjuration (healing) spell.

[. . .]

As a swift action, you can order the creature to convert the energy it has stored into protecting you. This is the equivalent of an abjuration spell that provides you with . . .

You see it, right? With CL 3, I can cast three targeted first-level spells into the companion and then order it to release those three spells at once. This is considered to be an abjuration spell or a conjuration spell, and the level of the effect is the number of spell levels used at once (in this case, three, for a third-level spell).

Now, how to get CL 3 with a single level of sorcerer? There's a few methods (like Bloodline of Fire in PGtF, or Spell Thematics/Ship's Mage + the Spellgifted trait, or others), but I like using Primitive Caster, which lets you add V, S, and/or M components to spells that don't have them already and rewards you with +1 CL for each one that you add. Since power word pain is already a really good spell and it only has a verbal component to start, that can be used to bootstrap into CL 3 while casting it. Since the spell energy is absorbed by you casting it at your not-a-creature companion, that should be enough to get 3 levels in there all at once and then bam, qualification!

(Note that you don't have to use the herb every time. You only need to do this once! Maybe you don't even need to actually go through with it but you simply need to have the capability! And there's no penalty for failing the Profession check and it can be used untrained, so just take 20 to get the herb(s) you need.)

So one level of sorcerer with divine companion and Primitive Caster takes care of the spell requirement. Human gives an extra feat to take care of Track. Hide and MS aren't sorcerer skills and I don't have any spare feats or ACFs left to use to fix that, so I had to take another class to take care of those requirements. Since the whole deal is to use Truespeak, using human paragon to get Truespeak as a permanent class skill effectively saves a feat that would have otherwise been spent on Truename Training. Human paragon, conveniently, also gives weird stuff like Perform in-class, since Perform is necessary to get into sublime chord.

Sublime chord also requires bardic music, and since IVT requires that the character be lawful, that means that I need to get bardic music from something other than bard, since no one wants to mess around with an alignment shift mid-build in order to qualify for stuff. There's a few options for getting bardic music without a nonlawful alignment, but the one that requires the fewest feats is virtuoso. Truth be told, that is virtuoso's sole purpose in this build. In a game that ignores stupid alignment restrictions, I'd just have taken a simple level of bard and gotten bardic music and my Perform ranks that way. Would have saved some cross-class skill points. Ah, well, nevertheless!

Now, the other really cool spell that involves a personal truename is warp truename. It's a really nasty debuff (the target's physical stats all become 10 and it loses all or almost all of its abilities), and it also changes the target's type to aberration. Which means that it's possible to take advantage of all sorts of really specific anti-aberration stuff that would otherwise be unreliable. I mean, if you're going to take revenge, take it on YOUR terms! (Have you ever read Moxon's The Revisionaries? Remember the part with Goop-Goop? I imagine a little like that.) In this case, we're looking at Aberration Banemagic and at the keeper of the cerulean sign, which is a delightful way to round out the progression. I like Banemagic because it's not actually metamagic and it simply requires that you be using magic on the target, so once you've warped their truename, you're automatically in business. And the Greater Banemagic ability from keeper of the cerulean sign is pretty welcome, too. I mean, whether it's adding +6d6 to a spell that's going to ping round after round or adding +6 to the save DC of a save-or-die, that's noticeable!

Let's talk about truenaming a little bit! Craft Wondrous Item happens to be a prereq for keeper of the cerulean sign, but it's also a grade-A feat for someone interested in making Truespeak checks. Make yourself an amulet of the silver tongue! Make a nice competence bonus to Truespeak! Make something with a bonus to Knowledge skills! Make other, cool, non-truenaming related items! Your cerulean sign has to be made solo, but nothing else necessarily must be. Also, the Paragnostic Assembly (Complete Champion pg 72) is there for bonuses as well; James qualifies with HD, ranks in Knowledges, and so on. (Also also, remember that the DCs for scramble true position and beckon monster are lower than the others.)

Sudden Extend is my favorite feat to use as a prereq for "any metamagic feat," since it works early on and it's always useful. What's more, the fact that you can use it on your highest-level spells is pretty nice! It never goes out of style. The reason James needs "any metamagic feat" is for Sculpt Spell, which frankly is just hilarious with scramble true position or legion of sentinels (or a few other choices). Dreamtelling is used to get commune effects to aid in researching personal truenames. Make liberal use of ancient knowledge here; also remember that you can spend time studying to change your Paragnostic Assembly bonus between Truespeak and a specific Knowledge skill, so since you're already spending time researching, there's no reason not to take advantage. Also, while it takes a few levels to really get a lot of ranks in K: Planes, two things to remember: first, it's only when warp truename comes online that it becomes important to research personal truenames (and that's about when you start getting a lot of K: Planes ranks), and second, there's lots of ways to get bonuses to Knowledge checks beyond just ranks. Venomous Strike is quite appropriate for someone with poison use, sneak attack, and a penchant for scry-and-die tactics. Use toxic weapon, store-bought poison, or both for a lovely little bonus.

So in summary, James researches personal truenames of targets he hates and uses them to either erase those targets from existence or to make their existence very brief and painful. He has loads of weaponlike spells with which to trigger sneak attack and the target of vengeance bonus over and over. He can do a true scry-and-die. He has an unusual method of triggering death attack via the scramble true position + greater anticipate teleportation + scry target combo. He uses Venomous Strike and toxic weapon to take advantage of poison use. He uses the seeker ability to aid in researching personal truenames. His spell combos are all sorts of fun. No one else goes as far as he does when it comes to taking true vengeance!

Game element Prereq Met at ECL
Sublime chord (before ECL 11): K Arcana 13 10
Sublime chord Listen 13 10
Sublime chord Profession (astrologer) 6 9
Sublime chord Perform (any) 10 7
Sublime chord Spellcraft 6 10
Sublime chord Bardic music 10
Virtuoso Diplomacy 4 3
Virtuoso Intimidate 4 5
Virtuoso Perform (any) 10 7
Virtuoso Arcane CL 1 2
Imaskari Vengeance Taker Hide 4 1
Imaskari Vengeance Taker Move Silently 5 2
Imaskari Vengeance Taker Survival 2 1
Imaskari Vengeance Taker 3rd level arcane spells 2
Imaskari Vengeance Taker Track 1
Imaskari Vengeance Taker Lawful Backstory
Imaskari Vengeance Taker Must have killed someone purely for revenge Backstory
Keeper of the Cerulean Sign Gather Information 5 12
Keeper of the Cerulean Sign K Arcana 8 8
Keeper of the Cerulean Sign K Dungeoneering 8 11
Keeper of the Cerulean Sign Sense Motive 5 12
Keeper of the Cerulean Sign Craft Wondrous Item 9
Craft Wondrous Item CL 3 6
Keeper of the Cerulean Sign Aberration Banemagic 12
Keeper of the Cerulean Sign Craft a cerulean sign without aid 11
Craft a cerulean sign without aid Invoke the Cerulean Sign as spell known 11
Venomous Strike Poison use 4
Venomous Strike 2d6 sneak attack 7
Sculpt Spell Any metamagic feat 3

Category Element Book Page
Class Human paragon Unearthed Arcana 43
Class Sorcerer PHB 51
Class Imaskari vengeance taker Underdark 37
Class Virtuoso Complete Adventurer 89
Class Sublime chord Complete Arcane 61
Class Keeper of the cerulean sign Lords of Madness 194
ACF Divine companion Complete Champion 51
Feat Track PHB 101
Feat Primitive Caster Frostburn 49
Feat Sudden Extend Complete Arcane 83
Feat Dreamtelling Heroes of Horror 122
Feat Craft Wondrous Item PHB 92
Feat Aberration Banemagic Lords of Madness 178
Feat Venomous Strike Drow of the Underdark 54
Feat Sculpt Spell Complete Arcane 83

Spells and other game elements are cited in-line or in their dedicated table.

Sincere thanks as always to mattie_p. I probably would have given up in making that skill table if it weren't for his auto-formatting spreadsheet. Thanks, man. You rock.

The Viscount

2022-01-12, 09:31 PM

Karakan, Karakan, gets all the vengeance that he can.

Karakan, the vengeful Poison-merchant
Master of the Poisoneus Hands

(Karakan: translates from Turkish into "dark blood")

Karakan is a Dragonwrought Kobold who has lived his live. He spend most of his younger years in the mines, honing his physical abilities while meditating each day (Draconic Rite of Passage) which turned him into a disciplined and well physically defined Kobold (monk). After spending most of his life in the tribe and barely leaving it on his own, he decides that his last years as great wyrm (121+ years) should be spend as wandering (poison) merchant, traveling the world to find trading connections for his tribe. After a long search, while traveling around in a caravan, he did find some people who did accept him as a kobold (selling poisons). But before his tribe could profit from the new potential trading partners, the caravan was attacked by brutal bandits who slayed most of the people.
Karakan barely survived this incident and was found by some Imaskari "Talent Scouts" on their way home form a slave marked. They did hope to find potential candidates under the slaves who have the fire of vengeance in their eyes and have potential to become Imaskari Vengeance Takers. They where out of luck so far.
But despite being almost dead, this Dragonwrought Kobold seems to be an interesting specimen. Once the kobold awakes, he explains what happened.
Karakan, angered by the loss of the valuable connections, swears vengeance as the "talent scouts" notice the fire in his eyes. Seems the talent scouts where lucky in the end. This starts a fruitful connection between em. Over time he gets introduced to the Lodge of the Retributive Masters. Those want to "help" him to get revenge and even are willing to build up a trading route with the Kobold tribe, if he also swears loyalty to the Lodge of the Retributive Masters in return.

Dragonwrought Kobold (Shadow Dragon heritage)

Sorcerer 5 / Monk 1 / Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 / Unseen Seer 4

Alignment: lawful - evil

Ability

LVL 1
(32P. + racial modifiers)
max lvl + full gear
(modifiers)

STR:
10
(14-2)
10

DEX:
16
(14+2)
18
+2 Horseshoe of Flame

CON:
12
(14-2)
12 (-)*
*none if temporary undead

INT:
16
(13+3)
30
+10 Horseshoe of Flame, +4 Wish

WIS:
12
(9+3)
12

CHA:
18
(15+3)
34
+6 Horseshoe of Flame, +5 Wish, +5 lvlUp

*Skills:
(+X) = X points invested; cross class (double cost included) when red colored

Level
Class
BAB
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Skills
(+X points invested)
Feats
Features

1st
Monk (1)
Fighting Style: Sleeping Tiger (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm)
+0
+2
+2
+2
Concentration: 4
Handle Animal: 2 (+4)
Hide: 4
Move Silently: 4
Sense Motive: 4
Spot: 4
Survival: 2 (+4)
Dragonwrought Kobold (Shadow Dragon: Move Silently +2)
(Races of the Dragon)

Bonus Feat: Weapon Finesse
Draconic Rite of Passage:
-1 HP
Blood Wind 1/day
(Races of the Dragon)

2nd
Sorcerer (1)
Variant: Animal Companion (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm)
+0
+2
+2
+4
Concentration: 5
Spellcraft: 4 (+4)

Animal Companion: medium Viper

3rd
Sorcerer (2)
+1
+2
+2
+5
Concentration: 6
Craft (Poisonmaking): 4 (+4)
Track
New Class Abilities

4th
Sorcerer (3)
+1
+3
+3
+5
Concentration: 7
Craft (Poisonmaking) 7 (+3)
Spellcraft: 5

New Class Abilities

5th
Dragonblood Sorcerer (4)
(substitution level - Races of the Dragon)
+2
+3
+3
+6
Use Magic Device: 5 (+5)

Class Skills:
minus Craft and Profession
plus Use Magic Device

Arcane insight +2

Spell-Like-Ablility

6th
Sorcerer (5)
+2
+3
+3
+6
Concentration: 8
Use Magic Device: 7 (+4)
Draconic Reservoir (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060420a)
Greater Draconic Rite of Passage:
(http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060420a)-3 HP
+1 Sorcerer spell progression

7th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker (1)
+2
+3
+5
+8
Concentration: 10 (+2)
Craft (Poisonmaking): 10 (+3)
Hide: 7 (+2)

Target of Vengeance

8th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker (2)
+3
+3
+6
+7
Concentration: 11
Craft (Poisonmaking): 11
Hide: 8
Move Silently: 5
Search: 3 (+3)

Poison Use

9th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker (3)
+4
+4
+6
+7
Concentration: 12
Craft (Poisonmaking): 12
Search: 8 (+5)
Poison Spell
(Drow of the Underdark)
Sneak Attack +1d6

10th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker (4)
+5
+4
+7
+8
Concentration: 13
Craft (Poisonmaking): 13
Spot: 5 (+5)

Far Sense

11th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker (5)
+5
+4
+7
+8
Concentration: 14
Craft (Poisonmaking) 14
Spot: 8 (+3)
Use Magic Device: 8 (+2)

Sneak Attack +2d6

12th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker (6)
+6
+5
+8
+9
Concentration: 15
Craft (Poisonmaking): 15
Hide: 9
Use Magic Device: 10 (+4)
Multiattack
(Monster Manual)
Seeker

13th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker (7)
+7
+5
+8
+9
Concentration: 16
Craft (Poisonmaking): 16
Hide: 10
Use Magic Device: 12 (+4)

Sneak Attack +3d6

14th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker (8)
+8
+5
+9
+10
Concentration: 17
Craft (Poisonmaking): 17
Hide: 11
Use Magic Device: 14 (+2)

Scry Target

15th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker (9)
+8
+6
+9
+10
Concentration: 18
Craft (Poisonmaking): 18
Hide: 12
Use Magic Device: 16 (+4)
Natural Bond
(Animal Companion: Fleshraker)
Sneak Attack +4d6

16th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker (10)
+9
+6
+10
+11
Concentration: 19
Craft (Poisonmaking): 19
Hide: 13
Use Magic Device: 18 (+4)

Death Attack

17th
Unseen Seer (1)
(Complete Mage)
+9
+6
+10
+13
Concentration: 20
Craft (Poisonmaking): 20
Hide: 16 (+3)
Use Magic Device: 20 (+4)

Damage Bonus +1d6

18th
Unseen Seer (2)
+10
+6
+10
+14
Concentration: 21
Craft (Poisonmaking): 21
Hide: 21 (+5)
Use Magic Device: 21 (+2)
Improved Multiattack
(Draconomicon)
Advanced Learning: Hunter's Eye
(PHB II)

Silent Spell

19th
Unseen Seer (3)
+11
+7
+11
+14
Concentration: 22
Craft (Poisonmaking): 22
Hide: 22
Move Silently: 9 (+4)
Use Magic Device: 22 (+2)

Divination Spell Power +1

20th
Unseen Seer (4)
+12
+7
+11
+15
Concentration: 23
Craft (Poisonmaking): 23
Hide: 23
Move Silently: 13 (+4)
Use Magic Device: 23 (+2)

Damage Bonus +2d6

Spells per Day/Spells Known

Level
0lvl
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
7th
8th
9th

1st
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

2nd
5/4
3/2
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

3rd
6/5
4/2
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

4th
6/5
5/3
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

5th
6/6
6/3
3/1
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

6th
6/6
6/4
4/2
-
-
-
-
-
-
-

GDROP*
6/7
6/4
5/2
3/1
-
-
-
-
-
-

7th
6/7
6/4
5/2
3/1
-
-
-
-
-
-

8th
6/7
6/5
6/3
4/2
-
-
-
-
-
-

9th
6/7
6/5
6/3
4/2
-
-
-
-
-
-

10th
6/8
6/5
6/3
5/2
3/1
-
-
-
-
-

11th
6/8
6/5
6/3
5/2
3/1
-
-
-
-
-

12th
6/8
6/5
6/4
6/3
4/2
-
-
-
-
-

13th
6/8
6/5
6/4
6/3
4/2
-
-
-
-
-

14th
6/9
6/5
6/4
6/3
5/2
3/1
-
-
-
-

15th
6/9
6/5
6/4
6/3
5/2
3/1
-
-
-
-

16th
6/9
6/5
6/5
6/4
6/3
4/2
-
-
-
-

17th
6/9
6/5
6/5
6/4
6/3
5/2
3/1
-
-
-

18th
6/9
6/5
6/5
6/4
6/4
6/3
4/2
-
-
-

19th
6/9
6/5
6/5
6/4
6/4
6/3
5/2
3/1
-
-

20th
6/9
6/5
6/5
6/4
6/4
6/4
6/3
4/2
-
-

* Greater Draconic Rite of Passage (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060420a)= +1 Sorcerer spell progression.

SLA

SLA have a special purpose in this build. Touch spell charges vanish if you "cast" another spell. With SLAs, we can bypass this limitation and keep our charges.

(Draconic Rite of Passage)
Blood Wind (SpellCom.) - Swift action spell that lets you make unarmed and natural attacks at range for a single round.
Starts with 1/day and goes up to 3/day at lvl 6.

(Dragonblooded Sorcerer SLA)
We pick Lesser Spider Form first when we get the ability. Later we change it temporary to Wings of Cover and finally to Hunter's Eye. 3/day
Note that we know a spell less of that lvl and give up one spell slot of that lvl as long as we have that spell as SLA.

Spells Known

0:
Detect Magic (PHB)- not much to say here
Detect Poison (PHB)- Helps to find and farm poisons (by finding poisonous plants and creatures with poison abilities).
Launch Item (Spell Compendium) - As the name suggests, launches an item at range. Will be abused to lauch Ossarra (Yuan-Ti mixture) that poisons all non-scaled ones.
...

1:
Lesser Spider Form - turns Karakan (and/or his animal companion) into a medium monstrous spider. Useful to stop fleeing foes or climbing up walls. Also good to stop melee enemies from aproaching us. Combines with Bood Wind a safe kill option.

Chilling Touch (PHB) - Gives one charge per "level". Thus a good touch spell to abuse with Poison Spell.

Death's Grimace (BoVD) - Leaves a personal mark on a dead body to claim that you murdered him. A good roleplay spell to work as vengeance taker.

Golem Strike (SpellCom.)- To be able to affect constructs with sneak attacks, if our target should use constructs to defend himfelf.

Stupor (BoVD) - places one creature already helpless in a clouded, confused state for h/clvl. Foe can be moved without noticing what really happens. Abuse this to preserve a foe that is helpless (e.g. from ability damage) and take him back and kill him in public (Imaskar) or wherever he deserves to die according to your contract.

2:
Alter Self (PHB) - turn into a tiny Shadow Dragon: +7NA claw/claw/bite attack 120ft fly speed average maneuverability; a nice travel form and early lvl combat form.

Mirror Image (PHB) - A good defense to get hit less often in a fight.

Wings of Cover (RotD) - Combined with Mirror Image a strong strategy to not get hit.

Knock (PHB) - nothing shall stand between a kobold and his ambitions. Knock all doors and chests open.

Magic Mouth (PHB) - Leave a magic mouth on the corpses of your foes with a message of warning. Can be made permanent (via scroll of permanency) if the corpse should be setup in public as example.

3:
Shivering Touch - a melee touch spell with a duration instead of charges. Just what we need for Poison Spell. The 3d6 dex dmg quickly turn most foes helpless so that all further attacks crit.

Nightmare Terrain - gives basically Hide In Plain Sight for the caster, which is the main selling point imho. The crouwdcontrol effect is just the icing.

Ghost Companion - kills target willing animal or (magical) beast and turns it into a Ghost (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/ghost.htm)for days per caster level. After that it really dies. Since we can get a new animal companion within 24h, this can be abused to get a really strong companion.

Greater Magic Weapon - up to +5 bonus for unarmed strikes.

4:
Locate Creature - great to track down your foes.

Polymorph - gives access to many forms to produce some venom and make poisons out of it (e.g Wywern). Combatforms like Hydra (multiple Bite attacks) or Wartroll (claw/claw/bite) are useful for large scale battles

Greater Invisibility - one of the best spells for sneaky gish characters
Dimensional Anchor (PHB) - Stop enemy from using teleport effects to escape

5:
Arcane Fusion - "Arcane Fusion: Poison Spell: Chill Touch + Poison Spell: Shivering Touch" allows to have 2 touchspells up, since you don't "cast" the spells, but you gain both effects. (bypasses the holding the charge rule to lose any touch spell if you attempt to cast another spell).

Evacuation Rune - Swift action to teleport back to a location you "marked" with this spell. With this we can quickly escape hopefully within the same round we have killed our target. Or if we somehow fail our target and need to escape. Can also be abused to send "marked" letters or gifts to your target foe. A nice Scry & Die tool.

Fabricate - to fabricate lots and lots of poisons.

Undying Vigor of the Dragonlords (Dragon Magic) - healing spell that also works on undead since it is not positive energy!

6:
Contingency - Mostly abused to save actions for buffing or for some other small tricks mentioned in the build.

Mordenkainen's Trusted Bloodhounds - Conjures hounds that are to everyone else invisible. They have Track and an effective survival skill equal to your caster level.

Probe Thoughts - Read directly into people's memory. Why bother asking verbally and risking to be lied to?^^

7:
Greater Teleport - Why bother with all the things that could happen on your journey to your target if we can skip all that to get to the main villain.

Forcecage (PHB) - Combine with Contingency: Arcane Fusion: Dimensional Anchor + (any other 1st lvl spell) to lock anyone (even caster) in place within a single round. Our personal dueling arena^^

Recommended Magic Items

None of these items are mandatory for the build to function, but they can greatly enhance the builds strengths.

Wish x5 for INT & CHA: (10x 28,825g) 288,250g

Necklace of Natural Weapons (Savage Species) + 1 + Assassination (Cityscape) + Impact (Arms & Equipment) + Keen (DMG) + Ghost Touch (DMG)

This is the main item of the build since it is so expensive. Effective price of a (+5 weapon + 600g) x3 (Claws, Bite, Unarmed Strike) results into a total price of 151.800g.
Our Fleshraker should also get one for Claws and Tail. Its bite doesn't have poison and can't be used with tail (which has poison) on the same target. Thus the bite attack is negligible and we ignore it to make the item a lil bit cheaper, 101.200g. Together, they charge our WBL with 253.000g
The Assassination ability enhances our poison DCs by the weapon enchantment. Combined with Greater Magic Weapon +5 (unarmed Strike) and Greater Magic Fang (max clvl wand; Claws + Bite for yourself and Claws + Tail on the fleshraker) the DC of all poison attacks will be raised by 5. Without this, poisons become weak against higher lvl enemies. Keen and Impact are nice, since our poisons and Shivering Touch can quickly render an enemy "helpless" to take critical damage. While the poisons sadly don't get multiplied, the sneak attack damage profits very well from this.

Anklet of Translocation + Horseshoes of Flame
Anklet of Translocation is a nice short range tacticle teleport that preserves our Full Attack when needed. The Horseshoes are applied on em mainly because of the great Statboosts (emulate race with UMD). +2 DEX, 10 INT, +6 CHA, 3x7h fly + nightmarish look per day

Shadow Cloak (DotU) 5500GP
Immediate action teleport. Either for defensive use to dodge an attack, or for tactile movement to preserve our Full-Attack.

Kimono of Storing 4.400g (Oriental Adventures)
Free action access to the Rod of Quickening and other stuff.

(Ghost Touch) Battle Bridle 9.900g (incl. 10% extra for GT)
Gives Mounted Combat and +5 on ride checks. The ghost touch ability is needed to ride the "ghost" Fleshraker while the kobold is not a ghost.

Metamagic Rod Quicken (normal) 75.500g
Can be abused for quickly refreshing buffs (e.g. Arcane Fusion: "Poison Spell: Chill Touch" + "Poison Spell: Shivering Touch).

Recommended Wands

I'll just note those worth special mentioning and won't make a full list of useful wands. You should know the normal stuff that you would pick yourself with UMD.

Greater Magic Fang (max caster lvl): Enhances our Natural Weapons by +5. This also benefits the Assassination enhancement to provide +5 for our Poison DCs.

Last Breath (Druid 4th - Complete Divine): Revives (-1hp stable) a creature that died the last round (without CON or LVL loss). Combined with the Contingency spell, we can now bring our Animal Companion back to life and avoid the 24h for getting a new one. This makes the Ghost Companion spell abuse more comfortable.
And since "lesser spider form" gives us the animal type, our kobold can qualify for the Ghost Companion spell aswell. Abuse Contingent Spell with Ghost Companion to bypass the casting limitation of the spider form. Later we can abuse Contingency:Last Breath to safely come back to life. Rinse and repeat whenever you feel the need for it.

Venomfire (Serpent Kingdom) - Enhances the venom of our animal companion (or any form for alter self/poly with access to venom) by alot.

Primal Instinct (Dragon Magic) - 24h +5 compentence bonus on Initiative & Survival checks

Grave Strike (Spell Compendium) - Allows Sneak Attacks on undead targets.

Vine Strike (Spell Compendium) - Allows Sneak Attacks against plant type enemies.

Golem Strike (Spell Compendium) - Allows Sneak Attacks against constructs.

Recommended Poisons

Here is a small selection of recommended poisons

Medium Sized Spider venom
Injury, DC 13, 1d4 STR / 1d4 STR or 1d6 STR /1d6 STR..
Our viper companion will give us access to this poison. The monstours spider has 2 different values since the values in the main statblock and the poison statblock differ. This typo seems to be in the SRD (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/monstrousSpider.htm)and the MM. So, pick the value that you like more..

Wyvern poison
Injury, DC 17, 2d6 CON / 2d6 CON
With Polymorph we can shape into a Wyvern ourselve and thus produce lots of the poison in downtimes. Burn off some polymorph slots before going to bed. Karakan relies on CON dmg poison when he wants to kill his enemies as fast as possible.

Darklight brew
Injury, DC 23, 2d6CON + 1d6STR / blinded

Bkack Lotus
Contact, DC 20, 3d6 CON / 3d6 CON
contact poison, thus only usable in ghost form due to poison immunity

Terinar root
Contact, DC16, 1d6 DEX / 2d6 DEX
again contact poison and thus only for ghost form. This is the poison of choice if we want to quickly make our foe helpless (together with Shivering Touch).

Ossara - Yuan Ti poisons from Serpent Kingdom

These nice things buff scaled ones (includes our Kobold Karakan) and poisons anyone else. You need to brun em up to create the smoke. Any creature that inhales the smoke is affected (either poisoned or buffed). Most noteable:
Faele: buff: -1 damage per dice taken / poison: 2d6 CON - 1d6 CON
Battasss: buff: bypass Concentration checks / poison 1d4 WIS - 1d4+2 rounds sleep
Ulathlasss: buff: become immune to heat and cold. take only half damage from fire and ice. If Karakan has direct contact with the burning oil, he even becomes immune to fire and ice temporary.

Karakan starts a simple kobold monk with access to Blood Wind as SLA 1/day and Weapon Finesse. This allows for a ranged full attack with claw/claw/bite which should give him once a day the upper hand in a battle. With becoming a Sorcerer we get an Animal Companion (variant) and pick a medium viper which gives the build early access to the poison theme of the SI. Lesser Spiderform is the first spell we pick and should carry us together with monk and blood wind over the early levels. The Dragonblooded Sorcerer substitution level gives the build access to UMD (to max it up to character lvl +3). While we need to spend double the points on the later levels, we still try to max it.
Alter Self will be abused to turn Karakan into a tiny Shadow Dragon (+7NA, 120ft fly average, claw/claw/bite) which is a good combat and travel form.
Karakan get more Blood Wind uses and we get the lost caster lvl back (via Gr. Draconic Rite of Passage). Finally he is worth to become a real Imaskari Vengeance Taker. "Poison Use & Poison Spell" allows us to apply the poisons we craft (poisonmaking) to apply to melee touch spells we cast. Together with Chill Touch and/or Silvering Touch we get multiple uses of each single poison dose we need to cast those spells. This just cries to be abused with multiple unarmed strikes and natural attacks via full attack (holding the charge rules allows touch spells to be placed on your unarmed strikes or natural attacks). Up to 4 attacks (unarmed strike(s) as primary weapon at full BAB, all natural weapons at -5), which means up to 4 poison save rolls (note that the secondary rolls can also be stacked, so make sure to keep track of em if needed).
Mirror Image + Wings of Cover keep the lil kobold alive if he should draw to much aggro^^
With Nightmare Terrain we basically get access to HIPS. Now we can much better fight in large crowds without being spotted by everyone immediately. This helps to be hidden in combat all the time and to always get sneak attack damage when needed.
Locate Creature helps to find our target foe and keep track if he tries to flee.
Multiattack lessens the penalties for all our Natural Weapons (to -2 for being secondary weapons). This helps to hit more reliable and apply our sneak attack damage and our poisons more often (due to hitting more often). Further Multiattack seems to be exploitable with the Monk's Unarmed Strike ability by RAW:

Monk's Unarmed Strike give the specific exception to let em count as either manufactured or natural weapon for "spells and effects".
"Effects" is undefined in 3.5 but heavily used over all rule books. A few rare cases even are more specifically talking about "magical effects", but that doesn't mean that all effects have to be magical.
While one might argue that the general rules for counting as natural weapon are not effects, this is not the chase for anything altering/trumping them.
In fact, anything that affects you is an "effect" by RAW. In the chase of feats, we have multiple feats with the following statement:

Special
You can gain this feat multiple times. Its effects do not stack. Each time you take the feat, it applies to a new type of weapon.

So it is safe to assume that the rules also see feats as effects. Now, (Improved) Multiattack is a feat that works with Natural Weapons. A monk's unarmed strike may count as Natural Weapon for spells and effects. So with Multiattack, we can now add our unarmed strike as natural weapon into our full attack routine.
How is this important you ask? Well, monk's unarmed strike also allows to be used with 8 different body parts (fists, elbows, knees, feet). So the optimal declaration of bodyparts for his full attack would look like: (example)
1. use regular Unarmed Strike attacks including iterative attack with your right elbow
2. use claws (thus blocking the fists) and bite
3. declare the remaining body parts as natural weapons (left elbow + left & right knees and feet).
By RAW it seems that a monk can get a crazy amount of attacks by selecting the Multiattack feat line. While the build doesn't rely on this RAW cheese, it is nice to showcase the possibility for this exploit in this build. I haven't seen this exploit mentioned so far and it was just a coincidence that I noticed it while writing up the build. That's why I wanted to share it here together with the build.

Seeker and Scry Target allows us to reveal more info about our contract target.
Polymorph is the base gish spell to go. But in this chase its main purpose is to get access to natural poisons as ingredient for craft poisonmaking. On the hand the common combat forms like War Troll or a Hydra work really well with the sneak attacks and poisons provided by the build.
Greater Invisibility is just pure gold in a sneaky gish build. Be it for just scouting or for easy kills against anything that can't see/reveal you.
Arcane Fusion allows us to have both Shivering Touch and Chill Touch up, both enhances via Poison Spell. This allows Karakan to apply 2 instances of poison per unarmed strike/natural attack he makes.
Natural Bound increases our effective Druid levels so that we can now have a Fleshraker as Animal Companion. These also produce a natural poison and are a much better combat animal than the viper. Since Karakan is small and the Flesharaker is of medium size, we can use it as mount almost anywhere where normal/medium PC can go. Finally we can share our Arcane Fusion: Poison Spells:(Chill Touch / Shivering Touch). We can now apply lots and lots of poisons per round.
Ghost Companion turns our Fleshraker into a Ghost (template) which greatly enhances its combat abilities. It gets a bunch of abilities including several with ability damage which have a great synergy with our poisons. With a Ghost Touch Necklace of Natural Weapons it can still use its physical abilities and apply poison. The animal dies really at the end of the spell, but since its duration is measured in days per caster level its still worth it. Especially since we can get a new animal companion within 24h of downtime.
If we have access to a wand of Last Breath, we can abuse Contingency to automatically raise the ghost the round after it really dies. Note that Contingency doesn't require you to "cast" the company spell. It sole requires "you to place" the spell. While the wand my be the caster of the spell, it's the wand's user who "places the spell"(chooses the target).
With that, we can now abuse Ghost Companion on ourselves. We abuse Lesser Spider Form to get the required animal type and Contingency:Ghost Companion to bypass the casting limitation while being in spider form. We can abuse the same Contingency:Last Breath combo to come back to life. Rinse and Repeat whenever we need it.

Dimensional Anchor helps to lock down teleportation as escape option if you have a caster as target. Together with Forcecage we have our personal duel arena.
Evacuation Rune can be used either defensively (mark a safe location) or offensively (mark a gift/letter that you send to your target) and only has a swift action casting time. Perfect for Karakan to escape in the same round he kills the main villain.
This works very well with his new gained Death Attack ability. Study target for 3 rounds via, kill and swift teleport away.
Once we get access to Greater Teleport, we can scry our target (Scry Target) of vengeance > study him for 3 rounds > teleport > Death Attack + swift action teleport back to safety. Blink in and out to leave a dead corpse behind.
Unseen Seer accompanies our Vengeance Taker levels well to finish the build. The Bonus Damage dice stack with Karakan's Sneak Attack (up to 6d6 sneak attack dmg). With gaining access to Hunter's Eye we can further improve his sneak attack damage dice. The extra caster level provided by Divination Spell Power (+1) helps to get the most of Hunter's Eye at lvl 20 (21/3= +7d6). Hunter's Eye is also selected as final SLA for Dragonblooded Sorcerer, so that it doesn't interfere with his touch spell charges (see holding the charge rules for chasting new spell and losing the charge).
Improved Multiattack gets rid of the remaining penalty for our secondary Natural Attack This allows us to attack with all natural weapons at full BAB. Since the build has a low BAB for a gish, this compensates that problem to some degree.

Last Words

We finally reached the end of the build. We have a very sneaky poison user that has multiple damage options (raw melee damage, sneak attack, poison, spells, temporary "becoming a ghost"..) with multiple escape options.
Thx due to Poison Spell each unarmed strike & natural weapon in a full attack applies 2 poisons on his victim. And if he turns into a Ghost (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/ghost.htm), he can use his unarmed strikes (charged with poison touch spells) back a touch attack again (with a Ghost Touch Necklace of Natural Weapons). Due to the Assassination enhancement, the DCs of the poisons get raised up to +5 (GMW + GMF). With this, we can quickly poison multiple enemies to death. Being a Ghost (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/ghost.htm)gives us many strong abilities that further enhance the ability damage output Karakan can dish out.
Just a lil example of a full buffed unarmed strike/natural attack made as touch attack:
Chill Touch + Shivering Touch + 2x Black Lotus poison + Ghost: Draining Touch + Hunter's Eye Sneak Attack
1Str dmg & 1d6 dmg + 3d6 Dex dmg + 2x 3d6 CON + 1d6 on any ability score selected + 6d6 +7d6
= potentially (if all saves are failed) 14d6 dmg + 1Str dmg + 3d6 DEX dmg + 6d6 CON + 1d6 on a single ability score (e.g CON again for a total of 7d6 CON dmg)
If the foe should survive this somehow, there is a high potential that he might be helpless sole due to Shivering touch, which lets all further attacks automatically crit (helpless (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/conditionSummary.htm#helpless)rules).
And while we are are talking about being a ghost, the undead type gives, alters some parts of the build. Polymorph can't be used without a CON score. But Alter Self still can be used. Since Alter Self sole gives gives natural weapons and further has a size and HD restriction, there is not much to choose from. Libris Mortis offers Bone Rat Swarm as a good option imho. While we don't get the swarm subtype, we get the swarm attack. Since it is listed as "Attack:" it has to be either a manufactured or natural weapon. Thus Karakan has now a swarm attack to release his touch attacks. Just move into those spaces where the most enemies are standing and automatically hit em at the end of the turn to release your touch spell charges (-are released always on contact, even unintentionally).
Remind you that the ghost template still affects Karakan in this form. While your target form for Alter Self may not have a template, Alter Self does not suppress any templates you already have. Thus the template is still in full effect (except those things where Alter Self calls out that you loose em, like attacks that rely on a body part. Being a Ghost doesn't change any body part at all, those remain all the same. thus Ghost abilities remain uneffected).
The Death Attack's DC can be raised up to 30 (10 base + 10 lvl + 10 Int modifier) which provides a very deadly SCRY & DIE tactic. I bet, you don't wanna be haunted by this kobolds ghost ;)
And when it comes down to tracking and spying out targets, the build relies on the IVT abilities and has a few spells like Locate Creature and Mind Probe to do the job.

I hope you all enjoyed the build and I'm looking forward for the reveal to see the other meals that have been cooked this round =)

The Viscount

2022-01-12, 09:32 PM

The chef's note does say least, not non-.

"He's run away! Get him!"

Alkathira screamed with frustration, bringing low her blade. The vampire in front of her was reduced to dust in a blaze of light, but there were many more, perhaps too many to leave her allies and chase after her prey. On the other hand, she couldn't risk the Derro Shadoweaver getting away. Memories of the homeworld vexed her, reminding her of the fate this cosmos could face if such beings were allowed to run amok. She was gripped by indecision.

I'll find out.

Time… slowed. Slowed, as someone who was-but-wasn't Alkathira delved into the weave. In the far realms of her minds, endless possibilities exploded, worlds dying and being born in an eternal fraction of a second.

Stay. I was told to stay.

Alkathira's laughter echoed through the caves as she charged.

--

Karaz Laksh panted, his hand to his side as he ran. Wizards weren't supposed to run, but he really thought he could take his pursuers, and his attempts at escaping through more conventional means were countered. Countered by that terrible woman – the one who chased him down in the waking world as well as in his dreams, the one who was dressed as a wizard but attempted to cut of his head with a crude sword.

Still, he was alive, uninjured – and he's escaped! And they'll have no way of tracking him down in time, magical means or otherwise. Only a moment more, and he'll get to his sanctum, where he'll be protected. Then will he take his vengeance. He'll eat their flesh, and spread their blood on the walls of the tunnels. He'll find th-

A figure materialized right in front of him as he ran, and before he could possibly react, his head was taken off in one clean swoop.

https://i.imgur.com/qSJKPmL.jpg

Alkathira Hamerubot:
LN female Synad. Duskblade 5/ Knight of The Weave 1/ Abjurant Champion 4/ Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10.

Str 16, Dex 8, Con 14, Int 14, Wis 8, Cha 16. All advancements go to Cha.

Level Class Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Reflex Save Will Save Skills Feats Class Features
1st Duskblade (PHBII p.19) 1 1 2 0 2 Craft (Poisonmaking) 4, Spellcraft 4, Survival 2 (cc), Tumble 4. Hidden Talent (Minor Psionic Creation) (XPH p.67) Skilled city dweller: Ride for Tumble (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20070228a), Arcane Attunement, Armored Mage (light).
2nd Duskblade 2 2 3 0 3 Craft (Poisonmaking) 5 (+1), Hide 1 (cc), Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 5 (+1). Combat Casting (b) -
3rd Duskblade 3 3 3 1 3 Craft (Poisonmaking) 6 (+1), Hide 2 (cc, +1), Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 6 (+1). Power Attack Arcane Channeling
4th Duskblade 4 4 4 1 4 Craft (Poisonmaking) 7 (+1), Hide 3 (cc, +1), Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 7 (+1). - Amored Mage (medium)
5th Duskblade 5 5 4 1 4 Craft (Poisonmaking) 8 (+1), Hide 4 (cc, +1), Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 8 (+1). - Quick Cast 1/day
6th Knight of the Weave (CoV p.111) 5 6 1 6 Craft (Poisonmaking) 8, Hide 4, Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 8, Use Magic Device 4. Fiendish Bloodline (Dragon Compendium p.98) Detect Magic, Read Magic
7th Abjurant Champion (CM p.50) 1 6 6 1 8 Craft (Poisonmaking) 8, Hide 4, Move Silently 1 (cc), Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 10 (+2), Use Magic Device 4. - Skilled City dweller: ride for tumble, Abjurant Armor, Extended Abjuration
8th Abjurant Champion 2 7 6 1 9 Craft (Poisonmaking) 8, Hide 4, Move Silently 2.5 (cc, +1.5), Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 11 (+1), Use Magic Device 4. - Swift Abjuration
9th Abjurant Champion 3 8 7 2 9 Craft (Poisonmaking) 8, Hide 4, Move Silently 3 (cc, +0.5), Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 12 (+1), Use Magic Device 4, Skill Tricks: Actobatic Backstab Track -
10th Abjurant Champion 4 9 7 2 10 Craft (Poisonmaking) 8, Hide 4, Move Silently 5 (cc, +2), Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 12, Use Magic Device 4, Skill Tricks: Actobatic Backstab. - Arcane Boost
11th Imaskari Vengeance Taker (Und p.37)1 9 7 4 12 Craft (Poisonmaking) 10 (+2), Hide 4, Move Silently 5, Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 14 (+2), Use Magic Device 4, Skill Tricks: Actobatic Backstab, Back on Your Feet. - Target of Vengeance
12th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 2 10 7 5 13 Craft (Poisonmaking) 15(+5), Hide 4, Move Silently 5, Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 15 (+1), Use Magic Device 4, Skill Tricks: Actobatic Backstab, Back on Your Feet. Practiced Spellcaster: Duskblade (CArc p.82) Poison Use
13th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 3 11 8 5 13 Craft (Poisonmaking) 16 (+1), Hide 4, Move Silently 5, Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 16 (+1), Use Magic Device 6 (cc, +2), Skill Tricks: Actobatic Backstab, Back on Your Feet. - Sneak Attack +1d6
14th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 4 12 8 6 14 Craft (Poisonmaking) 17 (+1), Hide 4, Move Silently 5, Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 17 (+1), Use Magic Device 8 (cc, +2), Skill Tricks: Actobatic Backstab, Back on Your Feet. - Far Sense
15th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 5 12 8 6 14 Craft (Poisonmaking) 18 (+1), Hide 4, Move Silently 5, Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 18 (+1), Use Magic Device 10 (cc, +2), Skill Tricks: Actobatic Backstab, Back on Your Feet. Staggering Strike (CAdv p.112) Sneak Attack +2d6
16th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 6 13 9 7 15 Craft (Poisonmaking) 19 (+1), Hide 4, Move Silently 5, Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 19 (+1), Use Magic Device 12 (cc, +2), Skill Tricks: Actobatic Backstab, Back on Your Feet. - Seeker
17th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 7 14 9 7 15 Craft (Poisonmaking) 20 (+1), Hide 4, Move Silently 5, Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 20 (+1), Use Magic Device 14 (cc, +2), Skill Tricks: Actobatic Backstab, Back on Your Feet. - Sneak Attack +3d6
18th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 8 15 9 8 16 Craft (Poisonmaking) 21 (+1), Hide 4, Move Silently 5, Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 21 (+1), Use Magic Device 16 (cc, +2), Skill Tricks: Actobatic Backstab, Back on Your Feet. Venomous Strike (DotU 54) Scry Target
19th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 9 15 10 8 16 Craft (Poisonmaking) 22 (+1), Hide 4, Move Silently 5, Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 22 (+1), Use Magic Device 18 (cc, +2), Skill Tricks: Actobatic Backstab, Back on Your Feet. Sneak Attack +4d6
20th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 16 10 9 17 Craft (Poisonmaking) 23 (+1), Hide 4, Move Silently 5, Spellcraft 4, Survival 2, Tumble 23 (+1), Use Magic Device 20 (cc, +2), Skill Tricks: Actobatic Backstab, Back on Your Feet. Death Attack
Duskblade spells known:

0-Level: Acid Splash (1), Disrupt Undead (1), Ray of Frost (1), Touch of Fatigue (1).
1st Level: Chill touch (1), Color Spray (1), Ray of Enfeeblement (2), Shocking Grasp (3), Resist Energy (4).
2nd Level: Dimension Hop (5).

Duskblade spells per day:

Level 0th 1st 2nd
1st 3 2 -
2nd 4 3 -
3rd 5 4 -
4th 6 5 -
5th 6 5 2

Knight of The Weave spells known:

1st Level: Protection from Good (6), Mage Armor (6), Shield (6), Bless Weapon (8), Divine Favor (10).
2nd Level: Darkness (8), See Invisibility (8), Shield Other (8), Darkvision (10), Delay Poison (14).
3rd Level: Sepia Snake Sigil (10), Dispel Magic (10), Fly (10), Daylight (14), Greater Magic Weapon (18).
4th Level: Bestow Curse (12), Death Ward (12), Lesser Globe of Invulnerability (12), Mark of Justice (16).
5th Level: Nightmare (14), Disrupting Weapon (14), True Seeing (14), Spell resistance (18).
6th level: Mislead (16), Banishment (16), Greater Dispel Magic (16), Teleport (20).

Knight of The Weave spells per day:

Level 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th
6th 2 - - - - -
7th 2 - - - - -
8th 3 2 - - - -
9th 3 2 - - - -
10th 4 3 2 - - -
11th 4 3 2 - - -
12th 4 3 2 2 - -
13th 4 3 2 2 - -
14th 4 4 3 2 2 -
15th 4 4 3 2 2 -
16th 4 4 3 3 2 2
17th 4 4 3 3 2 2
18th 4 4 4 3 3 2
19th 4 4 4 3 3 2
20th 4 4 4 3 3 3
Starting out, Alkathira plays as a classic gish – something that would stay true throughout her career. With 5 pp and access to psionic minor creation, she grants her party a versatility of resources usually not available to a focused class like the duskblade. She also knows her way around a poison lab, which means many poisons for intrigue or other purposes can be made. As a synad, she's also very well suited to the underdark – darkvision, 14 int and bonus languages (any) to speak undercommon from level 1, and the aberration type on top of a bonus to will saves to keep safe from the many monsters and evil npcs with abilities that invade the mind.

Staple options like color spray and ray of enfeeblement show up at the jump, and are backed up by power attack and arcane channeling (shocking grasp/ chill touch/ touch of fatigue) at level 3. Dimension hop, her only second level Duskblade spell, can be used for utility purposes on herself and her allies, and can be a nightmare when channeled against full-attackers or at any environment more interesting than a flat featureless plain. Quick cast once per day also comes along at level 5, and is incredibly useful for buffing, debuffing or damaging whenever she absolutely has to do it immediately.

She dips into Knight of The Weave at level 6, taking fiendish bloodline at the same level to enhance her very limited spell known list. Duskblade means easy entry with +5 BaB as well as enjoying the benefit of an arcane caster level, which stacks with KoTW. She immediately leaves the class for abjurant champion, which she qualifies for with the bonus combat casting feat from duskblade, preserving her full BaB and helping her supplement her AC after losing access to medium armor. Arcane boost is a nice way to use under-utilized spell slots when full attacking, and the rest of the features need no introduction to explain their usefulness. Martial arcanist, usually a very tempting option, is completely redundant for this build, meaning Alkathira leaves the class after 4 levels.

Her spell list is comprised of classic arcane and divine staples (though they're all arcane for her), as well as some options uniquely useful to the underdark and to her specific tactics. All of her spells are important, and most are obvious in their usefulness – nothing needs to be said about divine favor, see invisibility, dispel magic, sepia snake sigil, etc. Shield other can be used as a swift action to defend an ally at significant risk, which is nice. A couple of spells that may not be as obvious up to level 10 are protection from good and darkvision. Despite mostly fighting against evil targets, protection from good is awesome for Alkathira – she can cast it as a swift action, making it incredibly useful whenever mind-affecting enemies are afoot. Darkvision comes along right before joining the vengeance takers – those accept surface dwellers as well, and some of those may not have native darkvision.

She has use magic device, but it fully develops much later into the build – so it's lucky she can use wands for cure spells, restoration, scrolls of break enchantment and remove curse, all from her class list. Her other important achievement before level 10 is gaining access to acrobatic backstab at level 9. Since her staple option at the beginning of any fight is moving towards an enemy and channeling a spell at them, getting to do so against flatfooted enemies is a nice touch.

Alkathira enters the SI after gaining third level spells at level 10. KoTW's unique casting progression means she keeps progressing at exactly the same pace, despite moving to a half casting class. By level 20, she'll have full KoTW casting.

Level 11 itself is kind of bland, obviously – there's not much you can do with target of vengeance itself. The bonus damage from it can be multiplied by critical hits, so it's pretty good on a power-attacking chassis that'll soon get a third iterative, who's probably using a falchion (hopefully keen) as her standard weapon by this level. She also takes back on your feet, which is very situational but exceedingly useful.

A lot, however, happens at level 12. Poison use, when combined with her craft ranks and her access to minor creation means she has unlimited access to some extremely potent poisons. A triple weapon capsule retainer (CAdv p. 122) is a mundane purchase that's absolutely worth it at this point. She can pick and choose the best poison against the enemies she expects to be dealing with, never needing any supplies to get the perfect poison for the job. She also takes practiced spellcaster for duskblade – which, again, stacks with her KoTW CL. Her caster level for duskblade spells is 9, and her caster level for knight of the weave is 15. It's going to stagnate slowly through her career, finishing at 19 at level 20.
This is also the level that gets her 4th level spells – death ward, lesser globe of invulnerability, and the absolutely nasty on a duskblade bestow curse. A typical opening move for this level would be tumbling past an enemy into a good flanking position, probably swift casting shield (probably), protection from good or resist energy (situationally) on the way, and then channeling bestow curse with a powerful melee hit augmented by poison against a flatfooted opponent. Following rounds she can full attack an enemy that's probably flanked by now, using her swift action to cast another abjuration spell, apply another dose of poison, or use her arcane boost. This tactic will remain one of her most reliable tactics throughout her career, and will soon be enhanced by her sneak attack feature – which can be applied against flatfooted enemies in the first round, and flanked enemies in the following rounds.

During the following levels, this sneak attack will be improved upon with 2 feats. First, by staggering strike – a debuff that completely cripples full attackers, and forces anyone else to choose between getting away or doing something, mostly ensuring flanked full attacks for all subsequent rounds. The DC for this feat is equal to the damage dealt by the attack, which means only having 2d6 sneak attack dice doesn't matter – her power attack should do far more damage than can be bypassed by even the toughest enemies. She also has 10 ranks in UMD by this point (will go up to 20 by the end of the build), supported by pretty good Cha. That's useful for a whole heap of things, but a wratihstrike (CAdv p.158) wand is worth mentioning as a relatively cheap source of power for her, making it far easier to do tremendous amounts of damage and ensuring a fail on the staggering strike save.

The second feat utilizing her sneak attack is venomous strike, her last feat. Sacrificing 2d6 of damage on one of her sneak attacks for increased DC on her poison is absolutely worth it, and that option is especially attractive given the fact she's guaranteed to never run out of poison doses. It also doesn't really impact her staggering strike DC that much – especially against her vengeance target.

We've concluded the discussion on Alkathira's feats and most of her class features. The only features not yet discussed are the SLAs and the death attack. The specific SLAs the Vengeance taker gains access to are unique in that they emulate spells which would usually take far more time to cast than the standard action cost of an SLA. Their divinatory nature still makes it a hard sell to use them in combat – unless you can even further reduce their action economy cost, which Alkathira can do through her multitask racial feature once per day. Looking into the next room as a swift action can be worth it here and there, but a swift action use of seeker will be reliably worth it in combat. Facing a tough decision? Fearing there's something you're missing? Ask the DM if they're up to something, and how you should approach this combat if you wish to succeed in your mission. Just incredibly useful. Before we talk about death attack and scry target, let's look at the rest of Alkathira's spells.

Level 14 brings her daylight, which many enemies in the underdark will have severe disadvantage against, and delay poison. Delay poison is a weird spell, but it's there for a reason – "bring 'em back alive". Alkathira has been sent to hunt someone down, and the "I've poisoned you and I have the antidote" approach is a pretty good way of taking someone hostage, if the opportunity presents itself. That same theme is enhanced with mark of justice at level 16 – another option not usually available to arcane casters, and another one which allows her to deal with her targets non-lethally, when the situation justifies it. Her third spell which is all about dealing with her target is nightmare – possess someone's dreams while you're chasing after them, slowing them down. Fun.

Disrupting weapon is one of the best gish spells around, also usually unavailable to arcane casters. Its dependence on CL makes it a hard sell for most half-casters, but as discussed that's the opposite of being an issue in Alkathira's case. Alkathira was far from useless against undead before taking this spell at 14, but they're still resistant to her sneak-stagger, her chill touch and her poison – so having the option to just instantly destroy undead is covering up for many of the SI's weaknesses. Quick cast, as usual, covers for the cases in which she needs it right-freaking-now.

The rest of her spells are again just obviously awesome spells. Of special note are her CL again allowing her to fully utilize greater dispel magic, and her psionic minor creation allowing her to manufacture items to increase the DC on the encounter-solving spell which is banishment, coming online only 3 levels after a full wizard would have access to it. No "ugh, we'll be facing X demons, we should have brought Y holy symbol" for Alkathira.

20th level brings forth the capstone of the SI, death attack. It's also the point at which Alkathira hits 16 BaB, and the level in which she learns her final spell, allowing her to perform her final move: the 1000 mile decapitation.

Here's how it works: Alkathira scries on target. She looks at her target for 3 rounds, observing them and looking at their surroundings. She then uses her 1/day quick cast to cast teleport into an adjacent square. Quick casting teleport means it's still her turn when she arrives, so she still has her full-round action to go. She can absolutely demolish her target, full-attacking them with death attack, poison, sneak attack – anything she's got. Even if the DM (or judge) decides for some reason that she can't pick the exact square she teleports into, she still has her movement and a channeled-poisoned-staggering-death attack at hand. All in the turn she teleported.The image above is the least horny depiction of a bald woman with a sword on the internet.

All sources are notified in the text.

The Viscount

2022-01-12, 09:34 PM

The wildly different original pitch of Ed, Edd, and Eddy.

Eddy + Cat
https://i.imgur.com/UwFZppm.jpeg

Good Cop/Bard Cop
CN-LN Telthyrian Human

Bard 1/Battle Dancer 1/ deadly hunter Druid 1/ Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Lyric Thaumaturge 7

BACKGROUND

There once was a very naughty bard battle dancer named Eddy. They once got severly traumatized by a troll warlord, an experience that sent Eddy on the lam for months. Eddy switches alignment, forsaking the freedom and honor and dignity of a life of chaos and becomes a police officer dedicated to upholding the law. During this time they met a cat. The cat adopted them. Then Eddy and his new buddy went and got revenge and were recruited by the imaskari.

Abilities
Initial
Race / Template
Level 4
Level 8
Level 12
Level 16
Level 20

Str
10
0
10
10
10
10
10

Dex
14
0
14
14
14
14
14

Con
12
0
12
12
12
13
14

Int
10
0
10
10
10
10
10

Wis
13
0
13
13
13
13
13

Cha
17
0
18
19
20
20
20

Level
Class
Base Attack Bonus
Fort Save
Reflex Save
Will Save
Skills
Feats
Class Features

1st
Bard
0
0
2
2
K. (arcana) (+4) 4; Perform (dance) (+4) 4; Hide (+4) 4; Bluff (+4) 4; Move Silently (+4) 4; Concentration (+3) 3; Spellcraft (+4) 4; K. planes (+1) 1
Heighten spell, Talfirian song (Races of Faerun p. 170)
Bardic music, bardic knowledge, countersong, fascinate, inspire courage +1,

2nd
Battle Dancer (Dragon Compendium p. 26)
1
0
4
2
K. (arcana) 4; Perform (dance) (+1) 5; Hide 4; Bluff 4; Move Silently (+1) 5; Concentration 3; Spellcraft 4; Tumble (+3) 3; K. planes 1
Improved Unarmed Strike
AC bonus, unarmed strike

3rd

Deadly Hunter urban companion (WEB: Cityscape (http://xn--http-fb7a//archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20070228a%E2%80%9D))Druid (Unearthed Arcana p. 58)

1

2

4

4

K. (arcana) 4; Perform (dance) 5; Hide 4; Bluff 4; Move Silently 5; Concentration 3; Spellcraft 4; Tumble 3; Survival (+3) 3; K. planes (+2 CC) 2

Track (b), Alertness (b), Extra Music (Complete Adventurer p. 109)
Bonus to AC, Track, Favored Enemy, urban companion: feat cat: (Web: Fabulous Cats (http://xn--http-fb7a//www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd%2Ffools%2F20030401c%E2%80%9D)), wild empathy, nature sense, druid casting

4th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker 1
1
2
6
6
K. (arcana) (+1) 5; Perform (dance) (+2 CC) 6; Hide 4; Bluff 4; Move Silently 5; Concentration 3; Spellcraft (+1) 5; Tumble 3; Survival (+1) 4; K. planes 2

target of vengeance

5th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker 2
2
2
7
7
K. (arcana) (+1) 6; Perform (dance) (+2 CC) 7; Hide 4; Bluff (+1) 5; Move Silently 5; Concentration 3; Spellcraft (+1) 6; Tumble 3; Survival 4; K. planes 2

poison use

6th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker 3
3
3
7
7
K. (arcana) 6; Perform (dance) (+2 CC) 8; Hide (+1) 5; Bluff (+1) 6; Move Silently (+1) 6; Concentration 3; Spellcraft 6; Tumble 3; Survival 4; K. planes 2
Ascetic mage (Complete Adventurer p. 105)
sneak attack 1d6

7th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker 4
4
3
8
8
K. (arcana) 6; Perform (dance) (+2 CC) 9; Hide 5; Bluff 6; Move Silently 6; Concentration (+1) 4; Spellcraft (+1) 7; Tumble 3; Survival (+1) 5; K. planes 2

far sense,

8th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker 5
4
3
8
8
K. (arcana) 6; Perform (dance) (+2 CC) 10; Hide 5; Bluff 6; Move Silently 6; Concentration 4; Spellcraft 7; Tumble (+3) 6; Survival 5; K. planes 2

Sneak attack +2d6

9th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker 6
5
4
9
9
K. (arcana) 6; Perform (dance) 10; Hide (+3) 8; Bluff (+1) 7; Move Silently (+1) 7; Concentration 4; Spellcraft 7; Tumble 6; Survival 5; K. planes 2
Snowflake Wardance (Frostburn,p. 50)
Seeker

10th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker 7
6
4
9
9
K. (arcana) 6; Perform (dance) 10; Hide 8; Bluff 7; Move Silently 7; Concentration (+1) 5; Spellcraft 7; Tumble 6; Survival (+3) 8; K. planes 2; Balance (+1) 1

Sneak Attack +3d6

11th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker 8
7
4
10
10
K. (arcana) 6; Perform (dance) 10; Hide (+1) 9; Bluff 7; Move Silently (+3) 10; Concentration 5; Spellcraft 7; Tumble (+1) 7; Survival 8; K. planes 2; Balance 1

Scry target

12th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker 9
7
5
10
10
K. (arcana) 6; Perform (dance) 10; Hide 9; Bluff 7; Move Silently 10; Concentration (+1) 6; Spellcraft 7; Tumble 7; Survival 8; K. planes 2; Balance (+4) 5
Melodic casting (Complete Mage p. 44)
Sneak Attack +4d6

13th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10
8
5
11
11
K. (arcana) 6; Perform (dance) (+2) 12; Hide 9; Spellcraft 7; Tumble 7; Survival 8; K. planes 2; Balance 5; Perform (Ettiquette) (+2) 2

Death Attack

14th
Lyric Thaumaturge 1 (Complete Mage p. 67)
8
5
13
13
K. (arcana) 6; Perform (dance) (+2) 14; Hide 9; Spellcraft 7; Tumble 7; Survival 8; K. planes 2; Balance 5; Perform (ettiquette) (+1) 3

Bardic music, bonus spell

15th
Lyric Thaumaturge 2
9
5
14
14
K. (arcana) 6; Perform (dance) (+2) 16; Hide 9; Spellcraft 7; Tumble 7; Survival 8; K. planes 2; Balance 5;

Captivating Melody (Complete Mage p. 40), staggering strike (Complete Adventurer p. 112)
captivating melody

16th
Lyric Thaumaturge 3
10
6
14
14
K. (arcana) 6; Bluff (+1) 2; Perform (dance) (+2) 18; Hide 9; Spellcraft 7; Tumble 7; Survival 8; K. planes 2; Balance 5;

Spell Secret

17th
Lyric Thaumaturge 4
11
6
15
15
K. (arcana) 6; Bluff (+1) 3; Perform (dance) (+2) 20; Hide 9; Bluff (+1) 1; Concentration (+1) 1; Spellcraft 7; Tumble 7; Survival 8; K. planes 2; Balance 5;

Bonus Spell

18th
Lyric Thaumaturge 5
11
6
15
15
K. (arcana) 6; Perform (dance) (+1) 21; Hide 9; Bluff (+1) 4; Concentration (+1) 2; Spellcraft 7; Tumble 7; Survival 8; K. planes 2; Balance 5; Perform (ettiquette) (+1) 4

Mastery of twisted Shadow (Player's Guide to Eberron p. 126)
Sonic might

19th
Lyric Thaumaturge 6
12
7
16
16
K. (arcana) 6; Perform (dance) (+1) 22; Hide 9; Bluff (+1) 13; Concentration (+1) 3; Spellcraft 7; Tumble 7; Survival 8; K. planes 2; Balance 5; Perform (ettiquette) (+2) 10

Spell Seccret

20th
Lyric Thaumaturge 7
13
7
16
16
K. (arcana) 6; Perform (dance) (+1) 23; Hide 9; Bluff (+1) 4; Concentration (+1) 4; Spellcraft 7; Tumble 7; Survival 8; K. planes 2; Balance 5; Perform (ettiquette) (+2) 12

Bonus Spell

Spells per Day

Level
0lvl
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th

1st
2
-
-
-
-
-

2nd
2
-
-
-
-
-

3rd
2
-
-
-
-
-

4th
2
-
-
-
-
-

5th
3
0
-
-
-
-

6th
3
0
-
-
-
-

7th
3
1
-
-
-
-

8th
3
1
-
-
-
-

9th
3
2
0
-
-
-

10th
3
2
0
-
-
-

11th
3
3
1
-
-
-

12th
3
3
1
-
-
-

13th
3
3
2
-
-
-

14th*
3
4
3
0
-
-

15th
3
4
4
1
-
-

16th
3
4
4
2
-
-

17th*
3
4
4
3
1
-

18th
3
4
4
4
2
-

19th
3
4
4
4
3
-

20th*
3
4
4
4
3
1

Spells Known

Level
0lvl
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th

1st
4
-
-
-
-
-

2nd
4
-
-
-
-
-

3rd
4
-
-
-
-
-

4th
4
-
-
-
-
-

5th
5
2
-
-
-
-

6th
5
2
-
-
-
-

7th
6
3
-
-
-
-

8th
6
3
-
-
-
-

9th
6
3
2
-
-
-

10th
6
3
2
-
-
-

11th
6
4
3
-
-
-

12th
6
4
3
-
-
-

13th
6
4
3
-
-
-

14th
6
4
4
2
-
-

15th
6
4
4
3
-
-

16th*
6
5
5
3
-
-

17th
6
5
5
4
2
-

18th
6
5
5
4
3
-

19th*
6
5
5
5
4
-

20th
6
5
5
5
5
2

SPELLS
0: ghost sound, mage hand, detect magic, read magic, message, Summon instrument

1: instant diversion (Races of the Dragon p.113), cure light wounds, ironthunder horn (Spell Comp p. 126), instant of power (The Forge of War p. 114), Serene Visage (Spell Comp. 182)

2: whirling blade (Spell Comp p. 238), mirror image, deceptive facade (complete mage p.102), know vulnerabilities (Spell Comp p. 129), Glossolalia (Expanded Psionics Handbook p.220)

3: Shadow dagger (Shackled City Adventure Path p.336), haste, dissonant chord (Spell Comp p. 69), glibness, major image

4: Resonating bolt (Spell Comp p. 174), melf's slumber arrow (Complete Mage p.110), Fire Dance (Web: Far Corners (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fw/20031017a)), voice of the dragon (Spell Comp p. 232), greater invisibility.

5: dancing blade (PHB2 p.109), shadow evocation.

URBAN COMPANION

https://i.imgur.com/H8VKFKG.png

Size/Type: Tiny Magical Beast
Hit Dice: ½ d8 (2 hp) or ¾ of master’s HP
Initiative: +2
Speed: 30 ft. (6 squares)
Armor Class: 15 (+2 size, +2 Dex +1Nat armor), touch 14, flat-footed 13
Base Attack/Grapple: +0/-12
Attack: Claw +4 melee (1d2-4)
Full Attack: 2 claws +4 melee (1d2-4) and bite -1 melee (1d3-4)
Space/Reach: 2½ ft./0 ft.
Special Attacks: —
Special Qualities: Low-light vision, scent,
Saves: Fort +2, Ref +4, Will +1
Abilities: Str 3, Dex 15, Con 10, Int 6, Wis 12, Cha 7
Skills: Balance +10, Climb +6, Hide +16*, Jump +10, Listen +3, Move Silently +8, Spot +3 Feats:
1: Stealthy, Weapon FinesseB
3: Martial Study (shadow blade technique) (Tome of Battle p.31 & 76)
6: Martial Stance (Island of blades) (Tome of Battle p.31 &78)
9: Combat reflexes
12: Giantbane (Complete warrior p.111)
15: Martial Study (Shadow garotte)(Tome of Battle p.31 & 78)
18: Don't mind me (fabulous cats)

City Scape (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20070228a)
This is identical to the sorcerer's ability to summon a familiar (PH 52), including all benefits granted and gained by the familiar, except as noted below. Her functional level for determining the abilities of the companion is equal to her druid level or one-half her ranger level. She does not lose experience points if her urban companion is slain, and she requires only 24 hours to replace one who is lost.
Her urban companion has total hit points equal to 3/4 her own hit points, rather than half as per a familiar.
The urban companion gains the ability to speak with other animals of its kind when she has an effective master level of 1st.

Alertness, improved evasion, share spells, empathic link

FAB CATS
Variant: If you want to make the feline familiars in your game more exciting, consider letting them gain additional feats at the same rate as their masters do (at master levels 3rd, 6th, 9th, 12th, 15th, and 18th). In this way, a 10th-level human sorcerer could have a cat familiar that possessed four feats.

Imaskari Vengeance Taker: Getting there mad early. Check it.

A Telthyrian Human can take talfirian song and spend bardic music uses to cast illusion spells of 3rd level or higher. So, just like that, we have spent our two 1st level feats to get that amazing feat and the heighten spell pre-req, and annexed our third level feat slot for extra bardic uses. That means we can enter Imaskari Vengeance Taker at 4.

But, i wanted charisma to AC twice, and with the sunk cost of already having to make up some story about changing alignment (bards are chaotic) that makes sense and is capable of skirting past an elegance penalty thru sheer hard-work of composing an entire character arc, I might as well get that charisma to AC twice. Since we have this "must get revenge" pre-requisite for this class itself, we have a pretty much built in story about a bard battledancer travelling-ne’er-do-well who happened upon a trauma so severe that it changed their alignment from chaotic to lawful. Which then sets them on the “path to vengeance!” Full stop. That’s my angle. Getting into Imaskari vengeance Taker (IVT, henceforth) practically demanded that this be the story told. Of the bard with the ability to pump up their spells of 3rd level stat getting cajoled into the seedy world of lawfully-aligned revenge-maniacs. All the pieces are there. Except for the track feat.

Ok, we could go ranger to get that track feat, or we could go druid with favored enemy and free track free animal urban companion and wisdom to AC as a monk and spells. Which you know, is better than that level of ranger and its 1 BAB. Since we can already artificially inflate spell levels for feat/prestige prerequisites due to the terribly expansive and permissive language of the talfirian song feat, we can just slot the ascetic mage feat into that level six slot, thereby ensuring that we do indeed get charisma bonus to AC twice.

And that animal companion is just gonna die every 24 hours if we try to use it. So we’ll swap that on out with the urban companion acf from city scape. Which operates exactly like a sorcerer summoning a familiar, except it gets ¾ of your hp, which is nice, and there’s no xp penalty when your targets of vengeance try to to take you down by besmirching the life force of your familiar. What’s really cool is that because you can choose the familiar, you can choose a cat. And in the gift that can’t stop giving that is a single level of druid in a 3.5 edition optimization contest, is that the cat familiar got a significant boost with a variant rule found in Gwendolyn F. Kestrel’s DnD masterpiece: the Fabulous Cats April fool’s day article archived on the web. The familiar gets feats at the same rate as its master. It didn’t care about master’s fiddly little familiar based leveling constructs: It gets feats when you get feats by leveling up. We have an imaskari flanking buddy. Who can take island of blades!

We are gonna need to do some revengeancing soon, so let’s get this cat that can help me get flanking bonii on the people that im gonna sneak attack with my snowflake wardance infused bard spells (shadow dagger) (whirling bladed) while also providing a nice +3 cushion on my sparse skill ranks in move silently.

Levels 4 and 5 see our early entry into the class that we’ve all been waiting for!

https://i.imgur.com/Ar3dDf0.png
Imaskari Vengeance Taker. (as conceived by AI at wombo)

It gets our bard casting up to level 2! What do we get?! first level spells at level 5! That you can heighten them to 5th level if you’re weird and the spell to be heightened is an illusion spell.You would be doing this instead of doing any cool bard music based stuff, which is the probable better use of bardic music for the beginning levels???.

And I think I can devise the perfect entrance exam to join the IVTs. The IVT only care about the spell level of what people can cast. So they hire 20-35 5th level abjurers to try to counterspell you as part of a multi day initiation. They can run the statistical analysis on the sampling the counterspell success of the NPC wizards who conveniently all have the same stats. And if the heightened ghostsound that this bard can play gets counterspelled less than half of the time, well then he’s definitely capable of fulfilling the weird needs of this mafia-like vengeance organization and theory byzantine but statistically sound method of getting “jumped in”

The IVT is offering this build something specific: sneak attack and +5 levels of bard casting. Plus all that backstory, whew. It sure is flavorful. There’s some other stuff about target’s of vengeance and stuff, namely a huge bonus to bluff, but that’s gonna require some higher levels. Which, I believe, are going to conveniently follow this late night scree posing as honest entry.

5 succulent levels of imaskari vengeance taker. A total of 3d6 sneak attack. Oh, are those second level bard spells I see there? Are you whirling your snowflake wardance blades all over the place? And I’m sure the island of blades cat in your square is helping add some of those sweet sweet sneak attack dice.

Your cat has scent and can talk to you, isn’t that basically the same as getting a scent bonus on your own survival checks to track? I mean, it should be. Because then, you have a nice ToV bonus to your survival checks to make you as competent as a skillpoint starved ranger.

Speaking of your cat, whom has been officially named “Cat” because that’s what he is, and lawful bards think like that; Snakes swiftness or spider hand are some fun druid spells to share a casting on with the cat.

I wish i could tell you more about the in’s and outs of these levels, but they’re basically to make instant diversions and mirror images to get snowdance warflake attacks, and when you’re lined up adequately, hit the bad guys with a whirling blade of the slashing weapon of your choice. Plus, if you’ve made it this far, chances are you are using those weird little diddies in your spell list pretty creatively. And with a nice high DC of 22 before you start adding charisma or dex boosting items or abilities.

This is the high point of the build, I think. You have your shadow dagger, drawn from the shackled city adventure path.

So let’s talk about that book that’ll be a real burden for you to find a copy of. And…it falls directly into the hole that the dragon compendium falls into: Paizo published dnd logo-ed content. The weird, second party sourcebook. One is Dragon compendium, back when paizo did the publishing of dragon magazine. And another is the shackled city adventure path sourcebook, which came out later in the run of the pre-pathfinder era. Check out some of these screenshots.

https://i.imgur.com/fUWYgah.png

This thing is officially licensed and produced by the company responsible for the production of Wizards of the Coast’s 1st-party monthly modular content. Well, time to settle some case law, Mr. Volunteer Judge. We know all about the law. We’re a lawful battle dancer bard with shadowdagger.

Here's some discussion to help you decide: Link (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?634518-3-X-What-is-Official-1st-Party-3E-D-amp-D-Material&highlight=dragon+compendium+1st+party)

Anyways, if Dragon comp is allowed...then this should be.
SHADOW DAGGERhttps://i.imgur.com/WPEBW3Z.png

It’s an amazing spell that becomes like a lightning bolt that you can sneak attack with when you pair it with whirling blade. And it comes back to your hand for your attacks of opportunity, and with snowflake wardance, you may get charisma to attack rolls twice? Depending if you read that the charisma bonus stacking with strength or dexterity non-exclusively to the list of ability scores used to make weapons hit. Like in the case of weaponlike spells.. And if the opponent happens to be sneak attackable in that line of 10d6 shadow dagger damage, they become staggered. Limiting their movement or actions, and because it triggers per sneak attack, it applies to everyone hit by a whirling shadow dagger, so long as they are flanked, flatfooted, or denied dex to AC. . With giantbane and shadow garrotte on your cat, you should be able to get a few choice enemies to be sneak attackable pretty often.

Ahh yes, ALSO, this is the level where choosing serene visage and glibness can help you on your bluff checks against your target of vengeance. It is a +50 sense motive modifier to an epic bluff skill check to incept the idea of a suggestion spell, as an ex ability into the head of your target of vengeance. And I’m counting at least a +45 to that roll before we add charisma modifiers and bluff skill ranks let alone favored enemy, which will obviously be arcanists (complete mage p.32) if allowed, because that’s categorically the best favored enemy choice. Otherwise, choose something from your backstory.

And if you’re sharing these spells with your familiar, they too can instill suggestions on the catlike things that it can talk to. And if your ToV is a catlike thing, they are gonna be getting suggestion bombed until they turn themselves in to face the authorities.

Here we are, 20 levels in. I feel like we all learned alot. So the rest of this build is enhancing the gishy bard spell casting, culminating in shadow evocation, improved invisibility, fire dance, and dancing blade. If you need to, you can heighten a major image up to 9th level to resist dispelling. If I get around to monkeying with the skills, we should be able to fit eberrons “mastery of the twisted shadow” feat in there you should be able to cast instant diversion as a swift, get concealment for a whole line of sneak attacks from a whirling shadowdagger. Or maybe you need to hide when you set up your big shadow evocation. And you can heighten these illusions to get more concealment using bardic music uses and talfirian song. Further, this build leverages that sneak attack attack and can actually continue to use its early entry tricks well into late game. with 16 ranks in bluff and glibness and +10 to bluff, you can instill a suggestion in a target of vengeance no problem

The Viscount

2022-01-12, 09:37 PM

You decided whether spiked body shots are involved.

Ivy, the poisonous belly-dancer of death

Life is not always easy. Especially if you are born as Deepwyrm bastard in the drow society. Ivy's mother tried to raise her as best as she can. But she got sick and died early as Ivy was still young. Since her so called relatives didn't care for her, she left home with a wandering belly dancer group, who where luckily looking for some background dancer at that moment.
Years have passed and she did befriend with the others in the group and had a close relationship with them. And Shaely was like a younger sister to her. Spending every day for several years their relationship grew.
One day, while giving a personal show for a rich drow, an incident happened. The drow was drunk and tried to rape Shaely. She refused heavily while the other girls and Ivy tried to come to rescue. But the guards of the Drow block their way. Shaely, desperate in her situation drew a knife, attached from the drow's side and did cut him.
The drow in pain & anger ordered his guards to kill her and sell the others on the slave market.
Shaely cries out loud and swears to kill him!
At the slave market she gets a ruff treatment, since Ivy can't calm down anymore.
While she gets punished again for her behavior, 2 man stop by and watch the scene. They are Imaskari, scouting for good slaves that can be turned into loyal Imaskari Vengeance Taker with the "right treatment".
"And oh boy, what a furious young lady we have here.." one of em says, while the slave trader turns around and notices em.
... the beginning of Ivy's journey to vengeance starts...

Race: Deepwyrm Half-Drow

Stats:
STR: 14
DEX: 14
CON: 14
INT: 16 > 32 (+5 Wish, +5 from level + 6 from item)
WIS: 10
CHA: 10

Religion: Kossuth
Alignment: L-G

Level
Class
Base Attack Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Skills
Feats
Class Features

1st
Monk
Fighting Style: Cobra Strike (SRD)
+0
+2
+2
+2
Concentration: 4
Knowledge (religion): 4
Perform (dance): 4
Hide: 4
Move Silently: 4
Survive: 2 (4P)
Tumble: 4
Bonus Feat: Dodge
Endurance
AC bonus
flurry
unarmed strike

2nd
Combat Wizard (SRD)
+0
+2
+2
+4
Concentration: 5
Knowledge (religion): 5
Knowledge (planes): 3 (+3)
Fighter Bonus Feat: Mobility
Familiar: Parrot (same stats as Raven) (source Stormwrack)

< Fighter Bonus Feat

3rd
Combat Wizard
+1
+2
+2
+5
Concentration: 6
Knowledge (religion): 6
Knowledge (planes): 6
Combat Casting

4th
Combat Wizard
+1
+3
+3
+5
Concentration: 7
Knowledge (religion): 7
Knowledge (planes): 7
Perform: 5 (+2)

5th
Combat Wizard
+2
+3
+3
+6
Concentration: 8
Craft (Poisonmaking): 1
Knowledge (planes): 8
Perform: 6 (+2)

6th
Combat Wizard
+2
+3
+3
+6
Concentration: 9
Craft (Poisonmaking): 2
Knowledge (planes): 9
Move Silently: 5 (+2)
Track

Fighter Bonus Feat: Versatile Unarmed Strike
(source PHB II)
< Fighter bonus feat

7th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker
+2
+3
+5
+8
Concentration: 10
Craft (Posionmaking): 4 (+2)
Knowledge (Planes): 10 (+2)
Perform: 6 (+2)

Target of Vengeance

8th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker
+3
+3
+6
+9
Concentration: 11
Craft (Poisonmaking): 6 (+2)
Perform: 8 (+4)

Poison Use

9th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker
+4
+4
+6
+9
Concentration: 12
Craft (Poisonmaking): 8 (+2)
Perform: 10 (+4)
Poison Spell
(Drow of the Underdark)
Sneak Attack 1d6

10th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker
+5
+4
+7
+10
Concentration: 13
Craft (Poisonmaking): 10 (+2)
Perform: 12 (+4)

Far Sence

11th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker
+5
+4
+7
+10
Concentration: 14
Craft (Poisonmaking): 12 (+2)
Perform: 14 (+4)

Sneak Attack 2d6

12th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker
+6
+5
+8
+11
Concentration: 15
Craft (Poisonmaking): 15 (+3)
Perform: 15 (+2)
Tumble: 5
Extend Spell
Seaker

13th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker
+7
+5
+8
+11
Concentration: 16
Craft (Poisonmaking): 16
Perform: 16 (+2)
Tumble: 8 (+3)

Sneak Attack 3d6

14th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker
+8
+5
+9
+12
Concentration: 17
Craft (Poisonmaking): 17
Perform: 17 (+2)
Tumble: 11 (+3)

Scry Target

15th
Sacred Exorcist
(source Complete Divine)
+8
+5
+9
+14
Concentration: 18
Craft (Poisonmaking) 18
Knowledge (religion): 8
Perform 18 (+2)
Lolth's Caress
Exorcism
Turn Undead

16th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker
+8
+6
+9
+14
Concentration: 19
Craft (Poisonmaking): 19
Perform: 19 (+2)
Tumble: 14 (+3)

Sneak Attack 4d6

17th
Imaskari Vengeance Taker
+9
+6
+10
+15
Concentration: 20
Craft (Poisonmaking): 20
Perform: 20 (+2)
Tumble: 17 (+3)

Death Attack

18th
Spelldancer
(source Magic of Faerun)
+9
+6
+12
+17
Concentration: 21
Craft (Poisonmaking): 21
Perform: 21
Tumble: 21 (+4)
Persistent Spell
Spelldance

19th
Spelldancer
+10
+6
+13
+18
Concentration: 22
Craft (Poisonmaking): 22
Knowledge (religion): 11 (+3)
Perform: 22
Tumble: 22

Enthralling Dance
Evasion

20th
Spelldancer
+10
+7
+13
+18
Concentration: 23
Craft (Poisonmaking): 23
Knowledge (religion): 14 (+3)
Perform: 23
Tumble: 23

Cooperative Dance

Spells:
I won't list all spells that you can take at level up. Because imho a wizard profits more when they adjust their spell selection depending in which direction the campaign goes. As such, I will only list some build specific spells.

0:
Detect Magic / Poison
Both simple but useful. With Detect Poison, we can look for poison resources. Be it in the wild, or on the (black) market.

1:
Chill Touch / Corrosive Gasp (spell compendium)
Both are touch spells that have level (!) x charges. With Poison Spell and Monk's unarmed strike we can apply multiple instances of poison.

Mage Armor
Not much to say here, if you play a gish without armor.

2:
Alter Self
Early access to other forms. Troglodytes and Wyrmling Shadow Dragons are some good options here.

Mirror Image:
A nice defence for a gish

Knock
We are not a skillmonkey, but we have spells to compensate for this at least.

3:
Shivering Touch (Spell compendium)
Comes with a duration of round per caster lvl and thus is the better choice for Poison Spell.

4:
Flame Whips (Spell compendium)
gain two melee touch attacks with a 15-foot reach that each deals 6d6 points of fire damage. Combine these with your Shivering Touch and have fun with Poison Spell

Locate Target
I guess this should be obvious why this is a handy spell for this build.

Polymorph
Can be used to produce some venom for Craft (poisonmaking). Otherwise some nice combat form (Hydra, War Troll..) for larger battles.

5:
Contingency
To shorten bufftime

6:
Fabricate
To quickly fabricate poison with Ivy's craft (poisonmaking) skill.

Mordenkainen's Trusted Bloodhounds
Have track and casterlevel = survival

7:
Greater Teleport
For Scry and Teleport tactics.

Kiss of the Vampire (spell compendium)
The main reason for this spell is that it gives undead type. And that makes immune to ability damage and fatigue. If the bell is not ringing for you, Spelldancer gets ability damage and becomes fatigued when over her free limit for Spelldance. Persist any spell you want and can affort (spell slots).

1-5
Ivy starts out as monk and quickly switch to wizard after that. Now she can apply touch spells to her unarmed strikes. Mage Armor offers some extra protection for the early levels. Alter Self is a good combat and utility tool that pushes her good at lvl 5 (don't forget to share with your familiar).

6-10
Now we can enter IVT. Ivy gets access to frist SI abilties to macially persue her target better.
Versatile Unarmed Strike allows to switch the dmg type of our unarmed strike. Handy if the enemy should have specific DR types. Further, this allows to wield a "Whirling" - weapon enchantment. Posion Spell allows to add our poison to the our touch spells for extra fun. Shivering Touch and Flame Whip become our main touch spells. Polymorph helps if we should get into tougher fights (again, share with your familiar). Further we can produce venom with some forms (e.g. Wywern). Locate Target helps up to get the job done.

11-15
We get the SI ingredients abilities as everyone else. Helps to get the job done.^^
Extend Spell can be nice if you know that longer fights might occur. Or is you intend to flight for a longer time.
When we dip Sacred Exorcist, we get Turn Undead. That, we will use to fuel Lolth's Caress. That forces nearby foe to make any potential secondary poison save immediately. Stack some poison charges together with your familiar and nuke your foes with the accumulate secondary saves.

16-20
With spelldancer, we can now persist spells. Add in Kiss of the Vampire to become undead and persist anything you want. Make dancing shows with your spells up. Include even Fire Whip and pretend that it is part of the belly dance show. Lure your enemies into your poisonous dance of death. Dance cooperatively with your familiar and give everybody the hottest and most poisoning show of their live.

Recommend Item:

Necklace of Natural Weapons + 5 + Assassination + Whirling
Assassination adds the enhancement bonus of the weapon on out poison DC. Whirling allows to use Whirling Attack 3x day.

Belt of Battle:
A standard action more to active Lolth's Caress can make the difference between live and death.
Even just using it for the movement action to preserve the full attack is nice.

END

The Viscount

2022-01-12, 09:38 PM

Fire cleanses.

Lord Ej of Adon
The Flame of Vengeance
https://mcdn.wallpapersafari.com/medium/85/10/EaO8gx.jpg
LE Otherworldly Talaire Ranger 4/Warblade 1/Mortal Hunter 5/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10

Ability Scores
14 Str, 12 Dex, 14 Con, 12 Int, 14 Wis, 14 Cha
Increase Wis at 4th and 8th, Cha at all other opportunities

Build Table
Level Class Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Reflex Save Will Save Skills Feats Class Features
1st Ranger 1 1 2 2 0 32: {+4} Concentration: 4; {+4} Craft (Poisonmaking): 4; {+4} Handle Animal: 4; {+4} Hide: 4; {+4} Move Silently: 4; {+4} Tumble: 4; {+4} Survival: 4; {+4} Spot: 4; Otherworldly, AntagonistH, TrackB Favored Enemy (Humanoid (Human)), Voice of the City, Skilled City-Dweller (Ride for Tumble)
2nd Ranger 2 2 3 3 0 8: {+1} Concentration: 5; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 5; {+1} Handle Animal: 5; Hide: 4; {+1} Jump: 1; {+1} Move Silently: 5; {+1} Tumble: 5; {+1} Survival: 5; {+1} Spot: 5; Two-Weapon FightingB Combat Style
3rd Ranger 3 3 3 3 1 8: {+1} Concentration: 6; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 6; {+1} Handle Animal: 6; Hide: 4; {+2} Jump: 3; Move Silently: 5; {+1} Tumble: 6; {+1} Survival: 6; {+1} Spot: 6; Mortalbane, EnduranceB, Wild Talent (Adon)T -
4th Ranger 4 4 4 4 1 8: {+1} Concentration: 7; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 7; {+1} Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; {+2} Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; {+1} Tumble: 7; {+1} Survival: 7; {+1} Spot: 7; AlertnessF Urban Companion (Tiny Viper)
5th Warblade 1 5 6 4 1 6: {+3} Balance: 3; {+1} Concentration: 8; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 8; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; {+1} Tumble: 8; Survival: 7; Spot: 7; - Battle Clarity (Reflex Saves), Weapon Aptitude
6th Mortal Hunter 1 6 8 4 1 6: Balance: 3; {+1} Bluff: 1; {+1} Concentration: 9; Craft (Poisonmaking): 8; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; {+2} Survival: 9; {+2} Spot: 9; Fly-By Attack Mortal Hunting +1, Mortal Skin (Any Humanoid)
7th Mortal Hunter 2 7 9 4 1 6: Balance: 3; {+3} Bluff: 4; {+1} Concentration: 10; Craft (Poisonmaking): 8; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; {+1} Survival: 10; {+1} Spot: 10; Boost Spell-Like AbilityB Detect Mortals
8th Mortal Hunter 3 8 9 5 2 6: Balance: 3; {+3} Bluff: 7; {+1} Concentration: 11; Craft (Poisonmaking): 8; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; {+1} Survival: 11; {+1} Spot: 11; - Mortal Hunting +2
9th Mortal Hunter 4 9 10 5 2 6: Balance: 3; {+3} Bluff: 10; {+1} Concentration: 12; Craft (Poisonmaking): 8; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; {+1} Survival: 12; {+1} Spot: 12; Improved Familiar Smite Mortals
10th Mortal Hunter 5 10 10 5 2 6: Balance: 3; {+3} Bluff: 13; {+1} Concentration: 13; Craft (Poisonmaking): 8; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; {+1} Survival: 13; {+1} Spot: 13; - Spurn Mortal Magic, Mortal Skin (Any Non-dragon)
11th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 1 10 10 7 4 6: {+2} Balance: 5; Bluff: 13; {+1} Concentration: 14; {+3} Craft (Poisonmaking): 11; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; Survival: 13; Spot: 13; - Target of Vengeance
12th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 2 11 10 8 5 6: Balance: 5; Bluff: 13; {+1} Concentration: 15; {+4} Craft (Poisonmaking): 15; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; Survival: 13; {+1} Spot: 14; Metamorphic Transfer Poison Use
13th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 3 12 11 8 5 6: Balance: 5; {+1} Bluff: 14; {+1} Concentration: 16; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 16; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; {+2} Survival: 15; {+1} Spot: 15; - Sneak Attack +1d6
14th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 4 13 11 9 6 6: Balance: 5; {+2} Bluff: 16; {+1} Concentration: 17; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 17; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; {+1} Survival: 16; {+1} Spot: 16; - Far Sense
15th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 5 13 11 9 6 6: Balance: 5; {+1} Bluff: 17; {+1} Concentration: 18; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 18; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; {+1} Survival: 17; {+2} Spot: 18; Martial Study (Ruby Nightmare Blade) Sneak Attack +2d6
16th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 6 14 12 10 7 6: Balance: 5; {+2} Bluff: 19; {+1} Concentration: 19; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 19; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; {+1} Survival: 18; {+1} Spot: 19; - Seeker
17th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 7 15 12 10 7 6: Balance: 5; {+1} Bluff: 20; {+1} Concentration: 20; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 20; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; {+2} Survival: 20; {+1} Spot: 20; - Sneak Attack +3d6
18th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 8 16 12 11 8 6: Balance: 5; {+1} Bluff: 21; {+1} Concentration: 21; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 21; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; Survival: 20; {+1} Spot: 21; {+2} Clarity of Vision; Craven Scry Target
19th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 9 16 13 11 8 6: Balance: 5; {+1} Bluff: 22; {+1} Concentration: 22; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 22; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; Tumble: 8; {+2} Survival: 22; {+1} Spot: 22; Clarity of Vision; - Sneak Attack +4d6
20th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 17 13 12 9 6: Balance: 5; {+1} Bluff: 23; {+1} Concentration: 23; {+1} Craft (Poisonmaking): 23; Handle Animal: 7; Hide: 4; Jump: 5; Move Silently: 5; {+1} Tumble: 9; {+1} Survival: 23; {+1} Spot: 23; Clarity of Vision; - Death Attack H indicates the additional feat at 1st level for being Human.
B indicates a bonus feat from class levels.
T indicates the Talaire Wild Talent feat gained in place of an existing feat upon realizing Talaire Heritage.

Ranger Casting
Level 1st
4th 0 *Does not include bonus spells for a high Wis score.

Warblade Maneuvers
Level Maneuvers Known Maneuvers Readied Stances Known
5th Sapphire Nightmare Blade, Moment of the Perfect Mind, Claw at the Moon 3 Hunter's Sense
15th Sapphire Nightmare Blade, Moment of the Perfect Mind, Claw at the Moon, Ruby Nightmare Blade 3 Hunter's Sense

Mortal Hunter Casting
Level 1st 2nd 3rd 4th
6th 0
7th 1
8th 1 0
9th 1 1
10th 1 1 0
12th 1 1 1
14th 2 1 1 0
16th 2 1 1 1
18th 2 2 1 1
20th 2 2 2 1 *Does not include bonus spells for a high Cha score.

Level 5 The orphanage lay in ashes, whose taste seemed to fill Ej’s mouth. The only life that he had ever known lay in smoldering ruin.

“Who would do this? Why?”

“They were after you.”

Ej looked around for the source of the voice, but saw no one. “Who said that?! Where are you?!”

“Inside of you,” the voice responded. “We placed fragments of our consciousness in your mind for the time when they would be needed.”

“How did you know…” he trailed off, unsure of what he was trying to ask. “Why me?”

“You were born to the house of Adon, witnessed by an angel. You carry a destiny that you cannot ignore.”

“Me? What destiny?” The moment he asked, Ej felt a searing pain across his face, as if he had been in the fire that consumed his home. He screamed in pain, staggering toward the nearby lake in hope plunging his head into the cold water, but by the time he got there, the pain had subsided. He stared into his reflection in the placid water to see a mark of emerald flame across his face.

“To carry the flame of House Adon. The flame of vengeance.”

Otherworldly is a regional feat that originally only applied to a small number of racial/regional character backgrounds, but Champions of Valor offers expanded options to qualify for it, the most open-ended of which is Celestial-Attended Birth. If evil people Planar Binding an angel to cause an otherworldly birth doesn’t sit right, Ej could also have a more conventional Heroic DestinyTM and then be struck by TragedyTM that inspires him to seek revenge, or could plausibly be of Mullhorandi Royal descent (another Champions of Valor background that qualifies for Otherworldly) as he’s already a scion of a mysterious noble house. Speaking of, Ej is also a Talaire, a variant human from Complete Psionic. Talaire are, on their face, not terribly appealing, as they replace their regular human bonus feat with a variant Wild Talent, but there is also the following bit that makes them significantly better.
If one of the players decides that his background is Talairan (or if the DM decides for him), perhaps the symbol that appears on all Talairans was merely long delayed on the character. After some triggering event (even a dream), the symbol appears, and the PC wakes to psionic power. This means he must give up a feat and take Wild Talent instead, unless his particular Wild Talent feat is gained as part of his normal feat progression.So a Talaire that awakens their heritage later on can trade out any feat they like (in this case the dead weight of Ranger’s Endurance) for the special Wild Talent instead of their precious human bonus feat. This gives Ej a Power Point and Psionic Focus, and a 1/day ML 1 PLA for Psionic Minor Creation, alongside another splash of psionics in the form of the Antagonist Host feat, which grants a PLA Energy Ray or Crystal Shard 1/day at a ML that scales at ½ Character Level. The ML will come in handy later, and since feats that work on SLAs explicitly work for PLAs per Complete Psionic, it allows Ej to get some juice out of the Mortalbane feat tax for Mortal Hunter, especially at these levels where an extra 2d6 is much more meaningful. The Alertness feat from his Urban Companion, a few skill ranks which overlap with those required by the SI, and the maintaining of full BAB round out Mortal Hunter qualification. Tactics-wise, Ej will fight sword and board with a light shield and a one-handed weapon, using TWF and slinging his Antagonist PLA when appropriate. His saves are good, with Moment of the Perfect Mind shoring up his Will, and he should be fairly reliable in these levels. Out of combat, he is a capable scout, between his splash of stealth, good spotting, familiar, and tracking (with Scent thanks to Hunter’s Sense), and can craft poisons including with Psionic Minor Creation and by milking the venom of his Urban Companion, though he does not yet have Poison Use.

Level 10 Blood soaked through bandages from wounds that would not heal onto the sea and sun insignia of house Cogitare that adorned the swordsman’s tunic. Breathing raggedly, he assumed a fighting stance as a shadow, familiar and yet different in its shape from those that the thing had taken previously, save for the spear and shield. The swordsman’s eyes flashed red and he grew to a size that would be a match for this new horrid form. There would only be one chance. Another non-fatal exchange would at best mean another gaping wound that rejected even psionic attempts at mending. With a snarl, the Cogitari swung with all his might, only for the blow to be parried off the shield and the spear to find his throat.

Mortal Hunter is a fun class that, due to being tucked away in BoVD and its Outsider type prereq, doesn’t get enough love. It comes with some decent abilities for hunting and killing mortals, its own arcane casting, and most notably, a powerful (Su) Polymorph ability. This ability is initially limited to humanoids, which even then includes some gems like Flind Gnolls and Crucians for numbers or the likes of Avariel Elves and Darfellan for movement modes, but at 5th level opens up to any mortal nondragon, with mortal defined as any creature not of the outsider, construct, undead, or fey types, arguably including elemental forms even though they aren’t normally accessible through Polymorph. The Mortal Hunter list is small, but has some good stuff, and Ej will get particular use out of Vile Lance at 3rd level. Vile damage can be difficult to get rid of, which opens up the possibility of hit and run attrition tactics with Flyby Attack and his tracking abilities. Arcane casting also opens up Improved Familiar, since Urban Companion is identical to the ability to summon a familiar except in the ways it’s not. Ej’s arcane spellcaster level is still a little low, but high enough that he can scale up his snake to a larger version.
Level 15 Ej was curled up on a rock in the form of a black viper, staring down at the captive Cogitari. They were badly wounded but for the moment stable, at the brink of unconsciousness but as focused as they could be on the hateful glare they directed up at him. Ej hissed derisively as he slightered down towards his enemy. He sank his fangs into their flesh, pulling a piece of skin off as he pulled his head back.

“You’ll… never… get away with this!” The captive gasped as the venom began to take effect. “I have… powerful friends. They’ll… realize… I’ve gone missing. I’ll… be… raised… before… you… know… it...”

Ej flicked out his forked tongue with the bit of flesh on it. “No one will know until it’s too late,” he hissed. “You’ll be seen walking around like normal in the next few days. The venom of the Shadow Asp will have its chance to take effect before anyone is the wiser. Your soul will be bound to this place in the form of a shade,” he gave a sibilant chuckle, “at least until I return to put it to a… more productive use than your miserable existence. I will bend your shade to my will, and shred your soul into nothing to call replacements for the servants that your knights destroyed. By the time anyone thinks to really look into what happened to you, you will be nothing, not so much as a shadow on a wall.”

Ej has finally entered the SI. Target of Vengeance is a good sized bonus. As a flat improvement to damage it can be multiplied by Ruby Nightmare Blade, making Flyby Vile Lance attacks more threatening, and it also improves Bluff, which Mortal Hunter and the SI have allowed Ej to catch up on and is especially handy to have with his disguise abilities, and his already potent scouting/tracking skills along with the Far Sense ability. Poison Use is also online, and Ej can finally put his Psionic Minor Creation poisonmaking abilities, and the ability to milk venom from forms that he assumes or from his familiar (with these levels of casting progression, he can trade up to an Imp, which offers both its own venom and that of a medium monstrous spider Alternate Form). Meanwhile, apart from access to dragon forms, Ej continues to gain everything that there is to want out of the Mortal Skin ability. As its caster level is equal to character level, he’s now at Polymorph’s HD cap, and with the ML for Antagonist’s PLA reaching the threshold to qualify for Metamorphic Transfer in time for his 12th level feat, he can gain supernatural abilities from the forms he assumes as well. The possibilities this opens up are far too numerous to list, but there is one option that bears mention as a particularly grimdark means of taking vengeance on someone. By assuming the form of a Shadow Asp and taking its Create Spawn ability, Ej can cause an enemy killed by his Asp venom to rise as a Shadow in 1d2 days bound to the location where they died. This will likely require first capturing the target alive or otherwise being able to finish them off in a suboptimal combat form (milking venom while in Shadow Asp form is certainly possible, but Ej will likely need to be in that form when the poison kills the enemy, which will at the very least mean changing form while waiting for secondary damage to finish the target off), but having the option to methodically whittle targets down with vile damage helps there. Once a hated enemy is made into a Shadow, they can be pacified with Rebuke Undead from Rot Reaver form, and then, per BoVD, used as a soul component. The spell Call Dretch Horde has such a component and appears on the Mortal Hunter list, so this gives Ej a way to destroy the souls of foes forever, and as a little bonus gain some long-term minions (which, even if they aren’t much of a threat at this level on their own, can still assist by throwing Stinking Clouds around).
Level 20 Even when alone with his thoughts, Ej was never really alone, and the thoughts were not necessarily his. What thoughts he could be most certain were had been fixated on this as the numbers of House Cogitare had been increasingly diminished by his vengeance. But was it really *his* vengeance?

“They burned down the orphanage didn’t they?” The voice came to his head unbidden. “They knew you were destined to avenge the House of Adon.”

“That’s another thing. I haven’t exactly lived my life on the side of the angels. Something doesn’t add up about how I came by this destiny of mine.”

“…”

“I think you bound an angel to observe my birth. You gave me my ‘destiny’ on purpose. The ultimate oath of vengeance, one that the heavens themselves would witness as you swore to profane the mortal world. You then orchestrated events so that the Cogatari would learn of my existence as a scion of House Adon and attempt to kill me, so as to give me a push in the right direction. Well, am I right?”

“What do you intend to do now that you know?”

“The thing I’m best at. Vengeance.”

Finishing out the SI, Ej nabs a few handy divination abilities to improve his scouting, Craven to leverage his Sneak Attack into another flat damage source to multiply with Ruby Nightmare Blade, and the Death Attack capstone, which his attrition tactics and disguise abilities can help to afford observation turns, and which adds an immediate save-or-die threat to each of his passes along with the longer-term problem of vile damage.

Book of Vile Darkness: Boost Spell-Like Ability, Call Dretch Horde, Mortal Hunter, Mortalbane, Vile Lance, Rules for Soul Components
Champions of Ruin: Craven
Champions of Valor: Celestial-Attended Birth
Cityscape Web-Enhancement (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20070228a): Skilled City-Dweller, Urban Companion, Voice of the City
Complete Adventurer: Craft (Poisonmaking) Rules
Complete Psionic: Antagonist, Talaire, Wild Talent (Adon), PLA Rules
Complete Scoundrel: Clarity of Vision, Improved Familiar (Medium Viper)
Complete Warrior: Extra Smiting
Dungeon Master’s Guide: Improved Familiar (Imp)
Fiend Folio: Shadow Asp
Monster Manual III:
Player’s Guide to Faerun: Otherworldly
Tome of Battle: Martial Study, Warblade, Maneuvers
Underdark: Imaskari Vengeance Taker
Everything else is SRD.

The Viscount

2022-01-12, 09:41 PM

Fatespinners love those giant coins.

Jane Wick

https://i.imgur.com/kD4GH8V.jpg

Lawful Evil Human Beguiler 5/ Mindbender 1/ Beguiler 2/ Unseen Seer 2/ Imaskari Vengeance Taker 8/ Fatespinner 2 of Shar

Abilities Point Buy 4th 8th 12th 16th 20th
STR 8
DEX 16
CON 14
INT 18 19 20 21 22 23
WIS 8
CHA 8

Level Class Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Reflex Save Will Save Skills Feats Class Features
1st Beguiler 0 0 0 2 Bluff 4, Diplomacy 2, Disable Device 2, Hide 4, Intimidate 1, Listen 4, Move Silently 4, Open Lock 2, Search 4, Sense Motive 2, Spellcraft 2, Spot 4, Tumble 4, Use Magic Device 4. Track, Penumbra Bloodline Armored Mage, Trapfinding
2nd Beguiler 1 0 0 3 Bluff 5, Diplomacy 3, Disable Device 2, Hide 5, Intimidate 2, Listen 5, Move Silently 5, Open Lock 2, Search 5, Sense Motive 2, Spellcraft 2, Spot 5, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 5. Cloaked Casting (+1 DC), Surprise Casting
3rd Beguiler 1 1 1 3 Bluff 6, Diplomacy 3, Disable Device 2, Hide 6, Intimidate 3, Jump 1, Listen 6, Move Silently 6, Open Lock 2, Search 6, Sense Motive 3, Spellcraft 2, Spot 6, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 6. Darkstalker Advanced Learning (Power Word Pain)
4th Beguiler 2 1 1 4 Bluff 7, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 2, Hide 7, Intimidate 4, Jump 2, Listen 7, Move Silently 7, Open Lock 2, Search 7, Sense Motive 3, Spellcraft 2, Spot 7, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 7.
5th Beguiler 2 1 1 4 Bluff 8, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 2, Hide 8, Intimidate 4, Jump 3, Listen 8, Move Silently 8, Open Lock 2, Search 8, Sense Motive 4, Spellcraft 4, Spot 8, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 8. Silent Spell (Retrain @10th - Versatile Spellcaster)
6th Mindbender 2 3 1 6 Bluff 9, Concentration 1, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 2, Hide 8, Intimidate 4, Jump 3, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 2, Knowledge (Nature) 2, Listen 8, Move Silently 8, Open Lock 2, Search 8, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 8, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 8. Mindsight Telepathy (100 ft.)
7th Beguiler 3 4 2 7 Bluff 10, Concentration 1, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 2, Hide 10, Intimidate 4, Jump 3, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 2, Knowledge (Nature) 2, Listen 10, Move Silently 10, Open Lock 2, Search 8, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 10, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 10. Surprise Casting (Move Action)
8th Beguiler 3 4 2 7 Bluff 11, Concentration 1, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 3, Hide 11, Intimidate 4, Jump 5, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 2, Knowledge (Nature) 2, Listen 11, Move Silently 11, Open Lock 2, Search 11, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 11, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 11. Advanced Learning (Shadow Conjuration)
9th Unseen Seer 3 4 2 9 Bluff 12, Concentration 1, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 3, Hide 12, Intimidate 4, Jump 5, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 4, Knowledge (Nature) 4, Listen 12, Move Silently 12, Open Lock 2, Search 12, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 12, Survival 1, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 11. Shadow Weave Magic Damage Bonus +1d6
10th Unseen Seer 4 4 2 10 Bluff 13, Concentration 5, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 3, Hide 13, Intimidate 4, Jump 5, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 5, Knowledge (Nature) 5, Listen 13, Move Silently 13, Open Lock 2, Search 13, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 13, Survival 2, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 11. Silent Spell Advanced Learning (Hunter's Eye)
11th Imaskari Vengeance Seeker 4 4 4 12 Bluff 14, Concentration 5, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 3, Hide 14, Intimidate 4, Jump 5, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 5, Knowledge (Nature) 5, Listen 14, Move Silently 14, Open Lock 2, Search 14, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 14, Survival 6, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 11. Target of Vengeance +2
12th Imaskari Vengeance Seeker 5 4 5 13 Bluff 15, Concentration 5, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 3, Hide 15, Intimidate 4, Jump 5, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 5, Knowledge (Nature) 5, Listen 15, Move Silently 15, Open Lock 2, Search 15, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 15, Survival 10, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 11. Practised Spellcaster Target of Vengeance +3, Poison Use
13th Imaskari Vengeance Seeker 6 5 5 13 Bluff 16, Concentration 5, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 3, Hide 16, Intimidate 4, Jump 5, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 5, Knowledge (Nature) 5, Listen 16, Move Silently 16, Open Lock 2, Search 16, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 16, Survival 14, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 11. Target of Vengeance +4, Sneak Attack +1d6
14th Imaskari Vengeance Seeker 7 5 6 14 Bluff 17, Concentration 5, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 3, Hide 17, Intimidate 4, Jump 5, Knowledge (Arcana) 1, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 5, Knowledge (Nature) 5, Listen 17, Move Silently 17, Open Lock 2, Search 17, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 17, Survival 17, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 11. Target of Vengeance +5, Far Sense
15th Imaskari Vengeance Seeker 7 5 6 14 Bluff 18, Concentration 5, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 3, Hide 18, Intimidate 4, Jump 5, Knowledge (Arcana) 3, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 5, Knowledge (Nature) 5, Listen 18, Move Silently 18, Open Lock 2, Profession (Gambler) 1,Search 18, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 18, Survival 18, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 11. Craven Target of Vengeance +6, Sneak Attack +1d6
16th Imaskari Vengeance Seeker 8 6 7 15 Bluff 19, Concentration 5, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 3, Hide 19, Intimidate 4, Jump 5, Knowledge (Arcana) 5, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 5, Knowledge (Nature) 5, Listen 19, Move Silently 19, Open Lock 2, Profession (Gambler) 3, Search 19, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 19, Survival 19, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 11. Target of Vengeance +7, Seeker
17th Imaskari Vengeance Seeker 9 6 7 15 Bluff 20, Concentration 5, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 3, Hide 20, Intimidate 4, Jump 5, Knowledge (Arcana) 7, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 5, Knowledge (Nature) 5, Listen 20, Move Silently 20, Open Lock 2, Profession (Gambler) 5, Search 20, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 20, Survival 20, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 11. Target of Vengeance +8, Sneak Attack +1d6
18th Imaskari Vengeance Seeker 10 6 8 16 Bluff 21, Concentration 5, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 3, Hide 21, Intimidate 4, Jump 5, Knowledge (Arcana) 10, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 5, Knowledge (Nature) 5, Listen 21, Move Silently 21, Open Lock 3, Profession (Gambler) 5, Search 21, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 21, Survival 21, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 11. Arcane Mastery Target of Vengeance +9, Scry Target
19th Fatespinner 10 6 8 18 Bluff 21, Concentration 13, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 3, Hide 21, Intimidate 4, Jump 5, Knowledge (Arcana) 10, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 5, Knowledge (Nature) 5, Listen 21, Move Silently 21, Open Lock 3, Profession (Gambler) 5, Search 21, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 21, Survival 21, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 11. Spin Fate
20th Fatespinner 11 6 8 19 Bluff 21, Concentration 21, Diplomacy 4, Disable Device 3, Hide 21, Intimidate 4, Jump 5, Knowledge (Arcana) 10, Knowledge (Dungeoneering) 5, Knowledge (Nature) 5, Listen 21, Move Silently 21, Open Lock 3, Profession (Gambler) 5, Search 21, Sense Motive 5, Spellcraft 4, Spot 21, Survival 21, Tumble 5, Use Magic Device 11. Fickle Finger of Fate

Level 0th 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th 7th 8th
1st 5 4
2nd 6 5
3rd 6 6
4th 6 7 4
5th 6 7 5
6th 6 7 6 4
7th 6 8 7 5
8th 6 8 7 6 4
9th 6 8 7 7 5
10th 6 8 7 7 6 4
3 11th [/td] 6 8 7 7 6 4 [/tr]
12th 6 8 7 7 7 5
13th 6 8 7 7 7 5
14th 6 8 7 7 7 6 3
15th 6 8 7 7 7 6 3
16th 6 8 8 7 7 7 5
17th 6 8 8 7 7 7 5
18th 6 8 8 7 7 7 6 3
19th 6 8 8 7 7 7 6 4
20th 6 8 8 7 7 7 7 5 3

Jane Wick used to live in a house with her dog and fiancee… And well, you know what they say, “hell hath no fury like a woman scorned…” Those pants did NOT make her look fat and John is no longer alive to say any different. Overreaction? Maybe. But it definitely awakened something in her that she hadn’t known about before, a simple, yet insatiable murderous retritbutive based bloodlust. The puppy’s doing just fine, however. Happy ending.

I tried to make the build as focused and flavorful as possible with Imaskari Vengeance Taker in mind. As a solo arcane tracker, and assassin, using divination to do as much research as possible, Jane’s a one woman party and can do pretty much anything needed to exact revenge on any enemy of the guild.

@1-5 Jane is a simple Beguiler, building the foundation for what’s to come, picking up Penumbra Bloodline and Shadow Weave Magic for the flavor match and some bonus utility, but that comes last.

@6-10 She starts coming into her own; Mindsight, being important for an arcane tracker, once she’s within 100 ft there’s no way the target of her vengeance will be able to escape. She starts using invisibility to stay hidden while using non-attack-based spells to do her bidding, picking up Shadow Conjuration with Advanced learning to be able to cast any [Creation] or [Summoning] spell of her choice. She’s also become incredibly adept at staying hidden herself, with Darkstalker picking up where Invisibility, Greater Invisibility and her Hide and Move Silently checks end. Finally, her levels of Unseen Seer give her a ton of bonus damage to really help use what comes next, with 1d6 Bonus Damage and a Hunter’s Eye’s worth of d6s…

@11-15 Is somewhat of a sweet spot of Jane’s, but nobody would tell her that to her face. She gets her new favorite spell, Shadow Evocation, which allows her to use any Evocation spell of 4th or lower, which happen to include the likes of Orb of Acid, a no save beauty. But preparation is definitely Jane’s MO; so before going into the fight she’ll be asking her bestie, Shar, what to use against her Targets of Vengeance. The Clairvoyance spell and the versatility of Shadow Evocation allows her to tailor her tactics of how to approach, and dance with her next dance partner for maximum effectiveness. At 15th, she even gets to keep all her daily spells while still keeping an eye on her target, just getting more in the mood for murder with every second of Far Sense. She can also now swap over to Greater Invisibility in combat, and snipe with her giant Hide bonus from being invisible, dealing all those juicy 1d6 dice from all those sources to a likely flat footed/touch AC, once she’s done toying with her prey.

@16-20 Jane gets into a groove, getting even better at what she now knows to be her true calling, killing. More Sneak Attack dice, and Craven for a whopping HD’s worth of straight damage. Fatespinner lets her boost a DC by another +1 2/day Or +2 1/day, while allowing her to nab 8th level spells and keep her CL at 20/20. I couldn’t decide on whether or not to take the last 2 levels of Imaskari or go over to Fatespinner, but Greater Shadow Evocation from the Penumbra Bloodline and Fickle Finger of Fate felt fiercely, almost forcibly, flavorful.

Collar of Umbral Metamorphosis
Caine's Flagon of Shadows
Headband of Intellect +6
Tome of Clear Thought +5
Bracers of Murder
Feycraft Weapon
Metamagic Rods
Longspoon Masterwork Thieves' Tools

Wands:

Runestaves, or wands, of her favorite attack spells (Lesser/Orb of Acid, Shivering Touch etc.)
Primal Instincts, Sorc 3, +5 survival and initiative (uncanny dodge in combination)
Primal Senses, +5 spot and listen (uncanny dodge in combination)
Golem/Grave/Vinestrike

Other cool stuff… Jane’s not in it for the money, she’s never worked a day in her life. She lives to kill.

The Viscount

2022-01-12, 09:43 PM

The strongest of grudges are grudges of blood.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/647393639886094337/930982244074541097/Screen-Shot-2022-01-12-at-5-30-52-PM_x350.png

Valencia Hills-Beane: the Black Book

“Welcome to the Paragnostic Assembly, Thorn Hills-Beane. May I see your library card?” asked the archivist.

“I’m using the company account through the Retributive Masters and Mistresses. Here’s my authorization. And it’s Harrier Hills-Beane now.” She handed it over with a card from the Assembly’s catalog.

“Oh, please excuse me. I’ll amend our records accordingly,” he said and made a note in his ledger.

“You don’t need to worry about it,” Valencia said with a good-natured smile.

“It’s only been a year, hasn’t it? Is it usual to rise through the ranks that quickly?” the archivist pulled a lantern from his desk drawer and screwed on the glass around a brightly colored candle. He patted his pockets, presumably for a tindertwig.

“Two. If you would allow me, Exalted Philosopher,” Valencia said and held out a gloved hand for the lantern. She quickly received it and let out a long, slow breath into the enclosure. A flame bloomed at the candle’s tip and let out a quiet scent of lavender.

“That’s lovely,” she said and returned it to the archivist.

“Nice someone thinks so,” he said with a laugh. “We’ve got one of those newfangled chandler wizards doing his apprenticeship here; I’m always tripping over the damned things. Take a few with you on your way out if you want. You’d be doing me a favor.” He looked at the card from the catalog Valencia had handed him and muttered to himself.

“Problem?” she asked.

“No, not at all. I know just where it is, it’s just a bit of a walk is all.” He gripped the head of a cane, carved from dark horn and drew himself out of his chair. The cane was hewn from a devil itself, if you believed that sort of thing. It was one of the many symbols of office for the head archivist of the Paragnostic Assembly.

“I’m in no hurry. It’s true what they say about us, you know. We’re a patient sort.” She followed the archivist, staying a pace behind due both to etiquette and because she knew it wouldn’t be too long before he’d need to rest for a moment as they begun their long walk into the catacombs.

“Oh, well, you know me, dear, I try my best not to stereotype,” he said.

“You’ve moved up rather quickly yourself, haven’t you?” Valencia asked. Usually an Exalted Philosopher’s long, white beard touched his ankles. This one’s barely grazed his knees and still had tinges of light brown in it.

“You’re too kind. The fellow before me’s sailed on to be with his ancestors. Someone had to do it, and it looks like that was me.” He held out his arm to brace himself across the narrow hall. Valencia couldn’t pass.

“Catching your breath?” she asked.

“One moment please.” A giant blade blasted from the ceiling down to the floor and was gone just as quickly. He kept walking.

“Are the books I’m after really valuable enough for things like that?” she asked and followed a bit more closely.

“All books are that valuable. You needn’t worry. There’s a motion detector in this wall. It turned on when we turned the corner and calculated our average speed. When we were due to step between stone 750 and 751, the blade deployed. All we had to do was not be there, and I’d rather wait than hurry at my age,” he said.

“Still, it seems a bit extreme. What do you do if it gets someone? Doesn’t all the blood run down the crack where the blade goes? Wouldn’t the blade corrode?”

The archivist laughed and opened a door by holding the heavy golden medallion around his neck to be flush with an indentation in its precise size and shape.

“That’s a funny thing for an Imaskari vengeance taker to say, isn’t it? We’ve got cleaners for that. There’s a creche of rust monsters down there that dispose of the blades. They’re strictly single use for sanitary reasons.”

Valencia followed him through the door which vanished after her.

“Ignore that, it’s still there. We’ll come out of it right here on the way back,” the archivist said.

“I thought you didn’t stereotype people. It’s like a soldier who doesn’t like the idea of people using cannons as toys. To her, they’re dangerous tools to be treated with respect and only deployed when you aim them at something you wish to destroy. Vengeance is what my guild keeps for the same reasons,” she said.

“I suppose I hadn’t thought of it like that,” the archivist said. He reached into a built-in shelf and withdrew a book on Ghallanda cheesemaking to present to her.

“You know, I thought I gave you the card for—“

“Glamer,” the archivist said. “That’s what you’re looking for. They’re always changing, so I can guarantee your privacy.

Valencia leafed through the table of contents and found the name she was looking for.

“Gristlegrinder the Vast,” Valencia murmured to herself. She touched his name on the page.

The archivist tsked. “Oh, terrible fellow. One of the worst, even for a devil. No surprise he’s done something worthy of taking vengeance over.”

“He probably has, hasn’t he? Where is this woman?” Valencia tapped a name by Gristlegrinder’s: Gabriella.”

“Oh, well if she’s in that book, she’s been dead for quite some time. Only so much magic can do, even ours,” he said with a kind of helpless smile that thrived in bureaucracies.

“I’m aware of that. What I mean is, her remains are interred somewhere on your campus. I wish to speak with them.” A bead of sweat pearled on the archivist’s forehead. he wiped it away with the long sleeve of his robe.

“We’re really not supposed to disinter any of our departed members. Nothing necrophobic, you understand, just that the physical remains are considered Assembly property,” he said, clearly by rote.

“This is in the service of vengeance, Exalted Philosopher. You are within your rights and responsibilities to refuse, but you know the consequences it will bring.” She waited while he weighed his options.

He laughed and pushed a gem on his medallion. A spiral staircase leading further into the bowels of the building revealed itself in the floor.

“The things we do for our masters, eh? If I could see that page, I could direct you to the right place in the catacombs,” he said.

Valencia turned the book around and pointed at Gabriella’s name with her thumbnail, painted black to indicate that she was on business.

“Oh, dear,” he said with a queasy noise.

“Is there a problem?” she asked. Valencia’s free hand instinctively went to her belt, ready to flick the hilt of her knife up with her thumb to catch it in her hand and do her duty, as she did whenever she was impeded.

“Well, not exactly. This shape of line here attaching her name to Gristlegrinder, it means he, ah, not to be indelicate, took her as his bride.” The archivist twisted the leather braid that held his keys between his knuckles.

“And?”

“I mean, the lady’s remains might have some upsetting tales to tell. If you would give me your list of questions, I would be happy to question them for you,” he said.

Valencia gestured for him to begin down the stair, which he did.

“Very generous, but not necessary. I’m sure I’ve heard worse in my line.”

“Oh, I suppose you have, haven’t you?” They came to the shelf where Gabriella’s remains lay and the archivist unveiled them, still and dry after so much time had passed.

Valencia unfurled the tiny scroll from a compartment in her wristband and spoke the words of magic. Gabriella’s skull turned to face her.

“Good afternoon. Were you wed to the devil known as Gristlegrinder eighty-nine years ago?”

“Yes.”

“Who initiated the courtship?”

“I did.”

“Did you love him?”

“Yes.”

“Did he kill you?”

“No.”

“Who did?”

“The seventy-fifth archivist of the Paragnostic Assembly.”

With that, the seventh-ninth archivist of the Paragnostic Assembly swallowed loudly and dryly enough for Valencia to hear him even a respectable distance away.

Valencia straightened Gabriela’s skull so it lay the way it had been before she arrived and with that, her remains were still once more.

“I don’t understand,” the archivist said and reached in what he no doubt thought was a stealthful manner for a wand concealed in the drawstring of his robe.

Valencia flicked the hilt of her knife in a practiced manner, caught it in her hand, and pinned his wrist to the wall.

“No, I don’t suppose you do. It was forbidden to consort with devils back then. There weren’t any exceptions made. That much you can see for yourself.” She stepped in close to him and put her free hand across his throat.

“My predecessor was—was only doing what the Silver Flame told him. If he didn’t, he’d have been put to the pyre instead. You know that. You must know that!” He rested a frail hand on her forearm and dug in with his fingernails, more out of instinct than thinking it would make any bit of difference.

“Those involved have been dealt with. When you inherited this office, you took on certain responsibilities along with its rights and privileges. This is one of them. Gristlegrinder is waiting for you, archivist.”

“Why? Why do all this for that—that butcher?!”

Valencia ran her thumb along the handle of her knife. It was carved from horn, Gristlegrinder’s horn. It hadn’t been easy to get it. She laughed.

“He was a butcher, you know. A real one. Made his own sausages and things. It’s how he got his nickname. The only time he saw action in the Blood War was feeding the soldiers. I wonder what people will say about you in a hundred years.” Valencia pressed the edge of her knife to his throat, just drawing blood.

“This isn’t over. The Assembly won’t take this lying down, girl. You have no idea what you’ve begun.”

Valencia cut his throat. Hopefully Gristlegrinder could feel it.

“That’s where you’re wrong. If you see Gristlegrinder in Hell, tell him his great-great-granddaughter sends her love.”

LE human beguiler 4/imaskari vengeance taker 10/fiend-blooded 6

str 8
dex 10
con 14
int 18 (increases here)
wis 10
cha 14

Level
Class
Base Attack Bonus
Fort Save
Ref Save
Will Save
Skills
Feats
Class Features

1st
beguiler 1
+0
+0
+0
+2
bluff 4, diplo 4, disguise 4, forgery 4, listen 4, sense motive 4, sleight of hand 4, spellcraft 4, spot 4, tumble 4, umd 4
versatile spellcaster, track
armored mage, trapfinding

2nd
beguiler 2
+1
+0
+0
+3
bluff 1 (5), disguise 1 (5), hide 4, ms 5

cloaked casting (+1 dc), surprise casting

3rd
beguiler 3
+1
+1
+1
+3
bluff 2 (6), disguise 1, survival 4 (2), tumble 2 (6), umd 2 (6)
obtain familiar (raven)
advanced learning (entice gift)

4th
beguiler 4
+2
+1
+1
+4
bluff 1 (7), disguise 6 (7), sm 2, tumble 1 (7), umd 1 (7)

5th
Imaskari vengeance taker 1
+2
+1
+3
+6
balance 5, k (arcana) 4

target of vengeance

6th
Imaskari vengeance taker 2
+3
+1
+4
+7
concentration 8, k (arcana) 1 (5)
eschew materials
poison use

7th
Imaskari vengeance taker 3
+4
+2
+4
+7
k (arcana) 3 (8), k (planes) 6 (3)

sneak attack +1d6

8th
Imaskari vengeance taker 4
+5
+2
+5
+8
bluff 3 (10), k (planes) 4 (5), tumble 4 (11)

far sense

9th
Imaskari vengeance taker 5
+5
+2
+5
+8
bluff 1 (11), hide 6 (10), k (planes) 2 (6), tumble 1 (12)
improved familiar (imp)
sneak attack +2d6

10th
Imaskari vengeance taker 6
+6/+1
+3
+6
+9
hide 1 (11), ms 8 (13), tumble 1 (13)

seeker

11th
Imaskari vengeance taker 7
+7/+2
+3
+6
+9
bluff 3 (14), hide 3 (14), ms 1 (14), k (planes) 2 (7), tumble 1 (14)

sneak attack +3d6

12th
Imaskari vengeance taker 8
+8/+3
+3
+7
+10
bluff 1 (15), hide 1 (15), ms 1 (15), listen 7 (11)
practiced spellcaster (beguiler)
scry target

13th
Imaskari vengeance taker 9
+8/+3
+4
+7
+10
bluff 1 (16), hide 1 (16), ms 1 (16), k (planes) 2 (8), listen 5 (16)

sneak attack +4d6

14th
Imaskari vengeance taker 10
+9/+4
+4
+8
+11
bluff 1 (17), hide 1 (17), ms 1 (17) listen 1 (17), spot 6 (10)

death attack

15th
fiend-blooded 1
+9/+4
+4
+8
+13
bluff 1 (18), intimidate 7
blood calls to blood
fiendish companion, fiendish heritage +1 AC

16th
fiend-blooded 2
+10/+5
+4
+8
+14
bluff 1 (19), intimidate 6 (13), never outnumbered

fiendish sorcery (shadow evocation)

17th
fiend-blooded 3
+10/+5
+5
+9
+14
bluff 1 (20), intimidate 7 (20), k (arcana) 1 (9)

blood of the fiends +1 saves, fiendish heritage +1 cha

18th
fiend-blooded 4
+11/+6/+1
+5
+9
+15
bluff 1 (21), intimidate 1 (21), k (arcana) 4 (13), k (planes) 3 (11)
shadow weave magic
fiendish sorcery (Kyristan’s malevolent tentacles), smiting spell 1/day

19th
fiend-blooded 5
+11/+6/+1
+5
+9
+15
bluff 1 (22), intimidate 1 (22), k (arcana) 3 (17), k (planes) 4 (15)

fiendish heritage +1 int

20th
fiend-blooded 6
+12/+7/+2
+6
+10
+16
bluff 1 (23), intimidate 1 (23), k (arcana) 3 (20), k (planes) 4 (19)

blood of fiends (cold resist 5, fire resist 5), fiendish sorcery (waves of exhaustion)

You begin play as a beguiler. Versatile spellcaster allows you to take two slots of one level, glue them together, and make a slot one level up. Since beguiler knows every spell on its list, this enables you to get access to spells early (glue two 1s together to make a 2, etc) and mitigate the lost levels from imaskari vengeance taker later on. It also allows you to enter the class early, leaving more freedom later on. Ravens as familiars fly, can use tools, and can talk so they can use wands. They use your skills and beguiler has tons of skills, so enjoy it while it lasts. Entice gift gets your enemies to give you their goodies before you kill them. You already have your first level in imaskari vengeance taker so can bring your target of vengeance ability to bear against adversaries or enemies of the retributive masters.

Imaskari vengeance taker gives you some sneak attack along with stealth skills, which lets you take advantage of beguiler’s cloaked and surprise casting ability. Your divination slas are up now, allowing you to find targets of vengeance more easily. Your familiar is now an imp, which in addition to being able to fly, talk, and use magic items like wands, is also invisible whenever it wants to be and can disguise itself as less exciting familiar options.

You’re finished with imaskari vengeance taker and have collected more sneak attack, divination slas, and even a death attack. You’ve begun your journey in fiend blooded and have made your skin a bit thicker. This is why you’ve taken eschew materials and blood calls to blood, which boosts your saves against fiends. Practiced spellcaster helps regain all but one of the caster levels lost to imaskari vengeance taker.

You add to your magical repertoire further with fiendish sorceries, a more broad advanced-learning like ability which grants some goodies off your list. Versatile spellcaster allows access to one level higher spells than normal, and you get access to the ever-popular shadow evocation, great on beguilers, kyristan’s malevolent tentacles for bfc, and waves of exhaustion to debuff adversaries. Your mind becomes sharp as your teeth and your intelligence is nudged up a point, and you gain access to shadow weave magic, which bumps the saves and spell penetration on almost all your spells.

phb 2: beguiler
complete scoundrel: skill tricks
underdark: imaskari vengeance taker
heroes of horror: fiend-blooded, blood calls to blood
races of the dragon: versatile spellcaster
srd: track, eschew materials, human
player’s guide to faerun: shadow weave magic
complete arcane: obtain familiar, improved familiar, practiced spellcaster

The Viscount

2022-01-12, 09:46 PM

That's the entries for this round! Judges, do your stuff!

Seward

2022-01-12, 10:30 PM

Nice variety. It seems like everybody did something pretty different.

Thurbane

2022-01-12, 10:49 PM

Yeah, I didn't get much further than Beguiler 6/IVT 10/Unseen Seer 4, but couldn't really think of anything interesting to use the SI for...

Venger

2022-01-13, 12:25 AM

What a great turnout. Looking forward to reading these dishes.

Gruftzwerg

2022-01-13, 01:12 AM

Nice variety. It seems like everybody did something pretty different.
Despite all the complaints^^
Agree, we ended up with pretty diverse builds. I hadn't expected that with this SI^^

What a great turnout. Looking forward to reading these dishes.

Just glanced through and all look very promising. I need to make some time free today to inspect em more deeply.

_____________

Good Luck to all entries and thanks for everyone's hard effort. <3

Zaq

2022-01-13, 01:23 AM

Obviously I haven't read as thoroughly as a judge will, but at a skim, it looks like we all had some fun this round! Looking forward to doing a deeper reading, but there's some fun stuff on display.

Do we have any declared judges yet?

H_H_F_F

2022-01-13, 03:46 AM

Great variety! I haven't had the chance to fully delve into all the entries yet, but I think overall we did well, gang.

I'll be updating the spreadsheet soon, and share my "boring" idea after that.

H_H_F_F

2022-01-13, 05:54 AM

And... done. All 11 entries secured in the spreadsheet.

"Yeah, we can for sure talk. We have at least a few minutes until we catch up, if I'm reading these tracks correctly – and I usually do. It's kind of a long story though – you sure you're interested?

"So, my mother was a deep imaskari refugee in Evereska, right? Yeah, I know they're supposed to be a secret, but come on. Everybody knows, at this point.

"Now, they did not like her there. Not at all, and they liked me even less. Makes sense, given my skin color and such, yeah? I went to wizard school with all the moon elf boys, but I just never really felt like I belonged, you know? Yeah, classic protagonist stuff, for sure.

"You know, my mother wanted nothing to do with the Underdark. She tried raising me as a surface dweller. My only connection to the Underdark was being told that my birth parents were there, fighting their demons and such, and that they might one day make it to the surface to meet me. Like most drow, they were apparently these really tortured souls, chaotic-good folk trying to make sense of a world that would never accept them. You know the type? Oh, 4 of your party members, cool.

"Anyway, As I got older I sort of wanted to get more in touch with my roots. Went down to the Underdark. Started really getting into drow culture. Loads of super problematic stuff, obviously – but lots of cool stuff, too. So I was traveling in the Underdark with a few fellow drow, mostly dual scimitar wielders with panther companions, when I got the idea of going east to my mother's homeland. Like, those are my roots in some way too, right? Even though my mother doesn't really jive with them anymore, and the lack of blood relation on that side. That's how I got to my current line of work, which has been very fulfilling. Like, wizarding for ultimate power is great and all, but it can get really meaningless. Right now I'm working with a team, I'm doing stuff that matters, it's just great.

"So, anyway, not a lot of people working for the lodge so far west, right? Sort of wild out here. Lots of grave robbers and stuff, lots of criminals. That's when I started noticing that a lot of the low-lifes I was sent to hunt here were also being chased by the Evereskan Tomb guardians. Makes sense, right – if you're the sort of underground criminal that would get the lodge's attention, and you're working here in the northern Gauth Grottoes, you might as well be going nearer to the surface and robbing these tombs.

"Now, I think the Tomb Guardians are a bunch of superstitious jackasses, and I agree with nothing they do, so I was really ready to dismiss them as a whole. But then I realize something pretty crazy: you know how, like, if you want to be a vengeance taker, you have to join the organization and follow the code and stuff? And you know how that's what it's like with all these prestigious professions belonging to an organization?

"So, not the Tomb Guardians. Some ill-advised nationalist A-hole decided centuries ago that they had to teach any Evereskan Elf that had the right skillset. And even though they haven't seen me in nearly a century, and they hate my guts, they sort of had to accept me – they can't deny I was born in Evereska, and the rule books clearly state that drow count as elves.

"So now I can better hunt the criminals the lodge sends me after, and by the rules when I'm done I don't even have to return the artifacts they – oh, shoosh. There he is. There, there, a 150 ft away, next to that big bio-luminous mushroom. Right where the tracks were leading. Just a second please, let me get my poison. What? Oh, no. Colossal centipede, actually. Of course I fabricated it – time is money, and I'm not made of money. One more second, I need to get him before he gets more than 270 ft away. Shivering touch!

"Cool, he's down. Let's go finish him off. What was I saying?"
Male Lesser Drow (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20040215a&page=2) Illusionist 3/ Master Specialist (CM p.70) 1/ Drow Paragon (UA p.32) 1/ Imaskari Vengeance Taker (Und p.37) 10/ Evereskan Tomb Guardian (PgtF p.53) 3/ Archmage 2.

Level Class Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Reflex Save Will Save Skills Feats Class Features
1st Illusion specialist wizard 1 0 0 0 2 Concentration 4, Craft (poisonmaking) 4, Hide 4, Knowledge (Arcana) 4, Sleight of Hand 2 (cc), Spellcraft 4. School Focus (Illusion), Alertness (b) Shadow Shaper (UA p. 63), Familiar (rat).
2nd Illusionist 2 1 0 0 3 Concentration 5, Craft (poisonmaking) 5, Hide 5, Knowledge (Arcana) 5, Sleight of Hand 2.5 (cc), Spellcraft 5. - -
3rd Illusionist 3 1 1 1 3 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 6, Hide 7, Knowledge (Arcana) 6, Sleight of Hand 3 (cc), Spellcraft 6. Track -
4th Master Specialist 1 1 1 1 5 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 7, Hide 6, Knowledge (Arcana) 7, Sleight of Hand 3.5 (cc), Spellcraft 7. Skill Focus (Spellcraft) (b) -
5th Drow Paragon 1 1 1 3 5 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 7, Hide 7, Knowledge (Arcana) 7, Move silently 5, Sleight of Hand 4 (cc), Spellcraft 7, Survival 2. - Improved Spell-Like Abilities
6th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 1 1 1 5 7 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 7, Hide 9, Knowledge (Arcana) 7, Move silently 9, Sleight of Hand 5, Spellcraft 7, Survival 3. Darkstalker (LoM p.179) Target of Vengeance
7th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 2 2 1 6 8 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 7, Hide 10, Knowledge (Arcana) 7, Move silently 10, Sleight of Hand 8, Spellcraft 7, Survival 6. - Poison Use
8th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 3 3 2 6 8 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 7, Hide 11, Knowledge (Arcana) 7, Move silently 11, Sleight of Hand 11, Spellcraft 7, Survival 10. - Sneak Attack +1d6
9th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 4 4 2 7 9 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 11, Hide 12, Knowledge (Arcana) 7, Move silently 12, Sleight of Hand 12, Spellcraft 7, Survival 12. Poison Spell (DotU p.51) Far Sense
10th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 5 4 2 7 9 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 13, Hide 13, Knowledge (Arcana) 7, Move silently 13, Sleight of Hand 13, Spellcraft 7, Spot 3, Survival 13. - Sneak Attack +2d6
11th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 6 5 3 8 10 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 14, Hide 14, Knowledge (Arcana) 7, Move silently 14, Sleight of Hand 14, Spellcraft 7, Spot 7, Survival 14. - Seeker
12th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 7 6 3 8 10 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 14, Hide 15, Knowledge (Arcana) 10, Listen 1, Move silently 15, Sleight of Hand 14, Spellcraft 10, Spot 7, Survival 14. Practiced Spellcaster (CArc p.82) Sneak Attack +3d6
13th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 8 7 3 9 11 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 14, Hide 16, Knowledge (Arcana) 13, Listen 2, Move silently 16, Sleight of Hand 14, Spellcraft 13, Spot 7, Survival 14. - Scry Target
14th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 9 7 4 9 11 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 14, Hide 17, Knowledge (Arcana) 13, Listen 2, Move silently 17, Sleight of Hand 17, Spellcraft 13, Spot 8, Survival 17. - Sneak Attack +4d6
15th Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 8 4 10 12 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 14, Hide 18, Knowledge (Arcana) 15, Listen 2, Move silently 18, Sleight of Hand 18, Spellcraft 15, Spot 9, Survival 18. Eldritch Erosion (CS p.77) Death Attack
16th Evereskan Tomb Guardian 1 8 4 12 14 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 14, Hide 19, Knowledge (Arcana) 15, Listen 2, Move silently 19, Sleight of Hand 19, Spellcraft 15, Spot 15, Survival 19. - Sacred Duty
17th Evereskan Tomb Guardian 2 9 4 13 15 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 14, Hide 20, Knowledge (Arcana) 15, Listen 3, Move silently 20, Sleight of Hand 20, Spellcraft 15, Spot 20, Survival 20. - Devoted Pursuit, Dodge Bonus +1
18th Evereskan Tomb Guardian 3 10 5 13 15 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 14, Hide 21, Knowledge (Arcana) 15, Listen 8, Move silently 21, Sleight of Hand 21, Spellcraft 15, Spot 21, Survival 21. School Focus (Conjuration) Swift Tracking
19th Archmage 1 10 5 13 17 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 22, Hide 21, Knowledge (Arcana) 15, Listen 8, Move silently 21, Sleight of Hand 21, Spellcraft 15, Spot 21, Survival 21. - High Arcana (Arcane Reach)
20th Archmage 2 11 5 13 18 Concentration 6, Craft (poisonmaking) 22, Hide 21, Knowledge (Arcana) 23, Listen 8, Move silently 21, Sleight of Hand 21, Spellcraft 15, Spot 21, Survival 21. - High Arcana (Mastery of Shaping)
He was supposed to be good at sneaking from relatively early on, entry as soon as possible without cheese, 8th level spells. I had all these different tactics and other build ideas that I've given up because they didn't feel like they highlighted the SI as much as other parts, but the end result didn't really feel like it highlighted anything. Like, cool, you're a wizard. You use spectral hand and poison spell, and you have arcane reach later on. So what, you know?

I did think Eldritch erosion was a nice touch, given the SI giving you exactly enough sneak attack to get it. Put it on something with no SR, and you can make something that'd be very resistant to half your stuff much less of an issue for 10 rounds. I did also think Evereskan Tomb Guardian was a nice catch by me, and a good way to highlight the track requirement without giving up caster levels.

And I did enjoy writing the fluff, even though it wasn't super interesting and gave too much of a chaotic vibe, IMO.

But yeah, this sort of build is why I went "Ugh, arcane caster round" in the beginning. This is the sort of stuff it can bring out of me, and I don't like it.

Malphegor

2022-01-13, 07:55 AM

James’ trick with the divine companion to qualify for a class is really cool, I’ve never seen that before

AsuraKyoko

2022-01-13, 10:41 AM

My build idea was to use Vecna-Blooded to make someone who would be able to track down and kill anyone who investigates them, meaning they could kill someone, and then also make sure to remove any loose ends and other people who might be able to make trouble. I didn't have time to flesh it out very well, though, since I was super busy for the past month or so.

Seward

2022-01-13, 11:18 AM

Like, cool, you're a wizard. You use spectral hand and poison spell, and you have arcane reach later on. So what, you know?

Most builds will have 10 levels of half caster, meaning by the end you really aren't a primary caster anymore.

You have to embrace that to bring out the flavor of the ingredient. Which can be tricky for the story, I agree, as many ways to enter the class have you spending your early levels as a primary caster, or at least as a near-full-caster gish that will be tempted to behave like a primary caster to contribute.

I think I would have had more trouble with a typical full casting class like Loremaster or even Mage of the Arcane Order. Then you really get into "what is a primary arcane caster" and distinguishing it from just a wizard or sorcerer gets very difficult. I mean, you can take the PRC just to have more class abilities than the base classes give, but for this competition I think you'd have to really make the PRC thematic with your spell selection, tactics, feats, skills and behavior to stand out from "I took more wizard with same spells".

My build idea was to use Vecna-Blooded to make someone who would be able to track down and kill anyone who investigates them.

Man, I really like that idea. I wish you'd had time to flesh it out. Most assassins don't think enough about retaliation, and that ability gives you all you need to set up a new ToV for each guy who tries to learn about you.

Now I want to do a 15th level story arc using 4 of these Vengeance Takers. there's enough variety to make a fairly balanced party. "Ok, so their leader is a cleric and Bob caught a glimpse of her so I guess that one goes to Bob. Harry managed to get a name for her arcane casting researcher, but doesn't want that one? Jane, you good with that? Yes? Ok. Each has a bodyguard, Bob can you cast a silent image of the Cleric's so Harry has his target? Fine. I guess it's on me to get a name or image of the other bodyguard. I've got the ring of sustenance so I can take a few hours to nail that down and still be ready for the final "prep spells and planning" session before we go in while the rest of you are taking 32 hours to do what I can do in 26".

H_H_F_F

2022-01-13, 11:50 AM

Most builds will have 10 levels of half caster, meaning by the end you really aren't a primary caster anymore.

You have to embrace that to bring out the flavor of the ingredient. Which can be tricky for the story, I agree, as many ways to enter the class have you spending your early levels as a primary caster, or at least as a near-full-caster gish that will be tempted to behave like a primary caster to contribute.

Agreed. I feel that mu submitted entry achieved this. My unsubmitted and unnamed drow entry, at whom this rant was directed, did not - at least, I feel it did not. You can look at the table and come to your own conclusions.

I did try to lean in with the swift tracking, eldritch erosion, skill choices, darkstalker - but it felt far too bland.

I think I would have had more trouble with a typical full casting class like Loremaster or even Mage of the Arcane Order. Then you really get into "what is a primary arcane caster" and distinguishing it from just a wizard or sorcerer gets very difficult. I mean, you can take the PRC just to have more class abilities than the base classes give, but for this competition I think you'd have to really make the PRC thematic with your spell selection, tactics, feats, skills and behavior to stand out from "I took more wizard with same spells".

Oh, 100%. There's a reason we don't do those, right? The spellcasting is the main feature, and it overshadows everything else.

Gruftzwerg

2022-01-13, 12:34 PM

I had some time read the builds a bit more carefully and wow. Only 2 builds with unseen seer. I had thought to see more unseen seer. But maybe that thought bears some logical error..^^

And I really like the Drider fluff the most so far. I hadn't expected to see a monstrous entry^^

Back to investigating the builds more deeply!

Wildstag

2022-01-13, 02:41 PM

Unsubmitted entry

Speaking of... I'd been considering submitting a build that went Ranger->Vigilante->Secret Ingredient. There's two alignments I could be with it, LN or LG, but it's just so taxing writing a Lawful character sometimes, especially one that would have to be on long missions. The character would need to declare the target through Secret Ingredient and then use the scrying to witness a crime taking place, and only then could you combine Smite the Guilty with other things.

The big thing I wasn't certain of, though it's almost certainly possible, was if I could advance a PrC's spell-casting with the Secret Ingredient. I don't see any rules in any book about prestige classes that give spellcasting and whether or not they can then be advanced by other PrCs. Given the half-casting progression of the Secret Ingredient, I'd have been able to max out Vigilante's casting while getting all the core class features.

Overall though, the Vigilante really works well (thematically) with this class I think, it's just an issue of balancing enough of the SI and Vig to get the best of both while still being useful.

Venger

2022-01-13, 03:22 PM

If a prc grants casting, you can advance it through a +casting class like imaskari vengeance taker if you want just like a base class.

loky1109

2022-01-13, 06:56 PM

Name Alignment / Race Class Levels Chef Judge 1 Judge 2 Judge 3 Total Place
Queen of Swords (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332066&postcount=81) LN Deep Imaskari Wizard 5/Ruathar 1/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Master of The Unseen Hand 4
Dril’jhael Vralice (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332068&postcount=82) LE Drider Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10
LuckLuck (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332071&postcount=83) LE Goblin Duskblade 10/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10
James (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332075&postcount=84) LE Human Human paragon 1/Sorcerer 1/Imaskari vengeance taker 10/Virtuoso 1/Sublime chord 1/Keeper of the cerulean sign 6
Karakan (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332078&postcount=85) LE Dragonwrought Kobold Sorcerer 5/Monk 1/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Unseen Seer 4
Alkathira (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332081&postcount=86) LN Synad Duskblade 5/Knight of The Weave 1/Abjurant Champion 4/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10
Eddy + Cat (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332083&postcount=87) CN-LN Telthyrian Human Bard 1/Battle Dancer 1/Deadly Hunter Druid 1/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Lyric Thaumaturge 7
Ivy (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332093&postcount=88) LG Deepwyrm Half-Drow Monk 1/Combat Wizard 5/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Sacred Exorcist 1/Spelldancer 3
Lord Ej of Adon (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332095&postcount=89) LE Otherworldly Talaire Ranger 4/Warblade 1/Mortal Hunter 5/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10
Jane Wick (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332097&postcount=90) LE Human Beguiler 7/Mindbender 1/Unseen Seer 2/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 8/Fatespinner 2
Valencia Hills-Beane (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332104&postcount=91) LE Human Beguiler 4/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Fiend-Blooded 6

Akal Saris

2022-01-16, 07:08 PM

Gruftzwerg

2022-01-16, 08:05 PM

I love the variety of builds on display this time around! There's quite a few rare PrCs as well as some interesting monstrous and early entry builds. I also think it's great that a few chefs worked hard to build poison use effectively into their builds :)

Yeah, I'm really enjoying all builds I've read so far. And while we have many entries all are different. Just great imho.

I think we all have to thank for the great poison guide on the minmax forum for the "poison use" implementation into the builds. I at least was really grateful to had the handbook for building my entries.

________________________

btw.. do we have any judges so far?^^

Akal Saris

2022-01-17, 04:09 AM

Heh, thanks! I'm glad it's been helpful :)

Korahir

2022-01-17, 01:52 PM

I have started judging because time may permit it. I hope to be finished by the weekend. If not I'll post an update.

H_H_F_F

2022-01-17, 02:27 PM

I have started judging because time may permit it. I hope to be finished by the weekend. If not I'll post an update.

Thank you, Korahir!

loky1109

2022-01-17, 03:25 PM

Good news!

AsuraKyoko

2022-01-18, 02:27 PM

Man, I really like that idea. I wish you'd had time to flesh it out. Most assassins don't think enough about retaliation, and that ability gives you all you need to set up a new ToV for each guy who tries to learn about you.

Now I want to do a 15th level story arc using 4 of these Vengeance Takers. there's enough variety to make a fairly balanced party. "Ok, so their leader is a cleric and Bob caught a glimpse of her so I guess that one goes to Bob. Harry managed to get a name for her arcane casting researcher, but doesn't want that one? Jane, you good with that? Yes? Ok. Each has a bodyguard, Bob can you cast a silent image of the Cleric's so Harry has his target? Fine. I guess it's on me to get a name or image of the other bodyguard. I've got the ring of sustenance so I can take a few hours to nail that down and still be ready for the final "prep spells and planning" session before we go in while the rest of you are taking 32 hours to do what I can do in 26".

I'm glad you like it! I also wish I had time to flesh it out. I had considered a few different entries into the class, like Beguiler, Sha'ir, Wizard, Assassin, but I couldn't find one that particularly jumped out at me. Now that I'm thinking about it again, I might draft up more of a build stub to see what the character would look like...

(I also love the idea of having a group of them team up like that, could make for a fun heist-style game, perhaps)

NinjaGuy

2022-01-21, 03:25 AM

Finally got around to finishing reading all the entries thoroughly, and man do I thoroughly enjoy them all! I laughed, I cried, I learned a bunch of tricks along the way... Well done all!

Funnily enough the initial build I disposed of was a Dragonwrought Kobold too, but I was going to go cross setting to Dragons of Eberron for the Stalking Wyrm sovereign archetype! ... Hide Move Silently and Survival are always in class for them, Track is a bonus feat, they can cast spells from the Air, Animal, and Earth domains as arcane spells and get Favored Enemy as if they were a Ranger equal to his Sorcerer caster level... Wasn't sure if the clear synergy overrides the cross setting grab so I scrapped the idea.

Also, Air, Animal and Earth domains? For Stalking Wyrm? Give them Travel or Trickery or something... Anyway, good luck to all the contestants!

Korahir

2022-01-21, 07:26 AM

Judging incoming.....

Originality
The only metric that is purely subjective and not at all scaled. If your build blows me away, it’s a 5. If I saw it coming from a mile away it is a 1. Unheard of combinations of feats, spells, races, skills, etc. increase the score. Known cheese or human tend to decrease the score.

Power
starting score 3
Will break it down into certain levels (mostly 1-5, 6-10, 11-15, 16-20) and see if you are ahead of the cure or below the curve of what I would expect at that level.
Conscious choices made in your write up may hurt your power score (i.e. “wasted” feat slots, skill ranks, etc.)

Elegance
starting score 3
minor error – 0,25:
error – 0,5
major error – 1 (most of the times multiple errors stuck together)
Everything in its right place: +0,25 up to +2: classes, feats, skill ranks, spells are chosen in a meaningful, creative order.

UotSI
Starting score: qualified=3, not qualified 1
Possible point gains and deductions:
• Entry level, finishing the SI and the general necessity of IVT for the build matters
• Target of vengeance
• Poison use
• Sneak attack
• Far Sense, Seeker, Scry target
• Death attack
• Spells: casting progression is used in a meaningful way
• Skills: Skills that IVT offers as class skills and/or adds significant bonuses are used in the build.

Valencia Hills-Beane: the Black Book: Total 8
Originality 3
Base: 2,5:
• Beguiler- expected; hide + ms + arcane casting + surprise casting synergy
• fiend-blooded- why? has no synergy with anything IVT offers. No hide, ms, survival, spot and listen on class skill ist. So it is all about bluff? I don’t see Improved feint…. curious.
• Human: staple; expected in any contest
Background: well written; entertaining + 0,5

Power 3
Starting score: 3
Levels 1 – 5: Beguiler 4/IVT 1
• If everything would work as you had planned, the build is powerful early on. Decent AC, solid casting, a familiar, etc. +0,5
• Trapfinding is not used, not sure why
• Surprise casting is a complete waste with that build. You do not have improved feint nor 6 levels in beguiler so you feint as a standard action. That keeps to be a problem for all levels -0,5
Levels 6 – 10:
• With every level of IVT your power level decreases. The reasons for it are given in the notes to the Elegance and UotSI scores. Of course the build still has a very solid basis and I don’t want to deduct points in 2 different categories for basically the same “mistake” even if it is a choice in this case.
Level 11 – 15:
• Pretty much the same as above. IVT just isn’t the class for your start. Nothing much changes powerwise. You are on the decline by missed caster levels and not much you gain from the class features otherwise.
Level 16 - 20:
• Fiendblooded I see no synergy with IVT. The bonus spells are alright. It is a solid class with a nice flavor. I just imagine the build being a million times better as Beguiler 6/fiendblooded 10/+x 4 or completely rearrange the feats to go versatile spellcaster, heighten spell, combat expertise and improved feint.

Elegance 1
Starting score 3
• Ability scores: 32 points spent correctly. Dex 10 seems a tad too low for what I assume your character will be doing (some sneaking at least). Wisdom 10 also indicates nothing spectacular will happen with spot, listen, sense motive and survival, which are main features if IVT. All in all: Not convinced this array of stats makes best use of the 32 points. -0,25
• Alignment must be LN or LE / correctly listed as LE
• BAB + saves: calculated correctly
• HP: not listed, not important
• Skills: -1

Level 1: 44 skill points gained and spent:
bluff 4, diplo 4, disguise 4, forgery 4, listen 4, sense motive 4, sleight of hand 4, spellcraft 4, spot 4, tumble 4, umd 4
why go beguiler if you don’t plan on skilling hide+ ms. no survival yet skilled but track feat chosen – why?
Level 2: 11 ranks gained, 11 spent
bluff 1 (5), disguise 1 (5), hide 4, ms 5
going for the preqs now. Still no survival.
Level 3: 11 ranks gained, but the write up makes no sense. Increase bluff by 2 to 6, which was previously maxed out at 5?
bluff 2 (6), disguise 1, survival 4 (2), tumble 2 (6), umd 2 (6)
Level 4: 11 ranks gained, and …..
bluff 1 (7), disguise 6 (7), sm 2, tumble 1 (7), umd 1 (7)
• Increase disguise by 6 to 7? what? it was maxed out before. sm 2? sense motive to 2 or increase sense motive by 2? At this point I’ll stop and just call it a complete mess

• Feats: -1

Versatile spellcaster: only works with spells you already know. Beguiler 4 does not know any 3rd level spells. You need versatile spellcaster and heighten spell to heighten a known 2nd level spell to 3rd.
Track: I just don’t get it why you didn’t pick up ranks in survival cross class constantly until you enter IVT. 2 ranks in Survival and a feat spent on entering a suboptimal class. Tracking is rather useful at low levels.
Obtain familiar: obvious choice, thematically fitting. Needs 4 ranks of knowledge (arcana) which you don’t have at level 3.
Eschew materials: Chosen as a prerequisite for fiend-blooded.
Improved familiar: imp chosen. Requires arcane caster level 7. Not qualified for. Your caster level is 6 at the time you take the feat.
Practiced spellcaster: qualified for. Makes no sense picking that feat after missing the required caster level on improved familiar. Just switch them.
Blood calls to blood: Chosen as a prerequisite for fiend-blooded which is a problem because when leveling up the first step is choosing a class, the sixth step is choosing a feat. So you cannot qualify for the class with a feat you pick technically later.
Shadow weave magic: nice pick up in conjunction with fiendblooded. Requires you to worship Shar as you don’t have 15 Wisdom. Since you never mention a deity this has to be assumed.

UotSI 1
Starting score: not qualified = 1

Beguiler 6 is a possible entry into IVT I expected. It has nice synergy regarding skill prerequisites and cloaked casting as a move action is a nice setup for a save or suck spell.
You did go for Beguiler 4 with versatile spellcasting to cast 3rd level spells. Versatile spellcasting requires you to know a 3rd level spell before you can cast it. Beguiler while stating you know the whole spell list also says hat you need “access to a spell level” before knowing it. The only way to get access is via class advancement. Advanced learning also does not help with that issue. You can only choose a spell of a level you already know (and therefor have access to). You would need heighten spell and versatile spellcasting to heighten a known spell to 3rd level.

• Target of vengeance: There is nothing special you do with that class feature.
• Poison use: There is nothing you do with that class feature. -0,25
• Sneak attack: Dex 10, Str 8 and a BAB of +12 at level 20. So melee is not your angle. I guess you assumed cloaked casting spells would be your go to sneak attack option but see above why that does not work as you intended. -0,25
• Clairvoyance, Divination, Scry: There is nothing you do with that class feature. Cha 14 is okay to boost the DC a little.
• Death Attack: High Int boosts the save DC. Little to do with it still as I am not sure how you will be able to deliver your attack.
• Spells: nothing that would redeem your score
• Skills: nothing that would redeem your score

Jane Wick: Total 9,75

Originality 2,5

• human … overused
• Beguiler- expected; hide + ms + arcane casting + surprise casting synergy
• Mindbender dip – curious what you make of it
• Unseen seer: sneak + arcane casting = unseen seer. why enter it before IVT?
• Fatespinner of Shar: Shar? curious

Power 3
Starting score: 3
• Dex 16 and Wisdom 8. So I expect a whole lot of sneaking and no physical scouting. Int 18 and all others 8 means to me: you absolutely need the skill points from level 1 to 3. Otherwise just go Int 17 and put the remaining 3 in Wis or Cha. I don’t see a reason for INT 18 in the ranks of the early levels. -0,25
• Skill choices that hurt the build in power -0,5

• Diplomacy 4 ranks and -2 Cha. I really hope that mindbender dip is worth something.
• Disable device 3, Open lock 3 and jump 5? what for? Also increasing Open locks from 2 to 3 at level 18 is completely pointless -
• Not a single maxed out skill?
• UMD 11 ranks with -2 Cha ???
• Survival: 1st rank at level 9 (wis – 2 btw), Track feat at level 1. waste of a feat slot.
• Concentration: 1st rank at level 6, stays at 5 until level 18, then suddenly jumps to rank 21 ???
• K dungeoneering and K nature 2 ranks at the mindbender dip? what for?

Level 1 – 5: Beguiler
• Good Dex, decent Con and great Int make for a solid start into the build.
Level 6 – 10: Mindbender 1 / Beguiler 2 / Unseen Seer 2
• The Mindbender dip well placed in between Beguiler to be able to pick up Shadow Conjuration with advanced learning. +0,25
• Beguiler 6 is a possible entry into IVT I expected. It has nice synergy regarding skill prerequisites and cloaked casting as a move action is a nice setup for a standard action spell. Beguiler 7 is cool too. Grab that advanced learning on the way as you don’t plan to go early into IVT. Cloaked casting works great with IVT. I just don’t get your skill selection and rank allocation. At times it seems completely random to me.
• Hunter’s eye was what made you enter Unseen Seer. Nicely done. + 0,25
Level 11 – 20: IVT 8 + 2 Fatespinner
• Fatespinner is a nice addition to the build, which is easy on entry requirements and improves on some main concepts of the build (increased DC i.e.). everything about IVT you can read in the UotSI category. +0,5

Elegance 2
Starting score 3
• Ability scores: 32 points spent correctly.
• Alignment must be L anything. LE in the write up.
• BAB + saves: calculated correctly
• Skills: -1

• Skill ranks: at level 10 you spent 14 ranks but only gain 12 (6 + 5 Int + 1 human)
• at level 19 you spent 8 ranks but would have gotten 9 (2 + 6 Int + 1 Human)
• Level 4: Intimidate 4 ranks is not possible as it is a cross-class skill and therefor the max is half of 7 which is 3.5

• Feats: +0,00

Track: See skills above. Penalty in power not elegance.
Penumbra bloodline: nice pickup to extend the spell list.+0,25
Darkstalker: absolute staple in sneaky characters
Mindsight: minor failure to qualify. It requires telepathy, which you only get at the 8th step of the level up while you have to pick up the feat as the 6th step. -0,25
Shadow weave magic: Explains the Shar mention in Fatespinner. Nice pickup. +0,25
Silent Spell: Nothing in the beguiler entry nor the unseen seer entry mentions retraining which means you refer to the retraining rules in PHB II which are optional and need DM agreement. So no versatile spellcaster for this build. –0,25
Practiced spellcaster: expected
Craven: expected.
Arcane mastery: staple in builds that need to overcome SR reliably.

UotSI 2,25
Starting score: 3
• Target of vengeance: There is nothing special you do with that class feature. Weapon damage bonus is completely lost on your build. The bluff, hide + ms bonus is alright, the rest almost does not matter.
• Poison use: There is nothing you do with that class feature. –0,25
• Sneak attack: This gets a lot of attention. Craven was expected. Unseen seer too. Hunter’s eye is great too. +0,5
• Clairvoyance, Divination, Scry: You mention your best buddy Shar to be useful and refer to Far sense although I have to admit I don’t quite follow what you mean by keeping your spell slots. Cha 8 is a horrible stat to base the DC off (scrying). -0,25
• Death Attack: You don’t finish the SI so you don’t get that (horrible) capstone. -0,25
• Sadly I don’t see the reason to enter IVT. Beguiler 7/Mindbender 1/Unseen Seer 10 / Fatespinner 2 seems way better to me. IVT would have never crossed your mind if it wasn’t the SI. I guess that’s why you didn’t finish the SI in the end and you enter late. -0,5
• Spells: See above
• Skills: nothing noteworthy regarding the SI that wasn’t mentioned before

Lord Ej of Adon Total: 15,5

Originality 4
• Talaire? Love them.
• Mortal Hunter: Fits perfectly with IVT and is rarely used.
• Ranger: ofc expected
• Warblade Dip: overused but great mechanically
• Background: nice read.

Power 3,75
starting score 3
Mad as hell with no score above 14 -0,25
levels 1-5:
• Ranger: Obvious, but some minor very cool aspects used to increase power (ACF for familiar, the endurance -> wild talent swap).
• Warblade: The dip works nicely in covering some weaknesses.
levels 6-10:
• Mortal Hunter is a significant upgrade to ranger and keeps pushing your power level. +0,5

levels 11-20: IVT:
• Metamorphic transfer: Perfect! +0,5
• The rest is covered in UotSI and Elegance

Elegance 4
starting score 3
• Ability scores: 32 points spent correctly.
• Alignment must be LE. LE in the write up.
• BAB + saves: calculated correctly
• Skill ranks gained and spent check out
• Spot but no listen? guess ranks were tight with Int 12
• Sad that you did not max out hide and ms /
• Feats: +0,5

• Track: well used (ranks + hunter’s sense); bonus added to UotSI as well (target of vengeance) +0,5
• Otherworldly: not the biggest fan of the lame excuse of celestial born… especially in a round with deep imaskari on the table which naturally qualify for otherworldly. -0,25
• Antagonist: very flavorful on a Talaire. +0,25
• Two weapon fighting: not sure about sword and board. I’d still prefer two weapons.
• Mortalbane: Psionics and magic transparency may be an issue
• Wild Talent (Adon): Nicely done swapping the useless endurance for it. +0,5
• Alertness: I am one of the guys who thinks you cannot use the alertness feat from a familiar as a prerequisite. It is conditional (must be nearby). -0,5
• Flyby attack: requires a fly speed? –0,5
• Improved familiar: not sure if it is worth the feat slot for the poison alone?
• Metamorphic transfer: Perfect. Accounted for here and in Power. +0,5
• Martial Study: RNB seems good enough to justify the feat slot
• Craven: expected

• Mortal Hunter: Such a perfect fit for IVT in every possible way. love it. +0,5

UotSI 3,75
Starting score: 3
• Late entry but couldn’t get in earlier with the build
• Target of vengeance: Well used on a BAB 17 build. Spot, Survival (track) and Bluff used. As mentioned above: would have loved to see more hide and ms + 0,75
• Poison use: max ranks in craft poisonmaking, viper familiar + 0,25
• Sneak attack Craven, not much else
• Far Sense, Seeker, Scry target boost sla + Cha 14
• Death attack: does little for you (Int 12) - 0,25
• Spells: casting progression is used in a meaningful way: maxes out Mortal hunter casting
• Skills that IVT offers as class skills are used in the build.

Ivy, the poisonous belly-dancer of death Total: 9,25
Originality 3
• Deepwyrm Half Drow: dragonblood subtype but I don’t see any obvious reason to have it. Neither any reason to be a half-drow.
• Deity: Kossuth; not sure if that matters.
• Monk: Since IVT requires lawful alignment and monk offers a wide array of skills I expected monk entries. flurry works well with target of vengeance if you can hit reliably.
• Spelldancer + persist spells: alright, a little cheesy but nothing original
• Sacred Exorcist + lolths caress: that’s something I have never seen.

Power 3
starting score 3
• 10 BAB is low for a stat array and stub that looks like a gish and that possibly uses flurry of blows
• Why is tumble maxed?
• Why do you need 14 ranks in K:religion? That’s at least 7 ranks wasted. -0,25
levels 1-5:
• The monk dip for dodge and monk stuff is okay. But nothing significant. /
• Combat wizard: Helps with the spelldancer preqs and offers the best spell list. Makes sense.
levels 6-10:
• Track: 2 ranks in survival, Wisdom 10…. wasted feat slot -0,25
• IVT entered. Nothing done with it.
levels 11-15:
• Sacred exorcist + lolths caress is cute but not a power boost.
levels 16-20: +0,5
• spelldancer + persist=power not much more to say to that. The bonus would be higher if you had the combo up earlier.

Elegance 2
starting score 3
• Alignment must be LG. Is LG.
• Attributes 32 points spent. No real dump stat. Looks like a typical gish array.
• Bab + saves calculated correctly.
• Skill ranks per level are correct. /
• Feats: - 0,75

• Endurance: preq for spelldancer; absolutely useless for you otherwise. I see no reason to pick it at level 1 -0,5
• Dodge: preq for spelldancer; minor utility early on
• Mobility: preq for spelldancer; minor utility
• Combat casting: preq for spelldancer; useful
• Versatile unarmed strike: usually an alright feat for a monk; for a gish that relies on alter self/polymorph less so. Also why pick it up after all the useless junk for spelldancer and not before? -0,25
• Poison spell: expected but very thematic and works well for the build +0,25
• Extend spell: preq for spelldancer persistency
• Lolth’s caress: technically failed to qualify: step 6 of level up is picking feat. Step 8 is adding the class features. –0,25
• Persistent spell: expected when looking at the stub.

• IVT + spelldancer: I just don’t see it. Why would anyone want to enter IVT to end up in spelldancer? Of course spelldancer is fun and persistent spell is a staple but why take a ten level detour into something that does literally nothing for the rest of the build? Penalty only in UotSI
• Spells: Alter Self: not sure how you come to the conclusion that you can turn into a shadow dragon wyrmling? You are still humanoid not a dragon. / –0,25

UotSI 1,25
Starting score: qualified=3
• Target of vengeance: Survival 2 ranks, hide 4 ranks, ms 5 ranks, spot 0 ranks, listen 0 ranks, sense motive 0 ranks: why enter IVT if you don’t plan to use the skills it requires and boosts? You do nothing with that class feature – 0,5
• Poison use: Craft poison making, poison spell, Lolth’s caress; Why pick a parrot over a poisonous familiar? +0,25
• Sneak attack You do nothing with that class feature. - 0,5
• Far Sense, Seeker, Scry target : Cha 10 and nothing special done with them. – 0,5
• Death attack decent DC thanks to Int. Not mentioned in your write up.
• Spells + - 0,5: casting progression is used in a meaningful way
• Skills + - 0,25: Skills that IVT offers as class skills and/or adds significant bonuses are used in the build.
• Overall: Sorry, but this just lacks everything. Why not enter literally any almost full casting progression prestige class or expand on the poison theme? -0,5

Eddy + Cat Total: 12,25
Originality 4
• Telthyrian Human: I smell regional feats.
• Bard/Battle Dancer/Deadly Hunter Druid and cats? all very intriguing

Power 2,5
starting score 3
• Perform etiquette 12 ranks what for???? -0,25
• Concentration 4 ranks picked up at level 16 to 20 wtf is going on here? –0,25
levels 1-5:
• No weapon finesse or ranged feats.
• Crossbow pinging and level 1 spells (druid and bard) until level 9? -0,5
• Double Charisma to AC is fine +0,5
levels 6-10:
• Snowflake wardance to the rescue at level 9 (!) what is your role before that? Because it seems to me you are not very competent before level 9 -0,5
levels 11-20: powerwise finally everything comes together and you finish the build with a powerlevel I’d say is fitting. +0,5

Elegance 2,25
starting score 3
• oh boy… I am not a big fan of alignment switches. Seems like all you got to justify it is a trauma…. Why not play the Faustian pact card (as in signing a devil’s contract and thereby be forced to switch alignment)? At least that would have a rules text backing it up. -0,5
• Attributes:
• 32 points spent. No real dump stat. Curious what skills you prioritize given 10 Int and
• Con is more important than Charisma at level 16 + 20?
• Bab + saves are calculated correctly.
• Skills: -0,75

• Bluff jumps from 7 ranks (listed at level 12) vanishes for 4 levels, comes back with 2 ranks at level 16, then is listed with 3 ranks and 4 ranks at level 17 and 18 and jumps back to 13 ranks at level 19 -0,5
• Balance 5 ranks? Tumble 7 ranks? What for?
• Skilling crossclass perform (dance) at the first 4 levels of IVT, and perform etiquette and perform dance at level 10 baffles me given the exhaustive skill list and even IVT offering a class feature that boosts 6(!) different skills vs one enemy -0,25
• Move silently vanishes from the list with 10 ranks at level 13 ?
• I have no clue what all these little dips and dabs in ranks accomplish. Especially given IVT which screams for either Bluff, Hide+ MS, Spot+Listen or Survival, maybe even Sense motive (although) it is not a class skill for IVT.

• Feats: +0,75

• Heighten spell + talfirian song: great early entry trick +0,75
• Track: picked up together with 3 ranks in survival.
• Extra music: required for lyric thaumaturge.
• Ascetic mage: yeah makes sense. 2x Cha. Why increase con at 16 and 20 though?
• Snowflake wardance: another staple. Works well in the build. Is the absolute centerpiece of the build
• Melodic casting preq for lyric thaumathurge
• Captivating melody: dc buff
• Staggering strike: great sneak attack feat (points in UOtSI)
• Mastery of twisted shadow: late for my taste but useful for the concealment. Not the hide part as 9 ranks and Dex 14 just won’t be enough at level 18.

• Bard: If it weren’t for the alignment clash, bard works quite alright with IVT. I just really don’t like that alignment switch.
• Battle Dancer: Chaotic monk for Cha to AC.
• Deadly hunter druid: good choice. Personally I don’t buy into the cats are fabulous bs. Sorry but no sane DM would allow that variant. That cat is nowhere near the power level it should be. -0,25
• Lyric Thaumaturge: alright to finish up

UotSI 3,5
Starting score: qualified=3
• early entry + 0,5
• Target of vengeance You get some use out of it with whirling blade. If only you had invested more in the skills It also buffs significantly
• Poison use You do nothing with that class feature. - 0,25
• Sneak attack Staggering strike is great. The cat doesn’t count as mentioned above. It would help if it would count. Mastery of twisted shadow is a small bonus +0,5
• Far Sense, Seeker, Scry target: Cha 19 and scry by level 11 means these will be useful to you. +0,5
• Death attack You do nothing with that class feature. - 0,25

Alkathira Hamerubot: Total: 14,75
Originality 4
The only metric that is purely subjective and not at all scaled. If your build blows me away, it’s a 5. If I saw it coming from a mile away it is a 1.
• Synad always hypes me up. Wombo combo incoming for a hefty burst of damage in one round? It can be a pain by RAW as there is a lot of wriggle room in the wording of multitasking.
• Knight of the Weave I expected but it is still rarely used.

Power 3,5
starting score 3
• I am very worried about your Reflex save. –0,25
• BAB +16 is great though +0,5
• Why no ranks in concentration? Do you never cast in any dangerous situation? -0,25
levels 1-5:
• Duskblade: works with the build; solid gish class. You are quite powerful early on (Str+BAB+Power Attack and casting) +0,5
levels 6-10:
• Knight of the weave: Was on my shortlist of classes to look out for. Works well except for losing armor proficiency which you amend with levels in abjurant champion
• Abjurant champion: Fits in with Duskblade and Knight of the weave. Is always a staple.
levels 11-20:
• IVT all the way. Solid finish.

Elegance 3
starting score 3
• Alignment: Must be LN because of IVT and KotW and it is.
• Attributes: 32 points spent. Dumping Dex and Wis. 16 Str and 16 Cha is a solid Gish basis. 14 Int is quite the investment. Advancing Cha over Str seems solid given the spells you get.
• Bab + saves are calculated correctly.
• Skill ranks gained and spent are correct each level.
• Tumble 23 ranks with Dex 8 and piling on Acrobatic Backstab asap. The DC for that combo is 25. How do you plan to hit that number reliably? -0,25
• Back on your feet is alright.
• UMD 20 ranks with decent charisma is useful. I just to see the benefit of it over skills that IVT offers.
• Feats: +0,25

• Hidden Talent (Minor Psionic Creation): amazing with poison use and craft poisonmaking +0,25
• Combat casting: preq for abjurant champion; no ranks in concentration -0,25
• Power Attack: staple /
• Fiendish bloodline: bloodlines are always fine to extend spell lists. Fiendish wouldn’t have been my first choice but it works fine.
• Track: Absolute waste of a feat given 2 ranks in survival and Wisdom 8. preq for IVT –0,25
• Practiced spellcaster: nice catch using it to double advance Duskblade and Knight of the weave +0,5
• Staggering strike: Sneak Attack staple
• Venomous strike: that feat is rather weak for the 18th level slot. Craven would be way better imho.

UotSI 4,25
Starting score: 3
Late entry but not possible earlier with KotW
Target of vengeance:
• All you use is the damage bonus.
• You write: “Level 11 itself is kind of bland, obviously – there's not much you can do with target of vengeance itself.” I couldn’t disagree more: use feints in combat, baffling defense with sense motive, hide in plain sight darkstalker + hide + ms, spot + listen for great scouting, and a myriad of options whre you use the weapon damage in an interesting way. There is plenty to do with it. You just didn’t do anything with it.
• Skills + - 0,25: Hide 4 ranks + ms 5 ranks + 2 ranks survival; no bluff, no spot, no listen, no sense motive: why would you care about IVT? Dumped Wis and Dex on top. -0,25
Poison use Craft poisonmaking maxed out, venomous strike + 0,25
Sneak attack: +0,25
• Staggering strike is great. Mislead also is a great spell to trigger sneak attack although at high levels invis isn’t very reliable. You write:
• “A typical opening move for this level would be tumbling past an enemy into a good flanking position” hell no you will get smacked around half the time. Sneak attack triggered by acrobatic backstab should be built in a way where let’s say at level 12 you fail the tumble check at most 10% of the time not over 50% of the time since you only have on try per encounter. Your highest chance of sneak attacking is a flanking buddy.

Far Sense, Seeker, Scry target: +0,75
• Very nice catch that Synad Multitasking works with SLAs, which are purely mental and the scry and die attack
Death attack you overhype it a little in your write up (DC isn’t that amazing for level 20) but you do something with it and It works fine. +0,25

Karakan, the vengeful Poison-merchant: Total: 9,75
Originality 2
• Dragonwrought kobold: hope there is enough justification later for this cheese right at the start.
• Monk + Sorcerer with GRoDP: it is solid, it is known
• Unseen Seer is what I don’t want to see.

Power 3.5
starting score 3
• stats are great thanks to dragonwrought(12, 16, 12, 16, 12, 18)
• UMD 20 ranks with decent charisma is useful. I just don’t see the benefit of it over skills that IVT offers.
• 8 ranks of Search? why? -0,25
•

levels 1-5: Monk + Sorcerer is very solid. Ascetic mage is missing in my humble opinion but everything else is solid. +0,5
levels 6-10: IVT isn’t a great fit for the build regarding power. When you are not hunting down your target of vengeance there is little you gain from the class. (see elegance)
levels 11-15:
• Natural bond: I don’t think it is worth the feat slot. Boosting your effective druid level from 2 to 6 seems not worth it at level 15. At level 6 this would be great. At level 9 okay, level 15 is too late to matter. -0,25
levels 16-20: Unseen Seer overshadows IVT but boosts your power enough to warrant a bonus. +0,5

Elegance 2,25
starting score 3
• Alignment: Must be L anything. LE is written down.
• Attributes: 32 points spent.
• Str should be 12 and not 10 (14 – 2 racial). -0,25
• Bab is calculated correctly. /
• Will save calculated wrongly at level 8: it was 8 before and suddenly is listed as 7. Final will save should be 2 higher. -0,25
• Skills:
• UMD is a class skill after the 5th level. So the level 6th sorcerer level UMD cross class is incorrect. You would have 2 ranks more -0,25
• Feats:

• Dragonwrought: power grab
• Weapon finesse: actually glad you picked that up and do not rely solely on crossbow pings.
• Track: absolute waste of a feat for your build –0,25
• Draconic reservoir: why pick that up after track? It is way more useful than track.
• Poison Spell: Nice pickup on a poison based character +0,25
• Multiattack + improved multiattack: staples

• Unseen Seer: I hate to be that guy but why would you ever consider IVT over more levels of Unseen Seer? Monk 1 / Sorcerer 5 / Unseen Seer 10 / IVT 4 would give you level 9 spells. That’s easily better than anything IVT offers. It is just such a clear case of overshadowing the ingredient. -0,5
• Spells:
• You put a lot of effort into the spell list. It is thoroughly constructed. I may disagree at times with certain choices or interpretations but overall it is well done. +0,5

UotSI 2
Starting score: not qualified 1
• failed to qualify: MS only 4 ranks; racial bonus gained from draganwrought does not help as it is a bonus, not actual ranks.
• Target of vengeance: +0,25
• The natural attack routine works very well with the weapon damage bonus.
• Skills are a little all over the place Hide maxed out but only gets ranks after entering IVT, MS left at 4 ranks until level 8 and left at 5 until level 18. Survival left at 2 ranks. No bluff, 5 ranks of spot at level 10, 8 at level 11?, no listen

• Poison use: Craft poison making maxed out +, poison spell, animal companion, touch spell routine +0,5
• Sneak attack: invisibility + greater invisibility, The animal companion is too weak to really matter as a flanking buddy
• Far Sense, Seeker, Scry target: high Charisma but nothing special done with them
• Death attack: The scry and die is there + 0,25
• Spells: casting progression is used in a meaningful way

James Total: 17,25
Originality 5
• human for human paragon and I already saw truespeak in the table….. I am intrigued
• Divine Companion ACF
• Unname
• warp true name and aberration bane magic
• I wish I’d know anything about poetry. Is this poem in a special meter or verse form?
• … thanks for sharing this build.

Power 3,25
starting score 3
levels 1-5: Human Paragon + Sorcerer (Divine companion ACF) straight into IVT: powerwise, it is a little worrying as you rely on level 1 spells. I think the early levels will be tough and your whole career is better spent not too close to danger. -0,25
levels 6-10 IVT + Virtuoso: nothing spectacular going on regarding power. Steady increase as it should be.
levels 11-15: Sublime chord kicks in and gives the necessary push up to 9th level spells in the end.
levels 16-20: Keeper of the cerulean sign is a great addition and rounds the build out.
Spells: Extensively researched and at least I couldn’t find anything that I wouldn’t allow at my table while also being extremely creative. +0,5

Elegance 4,5
starting score 3
• Alignment: Must be L anything. LE is written down.
• Attributes: 34 points spent. I guess Str 12 is a typo? Should be 10 instead of 12? –0,25
• BAB and saves: BAB and saves are calculated correctly.
• Skills: Despite my disappointment that neither survival, hide nor move silentlyare maxed out, the ranks are spent in a meaningful way and explained in the write up.
• Feats: +1,75

• Track: completely wasted feat. preq for IVT –0,25
• Primitive caster: holy hell. Marvelous +1
• Sudden extend: I can follow your logic. Always solid
• Dreamtelling: requires DM agreement which usually is not a problem. well used in the build +0,25
• Craft wondrous item: staple
• Aberration banemagic: perfect combo with warping truename +0,5
• Venomous strike: I think there are better sneak attack feats. on the other hand poisons versus victims which probably have Con 10 are very likely to work.
• Sculpt Spell: great fit +0,25

• Curious what was cut in the Otto’s irresistible dance write up.

UotSI 4,5
Starting score: qualified=3
• Entry level: earliest possible entry without flaws +0,5
• Target of vengeance: The weapon damage bonus for weapon-like spells are very well thought out. Skill bonuses are not used at all, since you need them elsewhere
•
• Poison use toxic weapon
• Sneak attack: legion of sentinels; cloud of knives; mislead, arcane spellsurge +0,25
•
• Far Sense, Seeker, Scry target: scry and die, researching true names + 0,5
• Death attack scry and die is there +0,25

LuckLuck Total: 11
Originality 3
• Race: Goblin? Wow very rare. Any cool option you found to milk some optimization out of it? Nope, your inner goblin called… alright
• 10/10 Build Duskblade/IVT

Power 2,5
starting score 3
• going Goblin and relying on strength is fine in a normal game, but in an optimization contest it is kind of weird -0,25
• Spells: Acid Arrow chosen over enervation, shout and toxic weapon? I think that is a very poor choice. –0,25
• The rest of the spells is okay although I’d pick some spells in a different order (i.e. shocking grasp and true strike).

levels 1-10: Duskblade all the way is solid. Nothing much to say that isn’t said elsewhere.
levels 11-20: IVT the rest of the way. Same as above. Eerything I have to say is said elsewhere.

Elegance 2,5
starting score 3
• Alignment: Must be L anything. LE is written down.
• Attributes: 32 points spent.
• BAB and saves are calculated correctly.
Skills:
• You alternate between Concentration and Survival, and Hide + MS until you enter IVT. Then you diversify your skills a little. Although it probably would have been better to keep maxing out those 4. Hide + ms end up maxed.
• The 5 ranks Perform (dance) for shrouded dance is a little much investment for my taste
• Ecstatic Fervor is from Dragon 357 ( I cannot check since I have no Dragon magazines) and was never printed in a legal source for this contest. –0,25
Feats:
• Track: almost completely wasted feat. preq for IVT –0,25
• Combat casting: solid
• Two weapon fighting+itwf+gtwf: solid concept to use Target of vengeance
• Arcane Strike: solid in a twf build
• Darkstalker: staple
• versatile spellcaster: solid

• Duskblade 10: on the one hand I really like a solid 10/10 build. On the other hand IVT can be entered at level 3. The way you built the duskblade is alright and fitting

UotSI 3
Starting score: qualified=3, not qualified 1
• late entry
• Target of vengeance: The weapon damage bonus combined with the two-weapon fighting chain works fine. Hide+MS and some survival used on top +0,25
• Poison use: You do nothing with it other than smearing poison on your weapons.
• Sneak attack: hide + ms + darkstalker and some invisibility is all you got here. That’s not enough for my taste for a bonus
• Far Sense, Seeker, Scry target : 6 Charisma is very bad for the Scry SLA DC. Will negates after all. You do nothing with all three SLAs. -0,25
• Death attack: 14 Int, DC not horrible. Not mentioned in your write up. At level 20 probably useless to you. --0,25
• Spells: casting progression is used in a meaningful way
• Skills: Skills that IVT offers as class skills and/or adds significant bonuses are used in the build.

Dril’jhael Vralice 13,25
Originality 4
Drider: cool. 6 HD + 4 LA. Inherent casting that qualifies for the SI all you need is the base class to progress it by the SI. but there is no base class …. Still this unusal mode of entry should be rewarded in Originality

Power 2,75
starting score 3
• 18 Con and increases into Con seem a bit wasteful over Cha and more spells. -0,25
• Extended spell flower + girallon arms + touch spells + spectral hand means you stand there casting for at least 7 turns before you can waddle into action. Does not seem that great. –0,25
• 4 LA hurts but not enough to warrant a penalty.

10: Drider is actually pretty decent. I think it is one of the more sensible +4 LA races. +0,25
levels 11-20: Regarding power IVT sure as hell isn’t the perfect choice for a Drider.

Elegance 2,75
starting score 3
• Alignment: Drider are always chaotic evil. While there is of course the possibility of a lawful drider a little more reasoning for that would have been nice.
• Attributes: 32 points spent.
• BAB and saves are calculated correctly
• Skills calculated correctly. I would have liked more ranks in survival from the start but overall it is a sensible way to work with the skill points you get. /
Feats:
• Track: borderline case of too little ranks in survival to matter
• Spit venom: solid but why didn’t you also add deadly spittle?
• Extend spell: needed for the spell flower combo
• Poison spell: actually very good in this build +0,25
• Invisible Spell: it’s okay with spectral hand to be able to deliver sneak attack
• Venomous Strike: your poison is already good, making it better if you can sneak attack seems worth it

• Drider: Let’s talk about why you need a base class: So you need that one level in the base class to be sure. Anything else is up to the DM. -0,5

Link to a discussion thread: https://www.google.at/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiciseM_L31AhULGuwKHYJgCD0QFnoECAkQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Frpg.stackexchange.com%2Fquestion s%2F26985%2Fhow-do-prestige-classes-that-advance-spellcasting-interact-with-racial-spellcast&usg=AOvVaw2dACPiZDkraPRlVCllpLmQ

• Spectral hand is a horrible mess of RAW. It is unclear how fast the hand moves, if iterative attacks are therefore possible (it returns to you after delivering a spell). Invisible spell + spectral hand to deliver a single sneak attack seems feasible to me. Everything else is stretching RAW thin.

UotSI 3,75
Starting score: qualified=3
• late entry
• Target of vengeance: Decent use of the skills. Not so much use of the weapon damage bonus.
• Poison use: poison spell, inherent poison, craft poisonmaking +0,5
• Sneak attack: invisible spectral hand + venomous strike +0,25
• Far Sense, Seeker, Scry target: Scry and die mentioned. the rest only of minor help.
• Death attack: 16 Int, DC not horrible. Delivered via spectral hand? so spend more time standing there watching? I don’t think so.

Queen of swords Total:12,75
Originality 3,5
• Deep Imaskari thematically very fitting; only one this round
• Master of the Unseen Hand.. nice.
• Ruathar I expected.

Power 3,5
starting score 3
• 6 Dexterity is rather curious. Con 14 and Dex 10 would be better imho. Don’t see anything that requires Con 16. -0,25
• Disable Device 1 rank? it is trained only; not sure what to do with 1 rank though
• A bunch of Knowledge skills + collector of stories but no knowledge devotion? -0,25
•
levels 1-5: Wizard: 5: Solid start for what you want to do and a Tier 1 class +0,5
levels 6-10: Ruathar 1: works very well with IVT as it offers all the skills required for IVT. IVT see UotSI. Power stil ahed of the pack. +0,5
levels 11-15: Master of the Unseen hand: very cool use of target of vengeance (bonus in UotSI)
levels 16-20: Build ends up quite alright. Only getting to 6th level spells is a bummer but the concept of the build works in regards to power.

Elegance 2,25
starting score 3
• Alignment: could be L anything; is LN
• Attributes: 32 points spent.
• BAB and saves are calculated correctly.
• Skill ranks are calculated correctly.
• Distracting Taunt and Ecstatic Fervor are from Dragon 357 ( I cannot check since I have no Dragon magazines) and was never printed in a legal source for this contest. –0,25
• Feats: -0,5

• Track: Wis 8, 2 ranks of survival from level 1 to 8, 5 ranks at 9, 7 ranks at 10, 9 ranks at 11, 11 ranks at 12 until 20. Since track is mainly useful early on: almost completely wasted feat slot – 0,25
• Metamagic school focus: feat is alright for a focused specialist
• Quicken spell: interesting first choice for a metamagic feat
• Twin spell: another really costly metamagic feat very early?
• Arcane thesis whirling blade: okay makes sense with quicken and twin spell. Although I have issues with your write up: “Her mastery of whirling blade is designed to let her quicken and twin whirling blade at level 9.” At level 9 your highest spell level 4. Whirling blade is a 2nd level spell. Quickened whirling blade reduced by arcane thesis and reduced by metamagic scholl focus ends up being a 4th level spell. Same goes for twin spell. How on earth would a twinned quickened whirling blade work at level 9 in a 4th level spell slot. You would need a 6th level spell slot for it to work (2nd level whirling blade + 2 quicken + 2 twinned). –0,25
• Practiced spellcaster: staple
• Craft Rod: okay
• Somatic weaponry: I can see it come up though probably there are better options out there.

• Spells known missing. There are spells mentioned in the write up but a list would be very much appreciated. Spells mentioned in the write up are all sensible choices.

UotSI 3,5
Starting score: qualified=3
• entry at expected level
• Target of vengeance: works very well with whirling blade and telekinesis. Skill bonuses hardly matter. +0,5
• Poison use: minor creation +0,25
• Sneak attack: You do nothing special with it
• Far Sense, Seeker, Scry target: Scry with Cha 14 based DC at level 18 is too late to matter. Nothing special done with the others. -0,25
• Death attack: Int high enough so that the DC might matter but scry and die is not so useful at level 20 as it is at level 10-15.

And that's it folks. If someone could make a table and check my math on the totals?

H_H_F_F

2022-01-21, 07:51 AM

Thank you, Korahir! I'm looking forward to digging into these soon.

Venger

2022-01-21, 07:54 AM

Thanks for the speedy judging. No disputes.

loky1109

2022-01-21, 09:23 AM

Name Alignment / Race Class Levels Chef Korahir Total Place
James (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332075&postcount=84) LE Human Human paragon 1/Sorcerer 1/Imaskari vengeance taker 10/Virtuoso 1/Sublime chord 1/Keeper of the cerulean sign 6 17,25 17.25 1st Gold
Lord Ej of Adon (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332095&postcount=89) LE Otherworldly Talaire Ranger 4/Warblade 1/Mortal Hunter 5/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 15,5 15.50 2nd Silver
Alkathira (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332081&postcount=86) LN Synad Duskblade 5/Knight of The Weave 1/Abjurant Champion 4/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 14,75 14.75 3rd Bronze
Dril’jhael Vralice (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332068&postcount=82) LE Drider Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 13,5 13.5 4th
Queen of Swords (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332066&postcount=81) LN Imaskari Wizard 5/Ruathar 1/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Master of The Unseen Hand 4 13 13 5th
Eddy + Cat (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332083&postcount=87) CN-LN Telthyrian Human Bard 1/Battle Dancer 1/Deadly Hunter Druid 1/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Lyric Thaumaturge 7 12,25 12.25 6th
LuckLuck (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332071&postcount=83) LE Goblin Duskblade 10/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 11 11.00 7th
Karakan (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332078&postcount=85) LE Dragonwrought Kobold Sorcerer 5/Monk 1/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Unseen Seer 4 9,75 9.75 8th
Jane Wick (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332097&postcount=90) LE Human Beguiler 5/Mindbender 1/Beguiler 2/Unseen Seer 2/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 8/Fatespinner 2 9,75 9.75 8th
Ivy (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332093&postcount=88) LG Deepwyrm Half-Drow Monk 1/Combat Wizard 5/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Sacred Exorcist 1/Spelldancer 3 9,25 9.25 10th
Valencia Hills-Beane (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332104&postcount=91) LE Human Beguiler 4/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Fiend-Blooded 6 8 8.00 11th

daremetoidareyo

2022-01-21, 11:20 AM

No disputes here either

H_H_F_F

2022-01-21, 11:26 AM

No disputes here as well.

Zaq

2022-01-21, 12:01 PM

Thank you, Korahir! I appreciate the work you put into this. I have no disputes.

Korahir

2022-01-21, 12:14 PM

Thank you, Korahir! I appreciate the work you put into this. I have no disputes.

Thanks. I felt it was my turn to step up. Haven't judged in a while and 11 builds felt doable.

Seward

2022-01-21, 12:41 PM

I appreciate anybody who can judge this stuff. I like to think I have a decent grasp of 3.5, but the other chefs prove me wrong every time. I know I've got some pretty glaring holes on missed opportunities as a chef, based on campaigns I never played with their sourcebooks and some late splatbooks never purchased but I enjoy trying anyway.

NinjaGuy

2022-01-21, 01:08 PM

No disputes from me, thanks for the effort!

Korahir

2022-01-21, 01:21 PM

Btw. Sorry for all the typos. Should have read everything once more before posting.

The Viscount

2022-01-21, 09:04 PM

Thank you, Korahir!

I have two disputes for you.

Korahir, thanks for your job!

I understand my disputes wouldn't change my place, but I'll anyway try. )

18 Con and increases into Con seem a bit wasteful over Cha and more spells. -0,25
Plus 1 spell of 2nd and maybe 1 of 3rd levels? And on the other side of the scale is +2 poison DC.
I don't know. This doesn't look very significant.

Target of vengeance: Decent use of the skills. Not so much use of the weapon damage bonus.
I do up to 6 spell attacks in single round. Is +66 damage not much use?

Far Sense, Seeker, Scry target: Scry and die mentioned. the rest only of minor help.
I need Far Sense. Without it I have issue to use Spectral Hand:

After it delivers a spell, or if the hand goes beyond the spell range, goes out of your sight, the hand returns to you and hovers.
I need option to see my target on ~200 ft (my darkvision is only 60 ft) and/or around the corner, being out of observation myself.

Extended spell flower + girallon arms + touch spells + spectral hand means you stand there casting for at least 7 turns before you can waddle into action. Does not seem that great. –0,25
Yes, I can't use it in direct fight. But why should I found myself in direct fight? I'm assassin, striking in surprise after preparing is my meat and potatoes.

A minor dispute and an explanation.

Dispute - with Whirling Blade, when I talk about a first round nova, I am talking about devoting two spell slots, one for Quickened Whirling Blade, one for Twinned Whirling blade, which is sufficient to kill most ToV at that level in the surprise round (and take a chunk of hp off anybody else in the line).

Queen of Swords will have a third whirling blade prepped and quickened for the next round in her third Metamagic School Focus/Focused Specialist L4 slot. Given that this is an assassination build, getting dinged -.25 for what is a quite powerful ranged nova at that level seems odd, as it is what keeps her useful in that role until TK comes on line (and remains a useful way to work her L4 slots all through the build, at least until use of a metamagic rod of quicken in the 15+ levels become staple)

Explanation of skill points spent on disable device. This is part of her low level utility. When you have a gigantic brain, a +6 disable device, +8 with masterwork picks at level 1 is sufficient to do things like sabotage a rope bridge, or rig a wagon wheel to fall off etc. She pathologically doesn't believe spells that can be resisted will work, so devotes her first couple levels to bizzare rube-goldberg traps and plots using indirect means to kill.

It was a part roleplay choice and part "be useful when I am low on spell slots in baby levels choice". It doesn't play in much later, and you didn't ding me on it. But I thought you might want to know what that was about.

Chefs, I intend to close the round out on the normal posted time on the 23rd. If anybody else has anything, have it in before then.

daremetoidareyo

2022-01-21, 10:39 PM

What is the next choice gonna be?

OA's battlemaiden?!

The Viscount

2022-01-21, 11:55 PM

I'm feeling unkind. It will be bad.

H_H_F_F

2022-01-22, 12:27 AM

Are we talking weak-bad, or big-bag-of-nothing-bag, a-la Shining Blade / Knight of The Iron Glacier?

daremetoidareyo

2022-01-22, 08:06 AM

I'm feeling unkind. It will be bad.

I can’t wait to complain about it

The Viscount

2022-01-22, 10:13 AM

I'm aiming for something less nothing than Shining Blade.

H_H_F_F

2022-01-22, 10:32 AM

I'm aiming for something less nothing than Shining Blade.

That's not really all that comforting, is it?

Seward

2022-01-22, 11:40 AM

I keep wanting to use the trickster classes for something. Or maybe Survivor. Some of those tiny PRC's seem fun, but probably don't fit this arena very well. In a 20 level build, a 5 level prc might not have enough impact.

loky1109

2022-01-22, 12:11 PM

Maybe Berserk from Deities & Demigods? Or Lifedrinker from BoVD?

Troacctid

2022-01-22, 02:59 PM

I have no disputes.

The Viscount

2022-01-22, 03:05 PM

That's not really all that comforting, is it?

Sorry, that's confusingly worded.

I'm planning for a class that does more than shining blade. It'll be a while before I whip out a class that does less.

H_H_F_F

2022-01-22, 03:24 PM

Sorry, that's confusingly worded.

I'm planning for a class that does more than shining blade. It'll be a while before I whip out a class that does less.

Oh yeah, I got that. I was just saying that being "less nothing than shining blade" is about as comforting as "tastes better than mud".

The Viscount

2022-01-22, 05:23 PM

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FBsD2O_XsAUojgU.jpg

loky1109

2022-01-22, 06:56 PM

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FBsD2O_XsAUojgU.jpg

This is reassuring.

Wildstag

2022-01-22, 10:55 PM

I propose y'all do a mix of two bad 5-level prcs, just so we can knock out a couple of those. Like Incarnum Blade and Invisible Blade.

H_H_F_F

2022-01-23, 12:39 AM

I propose y'all do a mix of two bad 5-level prcs, just so we can knock out a couple of those. Like Incarnum Blade and Invisible Blade.

Sounds like a concept for a few Junkyard Wars rounds.

Korahir

2022-01-23, 02:32 AM

Answers to disputes:

Dril'jhael Vralice

Con over Cha: I disagree. Given the choice between a 2nd level spell slot and +2 DC on a poison, I would choose the spell slot anytime. Add in another spell slot and increased DC and the choise is pretty obvious to me.

Target of vengeance: On a second thought I probably didn't give you enough credit for all the touch spell attacks. +0,25 UotSI

Far Sense: That use what was I meant with minor help.

The spell flower combo: there will be plenty of fights very you don't get the jump on your enemies.

Queen of Swords

Dispute: A thanks for clearing that up. Remove the penalty. It is indeed uncalled ofr.
+0,25 Elegance
Explanation: Thanks for clearing that up.

That should clear everything up.

loky1109

2022-01-23, 03:18 AM

Answers to disputes:
Queen of Swords

Dispute: A thanks for clearing that up. Remove the penalty. It is indeed uncalled ofr.

Explanation: Thanks for clearing that up.

What is the final score?

Korahir

2022-01-23, 03:47 AM

What is the final score?

Should be + 0,25 for both

loky1109

2022-01-23, 03:52 AM

Name Alignment / Race Class Levels Chef Korahir Total Place
James (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332075&postcount=84) LE Human Human paragon 1/Sorcerer 1/Imaskari vengeance taker 10/Virtuoso 1/Sublime chord 1/Keeper of the cerulean sign 6 17.25 17.25 1st Gold
Lord Ej of Adon (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332095&postcount=89) LE Otherworldly Talaire Ranger 4/Warblade 1/Mortal Hunter 5/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 15.50 15.50 2nd Silver
Alkathira (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332081&postcount=86) LN Synad Duskblade 5/Knight of The Weave 1/Abjurant Champion 4/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 14.75 14.75 3rd Bronze
Dril’jhael Vralice (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332068&postcount=82) LE Drider Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 13.50 13.50 4th
Queen of Swords (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332066&postcount=81) LN Imaskari Wizard 5/Ruathar 1/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Master of The Unseen Hand 4 13.00 13.00 5th
Eddy + Cat (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332083&postcount=87) CN-LN Telthyrian Human Bard 1/Battle Dancer 1/Deadly Hunter Druid 1/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Lyric Thaumaturge 7 12.25 12.25 6th
LuckLuck (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332071&postcount=83) LE Goblin Duskblade 10/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 11.00 11.00 7th
Karakan (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332078&postcount=85) LE Dragonwrought Kobold Sorcerer 5/Monk 1/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Unseen Seer 4 10.00 10.00 8th
Jane Wick (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332097&postcount=90) LE Human Beguiler 5/Mindbender 1/Beguiler 2/Unseen Seer 2/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 8/Fatespinner 2 9.75 9.75 9th
Ivy (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332093&postcount=88) LG Deepwyrm Half-Drow Monk 1/Combat Wizard 5/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Sacred Exorcist 1/Spelldancer 3 9.25 9.25 10th
Valencia Hills-Beane (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332104&postcount=91) LE Human Beguiler 4/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Fiend-Blooded 6 8.00 8.00 11th

Updated table.

Updated again.

The Viscount

2022-01-23, 10:22 AM

Thank you for the quick response, Korahir.

I have 2 more for you.

Here my lil dispute for the judge. I'm overall very happy with the judging and thankful. But I wanted to point out a few things..

Originality 3
• Deepwyrm Half Drow: dragonblood subtype but I don’t see any obvious reason to have it. Neither any reason to be a half-drow.
• Deity: Kossuth; not sure if that matters.
• Sacred Exorcist + lolths caress: that’s something I have never seen.
There is not much of an alternative for the Race choice:
Lolth's Caress requires either to be a Drow or have Lolth as religion. Monk and Sacred Exorcist (SE) locks my alignment to L-G. And SE further requires: "
...requires the sanction of a church or order that ordains sacred exorcists. Only characters judged by their church to be exemplary in faith and devotion, strong of will and upright in morality, are made sacred exorcists.
So, L-G Sacred Exorcist Lolth follower wouldn't work here.
Being a regular Drow is sub-optimal due to the +2 LA adjustment. Which leaves sole the two Half-Drow races as solid options. The Deepwyrm option gives "dragonblooded" and thus allows for some better options for Alter Self. The Shadowdragon form is a good early combat form and remains a good traveling form on later levels. Better than any non-dragon option for Alter Self.
Kossuth is know for "purification through fire", which should qualify as the related church. L-G followers is fitting as the fire theme for this build.

Power 3
starting score 3
• Why is tumble maxed?
• Why do you need 14 ranks in K:religion? That’s at least 7 ranks wasted. -0,25
levels 1-5:
• Track: 2 ranks in survival, Wisdom 10…. wasted feat slot -0,25
• IVT entered. Nothing done with it.
levels 11-15:
• Sacred exorcist + lolths caress is cute but not a power boost.
levels 16-20: +0,5
• spelldancer + persist=power not much more to say to that. The bonus would be higher if you had the combo up earlier.
Tumble is there because of multiple reasons. First as gish we are much more in melee combat and tumble is nice for repositioning. Second, as assassin-like character we only care about our main target. Wasting time for others is not in the intention of the SI. Thus tumbling directly to the main target is an good option imho. Finally, when we have cleared the target and need to retreat the combat fast, we can rely on tumble for the quickest escape route
Knowledge (Religion) did get some remaining points of the build. I didn't liked the idea to invest the remaining point into a new or lower skill at that high lvls. It would have been wasted anywhere else imho.
Track and Survival 2 ranks are the requirement of the SI. So there is no way to skip em in the build. But the SI itself overshadows the feat and the skill, making any investment useless over time. The divination abilities and the spells the SI gives itself makes Track and Survival pointless. Imho we should get point for not falling for that trap (putting points into survival unless you have a special reason to do so).
Sacred Exorcist + Lolth's caress is there as finishing combo when Ivy has stacked enough poisons on the enemies/on the target/s (Whirling enchantment for AoE attack or full attack for single target). Note that poison applied from others (e.g. Familiar) get also triggered.
I wanted to focus on the SI first. Further Spelldancer is still a fine "end of build" ability to have imho.

Elegance 2
starting score 3
• Feats: - 0,75
Spoiler: feat details
Show

• IVT + spelldancer: I just don’t see it. Why would anyone want to enter IVT to end up in spelldancer? Of course spelldancer is fun and persistent spell is a staple but why take a ten level detour into something that does literally nothing for the rest of the build? Penalty only in UotSI
• Spells: Alter Self: not sure how you come to the conclusion that you can turn into a shadow dragon wyrmling? You are still humanoid not a dragon. / –0,25
Imho Spelldancer offers some role-play "strategies" to kill our target of vengeance. Being a first class "magical" belly dancer is a good excuse to enter the territory of well (magically) guarded (against teleport) targets. It allows us to be less suspicious for being agile and using magic for any security controls. And if we should have somehow a group of targets, this is a good option to get em all unprepared. Ivy can also join or hire a group of dancers for an even better disguise.
The Shadowdragon wyrmling is possible due to being a Deepwyrm Half-Drow as mentioned. The dragonblood subtype should unlock dragons as legal choice for Alter Self.

Feats:
The sole other option at lvl 1 would be Combat Casting or the useless (but required) Track feat. The other feats either have higher requirements or are useless at the moment (metamagic).

Versitile Unarmed Strike is to allow "Whirling" as legal weapon enchantment (for 3x Whirlwind Attack/day; nice with Lolth's Caress). Since the enchantment comes up later (due to character wealth) it ain't needed to be picked early.

Lolth's Caress: Yeah, it seems I got the level up order wrong here.. my bad.

UotSI 1,25
Starting score: qualified=3
• Target of vengeance: Survival 2 ranks, hide 4 ranks, ms 5 ranks, spot 0 ranks, listen 0 ranks, sense motive 0 ranks: why enter IVT if you don’t plan to use the skills it requires and boosts? You do nothing with that class feature – 0,5
• Sneak attack You do nothing with that class feature. - 0,5

As said before, the SI itself gives abilities and progresses spells which overshadow the use of skills. Further the build has spells to boost skill checks (forgot to mention it thou..). Investing into those skills is a waste of build resources imho. Finally half of the mentioned skills are more suited for spies and not for assassins.. (Sense Motive, Listen,...)

Sneack Attack:
I thought this would be a self explaining ability (sorry, may bad). Besides from the common use, the build mentions 2 scenarios where it gets sneak attacks. The build has access and mentiones Scry + Teleport tactics which should earn a surprise round. The same can be said, when Ivy starts a battle during one of her dancing shows (Whirling weapon + Belt of Battle for Lolth's Caress activation). And with a buffed familiar, there is always the option to flank a target.

First I wanted to thank the judge for the quick and nice judging. And I also wanted to explain some of the issues with the build:

Power 3.5
starting score 3
• UMD 20 ranks with decent charisma is useful. I just don’t see the benefit of it over skills that IVT offers.
• 8 ranks of Search? why? -0,25
• levels 6-10: IVT isn’t a great fit for the build regarding power. When you are not hunting down your target of vengeance there is little you gain from the class. (see elegance)
levels 11-15:
• Natural bond: I don’t think it is worth the feat slot. Boosting your effective druid level from 2 to 6 seems not worth it at level 15. At level 6 this would be great. At level 9 okay, level 15 is too late to matter. -0,25

UMD offers the build a few nice things besides from the common use. First there is the mentioned Last Breath spell and the combos that it offers (with Ghostly Companion) for this build. Further, it gives access to the spells to unlock sneak attacks against normally immune targets (via wands, see magic items section). With UMD we can apply sneak attack damage to almost anything.

Search is a requirement for Unseen Seer and otherwise not really useful for the build/SI.

The SI offers the build (when not hunting down targets) sneak attack (which the build makes use of, see skill and spells) and the death attack. Further the poisons are always useful in combat. With the Poison Spell feat, we make good use of the SI abilities even on regular adventures.

Natural Bound comes up late in the build. But imho it is still a good combat boost. The fleshraker has more attacks per round to apply poison (share Poison Spell) and brings his own poison in addition. The Dex dmg poison has a good synergy with Shivering Touch (again Dex dmg) to render enemies quickly helpless. It can be used as mount or as separate flanking buddy.

Elegance 2,25
starting score 3
• Str should be 12 and not 10 (14 – 2 racial). -0,25
• Will save calculated wrongly at level 8: it was 8 before and suddenly is listed as 7. Final will save should be 2 higher. -0,25
• Skills:
• UMD is a class skill after the 5th level. So the level 6th sorcerer level UMD cross class is incorrect. You would have 2 ranks more -0,25
• Feats:
Spoiler: feat details
• Track: absolute waste of a feat for your build –0,25
• Draconic reservoir: why pick that up after track? It is way more useful than track.
• Unseen Seer: I hate to be that guy but why would you ever consider IVT over more levels of Unseen Seer? Monk 1 / Sorcerer 5 / Unseen Seer 10 / IVT 4 would give you level 9 spells. That’s easily better than anything IVT offers. It is just such a clear case of overshadowing the ingredient. -0,5

The Str value itself is correct with being 10, I got the racial modifier wrong (-4 !). I guess the error occurred while copying the values into the table. My bad.
Will saves are also my bad. I had made some last minute changes with lvl order and it seems I've failed to correct the values at some point..^^

UMD & substitution lvl. The skill is only a classskill for the substitution lvls as far as I know. It becomes a cross-class skill again on later levels. The main benefit here is the maximum amount of points you can have in the skill (max and not half) for the remaining levels.

Track is really a waste of a feat for the SI (because the SI's own abilities and spells overshadow track totally). But it is sadly a requirement for it. Thus I had to pick it before entering the SI. Imho Track is just a feat tax for the build, unless you can pull out some benefits that the SI abilities or spells can't do. I'm not aware of any useful options here.

You would choose IVT over Unseen Seer (US) because we get the divination abilities for free. For a sorcerer gish with limited spell choices reason enough to go for IVT. Further Poison Use can be very powerful in the hands of a gish as showcased in the build (and Sorcerers are feat starving most of the time, another reason for IVT). The Death Attack is the final reason why IVT 10 can be more appealing than US 10.
And taking the remaining lvls in the build for US is the best choice for the build. I don't see how my use of US overshadows the SI here? If I would have taken US to lvl 10 sure, but that is not the chase here. The build is also not focused to get 9th lvl spells (which would overshadow the SI). I don't see it justified that the few levels used here overshadow anything of the SI. It builds very well up on the SI base if you ask me.

UotSI 2
Starting score: not qualified 1
• failed to qualify: MS only 4 ranks; racial bonus gained from draganwrought does not help as it is a bonus, not actual ranks.
• Skills are a little all over the place Hide maxed out but only gets ranks after entering IVT, MS left at 4 ranks until level 8 and left at 5 until level 18. Survival left at 2 ranks. No bluff, 5 ranks of spot at level 10, 8 at level 11?, no listen
• Sneak attack: invisibility + greater invisibility, The animal companion is too weak to really matter as a flanking buddy

Move Silently: As mentioned above, I failed while rearranging the lvl for the build. My bad, the build could have easily qualified, but I failed as said..^^
Further, MS ain't that mandatory for the SI. Hide will/can be abused in combat (in combo with Nightmare Terrain). While MS does not help that much. Due to access to teleport and optionally becoming a ghost, MS becomes useless over time for the build.
Survival is a skill tax of the build which gets overshadowed by the SI abilities and access to spells.
Spot 8 is the requirement to enter US.
Listen is for suited for spies and not for assassin type characters like the SI. Thus there is no need for the build. Since we can skip almost everything with divination + teleport, scouting becomes almost useless. Why invest into listen for the SI at all? This is not a mundane scout like headhunter. The SI is a magical headhunter by default.

The Animal Companion (AC) can reliably flank (and hit due to "ghost touch - touch attacks") as soon as we can turn it into a Ghost. The defensive abilities of being a ghost will help even the standard AC to fulfill this role.

_____________

thx for your time and effort to judge.
and to everybody else, good luck (with the contest) and hf (reading the entries) ^^

Seward

2022-01-23, 12:01 PM

No disputes. And as others said, thanks for judging. I found it very consistent and fair between very diverse builds.

Wildstag

2022-01-23, 03:12 PM

Sounds like a concept for a few Junkyard Wars rounds.

Ah, but junkyard is gimmicky: do this and this but NOT this. An optimization challenge would explicitly be "use this and perfect it", plus viscount stated they'd prefer to double up 5-level prcs if they did use one as an SI.

Korahir

2022-01-24, 03:18 AM

Answering the two remiaing disputes:

LG Kossuth and Half Dow: I have to amit I didn't factor in Lolth's caress prerequisite.

Dragonblood Subtype: I think I already mentioned in my original judging that you cannot assume a dragon form via alter self if you are not of the dragon type. Dragonblood subtype does not change that. Thread with discussion on that topic:
https://forums.giantitp.com/archive/index.php/t-246548.html

Track and Survival: As you can imagine I wholeheartily disagree. I don't think suboptimal prerequisites are traps rather than stepping stones to be used in creative ways. Therefore everything a class offers is important and should be used not avoided.

Regarding feats: Spelldancer has a hefty feat tax. This is one of many reasons why I don't think it is a great fit for IVT. IVT has Track as a feat tax. Adding to that Doge, Mobility and Endurance and not using any of them to a significant degree seems pointless to me. If I had to do the feats with your build: I'd do: Track first to use the few ranks you have, then Improved Versatile Unarmed Strike and Endurance last.

All the other points: thanks for clearing them up. Some I agree, some I disagree but I have nothing signifcant to say about them.

Scoring Stands

Search: I shouldn't have deducted points twice for the same thing: Search 8 ranks is for Unseen Seer and I also deducted points for Unseen Seer in Elegance. Add +0,25 in power.

Track: I am really curious why you think Track is pointless. Scrying can fail, Divination may only give pointers and Clairvoyance is very specific. Reading tracks has alwas been very useful in any camapign I played in or managed as a DM up to level 15.

Unseen Seer: You are telling me that you value death attack (a completely unreliable hard to pull off class feature), divination sla and poison use (which can be gotten by anyone at level 1 via feat or choice of a base class) higher than nineth level spells. Sorry, that is ludicrous.

Also in an optimization contest working under the premise that there is a possibility to go to nineth level spells and to start on that path but not finisht it, is just not optimization. You mention in the dispute not once target of vengeance. That class feature is pretty much the only reason IVT exists. +11 on weapon damage, survival, hide, ms, bluff and sense motive is unique.

All the other points: thanks for clearing them up. Some I agree, some I disagree but I have nothing signifcant to say about them.

Seward

2022-01-24, 11:11 AM

That class feature is pretty much the only reason IVT exists. +11 on weapon damage, survival, hide, ms, bluff and sense motive is unique.

This is why the class grew on me. Other classes give similar benefits (such as Scar Enforcer, which gives favored enemy elves/humans and sneak attack and half progression of spellcasting) but unlike Scar Enforcer, whose unique thing is you end up with NO subtype (so no favored enemy, bane etc will ever work on you) the ToV actually adds up to something pretty exciting if assassination is your jam, and you can translate it into enough hits to matter. The other stuff - sneak attack, poison, death attack, SLAs - they're icing, well and also something that helps against everybody else you might fight that day. They're why your party doesn't throw you out I guess.

The Viscount

2022-01-24, 06:44 PM

We appreciate your speedy reply, Korahir!

And now, it's time for the reveal!

Name Alignment / Race Class Levels Chef Korahir Total Place
James (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332075&postcount=84) LE Human Human paragon 1/Sorcerer 1/Imaskari vengeance taker 10/Virtuoso 1/Sublime chord 1/Keeper of the cerulean sign 6 Zaq 17.25 17.25 1st Gold
Lord Ej of Adon (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332095&postcount=89) LE Otherworldly Talaire Ranger 4/Warblade 1/Mortal Hunter 5/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 WhamBamSam 15.50 15.50 2nd Silver
Alkathira (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332081&postcount=86) LN Synad Duskblade 5/Knight of The Weave 1/Abjurant Champion 4/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 H_H_F_F 14.75 14.75 3rd Bronze
Dril’jhael Vralice (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332068&postcount=82) LE Drider Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 loky1109 13.50 13.50 4th HM
Queen of Swords (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332066&postcount=81) LN Imaskari Wizard 5/Ruathar 1/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Master of The Unseen Hand 4 Seward 13.00 13.00 5th
Eddy + Cat (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332083&postcount=87) CN-LN Telthyrian Human Bard 1/Battle Dancer 1/Deadly Hunter Druid 1/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Lyric Thaumaturge 7 daremetoidareyou 12.25 12.25 6th
LuckLuck (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332071&postcount=83) LE Goblin Duskblade 10/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10 Seward 11.00 11.00 7th
Karakan (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332078&postcount=85) LE Dragonwrought Kobold Sorcerer 5/Monk 1/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Unseen Seer 4 Gruftzwerg 10.00 10.00 8th
Jane Wick (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332097&postcount=90) LE Human Beguiler 5/Mindbender 1/Beguiler 2/Unseen Seer 2/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 8/Fatespinner 2 NinjaGuy 9.75 9.75 9th
Ivy (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332093&postcount=88) LG Deepwyrm Half-Drow Monk 1/Combat Wizard 5/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Sacred Exorcist 1/Spelldancer 3 Gruftzwerg 9.25 9.25 10th
Valencia Hills-Beane (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=25332104&postcount=91) LE Human Beguiler 4/Imaskari Vengeance Taker 10/Fiend-Blooded 6 Venger 8.00 8.00 11th

Congratulations to our entrants!
Next round up shortly.

Seward

2022-01-24, 07:17 PM

I made a bit better showing this time, but no shame to losing out to those top entries. They were really good and fun. The truenamer one especially just fit the flavor so well.

Korahir had good comments on both of my builds. Here's more explanation for what was going on in my head when I created the characters (or not going on as the case might be).

My Complete Scoundrel was in a box from moving and I foolishly relied on a web page that didn't cite sources, which is why both builds used illegal skill tricks. Also I never really used them in play back in the day, so I lacked the "that's odd" detector I often have with feats/spells in that situation.

Only losing -.25 on my builds for illegal is a big step up from my last effort so..progress I guess.

In both builds, I couldn't do more than take it early and invest enough survival to make it minimally useful in baby levels. By the time skill ranks got invested seriously, it had expired in usefulness.

Queen of Swords rapidly outstrips it with spells, although she does invest in Survival (along with other ToV skills) later. It's just that by the time she is good at tracking her target, she's more likely to find his location with magic or infiltration.

Luckluck did his best, but until his ToV levels it wasn't a class skill, and he couldn't enter till L10 at earliest.
He gets decent at tracking a ToV by the end, but high level parties rarely need that ability.

To be clear, both characters DID develop survival once they got into IVT, it's just that there was a pretty big gap between level 1 and when it got effective again, and by then I was pushing L15 where it isn't as helpful.

I think to not get dinged on this front though, you needed to either get Track for free with a class that is also useful for your overall build, or use it as a prereq for something other than IVT or keep survival maxed in the 1-10 range or work in scent or similar (Luckluck spent max skill ranks but neg wis modifier and cross-class doesn't cut it). The judging had a fairly high bar here.

Both characters had low charisma. While both could make use of Divination even in high levels, there was no way to do either as a charisma build nor any way to get those SLAs faster without other abilities that matter more for power growth (like LuckLuck's 2nd quick spell, or Queen's MotUH progression)

You are 1 level short for a Sorcerer Unseen Seer/IVT build (between them they burn 14 levels, with half casting in IVT. With only 6 levels of sorcerer/ruathar you only get to CL9, not enough for sorcerer TK). Queen of Swords had to be wizard or had to give up an IVT level. Which worked better with a Deep Imaskari human anyway. Queen of Swords had clairvoyance at L5 and scry at L8. Only Divination was exciting for her to get later.

Luckluck could have been a race without a -4 charisma hit, but he still would have had at best 8 cha with any other likely race attempting this build. Only Duskblade advances TWF bab fast enough, and that's an int based class. Those SLAs were always gonna suck, although divination is nice.

All chasse choices have stuff that won't play well with SLA. MotUH and Duskblade weren't good fits for those abilities.

Queen of Swords got +.25 for using routine wizard spells (and high crafting skills from raw int) to make free poison. She also had a decent death attack DC.

Luckluck used both as "If I have it, it might help", and he didn't get dinged for not doing more.

But…really for both characters neither mattered. They could kill anything they could reach with a weapon purely with weapon damage. They'd use the class abilities in play, but only because it is belt-and-suspenders…basically free to do so why not?

6 Dexterity 16 con - That was an artifact of build evolution. I had an early version with 14 strength and 14 con for closer combat before whirling blade worked which had no room for higher dex, and never adjusted it, although partly I kinda liked the idea of a book-learning scholar who entered the underdark tripping over her robe. When I decided not much strength was needed those points dropped into con, as I'd already decided AC wasn't a focus (too many resources needed to make it work most of the time plus good ranged options) and she was going to use magic for any stealth needs. I agree that 10 dex/14 con would have been objectively better and didn't dispute getting power dinged for it. Given how many versions of the character I created before settling on the MotUH version, I'm surprised more weirdness didn't slip in.

Lack of Knowledge Devotion - I don't own Complete Champion (or Tome of Battle), so I am going to lose power points sometimes by not using those options. You'll never see a Warblade or a Devotion feat in my builds. I don't really mind that handicap. But Knowledge Devotion would have made a decent L18 feat, and if I'd invested all those skill points from slight of hand for a skill trick back into KN skills, it could have been .25 more powerful. The feat I took - Somatic Weaponry (or still spell+arcane thesis) was something every build I tried attempted to fit in during level 1-10, because it affects your ability to 2-hand a whirling blade, so when I had a random feat left over and metamagic rods clogging up my hands it seemed like an ok finisher.

I thought 3.5 power overall was pretty fair for this build, given that our baseline is something like a generic wiz10/IVT10 with 8th level arcane spells at L20. I actually know pretty precisely what I gave up, as I played a telekenetic themed sorceress from L1-L16 without MotUH, who used TK violent thrust as her primary "screw finesse I just need to kill that guy" strategy from L10 onward.

The higher level slots and metamagic let you do quite a bit (sculpted cyclonic blasts to eliminate fog, control weather to just prevent fog or high winds, spamming disintegrate to make corridors bypassing trap/ambush filled entrances, not to mention moment of prescience and limited wish). But in terms of killing power, Queen of Swords at level 16 eclipsed a "wizard 15 spell slots using TK" baseline, MotUH4 is just that good, and vs a ToV, she eclipsed my sorceress for the entire L10-20 range. I actually looked hard at going into MotUH on the sorceress but she cared more about battlefield control, action economy management for the party and arcane utility vs just killing jerks using TK. When she actually used the TK seriously against anything but a final boss type monster, overkill was typical even without MotUH boosts (and the final boss types knew they'd been kissed...)

Skills - I spent a lot of time actually figuring out how to develop the "Favored Enemy" suite of skills, as it would help her locate her ToV for long range attacks and with glibness-level bluff vs that target open other options. Spot, Listen and Sense Motive are also helpful for noticing when your ToV has decided to ambush YOU, and she saw value in that when she started assassin training.

I was a little disappointed that wasn't mentioned until I realized after reading other entries not getting dinged for lack of skill use WAS acknowledging that I was trying on that front. I just didn't do anything amazing enough to rate a bonus.

Spells - I mentioned the stuff she always uses. She's a wizard assassin. Everything else would be target and to some extent party dependent. She'd think about what spells to prep when doing that 24 hour ToV assignment.

Basically her Focused Specialist slots tended to be TK related stuff - minimum 3 TK spells in L5, 2 quickened whirling blades and one twinned whirling blade in L4 slots, L3 slots GMW and maybe keen weaon or flame arrow or similar, L2 slots more whirling blades. Probably 1 guided shot spell, 1 dimension hop or similar escape spell but mostly what does party need? What are we doing today? Leave a couple open just in case. What did the party need that day?

As quicken rods come online she'll routinely prep "remove obstacle" or "move me to a better angle" spells that she can quicken to set up attacks.

Craft Rod. I really, really, REALLY wanted the L16-20 version to be able to quicken a violent thrust and follow up with another violent thrust. I could not make it work, the spell slots just aren't there in a MotUH4+IVT10 build and I didn't like my other approaches without MotUH4 (I almost went with magical trickster to show how far down the barrel I was scraping). That left WBL approaches and I had some flexibility with my higher level feats. So I figured the only way to really claim I could have a full quicken rod as a routine strategy was to craft it myself, especially as I had the quicken feat already to support whirling blade. For this challenge I figured any truly required item probably needs crafting feat support, so I went there.

A side benefit of this is she can quicken other stuff and THEN violent thrust. 1 Violent Thrust kills damn near anything in those levels anyway, so yeah, quicken teleport+VT is a thing, as would be defeating, say, a solid fog defense via a quickened wind spell to clear it away followed by violent thrust, or at L20 beating a wall of force via quicken disintegrate+violent thrust.

I knew this wasn't going to score amazingly and am satisfied with the middling score. It isn't blazingly original or amazingly powerful. I was trying for a 12 (basically solid in each category) but between the illegal skill trick and a couple optimization bobbles, his final score was fine. Maybe my next one in this category will hit the mark.

It was an effective build, and one that could handle martial+arcane utility well at any table. Even as a goblin. I'd totally enjoy him. I was bored and snowed in, and the flavor text was so much fun to write that doing the work for the build seemed worthwhile.

Race - best options for charop would likely have been wood elf (+2 str/dex and int/con can be worked around) or maybe strongheart halfling with feat spent on weapon finesse. -.25 was fair there. I gave in and wrote up the goblin because I had fun fluff/story for it and absolutely no sense of who the character was with another race. It happens.

Honestly though, the -4 cha only dropped the SLA DC by 1 or 2, and in fact this character hits nearly as accurately as a wood elf (due to size) does only 2 points less with on-hand, 1 point less offhand, and dex/str are close enough weapon finesse just isn't worth it. With fullbab and eventually arcane strike, hitting his targets isn't going to be a problem, and like any good TWF build, strength damage is an afterthought to his total damage. And of course int and con are higher than wood elf, which compensates a bit on a close range build. It's similar to choosing a half-elf instead of half-orc for a barbarian build.

Final spell - ok Acid Arrow wasn't the best choice. Enervation or any other short range spell (including shout, which I never find useful on any build) isn't any better than just running up and channelling+arcane striking something. Toxic Weapon was on point enough so I didn't dispute the -.25, especially as some of the other spells were probably charop borderline, fitting his style and history closer than a platonic ideal-duskblade-twf guy. Since LuckLuck poisoned his weapons before a kill, he should have also wanted to use a spell to do the same. He's fishing for natural 1s at level 20, but if he cast toxic weapon on both weapons and poisoned both weapons and maybe got a death attack set up, he'd have 5 chances to fish for that 1 on his first two hits. I looked at Toxic Weapon and went "meh, they save on a 1, and it only works for 1 attack", but that's true of any poison he uses so, I should have stayed consistent.

Why Acid Arrow? I just ran out of spells that seemed at all useful and looked for something he couldn't do, and realized vs anticipate teleport he'd be relying only on raw stealth to walk right up to his target, and wanted a better long range choice for enemies with few enough hp for it to work. I should have trusted his raw stealth more, he really was quite good at that by level 20.

One goal of this character was to use the skills Queen Of Swords tanked, and it worked for him. Like her, he got a +0 on skill use - adequate but not amazing. As he lacked her long range power, his ability to stealth and get in close to set up his blender attack was quite important. It was also the one thing his race helped with (+4 hide for size, +4 racial move silent for stealth, which is why he was in the running enough to get in my head and come to life).

loky1109

2022-01-24, 08:13 PM

O! I take HM!
Thanks very much!

And thanks to all contestants and to our judge Korahir!

It not bad, but... You could do it much better with one little change.
You should change genders of your hero and the hero's main enemy.
Drow female who messing with half-blood male, sales him in slaves, kills his friends? I say yes, it is believable, even more, it's typically, normal. Same things made by drow male with even half-drow female? No, it can't be.

Maybe I wrong in understanding drow, but it's my point of view.

Zaq, WhamBamSam, H_H_F_F. I'm not surprised to see you at the top.

H_H_F_F

2022-01-25, 12:55 AM

Can't complain about bronze. Congratulations, everyone! Well deserved, Whambamsam. Zaq... stop it already.

I have some thoughts I'll share later when I'm not on mobile, as well as update the spreadsheet

Akal Saris

2022-01-25, 09:06 PM

Congrats to everyone for some great builds, and a tip of the hat to Loky for the clever use of drider as an entry!

loky1109

2022-01-25, 10:48 PM

Congrats to everyone for some great builds, and a tip of the hat to Loky for the clever use of drider as an entry!

Thanks! Trying to do my best!

H_H_F_F

2022-01-26, 06:41 AM

Yesterday was a very busy day, but now I have the time to properly comment. Also looking forward to a D&D weekend IRL.

So: Very good round! Zaq amazed me as usual with James, which I thought was phenomenally clever. Seeing a drider was fun, and lord Ej was a cool, smooth entry. I really liked Eddy+Cat as well – but it didn't blow my mind, which I was pleased with, because it's nice to be reminded daremetoidareyou is human too.

As for my entry: I was questioned for not leaning into any of the skills the class had to offer. The build did have an earlier version which invested in survival, and hide. But over time I just got more and more stubborn, and changed it. The reason? I wanted to make an entry that would have absolutely no reason to prefer unseen seer to the SI, as much as possible. I built a gish. I wanted to lean on the bonus damage, and utilize sneak attack as a source of debuffs, not damage unto itself (so the lower final amount wouldn't matter.) I wanted to be really into poison, I wanted to use the SLAs, and I wanted to finish my entire spell progression. I feel like I've been successful in this goal – Imaskari Vengeance Taker is, IMO, undoubtedly better for Alkathira than unseen seer. That was what I was going for, and I'm happy with it.

Almost immediately after the reveal, I realized I made a great error about abjurant champion: martial arcanist doesn’t work on the same class you advance, it works on any one arcane class you have. This means that with 16 BaB and practiced spellcaster, martial arcanist can give you 20 CL as a duskblade with only 5 levels, which stacks with knight of the weave – and as I've shown, KoTW has a few spells that really enjoy a high CL. So, I've since come up with a couple of really fun and unusual mid-op gish builds with very high CL based on this combination.

The first is Duskblade 5, KoTW 1, Abjurant Champ 5, Green Star Adept 9.
This build ends up with 16 BaB, full KoTW casting, all the fun advantages of GSA without the devastating last level, and a CL of 35 (39, if you're interpreting GSA in the generous way, which I think is wrong as the example clearly shows.) It's playable as a gish throughout. You can replace the last level with a Master of Masks dip for a CL of 36 instead with the archmage mask, but this build as presented is playable and very straightforward, so adding dipping at the end may be frowned upon by a DM.

Obviously, you could make it stronger by taking a level spelldancer and do some persistomancy (especially since you're immune to fatigue) but this is meant to be a practical optimization build for mid op tables that has a fun ace up their sleeve with their very high CL. If what you want is shenanigans, master spellthief and sublime chord are about one kilometer straight and to your left.

A big strength of this build is having all but 1 (practiced spellcaster) of its feats free to be combat feats, a bloodline feat, or anything else you fancy. It takes 3 prcs, 2 of which require a feat you gain as a bonus and 1 requiring no feats.

It also only uses phb2, champions of valor and the completes, so it may be usable in many tables where many sources or ToB are frowned upon (and therefore, low to mid op more likely.) It's really strengthened by access to dragon compendium for bloodline feats, though.

Build 2 uses more sources and more resources, and uses a stricter alignment as it is an exalted build. It ends up with a lower CL, but advances faster and has more options and more fun flavor. The "canon" version of it uses Legacy Champion, assuming your DM is a decent person that would be willing to design a weapon of legacy that isn't absolutely trash. It's also doable without it.

First 11 levels are the same – duskblade 5, KoTW 1, Abjurant Champion 5. Then, you go for Exalted arcanist 2/ legacy champion 4. Last 3 levels can still be GSA, or anything else pretty much.

The non-legacy version just takes exalted arcanist 5, and the last four levels just have to be full BaB – Paladin 4 is nice on a Cha build if you take a devotion feat, or you could go for warblade and JPM, but those kind of have their own identity.

This build has lower CL and feels less martial overall, but it gets spells somewhat faster, has more spells, and has access to greater luminous armor, which is really good for abjurant champions.

Overall, I find both builds to be fun and playable in mid op games. They can pull a few neat tricks, and the first one especially has a lot of room for customization with feats.

Seward

2022-01-26, 10:53 AM

H_H_F_F

2022-01-26, 11:14 AM

When I saw Alkathira, I thought "That's who LuckLuck wishes he was". Abjurant Champion was banned so it was off my radar, although, my goblin needed his 2 quick-casts enough he woudln't have dipped anyway. I can see why it is a go-to for gish, but the use of Knight of the Weave and all that followed was just really interesting. Maybe she's the one who invited him to join...

I'm glad you liked her, Seward. I was happy to see someone else went for straight-up gish. I thought I'd be the only one to really notice and utilize the BaB and damage bonus, when everything else tried to scream "sneak-caster"

Edit: what do you mean by Abjurant Champion being banned? Did I miss something?

H_H_F_F

2022-01-26, 02:49 PM

And... the spreadsheet is fully updated.

Thank you to everyone for participating! Thank you, Korahir, for judging! And as always, thank you to our beloved chair, the Viscount! Chairman Viscount gives us a happy life. Follow Chairman Viscount forever. The sunlight of Viscount thought illuminates the road of the great optimizing 3.5 revolution. The hearts of the sons and daughters of GiTP go out to Chairman Viscount. Advance victoriously while following Chairman Viscount's revolutionary line in optimizing and fluff. Forging ahead courageously while following the great leader Chairman Viscount. Respectfully wish Chairman Viscount eternal life!

Seward

2022-01-26, 08:19 PM

Edit: what do you mean by Abjurant Champion being banned? Did I miss something?

I played 3.0 and 3.5 in several campaigns in the 2000-2008 timeframe before shifting to Pathfinder. In the only campaign that allowed a fair amount of splatbook material that PRC was explicitly banned.

It's a hole in my optimization. I got more books and stuff than we were allowed to play, but I have to educate myself on the stuff that I wasn't allowed to use, plus the gaps from books I don't own. I'm aware of a fair amount from web resources and just conversations on boards like this of stuff I never used, but it isn't in the top of my mind when making a build, and only when my usual favorites aren't working do I tend to dig deeper. It is made worse by not playing 3.5 for a decade and having my mind cluttered with Pathfinder stuff. (as an example, I described a combo in my Queen Swords fluff text that only works with Pathfinder Deeper Darkness and 3.5 Ebon Eyes. It's helpful with 3.5 Deeper Darkness...it's concealment you can see through, so you get a miss chance and immunity to sneak attack and similar but it isn't anything like how much sleet-storm-like blackout can cause). I noticed my error about a week after I submitted the character and fortunately the judge didn't think it was important....also the character was arrogant enough she could describe a minor helpful tactic as paradigm changing so it might have been chalked up as bravado.

I saw this PRC and immediately noticed the damage potential and never strayed from a gish concept, one ranged, one melee. I had a harder time doing much with sneak attack and poison, both tactics I've never been that fond of and if I was going down that road, I'd want to build with classes that give more than 4d6 of sneak attack in 10 levels. (I'm the kind who would cherry pick each class and prc that gives it in level 1, then start adding those that add in level 2 to get enough sneak to make it worth losing it. Especially since Craven isn't a feat I really feel right using, as I never owned that book). As for poison it's hard to take seriously in a 20 level build. The DCs are low enough anything over 10th level will mostly save if they aren't naturally immune, and if they are weak for some reason they are a slow poison or hero's feast away from being essentially immune. I must admit some of the entries did some pretty clever thing with poison, I just wonder in real life if they kept running into "Ok, the ToV is a demon. Oh well, no poison."

Venger

2022-01-26, 08:48 PM

Thanks for updating the spreadsheet.

Zaq

2022-01-27, 05:44 PM

I'm so glad that everyone liked my build! Displaying a new early entry trick is always a little dicey because no matter how ironclad the RAW is, if the judge doesn't like it then the judge doesn't like it, so I feel like I got lucky there.

Although it's not always possible, I feel like one of my guiding principles when building for IC is "why do I NEED to be the secret ingredient? What can I do because I'm the secret ingredient that I couldn't do otherwise?" And although this class didn't really have too many genuinely unique features that would let me answer that question, the premise of the class—spending a long time prepping in order to hate on one specific dude at a time—opened up the possibility of the nearly unused truename spells. (Also the fact that knowing the target's "name" is one of the ways you can swear vengeance on them is what got my mind working in that direction in the first place, but that's why I STAYED there, at least.) So I guess it's more about what I COULDN'T do if I weren't in the SI than about what I WOULDN'T do if I weren't in the SI.

Not gonna lie, I almost gave up because the truename spells are, overall, really bad even if you have the target's personal truename. They're just lacking in oomph. But as a sorcerer-style caster with limited spells known, I didn't have to optimize every single one of them: I could pick and choose. And as I explained, the lure of unname was too great to ignore, since I genuinely believe that no character has actually ever cast unname in the history of 3.5. It's so unwieldy and not worth it. But it fit the fluff like a glove, so I had to try!

I genuinely do not think I could have handled the monstrosity that was James's skills if I were going in unaided. mattie_p, your spreadsheet is killer and I love it. Every time I use it I'm grateful anew for it.

Korahir, the poems were limericks! I had to get a little loose with the meter, but they're a fun form of lighthearted verse in English. I needed a Perform skill to qualify for virtuoso and sublime chord, but I never intended for James to actually roll Perform, so I could pick whatever the hell I wanted. Taking Perform (Limerick) gave me an excuse to not write a standard fluff block, and I think that helped my thought process!

Gruftzwerg

2022-01-30, 09:03 AM

I wanted to congratulate the winners too. I was sick the past days and thus the late response.

My personal favorite remains the Drider entry.

loky1109

2022-01-30, 09:22 AM

Wish you good health.

My personal favorite remains the Drider entry.
I'm much glad to hear that.

daremetoidareyo

2022-01-30, 11:06 AM

HM goes to the drider