[DDS] [Spheres] Ultimate Engineering Playtest and Kickstarter

[Mister Rex]

Hello everyone and welcome to one of the largest playtests I have the honor to help run.

The New
Drop Dead Studios is launching their last two large-scale projects with a kickstarter for Spheres of Guile, a new skill-based system for the "spheres" system and completing the trio of might, magic, and now utility, as well as Ultimate Technology, a massive rework of the Tech sphere to be less designed from Paizo's technology guide. This means the Ultimate Technology and the Tinker sphere have been built totally from the ground up! A link to the kickstarter can be found here (https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/adammeyers/spheres-of-guile-and-ultimate-engineering).

If you are new to Spheres and don't know what the fuss is about, Spheres of Might and Spheres of Power are two of the largest and best-supported third party subsystems for Pathfinder 1e, focusing on a "talent tree" style progression allowing for the greatest amount of customization. We have a wiki which is upkept by a good friend and fellow author, which can be found here to learn more about what Spheres is (http://spheresofpower.wikidot.com/).

The Playtest
Ultimate Engineering is a massive, sprawling playtest with a new alternate class to the original Spheres of Might technician called the "Inventor", plus the entire new sphere I mentioned.

Ultimate Engineering can be found with this link to a google folder, containing documents separated by chapter (https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1CBWEkEaNUoDYGvM22CAmCG2Z0miUP_Z_?usp=sharing).

The running changelog of Ultimate Engineering since its launch into playtest (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1PA2RHDFb7xxZmeNVgH2XiyCgCXwGoyzZwHdEwcjtG2I/edit?usp=sharing) on the 13th is being documented here.

We have an active playtest community you can join via. Drop Dead Studios discord. Due to the size of this playtest, I am focusing on comments on the documents itself, but will try to be active here to answer questions.

I'm looking forward to your help, and hope you all find something worthy of your next grand inventing spree.

[SangoProduction]

Is there a reason why this is distinct from the Tech sphere?
Not to be rude, it just seems incredibly similar in many ways.
Or is this meant to be an update to Tech sphere to perhaps make it more digestible?

[Kitsuneymg]

Is there a reason why this is distinct from the Tech sphere?
Not to be rude, it just seems incredibly similar in many ways.
Or is this meant to be an update to Tech sphere to perhaps make it more digestible?

KS says it’s a replacement.


Personally, I wish the UE and SoG were separate products. I want SoG. I don’t want yet another way to add unwanted tech to my fantasy game. It’s just another piece of content for my “no” list. Sphere of Guile though? Gimme.

[Seerow]

Is there a reason why this is distinct from the Tech sphere?
Not to be rude, it just seems incredibly similar in many ways.
Or is this meant to be an update to Tech sphere to perhaps make it more digestible?

After having this discussion with them a few times on the discord..... Tech Sphere was designed to be compatible with Pathfinder Tech stuff, which caused a bunch of balance problems.

So Tech Sphere and Technician are staying in and untouched for those who like it (so this isn't considered an Errata of Tech), but they're making this new Tinker Sphere/Inventor Class to cover basically the same ground, but in a more generic way without having to hold to the design space that Pathfinder Technology stuff used. Ideally it should end up a bit more internally consistent and easier to use.


Having been pushing my way through the playtest docs the last few days.... I do not think it is quite there yet. In a lot of ways it feels every bit as bloated and unwieldy as Tech did. It is definitely different, and I do enjoy a lot of the customizability it grants (I love that most talents give like 5+ new options to play with), but my main concern with it is that at a fundamental level it is a ton of information that needs to be all absorbed simultaneously to be usable. I don't know how many people are going to invest enough to do that.


Personally, I wish the UE and SoG were separate products. I want SoG. I don’t want yet another way to add unwanted tech to my fantasy game. It’s just another piece of content for my “no” list. Sphere of Guile though? Gimme.

There's also this. While I am pretty sure UE and SoG are going to be separate products, tying them both to the same kickstarter seems like it's basically using the expected popularity of SoG to prop up UE. But then, looking at the current pledges, most people pledging seem to be going for both books, so maybe the demand isn't as lopsided as I'd have expected.

[Mister Rex]

Is there a reason why this is distinct from the Tech sphere?
Not to be rude, it just seems incredibly similar in many ways.
Or is this meant to be an update to Tech sphere to perhaps make it more digestible?

It's not rude at all. The Tinker sphere is meant to detach from Paizo's tech (mainly the charge system, but also rebalance a lot of the original tech options to be less "magic with another coat of paint" on it. I.E. less "gain +2 enhancement to strength as a gadget" and more "this gadget gives you a bonus on these types of checks". A very consistent complaint with the current Tech sphere is how many things are either all day replacements to certain magic, or magic items, or are confusing.


Personally, I wish the UE and SoG were separate products. I want SoG. I don’t want yet another way to add unwanted tech to my fantasy game. It’s just another piece of content for my “no” list. Sphere of Guile though? Gimme.

Sorry to hear that. There has been a herculean amount of effort to try to make this option not be too tech heavy and give as many possible GM-forward avenues to inventorship fitting a setting, such as GM-forward "tinker traditions" to determine tech level (such as no signal-based technoology in a DaVinci or "Coalpunk" style setting).


After having this discussion with them a few times on the discord..... Tech Sphere was designed to be compatible with Pathfinder Tech stuff, which caused a bunch of balance problems.
It sure does.


Having been pushing my way through the playtest docs the last few days.... I do not think it is quite there yet. In a lot of ways it feels every bit as bloated and unwieldy as Tech did. It is definitely different, and I do enjoy a lot of the customizability it grants (I love that most talents give like 5+ new options to play with), but my main concern with it is that at a fundamental level it is a ton of information that needs to be all absorbed simultaneously to be usable. I don't know how many people are going to invest enough to do that.

As we talked on discord, if you find something where the wording feels bloated, leave a comment and help me fix it. As for players that "won't be able to use it because its too many words", yup. Those people will be marginalized because if you want "realistic, in depth tech options", it comes at the cost of needing to explain that the tech weapon cord does X, has X distance of cord, is retrieved as Y action, can't be retrieved if attended, and if the cord is broken the gizmo is broken. Because if I don't say all of that, people will ask and have proven that they will ask.

Regardless, that's why this is a playtest. I'm trying to put the effort, elbow grease, and legwork in to clean things up, make it easier to read, and make it easier to parse. I apologize if the playtest isn't up to expectations.

[EldritchWeaver]

Personally, I wish the UE and SoG were separate products. I want SoG. I don’t want yet another way to add unwanted tech to my fantasy game. It’s just another piece of content for my “no” list. Sphere of Guile though? Gimme.

The books are separate. You can back the kickstarter and only pay for SoG book(s). The crossover content to SoG for UE would be part of the UE pagecount (assuming stretchgoals are met).

[Kitsuneymg]

The books are separate. You can back the kickstarter and only pay for SoG book(s). The crossover content to SoG for UE would be part of the UE pagecount (assuming stretchgoals are met).

You can’t actually avoid paying for UE. It’s a single Kickstarter for both. You can choose a reward level that only gets you the SoG pdf/books, but you absolutely can’t control what product “your” money goes towards. Cause once you give it to them, it ain’t yours.

I doubt a tech only Kickstarter would have been nearly as successful. Which is of course why they glue it to a product a lot of people have been clamoring for.

[EldritchWeaver]

I doubt a tech only Kickstarter would have been nearly as successful. Which is of course why they glue it to a product a lot of people have been clamoring for.

Not sure on if UE would have been not as successful, considering the vast majority backed the project for both books.


You can’t actually avoid paying for UE. It’s a single Kickstarter for both. You can choose a reward level that only gets you the SoG pdf/books, but you absolutely can’t control what product “your” money goes towards. Cause once you give it to them, it ain’t yours.

True, each book and stretchgoal will have its piece of the budget assigned from the big pile of cash. So one can't say that the dollars they spent on flow only to the parts they are interested in. And I don't see how assigning UE or SoG exclusive dollars to these budgets only influence the end result - it just means that the non-specific money is shifted around. But does that actually matter, if these parts are made? You paid after all just for the books you will have in your possession. (And in all likelihood, even if you buy the book only after kickstarter, some money will end up in SoG-unrelated matters anyway at some point (once all expenditures have been made). Demanding otherwise isn't how business works, considering there has never been a promise to do it like that in the first place for whatever release. Not from DDS or any other RPG company I'm aware of.)

In the end, if you do participate in kickstarter and use the appropriate pledges, DDS can decide on which stretchgoals to prioritize. And have at least a chance that this material is being written. PF1 isn't actively supported by Paizo anymore. So the big question is if SoG books are going to be made afterwards in the first place after the fulfillment of the kickstarter. And if you want to see a USoM then a highly successful kickstarter increases the chance for that, too.