Magic Nullifying Shackles - Wondrous Item

[JohnDaBarr]

How good/bad would this magic item be?

Capturing magical users alive is hard enough but keeping them captive is almost impossible and usually resorts with outright hand chopping and tongue removing from all sides, so in order to keep things civilized I usually introduce something like this in my campaigns. If needed a Very Rare type of Magic Nullifying Shackles exists to cover spells up to level six spells.


Magic Nullifying Shackles
Wondrous Item - Rare

You can use an action to place these shackles on an incapacitated creature. The shackles adjust to fit a creature of Small to Large size. In addition to serving as mundane manacles, the shackles prevent a creature bound by them from casting spells of first, second and third level. Shackles do not prevent the creature bound by them from suffering effects of spells cast by others.

Escaping the shackles requires a successful DC 25 Acrobatics check. Breaking them requires a successful DC 25 Athletics check. Each set of shackles comes with one key. Without the key, a creature proficient with Thieves' Tools can pick the shackles lock with a successful DC 20 check. Shackles have 15 Hit Points.

[Chronos]

Calling them "rare" doesn't really mean much. What you really need to know is what groups have access to them? Is this something that every town with a town watch has a pair of, or only the big cities? How many pairs would Waterdeep have available, and how many can be expected to already be in use? Would a ragtag group of bandits be able to use them? How about the Zhentarim? At some level, of course, the answer is "whatever the plot requires": If you want an imprisoned spellcaster, then the group who imprisoned them has a pair. But your players will expect that if a group has this magic item, they're likely to have other magic items as well.

Also, I see what you were getting at in limiting them by spell level: They can completely shut down a low-level spellcaster, but a mighty wizard can still overcome them. But the net effect is that that wizard, in the shackles, can cast her most powerful spells without restriction, but can't cast her simplest ones, which feels a bit off. I suppose that you could have them decrease the effective level of spell slots, so you need a 6th level slot to cast 3rd level spells, or a 7th slot to cast 4ths, and so on, but that might get too complicated.

[JohnDaBarr]

They would be available for most larger organizations/states/cities. A small town somewhere would not have these but a city like Waterdeep would have a dozen.

The idea is to scale them by power. The basic ones just cover first three levels which is enough for third casters and half casters, a stronger version would covers everything up to six spell level and after that an artifact level one that cover all except level nine spells.

[Asmotherion]

I'm pretty sure it exists in 3.5e. Just can't confirm the source... probably Magic Item Compendium?

I mean, it wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility to be implemented in 5e

[JohnDaBarr]

I'm pretty sure it exists in 3.5e. Just can't confirm the source... probably Magic Item Compendium?

I mean, it wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility to be implemented in 5e

I believe 3.5ed only had Shackles of Silence and Dimensional Shackles.

[Asmotherion]

I believe 3.5ed only had Shackles of Silence and Dimensional Shackles.
found them. Book of Exalted Deeds, page 116

[Unoriginal]

How good/bad would this magic item be?

Capturing magical users alive is hard enough but keeping them captive is almost impossible and usually resorts with outright hand chopping and tongue removing from all sides

This is not correct. 5e casters are much too limited in their powers for them to be almost impossible to keep them captive or to require mutilation.

A gag, a blindfold and regular shackles preventing them from moving their fingers neutralise nearly all of a caster's powers. Only Subtle metamages and to a lesser extent Forge clerics wild shape capable druids are hard to keep captive.

[JohnDaBarr]

This is not correct. 5e casters are much too limited in their powers for them to be almost impossible to keep them captive or to require mutilation.

A gag, a blindfold and regular shackles preventing them from moving their fingers neutralise nearly all of a caster's powers. Only Subtle metamages and to a lesser extent Forge clerics wild shape capable druids are hard to keep captive.

Sure that works, but my point was not to torture people... and keeping someone gagged, blindfolded and immobile for more than a day is by definition torture.

[Slipjig]

Maybe change it so that a caster doesn't have access to the top three levels of spells to which they have access? So if the prisoner can cast 6th-level spells, it shuts down 4-6th level casting, but still leaves then access to levels 1-3 (or level 1-3 spells that could be cast while shackled).

That still shuts down low-level and partial casters, and significantly hinders higher-level casters without shutting them down completely.

I'd also change the description so that they could be applied to an incapacitated or willing subject.

Did you also want it to be possible to apply them to a grappled opponent? Shackling a resisting opponent would be difficult, so maybe it requires an attack roll with disadvantage, and each wrist requires a successful attack.

[Unoriginal]

Sure that works, but my point was not to torture people... and keeping someone gagged, blindfolded and immobile for more than a day is by definition torture.

Keeping someone in shackles isn't, by the same definition?

If you want a magic item to limit or prevent casting, it could easily be a ring cursed so that it can't be removed except by those with the proper authority, for example. Or a circlet, armlet, etc.

[JohnDaBarr]

Maybe change it so that a caster doesn't have access to the top three levels of spells to which they have access? So if the prisoner can cast 6th-level spells, it shuts down 4-6th level casting, but still leaves then access to levels 1-3 (or level 1-3 spells that could be cast while shackled).

That still shuts down low-level and partial casters, and significantly hinders higher-level casters without shutting them down completely.

I'd also change the description so that they could be applied to an incapacitated or willing subject.

Did you also want it to be possible to apply them to a grappled opponent? Shackling a resisting opponent would be difficult, so maybe it requires an attack roll with disadvantage, and each wrist requires a successful attack.

Couple of interesting suggestions, thx. Still allowing most caster just access to few second level spells basically means they will escape. On the other hand adding language for shackling a resisting opponent could be prudent. Additional grapple athletics check should do the trick.



Keeping someone in shackles isn't, by the same definition?

If you want a magic item to limit or prevent casting, it could easily be a ring cursed so that it can't be removed except by those with the proper authority, for example. Or a circlet, armlet, etc.

It is debatable but shackles at least allow for some limited freedom of moment while also inhibiting mundane ways of escape. Simply holding a caster in perpetual darkness, gagged and immobilized is not only morally questionable but is also logistical nightmare (assuming the prisoner isn't undead). Because they have biological functions and assuming you don't want them dying from exposure or hunger you will have to let them have some freedom and that a logistical nightmare if you want to clap down on potential magic use.

And having a cursed magic inhibiting ring (or similar) still means that you would still want to put a pair of mundane shackles on your prisoner just in case.

[qube]

I'd do something in the lines of

Casting a spell with a somatic component requires a DC 25 arcana(dexterity) check. Failure means the spellslot is used, but the spell isn't cast.

I'd still post a guard with said wizard (or any other dangerous advent...*cough* criminal); as a wizard shouldn't attempt to cast spells in the first place. Just like a barbarian shouldn't try to bend the bars.

[tKUUNK]

In a world with fairly common magic, and people who use it for unlawful purposes, yes, this would be a thing.

Gagging a spellcaster to prevent casting might work fine until you want to ask your prisoner a question....what to do then? Take off their gag? Spell gets cast. Ask them to play charades? Spell gets cast.

I realize Antimagic Field is a high level spell, but if I'm building a world with considerable magic, there will be other ways to achieve the effect: ritual magic, artifacts, or maybe even some sort of magic-absorbing gem / mineral. These manacles and possibly entire prisons with antimagic fields would exist. Paddy wagons (and merchants' wagons to help prevent magical theft) with antimagic may exist also.

The way you wrote the shackles up to kick off this thread is perfect IMO.

[Kol Korran]

There was a series of books (I think it was "Wizard's First Law?") Which introduced a similar concept- A collar, that prevents any spellcasting/ magic abilities by the wearer. It could only be opened by those with the knowledge (Or the appropriate magic tool). Might make it easier from the logistics side. You can take the caster with you as a travel companion, with far less worry about logistics.

The collar, while less limiting physically than shackles, provokes... different mental/ social connotations...

[Waterdeep Merch]

Maybe explain it as an anti-magic material instead of a magic item? They're common in a lot of other fictions, and has some interesting implications for world building, could even be used as a defensive item by a martial character that feels like gambling on not receiving magical healing. The collar idea works here, as would locked bracers. Maybe even a sealed mask to conceal the powers and identity of a famed wizard?

[False God]

I don't see any problem, at the end of the day, what you're making is a reasonable McGuffin to shut down casters. It can be used for and against the players.

The idea that there are more powerful versions for higher spell levels (which might be rarer) is also a good limitation. Leaves good room for reasonable judgement errors or simple failures to check how powerful a caster is before shackling them. Also a good way to grade the relative capabilities of a city or town or specific agent.

Some unassuming guy pulls out a pair of "You don't do magic no matter what spell level." version of these? You know you're dealing with the Feds.

[Angelalex242]

And not just the Feds, the Feds of a BIG city. Like, even Waterdeep is only gonna have one or two copies of that.

Heh. There's probably stories about the time Waterdeep tried to put those on Halister (Mad Mage).

I leave it to your creativity to guess how THAT ended...

[Sorinth]

Why not just allow for disrupting spellcasting outside of combat. So the spellcaster starts chanting and the guard standing next to the prisoner punches the spellcaster in the gut causing the Verbal component to fail. The rules in combat already don't follow the rules outside of combat so I wouldn't get too hung up on needing precise rules, if something makes sense then it should work.

[Witty Username]

I would use the shackles in the dmg, planner or dimensional shackles, the ones that prevent teleportation as a starting point.
Antimagic shackles is a great idea for high level people to have access to, 8th level spellcasting required. Like kings have one or two for special cases.