Advice for a 12th level Forge Cleric

[CTurbo]

I have a buddy playing in a campaign where until now, they were not allowed to multiclass, but now can if they want. The DM does not use XP but instead levels the characters up at milestones. They level up more quickly and expect to reach level 20 by the end of summer. The DM says they will likely top out at level 21 in which the only things gained at that level are more hit points and a bonus feat/ASI. He's considering allowing 1 ability score to max at 22 instead of 20, but only at level 21. The BBEGs are a mated pair of Ancient Red Dragons with some red dragon children they're hunting down.

The rest of the party is

Tabaxi GWM Totem Barb 12(Bear, Eagle, Eagle) who really wants Barb 20, but also really wants 3 levels of Champion.
Wood Elf Sharpshooting Gloom Stalker 12 with Skulker who will probably go Rogue and not look back.
Tiefling Abjurer Wizard 12 that will probably take a small dip in Warlock at some point, but otherwise wants at least Wiz 18 for sure.
Fallen Aasimar Conquest Paladin 12 that definitely wants Paladin 20.

And then there is the Hill Dwarf Forge Cleric.

16 Str, 14 Dex, 20 Con, 13 Int, 20 Wis, 9 Cha

HAM(+1 Str) at level 1
Res(Con) at level 4
Dwarven Fortitude(+1 Con) at level 8
+2 Wis at level 12

The character is apparently a "beast" and is very good at being a Cleric and doing Cleric things, but he's a bit bored with it. The problem is he doesn't know which way to take things from here. He knows he wants to go up to Cleric 17 for sure for the fire damage immunity. That leaves 3-4 levels to dabble in. He could just stay the course to Cleric 20 for Divine Intervention, but he doesn't want to stay bored with it. He'd get 3 more feats if he chose that option, but doesn't know what to take. Warcaster and Lucky are always good options.

His AC is 23. He rarely makes weapon attacks. He uses the Spirit Guardians/Spiritual Weapon combo in combat and likes the Dodge Action.

I'm a big fan of the 5e Cleric, but it's playstyle can definitely get monotonous. I think he's just looking to do a more variety of things.

What direction would you take this character?

[ftafp]

it's funny, Forge cleric always stood out to me as the most interesting cleric primarily because it's not confined spirit guardians/spiritual weapon spam. On the low-optimization side of things you get Wall of Fire and Animate Objects which do significantly better damage and have their own techniques to utilize. On the cheesier end of things, Fabricate turns you into The Department of Firearms and Fat Stacks, and technically, the rules don't forbid Creation from replicating magic items. Either case buys you time until you get Conjure Celestial at 13 which has lodes of different uses

Given that there aren't a lot of good directions to multiclass into at this level (particularly ones that will change the build's playstyle in 3 levels) I'd honestly advise your friend to research all the other concentration and utility spells they have access to and break out of the rut. If they're curious, the guys over at https://tabletopbuilds.com/ have a discord where they get really creative with some of the character options. I'd advise asking for more details there

[Gtdead]

Some ideas:

Instead of going melee with SG, go ranged dpr with Summon Celestial or even Animate Objects burst. These 2 spells are very competitive.
Dipping Druid for Magic Stones to combine with 3 Zombies for more magical ranged dpr. (Although at this level, this doesn't sound so hot).
Dipping Sorcerer for Silvery Barbs to combine with Couatl's attempts to poison and grapple (Need Cleric 13 for this). Sorcerer also dramatically boosts the core SG playstyle through Shield/Absorb Elements and Metamagic.

Also Cleric can boost minion survivability dramatically with Warding Bond. Even the melee version of Summon Celestial is useable with this trick despite the abysmal hit points.

Edit: Hadn't noticed the 9 CHA, so Wizard instead of Sorcerer. War/Diviner/Chronurgist are all good for this.

[nickl_2000]

What about going 3 levels into Swarmkeeper Ranger? He would get a little more spell progression since it's a half caster, he can up his AC by 1 more with fighting style (or choose a different one), and he gets the Swarms abilities.

The Swarm says "Once on each of your turns, you can cause the swarm to assist you in one of the following ways, immediately after you hit a creature with an attack:" A spiritual weapon makes a Melee Spell Attack, so it should qualify. Then you have the ability to move someone you hit back into the Spiritual Guardians area. I am not sure it would change his fighting style, but it does give him a little bit more to do with what he is currently doing.

[Thunderous Mojo]

13 Intelligence opens up the Artificer as a multi-class option.

Three levels of Artificer net you:

4 Infusions known, 2 Infused Items.
Only 1 effective level loss from Fullcaster spell slot progression.
Access to Booming Blade, and other great cantrips.
Access to the Artificer spell list, which is a great list, for a Preparation caster.


Any Artificer subclass will do…Armorer has obvious synergies.

The Forge Cleric/ Armorer Artificer’s own armor would act as the spell casting focus for their Artificer spells, and they can punch Red Dragons with Lightning Fists empowered by Booming Blade, which can help limit the dragons mobility or do some extra damage that scales off character level.

The Infiltrator Armor option can help the character with Movement speed, or help with Stealth checks, and has a Lightning Ranged Weapon option.

Many new choices are opened up.

[5eNeedsDarksun]

This is a bit tough, as my first couple of thoughts require Chr 13 (Paladin and Sorc) which the character doesn't have. Without smite, and that you said the character doesn't attack much, I'd be thinking about ways to improve the Cast a Spell action.

That said, I think a couple of things that would free the character up to do other things are 1) metamagic, which could still be attained in a limited way through Metamagic Adept, and 2) the Shield spell, which would help him not have to dodge so much.

How about 2 levels into Diviner to get Portent?

[CTurbo]

He doesn't have the Cha score to dip in Bard, Paladin, Warlock, or Sorcerer

He does qualify for Wizard and Artificer though. Wiz adds a lot of utility, but since there is already a Wiz in the group, I don't think it's all that necessary. Still helpful though and the Shield spell would be nice to have as would Booming Blade. I am not very familiar with the Artificer, but it seemed like many of the class features kinda overlapped with Forge Cleric? I'll have to look again and get him to look too.

I think Druid makes the least sense of all classes considering Plate armor, metal shield, and Smith tools.

Monk doesn't fit for the same reason, but a few Monk levels could grant him some Bonus action Ki options including being able to Dodge with his Bonus action. Not worth it to me.

Barbarian is another obvious no since he would never be able to rage.

A level or 2 of Rogue is decent on any character. Extra skills, Expertise, and Cunning Action. Does a Forge Cleric need Cunning Action? Eh it does add a lot of mobility. None of the level 3 Rogue subclass features look interesting though.

Fighter is an easy one. I think all 5 characters should take 2 levels of Fighter for Action Surge lol. I think he kinda wants to be a little better with attacking so Fighter gets him access to the Warhammer and Dueling Fighting Style. He doesn't really need more AC so yeah the Defense Fighting Style would work. He'll get Magic Plate at some point too. I was thinking 3 levels for Battlemaster. I think he'd like and get some use out of Commander's Strike because the Barb, Ranger, and Pally all hit REALLY hard. Pushing Attack would work really well with Wall of Fire. Tripping Attack works really well with the Pally's Aura. Eldritch Knight would add 2 wiz cantrips and 1st level spells. Most importantly Booming Blade.

Ranger is a good fit given the 20 Wis and, like the Fighter, it boosts melee a bit, and adds some utility. But I'm not seeing any Ranger subclass level 3 abilities that look very exciting for a Forge Cleric. I hadn't thought about the Swarm Ranger being able to move enemies up to 15ft on a failed save though. That would work really well with Wall of Fire.

I think if it were me, I'd take 2 levels of Fighter and 2 levels of Diviner Wiz for Portent. Portent is great, but less so against enemies with Legendary Actions. Booming Blade is the best way to increase melee capability. A single high level attack would be 7d8+Str which isn't too shabby. Defense Fighting Style is boring but effective, but I think Protection or Interception would fit best.