High level war weaver

[King of Nowhere]

I am building a party of level 18-20 npcs to be the final bosses in the current story arc.
I decided the wizard is going to be a support, with war weaver to share buff spells with his allies.
Problem is, i am having troubles finding buff spells that are actually useful at high level in a high magic campaign. There is almost nothing that you can't already get from your equipment - and as the star party of nerull, they have access to the very best stuff.
What's not covered there is often moot because a high level enemy party (in this case, the pcs, but it applies to everyone they can expect to fight) can circumvent it easily.

I mean, resist energy? They all have at least 20 from equipment. Stoneskin? Everyone in the party uses adamantium weapons. Haste? It's already an area buff, you don't need a war weaver for it.

Some useful stuff is protection from spells (+8, but not cumulative with the +5 they already have), mind blank (but useless here because the party does not use enchantments), fire shield (but the party melee will likely be immune).

And i have a cache of 4 spells of level =< 5 to release as move action, but i can't find a single useful one.

Any suggestion on actually useful stuff i could give this guy?

[RandomPeasant]

Why not just houserule War Weaver to have more than five levels? You could even use one of the existing tricks for progressing the level of spells you can share more than normal if you're a stickler for RAW. The problem seems to be that the class caps too early for when you want to use it, just make it not do that.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

You could also give the war weaver levels in legacy champion. That way he could extend war weaver farther AND buff minions simultaneously. Give him a number of minions from planar binding and such to round out however many extra targets he needs. Stuff like etherealness + ghost touch equipment, for instance, could go a long way on a pit fiend.

[Feldar]

Strictly RAW:

Favor of the Martyr -- shut down most things that cause conditions (Pal 4)
Delay Death -- keep on fighting (Clr 4)
Death Ward -- protection from negative energy for everyone! (Clr 4)
Nerveskitter -- why yes, I do want my group to go first, going first is Win (Wiz 1)
Protection from <whatever> -- mind control sucks -- let's skip that. (Clr 1)
Sheltered Vitality -- ability damage sucks -- let's skip that (Clr 4)
Lesser Ironguard -- they probably use metal weapons... (Wiz 5)
Undulant Innards -- crits suck -- let's skip those. (Wiz 3)

The buffs don't have to be high level to be useful. Blanket protection is a good thing, regardless of level. As for access, rings of spell storing, spell storing weapons, etc. These can be refilled during "downtime".

I'm sure other folks can come up with suggestions.

[King of Nowhere]

Why not just houserule War Weaver to have more than five levels? You could even use one of the existing tricks for progressing the level of spells you can share more than normal if you're a stickler for RAW. The problem seems to be that the class caps too early for when you want to use it, just make it not do that.

being able to cast a single target buff and affect all your allies is always useful. if i can find the right buffs to apply

[Feldar]

I will add that war weaver is severely broken -- one standard action to get 25 spells out at max level, all for only one level of casting lost.

This class gets nerfed in my home rules.

[FauxKnee]

Remember that eldritch tapestry can be used outside of quiescent weaving; zero-cheese options like nerveskitter/I] at the start of combat or a timely [I]swift etherealness can help your party quite a bit.


Haste? It's already an area buff, you don't need a war weaver for it.

While you're correct, quiescent weaving is useful for area spells for the action economy. The vast majority of the time you will be able to spare the move action on the first turn. IMO any short-duration buff you'd consider casting otherwise is a great choice, including obvious stuff like haste and dimension step.

As RandomPeasant suggested, you can use shenanigans to share higher-level spells via the eldritch tapestry. Bloodlines, uncanny trickster, legacy champion, and sanctum spell (see the errata which explicitly makes this work) are the usual suspects.

You can also pursue some options to broaden the list of shareable spells. Spellguard of Silverymoon's ability to cast some personal spells at touch range may work under your interpretation, which opens up stuff like ruin delver's fortune. If you pursue this path, the Arcane Reach ability of the Archmage would be useful, and Magic of the Land removes the restrictions on available personal spells. Opening combat with stuff like true strike and friendly fire active on the entire party may not be the most creative, but it's tough to argue efficacy. Standard wizard BS like celerity with daze immunity is just as good on your party, and alter fortune can give your team a second chance against battlefield control. You can do things like greater mirror image (or superior invisibility, when using higher-level tricks) combined with mind blank, protecting them from area dispels / disjunctions with wings of cover from 30+ feet away.

[King of Nowhere]

Strictly RAW:

Favor of the Martyr -- shut down most things that cause conditions (Pal 4)
Delay Death -- keep on fighting (Clr 4)
Death Ward -- protection from negative energy for everyone! (Clr 4)
Nerveskitter -- why yes, I do want my group to go first, going first is Win (Wiz 1)
Protection from <whatever> -- mind control sucks -- let's skip that. (Clr 1)
Sheltered Vitality -- ability damage sucks -- let's skip that (Clr 4)
Lesser Ironguard -- they probably use metal weapons... (Wiz 5)
Unulant Innards -- crits suck -- let's skip those. (Wiz 3)

The buffs don't have to be high level to be useful. Blanket protection is a good thing, regardless of level. As for access, rings of spell storing, spell storing weapons, etc. These can be refilled during "downtime".

I'm sure other folks can come up with suggestions.

how would i get the wizard to share paladin/cleric spells this way?
war weaver is an arcane class, i wouldn't want to use sheanigans to share divine spells if I could anyway

ironguard and unduland innards, on account of shutting down too hard entire builds, are banned at my table.

the only thing remaining in your list is nerveskitter, which is actually a good option

Remember that eldritch tapestry can be used outside of quiescent weaving; zero-cheese options like nerveskitter/I] at the start of combat or a timely [I]swift etherealness can help your party quite a bit.



While you're correct, quiescent weaving is useful for area spells for the action economy. The vast majority of the time you will be able to spare the move action on the first turn. IMO any short-duration buff you'd consider casting otherwise is a great choice, including obvious stuff like haste and dimension step.

As RandomPeasant suggested, you can use shenanigans to share higher-level spells via the eldritch tapestry. Bloodlines, uncanny trickster, legacy champion, and sanctum spell (see the errata which explicitly makes this work) are the usual suspects.

You can also pursue some options to broaden the list of shareable spells. Spellguard of Silverymoon's ability to cast some personal spells at touch range may work under your interpretation, which opens up stuff like ruin delver's fortune. If you pursue this path, the Arcane Reach ability of the Archmage would be useful, and Magic of the Land removes the restrictions on available personal spells. Opening combat with stuff like true strike and friendly fire active on the entire party may not be the most creative, but it's tough to argue efficacy. Standard wizard BS like celerity with daze immunity is just as good on your party, and alter fortune can give your team a second chance against battlefield control. You can do things like greater mirror image (or superior invisibility, when using higher-level tricks) combined with mind blank, protecting them from area dispels / disjunctions with wings of cover from 30+ feet away.
some good suggestions here. most of the op options are disqualified for being too op for my table. mirror image is personal. ruin delver fortune uses the caster's charisma bonus, hence it's useless on a wizard with cha 8

regarding the short duration buffs, it's entirely true, but i do expect the fight to entail disjunctions. spells stored into quiescent waving are immune to be disjoined and could be a great way to buff back your party after disjunction.

[Feldar]

how would i get the wizard to share paladin/cleric spells this way?
war weaver is an arcane class, i wouldn't want to use sheanigans to share divine spells if I could anyway


Zero shenanigans required. Look up a ring of spell storing in your DMG. You need a friendly cleric and paladin to drop those spells into the ring if you can't cast them, but otherwise totally legal.

[FauxKnee]

some good suggestions here. most of the op options are disqualified for being too op for my table. mirror image is personal. ruin delver fortune uses the caster's charisma bonus, hence it's useless on a wizard with cha 8

regarding the short duration buffs, it's entirely true, but i do expect the fight to entail disjunctions. spells stored into quiescent waving are immune to be disjoined and could be a great way to buff back your party after disjunction.

Yeah, the Spellguard + Magic of the Land + Arcane Reach stuff is definitely abusive. Just figured I'd point out that it was possible. After posting I remembered that there was a build showcase 'The White Elephant' (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?600206-Optimization-Showcase-in-the-Playground-The-White-Elephant&p=24195441) which explores SoS in more detail, in case anyone is interested.

I think it makes sense to have an initial weaving ready to drop at the beginning of combat. If your wizard is worried about mordenkainen's disjunction, he might prepare extra copies of the key buff spells and ensure he has a time stop to spare. He could spend his standard action stopping time, using the extra rounds to load up the quiescent weaving. After time stop expires and his original turn continues (of which he already spent the standard action), he can spend his move action to release them all.

[Biggus]

Unulant Innards -- crits suck -- let's skip those. (Wiz 3)


What book is this from?

[MaxiDuRaritry]

What book is this from?Undulant innards, from Lords of Madness, I think.

[edit] Master's touch, mirror move (https://www.wizards.com/dnd/article.asp?x=dnd/sb/sb20000901a), heroics, and bladestorm are all ways to grant bonus feats for awhile, allowing you to cherry-pick feats to grant your party when needed. An example: you've been ambushed by a surprise hydra-with-lots-of-templates? Give the party Improved Sunder (since nobody sane would take it under normal conditions).

[Biggus]

Undulant innards, from Lords of Madness, I think.


Thank you.

@OP: some other possibilities:

Protection From Energy
Girallon's Blessing
Heroism
Indomitability

[Feldar]

Undulant innards, from Lords of Madness, I think.

Thanks, I went back and fixed the spelling.

[Fouredged Sword]

I always found that a healing hymn war weaver sublime chord is an interesting build. Arcane disciple yourself into access to the healing domain and sanctum spell it into a 5th level spell capable of being cast through your war weave.

What, you though the fight was over? The enemy has a full combat rest button that they hit the moment things look like they have taken a turn for the worst.

You also store 4 castings of CLW in your weave that each heals the entire party 1d8+28 hp for a total of 4d8+112 hp per party member healed as a move action.

Basically you run the party out of resources. Whatever they do you undo, while also doing all the standard sublime chord stuff in the background. Remember you are a sublime chord with full sorcerer 4th level plus casting. You can step outside the healbot lane by just picking a spell known that's offensively useful. War Weaver lets you do the healing and buffing thing cheaply in terms of actions and slots. That means you can spend the rest of your actions doing actually useful things.

[Faily]

Oh boy, playing buff-focused casters is one of my favorite things, although it's been a while since I looked at 3.5 and even longer since I looked at War Weaver, so I apologise if I misremember what kind of spells it can use in its Weave.



mind blank (but useless here because the party does not use enchantments)


Mind Blank is a super useful buff, as its strength is in protecting you from almost ALL Divination. So slap Greater Invisibility + Mind Blank on the entire group, and watch the PCs flail about to try to find the undetectable invisible enemies.

There's also Spell Turning, True Seeing, Telepathic Bond, Protection From Energy (it will soak up a lot of damage before Resist Energy begins to do its work), Greater Heroism (+4 Morale bonus to most rolls is nothing to scoff at), Displacement (and its lesser cousin Blur, if you don't want to do Greater Invisibility), Keen Edge (saves your buddies from having to buy weapons with Keen, Scabbards of Keen Edge, or investing in Improved Critical), Greater Magic Weapon, Absorption, Superior Invisibility, Energy Immunity, Ironguard (immune to pesky metal weapons), Bite of the Werebear (and the other spells in that chain), Superior Resistance, Draconic Might, False Life, (Greater or normal).

There's also some useful buffs that have Mass-versions, like Fly, Resist Energy, Darkvision, Snake's Swiftness.

[Paragon]

Faily made a good list.
I'll just add Heroics and stuff like Mirror Move that are insanely versatile in the Tapestry

[King of Nowhere]

Zero shenanigans required. Look up a ring of spell storing in your DMG. You need a friendly cleric and paladin to drop those spells into the ring if you can't cast them, but otherwise totally legal.

the srd is ambiguous on whether the ring of spell storing will let someone who's not a spellcaster cast spells from it. I'd rule not, anyway; don't want people to have access to all manners of personal spells. And I'd definitely rule that casting a spell that you cannot cast yourself through an item can't use your eldritch tapestry.


I always found that a healing hymn war weaver sublime chord is an interesting build. Arcane disciple yourself into access to the healing domain and sanctum spell it into a 5th level spell capable of being cast through your war weave.

Putting aside that I have no idea how you'd get 1d8+28 on a cure light wounds that explicitly caps at 1d8+5, this guy is an antagonist, and specifically a follower of nerull. Not much chance of him getting the healing domain...
I looked arcane disciple for magic domain and spell resistance, giving all his team spell resistance 32 with a single casting would have been wonderful. Alas, nerull only has useless domains.

[Biggus]

I apologise if I misremember what kind of spells it can use in its Weave.

[...]

There's also Spell Turning, True Seeing, Telepathic Bond, Protection From Energy (it will soak up a lot of damage before Resist Energy begins to do its work), Greater Heroism (+4 Morale bonus to most rolls is nothing to scoff at), Displacement (and its lesser cousin Blur, if you don't want to do Greater Invisibility), Keen Edge (saves your buddies from having to buy weapons with Keen, Scabbards of Keen Edge, or investing in Improved Critical), Greater Magic Weapon, Absorption, Superior Invisibility, Energy Immunity, Ironguard (immune to pesky metal weapons), Bite of the Werebear (and the other spells in that chain), Superior Resistance, Draconic Might, False Life, (Greater or normal).

There's also some useful buffs that have Mass-versions, like Fly, Resist Energy, Darkvision, Snake's Swiftness.

Sadly you did misremember, War Weaver can't use spells which are above 5th level, which target items rather than creatures, or which have a range of personal, and most of your list are in one of those categories.


Mind Blank is a super useful buff, as its strength is in protecting you from almost ALL Divination. So slap Greater Invisibility + Mind Blank on the entire group, and watch the PCs flail about to try to find the undetectable invisible enemies.

It's debatable whether this works or not. There's a thread about it here (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?369362-Does-mind-blank-protect-against-true-seeing/), with several of this site's experts pitching in on both sides.

[King of Nowhere]

Oh boy, playing buff-focused casters is one of my favorite things, although it's been a while since I looked at 3.5 and even longer since I looked at War Weaver, so I apologise if I misremember what kind of spells it can use in its Weave.



Mind Blank is a super useful buff, as its strength is in protecting you from almost ALL Divination. So slap Greater Invisibility + Mind Blank on the entire group, and watch the PCs flail about to try to find the undetectable invisible enemies.

There's also Spell Turning, True Seeing, Telepathic Bond, Protection From Energy (it will soak up a lot of damage before Resist Energy begins to do its work), Greater Heroism (+4 Morale bonus to most rolls is nothing to scoff at), Displacement (and its lesser cousin Blur, if you don't want to do Greater Invisibility), Keen Edge (saves your buddies from having to buy weapons with Keen, Scabbards of Keen Edge, or investing in Improved Critical), Greater Magic Weapon, Absorption, Superior Invisibility, Energy Immunity, Ironguard (immune to pesky metal weapons), Bite of the Werebear (and the other spells in that chain), Superior Resistance, Draconic Might, False Life, (Greater or normal).

There's also some useful buffs that have Mass-versions, like Fly, Resist Energy, Darkvision, Snake's Swiftness.

Spell Turning, Bite of the Werebear (and the other spells in that chain) those are personal range, can't be shared True Seeing, Protection From Energy (it will soak up a lot of damage before Resist Energy begins to do its work), Superior Resistance, Draconic Might, Keen Edge (saves your buddies from having to buy weapons with Keen, Scabbards of Keen Edge, or investing in Improved Critical) those do nothing that's not already covered by equipment, Telepathic Bond we always handwave team communication and strategy anyway, Greater Magic Weapon sharing spells specifically does not work for this; also, it's covered by equipment Absorption, Superior Invisibility, Ironguard (immune to pesky metal weapons) those are banned at my table, Displacement (and its lesser cousin Blur, if you don't want to do Greater Invisibility), those are actually good, but I expect everyone in the party to have access to (at least temporary) true sight as swift action soon enough, Energy Immunity, this would be useful, but nobody in the party is focusing on elemental damage, so won't be relevant in that fight, False Life, (Greater or normal), greater is pathfinder only; normal is fine, but a minuscule bonus, Greater Heroism (+4 Morale bonus to most rolls is nothing to scoff at) this is the only thing in that list that's really useful

I wouldn't rule mind blank + invisibility to work like that in any case. As for protection from divination, this is the top party of nerull, and they enjoy protection from divinations by living in strongholds that are protected against divinations, only coming out briefly to fight. So, not really relevant in this case either.

I don't want to sound petulant or oppositive. I appreciate that people give me lists, so that I may find some occasional good stuff in them.

I just want to show what I mean by "there's almost nothing that's actually useful for my situation"

[Fouredged Sword]

the srd is ambiguous on whether the ring of spell storing will let someone who's not a spellcaster cast spells from it. I'd rule not, anyway; don't want people to have access to all manners of personal spells. And I'd definitely rule that casting a spell that you cannot cast yourself through an item can't use your eldritch tapestry.


Putting aside that I have no idea how you'd get 1d8+28 on a cure light wounds that explicitly caps at 1d8+5, this guy is an antagonist, and specifically a follower of nerull. Not much chance of him getting the healing domain...
I looked arcane disciple for magic domain and spell resistance, giving all his team spell resistance 32 with a single casting would have been wonderful. Alas, nerull only has useless domains.

There is a bard ACF called healing hymn that lets you add your ranks in perform to the amount of healing provided by conjuration(healing) spells. It can be a sacred or profane bonus based on if you are good or evil. 23 max ranks in perform +5 from caster level =28.

The effect is set at time of casting too, so you can sing and then load up your weave's stored spells one day and then release them at any time to their full effect.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

There is a bard ACF called healing hymn that lets you add your ranks in perform to the amount of healing provided by conjuration(healing) spells. It can be a sacred or profane bonus based on if you are good or evil. 23 max ranks in perform +5 from caster level =28.

The effect is set at time of casting too, so you can sing and then load up your weave's stored spells one day and then release them at any time to their full effect.Um... I just read over that ACF. If you have ranks in more than one Perform skill, I think you add all the ranks together to determine your bonus to healing. So if you have a high Int score and take Versatile Performer for free ranks in lots of Perform skills...

[Biggus]

True Seeing, Protection From Energy (it will soak up a lot of damage before Resist Energy begins to do its work), Superior Resistance, Draconic Might, Keen Edge (saves your buddies from having to buy weapons with Keen, Scabbards of Keen Edge, or investing in Improved Critical) those do nothing that's not already covered by equipment

How does Protection from Energy do nothing that's not already covered by equipment? In your OP you said they all have at least energy resistance 20 from equipment, but PfE makes you immune to that energy type until it's expended.


Energy Immunity, this would be useful, but nobody in the party is focusing on elemental damage, so won't be relevant in that fight, [...] Greater Heroism (+4 Morale bonus to most rolls is nothing to scoff at) this is the only thing in that list that's really useful


Energy Immunity and Greater Heroism are 6th and 7th level Wizard spells respectively.


False Life, (Greater or normal), greater is pathfinder only; normal is fine, but a minuscule bonus

False Life is personal range so not eligible.

You didn't respond to the suggestions in my previous post, were they also no use for some reason?

[King of Nowhere]

How does Protection from Energy do nothing that's not already covered by equipment? In your OP you said they all have at least energy resistance 20 from equipment, but PfE makes you immune to that energy type until it's expended.



right, i keep forgetting about that.
Still, as I said, nobody in the party focuses on elemental damage, so it's not going to be relevant in this fight.




You didn't respond to the suggestions in my previous post, were they also no use for some reason?

Only post of suggestions I see from you is

Thank you.

@OP: some other possibilities:

Protection From Energy
Girallon's Blessing
Heroism
Indomitability
heroism is fine, but there's greater heroism already. protection from energy was already mentioned. indomitability is very good when it can be massed; I confused it with ironguard.
girallion's blessing is banned (my setting has firearms, and they synergize very well with rogues; the party rogue is oneshooting people left and right and I'm trying to keep his power in check; even npc rogues are very dangerous. I'd rather not give them double number of attacks)


our table's general criteria for banning is that a character of your own level can't screw you up too badly without some form of resistance. So, flat out immunity to sneak attacks is nope because it makes rogues useless, as is too much resistance to weapon damage, as are spells that cannot be resisted and put you out of the fight. On the other hand, also stuff that would raise your damage per round enough to reliably oneshot your target (assuming reasonable armor) in the surprise round is forbidden. Stuff with saving throw: negate is almost always ok, as are straight numerical bonuses - as long as they don't get too crazy.
Abusing action economy is another disallowed thing, excepting some very mild cases.
Finally, stuff that causes a lot of bookkeeping (I'm mostly looking at the polymorph line of spells) is not forbidden, but it's frowned upon, and we prefer to not use it for purely practical reasons.

[Feldar]

the srd is ambiguous on whether the ring of spell storing will let someone who's not a spellcaster cast spells from it. I'd rule not, anyway; don't want people to have access to all manners of personal spells. And I'd definitely rule that casting a spell that you cannot cast yourself through an item can't use your eldritch tapestry.

I haven't read the SRD, but the DMG description (pg 233) for a minor ring of spell storing makes it perfectly clear that ANYONE can cast spells from a ring of spell storing:


A wizard could cast two magic missile spells and a mage armor spell into the ring (1 + 1 + 1 = 3). She could then give the ring to a druid, who casts the mage armor spell from the ring and then puts a calm animals spell into the ring. The druid could give the ring to a barbarian, who could use all the spells but could not replace any.

RAW the war weaver can use a ring of spell storing to cast spells from any source. There is nothing RAW that prevents the war weaver from putting divine spells or even non-wizard spells into the weave from a spell storing device.

You can house rule what you want at your table of course.

[King of Nowhere]

By the way, even though there's not much stuff that's useful to me, I still have enough spells to cover the fight, including some prebuff.
I built the character almost completely, I just need to pick feats.
I decided this guy will just play defensive for his friends; counterspelling, buffing, and raising veils as needed. And I can't think of feats that would be useful with that. Ok, the usual extend spell for buffs. Quicken spell, but he's got a metamagic rod for it.
Improved counterspell is a must. what else?


I haven't read the SRD, but the DMG description (pg 233) for a minor ring of spell storing makes it perfectly clear that ANYONE can cast spells from a ring of spell storing:


A wizard could cast two magic missile spells and a mage armor spell into the ring (1 + 1 + 1 = 3). She could then give the ring to a druid, who casts the mage armor spell from the ring and then puts a calm animals spell into the ring. The druid could give the ring to a barbarian, who could use all the spells but could not replace any.

RAW the war weaver can use a ring of spell storing to cast spells from any source. There is nothing RAW that prevents the war weaver from putting divine spells or even non-wizard spells into the ring.

You can house rule what you want at your table of course.
Oh. I see. The srd is lacking a lot of clarifications.
Still, I'd rule that a war weaver must cast a spell with his own power to put it into the tapestry.

[Feldar]

Still, I'd rule that a war weaver must cast a spell with his own power to put it into the tapestry.

Yeah, I get that. I'm toying with that house rule myself, but I'm leaning against it because I'm also taking two additional casting levels away from the war weaver because I think that being able to drop the equivalent of 25 spells with a single action is beyond a bit on the side of too powerful.

My way, it's an excellent buffer but pays a heavy cost for that.

[Maat Mons]

One possible way to deal with War Weaver's cap of 5th-level spells is to use e.g. Recaster to pick things up from spell lists where they are lower level. Picking up Heal as a 5th-level spell from the Adept spell list is one example.

On a slight tangent, immunity to critical hits doesn't make Rogues useless. Any well-built Rogue will have the Penetrating Strikes ACF from Dungeonscape, and so will still deal half his normal Sneak Attack damage to creatures normally immune. You don't need to write constructs, elementals, oozes, plants, undead, and the Fortification armor ability out of your setting. Rogues don't suck quite so bad that they necessitate such drastic measures.

Also, the idea of banning things because they screw over specific characters is kind of funny. I'm imagining a Sorcerer who takes only Electricity spells, for theme, asking his DM to ban Resist Energy. Because, clearly, a 2nd-level spell that can lay low even the mightiest Blue Dragon Mage is OP.

[Faily]

I don't want to sound petulant or oppositive. I appreciate that people give me lists, so that I may find some occasional good stuff in them.

I just want to show what I mean by "there's almost nothing that's actually useful for my situation"

No offense taken. I am partially to blame for the list for not double-checking War Weaver's limitations or the spells myself (again, it's been like 10 years since 3.5 for me as I've been almost exclusively Pathfinder since 2012). :smallsmile:

What sort of tactics does the PCs prefer?

One of the Otiluke spells (Repelling Sphere?) can keep melee-folks away, and Magic Circle Against Good can keep summoned critters at bay. Wind Wall can make things tricky for archers. If the PCs use Invisibility-tactics, a scroll or two with Invisibility Purge takes care of that within a certain range (though it shuts down your own Invisibility). Wall-spells are excellent for control in separating the PCs (Wall of Stone can be used to make domes too. Cast Cloudkill and quicken a Wall of Stone into a dome around it to trap someone in poisonous gas. Wall of Force and Prismatic Wall are notoriously difficult to get past too). Ring of Counterspells can also protect against some direct dispelling which is very useful for a caster that favors high amount of buffs.

[Fouredged Sword]

Sanctum spell can also be used to cast a 6th level spell into the spellweave. Sanctum spell makes a spell count as one level lower outside your sanctum.

Another thing that is useful to apply to spellweaver is classes that extend the class features of another class. 5 levels of legacy champion adds 4 levels to warweaver allowing you to cast 9th level spells into your weave.

Wizard 5 / warweaver 5 / Legacy Champion 5 / Abjurant Champion 5 is a valid build that makes the whole party a pain in the ass to hit in melee.

[King of Nowhere]

No offense taken. I am partially to blame for the list for not double-checking War Weaver's limitations or the spells myself (again, it's been like 10 years since 3.5 for me as I've been almost exclusively Pathfinder since 2012). :smallsmile:

What sort of tactics does the PCs prefer?



I was about to write the pcs main powers and how I am planning to use this dude to face most of them, but then I remembered my players read this forum.

I'll just say that combat at my table is a bit different from what most people in this forum assume. On one hand, we play in a high magic world, which means lots of loot for everyone. By "a lot", I mean that 11th level npcs are given around 200k gold. Because of that, everyone can afford some utility items like see invisibility or single use teleportation - taking the bite off of many strategies, like the aforementioned caging people with walls.
The optimization level is pretty high, though nowhere near TO - the party can discuss and strategize for hours before a big fight, the casters have long lists of buffs they never leave home without, and they use their resources effectively. On the other hand, the whole "can't screw you up too badly without counterplay" guideline means that lots of stuff that would be expected at this level of play is banned or nerfed.
In the current meta, fighters are very tanky against a variety of physical and magical attacks, and they can reliably deal some damage, but they tend to kill slowly. Rogues deal a lot of damage, but they are the most frail class. Most casters focus on save or die - which often fail due to the ubiquitous use of cloaks of resistance, but they decide an encounter when they succeed.
Clerics are currently in trouble, they did use to have solid SoD, but most of those are negative energy effects, and everyone is stocking up in scarabs of protection - with holy word and such banned for not giving counterplay, this leave clerics with limited offensive potential and relegates them mostly to healers and buffers - until they get implosion.

Still, while the nerfs reduce lethality somewhat, combat is still over in a few rounds - because ganging up on a single opponent to ensure a kill works fine.
Resurrection is easily available to the party and to boss-level enemies, so i expect a high degree of letality.

[DarkSoul]

Have you considered other classes that make the spells you put through the tapestry better?

Master Specialist (Abjuration) 10 opens up a lot of personal-range protective spells to be sent through the tapestry, for example, then a level of Abjurant Champion auto-extends them and starts boosting AC bonuses granted (but that won't be worth much because you don't have enough levels to get 10 Master Abjurer and appreciable numbers of War Weaver/AbC levels; it's one class or the other by this point). Regardless, free extend spell and casting personal-range abjurations as touch spells, then running them through the tapestry to become close range is possible.

Also, when you're considering what to use for spells in the tapestry, if this group has been together for any significant amount of time, they can rely on the War Weaver to provide buffs A, B, C, D, and E. They know this, so they'll choose other items to purchase instead. Having everyone buy items individually to cover all their weaknesses likely results in the PCs getting a bunch of items they can't/won't use because they already have their own copies.