King of The Hill Reboot

[Rater202]

Exactly what it says on the tin. (https://collider.com/king-of-the-hill-reboot-mike-judge/)

There are not a lot of details. TcTropes is claiming that it's a soft reboot that takes place 15 years after the original series but they don't provide a source.

[Peelee]

I'm petty excited, I tell you what.

[Rater202]

So apparently the "15-year time skip" comes from a guy who worked on the orignal series who had apparently been talking to the creators. I'll see if I can find the oringal source.

Though... If it is going to be a fifteen-year time skip...

That would make Bobby about 28. Which is around the time a lot of people have to start making a genuine effort to understand people who are much younger than them, or subcultures different from their own. Bobby was an open-minded kid, of course, but the older you get the more set in your ways you become.

A recurring plot in the original series was Hank encountering people that he just doesn't understand. Sometimes he's right about them being jerks or idiots(the teen paintballers, the middle age witches) but othertimes he either learns to accept them, develops some understanding of their position even if he doens't agree with it,or find some underlying principle he can respect or some common ground to bridge the gap, and while it's subtle he does get some character development over the course of the series, being slightly but noticeably more understanding and empathetic.

Despite the presence of multiple Christmas and thanksgiving episodes, only a couple of years seem to pass over the course of the show. if Hank's life experiences, his encountering and learning to understand or accept people different from him, continues at a consistent rate, then fifteen years later...

I don't know, th idea that Hank has mellowed out somewhat and is more open-minded in his old age while Bobby is starting to struggle to understand people, just turning their dynamic around in an organic matter...

I'm not sure they're gonna do that, but it might be interesting.

[BeerMug Paladin]

Seems like there's nowhere to go but down with a project like this. Placing Bobby in Hank's old role of being a normal guy that just doesn't understand his kid or is somewhat shaken with the weird things that happen around him just doesn't seem like it would fit the character that well. And keeping Hank's role effectively the same and just aging everyone up seems pointless, other than potentially explaining the absence of some characters or the appearance of others. Though I do imagine they could easily make Bobby a Todd Chavez type of character.

They'd just have to come up with a new core dynamic, but as KotH being a relatively static universe for its existence up until now, that seems like a tough sell.

Mostly my skepticism comes from liking the original show as much as I do. It will be hard not to directly compare them and it's a high bar to pass. I can think of ways to make it work by my standards, but... I'm skeptical it will.

[Rater202]

You don't put Bobby in Hank's shoes, not exactly...

As a proposed scenario: If there's a 15-year time skip, that means that Good Hank and Gracie would be teenagers.

If you do a scenario where Bobby moved away from Arlen in pursuit of his comedy career but had to move back in with his parents for some reason while at the same time something happens to either Didi, Luanne and Lucky, or both forcing the elder Hills to take custody of their great-niece, their much younger sibling(in-law) or both then you could have a situation where Bobby, much the same as he was but more mature, realizes that... He doesn't really understand the generation after him.

Building on it: While Cotton loved Good Hank and spoiled him rotten, showing him affection that he never showed Hank, Didi... Seems apathetic to his existence. Now I'm not holding that first episode against her since it's clear cut postpartum depression, but Didi in several episodes seems to outright resent having to take care of a baby. Beyond that, she's just... Not exactly the kind of person who's cut out to have kids. I could see Good Hank as a teenager being a troubled kid.

Or hell, now that I think about it, nothing even needs to have happened to Didi. She could just have a new husband or boyfriend who doesn't want a kid in the picture and she just sends him on a bus to Arlen to live with his big brother expecting Hank to take care of G.H.

Meanwhile, based on how Luanne and Lucky act, I imagine that young Gracie Kleinschidt would be... Honestly a bit spoiled. There both good-natured people who want to do right but aren't exactly all put together. With Lucky's "peepee" money, the settlement he got from his crooked lawyer after that one episode, the fact that Hank seems to have convinced him of the value of honest work after that incident(Lucky says he'll be looking for a job) and the fact that, while Luanne's aspirations for higher education didn't pan out she's been shown working as a barber and managing production fo direct to DVD children's videos. The idea that she was continuing to work as a barber or getting royalties from Manger Babies merch... Or both...

Gracie Kleinscmidt probably grew up well off.

And well... Brittany Murphy and Tom Petty are no longer with us. The idea that something happened to the parents, who are dearly missed, would be... One way of dealing with that.

So... If Orphaned Gracy and Abandoned GH are made to live with the Hills for reasons, you'd have two teenagers from opposite backgrounds... And Hank and Peggy are in their late 50s at this point, they don't have the energy to take care of two teens. So they contact Bobby who moves Back to Arlen to help out...

Bobby managed to break it into comedy, became moderately successful at first, but after a few years his popularity is waning. Gracie and G.H. don't find him funny at all. Bobby, meanwhile, realizes that he doesn't understand the experiences of teenagers now or the Gen-Z sense of humor.

Maybe he thinks that getting to understand them will let him reach younger people with his humor and revitalize their career, or maybe he just wants to be a "fun uncle" but either way...

Not a hard prediction. Just a way they could go if the 15 year time skip turns out to be true.

[Ruck]

I think I'd rather just not have Luanne or Lucky in the show, or mentioned that they moved away, than that they died. Too depressing.

I'm not sure about some of the ideas floated here-- one of Bobby's traits is, despite Hank not really getting him and him not fitting into Hank's ideal vision of a son, he's very comfortable in his own skin and confident in who he is. I don't really care for the thought of that being something he ages out of.

That all said, I enjoyed the Beavis and Butt-Head revival in 2011 (which, apparently, is also getting an aged-up revival produced), so I expect that Mike Judge and co. will still have a good handle on the characters and make this work.

[Rater202]

I'm not sure about some of the ideas floated here-- one of Bobby's traits is, despite Hank not really getting him and him not fitting into Hank's ideal vision of a son, he's very comfortable in his own skin and confident in who he is. I don't really care for the thought of that being something he ages out of.

I didn't say he'd age out of being comfortable with himself in my "plausible way this could go" thing. I'm bad at explaining.

Like, I imagine that he'd still be mostly the same, just more mature, but...

Like, there was one episode where he finds a Ray Jay Johnson record that all the adults think is hilarious and he just doesn't get it.

I'm picturing something similar.

Or like... If you pay attention, a recurring theme in the series is the effort it takes to bridge the generational gap: Cotton didn't even try, he doesn't acknowledge that his son is growing up in a different environment, a different time with different values, and is a different person. Instead, he tries to force Hank to conform to the values of his own generation and in doing so does irreparable damage to Hank, leading him to grow up into the emotionally repressed man who struggles to understand things outside of his narrow worldview.

And yet despite that, and despite his disappointment that the pattern is repeating with Bobby, he makes an effort. He doesn't force Bobby to be like him, not usually, but he keeps trying to find things they're both interested in ad for every "dahd, you were right" episode there's an episode where Hank learns to see things from Bobby's point of view, or develops a respect for what Bobby wants to do, or just accepts that it's a thing.

The series finale(not counting the four episodes that were pushed back) is literally just about the two of them finally having an unambiguous middle ground that they both enjoy equally and it ends with them having a deep bonding experience over grilling steaks for an impromptu neighborhood cookout.

So like, it would make sense if a time skip or sequel series also included the generational conflict theme. But of course, Bobby wouldn't go about it the Hank way, he'd go about it the Bobby way.

[Psyren]

This is... fine I guess? When it comes to a modern animated portrayal of the charms of small-town Americana, we already have imo the best possible version of that (Bob's Burgers) so I'm not sure what a KotH revival can really add beyond brand recognition - but I'm open to being pleasantly surprised.

Beavis and Butthead I'm a lot more skeptical on. I'm guessing that the licensing arrangements they'd need to react to music videos like they used to will be much more expensive now that they aren't part of the network artists needed for mainstream exposure, so that just leaves the hormone-driven hijinks aspect of the show - which again, we already have as good a version of as we're going to get (Big Mouth.)

That leaves the Daria revival as the remaining vector for innovation, should it ever escape development hell.

[Gnoman]

If they kill off Peggy, they'll have a large and well-realized cast of characters with years of existing characterization that they can build off. Getting the original VAs isn't strictly necessary - even the adults would have aged enough to sound different - but all the existing dynamics gives the potential for so much more than you'd get from a new IP.

[GentlemanVoodoo]

After reading the article, I'm incline to say bad idea all around. Reboots even soft ones are playing on nostalgia bait. And for most things it is more misses than hits. King of the Hill, and Bevis & Butthead for that matter, are products of there time and should stay as such.

[Starbuck_II]

This is... fine I guess? When it comes to a modern animated portrayal of the charms of small-town Americana, we already have imo the best possible version of that (Bob's Burgers) so I'm not sure what a KotH revival can really add beyond brand recognition - but I'm open to being pleasantly surprised.

Beavis and Butthead I'm a lot more skeptical on. I'm guessing that the licensing arrangements they'd need to react to music videos like they used to will be much more expensive now that they aren't part of the network artists needed for mainstream exposure, so that just leaves the hormone-driven hijinks aspect of the show - which again, we already have as good a version of as we're going to get (Big Mouth.)

That leaves the Daria revival as the remaining vector for innovation, should it ever escape development hell.

Wasn't Bob's Burger just a dreamscape for Archer?
What he really wishes he could have: a simpler life without murder?

[Psyren]

Wasn't Bob's Burger just a dreamscape for Archer?
What he really wishes he could have: a simpler life without murder?

Headcanon accepted but doesn't really change my point :smallbiggrin:

[Rater202]

Wasn't Bob's Burger just a dreamscape for Archer?
What he really wishes he could have: a simpler life without murder?

No.

There was an episode of Archer where an Amnesiac Sterling marries Linda and becomes a Stepfather to her three kids under the name Bob, but those are depicted as an AU version of the Belchers native to Archer's world

(and Archer takes the name Bob while amnesiac, implying that there isn't a NAtive Bob Belcher)

We get a vision of Archer's ideal life throughout the three "Coma Seasons." Dreamland shows a world where, while bad things happen, he's a more competent and heroic version of himself—and all of his coworkers are too, or else in positions archer thinks they'd be happier in, except for Cyril who is crooked cop...

Danger Island shows a world where, while archer is still somewhat selfish and his coworkers are similar, the morality of the world is in black and white and she's still the type to sacrifice himself rather than let bad things happen to his loved ones. Admittedly, Cyril being a Nazi and the antagonist of the dream says some... Archer clearly has issues with Cyril.

1999 is mostly similar to the early seasons.

The three of them suggest that Sterling is mostly content with his life as a Secret Agent, he just... Wants to have things be simpler, be more competent, and be more heroic.

(Of special note is how Kreiger is depicted in these scenarios: In the first coma dream, he's depicted as a heroic scientist who created a proof of concept for cyborgs and tricked the Nazis into spending a fortune and throwing away dozens of lives hat otherwise would have been thrown away by the war effort. In the second, he's Archer's wisecracking talking animal sidekick. In this third, he's literally incapable of hurting people. This suggests that Archer thinks highly of Krieger which... Scans. Krieger might be the most unambiguously evil member of the agency but he's also the most genuinely friendly and has gone out of his way to do nice things for Sterling)

Tragically, every time Archer tries to better himself, be it morally or in terms of his general competence something happens that sets him back. sometimes even including his coworkers deliberately sabotaging him.

Of course, any further discussion of Archer should be done in a more appropriate thread.

Back to the topic at hand... Assuming that the "fifteen Year Time Skip" thing pans out... How would allt he characters have changed over time?

What about Dale? I've got the mentle image that he's still a old school conspiracy theorist and he thinks all of the new generation of conspiracy theorists—the ant-vaxxers, the flat earthers, and so on are all a bunch of posers wasting their time on nonsense. Meanwhile he's going over the declassifed Roswell documents in intense detail trying o prove that they are in fact forgeries.

...Buck Strickland is probably dead. He was up there in age to begin with and his criminal hlifestyle, unhealthy eating habits, excessive drinking, penchant for unsafe sex with random women, and so on have already taken their toll on him by the time the series starts and over the course of the orignal series he almost gets assainated by his side chick when he rekindles his rlationship with his wife, amost gets killed after cheating in a backroom card game, has a severe heartattack on screen, and gets the crap kicked out of him by ostriches he tries to have killed as part of an ensurance scheme.

Either his luck will run out and something will finally kill him or his body will crap out on him.

And if Buck isn't around anymore, Hank is most likily to assume control of Strickland Propane either by inheriting or buying the company or just being put in charge by whoever else does and... That would basically be Hank's best life.

...I also think it would be funny if the lesson from Dia-BILL-ic Shock managed to stick so fifteen years later Bill is actually in great shape due to Bill continuing to excersize and slowly accumulating better habits.

[codybene]

Exactly what it says on the tin. (https://collider.com/king-of-the-hill-reboot-mike-judge/)

There are not a lot of details. TcTropes is claiming that it's a soft reboot that takes place 15 years after the original series but they don't provide a source.

OMG!!!!!!!!!!! As a south texan I approve this I'll tell you Hwhat!!!

[Rater202]

o the thought occurs to me that in the original run, Fox made the creators tone done things like character development and running arcs because they wanted it be be easy to follow the show when reruns were aired out of order.

But... Running episodes of a show completly out of order is falling out of favor, and with the rise of streaming services, the idea of just taking a couple of hours to binge-watch a season of a show to completion is being normalized.

Also, as far as I can tell they're doing it themselves rather than being produced specifically by a network.

So... The revival might have stronger continuity?

Like, the original show wasn't too bad about things, but you do have things like... The episode with the woman who tried to get Halloween banned has Bobby mention(and then flashback to) Hank trying to get him to eat chopped liver, but later in the episode where Bobby gets gout after becoming addicted to new york style deli food Hank mentions that the family doesn't eat liver because "we're not ghouls."

Or like, relatively early John Redcorn starts to develop feelings of guilt regarding sleeping with Nancy after he realizes that Dale has been nothing but a good friend... But much later on is shown being ready, willing, and able to rekindle the affair without any such thoughts.

Or... How there was that whole episode about Hank and Peggy both growing up in the same town and being high school sweethearts and then a couple seasons later it turns out that Peggy is from a ranch in Montanna while its pretty clear that Hank had been raised entirely in Texas.

That mght be less of an issue if they're allowed to do stronger continuity.

[Ruck]

Back to the topic at hand... Assuming that the "fifteen Year Time Skip" thing pans out... How would allt he characters have changed over time?

What about Dale? I've got the mentle image that he's still a old school conspiracy theorist and he thinks all of the new generation of conspiracy theorists—the ant-vaxxers, the flat earthers, and so on are all a bunch of posers wasting their time on nonsense. Meanwhile he's going over the declassifed Roswell documents in intense detail trying o prove that they are in fact forgeries.

...Buck Strickland is probably dead. He was up there in age to begin with and his criminal hlifestyle, unhealthy eating habits, excessive drinking, penchant for unsafe sex with random women, and so on have already taken their toll on him by the time the series starts and over the course of the orignal series he almost gets assainated by his side chick when he rekindles his rlationship with his wife, amost gets killed after cheating in a backroom card game, has a severe heartattack on screen, and gets the crap kicked out of him by ostriches he tries to have killed as part of an ensurance scheme.

Either his luck will run out and something will finally kill him or his body will crap out on him.

And if Buck isn't around anymore, Hank is most likily to assume control of Strickland Propane either by inheriting or buying the company or just being put in charge by whoever else does and... That would basically be Hank's best life.

Yeah, it's come up elsewhere for me before, but I see Dale as someone who thinks the more popular conspiracies these days are false flags to distract you from the real conspiracies.

Buck being dead certainly would make sense given his age and lifestyle, although if they've got Stephen Root around already, they could bring him back. He'd probably be at an age where he'd have to retire from Strickland Propane anyway, though, so I think something like your scenario would be most likely.

[Rater202]

On the topic of Dale... Dale is shown in a couple of episodes to have a strong understanding of how the government works.

Like, in one episode he's able to get an error on Hank's driver's license repairs by threatening to go over the DMV clerk's head by calling their superiors and superior's superiors and proceeds to list them off in ascending order of authority until he gets to someone with the authority to cut through the red tape and fix the error.

In another episode, he's able to fill out the paperwork to get land seized from native people given to John Redcorn...

...Which is really impressive becuase the tribe that Redcorn claims descent from is known to have died out before the White Man came to the new world and is not known to have ever had settlements in Texas.

So Dale probably doesn't believe in things like "the earth is flat and the government is covering it up" and "there are government racking chips in the vaccines" simply becuase he knows that it's impossible for the government to keep those things secret.

Meanwhile, the kind of theories he actually beleives? I mean, he's already been proven right about a couple of them. The episode where he thinks Joseph was fathered by an alien has an appearance by what... May in fact be an actual alien? And Bill was in fact a test subject(albeit in the control group) of an illegal government supersoldier experiment not unlike some such theories Dale mentions at a time.

The classical theories are true, in universe. The government is covering up aliens and human experimentation.

[Peelee]

On the topic of Dale... Dale is shown in a couple of episodes to have a strong understanding of how the government works.
This wasn't how the government works, though. The clerk always had the power to change it, but did not want to go against policy. Dale threatened a big enough headache for the clerk that it was worthwhile for the clerk to go against policy. This does not mean that the clerk would not get in trouble or be otherwise responsible for acting against policy. It just means that the clerk suddenly cared more about getting these people gone then doing what he was supposed to do.

And Bill was in fact a test subject(albeit in the control group) of an illegal government supersoldier experiment not unlike some such theories Dale mentions at a time.
Bill was given a placebo.

The classical theories are true, in universe.
The only classical theory that is confirmed either way is confirmed false by Dale himself, in the aforementioned "hank's drivers license" episode.

[Rater202]

This wasn't how the government works, though. The clerk always had the power to change it, but did not want to go against policy. Dale threatened a big enough headache for the clerk that it was worthwhile for the clerk to go against policy. This does not mean that the clerk would not get in trouble or be otherwise responsible for acting against policy. It just means that the clerk suddenly cared more about getting these people gone then doing what he was supposed to do.Dale still accurately listed the clerk's superiors in ascending order.

He knows who to call for his threat to be credible, which was my point.


Bill was given a placebo.I don't see how Bill being in the control group is relevant. He was still a test subject in an experiment that actually happened.

The whole plot of the episode was that when Bill was injured Hank accidentally saw Bill's medical records and realized that a whole huge chunk of it was blacked out, prompting Dale to infiltrate the base and find records of the experiment.

The simple fact that Operation: Infinite Walrus happened in the first place is all that's relvant.

[Peelee]

Dale still accurately listed the clerk's superiors in ascending order.

He knows who to call for his threat to be credible, which was my point.
Totally fair. I also liked that bit about Dale: he may not trust them, but he damn well knows them.

I don't see how Bill being in the control group is relevant. He was still a test subject in an experiment that actually happened.

The whole plot of the episode was that when Bill was injured Hank accidentally saw Bill's medical records and realized that a whole huge chunk of it was blacked out, prompting Dale to infiltrate the base and find records of the experiment.

The simple fact that Operation: Infinite Walrus happened in the first place is all that's relvant.

Fair. Though this also happened at the same time that the Tuskeegee Experiment was going on, and is significantly less shocking/abhorrent.

[Rater202]

Totally fair. I also liked that bit about Dale: he may not trust them, but he damn well knows them.
Yeah. That's part of why I think that Dale, if they doing a 15 year time skip like the rumors say, would be dismissive of more modern theories.

Like, you'd have to pay off millions of people all over the world hundreds of millions of dollars each to cover up the Earth being flat. the government simply isn't capable of that and Dale would know that.
Fair. Though this also happened at the same time that the Tuskeegee Experiment was going on, and is significantly less shocking/abhorrent.A valid point, but it's definitely closer to the type of conspiracy theories that Dale follows than Tungeskeegee is.

...It's also personal. It happened to someone he knows and, while Dale is the most likely to give Bill**** or laugh when he's hurt, Dale has demonstrated more than once that at the end of the day he cares for Bill's wellbeing... Even if he goes about it an unorthodox way.

...Honestly the same is true of all four of the guys. Like, in the episode where Peggy is spiking Hank's food with testosterone the more aggressive and energized Hank tears apart Dale's latest bit of nonsense by cross-referencing against several of Dale's other fantasies and theories... Which indicates that Hank is paying attention to and memorizing what Dale says when he goes off on his tangents.

I brought it up becuase... Dale is kind of on to something. Which is th other reason I think he'd be dismissive of the modern theories. He has personal experience supporting some of his theories which would make him less likely to believe radically different theories.Although, on the topic of Operation Infinite Walrus...

And I admit that this is pure bull**** on my part, the real answer is probably just ignorance on the part of the writers...

But it wouldn't have made sense to give Bill a placebo.

Like, the point of giving a control group a placebo is to rule out the effects of perception in the test. It would have only been effective if Bill had been told what they were actually testing.

Bill wasn't told "this is an experimental treatment to give soldiers blubber and thick body hair to help fight in arctic conditions." He was told he was getting a "super vitamin."

And while it would be in character for Dale to misread "placebo" as "place-bo" you'd think that the actual name of the treatment would have been in the documents...

Unless the actual name is something that could also be misread as "place-bo." Or is just flat out called "place-bo."

It's most certainly not intended and kind of goes against the message of the episode, but... It's one of those things where the facts don't quite line up and you get to thinking.