Futurama is being revived... again.

[Lord Vukodlak]

So the word is Futurama is coming back and on Hulu no less.
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/futurama-revived-at-hulu-1235090020/

[Dire_Flumph]

Good news everyone!

If there's any show that deserves adding yet another series finale to its belt, it's Futurama.

[MammonAzrael]

My gut reaction is "Oh god, just let it rest in peace." I was excited by news of both Futurama's previous revivals (the four movies, then further seasons). I felt both outings were lacking compared to the original seasons. I don't know what the popular or critical consensus' are on these, that's just my own opinion. While I would love to new episodes to reach the same quality as the original seasons, I don't see much evidence that any of these various franchise revivals have managed that.

So...I doubt it'll great, or even terribly good, so I won't get hyped about it, but if I'm wrong that'll be awesome.

[Rater202]

Gonna be honest, the most recent finale felt pretty definitive. Gave some pretty decent closure.

And then we had the Simpsons episode that crossed over with Futurama which, despite the shows treating each other as mutually fictional beforehand, apparently is considered canonical as Bender is occasionally seen sleeping in the Simpsons basement(one episode shows that MArge is using him as a safe) which to me felt like a back door so that if they wanted to they could do things with the Futurama cast again.

I don't think a revival is needed for this.

[Peelee]

The greatest show ever made coming back for yet another revival? I would like to purchase a ticket for this ride.

And then we had the Simpsons episode that crossed over with Futurama which, despite the shows treating each other as mutually fictional beforehand, apparently is considered canonical as Bender is occasionally seen sleeping in the Simpsons basement

The Simpsons is a fictional TV show in the Futurama universe.

[Tvtyrant]

My gut reaction is "Oh god, just let it rest in peace." I was excited by news of both Futurama's previous revivals (the four movies, then further seasons). I felt both outings were lacking compared to the original seasons. I don't know what the popular or critical consensus' are on these, that's just my own opinion. While I would love to new episodes to reach the same quality as the original seasons, I don't see much evidence that any of these various franchise revivals have managed that.

So...I doubt it'll great, or even terribly good, so I won't get hyped about it, but if I'm wrong that'll be awesome.

Fully half of what I consider the best episodes were in the revival era, so I am hesitantly on board. The show's early seasons had a lot of timely pop culture references, which severely limits the humor for anyone not of Gen X or a millennial.

I'm not sure the show needs another season at this point, but if we get one more Murder on the Planet Express ship level episode I will be satisfied.

[Rater202]

The Simpsons is a fictional TV show in the Futurama universe.

Yes. And Futurama was a fictional show in the Simpsons.

Then they did a crossover episode anyway. ("a show out of ideas teams up with a show out of episodes") and now Bender is just permanently deactivated in the Simpsons' basement, traveling back to the future the long way.

Marge uses him as a safe.

Considering the tagline of the episode coupled with the fact that it came shortly after Futeruma was canceled again, the whole thing very much came across as an excuse to use the Futrama cast for things if they counl't be revived again.

[Peelee]

Yes. And Futurama was a fictional show in the Simpsons.

Then they did a crossover episode anyway. (a show out of ideas teams up with a show out of episodes) and now Bender is just permanently deactivated in the Simpsons basement, traveling back to the future the long way.

Marge uses him as a safe.

Yes, that's all very nice. Thay just means that Simpsons writers like the idea of a crossover.

I don't think they care about "Simpsons Canon" as much as you do.disregarding that the Simpsons keep moving into the future as ageless beings which kind of makes "canon" more than a bit silly already.

[Dienekes]

Gonna be honest, the most recent finale felt pretty definitive. Gave some pretty decent closure.


In fairness so did the seven series finales before that one.

Really, if they have some interesting nerdy sciency episodes with the fun characters I’ll enjoy it. If they waste more time on Fry and Leela’s will they won’t they nonsense I’ll probably turn it off.

[BeerMug Paladin]

Futurama coming back after a while of being away is probably a good thing for it. I feel that a good portion of the first revival's episodes were great, with only a few overall miss episodes that felt like they were commenting on issues they were 20 or more years too late to address.

If the writers come back to the revival this time with as many good, interesting ideas and plotlines as the first revival managed to pull off, it ought to be good overall.

[Lemmy]

I don't know...

I love Futurama, but... Considering every other revival and sequel of old series these days, I can't help but fear that they will try to " update the series for modern audiences" and ruin it. Specially if isn't being beinf written by the old writers.

Also... "Simpson's canon". LOL! The idea that The Simpsons cares about canon is funnier than anything the show hasndone in the past 15 years.

[Eldan]

Aaand now John DiMaggio has confirmed he's not going to be part of and they are recasting bender and all the other voices he did.

[Androgeus]

And then we had the Simpsons episode that crossed over with Futurama which, despite the shows treating each other as mutually fictional beforehand, apparently is considered canonical

Canon is made up. Crossovers doubly so.

[Eldan]

Plus Futurama has several times demonstrated that they have the technology to travel to fictional worlds.

[Peelee]

Aaand now John DiMaggio has confirmed he's not going to be part of and they are recasting bender and all the other voices he did.

That's disappointing, but voice actors are endlessly impressive and i have faith in them to pull it off. Bender wouldn't have been what he was without DiMaggio, and they're not releasing a lot of info on the details, but it sounds like even thoigh he wanted to come back, he was holding out for more money, likely because he expected they wouldn't move forward without him. I'm hoping that the fact that they will may change his mind and have him accept the deal on the table (assuming it still is on the table, and it'd be silly to not be).

[Willie the Duck]

Gonna be honest, the most recent finale felt pretty definitive.

Fully half of what I consider the best episodes were in the revival era

If the writers come back

Okay, here are my thoughts (in no particular order and of no particular importance):

The show was always an episodic romp through whatever the writers decided they wanted to do. Even moreso than The Simpsons, any kind of 'ongoing plot' is the weakest part of the show to begin with (ex: as mentioned above, that Fry and Leela are together when the plot demands, apart when one of them needs to be romantically linked with anyone else, and courting when that would be funny). Thus I don't really need closure, nor the idea that revisiting the show would break any kind of closure.

The actual premise of the show isn't that mindblowingly special, nor the specific world built for it (New New York with the tubes, the reoccurring secondary cast, the 20th-century personalities now exist as heads in jars conceit) all that interesting. What the show brought was team Groening writing room doing something to which they actually have a passion, leeway to include whatever fantastical elements The Simpsons usually relegates to Treehouse of Horror episodes, and a voice cast with genuine chemistry. As anyone who has trudged through all the examples on a Know Your Meme entry for any of the Futurama-related memes knows, Futurama - actual talent behind the jokes = nothing special. Therefore, this new show will be as good or bad as the passion behind it.

I agree that there is no specific correlation between quality and when in the broadcast era (original, movie, revival, one-off Simpsons crossover) it came out. There was good and bad throughout.

Yeah, Canon means nothing in either show. Bender is still present in the Simpsons basement and seen occasionally because viewers will point and say, 'I get that reference!'

[Mastikator]

I guess I'm in the minority that really like the later seasons, in fact I think some of the best episodes are from the later seasons and I especially like that they lean heavily into the weird but "hard" science fiction parts. The moby **** and bender-ularity episodes are my fan favorites. The finale is of course amazing.

Whether the new season is good or not is not inevitable, it's a matter of choice really. They could choose to make it good or choose to make it bad. (like the simpsons is made bad on purpose (yes, it really is))

[Peelee]

Okay, here are my thoughts (in no particular order and of no particular importance):

The show was always an episodic romp through whatever the writers decided they wanted to do.
Yeah, but there were still definitive plans on things to happen in the future. Quick and dirty examples are Nibbler's shadow in the pilot and Leela's parents in the background crowd when they first encounter the mutants. There are more, per the commentary, but I can't remember some of them and some others weren't able to be pulled off yet.

I guess I'm in the minority that really like the later seasons, in fact I think some of the best episodes are from the later seasons and I especially like that they lean heavily into the weird but "hard" science fiction parts. The moby **** and bender-ularity episodes are my fan favorites. The finale is of course amazing.

Whether the new season is good or not is not inevitable, it's a matter of choice really. They could choose to make it good or choose to make it bad. (like the simpsons is made bad on purpose (yes, it really is))
Game of Tones totally beat out Jurassic Bark and Luck of the Fryrish for me.

[Psyren]

If this means they cancel Disenchantment for good then I'm here for it :smalltongue:

[Peelee]

If this means they cancel Disenchantment for good then I'm here for it :smalltongue:

Ah yes, similar to how once Futurama came out, they cancelled the Simpsons.

You can easily not watch shows you don't like. Disenchantment doesnt even have that much advertising, I can't imagine it's annoying you terribly much.

[Willie the Duck]

Yeah, but there were still definitive plans on things to happen in the future. Quick and dirty examples are Nibbler's shadow in the pilot and Leela's parents in the background crowd when they first encounter the mutants. There are more, per the commentary, but I can't remember some of them and some others weren't able to be pulled off yet.

I don't dispute that these things exist, nor that there wasn't plans from the beginning. What I'm saying is that the series thrived on an inventive episode idea, not on following how the lives of the characters evolved. Yes, Leela found out who here parents were, but what made that pay off was the episode where* the cast was de-aged back to teenagers and she insisted on getting to live the teenager experience with her folks she was denied when she went through teendom the first time through.


Game of Tones totally beat out Jurassic Bark and Luck of the Fryrish for me.

Overall, I find it pretty much half-and-half. The early seasons had some rather unimpressive ones (IIRC correctly the one where Fry saves NNY from the giant garbage ball threatening NNY because modern people don't know how to not recycle was pretty tedious), as well as the reboot era (I may be alone in not really liking the final finale, what with the 'Leela turns down Fry's marriage proposal and despite them being on-again-off-again since forever, he now feels he has to commit suicide' nonsensery). Likewise, both early and late seasons had real great ones like these you mention.

[Bohandas]

I like Futurama and I'd like to see this, but not enough to sign up for Hulu

[Giggling Ghast]

Supposedly they're not bringing back John DiMaggio as Bender over a pay dispute, which strikes me as ... inadvisable.

https://deadline.com/2022/02/futurama-revived-new-season-hulu-original-cast-john-dimaggio-not-returning-bender-1234929844/

[Peelee]

Supposedly they're not bringing back John DiMaggio as Bender over a pay dispute, which strikes me as ... inadvisable.

https://deadline.com/2022/02/futurama-revived-new-season-hulu-original-cast-john-dimaggio-not-returning-bender-1234929844/

We've already been discussing this a bit, yes.

[JoshL]

I am interested. Like others here, I think the (most recent) ending was absolutely perfect. There were some great later episodes, there were some ones I couldn't stand, but you could say the same of any season. I really hope they get John DiMaggio back, or if not, write a new character rather than having a different actor as Bender. But honestly, I think they could do the show without him.

It would be harder replacing Billy West, since he was almost half the cast.

[Psyren]

Ah yes, similar to how once Futurama came out, they cancelled the Simpsons.

You can easily not watch shows you don't like. Disenchantment doesnt even have that much advertising, I can't imagine it's annoying you terribly much.

It's not really the whole show I hate, mostly Elfo.


I really hope they get John DiMaggio back, or if not, write a new character rather than having a different actor as Bender. But honestly, I think they could do the show without him.

It would be harder replacing Billy West, since he was almost half the cast.

I don't really see how you do the show without Bender as he was the foil. But I suppose it could be done.

[BeerMug Paladin]

I don't really see how you do the show without Bender as he was the foil. But I suppose it could be done.
"Bender, something about you seems different lately. Did you get a haircut?"
"Get real meatbag. I pride myself on neglecting my system updates so I always stay as glorious as the day I was made."
"That seems like something you'd say... But I still don't know."
"Yeet my stately chromey rump if you think otherwise!"
"Now that's the Bender I know!"

[Willie the Duck]

Hulu is using Bender in the adds for the thing, so I am assuming he will be in the show. I'm guessing they will find a suspiciously similar substitute of a voice actor.

[The Glyphstone]

And its not like they don't have plenty of audio for a new VA to listen to for an imitation.

Heck, Futurama is exactly the sort of show that would specifically devote a joke or three to Bender's "new voice synthesizer".

[Lord Vukodlak]

I don't really see how you do the show without Bender as he was the foil. But I suppose it could be done.
Doing the show without Bender would work about as well as That 70s show without Eric and Kelso.

So apparently John DiMaggio(voice of Bender). Asked for a higher pay check then what. Billy West and Katey Sagal already agreed to.
The three stars were offered equal pay.(I’m assume that’s per line, otherwise Billy is getting the shaft.)
Billy and Katey agreed to X amount which wasn’t enough for John.
I know people love to hate on the big corporation but knowing his co-stars already agreed makes it hard to side with him.

I think the real issue is John is a more prolific voice actor and more in-demand. Thus his time is worth more money.
In any event if they give John more money then Billy and Sagal would need a similar pay raise.
Even if Fry, Leela, and Bender the characters are worth and equal amount to Futurama. The actors behind them might not be worth the same amount to Hollywood at large.

[Peelee]

The problem is he's doing this in a field where he's easily replaceable. Top notch voice actors are insane at the level of control they have. IIRC, at least three voice actors on the show already other than Billy West can perfectly imitate Zoidberg's voice, for example. The documentary I Know That Voice (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmmakeVo4lg) had a snippet of Maurice LaMarche telling the story of how he realized he should make money from his talent when, in 7th grade or so, his teacher did a horrible (so normal, really) Columbo impersonation and after class MLM went up to him and said, in a "if you closed your eyes you would swear they brought in Peter Faulk for this" voice, how to do a better Columbo.

I'd be surprised if any of the existing Futurama cast voiced Bender, out of respect for DiMaggio. But I also wouldn't be surprised if they brought in someone new. Sure, we may get fewer side characters like Randy, but getting a voice for Bender isn't an insurmountable obstacle.

I'm hoping they decide to go that route, DiMaggio sees the writing on the wall, and agrees to the terms (which, from what little I know, sound relatively fair - he is reportedly holding out at least in part because of how Futurama is a big name property).

[Psyren]

And its not like they don't have plenty of audio for a new VA to listen to for an imitation.

Heck, Futurama is exactly the sort of show that would specifically devote a joke or three to Bender's "new voice synthesizer".

Justifying/lampshading it in the show isn't really the issue though, they can certainly do that. It's how the "fans" would react.


Doing the show without Bender would work about as well as That 70s show without Eric and Kelso.

My thought exactly :smallbiggrin: I guess we'll see.

[Peelee]

I think there's no chance in hell they'll do the show without Bender. I think there's a very substantial chance they'll do the show without Dimaggio.

[Willie the Duck]

The problem is he's doing this in a field where he's easily replaceable. Top notch voice actors are insane at the level of control they have. IIRC, at least three voice actors on the show already other than Billy West can perfectly imitate Zoidberg's voice, for example. The documentary I Know That Voice (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmmakeVo4lg) had a snippet of Maurice LaMarche telling the story of how he realized he should make money from his talent when, in 7th grade or so, his teacher did a horrible (so normal, really) Columbo impersonation and after class MLM went up to him and said, in a "if you closed your eyes you would swear they brought in Peter Faulk for this" voice, how to do a better Columbo.

I'd be surprised if any of the existing Futurama cast voiced Bender, out of respect for DiMaggio. But I also wouldn't be surprised if they brought in someone new. Sure, we may get fewer side characters like Randy, but getting a voice for Bender isn't an insurmountable obstacle.

I'm hoping they decide to go that route, DiMaggio sees the writing on the wall, and agrees to the terms (which, from what little I know, sound relatively fair - he is reportedly holding out at least in part because of how Futurama is a big name property).
With Futurama in particular, there are probably people who first watched it as 8-10 year-olds who have been doing Bender impressions for almost 2 dozen years.

[brionl]

I already have Hulu, so I'll watch it. The old series is on Hulu, and my wife only moved to the US a couple of years ago so she has never seen it. We're going gradually through the back catalog now, in preparation for the new series.

I'm half-optimistic, half-pessimistic. So far the "final" episodes have been pretty good. I'm not sure if they can pull off another one.

[Bohandas]

And its not like they don't have plenty of audio for a new VA to listen to for an imitation.

Heck, Futurama is exactly the sort of show that would specifically devote a joke or three to Bender's "new voice synthesizer".

The technology's good enough now that they could probably use an actual voice synthesizer if it came down to it.

Have you ever seen the WayneradioTV video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRRpVcrZxZ8) where they spend the third quarter of the video messing around with a text-to-speech program and making it sound like different characters (including the narrator from Winnie the Pooh, Hans Moleman from The Simpsons, Infomaniac from Lego Island, and the youtuber Chills)?

[Willie the Duck]

The technology's good enough now that they could probably use an actual voice synthesizer if it came down to it.

Have you ever seen the WayneradioTV video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRRpVcrZxZ8) where they spend the third quarter of the video messing around with a text-to-speech program and making it sound like different characters (including the narrator from Winnie the Pooh, Hans Moleman from The Simpsons, Infomaniac from Lego Island, and the youtuber Chills)?

I'm sure they physically could do so. Whether it would be legal to do so is another question. Crispin Glover's successfully suing over being in Back to the Future II despite not actually being in Back to the Future II set a pretty big precedent about attempting to create/replicate a specific person's performance without actually paying them to perform it. Having someone else come and do a spot-on impression of them doing the performance, however, is fair game.

[Androgeus]

The other thing to consider about replacing DiMaggio is that you also need to duplicate his acting choices not just his voice.

Honestly they should just do a Doctor Who and have Bender regenerate in the first episode

[Peelee]

The other thing to consider about replacing DiMaggio is that you also need to duplicate his acting choices not just his voice.

Yes, this is what "voice acting" is. It's not just duplicating a voice. It's creating or replicating a character.

[Lord Raziere]

The other thing to consider about replacing DiMaggio is that you also need to duplicate his acting choices not just his voice.

Honestly they should just do a Doctor Who and have Bender regenerate in the first episode

Yeah, they could do a joke about his voice chip or whatever being damaged in some accident then Farnsworth having to install a new one.

also Bender's personality HAS been changed by shocks of electricity and being rebooted in the past such as when he was a penguin. it wouldn't be the most drastic change he has gone through.

[Anteros]

Doing the show without Bender would work about as well as That 70s show without Eric and Kelso.

So apparently John DiMaggio(voice of Bender). Asked for a higher pay check then what. Billy West and Katey Sagal already agreed to.
The three stars were offered equal pay.(I’m assume that’s per line, otherwise Billy is getting the shaft.)
Billy and Katey agreed to X amount which wasn’t enough for John.
I know people love to hate on the big corporation but knowing his co-stars already agreed makes it hard to side with him.

I think the real issue is John is a more prolific voice actor and more in-demand. Thus his time is worth more money.
In any event if they give John more money then Billy and Sagal would need a similar pay raise.
Even if Fry, Leela, and Bender the characters are worth and equal amount to Futurama. The actors behind them might not be worth the same amount to Hollywood at large.

People are allowed to charge whatever they want for their services. There's nothing to side against. If they don't want to pay a potential employee what he thinks he's worth, that's their decision. He's not obligated to take less than his value just because someone else did, and they're not obligated to pay him more than they think he's worth. There's no right and wrong to this.

Honestly, the show will probably not be worth watching. If they had fresh ideas and good writers they wouldn't need to resort to resurrecting a 20 year old show that was already cancelled 14 times. I love Futurama, but this feels like a cash grab rather than a passion project.

[Peelee]

Yeah, they could do a joke about his voice chip or whatever being damaged in some accident then Farnsworth having to install a new one.

Professor! Lava! Hot! Voice actor! Impressions! Job! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yMXNFCP_Qqk)

This is literally what voice actors do.

[Lord Raziere]

Professor! Lava! Hot! Voice actor! Impressions! Job! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yMXNFCP_Qqk)

This is literally what voice actors do.

And yet, people, on the comments section of that very video will somehow claim that Mel Blancs is the "best" Bugs Bunny despite the differences being slight and near indistinguishable to me. either there are people out there who hear details on a level I can't, or they just like to complain and nitpick and need the additional explanation so they hopefully keep quiet.

[Peelee]

And yet, people, on the comments section of that very video will somehow claim that Mel Blancs is the "best" Bugs Bunny despite the differences being slight and near indistinguishable to me. either there are people out there who hear details on a level I can't, or they just like to complain and nitpick and need the additional explanation so they hopefully keep quiet.

I think that's a bit of elitism, myself. As you say, several of them are nearly indistinguishable. I'm sure some people can tell a difference, but even then, it's minor. Voice actors are amazing. The top notch ones can do insane things. Remember Robopuppy (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFrT3zFk3KA)? In the commentary, David X Cohen comments on how they barely had to do any post processing on the voice, and Billy West does an example of his unfiltered robopuppy voice. It's like 95% of what you hear in the final product. IIRC most of the difference that I could tell was that they lowered the pitch a bit for the end result. But the electric sounding effects? It was almost unnerving to hear him do it on a whim.

But yeah, I don't think any explanation would be needed. At least here I can vent about it. I don't dare say anything on the reddit page.

[Bohandas]

Honestly, the show will probably not be worth watching. If they had fresh ideas and good writers they wouldn't need to resort to resurrecting a 20 year old show that was already cancelled 14 times. I love Futurama, but this feels like a cash grab rather than a passion project.

If they had fresh ideas and good writers they wouldn't be Disney. Their MO is to acquire an already successful franchise and squeeze the life out of it. They're like a cross between the Borg and Dracula.

[Peelee]

If they had fresh ideas and good writers they wouldn't be Disney. Their MO is to acquire an already successful franchise and squeeze the life out of it. They're like a cross between the Borg and Dracula.

Considering the sheer amount of media properties that Disney owns and that good quality media still comes out of them, this seems a bit dramatic.

[BeerMug Paladin]

I've never cared for any of the franchises Disney has supposedly 'squeezed the life out of', so I can't exactly share that particular fear. I simply do not have that concern and see no reason to start now. Although I'd be worried about a Futurama project's quality if they insisted on making it live action and using it as the springboard for a brand new Cinematic Universe franchise. Those suck and are always awful.

As a TV series, I would hope the writers/creators have had enough time to think up new interesting plots they're interested in doing. Sci-fi is hard to make interesting plots for that use the genre to its strengths, and I feel most of the best episodes actually lean into the uniqueness of the genre. A lot of the less memorable Futurama episodes merely use sci-fi as the backdrop for the plot, which while there's nothing wrong with doing that, I think tends to cause a dip in quality, or at least my enjoyment of the show.

Also, I wouldn't be surprised if some dedicated fans have sent in fan scripts that are worthy of being produced into a show. I have no idea if that's on the table, but I liked the other revivals enough to be mildly optimistic about bringing it back again. Also, I enjoy being happy, so I don't want to prime myself for negativity right out of the gate.

[Rodin]

I think that's a bit of elitism, myself. As you say, several of them are nearly indistinguishable. I'm sure some people can tell a difference, but even then, it's minor. Voice actors are amazing. The top notch ones can do insane things. Remember Robopuppy (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFrT3zFk3KA)? In the commentary, David X Cohen comments on how they barely had to do any post processing on the voice, and Billy West does an example of his unfiltered robopuppy voice. It's like 95% of what you hear in the final product. IIRC most of the difference that I could tell was that they lowered the pitch a bit for the end result. But the electric sounding effects? It was almost unnerving to hear him do it on a whim.

But yeah, I don't think any explanation would be needed. At least here I can vent about it. I don't dare say anything on the reddit page.

Honestly? I can hear it and understand why people say Mel Blanc is the best. They're very similar, but Mel Blanc's voice is the one that set the nostalgia bells ringing in my brain. The others varied in quality, with Billy West in particular sounding like Billy West doing a Bugs Bunny impersonation. That's because I've heard enough Billy West voices (mostly from the dozens he did for Futurama) that I can pick out his voice if I'm watching out for it.

However, that's not the same thing as saying Mel Blanc (or John DiMaggio) is irreplaceable. The writing and art quality is a lot more important than the performance as long as the performance meets a certain minimum standard. What differentiates the quality of most Bugs Bunny cartoons isn't whether Mel Blanc is doing the voice or not - it's when they were made.

That's the most concerning thing for me. The post-revival Futurama episodes are (mostly) not as good as the originals. Now they're reviving for a second (or is it third?) time, and I'm dubious about whether they can recapture the magic. Especially after I suffered through the first few episodes of Disenchanted before giving up on it entirely.

[Anteros]

That's the most concerning thing for me. The post-revival Futurama episodes are (mostly) not as good as the originals. Now they're reviving for a second (or is it third?) time, and I'm dubious about whether they can recapture the magic. Especially after I suffered through the first few episodes of Disenchanted before giving up on it entirely.

Even the original episodes have not held up great in my opinion. I used to be able to binge Futurama or use it as background noise when nothing else was on, but lately I find myself uninterested in it entirely. They're not timeless the way the early Simpsons are.

Also, yes. Disenchanted was offensively awful despite feeling like fantasy re-skinned Futurama. If it's the same creative team as that show then I'm even more skeptical.

[CheesePirate]

Disenchanted was offensively awful despite feeling like fantasy re-skinned Futurama.

How many episodes did you watch? It took me a few to get into it, as it's so different from Futurama and the Simpsons. More of a drama with some comedy bits thrown in, not so much the constant barrage of jokes I was used to from Matt Groening's other shows. Still enjoyable, in a different way, and it feels refreshing that the story keeps going instead of hitting the reset button after (nearly) every episode.

I definitely agree with you that Futurama hasn't held up great. I still like some of the episodes but I could certainly describe others as "offensively awful". Parts of that show really did not age well at all, and not just the original run.

Modern day The Simpsons still has the odd full episode or Treehouse of Horror segment that I enjoy, but right now Disenchantment is absolutely my favourite Groening show. Can a revived Futurama change that? All I know is my gut says "maybe".

[Bartmanhomer]

As much as I enjoy watching Matt Groening's work, I'm going to give Futurama revival a pass.

[Eldan]

How many episodes did you watch? It took me a few to get into it, as it's so different from Futurama and the Simpsons. More of a drama with some comedy bits thrown in, not so much the constant barrage of jokes I was used to from Matt Groening's other shows. Still enjoyable, in a different way, and it feels refreshing that the story keeps going instead of hitting the reset button after (nearly) every episode.

I probably gave Disenchantment far more of a chance than I should have, given that I don't like it, based mainly on "it's Groening and good voice actors, surely there will be good jokes at some point". All of the first season, most of the second.

It just... wasn't good? I didn't like any of the characters and more than 90% of the jokes fell entirely flat for me. The idea of more story focus would have been nice, and the story was halfway interesting... but it was interrupted far too often for one-off joke episodes that weren't funny and didn't advance anything.

[Anonymouswizard]

I got past two series of Disenchantment, but the third lost me. While there's some good episodes in there it's just not a strong show.

[BeerMug Paladin]

I probably gave Disenchantment far more of a chance than I should have, given that I don't like it, based mainly on "it's Groening and good voice actors, surely there will be good jokes at some point". All of the first season, most of the second.

It just... wasn't good? I didn't like any of the characters and more than 90% of the jokes fell entirely flat for me. The idea of more story focus would have been nice, and the story was halfway interesting... but it was interrupted far too often for one-off joke episodes that weren't funny and didn't advance anything.
I really want to like this show, because I think it has some interesting ideas, just not executed as well as it could be. I keep ending up watching some, semi-enjoying it but wanting it to be better. Some episodes are pretty good. Probably more of the jokes I think worked for me, but an awful lot of them come across to me feeling rather familiar, and often recycled. But this is a thing that afflicts most comedies.

One big issue I've noticed is that I keep getting the feeling that it wants to be transgressive, modern and subversive, but almost all of the ways it attempts to do so would've worked better several decades ago. Now the edgy commentary it thinks it's providing is just the cultural norm. It's a weird feeling to see a modern show that feels decades out of date, but I wouldn't exactly say that makes it bad. At least it's not R&M.

I'd clarify further, but that's both off-topic and getting too detailed about the subject could run afoul of forum rules.

[CheesePirate]

It's a weird feeling to see a modern show that feels decades out of date
At least it doesn't seem to have any of the awful transphobia that pops up in both The Simpsons (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVXy6a7-JYQ) and Futurama.

[Bohandas]

At least it doesn't seem to have any of the awful transphobia that pops up in both The Simpsons (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVXy6a7-JYQ) and Futurama.

I think that's an unfair assessment. Futurama has episodes that lampoon gender itself and I can see how many of these when viewed today would look like they're making fun of trans people, but the fact of the matter is I don't think actual transgenderism was on anyone's radar outside of a few niche circles when the original Futurama came out over 20 years ago

EDIT:
And the one that springs most obviously to mind, the one with the robot olympics, I think was really more of a spoof of how unnecessarily human robots in science-fiction programs are

EDIT:
Like, if I shot someone with a grenade launcher, and you got your face burned off because you were standing near them, I didn't shoot you, I shot them and you were collateral damage

[CheesePirate]

I think that's an unfair assessment. Futurama has episodes that lampoon gender itself and I can see how many of these when viewed today would look like they're making fun of trans people, but the fact of the matter is I don't think actual transgenderism was on anyone's radar outside of a few niche circles when the original Futurama came out over 20 years ago

My comment was in response to a comment saying Disenchantment feels decades out of date. My point is that at least in some areas it feels slightly more modern and not like decades old Futurama or the Simpsons.

If I may offer some advice, I'd suggest perhaps not using the word "transgenderism" when talking about these things, as it is often used to dehumanise transgender people. More neutral terms would be "being transgender", "the transgender community".


And the one that springs most obviously to mind, the one with the robot olympics, I think was really more of a spoof of how unnecessarily human robots in science-fiction programs are

Like, if I shot someone with a grenade launcher, and you got your face burned off because you were standing near them, I didn't shoot you, I shot them and you were collateral damage
"No, your honour, I was using my grenade launcher to shoot at the car, not at the people sitting inside it on their way to work."

[Bohandas]

"No, your honour, I was using my grenade launcher to shoot at the car, not at the people sitting inside it on their way to work."

Which would make the difference between murder and constructive manslaughter if you thought the car was empty.

And there is similarly a difference between obliviousness, inconsideration, and hostility


More neutral terms would be "being transgender", "the transgender community".

I'll keep that in mind for the future. However you should know before you start getting offended at people and seeib enemies everywhere that the constructions you propose don't follow the normal rules of the English language and you should not expect people to come up with them on their own. Thay're technically grammarically correct but they come off as stilted and artificial, and no native English speaker would ever naturally construct the phrases that way without being told. (In much the same way that nobody ever says "more stupid" instead of "stupider" or "to go boldly" instead of "to boldly go")

[Peelee]

Thay're technically grammarically correct but they come off as stilted and artificial, and no native English speaker would ever naturally construct the phrases that way without being told. (In much the same way that nobody ever says .... "to go boldly" instead of "to boldly go")

Is this a reference to split infinitives? Because that's not actually a thing in English, and only came about because of some people who wrongly believed that English, a Germanic language, should be more like Latin, which literally cannot have split infinitives because the infinitive is a conjugation, which is not the case in English.

[Bohandas]

Is this a reference to split infinitives? Because that's not actually a thing in English, and only came about because of some people who wrongly believed that English, a Germanic language, should be more like Latin, which literally cannot have split infinitives because the infinitive is a conjugation, which is not the case in English.

Which is exactly my point. We're on the same side here. No native or fluent English speaker would ever use the construction without the split infinitive; it comes off as stilted and sticks out as a phrase that is clearly artificial.

[Peelee]

Which is exactly my point. We're on the same side here. No native or fluent English speaker would ever use the construction without the split infinitive; it comes off as stilted and sticks out as a phrase that is clearly artificial.

It doesn't, though. English doesn't care one way or the other about split infinitives. Both are grammatically correct.

[Bartmanhomer]

Some of the jokes from Futurama and the Simpsons were a bit offensive during the 1990s and 2000s about transgender people. I was young back then and I didn't even notice it.

[Talakeal]

Some of the jokes from Futurama and the Simpsons were a bit offensive during the 1990s and 2000s about transgender people. I was young back then and I didn't even notice it.

Something I noticed rewatching Married with Children was how lazy homophobic / transphobic jokes were; a character simply being gay/trans was the whole joke, nothing more needed.

[Bartmanhomer]

Something I noticed rewatching Married with Children was how lazy homophobic / transphobic jokes were; a character simply being gay/trans was the whole joke, nothing more needed.

Yes. Married with Children was very degrading, unfortunately. :frown:

[Bohandas]

It doesn't, though. English doesn't care one way or the other about split infinitives. Both are grammatically correct.

They are both gramarically sound but the one with the split infinitive is less artificial.

Similar to my other example case: "stupider" and "more stupid" are both gramarically sound but "more stupid" comes off as markedly artificial sounding whereas "stupider" doesn't.

[Mystic Muse]

I can't recall a single recent time someone has used the word "stupider" and sounded natural.

[BeerMug Paladin]

At least it doesn't seem to have any of the awful transphobia that pops up in both The Simpsons (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVXy6a7-JYQ) and Futurama.
I suppose saying it feels decades out of date is a bit too harsh. If it were made decades ago it'd probably be casually everything-phobic once in a while. So I can at least give it credit for that.

[Willie the Duck]

I think that's an unfair assessment. Futurama has episodes that lampoon gender itself and I can see how many of these when viewed today would look like they're making fun of trans people, but the fact of the matter is I don't think actual transgenderism was on anyone's radar outside of a few niche circles when the original Futurama came out over 20 years ago

Something I noticed rewatching Married with Children was how lazy homophobic / transphobic jokes were; a character simply being gay/trans was the whole joke, nothing more needed.

I have nieces/nephews/friend's kids who are hitting their teens and switching from kids shows to sitcoms and even re-watching shows from the 80s-00s and sharing their experience of them in my presence. What I've learned/re-remembered:

Being homosexual was pretty much 'the whole joke*' right up until Will and Grace, where the jokes at least became more of, 'sure, but what about (honestly by modern standards a rather minstrel show farce of) the gay male experience is the joke?'
*occasionally a show like Soap or Cheers would treat the actual gay person as perfectly respectable and it be other peoples' reactions to be that worthy of lampooning, but it was still 'OMG, there is gay-ness!' as the entire joke set-up

People within any facet of the non-cis or genderqueer communities were almost not acknowledged as real. They were a joke so much that the very existence of them was barely acknowledged/got intermingled with drag queens and regular gay maleness*. I think the earliest I can remember would be ~1998. At that time Becker had an old male childhood friend come back as a woman and the joke is Becker's reaction to it (surprise/vague disgust, acceptance, than worry that he'd been attracted to her). Also about that time Mad About You had an episode where side character Ira's girlfriend announces that she's going to transition to being a male, and the joke is that that the guy and the next table is so surprised that he chokes on his meal and has to get the Heimlich maneuver**. Beyond that, yeah, tv mostly had transgender people or situations be the Married with Children style which treated it as a joke in and of itself.
*CPO Sharkey had a joke about a guy with a purse (actually a wig salesman with a leather bag full of their product) being mistaken for 'a gay' and Sharkey's attempt to hide said person (lest people know he was buying a wig) being mistaken for him hiding closet homosexuality. Soap also had a gay couple where they talked about Billy Crystal's character 'becoming a woman' so they could openly be together.
**to the show's credit, that's the extent of it being a joke and after that Ira reacts rather more confused about his role than disgusted or mocking. It was a guest role and the situation never mentioned again, but for the rest of the episode people treated the situation seriously and with relative grace

And then of course there is Klinger on M*A*S*H, which, well, that's not gender fluidity or anything, that's a guy in a dress because doing so in the 1950-1 armed forces would be a sign of insanity, which was the point for Klinger. M*A*S*H was on both sides of every social issue depending on the writer in charge that day and certainly wouldn't be seen as very good at it by modern standards, but I'll cede to it that Klinger is completely tangential to gender identity.


I suppose saying it feels decades out of date is a bit too harsh. If it were made decades ago it'd probably be casually everything-phobic once in a while. So I can at least give it credit for that.

Disenchantment feels like tired old writers tackling social issues in a world they no longer understand. It grabs some low-hanging fruit (Bean realizes she's some level of WSW; and no one really bats an eye), but then misses even straightforward other situations upon which they could have capitalized (Elfo is a 90's 'nice guy' character who doesn't exactly get put in place or called out about that behavior). It does seem to have a very 90s version of the unsympathetic protagonist setup (it's Seinfeld, not Rick and Morty), so I can certainly understand someone feeling that it feels out of date. And I think that's what it is -- a bunch of writers who wished they had the cachet to do this 25 years ago instead doing it now, even though time has moved on.

[Ruck]

Also, I wouldn't be surprised if some dedicated fans have sent in fan scripts that are worthy of being produced into a show.

Most TV writers' rooms won't read fan scripts or spec scripts for legal reasons. If they don't use the script or hire the writer, but something in a later episode resembles something in that script, the writer has a legitimate claim to credit for their work, and the guaranteed rate and etc. that comes with that (and legal recourse if they don't get it). I guess some shows might run a fan contest but the terms and conditions would almost certainly involve signing over the rights to your submission.

[Peelee]

Most TV writers' rooms won't read fan scripts or spec scripts for legal reasons. If they don't use the script or hire the writer, but something in a later episode resembles something in that script, the writer has a legitimate claim to credit for their work, and the guaranteed rate and etc. that comes with that (and legal recourse if they don't get it). I guess some shows might run a fan contest but the terms and conditions would almost certainly involve signing over the rights to your submission.

Aye. Not to mention that the type of writer who would send in a fan script and the type of writer who would write a good script likely make two separate circles on a Venn diagram.

[Aedilred]

Aye. Not to mention that the type of writer who would send in a fan script and the type of writer who would write a good script likely make two separate circles on a Venn diagram.

The sole point of overlap being "Abraham Simpson (https://simpsons.fandom.com/wiki/The_Front)", and he got hired.

[JadedDM]

John DiMaggio to Return for 'Futurama' Revival. (https://deadline.com/2022/03/john-dimaggio-return-futurama-revival-hulu-bendergate-1234968435/)

Looks like things were resolved then.

[Anteros]

That makes me slightly more optimistic. Also, I think it's on Hulu and not Disney+ like this thread previously thought. Unless I'm mistaken.

[Rodin]

That makes me slightly more optimistic. Also, I think it's on Hulu and not Disney+ like this thread previously thought. Unless I'm mistaken.

Hulu isn’t available outside the US. It will be available on Disney+ internationally.

[Peelee]

Hulu isn’t available outside the US. It will be available on Disney+ internationally.

Ah yes, I nearly forgot my weekly "rage at the idea that they would ideally have me pay for two* streaming services owned by the same company".

*At least.

[Anteros]

Ah yes, I nearly forgot my weekly "rage at the idea that they would ideally have me pay for two* streaming services owned by the same company".

*At least.

Where do you think those giant piles of gold that Scrooge swims in come from?

[Peelee]

Where do you think those giant piles of gold that Scrooge swims in come from?

Adventuring, of course. I believe they are quite explicit about that.

[Eldan]

Hiring mercenaries to slaugther natives in the Transvaal, so he can take over their land and mine it for diamonds.

Yes, that's actually in the comics.

[Metastachydium]

Adventuring, of course.


Hiring mercenaries to slaugther natives in the Transvaal, so he can take over their land and mine it for diamonds.


Hm. Putting together a team of reckless murderhobos, raiding some far off "wilderness area", killing all the locals and looting the place? Yeah, adventuring sounds about right.

[Rater202]

So... If they're doing this... I hope they utilize Nibbler and the Niblonians more.

They stated quite explicitly in Bender's game that Nibbler forgot to mind-blank everyone when he got back from wherever he went after swallowing himself at the end of Bender's Big Score, and the masquerade regarding Nibbler's sentience and the existence of his race was more or less blown by this and the exposure of where Mom was getting her Darkmatter from.

And then in the Revival that came after the movies... It comes up like, twice. Once in the episode where the device meant to find a missing Niblonian ship destroys several planets and once in the episode that revealed that cats were aliens.

Everybody in the main cast, if not the earth, being aware that Nibbler and his species are people and not pets should be a status quo changer.

Like... Show him talking shop with the Professor, since his people are so much more advanced than anyone else. Show him and Zoidberg at an exotic animal buffet. Maybe he needs to render on behalf of the planet express crew when one of their deliveries screws up a Nibblonian peace-keeping operation.

Hell, have him get arrested for public defecation because he's used to pretending to be a dog

Do something with him.

Who voices Nibbler? Is his VA to expensive to be a regular?

[Peelee]

So... If they're doing this... I hope they utilize Nibbler and the Niblonians more.
I feel like they use him and them as much as they want to. He tends to have purpose, so just tossing him in stuff with no purpose doesn't quite work (unlike, say, Scruffy, where that works exceptionally well).

Everybody in the main cast, if not the earth, being aware that Nibbler and his species are people and not pets should be a status quo changer.
Not really, because Nibblonians aren't common on Earth. For the longest time, they thought Leela's was the only one left in existence.

Who voices Nibbler? Is his VA to expensive to be a regular?
Frank Welker. You'll know him from his role as "virtually any animal you've ever heard in virtually any production that doesnt use pre-recorded animal sounds". :smallwink:

ETA: surprisingly good write-up on him here : https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Creator/FrankWelker

[Aedilred]

So... If they're doing this... I hope they utilize Nibbler and the Niblonians more.
...
Who voices Nibbler? Is his VA to expensive to be a regular?
I think the Niblonians generally - and Nibbler in his guise as "ancient source of knowledge" rather than "Leela's cute pet" - are best deployed sparingly. The odd nod to it would be one thing (like when they occasional to show Amy actually doing some science) but making Nibbler a full regular would be too much, I think.

[Bohandas]

Disenchantment feels like tired old writers tackling social issues in a world they no longer understand. It grabs some low-hanging fruit (Bean realizes she's some level of WSW; and no one really bats an eye), but then misses even straightforward other situations upon which they could have capitalized (Elfo is a 90's 'nice guy' character who doesn't exactly get put in place or called out about that behavior). It does seem to have a very 90s version of the unsympathetic protagonist setup (it's Seinfeld, not Rick and Morty)

If it was really like Seinfeld than it wouldn't be tackling social issues at all. That's the Seinfeld formula, "no hugging, no learning", and I wish there were more shows that followed it

[Willie the Duck]

If it was really like Seinfeld than it wouldn't be tackling social issues at all. That's the Seinfeld formula, "no hugging, no learning", and I wish there were more shows that followed it

90s with regard to unsympathetic protagonist. It was right there in the sentence.