Quick Question about Goodberry

[Khrysaes]

So..

Goodberry, summon 10 berries, each restoring 1 hp.

This works with life Cleric level 1, which makes each berry 4hp?

Disciple of Life
Also starting at 1st level, your healing spells are more effective. Whenever you use a spell of 1st level or higher to restore hit points to a creature, the creature regains additional hit points equal to 2 + the spell’s level.

BUT, does it work with Moon Sickle?

When you cast a spell that restores hit points, you can roll a d4 and add the number rolled to the amount of hit points restored, provided you are holding the sickle.

And if so, how?

Follow up with Wildfire druid
Whenever you cast a spell that deals fire damage or restores hit points while your wildfire spirit is summoned, roll a d8, and you gain a bonus equal to the number rolled to one damage or healing roll of the spell.

Arguably, they wouldn't work because the spell doesn't restore HP but summons berries that restore HP?

Relevant:
https://dnd.wizards.com/articles/sage-advice/rules-answers-august-2015

Spellcasting

If I’m a cleric/druid with the Disciple of Life feature, does the goodberry spell benefit from the feature? Yes. The Disciple of Life feature would make each berry restore 4 hit points, instead of 1, assuming you cast goodberry with a 1st-level spell slot.

Looking at the wording. It is the difference between “use a spell” and “cast a spell” to restore hit points.

[nickl_2000]

DM question. If you are the DM, then whatever feels right.

At my table, we played that you would create 14 goodberries instead of 10 and it would only heal 1 hp. Can't tell you RAW/RAI, but that seemed like a good compromise to keep the Life Cleric class ability without it being silly.


For the Wildfire Druid and the Moon Sickle, I would argue that the spell doesn't recover hit points. It creates the berries that recover the HP, so neither ability applies. However, I could see something similar as what we did with the Life Cleric. It didn't come up since we haven't had a Druid at the table since the Wildfire and Moon Sickle came out.

[Willie the Duck]

As always, DM's call. It is hardly overpowered, given the opportunity costs involved (if you want to create a druid/cleric multiclass with two specific archetypes and also search out a specific magic item, that's a hefty sunk cost). However, I always felt that the Life Cleric/Goodberry combo was an unintended confluence of specific rules wording (like they didn't realize when they made the Life Cleric feature that there would be a low-level spell that included ten distinct healing instances).

[JackPhoenix]

Follow up with Wildfire druid
Whenever you cast a spell that deals fire damage or restores hit points while your wildfire spirit is summoned, roll a d8, and you gain a bonus equal to the number rolled to one damage or healing roll of the spell.

There's no healing roll with Goodberry, so you can't add a bonus to non-existent roll.

[Khrysaes]

There's no healing roll with Goodberry, so you can't add a bonus to non-existent roll.

No, but there is one associated with moonsickle

[JackPhoenix]

No, but there is one associated with moonsickle

Nope, because Moonsickle isn't a spell.

[Chronos]

The sickle works when the spell is cast. Goodberry doesn't do any healing when the spell is cast, so RAW, there's no effect from the sickle. That said, I could see a houserule that you get 1d4 extra berries.

And Wildfire definitely doesn't do anything, because it only adds to rolls, and Goodberry never has any rolls.

[sithlordnergal]

The sickle works when the spell is cast. Goodberry doesn't do any healing when the spell is cast, so RAW, there's no effect from the sickle. That said, I could see a houserule that you get 1d4 extra berries.

And Wildfire definitely doesn't do anything, because it only adds to rolls, and Goodberry never has any rolls.

Disciple of Life works with Goodberry, as per Sage Advice, and it states "Also starting at 1st level, your healing spells are more effective. Whenever you use a spell of 1st level or higher to restore hit points to a creature, the creature regains additional hit points equal to 2 + the spell's level.". If you were correct then Goodberry wouldn't work with Disciple of Life. As such, both abilities work with Goodberry as well.

[Khrysaes]

Disciple of Life works with Goodberry, as per Sage Advice, and it states "Also starting at 1st level, your healing spells are more effective. Whenever you use a spell of 1st level or higher to restore hit points to a creature, the creature regains additional hit points equal to 2 + the spell's level.". If you were correct then Goodberry wouldn't work with Disciple of Life. As such, both abilities work with Goodberry as well.

Right, and there is the problems? Disciple of life says “use a spell”. Moonsickle and wild fire druid say “cast a spell”. Additionally, as mentioned the wildfire druid says it adds to a roll.

Here is the chain of logic i found on a reddit post that makes sense. For moon sickle.

1) Did you just cast a spell? If yes, continue.

2) Does the spell reference restoring hit points somewhere in its text? If yes, continue.

3) Roll a d4 and now act as if the text of the spell says "restore a number of hit points plus whatever the d4 roll was".

So lets say I cast goodberry. The spells says that "Eating a berry restores 1 hit point". If I'm holding my moon sickle, I roll a d4. Lets say I get a 2. Now we treat it as if the text of the spell says "Eating a berry restores 3 hit points". Each berry is the same and is determined when I cast the spell.

Step 4, my own logic applies wildfire druid.

4) because you now roll a 1d4 of healing for goodberry, as per enhances bond you roll a 1d8 and add that to the result. So goodberry would be upon cast
“Eating a berry restores 3+spell slot level+1d4+1d8 hit points. “

[Silpharon]

“Eating a berry restores 3+spell slot level+1d4+1d8 hit points.“

First take would be for neither to work, as the Life Cleric ability says "use a spell to" instead of "cast a spell that". The former implies intent to heal, the latter requires direct healing from the spell effect.

That said, as a DM, I'd allow the Moon Sickle trick. I think that level of semantic parsing is just not RAF (ruled as fun), and it doesn't really break anything. It's hard to fully know RAI given WotC didn't give rationale for their ruling on Life Cleric.

I would not allow the Wildfire trick. The d8 is added to a "healing roll of the spell", and the Moon Sickle does not add the roll to the spell, but rather restores extra hit points directly from the item's power.

So I'd allow 3+slot level+1d4 for each berry (where the roll is made once at casting).