Resilient - just a few questions

[Entessa]

1) Am I wrong, or if I've got more than one feat/race giving you the same feature, such as "bluff", you cannot get expertise on them only because you have two different things doing the same thing? I will explain better:
Human: variant - I take bluff
Level 4: I take actor - I get bluff again

I don't gain expertise on bluff, am I wrong ?

[Warder]

You're right, getting proficiency in something twice does not mean you get expertise. Only stuff that explicitely says you get expertise gives you expertise.

[Contrast]

Your proficiency bonus can’t be added to a single die roll or other number more than once. For example, if two different rules say you can add your proficiency bonus to a Wisdom saving throw, you nevertheless add the bonus only once when you make the save.

P173 of the Players Handbook if you want to read the whole thing.

[Entessa]

Thank you both.

[Pex]

Not all the time, but sometimes a feature that gives proficiency in something will say if you already have proficiency in it you may choose something else to get proficiency.

[Segev]

Not all the time, but sometimes a feature that gives proficiency in something will say if you already have proficiency in it you may choose something else to get proficiency.
And, in this vein, especially if you had a choice in the earlier-taken feature as to which proficiency to gain, you should ask your DM if it's okay if you re-choose the earlier one when you get the later one's proficiency.

Or just ask if you can choose a different proficiency of the same sort (language for language, skill for skill (possibly even same ability score), save for save, or tool for tool). It probably won't break anything.

[Devils_Advocate]

There's actually a general rule in the section on Backgrounds, under "Proficiencies" (which spellcheck reminds me isn't a real word because "proficiency" isn't a count noun) on PHB p. 125.


If a character would gain the same proficiency from two different sources, he or she can choose a different proficiency of the same kind (skill or tool) instead.
The interesting question is how to interpret the parenthetical. Is this limited to skills and tools? It doesn't explicitly say that it is. If it's not, then e.g. longsword proficiency becomes helpful to an Elf Rogue, because getting it from race and class means that you can gain proficiency with a finesse or ranged weapon that you might actually want to use. Heh!


I'm confused by the OP's example. Is "bluff" supposed to mean proficiency with the Deception skill? The Actor feat doesn't confer that, it gives advantage on some Deception and Performance rolls. Proficiency and advantage work together just fine.

[KorvinStarmast]

I'm confused by the OP's example. Is "bluff" supposed to mean proficiency with the Deception skill? The Actor feat doesn't confer that, it gives advantage on some Deception and Performance rolls. Proficiency and advantage work together just fine. Yeah, I guess we might ask them to review the PHB again and maybe clarify their question. :smallsmile: (3.x players still default to 3.x terms, right?)

[Entessa]

There's actually a general rule in the section on Backgrounds, under "Proficiencies" (which spellcheck reminds me isn't a real word because "proficiency" isn't a count noun) on PHB p. 125.


The interesting question is how to interpret the parenthetical. Is this limited to skills and tools? It doesn't explicitly say that it is. If it's not, then e.g. longsword proficiency becomes helpful to an Elf Rogue, because getting it from race and class means that you can gain proficiency with a finesse or ranged weapon that you might actually want to use. Heh!


I'm confused by the OP's example. Is "bluff" supposed to mean proficiency with the Deception skill? The Actor feat doesn't confer that, it gives advantage on some Deception and Performance rolls. Proficiency and advantage work together just fine. Yes, I meant deception skill. But I'm used to bluff since I've been a long time 3.5 player. Thanks for writing me that point you find on PHB p. 125. It's the first time I hear that, and I would bet my party too. Now the hard part is actually understanding how to interpret it.


Yeah, I guess we might ask them to review the PHB again and maybe clarify their question. :smallsmile: (3.x players still default to 3.x terms, right?)
you got me!