Help with Frostmaiden Encounter-Sephek Kaltro

[TheCleverGuy]

Running Rime of the Frostmaiden, and my level 2 party declined to fight Sephek Kaltro when they had him surrounded and isolated. I probably should have made him more aggressive, but the PCs never actually accused him of anything or made any aggressive moves themselves. Anyway, Torg's Caravan is headed from Bremen to Lonelywood, and the party decided to head off to Termalaine to look into the closed mine.

I'm thinking of setting up a new encounter where Sephek tries to murder the party members while they're sleeping at the Inn in Termalaine. They'll likely all be in separate rooms at the inn. My thought is that I'll have him attack a PC at random during the night, rolling his Stealth (only +2) against the PC's passive perception to see if they wake up. If they do wake up before being attacked they can yell to alert their friends, otherwise they'll take an attack when sleeping. Would that be an auto-crit, and are the chances of insta-killing a PC here too high? I figure if they survive the initial attack, their screams wake up the party anyway and its initiative as usual.

Also, should I enforce the rules about sleeping in armor/donning and doffing armor and such, or is it too punishing at low level to have them potentially fight unarmored? For reference the party includes a Barbarian, a Paladin, a Rogue, a Wizard (War Magic), and a Bard.

[Evaar]

Yes it would auto-crit, if they're asleep they are Unconscious.

This would very likely kill any level 2 character. Sephek makes two attacks per turn with 1d10+2d4+3 damage. If you're critting, make that 2d10+4d4+3. I just rolled that first attack randomly and did 20 damage. Presuming that wakes them up so they're only prone for the next hit and it's not a crit, I randomly rolled 14 damage.

So 34 damage in one round at level 2. If you're using fixed HP and your Barbarian has a +5 Constitution modifier (he doesn't), he would have 29 hit points at level 2.

And by the way, if Sephek is smart, he's not going to fail any stealth check because he can cast Misty Step 3/day without components (meaning he does it silently). So he can peer through the keyhole and get right next to their bed and start stabbin' all in one turn. Then he can probably just move onto the next one.

Sephek is a tough fight for an average low-level party. I would not recommend ambushing them with him.

Consider using other tools to provoke a confrontation with him if you need to. He can always murder someone else.

[Sigreid]

Why would he attack them if there is no beef between them? I really think you need a beef first.

[TheCleverGuy]

Autocrit does sound like bad news. I have to admit I am worried that Sephek by himself isn't going to be challenging enough in a straight fight. The party handily defeated a Yeti without any real trouble already, and it has the same CR.

I really like the idea that he's stalking them now, since he's pretty certain they suspect him of the original murders. What if I gave the party ample opportunity to spot him tailing them before he strikes?

[TheCleverGuy]

Why would he attack them if there is no beef between them? I really think you need a beef first.

They haven't accused him of anything, but they were poking around the caravan a lot and then trailed him to a tavern. They acted strangely enough to put him on guard, and his boss Torgga as well. Torgga would encourage him to take care of it quietly, or he'd just take it upon himself.

[rlc]

Autocrit does sound like bad news. I have to admit I am worried that Sephek by himself isn't going to be challenging enough in a straight fight. The party handily defeated a Yeti without any real trouble already, and it has the same CR.

I really like the idea that he's stalking them now, since he's pretty certain they suspect him of the original murders. What if I gave the party ample opportunity to spot him tailing them before he strikes?

Or, he isn’t worried about them at all now, so he continues doing what he’s been doing

[ProsecutorGodot]

Easiest solution is for him to not outright murder the first person he finds, but to have them bound and begin to question them. Make it a tense encounter where the PC who is interrogated by him has an opportunity to attempt to throw him off of the fact that they're directly investigating him. If they do a spectacularly bad job of that, at least they're awake at the beginning of combat and can make enough of a commotion to attract unwanted attention.

He's incredibly charismatic, makes friends easy and isn't terribly stupid. A good method for him to deal with a party member he still suspects is to knock them unconscious. Any signs of damage to him can be talked away as your now KO'd party member being in a drunken stupor and assaulting him. Said party member also has a negative reputation growing now off of lies spread by Sephek, as well as likely being blacklisted from dealing with Merchant's who associate closely with Torrga thanks to Sephek.

This is a bit of a change of direction for how you're advised to play him in the book but honestly I think it would be a lot more interesting if he wasn't just going to say "Yea, I did the murder(s), fight me"

[TheCleverGuy]

Easiest solution is for him to not outright murder the first person he finds, but to have them bound and begin to question them. Make it a tense encounter where the PC who is interrogated by him has an opportunity to attempt to throw him off of the fact that they're directly investigating him. If they do a spectacularly bad job of that, at least they're awake at the beginning of combat and can make enough of a commotion to attract unwanted attention.

He's incredibly charismatic, makes friends easy and isn't terribly stupid. A good method for him to deal with a party member he still suspects is to knock them unconscious. Any signs of damage to him can be talked away as your now KO'd party member being in a drunken stupor and assaulting him. Said party member also has a negative reputation growing now off of lies spread by Sephek, as well as likely being blacklisted from dealing with Merchant's who associate closely with Torrga thanks to Sephek.

This is a bit of a change of direction for how you're advised to play him in the book but honestly I think it would be a lot more interesting if he wasn't just going to say "Yea, I did the murder(s), fight me"

This is a great idea, thanks! I'll have to give it some thought.

[Keravath]

They haven't accused him of anything, but they were poking around the caravan a lot and then trailed him to a tavern. They acted strangely enough to put him on guard, and his boss Torgga as well. Torgga would encourage him to take care of it quietly, or he'd just take it upon himself.

It really depends on how you want to run it. However, if you have Sephek ambush them in their sleep and you play it realistically, the odds are good it will be a TPK as he eliminates the PCs one at a time. I'm assuming that isn't what you are looking for.


Depending on the party, even Sephek by himself could TPK the party if the rolls go the wrong way without ambushing them in their sleep. The typical d8 character will have 14 con and 17 hit points at level 2. One crit will likely put a character down even a regular hit at d10+2d4+3 averages 13.5 and hits 17 quite easily - and he gets two of them. On top of that Sephek has 75 hit points. A typical level 2 attack would be d8+3 or 7.5 damage on average assuming it hits - about a 70% chance for characters with a +3 stat. If there are 5 PCs making attacks each round then it would take about 3 rounds to take Sephek down. However, in that time Sephek stands a decent change of knocking at least 3 unconscious if not killing them.

Normally a CR3 would be a medium fight. However, besides 2 attacks for significant damage, Sephek also regenerates 5 hit points each round unless damaged by fire if he is in a cold place like outside. In fact, if he isn't damaged by fire, he can't die since the effect triggers at the start of his turn ... so Sephek will be popping up and delivering 2 more attacks unless it just happens that one of the characters is using fire damage. The players won't know about the regeneration and they may not have the tools or be able to figure out how to shut it down.

----

As for the players snooping around. Torgga is unlikely to give any instructions to Sephek to kill the characters unless she thinks they are after her. However, even then, she is only selling some stolen goods which the characters would likely find hard to prove (all her other nefarious activities would also be hard to prove - and she would probably know that). She does have a dead body in her sled but it is a fugitive with a bounty on their head so actually quite legal.

In addition, Torgga only cares about profits. She just looks the other way if some folks die when the caravan is in town. She isn't likely to get Sephek to go kill a bunch of characters on her orders since the inn is a public place - someone will likely see Sephek, especially when the characters start yelling and everyone in the inn tries to look and sees Sephek killing a bunch of folks. That WILL blow back on Torgga since Sephek is known to be her body guard and quite likely acting under her orders.

"Torrga is interested only in profits, turns a blind eye to Sephek's murderous escapades, and tries to help him as best she can without endangering her own life."

Finallly, Sephek is very unlikely to attack the players in an inn - it is far too warm. He loses his regeneration ability and his inability to be killed. If he wants to kill the characters it will be outside where he has the advantage.

Depending on what the characters have said to Sephek, he will either ignore them or hunt them down later. The fact that the characters are going off somewhere else and not following up on Sephek really sounds like they have missed some significant part of the plot line.

Hlin, the quest giver, is pretty clear about eliminating Sephek if he is guilty and if directly accused Sephek is likely to attack. If just asked questions he would deny it and move along.

"I will pay you a hundred gold pieces to apprehend Sephek Kaltro, ascertain his guilt, and deal with him, preferably without involving the authorities. When the job is done, return to me to collect your money."

It sounds to me that the players aren't sure he is responsible and can't find any further evidence so they are dropping it and moving on. They don't want to kill someone who is innocent, they don't want to confront him, and he has given them no reason to think he is guilty - so they are moving on to do something else.

One thing to keep in mind is that Sephek is actually undead. If there is a paladin in the party then using Divine Sense reveals this very clearly and could motivate the party to take action.

I'm guessing that the party just did not pick up on the hints from the quest giver.

1) Random people die when the caravan is in towns that sacrifice to the Frost Maiden. This has been going on for a while. ONLY these three towns, ONLY when the caravan is in town. (Sometimes you have to really connect the dots for the players - this implies someone associated with the caravan is committing the crimes).

2) Sephek is a body guard with the caravan. He is immune to the cold. This really needs to be emphasized. The temperature outside is -40 degrees or colder at night. Sephek wanders around the town wearing a vest, bare arms, head and hands with no coat. The players obviously didn't pick up on how crazy this really is. Everyone else is wearing thick furs, cold weather clothing, multiple layers, gloves, boots and they are still cold. Sephek is clearly far from normal. Even the goliaths who are used to the cold bundle up. He isn't even cold resistant, he is immune. Given that the land is engulfed by eternal darkness and cold due to the actions of the Frost Maiden - there is a connection that could be made there.

Although it is too late now, the best way to run this is usually to have the party catch up with the caravan in one of the towns where the murders happen. The party could then decide to follow him when he goes out, especially if they didn't get any conclusive answers when they talk to him. They could then see him stalking his next victim or Sephek might decide that the characters might make a suitable sacrifice to Auril. This forces the quest into the fight that it expects either because the characters get evidence watching him hunt or kill a citizen or because he attacks them. As mentioned, the party could also figure out he is undead which would also tend to initiate a conflict for most parties.



As it is now, play it like the sandbox it is, the characters have no proof, Sephek doesn't care since they aren't in his way to deal with more victims and Torgga doesn't care because they aren't interfering with her profits. The party goes to do something else. Have the party hear about another killing in another town with Sephek and the caravan, maybe even the town they just left. Perhaps also emphasize again how unusual Sephek is in terms of their lack of clothing. It is possible that hearing about more murders that they might have been able to prevent will encourage them to go and confront Sephek more directly the second time or at least try to follow him looking for proof one way or another.

[Porcupinata]

Why not have him be in the inn at Termalaine, but instead of having him attack the PCs, have them notice him act suspicouisly as he follows a lone person out.

Hopefully the PCs will get the hint and follow him, in which case they can rescue his victim and take him out.

Or worst case they do nothing and he kills his victim, and when the PCs find out that the person he followed was found dead then have more of a motive to confront him.

That's how I ran it, and my group did follow him out and killed him in an alley as he was in the process of attacking his victim.

[TheCleverGuy]

As it is now, play it like the sandbox it is, the characters have no proof, Sephek doesn't care since they aren't in his way to deal with more victims and Torgga doesn't care because they aren't interfering with her profits. The party goes to do something else. Have the party hear about another killing in another town with Sephek and the caravan, maybe even the town they just left. Perhaps also emphasize again how unusual Sephek is in terms of their lack of clothing. It is possible that hearing about more murders that they might have been able to prevent will encourage them to go and confront Sephek more directly the second time or at least try to follow him looking for proof one way or another.

That's the thing--they know he's undead already, they've put together that murders happen when the caravan is in town, they even managed to find the body in Torgga's sled and confront her about it (accepting it as legitimate bounty). They followed Sephek to a tavern waited until he left alone, had him surrounded in a deserted part of town, and then just talked to him without actually mentioning the murders and let him walk away!

I probably should have had him attack at that point, but now I'm not sure what to do. I'm starting to think that waiting until the party is in one of the bigger towns is a better idea. I had forgotten that his regen only works outdoors, so the inn attack is out.

[Keravath]

That's the thing--they know he's undead already, they've put together that murders happen when the caravan is in town, they even managed to find the body in Torgga's sled and confront her about it (accepting it as legitimate bounty). They followed Sephek to a tavern waited until he left alone, had him surrounded in a deserted part of town, and then just talked to him without actually mentioning the murders and let him walk away!

I probably should have had him attack at that point, but now I'm not sure what to do. I'm starting to think that waiting until the party is in one of the bigger towns is a better idea. I had forgotten that his regen only works outdoors, so the inn attack is out.

Weird :) ... the only guess I can make is that the players just haven't understood the information you've provided to them or they are intentionally deciding to not engage the quest.

They know he is undead. The quest giver told them that he is the likely killer. They know he is immune to cold. They know people die when he is in a town. However, when they chat with him they don't even mention the murders or ask him about them? What did they even talk to him about? Did they somehow decide that he was too dangerous to provoke and that they might die if they confronted him? I think you need to figure out why the players chose the specific course of action because there is something missing.

[TheCleverGuy]

They asked about his personal life and Torgga's sled dogs! *shrug*

[Doug Lampert]

They asked about his personal life and Torgga's sled dogs! *shrug*

So, it looks to him like the PCs are not interested in the murders.

Him ambushing them in the inn sounds like one of THOSE (https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20031017) plans. You know, the kind where we kill everybody that notices that we're killing people, and how do those plans always end? The dirigible inn is in flames, everybody is dead, and I've lost my hat. And any plan where you lose your hat is a bad plan.