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LibraryOgre
2022-03-12, 05:57 PM
Version 3

Hobelar - Ranger Subclass

The Hobelar is a ranger whose focus is horsemanship. Lightly armed and armored, they serve as scouts, skirmishers, or, not infrequently, simply mounted wanderers, ranging across prairies, even through bogs and forests, wherever their needs take them.

New Fighting Style:
*Horsemanship Fighting Style: While mounted, you gain at +1 to hit and +1 to damage. Most rangers who will become Hobelars will have chosen either Horsemanship, Dueling, or Archery fighting styles. This fighting style is available to Fighters, Paladins, and Rangers.

***

3rd level - Mounted Combatant: A consummate horseman, the Hobelar has advantage on melee attack rolls against targets smaller than their mount. If their mount is targeted by an attack, the Hobelar can choose for the attack to target the Hobelar themselves. Mounting requires only 5’ of movement. Lastly, if the mount is subjected to an effect which allows a Dexterity saving throw to take half damage, the mount takes no damage if the saving throw succeeds, and only half if it fails. If your game uses feats, and you have already selected Mounted Combatant, you may replace that feat with this feature.

3rd level - Horse Whisperer: A Hobelar is proficient in Animal Handling, and has advantage on Animal Handling checks regarding mounts. If the Hobelar was previously proficient in Animal Handling, they may choose another ranger skill to become proficient in.

3rd level - Hobelar’s Steed: At the end of a short or long rest, a Hobelar may declare one beast they are capable of riding as their Steed. Their Steed is charmed by them, can understand the Hobelar’s speech, and the Hobelar is mounted, they may choose to have any spell that they cast upon themselves also affect their steed. The Steed adds the Hobelar’s proficiency bonus to its AC, attack rolls, and saving throws, and has bonus hit points equal to the Hobelar’s level; these bonus hit points function like temporary hit points, in that they are deducted first, but may be healed with healing magic. Once the animal ceases to be the Hobelar’s steed, they lose any bonus hit points that may remain, as well as other bonuses. A Hobelar may have only one steed at a time.
The Steed may be any Large or Medium beast with no more than a ½ CR, and without a swimming or flying speed. Note that Medium characters cannot select a Medium beast.

7th level - Enhanced Mounts: The Hobelar excels at getting the most out of any mount. At the end of a short or long rest, the Hobelar may extend the following benefits to mounts that they cared for during that rest.
-+5 to speed
-Temporary Hit Points equal to the Hobelar’s proficiency bonus.
-+1 bonus to Armor Class
-The mount is under the effect of an Animal Friendship spell
The Hobelar may grant these bonuses to a number of mounts equal to their Proficiency Bonus, plus their wisdom bonus, in addition to their own mount. The bonuses last until the next short or long rest the Hobelar takes.

7th level - Ostler: Hobelars have a talent for dealing with horses, mules, and other riding beasts (including unusual or fantasy creatures, such as trained riding dogs, elk, or pegasi). When tending them with a healer’s kit during a short rest, they may expend a use of the kit to heal 1d6+4+mount’s Hit Dice worth of HP, in addition to any HD the mount may have spent to heal themselves. They may instead dispel one level of exhaustion, but cannot use a healer’s kit to dispel exhaustion from that mount again until the mount has completed a long rest. The Hobelar may treat a number of animals during a short rest equal to their proficiency bonus, but each will require a separate use of a healer’s kit (so, treating 4 horses requires 4 uses of the kit).

11th level - Primal Steed: The Hobelar draws upon their connection with nature, greatly enhancing their steed. They infuse their steed with primal energy, granting it abilities far beyond a normal beast of its type. The steed is friendly to the Hobelar and their companions and obeys the Hobelar’s commands. The animal now bears primal markings denoting its mystical nature.
The steed uses the statistics of a Primal Steed, below, or its own statistics, whichever are better; for example, if the steed usually has a strength of 18, it will use that instead of the Primal Steed’s 14; if it usually has a 13 Constitution, it will use the Primal Beast’s Constitution of 14. Items worn by or attuned to the steed disappear when the steed reaches 0 HP, but reappear when the next steed is empowered. When the Hobelar finishes a long rest, they may continue with their current steed, make changes to the optional abilities of their steed, or designate a new Primal Steed.
In combat, the steed acts on the Hobelar’s turn. It may move and use its reaction on its own, but the only action it takes is the Dodge action, unless the Hobelar uses their bonus action to direct it to take another action. That action can be one in its stat block, or some other action the steed is capable of. The Hobelar can also sacrifice one of their attacks when making the Attack action to command the steed to take the attack action. If the Hobelar is incapacitated, the steed may take any action of its choice, not just Dodge.

15th level - Master of Horses: While mounted, the Hobelar is a fearsome combatant. They cannot be dismounted against their will, and neither they nor their mount may be knocked prone. As a bonus action, the Hobelar may cast Cure Wounds, Jump, Longstrider, Barkskin, Lesser Restoration, Water Walk, and Stoneskin on their mount, provided they know the spell. They must still expend spell slots to do so. If their mount is their steed, these spells affect the Hobelar, as well.

***
Primal Steed
Medium or Large beast

Armor Class: 11 + Dexterity Bonus + Proficiency bonus
Hit Points: 5 + (3+Constitution Bonus) times the ranger level; the steed has hit dice equal to the Hobelar’s ranger level.
Speed: 40’

Str 14 (+2)
Dex 14 (+2)
Con 15 (+2)
Int 8 (-1)
Wis 14 (+2)
Cha 11 (+0)

Senses Darkvision 60’, passive perception 12+PB
Languages: Understands the language spoken by its summoner
Challenge –
Proficiency Bonus: equal to summoner’s

Primal Bond: The Primal Steed adds its summoner’s proficiency bonus to any ability check or saving through the steed makes

Natural Bond: The Primal Steed is able to use the following abilities, when its Hobelar acquires them: Land’s Stride, Hide in Plain Sight, Vanish, Feral Sense, and Foe Slayer (using the Hobelar’s Favored Enemies).

Optional Features (choose 2; may choose those marked * twice)
*Agile: Add +2 to the Steed’s Dexterity.
Aquatic: The Steed has a swimming speed equal to its base speed. It can breathe underwater, and so may its Hobelar, so long as they remain mounted.
Armored: The Steed’s Armor Class increases to 13 + Dexterity Bonus + Proficiency Bonus
Charger: The Steed may make a charging attack. If they move at least 20 feet in a straight line towards the target, then hits with an attack that same turn, the target takes an additional 1d6 damage (of the type of the attack). If the target is a creature, it must succeed on a Strength saving throw against the Hobelar’s spell save DC or be knocked prone.
*Fast: The Steed gains a +10 to their speed
Flyer: The Steed has a flying speed equal to its base speed.
Quick: The Steed may Disengage or Dash as a bonus action
*Strong: Add +2 to the Steed’s Strength.
*Tough: Add +2 to the Steed’s Constitution.
*Vicious: The Steed does an additional die of damage with its attacks.

Optional Actions (choose 1)
*Hooves. Melee Weapon attack: the Hobelar’s spell attack modifier to hit, reach 5 ft, one target. Hit: 1d8 + Strength Bonus + proficiency bonus bludgeoning damage.
*Claws: Melee Weapon attack: the Hobelar’s spell attack modifier to hit, reach 5 ft, one target. Hit: 1d8 + Strength Bonus + proficiency bonus slashing damage.
*Bite: Melee Weapon attack: the Hobelar’s spell attack modifier to hit, reach 5 ft, one target. Hit: 1d8 + Strength Bonus + proficiency bonus bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing damage.
*Tail Slap: Melee Weapon attack: the Hobelar’s spell attack modifier to hit, reach 5 ft, one target. Hit: 1d8 + Strength Bonus + proficiency bonus bludgeoning damage.



Hobelar - Ranger Subclass

The Hobelar is a ranger whose focus is horsemanship. Lightly armed and armored, they serve as scouts, skirmishers, or, not infrequently, simply mounted wanderers, ranging across prairies, even through bogs and forests, wherever their needs take them.

New Fighting Style:
*Horsemanship Fighting Style: While mounted, the warrior gains +1 to hit and +1 to damage.

***

3rd level - Mounted Combatant: A consummate horseman, the Hobelar has advantage on melee attack rolls against targets smaller than their mount. If their mount is targeted by an attack, the Hobelar can choose for the attack to target the Hobelar themselves. Mounting requires only 5’ of movement. Lastly, if the mount is subjected to an effect which allows a Dexterity saving throw to take half damage, the mount takes no damage if the saving throw succeeds, and only half if it fails.

3rd level - Horse Whisperer: A Hobelar is proficient in Animal Handling, and has advantage on Animal Handling checks regarding mounts. If the Hobelar was previously proficient in Animal Handling, they may choose another ranger skill to become proficient in.

3rd level - Hobelar’s Steed: At the end of a short or long rest, a Hobelar may declare one beast they are capable of riding as their Steed. Their Steed is charmed by them, can understand the Hobelar’s speech, and the Hobelar is mounted, they may choose to have any spell that they cast upon themselves also affect their steed. The Steed adds the Hobelar’s proficiency bonus to its AC, attack rolls, and saving throws, and has bonus hit points equal to the Hobelar’s level; these bonus hit points function like temporary hit points, in that they are deducted first, but may be healed with healing magic. Once the animal ceases to be the Hobelar’s steed, they lose any bonus hit points that may remain, as well as other bonuses. A Hobelar may have only one steed at a time.
The Steed may be any Large or Medium beast (medium in the case of small hobelars) with no more than a ½ CR, and without a swimming or flying speed.

7th level - Enhanced Mounts: The Hobelar excels at getting the most out of any mount. At the end of a short or long rest, the Hobelar may extend the following benefits to mounts that they cared for during that rest.
-+5 to speed
-Temporary Hit Points equal to the Hobelar’s proficiency bonus.
-+1 bonus to Armor Class
-The mount is under the effect of an Animal Friendship spell
The Hobelar may grant these bonuses to a number of mounts equal to their Proficiency Bonus, plus their wisdom bonus, in addition to their own mount. The bonuses last until the next short or long rest the Hobelar takes.

7th level - Ostler: Hobelars have a talent for dealing with horses, mules, and other riding beasts (including unusual or fantasy creatures, such as trained riding dogs, elk, or pegasi). When tending them with a healer’s kit during a short rest, they may expend a use of the kit to heal 1d6+4+mount’s Hit Dice worth of HP, in addition to any HD the mount may have spent to heal themselves. They may instead dispel one level of exhaustion, but cannot use a healer’s kit to dispel exhaustion from that mount again until the mount has completed a long rest. The Hobelar may treat a number of animals during a short rest equal to their proficiency bonus, but each will require a separate use of a healer’s kit (so, treating 4 horses requires 4 uses of the kit).

11th level - Primal Steed: The Hobelar draws upon their connection with nature, greatly enhancing their steed. They infuse their steed with primal energy, enhancing it far beyond a normal beast of its type. The steed is friendly to the Hobelar and their companions and obeys the Hobelar’s commands. The animal now bears primal markings denoting its mystical nature.
The steed uses the statistics of a Primal Steed, below, or its own statistics, whichever are better. Items worn by or attuned to the steed disappear when the steed reaches 0 HP, but reappear when the steed is summoned again. As with Find Steed, a steed may be dismissed with an action, if the Hobelar wishes to summon a different steed. When the Hobelar finishes a long rest, they may summon their steed again, if it has died. The steed appears in an unoccupied space within five feet of them.
In combat, the steed acts on the Hobelar’s turn. It may move and use its reaction on its own, but the only action it takes is the Dodge action, unless the Hobelar uses their bonus action to direct it to take another action. That action can be one in its stat block, or some other action the steed is capable of. The Hobelar can also sacrifice one of their attacks when making the Attack action to command the steed to take the attack action. If the Hobelar is incapacitated, the steed may take any action of its choice, not just Dodge.

15th level - Master of Horses: While mounted, the Hobelar is a fearsome combatant. They cannot be dismounted against their will, and neither they nor their mount may be knocked prone. As a bonus action, the Hobelar may cast Cure Wounds, Jump, Longstrider, Barkskin, Lesser Restoration, Water Walk, and Stoneskin on their mount, provided they know the spell. They must still expend spell slots to do so. If their mount is their steed, these spells affect the Hobelar, as well.

****

Primal Steed
Medium or Large beast

Armor Class: 11 + Dexterity Bonus + Proficiency bonus
Hit Points: 5 + (3+Beast's Constitution Bonus) times the ranger level; the steed has hit dice equal to the Hobelar’s ranger level.
Speed: 40’

Str 14 (+2)
Dex 14 (+2)
Con 15 (+2)
Int 8 (-1)
Wis 14 (+2)
Cha 11 (+0)

Senses Darkvision 60’, passive perception 12+PB
Languages: Understands the language spoken by its summoner
Challenge –
Proficiency Bonus: equal to summoner’s

Primal Bond: The Primal Steed adds its summoner’s proficiency bonus to any ability check or saving through the steed makes

Natural Bond: The Primal Steed is able to use the following abilities, when its Hobelar acquires them: Land’s Stride, Hide in Plain Sight, Vanish, Feral Sense, and Foe Slayer (using the Hobelar’s Favored Enemies).

Optional Features (choose 2)
Agile: The Steed may Disengage or Dash as a bonus action
Armored: The Steed’s Armor Class increases to 13 + Dexterity Bonus + Proficiency Bonus
Charger: The Steed may make a charging attack. If they move at least 20 feet in a straight line towards the target, then hits with an attack that same turn, the target takes an additional 1d6 damage (of the type of the attack). If the target is a creature, it must succeed on a Strength saving throw against the Hobelar’s spell save DC or be knocked prone.
Fast: The Steed gains a +10 to their speed
Tough: The Steed gains additional HP equal to the Hobelar’s level; these bonus hit points stack with those imparted by the Hobelar's Steed ability.
Vicious: The Steed does an additional d6 damage with its attacks.

Optional Actions (choose 1)
*Hooves. Melee Weapon attack: the Hobelar’s spell attack modifier to hit, reach 5 ft, one target. Hit: 1d8 + Strength Bonus + proficiency bonus bludgeoning damage.
*Claws: Melee Weapon attack: the Hobelar’s spell attack modifier to hit, reach 5 ft, one target. Hit: 1d8 + Strength Bonus + proficiency bonus slashing damage.
*Bite: Melee Weapon attack: the Hobelar’s spell attack modifier to hit, reach 5 ft, one target. Hit: 1d8 + Strength Bonus + proficiency bonus bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing damage.
*Tail Slap: Melee Weapon attack: the Hobelar’s spell attack modifier to hit, reach 5 ft, one target. Hit: 1d8 + Strength Bonus + proficiency bonus bludgeoning damage.

(Unique options may be available; a primal steed that appears to be a Stegosaurus may have a tail sweep that does piercing damage, but it will keep these basic statistics)



Hobelar - Ranger Subclass

The Hobelar is a ranger whose focus is horsemanship. Lightly armed and armored, they serve as scouts, skirmishers, or, not infrequently, simply mounted wanderers, ranging across prairies, even through bogs and forests, wherever their needs take them. (Unlike most of my subclasses these days, this is not a ranger that's also a bit something else; this is just straight-up light cavalry)

3rd level - Horsemanship Fighting Style: While mounted, you gain at +1 to hit and +1 to damage. Most rangers who will become Hobelars will have chosen either the Dueling or Archery fighting styles.

3rd level - Mounted Combatant: A consummate horseman, the Hobelar has advantage on melee attack rolls against targets smaller than their mount. If their mount is targeted by an attack, the Hobelar can choose for the attack to target the Hobelar themselves. Mounting requires only 5’ of movement. Lastly, if the mount is subjected to an effect which allows a Dexterity saving throw to take half damage, the mount takes no damage if the saving throw succeeds, and only half if it fails.

3rd level - Ostler: Hobelars have a talent for dealing with horses, mules, and other riding beasts (including unusual or fantasy creatures, such as trained riding dogs, elk, or pegasi). When tending them with a healer’s kit during a short rest, they may expend a use of the kit to heal 1d6+4+mount’s Hit Dice worth of HP, in addition to any HD the mount may have spent to heal themselves. They may instead dispel one level of exhaustion, but cannot use a healer’s kit to dispel exhaustion from that mount again until the mount has completed a long rest. The Hobelar may treat a number of animals during a short rest equal to their proficiency bonus, but each will require a separate use of a healer’s kit (so, treating 4 horses requires 4 uses of the kit).

3rd level - Horse Whisperer: A Hobelar is proficient in Animal Handling, and has advantage on Animal Handling checks regarding mounts. If the Hobelar was previously proficient in Animal Handling, they may choose another ranger skill to become proficient in. Additionally, Find Steed is added to the Hobelar’s spell list as a Ritual that they can perform beginning at 3rd level.

7th level - Enhanced Mounts: The Hobelar excels at getting the most out of any mount. At the end of a short or long rest, the Hobelar may extend the following benefits to mounts that they cared for during that rest.
-+5 to speed
-Temporary Hit Points equal to the Hobelar’s proficiency bonus.
-+1 bonus to Armor Class
-The mount is under the effect of an Animal Friendship spell
The Hobelar may grant these bonuses to a number of mounts equal to their Proficiency Bonus, plus their own mount. The bonuses last until the next short or long rest the Hobelar takes.

11th level - Primal Steed: The steed summoned by a Hobelar’s “Find Steed” ritual is greatly enhanced. The Hobelar infuses their steed with primal energy, allowing it to draw strength from their bond with nature. The steed is friendly to the Hobelar and their companions and obeys the Hobelar’s commands. The animal now bears primal markings denoting its mystical nature.
The steed uses the statistics of a Primal Steed, below, or its own statistics, whichever are better. Items worn by or attuned to the steed disappear when the steed reaches 0 HP, but reappear when the steed is summoned again. As with Find Steed, a steed may be dismissed with an action, if the Hobelar wishes to summon a different steed. When the Hobelar finishes a long rest, they may summon their steed again, if it has died. The steed appears in an unoccupied space within five feet of them.
In combat, the steed acts on the Hobelar’s turn. It may move and use its reaction on its own, but the only action it takes is the Dodge action, unless the Hobelar uses their bonus action to direct it to take another action. That action can be one in its stat block, or some other action the steed is capable of. The Hobelar can also sacrifice one of their attacks when making the Attack action to command the steed to take the attack action. If the Hobelar is incapacitated, the steed may take any action of its choice, not just Dodge.

15th level - Master of Horses: While mounted, the Hobelar is a fearsome combatant. The bonuses from Horsemanship Fighting Style double to +2 to Hit and +2 to damage. They cannot be dismounted against their will, and neither they nor their mount may be knocked prone. As a bonus action, the Hobelar may cast Cure Wounds, Jump, Longstrider, Barkskin, Lesser Restoration, Water Walk, and Stoneskin on their mount, provided they know the spell. They must still expend spell slots to do so. If their mount is their steed, these spells affect the Hobelar, as well.

***

Primal Steed
Medium or Large beast

Armor Class: 11 + Dexterity Bonus + Proficiency bonus
Hit Points: 5 + (3+Constitution Bonus) times the ranger level; the steed has hit dice equal to the Hobelar’s ranger level.
Speed: 40’

Str 14 (+2)
Dex 14 (+2)
Con 15 (+2)
Int 8 (-1)
Wis 14 (+2)
Cha 11 (+0)

Senses Darkvision 60’, passive perception 12+PB
Languages: Understands the language spoken by its summoner
Challenge –
Proficiency Bonus: equal to summoner’s

Primal Bond: The Primal Steed adds its summoner’s proficiency bonus to any ability check or saving through the steed makes

Natural Bond: The Primal Steed is able to use the following abilities, when its Hobelar acquires them: Land’s Stride, Hide in Plain Sight, Vanish, Feral Sense, and Foe Slayer (using the Hobelar’s Favored Enemies).

Optional Features (choose 2)
Agile: The Steed may Disengage or Dash as a bonus action
Armored: The Steed’s Armor Class increases to 13 + Dexterity Bonus + Proficiency Bonus
Charger: The Steed may make a charging attack. If they move at least 20 feet in a straight line towards the target, then hits with an attack that same turn, the target takes an additional 1d6 damage (of the type of the attack). If the target is a creature, it must succeed on a Strength saving throw against the Hobelar’s spell save DC or be knocked prone.
Fast: The Steed gains a +10 to their speed
Tough: The Steed gains additional HP equal to the Hobelar’s level; these stack with those granted by Enhanced Mounts.
Viscous: The Steed does an additional d6 damage with its attacks.

Optional Actions (choose 1)
*Hooves. Melee Weapon attack: the Hobelar’s spell attack modifier to hit, reach 5 ft, one target. Hit: 1d8 + Strength Bonus + proficiency bonus bludgeoning damage.
*Claws: Melee Weapon attack: the Hobelar’s spell attack modifier to hit, reach 5 ft, one target. Hit: 1d8 + Strength Bonus + proficiency bonus slashing damage.
*Bite: Melee Weapon attack: the Hobelar’s spell attack modifier to hit, reach 5 ft, one target. Hit: 1d8 + Strength Bonus + proficiency bonus bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing damage.
*Tail Slap: Melee Weapon attack: the Hobelar’s spell attack modifier to hit, reach 5 ft, one target. Hit: 1d8 + Strength Bonus + proficiency bonus bludgeoning damage.

(Unique options may be available; a primal steed that appears to be a Stegosaurus may have a tail sweep that does piercing damage, but it will keep these basic statistics)

Loek
2022-03-13, 08:10 AM
I'm going to go over these per level instead of per feature, to see how much they'd be getting at each of them.
Also, I should note that unless a campaign is very mount oriented, this is going to be a bit of a oddball class. So I'm going to rate this as if it's in a mounted campaign. (In a normal one, you can do pretty much whatever and the fact that you often can't benefit from it will balance things out)

Level 3:
The ranger gets:

The Mounted Combatant Feat
An improved, but limited to mounts, Healer Feat
A bonus proficiency
A paladin spell 2 levels before the paladins themselves get it
and a numerical boost when mounted


Generally, I'm not a fan of giving out (close to/exactly the same as) feats as class features. But in this case, in a game without feats at level up... maybe.
The find steed spell should be kicked to the correct level either way, so at 5th level. (Unless you make this your "animal companion" type critter, which might work...)
Overal this level is clunky, makes this character a god among animal wranglers and still somehow manages to feel bland.
I think I'd do the following:

Drop the fighting style (+1's are boring and while useful, they don't do much flavour wise)
Pick either the find steed spell or the Ostler thing. So either they have a magical horse they don't need to do much for, or they care for their own and their companions horses - If you keep find steed, eventually upgrade to the greater steed critters)
And add something, some action/bonus action that they can do while riding. An attack? A movement option? Something they can activate and do differently then the other people on the other mounts.




Level 7:
This is a weird one... again small numerical boosts, which aren't really fun, but can be helpful.
Then the proficiency mod + own, which means they can boost 4 mounts... which is great with a 4 person team... but awkward with a 5-6 person party.
The animal friendship thing is theoretically fun RP material... but how many people do you know that will willingly ride a hostile animal for more then that quick "must escape sequence"?
Like I said at the beginning... in a normal campaign none of this would even rate close to "good enough", but in a "ride of ride" campaign, it might very well break the balance in half.
Very hard to rate, but on a whole it feels both potentially powerful (numbers) and lacking (it doesn't give you much to do and it's more a standard "always on" type bonus after a certain point)



The rest is... hard for me to judge, so I don't think I will.
Though I do wanna say that I really like the ability to cast certain "self" spells on their mount. I'd probably move this up, say to that level 7 feature instead?

LibraryOgre
2022-03-13, 10:25 AM
I'm going to go over these per level instead of per feature, to see how much they'd be getting at each of them.
Also, I should note that unless a campaign is very mount oriented, this is going to be a bit of a oddball class.

Oh, this is ABSOLUTELY an oddball if you're not in a mount-oriented campaign. They get pretty much no features that are helpful without a mount.



Level 3:
The ranger gets:

The Mounted Combatant Feat
An improved, but limited to mounts, Healer Feat
A bonus proficiency
A paladin spell 2 levels before the paladins themselves get it
and a numerical boost when mounted


Part of the reason for the bonus is to create an explicit Horsemanship fighting style that a Fighters and Paladins can take. The Mounted Combat feat is there because otherwise, in a game with feats, it becomes a feat tax. And the Paladin spell is partially to make sure they're never without a mount, since it's so central to their abilities... it is an "animal companion", which gets upgraded at level 11.

Seems like Hostler might be a good idea to move to 7th level, with the ability to treat and improve mounts. And perhaps a bonus action to let the mount Dash, in addition to their own movement? This makes them very fast, compared to other mounted



Level 7:
This is a weird one... again small numerical boosts, which aren't really fun, but can be helpful.
Then the proficiency mod + own, which means they can boost 4 mounts... which is great with a 4 person team... but awkward with a 5-6 person party.
The animal friendship thing is theoretically fun RP material... but how many people do you know that will willingly ride a hostile animal for more then that quick "must escape sequence"?


Part of the reason for the proficiency mod + own for enhancing mounts was to give them a bit of growth; while at low level, they can handle a few party members, at higher levels, they can handle a larger party. I agree, the Animal Friendship part is mostly a meaningless bonus but, as you observed, it lets them eventually get control of a horse that doesn't like them.



The rest is... hard for me to judge, so I don't think I will.
Though I do wanna say that I really like the ability to cast certain "self" spells on their mount. I'd probably move this up, say to that level 7 feature instead?

The Primal Steed is a slightly better version of the ACF for Beastmaster rangers of Primal Beast, out of TCoE. Beastmasters get this at 3rd level, but this has a little bit extra (largely that they can use a regular steed's attributes instead of the primal beast's). Due to using Find Steed, they can already share spells with their steed when mounted... but I liked the idea that they could throw some spells to their mount quickly.

Thanks for the feedback. I'll play with this later.

Loek
2022-03-13, 03:33 PM
Ah, thank you for your insight, that helps.

I'd still be tempted to move the fighting style to just that, a fighting style that's available to classes X, Y, Z. Instead of granting it as a bonus.

As for the find steed. Understandable, but I'd then say that they aren't getting the ritual spell, but an actual class feature (which means you can set things like time to summon, time to wait if it dies, and more flavor/systems), and have the creature that class feature summons, use the stats of the find steed creature.
This way, you can layer the primal steed feature on top of that, when they get to that level. Streamlining the whole, while at the same time making it more unique to this class.


For level 7, yeah, move Ostler here, and I dunno... make it prof+wis mod mounts, instead? So you don't end up with 1 or 2 slow folk.
(A nice balance between maybe too few, and some arbitrary large amount. And with both numbers still able to grow, you might get enough to boost that guard/NPC/friend's mount as well?)

LibraryOgre
2022-03-15, 07:25 PM
New version up.

TL;DR

1) Horsemanship Fighting Style now independent; would-be Hobelars should probably learn that, Archery, or One-handed, but they don't have to.
2) Hobelar's Steed is now not magical, but a designation Hobelars give to a particular beast. Notably, they get bonus HP, but lose damage bonuses from Ranger's Animal Companions
3) Ostler moved to level 7.
4) Enhanced Mounts now applies to prof bonus + wisdom bonus + ostler's own mount.

They're still premier horsemen. But they're hyper-specialized... if they don't have a suitable mount, they don't get much.

Loek
2022-03-16, 11:00 AM
I like the improvements. So now we go on to the small details, to polish things off.

3rd level - Mounted Combatant: It's possible someone will play a variant human and pick the mounted combatant feat at level 1, so I'd add something along the lines of "If you already posses the Mounted Combatant feat, you can pick another feat instead" just to be thorough.

3rd level - Hobelar’s Steed: The size limitation is a good idea (though I'd make it specific so "large for a medium hobelar and medium for a small hobelar" to avoid the tiny gnome on a warhorse thing. (Unless you meant that the medium steed is only an option for the small creatures instead?)
But, more importantly, the limitations should probably relax as they increase in levels. Making flying, swimming and fighting mounts eventually possible for the steed. (But possibly staying away from truly sentient ones... or at least work differently on them)

7th level - Enhanced Mounts: "mounts that they cared for during that rest" <== not really needed, but it seems to be something that 5e does a lot. Maybe specify an amount of time they should spend taking care of them? (Will mostly be irrelevant, but x time studying/meditating is often specified in various classes.

11th level - Primal Steed: First of, please go through the language of this one again, as there's still some mention of summoning the mount, which no longer is relevant.
Beyond this... the stats for the primal steed are... a weird mix of mounts and animal companions (I'm guessing, as I don't do rangers much).
Before I dive to deeply into this one, how are you envisioning this. Does the hobelar pick between the full "primal steed" block and the beasts normal stat block? Or do they pick the best option for each section/stat?

(Ignoring optional features for a second)
But yeah, the primal steed block isn't great. It's equal to, or less than most common mounts (Camel, riding horse and warhorse seriously outpace it)
Strength wise, it's again outclassed by a number of normal mounts (Elephant, warhorse, camel)
And for a good number of these, the attacks will be seriously nerfed as well. (Also, how does bite work, do they count as all 3 types? Or the most beneficial one or does it do triple damage? once for each type?)
Mostly, only AC, HP and sight really get a buff.


Instead, my suggestion would be (combined with expanding the pool of potential mounts as you level up, as mentioned in the 3rd level feature) that I would recommend to have this not have their own stat block, but instead be "Like the base creature, but with the following increases... type thing)

And my suggestion would be:

Default increase to these mental stats (or getting which ever is higher, the normal stat or the one granted by primal steed)
Add darkvision
Increase HP by a certain amount (1 to 3 + con mod times the ranger level would be an interesting place to start)
Something with AC, I'm thinking a flat bonus related to the base creature instead of this new calculation, but I'm not sure (Would still need to respond to Dex increases/decreases I think)
Add primal bond and natural bond
And give them 1 or 2 of the optional features (hobelar's choice)
And if the base creature normally doesn't have an attack, then they can pick one attack as suitable for the creature


Assuming a change like mentioned above, some tweaks to the optional features:

Strong +2 Str (can be picked twice)
Dexterous +2 Dex (can be picked twice)
Tough +2 Con (can be picked twice)
Armored +2 AC
Fast +10ft (can be picked twice)
Vicious +x damage (or 1dx)
Accurate +1/+2 to hit?



This way the uniqueness comes from the base critter. While the blessings (which can change every time you "re-primal" something) means you get to tweak things on the go.


Anyhow, enough rambling. I hope the small finishing touches on the early bit and the, admittedly spitballed, bigger ideas for the later feature inspires you.

LibraryOgre
2022-03-16, 12:22 PM
I like the improvements. So now we go on to the small details, to polish things off.

3rd level - Mounted Combatant: It's possible someone will play a variant human and pick the mounted combatant feat at level 1, so I'd add something along the lines of "If you already posses the Mounted Combatant feat, you can pick another feat instead" just to be thorough.

Good point.


3rd level - Hobelar’s Steed: The size limitation is a good idea (though I'd make it specific so "large for a medium hobelar and medium for a small hobelar" to avoid the tiny gnome on a warhorse thing. (Unless you meant that the medium steed is only an option for the small creatures instead?)
But, more importantly, the limitations should probably relax as they increase in levels. Making flying, swimming and fighting mounts eventually possible for the steed. (But possibly staying away from truly sentient ones... or at least work differently on them)

I think I'm more inclined to make those options for Primal mounts, rather than expanding the base options. The problem with expanding the base option, to my mind, is leaving it beast. You want a pegasus? That's a celestial. A griffon? That's a monstrosity... but so is a minotaur. And an ankheg. While there's a certain beauty in a dwarf riding into battle on the back of a bullette, I tend to think that's an entirely different character.



11th level - Primal Steed: First of, please go through the language of this one again, as there's still some mention of summoning the mount, which no longer is relevant.
Beyond this... the stats for the primal steed are... a weird mix of mounts and animal companions (I'm guessing, as I don't do rangers much).
Before I dive to deeply into this one, how are you envisioning this. Does the hobelar pick between the full "primal steed" block and the beasts normal stat block? Or do they pick the best option for each section/stat?

Best for each. It's part of why I changed it from the base primal beast stats to mention specific attribute bonuses (qv in HP, from 5 to 3 + Con bonus).

For example, a warhorse has a 18 12 13; Primal Steed is 14 14 14. Primal Warhorse will then be 18 14 14, with an 8 intelligence, rather than a warhorse's 2. Primal Steed is 40' movement; Primal Warhorse is 60'.

I really like what you're suggesting, though, and really appreciate the feedback.