One PC, four classes. What do you build?

[Wasp]

What would be your favorite choice of four different classes and subclasses to use in one chatacter? What has to be considered to make this a viable character?

Let's say the assumption is to go to level 20 (alternatively level 12). Point Buy, feats allowed.

[kazaryu]

What would be your favorite choice of four different classes and subclasses to use in one chatacter? What has to be considered to make this a viable character?

Let's say the assumption is to go to level 20 (alternatively level 12). Point Buy, feats allowed.

lvl 5 hexblade tomelock (AB, repelling blast, X)
lvl 5 divine soul sorc (Quicken, transmute)
lvl 5 diviner wizard
lvl 5 tempest cleric

as long as you start with 2 levels in warlock the build should always be viable, alternatively starting with the 5 levels in sorcerer (also gets you that con save prof), then move into warlock. either way for the first several levels you're basically a sorlock. at level 10 you start to get weird, but with EB/AB scaling you've always got a reliable EB->quick EB to fall back on for damage. Other than that you have tons of options in terms of comboing. someone hits you? upcast hellish rebuke transmuted to lightning/thunder, then maximize. several melee mooks? upcast armor of agathys and cast blade ward. essentialyl the goal is to function somewhere between a ranger and a full caster. obviously you're not gonna be doing huge flashy magic, but you're also not as limited as half casters are. party needs someone up front? shadowblade+GFB/BB. need some extra support? you can cast bless to free up the clerics concentration. need focused dpr? hexblade curse+hex+scorching ray (transmuted if neccesary to dodge resistance/immunity.

and thats without even getting into feats. metamagic adept would be pretty gnarly for some more options (twin healing word for example). warcaster, elven accuracy. go halfling and go for bountiful luck.

realistically the exact subclasses taken would tend to be more reflective of the character themselves. hexblade is jsut...really strong. but you could go genie for a bit more consistent damage (rather than relying on hexblades curse). or GOO if you want telepathy, celestial for some charges of healing word, that don't count as spells so you can healing word and still cast a full spell that turn, etc. shadow sorc for a poormans darkness devilsight combo. but yeah...thats the basic idea.

[animorte]

I love this theme I started! Shout out to all you other great ideas! XD

Quite sad to say, I can't multiclass one Warlock into 3 other Warlock subclasses... Fine, I'll do something else.

Cantrips:
VHuman, 1st level feat Magic Initiate, 4th level ASI feat Spell Sniper - 4
(10) Celestial Warlock (Pact of the Tome) - 9
(6) Sorcerer: Draconic Bloodline - 5
(2) Cleric: Arcana Domain - 5
(2) Wizard: School of Illusion - 4

So that's a total of about = 27 (I think)
Exceptional amount of utility through all the cantrips you could ever need from any class. Also additional damage boosts = CHA on fire, radiant, eldritch blast, and draconic element from Radiant Soul, Agonizing Blast, and Elemental Affinity. I could also choose Elemental Adept feat for additional damage, but maxing Charisma is more important.

If I only wanted obscene amounts of cantrips (yeah I know right, haha), drop several levels of both Warlock and Sorcerer, replace them with Lore Bard (6) for 5 more and Land Druid (2) for 3 more. I would also get Strixhaven Initiate feat for 2 more. Alas I chose a route through which to actually make the build slightly more viable, also a limit of 4 classes.

I have another more legitimate build, but ran out of time tonight...

[Amechra]

Hmm...

Hexblade Warlock 4/[Insert Subclass Here] Paladin 7/Lore Bard 5/Swashbuckler Rogue 3. Probably not in that order, but screw any ability score that isn't called Charisma, apparently.

[animorte]

but screw any ability score that isn't called Charisma, apparently.

There you go, you win at Warlocks.

[Catullus64]

Here's a throwback for you: a 1st-Edition Bard.

Fighter 5/Rogue 5/Druid 5/Bard 5

Fighter Archetype would be Battlemaster.

Rogue would be Thief, naturally.

Druid would be Circle of Dreams.

Bard would be College of Lore.

[Wasp]

I love this theme I started! Shout out to all you other great ideas! XD

Quite sad to say, I can't multiclass one Warlock into 3 other Warlock subclasses... Fine, I'll do something else.

You started a good thing! And i think we might have our next thread, I love reading about mixing subclasses!

Now, I think there are different difficulty levels to this challenge.

1. All classes and subclasses allowed
2. No Hexblade
3. No Warlock
4. No CHA based classes 😉

[ftafp]

What would be your favorite choice of four different classes and subclasses to use in one chatacter? What has to be considered to make this a viable character?

Let's say the assumption is to go to level 20 (alternatively level 12). Point Buy, feats allowed.

4 classes pretty much rules out any full caster build. I'd have to say

Race: Bugbear
Class: Gloomstalker 5/Assassin 4/Battle Master 4/Wildfire 7
Progression: Gloomstalker 1-5, Assassin 1-3, Battle Master 1-2, Assassin 4, Battle Master 3-4, Wildfire 1-7
Base Stats: 8 Str, 17 Dex, 14 Con, 12 Int, 14 Wis, 10 Cha
ASI: Crossbow Expert@4, Piercer (+1 Dex)@11, Sharpshooter@13, +2 Dex@17
Fighting Style: Archery, Superior Technique

This build does absurd nova damage during a surprise round while using barely any resources (just pwt and action surge) and has an easy way to get said surprise round with pwt

[Kane0]

So is this a 4 way multiclass or a quad-gestalt? Because both are interesting in their own way.

[Amnestic]

I posted this before but the "Half True Mystic Theurge", aka MAD-city, needing a 13 in every stat except Con...which you probably want some of anyway.

Armourer Artificer 4/Ancients Paladin 7/Swarmkeeper Ranger 4/Arcane Trickster 5.

Grab yourself a headband of intellect for your attack stats, pump your ASIs into charisma for your paladin aura and you're "good" to go. 2 attacks/turn, 5d6 sneak attack + 1d6 from your swarm + 1d6 from your lightning launcher isn't...fantastic but it's certainly 'okay'. You're not going to be exceptional, but you will be weird.

There's also the "Techno Mystic Theurge" which uses Mizzium's Apparatus for alllll the spells: Knowledge Cleric 1/Stars Druid 2/Bard 1/Wizard X. You can pick anything for your wizard subclass so whatever features float your boat. Diviner is probably thematically appropriate for someone who knows everything, or War Wizard for the battle spell person. Strictly speaking this 'split' isn't even required. As long as you get expertise in Arcana (which I get via Knowledge Cleric - but a different cleric and then Bard 3 would work too) and Stars Druid 2 (for their star form) you can take pretty much any level split you like depending on your preferred class features. Going for something like a 4/4/6/6 split works absolutely fine since your Mizzium's lets you cast 9th level spells without them prepared, and you still have 20th level caster spell slots.

Still MAD though.

[nickl_2000]

Swarmkeeper Ranger 4/Battlemaster Fighter 4/Star Druid 5/Arcana Cleric 7

With Arcana Cleric you are picking up BB or GFB. Swarmkeeper and Battlemaster are for control and added on damage. Star Druid gives you a ranged attack/cantrip, better healing, or better concentration.

Round 1 Spirit Guardian/Spike Growth and Starry Form. Assuming you hit with Starry Form, you can use the Swarmkeeper to either add damage or move someone up to 15 feet into your Spirit Guardian/Spike Grown. Round 2 onwards you can move people around with thorn whip and swarmkeeper to keep them in the environmental dangers. When you get them close, you can Booming Blade to damage them, then also push them 5 feet away from you with the Gathered Swarm so they need to move to hurt you.

If you want to get even more crazy with moving people around, you can also pick up the crusher feat and Shillelagh.

With the Cleric and Druid levels, you get a fair amount of spells and rituals. You can heal extremely well and you can control and you only need to focus on Wis, Dex, and Con.

[Arkhios]

Not necessarily the most optimal nor even my favorite choice, but for the sake of theorycrafting and to challenge the abundance of Warlock and/or Charisma shenanigans:

Artificer (Battle Smith) 8/Fighter (eldritch knight) 3/Rogue (Arcane Trickster) 3/Wizard (TCE-Bladesinging) 6

...not necessarily in that order, but quite likely in those numbers

Obviously you would focus on Intelligence for both weapon and spell attacks.

Battle Smith is able to use magical weapons with their intelligence instead of strength or dexterity, and Eldritch Knight allows their signature weapon to be teleported back when required. Take a hand crossbow, infuse it with the repeating infusion (what ever it was called), and the Archery Fighting Style, and you're pretty much all set.

Wizard is mostly gravy on top, but both having access to up to 3rd level wizard spells, and spell slots as a 12th level spellcaster is nothing to scoff at. Plus TCE-Bladesinging Extra Attack is just bonkers!

[Mostlymad]

4 classes pretty much rules out any full caster build. I'd have to say

Race: Bugbear
Class: Gloomstalker 5/Assassin 4/Battle Master 4/Wildfire 7
Progression: Gloomstalker 1-5, Assassin 1-3, Battle Master 1-2, Assassin 4, Battle Master 3-4, Wildfire 1-7
Base Stats: 8 Str, 17 Dex, 14 Con, 12 Int, 14 Wis, 10 Cha
ASI: Crossbow Expert@4, Piercer (+1 Dex)@11, Sharpshooter@13, +2 Dex@17
Fighting Style: Archery, Superior Technique

This build does absurd nova damage during a surprise round while using barely any resources (just pwt and action surge) and has an easy way to get said surprise round with pwt

I went with something similar to the above but I was confused as to why you went Druid? Also not familiar with what pwt stands for... but I would love to understand the build. :smallconfused:

Here's the route I went with (Assuming I didn't mess up the maths):

Ranged Assassin
Race: Bugbear
Class: Gloomstalker 4/Artificer 2/Battle Master 11/Assassin 3
Progression: Gloomstalker 1-4, Battle Master 1-6, Artificer 2, Assassin 1-3, Battle Master 7-11
Base Stats: 8 Str, 17 Dex, 12 Con, 13 Int, 16 Wis, 8 Cha
ASI: Piercer (+1 Dex)@4, Sharpshooter@8, +2 Dex@10, Alert @17
Fighting Styles: Archery, Superior Technique
Weapon: Musket (d12) with Repeating Shot Infusion

Assuming surprise, everything hits, in round 1 @ lvl 20 with Action Surge, and Hunter's Mark BA you are:
+13 Base Initiative
8 Attacks with Advantage and +9 to hit
Total Damage is 24d12+12d10+4d8+52d6+128 Piercing Damage = a 550 avg

Melee Assassin
Race: Bugbear
Class: Gloomstalker 4/Eldritch Knight 11/Assassin 3/Paladin 2
Progression: Gloomstalker 1-4, Eldritch Knight 1-6, Assassin 1-3, Paladin 2, Battle Master 7-11
Base Stats: 8 Str, 17 Dex, 10 Con, 10 Int, 16 Wis, 13 Cha
ASI: +2 Dex@4, Great Weapon Master@8, +1 Dex and +1 Cha@10, Alert @17
Fighting Styles: Dueling, Superior Technique, Blind Fighting
Weapon: Shadow Blade (3d8)

Assuming surprise, everything hits, in round 1 @ lvl 20 with Action Surge, with Shadow Blade up:
+13 Base Initiative (can boost with Technique dice)
9 Attacks with Advantage and +11 to hit
Total Damage would be (58d8 + 42d6 + 63 Psychic Damage) + (42d8 Radiant Damage) = a 653 avg

[Amnestic]

Also not familiar with what pwt stands for...

Pass Without Trace, for superstealth.

[Mostlymad]

Pass Without Trace, for superstealth.Ah, thanks.

So what does 7 levels of wildfire druid net you?

[CMCC]

Geralt of Rivia without a doubt.

Hex/Paladin/sorc/sbard

[Amnestic]

Ah, thanks.

So what does 7 levels of wildfire druid net you?

I can't speak for the original creator but at a guess, 4th level spells and something to use your bonus action on for the stuff that survives your initial nova. It does seem like it could be replaced with other stuff without infringing on the 'core' of the build though.

[Catullus64]

Geralt of Rivia without a doubt.

Hex/Paladin/sorc/sbard

Huh. I would have said something like Fighter (Eldritch Knight) 7/Ranger (Monster Slayer) 7/Artificer (Alchemist) 4/Rogue 2

[loki_ragnarock]

Thinking out loud.

If the parameters include subclasses, this sort of skews us towards classes that get their subclasses early, like cleric, sorcerer, warlock, and wizard.
You could theoretically match the criteria as low as level five with these options.

For the classes that hit at the more standard level 3... you couldn't even match the criteria until level 12, having written off any ASIs in the process. Hmm.. so the trick would be to work in the early subclasses, probably, to leave more room for growth into other classes. Thus low level dips into cleric, sorcerer, and warlock, coupled with a focus on something else... except sorcerer genuinely brings nothing to the table until level 3ish, anyway, putting it in the same boat as the others by every meaningful metric. So cleric and warlock. Cleric nets proficiencies from a one level dip, plus a wide array of 1st level spells. Warlock nets... more than sorcerer, but not alot more; access to eldritch blast, hexblade for cheese, a low level, non-scaling spell slot. Cleric is the most meaningful one level dip for enhancing capabilities, unless you're looking specifically for the benefits of hexblade.
So cleric and warlock, sorcerer level one being garbage.

ASIs are also something to consider, which can pull in the fighter and rogue direction, though with a larger investment towards them. It also pulls classes towards a 4 level minimum to maximize ASI distribution, unless significant investment in fighter or rogue levels can offset the loss.

This is a complicated challenge. To compensate lost ASIs, dropping in fighter undermines alot of what you'd gain from cleric 1, and rogue compensation is hella long term investment. And to my knowledge there aren't any magic items that convert weapon damage to lightning/thunder damage, or that Tempest/Rogue combo would actually be pretty great. Hmm...

I'm going to have to think for a while. This is a hard challenge to pull off anything interesting with before 12th.

Till then:

Soulknife 11/Knowledge Cleric 1/Gloomstalker 3/Lore Bard 3

Why? I just want the skills, bro. Background gets you 2 skills. Rogue start gets you 4 skills. Cleric get you 2 more, gloomstalker gets you 1 more (base multi-class) and some stealth capabilities, Lore Bard gets you 4 (multiclass + subclass). That'll get you 13 of 19 skills. Be a half elf for 2 more (or a V. Human for 1). Use one of your three ASIs for Skilled for 3 more, and that's 18(17) of 19 skills. Take Prodigy for your other ASI for 19(18) of 19 skills. (Take your spare feat on Skill Expert for 1 more, for 19 of 19 skills.)

Congratulations, you're 18th level and can do every mundane thing. You're even actually good at quite a few of them, with expertise in some 7 (8) skills. But that hardly matters, as you can't roll less than a 10 with a skill. And in the event you should still fail a skill, maybe in one of those ones you don't have expertise in? Add a psi-di to turn that failure into (probably) a roaring success. Throw in Enhance Ability from your bard spells known, and you can do every mundane thing well. This leaves you two levels to play with, so you can choose to slap one each on ranger and bard for two sweet, sweet ASIs. Or you can double both into Lore Bard for better, short rest recharging inspiration and a third level spell. Or you could drop a level into bard/ranger for the ASI and a level into Knowledge Cleric if you want to be able to use whatever tool flawlessly 1/short rest, which frankly seems the most on the nose. Either way, this leaves you anywhere from 2-3 ASI you can actually use on, you know, Ability Score Improvements. Not too shabby.

I'd name him Jack.

EDIT:
Looking at him, I'm actually pretty content with Jack, even from the non-skill angles. He's a capable combatant with truly absurd accuracy, able to add a d10 psi die - enough, on average, to overcome Shield - to a missed attack, with a bonus action attack built in at all times should the first one fail. This guy will nearly always hit, and accuracy counts for *alot* in DPR calculations; 95-100% of a slightly smaller pool of dice vs. 60% of a larger pool of dice probably, roughly, balances out compared to a (non-soulknife) straight rogue. So 7d6+1d4 (maybe, mulling that)+1d8 (first turn)+5 (dex) isn't up there with the heaviest hitters, but it's respectable enough sudden damage to force some higher than average concentration checks. Nothing earth shattering, but capable.
Further, he combines well with any kind of hazard creation, though lacks the ability to create the hazard himself; between things like Longstrider, Athletics expertise, and bonus action dash, he's probably not the *best* Spike Stones drag build ever, but he's no slouch. Should be extremely reliably able to grapple with anything large or smaller with a minimum check of 21-22ish, with +5 from a psi-die if it doesn't succeed. Then dragging for something like 40ft of spike growth by using a bonus action to deliver 16d4 damage? Again, nothing amazeballs, but solid; being able to move other beings around the battle space opens up alot of tactical applications. Sure, you could stab the archemage, but if the Samuria is next up in initiative with his Action Surge fighting spirit ready to go, maybe just dragging him within Sam's move and letting him deal with it is a better call.
So, generally, effective *enough* in combat to leave me satisfied.
Tasha's options mean that he can switch out advantage on wisdom/int checks in specific circumstances to just having another expertise source (missed it the first go round, so 8-9 expertise instances, and what I'd lean into if I was to actually pursue this madness as the situational wis/int advantage is cool when you have it and sad when you don't). Ranger can potentially give out languages like candy, with three at first level if really going for it, but Favored Foe is... actually not so bad for this specific build. That it only activates once a turn is fine for a build that's really only trying for one big hit every turn, and the action economy advantage that is has means that it might actually be superior to Hunter's Mark in the scheme of things.
He's not as MAD as many 4-way builds, with a focus on DEX/WIS/CHA, but being able to get away with keeping wisdom/charisma relatively low if he focuses on buff distribution for his spells. Primary Dex for defense/offense, but otherwise psi-die can close the gap for other stats being lower. So starting half elf (assuming Tasha's allows moving the racial ASIs about) a standard array with Str: 8, Dex: 17, Con:12 , Wis: 14, Int: 10, Cha: 15 isn't impossible, perhaps a Str: 8, Dex: 16, Con:12, Wis: 14, Int 10, Cha 16 with point buy, both with Cha or Wis being interchangeable. With the two (or three) ASIs by 20th, he'd be rocking a 20 Dex/(16 Cha or Wis) either way. That's not too shabby... but if you were truly confident in the psi-dice covering the accuracy difference, you could diversify to make you better at skills. He doesn't *really* need to be better at skills, and Dex effects a fair few skills, so I'd probably focus there, myself, but the medium armor proficiency means you don't have to.
For defense, the ranger gives defense style, which is probably the most desirable of them save blind fighting. Hrmm. Hard call, there. I'd probably go blind fighting, but being able to rock a 20-28 AC (Studded + DEX + Style + Sheild of Faith (+ Shield proficiency if you feel like picking one up + magic bonuses for the armor/shield)) ain't too shabby. I think I'd be comfortable dropping it to 19-27 as a range. Being able to ignore much of the disadvantage for searching for things in the dark that comes with dark vision seems more enticing, increasing out of combat utility with this combat focused feature.
So, super-scout. Never needs light. Unbothered by darkness. Fast as the wind. Bit of a polyglot. Perfect infiltrator able to go in, find the secret doors, disable the traps, plant some traps of his own with the Snare spell, and able to report all of it in real time to a distant party in perfect silence. Able to talk his way in or out as a face, always notices the details, able to understand a fair few foes without magic, able to cast comprehend languages to understand the rest. Can facilitate perfectly silent communications with the party, if someone else can drop a PWT it's stealth city for errybody. Potent party booster with access to Guidance, Bless, and clutch Bardic Inspirations to help others be as competent as he is. Good at convincing people and animals to do what he wants. Enough magic to squeeze out a touch more utility. Just all around astoundingly competent dude. Not a combat monster, not a Rambo, not a guy who shakes the very foundations of the world, but otherwise he looks alot of fun.
I like Jack alot. Now I want to play Jack, and that's a problem.

[CMCC]

Huh. I would have said something like Fighter (Eldritch Knight) 7/Ranger (Monster Slayer) 7/Artificer (Alchemist) 4/Rogue 2

Watch the vid. Alchemist is giant no go for the character. Ranger is completely unnecessary when you actually dive into abilities. Paladin does a better job of matching the "hunting" abilities people associate with ranger. It's all in the build in detail. But I totally get where you're coming from.

EK and rogue are fine choices, but with the rest of the build, Sorc and Bard work better and provide literally the same things and more.

Here's the build:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4DLjEN9wig

Apologies for the sound quality. It get's better in later vids - I promise.

I also have another vid on the channel that dives into the DPR of this build, which is surprisingly very high for a 4 character multiclass. Triple digits.

And before i hear it from someone - i don't get paid for this. Completely unmonetized. Not that that should matter, but it's true.

[animorte]

You started a good thing! And i think we might have our next thread, I love reading about mixing subclasses!

Now, I think there are different difficulty levels to this challenge.

1. All classes and subclasses allowed
2. No Hexblade
3. No Warlock
4. No CHA based classes 😉

Hahaha, some people just want to watch the world buuurrrn!

That wouldn't really be a problem, Warlocks just happen to be my favorite. Some of the other build ideas I have are focused on other things, don't worry. I'll put them on here when I get a bit more time.

[Kane0]

An old build from pre-tashas I really liked was EK 7+/Warlock 2+/Rogue 2+ to couple together EB with a sneak attack longbow shot plus a bundle of goodies like Cunning Action, Action Surge and some utility magic. It was silly but effective, and still totally viable with room to add a fourth class like Sorcerer or War Wizard, although you might want to have rolled a good stat spread to try it comfortably.

But now with Tasha's we can do the same trick without burning bonus actions to do it by taking advantage of the new Bladesinger Extra Attack.
Bladesinger 6+/Hexblade 2+/ Rogue 2+/ Armorer 3+ (Fighter 2+ optional)

Now this does take a little bit of finangling, as it's not totally explicit if the Lightning Launcher is a valid option for Hex Warrior but it appears to work by the text. Assuming it does, here's some fun stuff the build does for you:
- Your standard attack action will be a CHA Lightning Launcher + Sneak Attack + Eldritch Blast with whatever invocations you choose to add to it (Agonizing + Repelling is traditional but you might want Lance of Lethargy instead)
- You can compliment your attack routine with both Hexblade Curse and Bladesinging before you even look at spells and concentration
- You aren't restricted to ranged combat, you can swap to Guardian armor and wade into melee just fine.
- You're packing better than half-caster spell progression with Wizard rituals, Art+Wiz casting working nicely together plus Pact Magic and Arcane Recovery for short rest flexibility
- Cunning Action, advantage on stealth, bonus skills and access to Expertise makes you pretty shifty before needing to pull out the magic
- You're also fairly speedy in short bursts with a +15 movement bonus between your armor and bladesong, and can get in extra dashes via Cunning Action
- You have four infusions up your sleeve too, which can be swapped around on any two of an AC boost, Darkvision, Bag of Holding, INT to your STR checks/saves, limitless mayonnaise, and more
- This build leaves 9 levels open to progress in whatever direction you want (Rogue for SA, Bladesinger for casting, 'Lock for Invocs, everything for ASIs, even dip into Fighter for action surge and a fighting style)

Of course, this is still notably MAD and ASI limited but that's sort of a given for almost any 4-way multiclass.

[JellyPooga]

Tier 1: Rogue 2/Ancestral Barbarian 3
Tier 2: Scout Rogue 5/Barbarian 3/Ranger 2
Tier 3: Rogue 7/Barbarian 3/Hunter Ranger 3/Fighter 2
Tier 4: Rogue 7/Barbarian 3/Ranger 7/Battlemaster Fighter 3

Race: V.Human
Feats: Sentinel, Polearm Master, Mage Slayer

Pros
Whatever the enemy does, I punish it.
I've got a Reaction for just about anything.
I'm just about unkilllable without using ripe gorgonzola.

Cons
My Ability Scores are the same at lvl.20 as they were at lvl.1

[animorte]

My Ability Scores are the same at lvl.20 as they were at lvl.1

I know exactly what you mean. Sometimes the utility that feats bring to the build are so much better than an extra ability mod or two. I very commonly prioritize feats.

[loki_ragnarock]

Tier 1: Rogue 2/Ancestral Barbarian 3
Tier 2: Scout Rogue 5/Barbarian 3/Ranger 2
Tier 3: Rogue 7/Barbarian 3/Hunter Ranger 3/Fighter 2
Tier 4: Rogue 7/Barbarian 3/Ranger 7/Battlemaster Fighter 3

Race: V.Human
Feats: Sentinel, Polearm Master, Mage Slayer

Pros
Whatever the enemy does, I punish it.
I've got a Reaction for just about anything.
I'm just about unkilllable without using ripe gorgonzola.

Cons
My Ability Scores are the same at lvl.20 as they were at lvl.1
... what are you gaining from so many rogue levels?

[animorte]

... what are you gaining from so many rogue levels?

The only thing that matters, sneak attack damage.

Also Evasion and Uncanny Dodge.

[JellyPooga]

The only thing that matters, sneak attack damage.

Also Evasion and Uncanny Dodge.

More the latter than the former; the additional 1d6 here or there isn't going to make a lot of difference. It also avoids the redundancy of taking Barbarian or Fighter to 5th and "paying" for Extra Attack multiple times. The alternative would be to take Ranger to 9th for Lands Stride and 3rd level spells. Certainly tempting, but Evasion just gives you so much security when it comes to both friendly fire and enemy AoE's.

[Hael]

Ill go with my summoner variant (in Ludics build thread) as a base. Wisdom doesnt need to be that high b/c its a summoning build.

6 peace cleric
6 shepherd druid

And now I want something eldritch blasty, so that I can get nonconcentration scaling damage and repelling blast, so cha will be my primary stat.

So we add some genie lock in there (at least 2 lvls for invocations) so that your summons can carry you around. The rest needs to be a cha class, so of course sorcerer for quickened eldritch blast silliness. So 6 lvls of Aberrant mind for psychic communication with the summons.

[animorte]

More the latter than the former; the additional 1d6 here or there isn't going to make a lot of difference. It also avoids the redundancy of taking Barbarian or Fighter to 5th and "paying" for Extra Attack multiple times. The alternative would be to take Ranger to 9th for Lands Stride and 3rd level spells. Certainly tempting, but Evasion just gives you so much security when it comes to both friendly fire and enemy AoE's.

Absolutely agree. Can't tell you how many times a caster was like, "Fireball?" or something to that effect and the Rogue was like, "go for it, I'm good."

"FIREBALL!!!"

[Kane0]

Absolutely agree. Can't tell you how many times a caster was like, "Fireball?" or something to that effect and the Rogue was like, "go for it, I'm good."
"FIREBALL!!!"

Not two sessions ago the monk in the party literally shoved the fighter out of harms way and screamed at the warlock "NUKE ME!"

Was a cool moment.

[loki_ragnarock]

The only thing that matters, sneak attack damage.

Also Evasion and Uncanny Dodge.
Well, not the first one. It's largely incompatible with PAM.

Evasion and Uncanny Dodge aren't bad

[animorte]

Charisma (I can't help myself) based duelist: I actually really want to play this one now.
(5) Swashbuckler Rogue
(6) Swords Bard
(3) Vengeance Paladin
(6) Hexblade Warlock (blade pact)
Rakish Audacity, Defensive Flourish, Vow of Enmity, Hexblade's Curse, Dueling fighting style, Defensive Duelist feat, maybe War Caster feat.

Wisdom - utility bubbles healing brawler: Since the rule is 4, Sorcerer (1) instead of Monk (8).
(6) Twilight Cleric
(6) Dreams Druid
(7) Mercy Monk
(1) Divine Soul Sorcerer
Twilight Sanctuary, Hearth of Moonlight and Shadow, Favored by the Gods, War Caster feat.

Don't worry, I've got more coming!

[loki_ragnarock]

War Wizard 2, War Cleric 2, Genie Warlock 1, Psi Warrior 3

Every part has “war” in it.

Beyond that I haven't thought it through at all.

EDIT:
Hasty post-hoc justification:
War Wizard 4, War Cleric 2, Genie Warlock 6, Psi Warrior 8

Use greatsword. GWM. Str = heavy armor. Cleric = Bonus action attack on rounds you don’t crit or kill. Channel divinity/Bless to make sure one of two attacks hits. Fiend Warlock + Blade pact. Eldritch Smite. Devil’s Sight + Darkness = advantage = greater chance to crit = greater chance for bonus attacks via GWM. Also = use eldritch smite and psionic strike on your crit attacks. War wizard 3 = shadow blade for higher base damage and advantage in darkness. Dao warlock adds proficiency bludgeoning to damage once a turn.

Reaction for +2 AC/+4 saves, usable every round as you aren’t focusing on spells, really. Defense fighting style (unless DM rules reroll effect would also juice smite dice, in which case Great Weapon style). Enough spell slots to spam shield a bit. AC Focus is 21 (Plate + Shield of Faith) to (23 (Arcane Deflection) or 26 (shield)). Saves could gain +1d4 (Bless) +4 (Arcane Deflection). Not bad for no paladin in sight. Resistant to Bludgeoning, with Absorb elements on hand for everything else to let those hp stretch further. Reaction can also be used to mitigate damage to allies, letting their hp stretch further.

Keep spells as defensive/buff to avoid high requirements for War Wizard and War Cleric and Warlock = 13 to 14 should do you. Start fighter for the con proficiency to maintain your spells best. Easy to focus on high constitution, so spells are relatively safe.

Getting around the battlefield is easier than typical melee types with Psi-Powered leap, letting you get to position quick.

5 ASI to use, so plenty of red meat for progression. Even a bit MAD it’ll still find it’s legs by focusing on making you a smasher. Actually, that's an angle: Greatsword + Dao = Crusher and Slasher at the same time, which stacks a bunch of effects onto an opponent you crit on what is kind of a crit fishing build. V. Human for GWM, Crusher and Slasher in progression, still leaves 3 ASI to round things out; getting those high pertinent stats is very doable. Alternatively, Warcaster + Booming Blade and nigh impossible to break concentration. Even so, I'd prefer the first, as that saves reactions purely for defense.
(Oof, this build needs extreme judiciousness with standard array and its' difficult with point buy: V Human Point buy can start you Str:15, Dex: 8, Con: 14, Int: 13, Wis: 13, Cha: 13. It's enough to start. The three ASI if you grab Crusher/Slasher are enough to get you to 20str and (14 all int/wis/cha or 16 in one), which is enough for a modest optimization. This might be one of those times where standard human is tempting, as that'd let you start 15 9 14 14 14 14, but you'd lose your early access to GWM and have slower strength progression, hurting your overall offensive development considerably. I'd stick with V. Human.)

Honestly, though, there isn't alot of justification for this beyond, well, everything having "war" in the name. You could probably do way better focusing on fewer things.

[Kane0]

Barbarian 4/Ranger/Druid/Scout Rogue sounds like a functional 'wildman' character. Bonus points for avoiding CHA too.

[JellyPooga]

Evasion and Uncanny Dodge aren't bad

Have you ever seen them in play? Experience varies, of course, but they're a little better than "not bad" IMO.

Uncanny Dodge makes Rogues second only to Barbarians in terms of HP efficiency; don't be fooled by the d8 HD. It works against any attack too, regardless of damage type.
Evasion covers most HP damage that isn't an attack, automatically halving damage and potentially (a high potential given good Dex and Save proficiency) eliminating it. Again regardless of damage type.

Between the two, the Rogue has the ability to halve or eliminate a vast majority of HP damage without having to expend resources or have a feature activated. For example, Rage damage reduction only works if Rage is active, which both requires a limited resource to be expended and for action on the Barbarians part, in turn requiring them to be active in the initiative order. The Rogue has no such limitations (albeit having some of their own).

In terms of characters that can survive HP damage, Tier 2+ Rogues rate among the best and that's discounting subclass/archetype. Not only can they survive the damage, they actually reduce resource requirements to replenish HP because they take less damage instead of having a larger HP pool, making them super team-friendly; not only is the Rogue largely resource-less, it makes the team as a whole more resource efficient, in large part because of Uncanny Dodge and Evasion.

[KorvinStarmast]

Fighter 6, Rogue 5, Druid (6), Ranger 3 (Gloom Stalker).
Need to have 13's in Str, Dex, Wis. The Ranger adds another fighting style. You only get 3 ASI's/feats to pick with some care.

[Mostlymad]

Fighter 6, Rogue 5, Druid (6), Ranger 3 (Gloom Stalker).
Need to have 13's in Str, Dex, Wis. The Ranger adds another fighting style. You only get 3 ASI's/feats to pick with some care.Fighter 6 nets you 2 ASIs so you’ll have 4 not 3.

[KorvinStarmast]

Fighter 6 nets you 2 ASIs so you’ll have 4 not 3. Man, I guess using my fingers misfired this morning. :smalleek: It is tempting to take Gloom Stalker 4 and druid 5 for the added ASI, but I find that Level 6 Druid features are decent so we forego the ASI.

[RogueJK]

Shadar-Kai Spirit Dancer

Level 12:
Ancestral Guardian Barbarian 5
Fighter 1
Bladesinger Wizard 2
Soulknife Rogue 4

Level 20:
Ancestral Guardian Barbarian 6
Battle Master Fighter 3
Bladesinger Wizard 2
Soulknife Rogue 9

Point Buy:
STR 13
DEX 15+2
CON 14
INT 13+1
WIS 9
CHA 8
ASIs: Elven Accuracy (+1 DEX), +2 DEX, +2 CON, +2 CON
Dueling Fighting Style

18 AC with no armor, and 20 AC while Bladesinging. (Can also use Mage Armor until you hit 16+ CON.) 40' movement speed normally, and 50' while Bladesinging. Requires zero weapons or armor. Has 3x attacks per turn, and +5d6 Sneak Attack, plus access to off-turn Sneak Attacks from Riposte maneuver. Ancestral Protectors and high movement speed allows it to tank and kite enemies with thrown Psychic Blades, with Rage and Uncanny Dodge to help negate damage. Equally viable both in melee or at up to 60' range with Psychic Blades, with backup 120' damage cantrip for even longer range. Has some utility spells/cantrips and defensive spells when not raging. Racial teleport is not a spell, so can be used while raging.

[Naanomi]

Fighter (2)/Rogue{Assassin} 3/Sorcerer{Shadow} X/Warlock{Undead?} Y

Bugbear or Half-Elf

Focus on massive range alpha surprise attacks

[RogueJK]

Half Elf Wise Wanderer

Level 12:
Stars Druid 2
Fey Wanderer Ranger 3
Arcana Cleric 5
Fighter 2

Level 20:
Stars Druid 2
Fey Wanderer Ranger 4
Arcana Cleric 12
Fighter 2

Point Buy:
STR 10
DEX 13+1
CON 15+1
INT 8
WIS 15+2
CHA 10
ASIs: Warcaster, +1 WIS/+1 CON, Crusher (+1 CON), +2 WIS
Defense and Blind Fighting fighting styles.

Basically an Arcana Cleric Frontliner build, with some additional Druid/Ranger spells, extra skills/Expertise from Ranger, forced movement from Crusher, bonus damage from Dreadful Strikes, additional ranged attack or Concentration options from Starry Form, plus Action Surge from Fighter.

Nearly WIS-SAD with WIS-based Shillelagh + Booming Blade + Potent Spellcasting for melee, WIS-based Chill Touch/Toll The Dead + BA Archer Form for ranged, WIS-based Face skills, and WIS-based spellcasting.

[RogueJK]

Spring Eladrin Charming Swordsman

Level 12:
Hexblade Warlock 2
Paladin 2
College of Eloquence Bard 3
Swashbuckler Rogue 5

Level 20:
Hexblade Warlock 2
Paladin 2
College of Eloquence Bard 7
Swashbuckler Rogue 9

Point Buy:
STR 13
DEX 13+1
CON 14
INT 8
WIS 8
CHA 15+2
ASIs: Elven Accuracy or Fey Touched (+1 CHA), +2 CHA, +2 DEX
Blind Fighting fighting style

Nearly CHA-SAD. CHA-based melee striking with Rapier + Booming Blade + 5d6 Sneak Attack + Divine Smite + Fancy Footwork. CHA-based ranged with Eldritch Blast. Very high Face capabilities from Max CHA, Expertise, Silver Tongue, racial Charm ability, and Panache. 19 AC with Half Plate + DEX + shield.

[RogueJK]

Dragonborn Dread Conquerer

Level 12:
Undead Warlock 1
Conquest Paladin 7
Divine Soul Sorcerer 1
College of Whispers Bard 3

Level 20:
Undead Warlock 1
Conquest Paladin 9
Divine Soul Sorcerer 5
College of Whispers Bard 5

Point Buy:
STR 15+1
DEX 8
CON 14
INT 8
WIS 10
CHA 15+2
ASIs: Dragon Fear (+1 CHA), +2 STR, +2 CHA or STR, +2 STR or CHA

Lots of different ways to impose the Frightened condition and lock down nearby enemies. Access to Spirit Guardians to further punish locked down enemies. Bonus melee damage from Divine Smite + Psychic Blades. Sorcerer, Bard, and Cleric defensive and buff spells.

[loki_ragnarock]

Have you ever seen them in play? Experience varies, of course, but they're a little better than "not bad" IMO.

Indeed, I have DMed a rogue to 20. I flip between understatement and hyperbole without much warning.

However, it seemed many levels to invest for purely defensive gains. They're good gains, of course.



Hmm... so the following technically doesn't work because you technically can't sneak attack with an unarmed strike, but if you get a DM willing to handwave that you might could do this:

Dragon Monk 4/Tempest Cleric 2/Arcane Trickster Rogue 11/Champion 3

Wait for a crit, turn the pile of sneak attack dice into lightning damage, expend channel divinity to maximize said crit. 2d4+12d6+5 maxed is 85ish damage.
Nothing special at this level, but it finally (almost) makes Tempesting a melee attack work. Otherwise about as SAD as can be for a crazed multiclass, needing only dexterity and wisdom to function. And you can use all those special "cleric only" attunement staffs in the treasure columns.

And "x only" attunement is what inspired this silliness:

Drunken Master Monk 16/ Dreams Druid 2/ Genie Warlock 1/ Peace Cleric 1

I just wanted to play a monk that can use any staff in the DMG. That's all. That's all I wanted. For that you need a level of Druid and a level of Warlock; for real, that's it. Cleric was tacked on because you can meet the subclass requirement as part of the build outline in the OP. These specific Warlock and Cleric options were chosen because their first level abilities scale via proficiency, making them viable despite a bare minimum dip. Dreams was taken because pop up healing is at least modestly useful. Way of the Drunken Master because it reflects the mental state of the madman who decided to put this together, though any monk could probably work, and Kensei is probably, technically, better for hitting things with staves/holding staves.

Be a V. Human. Take the Dual Wielder feat. Use a magic staff in each hand, head booting monsters as you go, expending charges for spells as needed to awaken trees or erect walls of force or whatever. Only four ASI to work with, but you'll be fine. Dump int and strength because who needs to be strong and smart? You've got magic sticks. (Start: 8 16 12 8 16 13, four ASI gets you to 20/20 Dex/Wis.)

This also lets the monk use:
Necklace of Prayer Beads, Pearl of Power, Robe of the Archmagi, Rod of the Pact Keeper, Rod of Resurrection, Wand of Binding, Wand of Fireballs, Wand of Lightning Bolt, Wand of Paralysis, Wand of Polymorph, Wand of War Mage, Wand of Web, Wand of Wonder,

In fact, there's only one class specific attunement requirement inside the DMG that's outside of the reach of this monk, but it does serve to highlight that somebody decided to keep all the good stuff in the hands of spellcasters...

[TotallyNotEvil]

Something roughly similar to what I recall some other user post that actually seemed like a nice martial character, it's something to the tune of:

- BM Fighter 5
- (Probably Bear Totem) Barb 4
- Gloom Stalker Ranger 4
- Swashbuckler 7

IIRC, it was all about being a TWF "beast", and that looks pretty alright for that. Two fighting styles, extra damage from rage, super easy SA.

It sounds like a pretty omni-competent "martial person", too. Four proficiencies (five, if you start with Rogue), four Expertises, three Ranger spells (Entangle, Goodberries, Hunter's Mark? And a free Disguise Self, which is neat), the assorted Ranger stuff (which, hey, includes a pseudo-Expertise? Cool, didn't remember that), three Maneuvers and some SD to play with, many of which can play well with the Rogue/Ranger side of it.

And hey, Barb resiliency (especially with Bear Totem) + Uncanny Dodge/Evasion makes you silly tough.

https://en.meming.world/images/en/b/be/But_It%27s_Honest_Work.jpg

[Bobthewizard]

Ninja assassin: Lots of teleporting, hiding, and surprising.

Shadar-Kai Shadow monk 8 / Echo knight 3 / Gloomstalker 3 / Twilight Cleric 6

(Fighter 1, Monk 6, Fighter to 3, Ranger 3, Cleric 6, Monk to 8)


Charisma compendium: SAD and lots of smites.

Hexblade 3/ Paladin 2/ Swords Bard 12 / Sorcerer 3

(Warlock 1, Bard 6, Warlock to 3, Paladin 2, Bard to 12, Sorcerer 3)

[Kane0]

For being as playable as possible whilst avoiding Hexblade, id probably go Barbarian 6 / Rogue 4 / Ranger 4 / Fighter 4

[loki_ragnarock]

Kensei Monk 14/Battlemaster 3/Peace Cleric 1/ Land Druid 2

Just barely got all save proficiencies. Phew.

Okay, this was just me screwing around with a really high to hit, mostly. Kensei Sharpen for the Blade for +3, Battlemaster Precision Attack for a d8 and Archery Style for +2, Cleric for Bless and Emboldening Bond for a d4 each, Land Druid mostly for an extra Bless per day via short rest. Focus down on dexterity with your 3 meager ASIs, V. Human start with Sharpshooter, but otherwise fairly SAD. (Point buy Str: 10 Dex: 16 Con: 12 Int: 8 Wis: 16 Cha: 8 start, 2 ASI to Dex 20, gravy, third for Wis 18)

So 6 prof +5 Dex +3 Sharpen +2 Style +4.5 Precision +2.5 Bless +2.5 Embolden -5 Sharpshooter = +20 to hit the first go, +18 for the non-emboldened follow up.

Generally enough to hit something at that level. You are absurdly mobile, have decent defenses and can hit the Tarrasque while sharpshooting with a roll under 10. You have enough spell resources to push out Bless some 7 times a day with a short rest, so you can spam this enough to run through most any adventuring day.
Is it better than just going straight Kensei? Probably not, no.

It mostly works; take something like Menacing Attack (trigger fear at absurd range, pelt with more arrows as target can't approach) and Goading attack (give disadvantage to hit anything but you while you reside in the next zip code) as your other two maneuvers. Now you've got some extra tools in the kit. Throw out an Entangle against low strength enemies and let advantage improve on your returns from Bless, perhaps. Heal if you absolutely need to. Make most saving throws handily.
But mostly be a ranged accuracy machine.

[Joe the Rat]

I'll take a No Hexblade difficulty, but that's a matter of protest until they add Cha-to-hit as a general Blade Pact feature.

Hmm, I've got a bit of slush on levels, but 3+ Fiendlock, 4+ Sorcerer, 2+Fighter, 2+ Rogue. Traditional Blastlock load, XBE or Gunner, Quickened metamagic. The rest as you like. This is the essential Fake Monk, using Eldritch Blast (with quickens and action surges) in place of actual unarmed strikes. Draconic Heritage would let you skip armor (shadows or otherwise) altogether, and the rouge Cunning Action saves you having to burn slots on Expeditious retreat to be a fleet-footed bastard.
(I like fiendlock as the reliable thp source helps make getting up close and personal survivable.)

I used a similar build (12 level) as an NPC combatant in an arena battle. There's just something satisfying about a nine eldritch blast nova at point blank range, sending the target PC flying out of the arena on 60 feet of knockback.

[loki_ragnarock]

I'll take a No Hexblade difficulty, but that's a matter of protest until they add Cha-to-hit as a general Blade Pact feature.

Hmm, I've got a bit of slush on levels, but 3+ Fiendlock, 4+ Sorcerer, 2+Fighter, 2+ Rogue. Traditional Blastlock load, XBE or Gunner, Quickened metamagic. The rest as you like. This is the essential Fake Monk, using Eldritch Blast (with quickens and action surges) in place of actual unarmed strikes. Draconic Heritage would let you skip armor (shadows or otherwise) altogether, and the rouge Cunning Action saves you having to burn slots on Expeditious retreat to be a fleet-footed bastard.
(I like fiendlock as the reliable thp source helps make getting up close and personal survivable.)

I used a similar build (12 level) as an NPC combatant in an arena battle. There's just something satisfying about a nine eldritch blast nova at point blank range, sending the target PC flying out of the arena on 60 feet of knockback.

Gotta bump Fighter and Rogue to 3+.

Part of the challenge is getting the builds in place with their relevant subclasses. Your goal works out, either way.