PDA

View Full Version : What if Rangers had Pact Magic spell progression?



Segev
2022-03-19, 08:32 AM
One problem Rangers have is that their spells are pretty good, but they have them so late that it doesn't feel like it. The Shadow Monk has Pass Without Trace two levels earlier. Ranger Spells can't be buffed because Bards would get them too early. And what would be good spells at ninth level are underwhelming at 17th.

But if Rangers got spellcasting at level one instead of two, they would feel less like level one was a dead level. Pact magic also goes up to fifth level spells, just like Rangers do. They would get their spells at a level that they were calibrated for, and their limited spells known would be made up for with the pact magic refresh rate.

Or, if the pact magic structure is too odd and you want them more compatible with other casters in multiclass, give them Sorcerer spell progression. No SP, not refresh mechanic, and maybe a carefully-curated set of the weaker druid and wizard spells (surely not all are winners) from levels six through nine.

By making them either pact mages or full casters, though, they get spells at an actually-useful level and also feel more like they contribute something at every level.

I understand why they are half casters, but their spells being delayed by that progression hurts them a lot more than it does paladins.

Amnestic
2022-03-19, 08:36 AM
Ranger Spells can't be buffed because Bards would get them too early.

This is a problem with Bard, not Ranger though. If we're already changing things then add a clause to Magical Secrets that you can't learn a spell at a level before the original class would be able to get that spell.

Which also stops them stealing Paladin spells before they can get them at the same time. And if Artificer they ever get any exclusive spells...

stoutstien
2022-03-19, 08:40 AM
I'm working on revamping all casting progressions and the ranger is in a weird place. I like the idea that your casting progression is dictated by the source. so innate casters are different than those who gain it by studying or gifted by X. The question I ran into was I'm not entirely sure where the ranger fits in.

solidork
2022-03-19, 09:59 AM
One problem with that, that I can see, is that one of the main use of the Ranger's spells is as utility - when you have 4 first level slots, expending one to have a chat with some animals isn't a big deal - whereas spending one of your two highest level slots would kinda suck.

Angelalex242
2022-03-20, 02:29 AM
IF they're getting pact magic, they'd need invocations to match.

Like they might get speak with animals at will. And then run around being Dr. Doolittle cause why not?

Animal Friendship likewise should be a thing Rangers have 'always up.'

Beast Bond is another thing they might have.

Kane0
2022-03-20, 04:46 AM
An interesting thought. Perhaps set them at say 2/3rds pact magic progression and simply omit higher level spells?

Level 2: 1x 1st level slot
Level 3: 2x 1st level slot
Level 5: 2x 2nd level slot
Level 8: 2x 3rd level slot
Level 11: 2x 4th level slot
Level 14: 2x 5th level slot
Level 17: 3x 5th level slot
Level 20: 4x 5th level slot

Raw spell progression is faster but your spells known is still really limited, and Ranger blasty spells arent known for being all that anyways

tokek
2022-03-20, 05:02 AM
One problem with that, that I can see, is that one of the main use of the Ranger's spells is as utility - when you have 4 first level slots, expending one to have a chat with some animals isn't a big deal - whereas spending one of your two highest level slots would kinda suck.

I think Tasha's fixed that with the Primal Awareness feature. Its nice to have once per day utility spells that don't count against your spells known - it really frees the character up to have those flavour spells that otherwise you would feel were holding you back from ones you will need more often.

4koboldsinacoat
2022-03-20, 05:43 AM
Full pact magic would be way to powerful, a 5th level character with extra attack, a d10 hit die, and 3rd level spells like conjure animals would be overpowered. If they had half casting progression with pact slots, then their casting would probably feel more limited, in the way that warlocks often feel more limited.

Amechra
2022-03-20, 09:03 AM
This is a problem with Bard, not Ranger though. If we're already changing things then add a clause to Magical Secrets that you can't learn a spell at a level before the original class would be able to get that spell.

Which also stops them stealing Paladin spells before they can get them at the same time. And if Artificer they ever get any exclusive spells...

Honestly, this is why the Bard (or whatever class they decided should get Magical Secrets) should be a half caster. The Artificer/Paladin/Ranger need to have class-exclusive 2nd/4th/5th level spells that are stronger than the norm for their spellcasting to not fall behind (since they get those spell levels a tier later than a full caster), and the Bard prevents that from happening.

Quietus
2022-03-20, 10:23 AM
Honestly, this is why the Bard (or whatever class they decided should get Magical Secrets) should be a half caster. The Artificer/Paladin/Ranger need to have class-exclusive 2nd/4th/5th level spells that are stronger than the norm for their spellcasting to not fall behind (since they get those spell levels a tier later than a full caster), and the Bard prevents that from happening.

I mean, the solution there is easy. Limit Bard to learning spells from Warlock, Wizard, Sorcerer, Druid, Cleric lists. Or add a clause that if a spell you're learning comes from the Artificer/Paladin/Ranger list, you treat it as a spell of <insert inflation here>. Spell level +2?

KorvinStarmast
2022-03-20, 10:24 AM
IF they're getting pact magic, they'd need invocations to match.

Like they might get speak with animals at will. And then run around being Dr. Doolittle cause why not?

Animal Friendship likewise should be a thing Rangers have 'always up.'

Beast Bond is another thing they might have. And cantrips.

All of these, but the simpler fix is to have the Ranger be a prepared caster like the Paladin is. :smalltongue: And, for Rangers to have 'domain' spells as the Paladins do, and as was done in Xanathar's for those three ranger kinds.

Sorinth
2022-03-20, 10:36 AM
Honestly, this is why the Bard (or whatever class they decided should get Magical Secrets) should be a half caster. The Artificer/Paladin/Ranger need to have class-exclusive 2nd/4th/5th level spells that are stronger than the norm for their spellcasting to not fall behind (since they get those spell levels a tier later than a full caster), and the Bard prevents that from happening.

If half-caster spells were super charged then they aren't really half-casters anymore. They are full casters with less spell slots.


I'm a fan of Druid becoming pact magic users with it's own list of Druidic invocations (Including at will casting of spells like Animal Friendship, Speak with Plants & Animals but lots of other stuff too), so Rangers also becoming pact magic users would also make a lot of sense. Though for the OP the reason Rangers feel the half-casting more then Paladins has to do with their spells being more useful out of combat, and there's no Ranger equivalent to smite. Take a couple of the iconic ranger spells like Hail of Thorns, Ensnaring Strike, and maybe Zephyr Strike and turn those into Smite-like abilities and you'd probably feel pretty good with the ranger as a half-caster.

Angelalex242
2022-03-20, 10:37 AM
Probably. The general concept is, Rangers are to Druids what Paladins are to Clerics.

KorvinStarmast
2022-03-20, 10:39 AM
I'm a fan of Druid becoming pact magic users with it's own list of Druidic invocations (Including at will casting of spells like Animal Friendship, Speak with Plants & Animals but lots of other stuff too), so Rangers also becoming pact magic users would also make a lot of sense. Though for the OP the reason Rangers feel the half-casting more then Paladins has to do with their spells being more useful out of combat, and there's no Ranger equivalent to smite. Take a couple of the iconic ranger spells like Hail of Thorns, Ensnaring Strike, and maybe Zephyr Strike and turn those into Smite-like abilities and you'd probably feel pretty good with the ranger as a half-caster. I'd love to see you flesh that out if you have the time to homebrew it. :smallsmile:

Witty Username
2022-03-20, 11:23 AM
I understand why they are half casters, but their spells being delayed by that progression hurts them a lot more than it does paladins.

I think I simply disagree.

The paladin doesn't get hurt as much because their spell list is worse, and often ignored.

Ranger getting pact magic would limit the effectiveness of there first and second level spells. Why ever cast Goodberry, when that is a conjure animals?

Monk getting one good spell faster than Ranger does not justify a game redesign.

As for scaling, Absorb elements,Goodberry, pass without trace, healing spirit, and conjure animals are good at all levels of play. Plant growth, name one spell on the paladin list with a 100ft radius.

5eNeedsDarksun
2022-03-20, 12:27 PM
I think I simply disagree.

The paladin doesn't get hurt as much because their spell list is worse, and often ignored.

Ranger getting pact magic would limit the effectiveness of there first and second level spells. Why ever cast Goodberry, when that is a conjure animals?

Monk getting one good spell faster than Ranger does not justify a game redesign.

As for scaling, Absorb elements,Goodberry, pass without trace, healing spirit, and conjure animals are good at all levels of play. Plant growth, name one spell on the paladin list with a 100ft radius.

I'd second most of this, particularly the last bit regarding Ranger spells being good over many tiers, despite not being the first to get them. The fact that many 'Rangers' are played with 3, 5, 9, or whatever levels then multiclassed out is proof those lower level spells are fine. They're a d10 class with multi-attack, and don't really need more / or more powerful spells. The gap between Ranger and Paladin is down to mainly 3 things:

1) Too many of the Ranger combat spells are concentration based. I'd include PWT here, as sometimes you want to keep it up over several encounters to move through an area.

2) Divine Smite. Paladins have an ability both to nova and to keep a concentration spell up. They can efficiently use slots for combat, which is a big issue for Rangers as they level.

3) Paladin Aura(s). The level 6 aura is incredibly strong, and all other martials are going to struggle to measure up to a class that gets this.

Solutions?
Well, I'll ignore the Aura situation since this post was about spells.

If someone wanted to simply make Rangers' spells work better and make it worth taking higher levels in the class I'd say give them a mechanic similar to Divine Smite. There'd be far less complaining about the Ranger Spell list if Rangers could just keep up concentration while converting other slots to 'Woodland Smite' or whatever. Yes, this makes the 2 classes more similar, and maybe it would be better to work through the Ranger list and either remove concentration from some spells or create/ borrow new ones, but that's a lot more complicated.

Amechra
2022-03-20, 12:33 PM
If half-caster spells were super charged then they aren't really half-casters anymore. They are full casters with less spell slots.

Not super-charged, exactly. You know how Find Greater Steed is a really good 4th level spell? It's stuff like that.

And chalk me down as also being interested in the Pact Druid. I find the current Druid... disappointing.

Amnestic
2022-03-20, 12:36 PM
If someone wanted to simply make Rangers' spells work better and make it worth taking higher levels in the class I'd say give them a mechanic similar to Divine Smite. There'd be far less complaining about the Ranger Spell list if Rangers could just keep up concentration while converting other slots to 'Woodland Smite' or whatever. Yes, this makes the 2 classes more similar, and maybe it would be better to work through the Ranger list and either remove concentration from some spells or create/ borrow new ones, but that's a lot more complicated.

Getting subclass specific ways to expend spell slots a la the artificer subclasses (except armourer) would be what I'd look for rather than a "Primal Smite". Drakewarden/Beastmaster both have something like this with their pet 'revives' (same as Battle Smith) so it'd be a matter of giving stuff like it to the other subclasses. Could be as simple as letting them use their SR/LR features again if you expend a spell slot, though that wouldn't fit for all of them mind you.

Petrocorus
2022-03-20, 12:52 PM
All of these, but the simpler fix is to have the Ranger be a prepared caster like the Paladin is. :smalltongue: And, for Rangers to have 'domain' spells as the Paladins do, and as was done in Xanathar's for those three ranger kinds.
This is exactly the fix i use and was going to advocate for.

In fact, after 8 years, i still don't understand why this was not like this from the beginning. I cannot fathom the mental process that lead the designer to decide the Ranger had to be a spells-known caster and with such a limited number of spells known.

KorvinStarmast
2022-03-20, 12:54 PM
In fact, after 8 years, i still don't understand why this was not like this from the beginning. I cannot fathom the mental process that lead the designer to decide the Ranger had to be a spells-known caster and with such a limited number of spells known.
Because the devs hated Rangers, and thus weren't willing to put in the work. :smallsmile:

Sigreid
2022-03-20, 12:57 PM
personally I think that replacing ranger spellcasting completely with invocations known as secrets of nature would be much more on theme for rangers.

Petrocorus
2022-03-20, 01:02 PM
1) Too many of the Ranger combat spells are concentration based. I'd include PWT here, as sometimes you want to keep it up over several encounters to move through an area.

....

If someone wanted to simply make Rangers' spells work better and make it worth taking higher levels in the class I'd say give them a mechanic similar to Divine Smite. There'd be far less complaining about the Ranger Spell list if Rangers could just keep up concentration while converting other slots to 'Woodland Smite' or whatever. Yes, this makes the 2 classes more similar, and maybe it would be better to work through the Ranger list and either remove concentration from some spells or create/ borrow new ones, but that's a lot more complicated.

I myself think the best way to do it would be to remove the concentration on their damage spells, except H's M.
Lightning Arrow, Flame Arrows and Swift Quiver don't need to be concentration spell.

Ninja Bear
2022-03-20, 01:03 PM
Honestly, this is why the Bard (or whatever class they decided should get Magical Secrets) should be a half caster. The Artificer/Paladin/Ranger need to have class-exclusive 2nd/4th/5th level spells that are stronger than the norm for their spellcasting to not fall behind (since they get those spell levels a tier later than a full caster), and the Bard prevents that from happening.
Well, or they need to be able to do unique things with those spells that can't be duplicated by the bard class.

What if we sort of split the difference between warlock and artificer, combining invocations/extra attunement slots? E.g.:


Natural Attunement
Since your magic draws on your attunement to nature, you can attune to spells as you would attune to a magic item.

Beginning at 6th level, you may elect to attune to a spell on the ranger spell list having a duration of more than one round and which does not require concentration, by spending a short rest focused only on that spell and spending a spell slot of the same level as the spell to cast the spell during that short rest. Once attuned, the spell occupies one of your attunement slots, and the spell's duration becomes permanent.

You receive an additional attunement slot at 10th, 14th, and 18th level.

Beginning at 14th level, you may elect to attune to a spell on the ranger spell list having a duration of more than one round and which does require concentration in the same manner, with the spell occupying two of your attunement slots. While attuned in this manner, the spell does not require concentration.

Petrocorus
2022-03-20, 01:04 PM
Because the devs hated Rangers, and thus weren't willing to put in the work. :smallsmile:
You're ironizing, but this is really as good an explanation as every other one i got.

Witty Username
2022-03-20, 02:36 PM
And cantrips.

All of these, but the simpler fix is to have the Ranger be a prepared caster like the Paladin is. :smalltongue: And, for Rangers to have 'domain' spells as the Paladins do, and as was done in Xanathar's for those three ranger kinds.

I am in support of this, for little more than logic. Spells known is not a method any other Wisdom based caster uses, and doesn't really have a good flavor justification either (like say EK, which could be justified as their knowledge of spells is very specific).

5eNeedsDarksun
2022-03-20, 03:53 PM
I myself think the best way to do it would be to remove the concentration on their damage spells, except H's M.
Lightning Arrow, Flame Arrows and Swift Quiver don't need to be concentration spell.

That's the kind of thing that would work. By the time I decided to multiclass out of Gloomstalker at level 9 in large part due to the issue of concentration competition (basically I couldn't see the benefit of sticking around for more levels to get more of the same) an optimal combat encounter looked like the following:
Step 1: Scout out the area and get the drop on the enemy
Step 2: Drop HM or PWT (as I'd often have HM up from a previous encounter or be using PWT for stealth)
Step 3: Pre-cast Lightning Arrow
Step 4: Go into combat using Lighting Arrow on the first hit, Bonus Action HM or maybe Ensnaring Strike, and remaining attacks with HM if up.

That's a heck of a process to follow to get more than 1 functioning combat spell up for an encounter and obviously will only work with successful scouting/ stealth. Why the heck would I want to stick around for 4 more levels to get 4th level spells that largely have the same issue?

If Lightning Arrow was, as you suggest, non-concentration with no other changes the Ranger would be able to keep HM or PWT up for multiple encounters and still get other combat spells off. Yes, there's a BA use, so isn't quite as efficient as Divine Smite, but it has a bit of AOE so I think that'd be more balanced.

Petrocorus
2022-03-20, 05:18 PM
Step 1: Scout out the area and get the drop on the enemy
Step 2: Drop HM or PWT (as I'd often have HM up from a previous encounter or be using PWT for stealth)
Step 3: Pre-cast Lightning Arrow
Step 4: Go into combat using Lighting Arrow on the first hit, Bonus Action HM or maybe Ensnaring Strike, and remaining attacks with HM if up.

By comparison with the Pally. Lightning Arrow is basically a smite spell.
But a Pally can combine a smite spell and Divine Smite.
HM is the Ranger's version of Divine Smite. It gives much less but on many more enemies, which fit with with the Ranger being less nova and more sustained damages.
BUT the Ranger is forbidden to combine his smite spell and his HM, just because of the concentration issue. So i think the issue is really here.

And BTW, for someone who's experienced in playing a Ranger, has Flame Arrows any advantage over keeping HM up?

5eNeedsDarksun
2022-03-20, 05:33 PM
By comparison with the Pally. Lightning Arrow is basically a smite spell.
But a Pally can combine a smite spell and Divine Smite.
HM is the Ranger's version of Divine Smite. It gives much less but on many more enemies, which fit with with the Ranger being less nova and more sustained damages.
BUT the Ranger is forbidden to combine his smite spell and his HM, just because of the concentration issue. So i think the issue is really here.

And BTW, for someone who's experienced in playing a Ranger, has Flame Arrows any advantage over keeping HM up?

It frees up your BA, but the downsides: Higher level slot, more (most?) resisted damage type, and no tracking benefit... yet another Concentration spell. Anyone see a theme here?

Witty Username
2022-03-20, 05:39 PM
Flame arrows, and I would include swift quiver are bad spells no matter how you slice it.
Flame arrows has 2 edge cases, 1 trolls, and 2 multiple archers. Trolls should be obvious. Multiple archers means more damage over 2 rounds than the Ranger would get from hunters Mark. Both are somewhat underwhelming for a 3rd level slot.

And swift quiver does nothing on the turn it is cast, for a 5th level slot. It is very hard to justify.

5eNeedsDarksun
2022-03-20, 05:54 PM
Flame arrows, and I would include swift quiver are bad spells no matter how you slice it.
Flame arrows has 2 edge cases, 1 trolls, and 2 multiple archers. Trolls should be obvious. Multiple archers means more damage over 2 rounds than the Ranger would get from hunters Mark. Both are somewhat underwhelming for a 3rd level slot.

And swift quiver does nothing on the turn it is cast, for a 5th level slot. It is very hard to justify.

I hadn't really thought about having a 2nd archer in the party. If you did, particularly with an 11th level+ fighter buddy Flame Arrows becomes pretty good, unless you run across fire resistant/ immune foes, which is going to happen pretty regularly.

Petrocorus
2022-03-20, 06:19 PM
And swift quiver does nothing on the turn it is cast, for a 5th level slot. It is very hard to justify.
If Swift Quiver would stack with HM, then i think it may be justified.

Leon
2022-03-20, 06:52 PM
No, what they have is good as it is. If they were more of a spellcasting class maybe but Spells for Rangers are extra tool in a varied tool kit. Don't see the need either for them to be prepared casters as most of the time your going to use a fixed selection spells anyway and only in edge cases would you be swapping thing around that particular edge case related spell.

5eNeedsDarksun
2022-03-20, 09:42 PM
One other thing that strikes me as I think about all these concentration based Ranger spells, particularly as they compare to Paladins, is that Rangers either need Resilient Con/ Warcaster or they've got to pigeonhole themselves into utility options and bonus action spells that activate on attack... or be prepared to fail Con checks regularly. Meanwhile the Paladin is going to be fine without. Why is this?

First, the Paladin. Well you're MAD, like the Ranger but 2 of the 3 abilities you need, Con and Chr, help your concentration by 6th level, so your bonus is likely minimum +5 and it's only going up from there. Second, Paladins have everyone's favorite buff spell, Bless, which stays viable through all tiers and has the handy benefit of boosting Con saves another 2 1/2 points, so now we're up to +7.5. So that's not quite auto-saves for generic 20 point or less hits, but we're getting close... at 6th level... without doing anything but casting your best most efficient (1st level) spell. And if all that doesn't work out you have other combat spells and spell slots that aren't concentration dependent like Find Steed, Find Greater Steed, and of course Divine Smite.

And the Ranger. Also MAD, so likely you've got a 14 Con; could be up or down a bit I suppose, but in all likelihood you're stuck with a +2, meaning you need to roll an 8 every time you get hit or lose concentration. That's 1/3 of hits disrupting concentration unless you do something about it, meaning all those concentration spells are likely going to cost you a feat somewhere down the line. I will give a little credit to one subclass here, the Gloomstalker, who gets Wis saves, so you could make an argument that this frees up the resources to take Res Con. Regardless the feat is pretty much a need.

ProsecutorGodot
2022-03-20, 10:15 PM
I think I simply disagree.

The paladin doesn't get hurt as much because their spell list is worse, and often ignored.

I might be misunderstanding your point here, but Paladin's unique spells are actually pretty above par, which is why you often see them stolen by Bard's (Find Greater Steed) and why Twilight Cleric is only that much better for taking Aura of Vitality, Aura of Life (situational, but in the situations it's meant for it's overwhelmingly effective) and Circle of Power. The rest of their spell list is not too shabby either. 2nd level being the only real "dead zone" assuming you've already used Find Steed.

Rangers, in comparison, already share their best class spells with the Wizard or Druid, aside from Zephyr Strike, while the remaining unshared spells are mediocre as you say in a follow-up comment.

I think your sentiment is correct though that a Paladin isn't particularly harmed by the delayed progression, but I would say it's actually because they have multiple good uses for their spell slots at any particular level. For example, they're not upset about getting 3rd level slots later because they have many consistently effective uses for those slots that don't really ever become less effective. Paladin spells are efficient and there's always going to be a useful thing for them to expend a slot on.

I also agree with Amnestic. We shouldn't let the fact that Bard's can steal it or that spellcasting subclasses might gain it as part of their subclass features limit the abilities of a Ranger spell because it certainly didn't limit the abilities of any Paladin spells.

Just take a quick glance at what Paladin's get as their "capstone" spells with Ranger's. Banishing Smite, Circle of Power and Destructive Wave* vs Conjure Volley and Swift Quiver. It's not a competition, it's a slaughter.
*Both of the damaging spells in this group, notably, are competitive with a Divine Smite at this level. Destructive Wave is nearly as damaging as a fifth level divine smite, two if they fail the save, before you account for it being AoE and with a prone effect on top of it all.

EDIT: I realize I got a bit distracted, I did have a point addressing rangers in all this - make them more functionally similar to Paladin's. Paladin's are a success story for Half Caster's, Ranger's should also be spells known with high quality unique spells.

Jervis
2022-03-21, 12:27 AM
I'm working on revamping all casting progressions and the ranger is in a weird place. I like the idea that your casting progression is dictated by the source. so innate casters are different than those who gain it by studying or gifted by X. The question I ran into was I'm not entirely sure where the ranger fits in.

They get their spells by smoking medicinal herbs

Angelalex242
2022-03-21, 01:25 AM
They get their spells by smoking medicinal herbs

Aragorn: I need my spells back maaaaan, got the heeeerb?

Gandalf: Sigh. Here you go...

Aragon: This kingsfoil is some GOOOD stuff maaaaaan...

Kane0
2022-03-21, 02:10 AM
*Checks notes*

I removed concentration from Hail of Thorns, Zephyr Strike, Flame Arrows, Lightning Arrow and Guardian of Nature amongst other changes.

Been working well so far.

Segev
2022-03-21, 02:57 AM
*Checks notes*

I removed concentration from Hail of Thorns, Zephyr Strike, Flame Arrows, Lightning Arrow and Guardian of Nature amongst other changes.

Been working well so far.

Swift Quiver would be another suggestion from me, maybe with an addition of allowing two attacks as part of the same action it's cast from.

5eNeedsDarksun
2022-03-21, 03:02 AM
They get their spells by smoking medicinal herbs

I literally laughed out loud. Well done.

Kane0
2022-03-21, 03:42 AM
Swift Quiver would be another suggestion from me, maybe with an addition of allowing two attacks as part of the same action it's cast from.

*Checks notes again*

Swift Quiver
5th-Level Transmutation
Casting time: 1 Bonus Action
Range: Touch
Components: V, S, M (a weapon or quiver containing at least one piece of ammunition)
Duration: Concentration, up to 1 hour

Until the spell ends your weapon attacks deal an extra 1d6 Force damage on a hit and once per turn you can duplicate one weapon attack you make before you roll the attack. This attack is treated as two identical attacks against the same target

Throne12
2022-03-21, 11:36 AM
Why not drop spells from rangers and replace it with somthing like warlocks invocations, or artificers infusions.

Sorinth
2022-03-21, 11:37 AM
For those interested here's the rough draft of my Druid using Pact magic
https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?643944-Druid-using-Pact-Magic

For Ranger's they would get less invocations then Druid Warlocks, and level prerequisites would potentially have to change as well.

Segev
2022-03-21, 01:26 PM
*Checks notes again*

Swift Quiver
5th-Level Transmutation
Casting time: 1 Bonus Action
Range: Touch
Components: V, S, M (a weapon or quiver containing at least one piece of ammunition)
Duration: Concentration, up to 1 hour

Until the spell ends your weapon attacks deal an extra 1d6 Force damage on a hit and once per turn you can duplicate one weapon attack you make before you roll the attack. This attack is treated as two identical attacks against the same target
Ah, you've changed it dramatically, then.

Kane0
2022-03-21, 03:05 PM
Yeah but it still more or less accomplishes the same thing. This way it doesnt eat up your BA every turn and you can get your once per turn damage boosts twice, both of which are notable benefits to rangers wheh you look at its subclasses. Lasts for more than one combat too.

Yakk
2022-03-21, 03:32 PM
I'm messing around with some Ranger changes.

First, a slight theme change. Rangers make deals with nature spirits for their magical powers; they become a Druid/Warlock/Fighter/Rogue cross (!) a bit.

Second, add in a 1st level Pact to Rangers (a 2nd subclass basically).

Hunt boosts Ranger spell progression by +1 level, and boosts Hunter's Mark at higher levels.
Pack gives the Ranger the Tasha's animal companion, and boosts it at higher levels.
Tooth gives Rangers some "Warden"/"Bloodhunter"/"Wildshape"-esque abilities.

---

But, along those lines, one approach might be to make the Ranger a short-rest half-caster with (possibly pseudo) spell points. Instead of being a "known spell" caster, make them pseudo-Vacian.

Covenant Magic
Starting at level 1, a Ranger can make Covenants with Nature Spirits during a long rest. Each Covenant Spirit knows up to 2 Ranger spells, and has a spell slot.

The total spell slots the Covenant Spirit cannot exceed the Ranger's class level, and the maximum level of the slot is 1st until level 5, when it becomes 2nd. At level 9 it becomes 3, at level 13 it becomes 4 and at level 17 it becomes 5.

The Ranger can discharge the Covenant by casting a spell the Covenant Spirit knows using its spell slot. The Covenant Spirit regains these spell slots when the Ranger takes a short rest.

Greater Covenant
Starting at level 9, a Ranger can form a Greater Covenant with 1 Nature Spirit. This Covenant Spirit can use its spell slot 3 times before completing a short rest, but also counts as 2 spirits when counting up its spell slots.

---

I guess this doesn't address your problem. But it does make Ranger's spell casting a bit less stilted.

sambojin
2022-03-21, 10:34 PM
I'd make them prepared casters. Yay! More versatility for when you move into different parts of a campaign or want to do different things. Less boredom, less being locked-in, and far more newbie friendly. Lvl+Wis spells to prep each day is great.

I'd also give them Ritual Caster at lvl2. Not the Druid version, the Wizard version. And you "know" all your spells of a level when you can cast them, all the time, so can cast any Ranger ritual for free. Ok, it's not a lot, but why shouldn't you be able to Speak with Animals or Detect Magic whenever you want (+10mins)? It gives them a bit of a niche that no other half-caste has, and not even a druid can do these things without having the spell actually prepared.

It just adds another dimension (or rather, keeps a core dimension of the class, while letting you do the things you need to do with your limited slots) without overpowering them. Setting up camp? Ritual out Silence to avoid being detected (with all the downsides of no party-chats as well). Need an animal buddy? Speak with animals and beast sense is almost as good as a familiar.

It comes in late enough for the higher level rituals that it won't break anything, and with being a prepared caster you can go from combat dude to natureman on a day to day basis, or as a matter of flavour for your character.

It's simple and it works. Prepared caster and all--Ranger-rituals casting makes them to be fun little characters that can do stuff no other martial can, while still being pretty good at cracking heads. Keeps the nature side of it core to the class no matter the build or subclass, while allowing enough flexibility in spell prep and slot usage to be usable (it always felt bad to use anything on nature-stuff when there was combat stuff and party stuff to do as well. Now you can have your fuzzywuzzies and eat them too!)


((Oh, and make Humanoid(any) as a pick for Favoured Enemy, any version of it. It allows for excellent trackers, bounty hunters, urban rangers, and all kinds of other class flavouring. Yes it's broad, but it's meant to be. You'll almost definitely encounter humanoids at some point in a campaign))

Segev
2022-03-22, 01:07 AM
Yeah but it still more or less accomplishes the same thing. This way it doesnt eat up your BA every turn and you can get your once per turn damage boosts twice, both of which are notable benefits to rangers wheh you look at its subclasses. Lasts for more than one combat too.

I see what you're doing. I think I still prefer it as written, just sans concentration and with the two attacks also happening when cast. But I don't see a problem with yours; it's just a matter of taste, to me.

Kane0
2022-03-22, 01:57 AM
I'd make them prepared casters.

I'd also give them Ritual Caster at lvl2.

Yes I have been doing the former for a few years now, works really nicely.

Hadnt actually considered the latter, even though I did come up with a few Ranger only spells for similar purposes (setting/hiding/protecting campsites, temporary rope bridges and rafts in particular)


I see what you're doing. I think I still prefer it as written, just sans concentration and with the two attacks also happening when cast. But I don't see a problem with yours; it's just a matter of taste, to me.

Fair fair.

sambojin
2022-03-22, 08:42 AM
Yes I have been doing the former for a few years now, works really nicely.

Hadnt actually considered the latter, even though I did come up with a few Ranger only spells for similar purposes (setting/hiding/protecting campsites, temporary rope bridges and rafts in particular)


It's actually kinda funny just how expansive Wismod+Lvl is for prepared casters, especially half-casters. But it's actually entirely intentional in the Ranger's case. At lvl5 with 14Wis you've got 7(!) spells to prepare. Not the paltry 4 known/locked-in ones you'd normally have. At lvl9 you have 11(!) to prepare, not 6 known. You can change every day, but your spell preparations are pretty wide and varied regardless.

This makes you a toolkit caster. Not many slots, but plenty of preps to handle many situations. It's actually closer to the Warlock thing than many realise (they end up with more known spells than slots to use them with), but on a pretty MAD class.

Alongside your basic ritual casting, it makes Rangers really unique in what they can do compared to any other 1/3rd-1/2caster. A smattering of all levels, or a couple of lvl1 keepsakes and level-shift the rest up for higher end situationals, or all lowers to upcast to slots worthy of them? It's your choice, and while you can choose wrong, you can at least Ranger up some rituals during rests or quiet time so you're definitely a Ranger regardless of slot usage or preps. And you would sometimes even prepare your ritual spells, and use real slots on them, for when time is of the essence.

It's a really simple, but quite wide-ranging change, that fixes the entire class. I'd be pretty happy with the basic PHB Ranger if they were prepared + ritual casters, no other changes needed.

(And there's been *so* many changes, whereas the above politely fixes everything, and gives them a niche and an identity in a party, as a martial + toolkit + nature ritual caster)

Petrocorus
2022-03-22, 08:58 AM
It's actually kinda funny just how expansive Wismod+Lvl is for prepared casters, especially half-casters. But it's actually entirely intentional in the Ranger's case. At lvl5 with 14Wis you've got 7(!) spells to prepare. Not the paltry 4 known/locked-in ones you'd normally have. At lvl9 you have 11(!) to prepare, not 6 known. You can change every day, but your spell preparations are pretty wide and varied regardless.

Why so many? They are half-casters, why just not give Lvl/2 + Wis.mod, like the Paladin?
Especially if you also allow the Ranger to ritual-cast spells without needing to prepare them.

sambojin
2022-03-22, 09:08 AM
Why so many? They are half-casters, why just not give Lvl/2 + Wis.mod, like the Paladin?
Especially if you also allow the Ranger to ritual-cast spells without needing to prepare them.


Uniqueness, mostly. Pallies use their slots for smites and the occasional Bless or other spell. Rangers use their slots for situations and solutions to them.

So, it's like they're two entirely different character classes :)

I don't think there's a "typical" half-caster archetype that should be followed. If anything, smites would make Pallies the outlier that *needs* to be toned down, not Rangers having spell toolkit versatility (especially considering the Ranger's spell list). Pallies can't mess it up, on any day, completely, because at worst their slots are +damage. Rangers can really mess it up, pre or post Tasha's. With these changes, they can't, they can just martial nature half-caster their way to glory.

It turns them from "meh", to "yep, I can Ranger real hard!" (If only I had more damage... And I can build for it, but it's not built-in. But I *can* spell up a natural solution to plenty of stuff!)

Segev
2022-03-22, 09:22 AM
I mean, even Wisdom Modifier + Half Ranger Level spells prepared is way, way more than the number of spells known they get now.

sambojin
2022-03-22, 10:00 AM
And would it be OP at full Ranger levels + Wismod, or just a really cool/ unique martial class?

I can't see it breaking anything. They'd still be well behind the top tier classes (ie: Pally or full-caster), they'd just be more awesome at what they do. Which is to be a Ranger, and one that is fun to play as.

I mean, what does this change break, to your mind (other than having a very versatile toolkit in many pillars of play, which was the intention of the changes in the first place)? Any horribly broken spell lists you could setup (considering concentration and low spell slots), any amazing combos? Even considering the powercreep of new Ranger subclasses?

I can't think of any. It just lets Rangers range a lot more (which sometimes it feels like they can't, they can only subclass, or try and build for max situational damage as the "I won Ranger!" buttons, which seems to limit the class), and gives them a weird skill/toolbox niche, but definitely not a rogue or bard or artificer or druid or wizard while they're doing it.

Nature and combat and magic combined, just not as unprepared for either/or/all. It gives the feel and the flavour of the class, without the limitations on what they should be. But there's definitely things you can do, and some things that only you can do, as a Ranger in a party of adventurers in any given space or time in DnD.


(I don't know if it's been addressed enough, but even at lvl5-9-13, Rangers have a pretty bad spell list. And lots of them are concentration. Giving more spells to someone off such a spell list isn't ever a bad thing, especially when so many of the spells are pretty weak or situational. Prepare away! And giving "free" +10min rituals probably won't hurt either, not off that list. It just makes them more well-rounded characters at their core of Ranger. Having a spell or two auto-prepared from your subclass is pretty irrelevant compared to the lack of spell slots you have to use that "feature", when you can barely Ranger on a given day other than being a fighter-light with quarter feats at 3rd/7th/whatever levels from those features. Not saying you can't MC for some nice builds, but these changes help core "Ranger" be a class you'd stick to (and even want to possibly dip 2-3lvls of). Rituals and full spell prep is almost enough, alongside the *whatever Ranger version* your table is using)


((Pre-Ranger boosts, when I did DM a campaign, early 5e, I had all Rangers have Humanoid(any) as a Favoured Enemy for free. It turns out they're just really good at tracking people, and then they start to specify different creature types that they're good at doing that with too. It worked out well.
I still think that Rangers should have Humanoid (any type) as a "favoured enemy" for free (and have Intimidation as a skill against them based on Con or Wis), on whatever version of that your Ranger is using. Even if it's a flat damage buff. It makes you scary and wild and not quite like "normal people". They are the "unnatural world" to you, no matter how uncivilized the humanoid is that it's against, so have known weak points and habits to you. And you are prepared to really kill/ hunt/ track them as a natural being with the world on your side for doing so. People are easy, it's all the weird stuff in DnD you have to specify for as favourites as a Ranger))


(((Having what are essentially druid rituals pre-prepared is like having really, really bad cantrips. I mean, you're already a MAD class. You can't really afford extra feats for magic or cantrips, but you're meant to be able to do nature magic sometimes.
Having slow, pretty bad "spell-cantrips" isn't going to change the fast-paced play on the battlefield. But, at least there's always something to do at other times. Without having to feat into it. You're still, strangely enough, one of the least "magicy" 1/3-1/2 martial/utility classes out there, you've just got options and a tiny bit of sustain of them, all wrapped up in your Ranger'ness. Yours don't Wizz or bang or smite or Shield, yours just RP away the average day, as adventures and adventurers sometimes do)))

Kane0
2022-03-22, 03:26 PM
I mean, even Wisdom Modifier + Half Ranger Level spells prepared is way, way more than the number of spells known they get now.

One or two more unless you pump WIS

animorte
2022-03-22, 05:31 PM
Maybe Rangers would be taken more seriously?

And Hunter's Mark wouldn't be considered a waste by the majority (I personally still like it).

Witty Username
2022-03-22, 08:15 PM
I might be misunderstanding your point here, but Paladin's unique spells are actually pretty above par, which is why you often see them stolen by Bard's (Find Greater Steed) and why Twilight Cleric is only that much better for taking Aura of Vitality, Aura of Life (situational, but in the situations it's meant for it's overwhelmingly effective) and Circle of Power. The rest of their spell list is not too shabby either. 2nd level being the only real "dead zone" assuming you've already used Find Steed.

Rangers, in comparison, already share their best class spells with the Wizard or Druid, aside from Zephyr Strike, while the remaining unshared spells are mediocre as you say in a follow-up comment.

I think your sentiment is correct though that a Paladin isn't particularly harmed by the delayed progression, but I would say it's actually because they have multiple good uses for their spell slots at any particular level. For example, they're not upset about getting 3rd level slots later because they have many consistently effective uses for those slots that don't really ever become less effective. Paladin spells are efficient and there's always going to be a useful thing for them to expend a slot on.

I also agree with Amnestic. We shouldn't let the fact that Bard's can steal it or that spellcasting subclasses might gain it as part of their subclass features limit the abilities of a Ranger spell because it certainly didn't limit the abilities of any Paladin spells.

Just take a quick glance at what Paladin's get as their "capstone" spells with Ranger's. Banishing Smite, Circle of Power and Destructive Wave* vs Conjure Volley and Swift Quiver. It's not a competition, it's a slaughter.
*Both of the damaging spells in this group, notably, are competitive with a Divine Smite at this level. Destructive Wave is nearly as damaging as a fifth level divine smite, two if they fail the save, before you account for it being AoE and with a prone effect on top of it all.

EDIT: I realize I got a bit distracted, I did have a point addressing rangers in all this - make them more functionally similar to Paladin's. Paladin's are a success story for Half Caster's, Ranger's should also be spells known with high quality unique spells.

I agree that the exclusive list is mediocre, I think Xanathar's has a couple good ones, but I don't remember names and books right now.
I was more talking about the overall lists, which the Ranger has many of the better spells from the druid list and some other good stuff.
Conjure Animals, Pass without trace, and Goodberry, for example.
Also, Paladin has divine smite. Which leads to some neglecting the entire list. Which is the often ignored part of my statement. Also, people complain less when they dump slots into smites, as opposed to say Hunter's Mark with some saying that they feel held back by it. I would argue part of that is having spells they would prefer to cast instead of Hunter's Mark more often then a Paladin has spells they would rather cast instead of smite.

I would argue that the Ranger having a weak spell list, and an not exclusive list are too different problems.
Citing the Sorcerer, they have 1 exclusive spell, and it is not very good, but as a caster they are not weak.

Overall, I would say Paladin has a decent list and Ranger has a good list. Unique spells is unrelated and won't be fixed by messing with the prepared vs known casting or spell slots anyway.

ProsecutorGodot
2022-03-23, 04:52 AM
I agree that the exclusive list is mediocre, I think Xanathar's has a couple good ones, but I don't remember names and books right now.
I was more talking about the overall lists, which the Ranger has many of the better spells from the druid list and some other good stuff.
Conjure Animals, Pass without trace, and Goodberry, for example.
The issue is that they're competing with druid, rather than how paladin competes with cleric for most of their overlapping spells. Rangers are lacking a strong pull to consider them over simply playing a druid in my opinion, which is why I think their unique spells are an important factor.

Also, Paladin has divine smite. Which leads to some neglecting the entire list. Which is the often ignored part of my statement. Also, people complain less when they dump slots into smites, as opposed to say Hunter's Mark with some saying that they feel held back by it. I would argue part of that is having spells they would prefer to cast instead of Hunter's Mark more often then a Paladin has spells they would rather cast instead of smite.
I thought I had addressed this, so I'll reiterate, smite is a positive impact on their spellcasting ability. There will be situations where the situational siren list of a half caster guess under utilized, however paladins can efficiently make use of all their spell slots. A ranger can only really use their spell slots efficiently with repeated castings of Goodberry.


I would argue that the Ranger having a weak spell list, and an not exclusive list are too different problems.
Citing the Sorcerer, they have 1 exclusive spell, and it is not very good, but as a caster they are not weak.
I'm reasonably confident saying they're the same problem, the fact that they have more unique spells than a full caster is an indication to me that powerful spells on their list acquired at late levels (for them) is an intentional thing. Rangers clearly got the worse end of that.


Unique spells is unrelated and won't be fixed by messing with the prepared vs known casting or spell slots anyway.
It's at least a bit of a related issue, a ranger might be less upset about their spell progression is the options they had were more effective and not a list of 4 generally good spells and a remaining list of situational or flat out bad spells. The thing is that it's easier to fix spell slots to be better than it is to fix a mediocre list of spells.

I'm probably a bit harsh on rangers spells but I simply can't help comparing them to paladin and finding both their supportive spells and buffing spells to be lacking in comparison. I want for them to be more comparable.

Witty Username
2022-03-24, 12:12 AM
You could do the 3.5 warmage solution
entire spell list known spontaneous caster for Ranger.
At the very least it would help seeing which spells need work and don't.
-
Another quick thought, maybe bringing Hunter's Mark closer in line to smite, up the damage to 2d6.

Edit: I seem to have misrembered, Ranger didn't get any exclusive spells in Xanathar's.

ProsecutorGodot
2022-03-24, 10:03 AM
Another quick thought, maybe bringing Hunter's Mark closer in line to smite, up the damage to 2d6.
Hunter's Mark (and Hex) should be class features, not spells. Then we can buff/adjust them for balance and to match themes within subclasses.

If it weren't for the fact that Oath of Vengeance had Hunter's Mark on their spell list it could be as simple as buffing it, but Vengeance is already a powerful and popular subclass so simply buffing Hunter's Mark might have noticeable impact outside of Ranger.

Edit: I seem to have misrembered, Ranger didn't get any exclusive spells in Xanathar's.

They did, Zephyr Strike, and it's one of the few good unique spells they have. In my opinion Steel Wind Strike also should have remained a Ranger exclusive spell but for some baffling reason they included it in the Wizard spell list.

Amnestic
2022-03-24, 10:31 AM
but for some baffling reason they included it in the Wizard spell list.

Wizards of the Coast not Sorcerers Rangers of the Coast :)

Segev
2022-03-24, 11:31 AM
Hunter's Mark (and Hex) should be class features, not spells. Then we can buff/adjust them for balance and to match themes within subclasses.

If it weren't for the fact that Oath of Vengeance had Hunter's Mark on their spell list it could be as simple as buffing it, but Vengeance is already a powerful and popular subclass so simply buffing Hunter's Mark might have noticeable impact outside of Ranger.For hunter's mark, I think it could be buffed without touching it by simply making a few other Ranger spells not need Concentration - flame arrows and swift quiver in particular. But it could also be buffed by having either a ranger class feature or an addition to the spell that says that hunter's mark (or ranger spells with targets in general) only require Concentration if the target is not a favored enemy.


They did, Zephyr Strike, and it's one of the few good unique spells they have. In my opinion Steel Wind Strike also should have remained a Ranger exclusive spell but for some baffling reason they included it in the Wizard spell list.I often have this problem, so I am asking for help, here: To me, zephyr strike has an underwhelming effect for requiring Concentration (you don't provoke OAs with movement), and a one-off benefit that, while nice, isn't worth breaking concentration on longer-running spells for. If all zephyr strike did was let you move +30 ft. and add +d8 to an attack's damage when you cast it, that'd be more or less worthwhile (depending on the action cost), as long as it was instantaneous or 1 round with no concentration. But as written, it feels too costly to be worthwhile, and weirdly has a meh effect and a one-off almost-worth-it effect.

Am I missing something? What makes it so good?

ProsecutorGodot
2022-03-24, 11:50 AM
I often have this problem, so I am asking for help, here: To me, zephyr strike has an underwhelming effect for requiring Concentration (you don't provoke OAs with movement), and a one-off benefit that, while nice, isn't worth breaking concentration on longer-running spells for. If all zephyr strike did was let you move +30 ft. and add +d8 to an attack's damage when you cast it, that'd be more or less worthwhile (depending on the action cost), as long as it was instantaneous or 1 round with no concentration. But as written, it feels too costly to be worthwhile, and weirdly has a meh effect and a one-off almost-worth-it effect.

Am I missing something? What makes it so good?

Counter question then - What other spells is a Ranger concentrating on in combat? Hunter's Mark, and? At least compared to the other combat oriented unique spells ranger has like Ensnaring Strike and Hail of Thorns it has guaranteed use outside of its one and done aspect.

Ranger's set a pretty low bar for what is a good use for their concentration in combat, the vast majority of their concentration spells are non-combat utility spells and the ones that are usable in combat are either mediocre or knock-off smite spells with usually worse rider effects. There are a small handful of exceptions but they're higher level spells, since the Ranger is a half caster these come in late and they're given less spell slots to use them. Several of these are 4th+ level spells as well, coming in past that oft mentioned T2 breakoff where most players never see.

I suppose if you expect some of those spells to have their durations extend through a combat that's a fair point, PWT and Conjure Animals/Woodland Beings have that potential, but it's only a consideration if you expect those spells to be worth keeping for their hour long duration. You've got a fair bit less of those higher level spell slots as well, so you're usually going to have more opportunity to use Zephyr Strike in times where it won't be competing for Concentration at all.

Final note, and again why I keep drawing the Paladin comparison, Ranger's can only expend their spell slots on spells. They're overfilled with niche spells so it's nice when they have something with a generally useful effect. Hunter's Mark is, by all accounts, not an earth shatteringly powerful spell but despite that it's considered a significant strength of the Ranger because otherwise their spell slots are going under-utilized. More ways to expend these spell slots in a meaningful way is a good thing and is a large part of why I find Smite to be so valuable, you can quickly burn a resource that would have otherwise gone unused for a powerful effect.

Petrocorus
2022-03-24, 03:00 PM
I don't think there's a "typical" half-caster archetype that should be followed.
Yes, there is.
The Ranger and the Pally are very similar in the way the classes are build, even symmetrical. They have the same spell level and spell slot progression. They also have several levels that are identical or very similar (give or take a ribbon feature) (levels: 2 (or close) , 3, 5, maybe 7, 9, 13, 17; plus the classic 4, 8, 12, 16, 19 that are similar for every one).
The Artificer also have the same spell level and spell slot progression. And it prepares its spells like the Pally, and also know all of its list, despite having a much better list than the other two and being an arcane caster.

The main difference is that the Ranger is the only one among half-caster with a limited number of spell known, and also the only divine caster with a limited list of spell known. It's also the only one who didn't get additional spells known and prepared from its subclasses originally.
Yes, the Artificer has cantrips and ritual casting, that may be because it's a more magical class, or because they decided that half-casters should have those and they're going to in 5.5.

The other main difference is that the PHB Ranger has ribbon features treated as main features and badly designed features here and there (primal awareness, HiPS) and cannot compensate with its utility spells it doesn't know while the Pally have real useful features and spells that actually synergise with them, including one feature that allow him to forgo casting spells.


Counter question then - What other spells is a Ranger concentrating on in combat? Hunter's Mark, and? At least compared to the other combat oriented unique spells ranger has like Ensnaring Strike and Hail of Thorns it has guaranteed use outside of its one and done aspect.
Those spells plus Lightning Arrow. They are basically the Ranger's Smite spells but they requires you to doff HM. Which means they doesn't cost a spell slot, but two.

Segev
2022-03-24, 04:35 PM
Counter question then - What other spells is a Ranger concentrating on in combat? Hunter's Mark, and? At least compared to the other combat oriented unique spells ranger has like Ensnaring Strike and Hail of Thorns it has guaranteed use outside of its one and done aspect.

Hunter's mark and pass without trace are good examples. Flame arrows should, theoretically, be a good choice. So, theoretically, should swift quiver. If you're saying "all their concentration spells suck, so why shouldn't zephyr strike?" then I guess you have an argument, there, but that doesn't make zephyr strike good.

Also, XGE put entangle on the Ranger list, which is a much better use of Concentration during combat than zephyr strike.

ProsecutorGodot
2022-03-24, 06:13 PM
Also, XGE put entangle on the Ranger list, which is a much better use of Concentration during combat than zephyr strike.

I hadn't looked very closely at the Tasha's list (which I assume is what you meant) so there could be more useful options included there.

Kane0
2022-03-24, 07:05 PM
*Checks notes again*


1st-level divination
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: Touch
Components: V, S, M (a bit of fur wrapped in cloth)
Duration: Concentration, up to 1 hour

You establish a telepathic link with one beast you touch that is friendly to you or charmed by you. The spell fails if the beast’s Intelligence is 4 or higher. Until the spell ends, the link is active while you and the beast are within one mile of each other. Through the link, the beast can understand your telepathic messages to it, and it can telepathically communicate simple emotions and concepts back to you. While the link is active, the beast gains advantage on attack rolls against any creature within your reach that you can see.


1st-level Conjuration
Casting time: 1 Action
Range: Self
Components: V, M (ranged weapon)
Duration: Instantaneous

As part of the action used to cast this spell you must make a ranged weapon attack, otherwise the spell fails.
Hit or miss, a rain of thorns sprouts from your ranged weapon or ammunition. In addition to the normal effect of the attack, the target of the attack and each creature within 5 feet of it must make a Dexterity saving throw. A creature takes 1d10 piercing damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one.
At Higher Levels: If you cast this spell using a spell slot of 2nd level or higher, the damage increases by 1d10 for each slot level above 1st.


1st-level Transmutation
Casting Time: 1 bonus action
Range: Self
Components: V
Duration: 1 minute

For the duration, your movement doesn’t provoke opportunity attacks.
On your turn you can choose to end this spell early. If you do so, you gain advantage on the next weapon attack you make and your speed increases by 30 feet until the end of that turn.


2nd-level Transmutation
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: Touch
Components: S
Duration: 8 hours

You touch a willing creature. Until the spell ends the target's AC cannot be less than 18 regardless of what kind of armor it is wearing. When the targeted creature is struck by a critical hit or takes fire damage this minimum AC is reduced by 1 (maximum once per turn). The spell ends when the minimum AC reaches 10 or the target's natural AC.


2nd-level divination
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: Self
Components: S
Duration: 1 hour

You sense the presence and nature of any trap that is within line of sight. A trap, for the purpose of this spell, includes anything that would inflict a sudden or unexpected effect you consider harmful or undesirable, which was intended as such by its creator.
Thus, the spell would sense an area affected by the alarm spell or a mechanical pit trap, but it would not reveal natural hazards or structural weaknesses due to the passage of time.
This spell merely reveals that a trap is present, and the danger it poses to you. You do not learn the location of each trap.


3rd-level Conjuration
Casting time: 1 Action
Range: Self (60-foot cone)
Components: S, M (one piece of ammunition or a thrown weapon)
Duration: Instantaneous

You throw a nonmagical weapon or fire a piece of nonmagical ammunition into the air to create a cone of identical weapons that shoot forward and then disappear. Each creature in a 60-foot cone must succeed on a Dexterity saving throw. A creature takes 6d8 damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one. The damage type is the same as that of the weapon or ammunition used as a component.
At Higher Levels: The damage increases by 1d8 for each slot level above 3rd.


3rd-level transmutation
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: Touch
Components: S
Duration: 8 hours

You touch a quiver containing arrows, bullets or bolts. When a target is hit by a ranged weapon attack using a piece of ammunition drawn from the quiver, the target takes an extra 1d8 fire damage. The spell’s magic ends on a piece of ammunition when it hits or misses, and the spell ends after twelve pieces of ammunition have been drawn from the quiver.
At Higher Levels: When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 3rd level or higher, the number of pieces of ammunition you can affect with this spell increases by six for each slot level above 2nd.


3rd level transmutation
Casting Time: 1 bonus action
Range: Self
Components: V, S, M (ranged weapon)
Duration: Instantaneous

As part of the casting of this spell you must make a ranged weapon attack, otherwise the spell fails.
Hit or miss, the weapon or ammunition emits bolts of lightning. In addition to the normal effect of the attack, the target of the attack and each creature within 10 feet of it must make a Dexterity saving throw. A creature takes 3d8 lightning damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one.
At Higher Levels: When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 4th level or higher, the damage for both effects of the spell increases by 1d8 for each slot level above 3rd.


4th Level Conjuration
Casting Time: 1 Bonus Action
Range: 30 feet
Components: M
Duration: Concentration, up to one minute

You make a vine sprout in an unoccupied space you can see. When you cast this spell, you can make the vine whip a creature up to 30 feet from it, if you can see the target. The creature must succeed on a Dexterity saving throw or be restrained and moved up to 20 feet in a direction of your choice within the 30 foot reach of the vine.
Creatures that are restrained by the vine take 4d8 poison damage at the beginning of their turn and as an action can attempt a Strength check against your spell DC to break free of the vine's grip.
Until the spell ends, you can use your bonus action to have the vine lash out again.


4th-Level Transmutation
Casting time: 1 Bonus Action
Range: Self
Components: V
Duration: 1 minute

A nature spirit answers your call and transforms you into a powerful guardian. The transformation lasts until the spell ends. You choose one of the following forms to assume: Primal Beast or Great Tree.
Primal Beast: Bestial fur covers your body, your facial features become feral, and you gain the following benefits:
- Your walking speed increases by 10 feet.
- You gain darkvision with a range of 120 feet.
- You make Strength-based attack rolls with advantage.
- Your melee weapon attacks deal an extra 1d6 force damage on a hit.

Great Tree: Your skin appears barky, leaves sprout from your hair, and you gain the following benefits:
- You gain 10 temporary hit points.
- You make Constitution saving throws with advantage.
- You make Dexterity- and Wisdom-based attack rolls with advantage.
- While you are on the ground, the ground within 15 feet of you is difficult terrain for your enemies.


4th Level Transmutation
Casting Time: 1 Action
Range: Touch
Components: S, M
Duration: 1 hour

Until the spell ends, the target has resistance to Bludgeoning, Piercing and Slashing damage


5th-Level Transmutation
Casting time: 1 Bonus Action
Range: Touch
Components: V, S, M (a weapon or quiver containing at least one piece of ammunition)
Duration: Concentration, up to 1 hour

Until the spell ends your weapon attacks deal an extra 1d6 Force damage on a hit and once per turn you can duplicate one weapon attack you make before you roll the attack. This attack is treated as two identical attacks against the same target.


And a few extra Ranger-specific spells of my own


1st level Illusion (Ritual)
Casting Time: 1 minute
Range: 20 feet
Duration: 8 Hours
Components: V, S, M
The area in a 20 foot radius around you is magically obscured from those attempting to locate it, dimming campfires and shrouding smoke. Any creature outside of the area of the spell has disadvantage on any Wisdom (Perception) or Intelligence (Investigation) checks to find your hidden campsite.


2nd level Conjuration (Ritual)
Casting Time: 1 Minute
Range: Touch
Duration: Concentration, up to one hour
Components: S, M
The piece of wood touches expands and turns into a square raft 10 feet long and 10 feet wide. This craft can support up to three large creatures, six medium creatures or nine small creatures on calm waters.
At Higher Levels: When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 3rd level or higher, the raft is 5 feet longer and wider, supporting one large, two medium or three small creatures more for each slot above 2nd.


2nd-Level Divination
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: Self
Components: S
Duration: Concentration, up to 1 minute
For the duration, you sense the weaknesses of creatures within 30 feet of you. When you cast this spell and on each of your turns for the duration you can use your action to determine one damage vulnerability, source of disadvantage or the lowest saving throw of one creature you can see within 30 feet.


2nd level Transmutation
Casting Time: 1 Minute
Range: 60 feet
Duration: Concentration, up to 1 hour
Components: S, M
The length of rope you are holding magically anchors itself to up to three surfaces you can see within range, creating a rope bridge that is 5 feet wide between those spaces that can support up to 500 pounds. Each 5 foot length has an AC of 13 and 20 hit points. Reducing a length to 0 hit points destroys it and might cause the bridge to collapse at the DM’s discretion.
At Higher Levels: When you cast this spell using a spell slot of 3rd level or higher, the range of the spell increases by 15 feet for each slot level above 2nd.


2nd level Abjuration
Casting time: 1 minute
Range: 20 feet
Duration: 8 Hours
Components: V, S, M
The area in a 20 foot radius is magically warded from those attempting to enter it. The spell fails if its area includes more than six creatures. Creatures and objects within the area when you cast this spell can move freely, all other creatures must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw against your Spell DC in order to enter the area. Spells and objects are unaffected.


Edit: And for completeness sake:

Favored Foe: When you hit a creature with an attack roll, you can mark the target for 1 minute or until you lose your concentration as if you were concentrating on a spell.
Once per turn, when you or an ally within 10 feet of you hit the target with an attack and deal damage to it (including when you mark it) the attack deals an additional 1d4 damage.
You can use this feature to mark your Quarry a number of times equal to your proficiency bonus, and you regain all expended uses when you finish a long rest.
This feature's extra damage increases to 1d6 at 6th level and to 1d8 at 14th level, and extends to allies within 30 feet of you at 10th level.


1st-Level Divination
Casting Time: 1 Bonus Action
Range: 90 feet
Components: V
Duration: Concentration, up to 1 hour

Choose a creature you can see within range. Until the spell ends, you gain advantage on Dexterity (Stealth), Intelligence (History and Nature) and Wisdom (Insight and Survival) checks in relation to, and when dealing with, that creature.
At Higher Levels: When you use a spell slot of 3rd level, you can select a creature you have met even if you cannot see them and they are outside of the spell's range. When you use a spell slot of 5th level, you can maintain Concentration on the spell for up to 8 hours.

Witty Username
2022-03-25, 08:45 PM
I hadn't looked very closely at the Tasha's list (which I assume is what you meant) so there could be more useful options included there.

Entangle, Aid, and Revifivy are the big ones. Searing smite is on there for some reason.
I like greater restoration on the list but I start to nood off at tier 4 play.

I personally think it should have included Aura of Vitality (it was added to the druid list) but I can't really complain about more spells.