Average +1 or rolling hp

[Entessa]

Barbarian fighter multiclass. Was thinking that in the case of d12 and d10 it may be better to roll rather than ask my dm for average.

For d6, having 4 is like 66%
while for a d12 having 7 is way less.

I mean, I should probably ask him to roll a dice in secret together with me, and I can choose between my roll (known) and his roll (unknown).

[Elder_Basilisk]

Statistically, you are better off taking 50%+1 than rolling. Rolling a d12 is Avery 6.5 50%+1 is 7. If your DM is going to give you a safety net by rolling in secret or letting you reroll or whatever, then odds are good that rolling will be better. For example if you roll and the DM rolls in secret, and you take the DMs roll when you roll a 4 or less, that results in an average of 7.833....

That said, DMs will not necessarily offer you safety net options if you want to roll. And even if they do, the extra .8333 average HP is not necessarily worth the small chance of ending up with a 1 or 2. Especially at low levels, a low roll can hurt more than a high roll can help. A second level fighter with 11+2xcon HP rather than 16+2xcon has a lot less leeway for being able to survive a round of lucky enemy hits or a crit.

[Keravath]

Barbarian fighter multiclass. Was thinking that in the case of d12 and d10 it may be better to roll rather than ask my dm for average.

For d6, having 4 is like 66%
while for a d12 having 7 is way less.

I mean, I should probably ask him to roll a dice in secret together with me, and I can choose between my roll (known) and his roll (unknown).

Average rounded up is ALWAYS better than straight rolling - yes, you miss out on the 12 but you also miss out on the 1. In the long run, average works better.

However, if you come up with a system that the DM goes for that will give you a higher average return than the straight average - then go for it. For example, if you could roll hit points with advantage (roll two pick higher) then that is much better than just taking the average of one die. Yes you will have some bad rolls where you might roll a 1 and a 2 and have to take the 2 but in the long term you should do much better than a 7 average.

For example, rolling 8+ on at least one d12 with advantage should happen 65% of the time ... making it much better than just taking a 7.

In the situation where you roll one and the DM rolls one and you pick ... then you would pick the DMs die whenever you rolled 6 or less ... as a result 50% of the time your average would be 9.5 ... and 50% of the time it would be 6.5% ... so the overall average would be 8 in the long run - making it better than taking the average BUT you can still roll badly, and can roll badly several times since realistically you are rolling at most 20 dice and in many cases just 5-10 for playing through levels 5-10 so even one bad roll can really contribute to having sub par hit points. From that perspective, just taking the average is a much more reliable option if your DM is the type where you get to roll but have to keep 1s and 2s etc.

[da newt]

Go with rolling but nat 1s are a reroll, or average rounded up (they end up statistically equal). If you can con your DM into something more generous, then choose that.

[Kane0]

Average is best for consistency, rolling is fine but you have to be OK with getting that 1 or 2. The game wont break if you do, but if your DM is nice and gives you an out for those poor rolls that tends to accelerate the dreaded HP bloat in the long term.

[OldTrees1]

Die
Average
Fixed
Bonus for Fixed
Chance to roll lower
Chance to roll higher

1d63.540.55033.33
1d84.550.55037.50
1d105.560.55040.00
1d126.570.55041.67
...
1d21.520.5500
1d10050.5510.55049
1d1000500.55010.55049.9
1d1000000500000.55000010.55049.9999


Expect rolling to be lower than taking the fixed (average + 0.5)

Alternatively, if the GM allows you to pick level by level, you could roll until you roll below average. Then take the average from then on.
For a 1d10 (T is below Fixed, Fixed value is neutral, H is above Fixed value). After 3 levels you are winning 20.4%, losing 79.5%, and neutral 0.1% but you are capping your loss at 1 bad roll.
Lose: (1 tails): 55.5%
Minor loss: (1 heads 1 tails): 24%
All neutrals: 0.1%
Tiny win (1 head and still rolling): 1.2%
Minor win (2 heads 1 tails): 8%
Win (2 heads and still rolling): 4.8%
Lucky (3 heads): 6.4%

[Chronos]

For d6, having 4 is like 66%
while for a d12 having 7 is way less.
No, for d6, having 4 is like having 114%, and for d12, having 7 is like having 108%. You only get those other numbers if you assume every roll is always going to be the maximum.

[Pex]

Average + 1 is better even if only for aesthetic reasons. A barbarian player rolling a 12 will feel fantastic for a while, but when he gets that 1 or 2 or 3 it will sting forever. Human nature treasure lost is more emotionally impactful than treasure gained.

[Lunali]

Average + 1 is better even if only for aesthetic reasons. A barbarian player rolling a 12 will feel fantastic for a while, but when he gets that 1 or 2 or 3 it will sting forever. Human nature treasure lost is more emotionally impactful than treasure gained.

Also, on a less human nature and more statistical side, having more hp is less likely to help you than having less hp is likely to hurt you.

DMs rarely change encounter balance based on character hp, so there will be a rough assumption of having average hp. Being above that amount isn't likely to help you very much as the assumption is that you aren't going to go down with average hp. Being below that can be dangerous.

[Ogre Mage]

I strongly prefer the average +1 and always take it.

[Snails]

Also, on a less human nature and more statistical side, having more hp is less likely to help you than having less hp is likely to hurt you.

DMs rarely change encounter balance based on character hp, so there will be a rough assumption of having average hp. Being above that amount isn't likely to help you very much as the assumption is that you aren't going to go down with average hp. Being below that can be dangerous.

That is true for any PC. A barbarian with averageish HP is doing very well in most fights when Raging. Any shortfall from average is effectively doubled.

Is a huge HP boost doubled, too? Of course, but at some point, enough of your friends will drop that you have many more HP to go might not matter...

[Havrik]

I give my players the choice of rolling for hit points or taking the average, but I make them roll a die and if it is odd they round down and if it's even they round up. So, a fighter going up a level can either roll 1d10 or roll a die and on odd they get 5 and even they get 6. I didn't want to make rolling the obvious bad choice mathematically.

Most of my players take the average, I think 1 out of 4 consistently rolls at each level.

[Keltest]

Pretty much definitionally, average + X will be better than straight rolling over a long enough time, since the rolls will tend to, you guessed it, average out.

HAVING SAID THAT

You only roll 19 times. This is a small enough sample size that you could end up with some pretty significant outliers. 10s and 12s with no corresponding 1s. I had somebody once who couldnt roll below a 7 for their hit die across all 20 levels, on a d8. So ultimately, the real question that you need to answer is: do you feel lucky?

[Kurt Kurageous]

I've never considered AVG+1. I like it.

I currently use a different method.
1. Roll the die
2. HP = the number on the die OR the number on the die subtracted from the maximum value of the HD.

Ex d8. Rolling 1 or 7 = 7, 2 or 6 = 6, 3 or 5 = 5. The worst roll is the roll equal to half the HD.

This almost guarantees above average hit points. I did this early on because I was unsure of how dangerous my encounters would be and wanted to make sure that the players wouldn't fall because of my inexperience.

Seven years later...I still use it because I know the players like it and they don't feel bad about their HP totals. And they won't even think about "if only I'd rolled better for HP."

How about you?

[Slipjig]

I give everybody max hp every time. My logic is that "more hit points" is a class feature for the classes that have it, and it never made sense to me to have this be the only class feature that you can miss out on forever on a single bad die roll. You don't have "a chance of more spell slots (if you roll well)".

[TyGuy]

I wanted my players to have their cake and eat it too. So they can have the excitement of rolling for high numbers, but without the sting of really low rolls. Instead of reroll rules we simply have a safety net for each dice.
A d6 roll of 1 counts as 2.
A d8 roll of 1 or 2 counts as 3.
A d10 roll of 1-3 counts as 4.
A d12 roll of 1-4 counts as 5.

I really like where this ends up mathematically as well.

[Chronos]

Quoth Slipjig:

You don't have "a chance of more spell slots (if you roll well)".
There speaks someone who never played 2nd edition.

[Willie the Duck]

I guess the question becomes: If you choose to roll, and at levels 2 and 3 you roll a 1 and a 4, can you just charge every fight until you die and make a new fighter-barbarian?

I mean, I wouldn't suggest it, but in an optimization discussion it should be mentioned.

[Necrosnoop110]

My DM house-rules: roll or take HD/2, whichever is higher.

[animorte]

I always prefer average+1. Current DM is one that prefers rolled stats but also doesn't allow anything less than 11 (for base stats). This is usually accomplished with 5d6 as opposed to 4d6. He doesn't let any stat pull you down. So speaking to that, the DM always allows rolling with advantage for those.

[JackPhoenix]

I let the players decide if thew want to use use average (+0.5, not 1) or roll. No rerolls, no change of mind if you roll too low, no multiple rolls, hidden or open. You rolled a 1? Well, you've gambled and lost, too bad.