View Full Version : New Guys Questions - Demiplanes and Prismatic Spheres

2007-11-25, 07:07 PM
Ok, I'm pretty much completely new to D&D. I'm far more interested in the magic side of the game(not just because of how powerful it can be).
Recently, since I've started actually reading whatever material I can find/download, I noticed the spell Genesis - a 9th level spell avaliable to Clerics with the Creation Domain that allows them to create a demi-plane.

I was wondering if it is possible for a wizard to replicate this effect without resorting to the unspecified area of 'Wish' - I considered playing a Cleric(air/creation domains) partially for the Genesis spell, but decided the wizards vast array of spells were more to my liking. If there are any ways to do this without wish, I would be very happy but if not I can live with it.

My other question is just on the viability of a specific tactic - namely creating a Prismatic Sphere at the center of a hurricane or tornado strength updraft created by the spell 'Control Winds'.
This would be used as a rather drastic method of crowd control, particularly in a large battle. With the huge wind vortex sucking almost anything towards its center where the Prismatic sphere is waiting to remove anyone who isn't dead by the time they reach it. I was thinking that the updraft - which could have a radius of 800ft(I think) at level 20 - would be large enough to prevent the sphere from being destroyed 1 colour at a time.

Just some random thoughts from a(possible) new player. If anything here is wrong/just plain stupid feel free to tell me. And expect more random questions in the future.

Thanks in advance for any answers.

Azerian Kelimon
2007-11-25, 07:13 PM
Genesis is also a Wizard spell.

The second tactic seems fine, but a prismatic sphere would probably dissipate the 'nado. That's the bummer on it.

2007-11-25, 08:28 PM
Genesis is also a wizard spell? Great - I guess the D&D Wiki is missing some info.

The Sphere would dissipate it? How-so? Because it stops all spells with its Indigo layer? I didn't really think of that, but the tornado can have a calm eye with a radius of as much as 40ft, so you could have the Sphere in a small calm area at the center.

I have another few questions, regarding Symbols of Death/Insanity, if anyone would like to answer.
If a wizard casts permanency on either of these Symbols, does that mean they are permanent(unless they are dispelled) even after being activated, and continue their effects? And would the Symbol of Death still end after killing 150 hit points worth of creatures?

Also (although it would be expensiveand deadly in any public place), could a shield be inscribed with a Symbol of Death set to activate when it is either touched or looked at, and then have permanency cast on the symbol, making the shield very useful for a blind-fighter(or just a careful user)?
Obviously the character wielding the shield would need a very high will/fortitude save depending on which rune was used, and it would still be risky.

Thanks for the quick response Azerian.

Azerian Kelimon
2007-11-25, 08:33 PM
Well, if the eye is big enough, nothing happens. It would be a great killalottaguys combo.

Now, the symbols explicitly say that, if permanenced, a dispel only suppresses them. After exhausting itself of HP, I believe a symbol of Death is inactive for 10 minutes, then logs back on.

The blindfighter tactic would be nice if you had more than 150 HP, seeing how it would affect you anyway if you're in the radius. Else, you'll die when it goes off.

Oh, try googling "D20 SRD". It has info about the spells that might help.

2007-11-25, 08:37 PM
Isn't Genesis an epic-level spell for wizards?

Azerian Kelimon
2007-11-25, 08:40 PM
Conjuration (Creation)
Level: Sor/Wiz 9, Creation 9
Components: V, S, M, XP
Casting Time: 1 week (8 hours/day)
Range: 180 ft. (see text)
Effect: A demiplane coterminous with the Ethereal Plane, centered on your location
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No

The spellcaster creates a finite plane with limited access: a demiplane. Demiplanes created by this power are very small, very minor planes.

A character can only cast this spell while on the Ethereal Plane. When he or she casts the spell, a local density fluctuation precipitates the creation of a demiplane. At first, the fledgling plane grows at a rate of 1 foot in radius per day to an initial maximum radius of 180 feet as it rapidly draws substance from surrounding ethereal vapors and protomatter.

The spellcaster determines the environment within the demiplane when he or she first casts genesis, reflecting most any desire the spellcaster can visualize. The spellcaster determines factors such as atmosphere, water, temperature, and the general shape of the terrain. This spell cannot create life (including vegetation), nor can it create construction (such as buildings, roads, wells, dungeons, and so forth). The spellcaster must add these things in some other fashion if he or she desires. Once the basic demiplane reaches its maximum size, the spellcaster can continue to cast this spell to enlarge the demiplane, adding another 180 feet of radius to the demiplane each time.

Material Component
A crystalline sphere

XP Cost
5,000 XP.

It's listed with the epic spells, but it's nonepic.

2007-11-25, 08:56 PM
It originally was a psionic power in the XPH, then it got moved around. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/genesis.htm)

Also, the origin of the tronado would have to be outside the sphere, otherwise it wouldn't work at all.

2007-11-25, 09:37 PM
The Wiki takes atleast some of its information from the SRD website, including the spell lists, so either the wiki or both SRD and the wiki are out of date.

Having over 150 health when using the symbol of death would be good, but a really nice fortitude save bonus could keep you safe aswell.
I'm guessing being on the safe side of a big shield wouldn't help too much if you had a few explosive rune notes on it that you detonated via a failed dispell attempt? Just some random thoughts.

For the eye, I was thinking a radius of just barely over 10 feet, just enough to not be touching the sphere.
And as for the tornados origin being outside the sphere? Well, you could always cast the tornado first, you could probably get the Prismatic Sphere up before any enemies got sucked into the middle. Or you could just fly above the sphere and cast Control Winds from there.

Also, the control winds spell would need to be cast(as a wizard atleast) via limited wish, due to it being a level 5 druid spell/cleric air domain spell.

Even though it could be cheesy(depending on how you use it), you can decide how fast/slow time flows on the demiplane you create via Genesis(but not chance it after creation, as far as I can tell), correct?
And, although you can't have life or construction, you can still make it have materials, can't you? And could you cast a gate spell leading to your demi-plane and force an enemy through it(either by pushing or with spells)?

Thanks alot for all the help, guys. It's greatly appreciated.

2007-11-25, 11:28 PM
The spellcaster must add these things in some other fashion if he or she desires.This sentence strikes me as vaguely humorous... Anyone wizard capable of casting ninth-level spells is going to be able to add life or construction to his plane a heck of a lot more easily than creating the plane in the first place.

Having over 150 health when using the symbol of death would be good, but a really nice fortitude save bonus could keep you safe aswell.Risky. No matter how good your save bonuses are, a natural 1 on the roll is always a failed save. And this symbol is probably going to get activated a lot more than 20 times.
I'm guessing being on the safe side of a big shield wouldn't help too much if you had a few explosive rune notes on it that you detonated via a failed dispell attempt? Just some random thoughts.Also risky. Unlike some spell traps, Explosive Runes explicitly damages the thing it was inscribed on, as well as the victim, so it'd probably blast through your shield. And the blast radius is pretty small, so there's a good chance that whoever you were fighting would be too far away to be affected.

2007-11-26, 12:26 AM
Um, there's a much safer way to have a Symbol of Death on your shield and not be affected by it:

You also can attune any number of creatures to the symbol of death, but doing this can extend the casting time. Attuning one or two creatures takes negligible time, and attuning a small group (as many as ten creatures) extends the casting time to 1 hour. Attuning a large group (as many as twenty-five creatures) takes 24 hours. Attuning larger groups takes proportionately longer. Any creature attuned to a symbol of death cannot trigger it and is immune to its effects, even if within its radius when triggered. You are automatically considered attuned to your own symbols of death, and thus always ignore the effects and cannot inadvertently trigger them.Although I would recommend one of the other symbols, since Death's hit point limit can occasionally be limiting. I would also combine at least two symbols, one to hit will saves, one to hit fort saves.

For example, Symbol of Insanity for the will save (though mind-affecting) and Symbol of Weakness for the fort save (most things will be incapacitated by 3d6 strength damage). Both have no HD or HP limit.

Also, the main weakness of this strategy is dispels. They can still be dispelled, and then you're out a massive amount of XP.