Potential Sorlock options?

[ThaddeusJenkins]

I'm currently playing an 8th level Aberrant Mind Sorcerer in a long running campaign, which has been a ton of fun, but i'm looking at adding something to it for a bit of flavour. Sorcerer doesn't get a lot of interesting stuff at this stage except more spells.

Warlock would make a lot of sense with her background and obviously on paper they go great together, but it would be great to get some ideas.

Hexblade is the obvious choice for taking Shield and using Hexblade Curse with spells like Magic Missile. But I already have 18 DEX (Good stat rolls), so the medium armour and CHA-based attacks are wasted. Otherwise, I can see Celestial being really useful for some good healing support, or maybe even Genie for the lamp utility.

Is it better to take the 1 level or go to 2 for invocations? I feel like getting free Mage Armor or Detect Magic etc are worth it, but it delays getting the next sorcerer ability (which seems really useful too), as well as impacting spell progression.

For context if it's needed, I serve as the party's blaster (and magical utility since our Wizard left), and i managed to find a Bloodwell Vial so i'm not likely to be casting many offensive spells from the Warlock list if I can help it.

[RogueJK]

Hexblade is the obvious choice for taking Shield and using Hexblade Curse with spells like Magic Missile. But I already have 18 DEX (Good stat rolls), so the medium armour and CHA-based attacks are wasted. Otherwise, I can see Celestial being really useful for some good healing support, or maybe even Genie for the lamp utility.

Hexblade's Medium Armor might not be that useful to you in light of your high DEX, but the +2 AC from wielding a shield very well could be.

Celestial's Healing Light is a great ability, but it relies on Warlock levels. So if you're only going to be taking 1 or 2 levels of Warlock, then you'll only have 2d6/3d6 of healing per day. That's perhaps better than nothing as emergency backup healing (especially if the Party Healer is the one who goes down), but healing 7-10 HP per day is not much at Level 10+.


Don't overlook Fathomless or Undead. Either one gets you a useful Bonus Action ability, and most Sorcerers don't have many use for their BAs besides burning Sorcery Points on Quickened Spell (at least until 14th level). Fathomless gets you a Spiritual Weapon-style BA attack and movement debuff, plus the utility of a swim speed and water breathing. Undead gets you a BA transformation for a little Temp HP and the ability to repeatedly inflict a non-Concentration Frightened debuff (provided you're making frequent attack rolls like with Eldritch Blast).

And daily uses of either one of those two abilities scales with Proficiency, not Warlock level.


Great Old One offers a bit less overall compared to Hexblade/Fathomless/Undead, but is thematically appropriate for an Aberrant Mind Sorcerer, and it gets you a beefed up Telepathy that lets you mentally speak at-will to a nearby creature even if you don't share a language. Whereas your existing Telepathy from Aberrant Mind is longer-ranged, but has the restriction that you have to both know the same language.


So my vote for Warlock dip subclass probably goes to Hexblade, with GOO or Fathomless as close runner-ups.


Is it better to take the 1 level or go to 2 for invocations? I feel like getting free Mage Armor or Detect Magic etc are worth it, but it delays getting the next sorcerer ability (which seems really useful too), as well as impacting spell progression.

Depends on what exactly you're wanting. If it's just the extra +1 to AC from Mage Armor over Light Armor, it's definitely not worth it. But if you plan to make frequent use of Eldritch Blast, for example, then going to Warlock 2 for Agonizing Blast and Repelling Blast is absolutely worth it. Or if you find yourself frequently sneaking around and disguising yourself, then Mask of Many Faces might be worth it.

Something like Mask of Many Faces and Misty Visions adds a lot of creative utility, and both seem appropriate for an Aberrant Mind Sorcerer/Warlock who likes to mess with people's minds.

Also keep in mind that you could potentially take just 1 level of Warlock and then take the Eldritch Adept feat at your next ASI, to pick up an Invocation.

[bsullivanp]

I'm currently playing an 8th level Aberrant Mind Sorcerer in a long running campaign, which has been a ton of fun, but i'm looking at adding something to it for a bit of flavour. Sorcerer doesn't get a lot of interesting stuff at this stage except more spells.

Warlock would make a lot of sense with her background and obviously on paper they go great together, but it would be great to get some ideas.

Hexblade is the obvious choice for taking Shield and using Hexblade Curse with spells like Magic Missile. But I already have 18 DEX (Good stat rolls), so the medium armour and CHA-based attacks are wasted. Otherwise, I can see Celestial being really useful for some good healing support, or maybe even Genie for the lamp utility.

Is it better to take the 1 level or go to 2 for invocations? I feel like getting free Mage Armor or Detect Magic etc are worth it, but it delays getting the next sorcerer ability (which seems really useful too), as well as impacting spell progression.

For context if it's needed, I serve as the party's blaster (and magical utility since our Wizard left), and i managed to find a Bloodwell Vial so i'm not likely to be casting many offensive spells from the Warlock list if I can help it.

I am literally going through the EXACT same situation and debate myself. I too am an 8th level AM Sorcerer in a long running campaign, who is also looking to potentially MC into Warlock.

For me, I am leaning toward Undead for flavor (its a Strahd/Homebrew campaign to level 20), and am the only true blaster in the party (other casters are a cleric and a moon druid). I don't know if you feel the same, but it seems like a balance between free/cheap direct damage vs. a much slower and less potent magic caster. I have never played a high tier game so no idea what the two level delay FEELS like in end game (say getting Wish at lvl 19 instead of 17, but that really applies to all high level spells).

I also pause with the spell slot totals. It sounds great to have two 1st level spells at SR (assuming 2 levels in Warlock), but we'd be giving up a 6th AND 7th level spell slots in exchange at high level. So unless my math is wrong, that would be giving up 13 Sorcery Points per long rest, meaning you would have to take over 6 SRs per day to make it work out. Right? Combined with the loss of direct sorcery points due to the two fewer Sorcerer levels, and the math doesn't add up.

But knowing that this isn't all about math, its about what's the most fun, I too would love to hear from others who went this route. Is it FUN? Do you feel underpowered in long campaigns?

[ThaddeusJenkins]

I am literally going through the EXACT same situation and debate myself. I too am an 8th level AM Sorcerer in a long running campaign, who is also looking to potentially MC into Warlock.
Ah, hello me :smallbiggrin:

I've honestly managed to completely miss Undead, but looking it up that sounds really cool. Honestly anything to use bonus actions is great though, I do admittedly burn most of my Sorcery Points on Quicken.

For levels, I think delaying the multiclass until level 10 might be a good idea, because the 5th level spell slot also comes with some nice magic for the Aberrant Mind. But for one level in Warlock I would be hard pressed to argue it affects spell progression too badly. With two levels you're technically correct in the math, but in practice unless you're hyper-optimising your Sorcery Points idk if it will change much at the highest tier. I'm more concerned with how long it takes to get to those abilities than what the end result will look like, honestly.


Celestial's Healing Light is a great ability, but it relies on Warlock levels. So if you're only going to be taking 1 or 2 levels of Warlock, then you'll only have 2d6/3d6 of healing per day.
That's a great point that I missed. Cure Wounds would be the best we're getting out of this one then, which is a shame.

Honestly I was going to skip out on Eldritch Blast. It's a fantastic spell but I don't want to fall on the crutch. As far as infusions go I'd be more torn between Detect Magic, Eldritch Mind for the constitution saves, Devil's Sight, and Misty Visions for Silent Image. Mask of Many Faces might not do me much good because i'm playing a goblin and there's only so much taller I can pretend to be :smallbiggrin:

[bsullivanp]

Honestly I was going to skip out on Eldritch Blast. It's a fantastic spell but I don't want to fall on the crutch. As far as infusions go I'd be more torn between Detect Magic, Eldritch Mind for the constitution saves, Devil's Sight, and Misty Visions for Silent Image. Mask of Many Faces might not do me much good because i'm playing a goblin and there's only so much taller I can pretend to be :smallbiggrin:

I have been reading that Repelling Blast is a very underrated and potent additional reason to get Eldritch Blast (in addition to the obvious Agonizing Blast). At least with Undead subclass, but I think it has usefulness beyond that.

The ability to push an NPC 10 FEET each time they are hit means that you could potentially push someone back 40 feet per turn from level 5 and 60 feet per turn at level 11 with a quickened EB. Coupled that with the Undead Fear ability in Form of Dread, and they can't move back toward you, both taking them out of melee range of yourself and your party, and potentially causing them to have to waste additional turns to dash away and then back again after fear wears off. All for the low low price of 2 sorcery points!

That feels to me like a huge win. Adding on Hunger of Hadar or Evard's Black Tentacles from the Aberrant psionic list and you could see a scenario where you are constantly pushing NPCs back into those AOEs on a consistent basis to take additional damage and reduced movement.

[animorte]

Yes, Repelling Blast is wonderful. No save, no size limit, no prerequisites other than beating their AC. It's exceptional especially if you have (or create your own) environmental hazards to keep pushing your enemies into. That being said, you will only have one ray unless you Quicken, etc. The free push is worth keeping in mind if you don't have something better to do with that action.

Most of this has been said before:
- My favorite personally is Genie Warlock. The vessel is fantastic and you get additional damage once per turn. Both of these scale with proficiency as well.
- Undead would be my next choice for this. The additional survivability and crowd control are both worth taking into account.
- I would not recommend Hexblade. Most of its benefits you likely won't be using.

Notable Invocations (some more situational than others):
- Devil's Sight
- Eldritch Mind
- Eldritch Sight
- Mask of Many Faces
- Misty Visions
- Repelling Blast

Other notes on an unlikely 3-level dip:
- Level 3 for the pact options can be useful (but that's for you to decide for dipping worth)
- Rebuke of the Talisman invocation would be useful for punishing enemies for getting close to you, uses reaction.
- Book of Ancient Secrets gives you some rather neat ritual casting.
- Voice of the Chain Master can be a super useful tool (also awesome familiar).

[Hael]

Hexblade and Genie will give you the most net damage (hexblade more than Genie as a sorlock), and the Hexblade gives you a shield. So its obviously the optimal class. Having said that, its also been done a thousand times.

None of the others are really good. The BA on fathomless is not great for a high lvl sorceror at this point in the game. You will have plenty of uses for BA via quickening spells as you have a lot of sorcery points and a lot of slots to burn.

The undead is ok. The problem is you start hitting a lot of frighten immune creatures, and the temphp is too little at this point in the game.
Fiend is meh for the same reason as the temp hp scales with warlock lvl.

Given all of that, I would pick Genie.