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Toliudar
2007-11-28, 12:53 PM
Hi folks,

I'm working on a druid 5, probably human, focused on mounted combat, riding his animal companion (either a heavy horse or bison, probably) into most battles. These are the givens. I understand that this is not necessarily the most optimized druid, and am fine with that.

However, I would like to make sure I can contribute in a significant way, so:

Assuming 4 (maybe 5, if I take a flaw) feats, what would you do with feat and weapon selection to optimize this build.

Shishnarfne
2007-11-28, 01:02 PM
Just taking the mounted combat feats can make you fairly scary in melee. Mounted Combat, Ride-by Attack, and Spirited Charge make a nice trio. Power Attack (and your favorite Druidic 2-handed weapon) makes it dish out a lot more damage in a hurry. As long as you can fit your mount into wherever you're fighting, you'll be able to dish out a fair bit of damage.
If you can't get your mount into the dungeon with you, you're still a full caster, so I wouldn't worry too much about helping.

Vasdenjas
2007-11-28, 05:29 PM
One fun concept I've thought of in the past is to have a Druid/Wizard/Arcane Heirophant (from Races of the Wild). This beefs up your Animal Companion with Int, ability to speak (and learn some skills with the Int skill points, like a knowledge skill you lack), SR (albiet not that great of an SR), deliver touch spells, etc. If you build it right (Dr 7/Wiz 3/ArcH 10) you can cast 9th level Druid spells still, plus level 7 Wiz spells. Oh, plus you can cast arcane spells with Druid armor on.

This adds a bit of MAD, but not too much. Focus on Int and Wis, get Mounted Combat. If you want to supplement with Mounted Archery, you can get Zen Archery if you gimp your Dex. Also Mounted Casting from the Miniatures Handbook can help with your Concentration checks, but since you'll be maxxing out Conc anyways, you may be ok still. This will give you good mobility on the battlefield and you can move-cast without problems all day long.

Also, since this build is more caster than physical, you can go Halfling, and get a Medium-szied mount, and have no problems getting into dungeons and such with your mount.

On the other hand, if you are more focused on being a medium-sized charger, then it's best to go with Prestige classes that happen to drop caster-levels, which isn't great, but some of them stack with a Paladin's Special Mount, so you can talk to your DM about letting them stack with animal companion as well. It makes sense to me. These would be Cavalier, and Wild Plains Outrider.

Otheriwse, Shishnarfe's ideas work good for a straight Druid-mounted combatist. :smallsmile:

ocato
2007-11-28, 06:01 PM
Personally, I would suggest being a halfling and taking a Dire Hawk(MM2) companion companion. Take Mounted Combat, ride-by attack, and spirited charge, and you can pretty much do flying hit-n-runs with a spear. At a higher level grab natural bond and the Dire Hawk will be your friend until a pretty high level probably.

littlechicory
2007-11-28, 07:38 PM
Personally, I would suggest being a halfling and taking a Dire Hawk(MM2) companion companion. Take Mounted Combat, ride-by attack, and spirited charge, and you can pretty much do flying hit-n-runs with a spear. At a higher level grab natural bond and the Dire Hawk will be your friend until a pretty high level probably.

If said halfling takes Mounted Archery at some point, he/she can prestige into halfling outrider. Then it can REALLY be hit-and-run.

Chronos
2007-11-28, 07:45 PM
Or you could get a gorilla for your companion, wildshape into a horse, and train it to ride you. I mean, if you're going to be a druid anyway.

Stephen_E
2007-11-28, 08:13 PM
With your selected mounts of choice I'd recommend taking a boost up for your Animal Companion.

Hv Warhorse - Take 1 level of Beastmaster, needs Skill Focus-Animal Handling as a prereq feat. Adds +3 to your Druid level for calculating AComp bonuses, i.e. +2HD, +2NAC, +1 Str/Dex, +1 Trick.

Bison - Take the Natural Bond feat - Comp Adven. You can use this feat to pay for the -3 lev adj to your Druid lev for Bison.

Wildplains Outrider (comp adven) is specifically designed to work with animal companions, and stacks with your Druid levels for calculating AC bonuses. It requires Mounted Combat and Track as prereqs. It's a 3 lev class that allows a full melee attack if your mount moves a single move or less. If your DM rounds up when 1/2ing Ranger levs for AC purposes, and you have Ranger or Druid as your favoured class (i.e 1/2 Elf, Human or houserule) you should definitely take 1 lev of Ranger, otherwise only do it if you really want the extra feat.

The Spirited charge stuff has already been mentioned.

Leadership. There are rules in the DMG, pg 200, for allowing a Paladin to combine his Special Mount with his follower from the Leadership feat. Talk to your DM as to whether he/she will allow this. This will potenially allow your AC to gain class levels. Scout, Barbarian and Fighter would be my recommended choices.

Equipment: Horseshoes of Zephyr. If you can, pay to get them combined with Horseshoes of speed, but 1st and formost get horseshoes of zephyr. For a combat mount they're essential as a magic weapon is for a fighter. Allows your mount to move over any liquid or solid surface with perfect footing leaving no tracks. Yes, you can charge over water, lava, or most broken ground because you're actually 4"s above the ground.
Don't forget Barding for your Mount, but check with your DM as to making your Mount proficient. The books don't cover this well, but you should be able to do it at the cost of a trick or two, depending on what level of barding you're looking at. I'd reccommend only light, but you might want to go the Mithral Fullplate approach. The GM may go for it simply because it'll suck large amounts of cash of you.

Weapons - Use your Flameblade spell, especially with Metamagic Empower rods (9,000gp). Touch Attack for (1d8 + CL/2)*1.5 from empower. This may make it worth taking 2 levs of Ranger. Also see how your DM feels about you creating a new spell - Flamelance. Maybe increasing the spell lev to 3rd.

Human would be my recommended race. You'll want the bonus feat.

The Arcane Heriophant is indeed a strong build, but it's one where you're relying more on your mount and the magical boosts you can do on it, than your own combat prowess. I'm not sure this is what you want.

Hope this helps.

ocato
2007-11-28, 11:39 PM
Personally, I would suggest being a halfling and taking a Dire Hawk(MM2) companion companion. Take Mounted Combat, ride-by attack, and spirited charge, and you can pretty much do flying hit-n-runs with a spear. At a higher level grab natural bond and the Dire Hawk will be your friend until a pretty high level probably.

I'd like to apologize, I confused the Dire Hawk (mm2) with the Dire Eagle (Races of Stone). I don't think the Dire Hawk can be taken as an animal companion, but the Dire Eagle can. It is also large sized, making it compatible with medium size for pretty much the same set up. The Dire Bat is a suitable core replacement. Martial Weapon Proficiency: Lance wouldn't hurt either.

daggaz
2007-11-29, 12:05 AM
Or you could get a gorilla for your companion, wildshape into a horse, and train it to ride you. I mean, if you're going to be a druid anyway.

Oh seriously man, i fell of my chair. God, can I please sig this?

Darkxarth
2007-11-29, 12:25 AM
Speaking of Druids and Animal Companions...

- Level 4 Druid, with a Wolf Animal Companion.
- At Druid level 3-5 you advance your animal companion 2 Hit Dice.
- A Wolf starts with 2d8.
- Its advancement says that from 4-6 HD it becomes a Large animal.

So a 4th level Druid would have a Large Wolf that he/she could ride, correct?

Stephen_E
2007-11-29, 12:30 AM
Speaking of Druids and Animal Companions...

- Level 4 Druid, with a Wolf Animal Companion.
- At Druid level 3-5 you advance your animal companion 2 Hit Dice.
- A Wolf starts with 2d8.
- Its advancement says that from 4-6 HD it becomes a Large animal.

So a 4th level Druid would have a Large Wolf that he/she could ride, correct?

Wrong. The FAQ specifically addresses this. The additional HD your AC gets are bonus HD, and while they do 90% of what animal advancement HD do, they don't change the companions size.

Stephen

Darkxarth
2007-11-29, 12:35 AM
Wrong. The FAQ specifically addresses this. The additional HD your AC gets are bonus HD, and while they do 90% of what animal advancement HD do, they don't change the companions size.

Stephen

Bah. Oh well, thanks very much.

Chronos
2007-11-29, 02:40 AM
Oh seriously man, i fell of my chair. God, can I please sig this?I don't think I've ever been sigged before... I'd be flattered.

Toliudar
2007-11-29, 03:19 AM
Thanks, everybody. I've got a lot to think about.

Skjaldbakka
2007-11-29, 03:23 AM
There is a spell in spell compendium that is an immediate action to cast and adds a bunch of fire damage in an area to an attack you make. I played a mounted druid that used this and share spell to good effect. Don't remember the name of the spell. Something Comet, maybe? Meteoric strike? something like that.

come to think of it, probably PHB II.

Just for kicks, I had the animal companion take Awesome Blow when I hit level 20.

Leon
2007-11-29, 03:51 AM
I'd like to apologize, I confused the Dire Hawk (mm2) with the Dire Eagle (Races of Stone). I don't think the Dire Hawk can be taken as an animal companion, but the Dire Eagle can. It is also large sized, making it compatible with medium size for pretty much the same set up. The Dire Bat is a suitable core replacement. Martial Weapon Proficiency: Lance wouldn't hurt either.

The Dire Hawk can Indeed be taken, as a -6 Companion unless your a raptoran where its a -3 Companion

Stephen_E
2007-11-29, 08:42 AM
While I don't have the stats for a Dire Hawk, my bet is that a Dire Bat is better as a mount. This is because Dire Bats are Good Flyers. Anything less than Good flyers can't hover. If you can't hover you're left with ride/fly-by attacks and/or sucking attacks of opportunity when you move away from your opponent, aside from the nusiance of operationg in crowded envioriments. My memory of standard Hawks is that they only have Average flying.

Stephen

Leon
2007-11-29, 09:28 AM
Hawk has Average, the other varibles tip to and fro in regard to whats better, Bat is a large creature and the Hawk a Medium for one

My favour goes to the Hawk as i dont have a Summon Dire bat spell at 2nd level for my Druid unlike Summon Dire Hawk (Even better when buffed)

Stephen_E
2007-11-29, 09:55 AM
Hawk has Average, the other varibles tip to and fro in regard to whats better, Bat is a large creature and the Hawk a Medium for one

My favour goes to the Hawk as i dont have a Summon Dire bat spell at 2nd level for my Druid unlike Summon Dire Hawk (Even better when buffed)

Are you telling me that Summon Dire Hawk is a 1st lev spell?

Personally I find Reduce Animal is fine for getting the DireBat down to M size. Minumal reduction of Str which is the vital stat since a flyer can't fly with more than a light load.

Frankly I can't see how any M sized Average flyer is going to manage flying down 5' wide passages without crashing. Look at the DMG pg20 and you'll see what a problem average flying is. Travel at less than half your normal speed and you fall out of the air. That's a problem! You overrun your party. Want to get back to them? Go in reverse, oops, no, can't do that. Do a 180 turn? oops, can't do that.

Seriously, if your DM has read and decided to use pg 20 of the DMG, and you try flying in combat or an enclosed space without Good+ flight capability, you're screwed.

Stephen

Leon
2007-11-29, 11:20 PM
Are you telling me that Summon Dire Hawk is a 1st lev spell?

Stephen
Haha, oops i meant 2nd Level Spell, sorry i also diverged from the Mount line of thounght into the Summoned Creature line - Late night posts :)

Ethier way i dont tend to think of Mounted Combat indoors regardless of size, so that is open to any discussion

Cuddly
2007-11-30, 12:11 AM
Get ride-by attack, mounted combat, and spirited charge. Get monkey grip. Get a huge club. Turn into a dire ape. Pick up the club. Cast Shillelagh. Cool, now you look really ridiculous, and your club does damage as a colossal weapon.


It's not very optimal.
Proficiency with a lance may be a good choice.

Leon
2007-11-30, 01:49 AM
MWP - Lance
a Wand of Extended Brambles
an Ironwood Lance