this campaign is just too much

[Maus91]

TL;DR I'm playing in a home-brewed, kind of complicated campaign and I'm not keeping up. Don't feel like I can leave because life and friendships.

Several years ago a friend of mine tried to gauge my interest in joining his dnd group, but I had never played before and despite being a fan of fantasy literature generally, I really didn't see the appeal to the game, so he didn't pursue it any further. A few years after that I was going through an emotionally rough patch and this same friend went ahead and invited me to join his group (another member of the group had just moved away) and despite still not getting the game, I felt I really just needed some time away from my issues and felt that entering into a fantasy world with some other dudes for a few hours every week would be a good way to do that, so I took him up on the offer. Of course I ended up really enjoying the game and I've become good friends with the other guys in the group. We have lots of fun playing at the table, but we're also a support to one another in our everyday lives as we deal with work, family, health issues, and whatever else is going on.

To be clear, even though I entered the game mostly just looking for social interaction, I very much enjoy playing the game itself and I have invested a lot of time and energy away from the table reading rules, crunching numbers, reading and posting in forums, trying to optimize characters, watching videos, and generally thinking/talking about dnd. I'm into the game, is what I'm saying. I came into the game as an adult, never having played any RPG before and now we've played through a few campaigns in the years since I've joined and it's been great! Now here's the BUT . . .

Most of the other guys had played when they were much younger, so they are familiar with the earlier editions or the "old ways" as I call them. And I get it, there were some cool mechanics lost, and deeply seated nostalgia puts a shine on all that. So after finishing a campaign, my original friend, who is also the forever DM, asked the group if we would be interested in playing a game based in 5e but that incorporates some previous edition lore and crunchiness in an open world where we could encounter anything. We all agreed that sounded good and we got to playing.

Things started slowly as we were all getting used to the setting and a few added general rules (hi encumbrance!, etc.), and it was fun. The setting really is wide open, with no central plot line, just a lot of threads we come across and pull when we feel like it and those lead to other threads and it just goes on. It's a lot of work for the DM, but he really enjoys the challenge. I feel like he's been building up to this campaign his whole life, and he's doing a great job! We're about a year in, but I find myself just not keeping up.

I can't explain all the quirks of this campaign, but there's one bit that might give you an idea of what I'm dealing with. In between sessions there's a side game some of the group plays through emails and messaging. See, when we clear a dungeon or kill a wizard, we don't just leave the lair/tower to the townsfolk or for another dragon to take over, no, we leave NPCs at each location to clean up the place and defend/manage it for us. So the side game is about what happens at those places. Sometimes our enemies attack them or our PCs go and visit and there are a lot of tables to roll from. It's actually very cool and I WHOLEHEARTEDLY support the existence of this game, but I just don't have time for it myself. This was fine until the stuff that happened in this side game started to have effects on what was going on at the table.

Again, there's a lot going on and I can't explain everything here, but increasingly because of the above and other things, I feel like I'm getting left behind and when I ask for some help in catching up I'm made to feel like a slacker. It has been a running joke during normal campaigns that me and my characters don't know what's going on most of the time, but because there was a central story, it wasn't too hard to figure out. Now with everything so open, I really can't remember what happened 3 sessions ago when we first encountered this random, seemingly insignificant thing and how the side game resolved/complicated the situation and what history this place/NPC has that has been hinted at through the whole campaign and how all that should affect what's happening right now at the table.

And look, I want everyone to have fun so I am not expecting everyone to simplify the game just for me. I totally understand the draw for this kind of complexity, and if I were 15 years old I would be totally geeking out and all in, but I'm, er, older than that and kind of a mess.

You would think I could just take a break until this campaign was over but a couple of problems with that. First, I'm not sure this campaign will ever be over. I think maybe this is just what we do now because our DM is having a GREAT time and could put just about anything into it and he will. Second, I am kind of a mess, as mentioned, and I still need this connection with these guys and this is the vehicle for that connection. And any one session is still filled with good food and drink and lots of laughs, it's just this overarching feeling that I'm disappointing everyone that is irritating. I would miss the good parts terribly if I were to stop going.

So, I'm not even sure if I'm asking for advice or what. I think I just wanted to get it out there.

[Black Jester]

That was an interesting read, thank you for sharing.

Obviously RPGs are first and foremost a social activity, and a part of the fun is spending time with people you can sympathise with.*

Do you think that your fellow players are understanding that you don't have the time/energy to contribute on that level of the game? It might be a good way to handle this by being honest and open about your fear of disappointing the others: Of course, this require a lot of trust to open up, so ... don't do it if you feel uncomfortable, but if your DM specifically tried to invent you to the game in a time when you needed the extra fun time, you can talk to him about it?
In my experience, even if the other players were frustrated with you, it is way easier to be understanding when you understand where the other person is coming from.

One way to create a break, maybe just to make yourself some breathing room (and a distraction from your personal mess - it's escapism, but it can make you feel better anyway) is trying to run your own game, with the same players. Trust me, most DMs long for the sweet, sweet opportunity to pass the heavy crown (so to speak) to the next in line and just enjoy a little bit of freedom and shenanigans before it goes back to the campaign mines.


*: Once you turn "adult", with a real job and long term employment, it becomes quite hard to meet new people, just as potential friends. RPGs are actually one of the very few cultures where it is kinda normalized to meet strangers just because you share some common interests, require each other to pursuit these interests and there is some infrastructure in place where you can find like-minded people. This cozy aspect of RPGs as a rather wholesome community-building activity seems a bit under-appriciated to me.

[KorvinStarmast]

Take notes. Become the 'scribe' for your group. That will get you to keep track of what's going on.

Paragraph 3 of your opening post: that's great. You got to enjoy the game and you have made new friends. Mission accomplished.
About this part.

We're about a year in, but I find myself just not keeping up.
That's not actually a problem. In the group I play in with PhoenixPhyre, I often miss out on some of the plot lines that the other players really get invested in. I don't worry about it, I ask questions for clarification and move on because they catch me up.
Of course, none of them have the capacity to make me feel a lesser person for me asking questions now and again.

{Side game} It's actually very cool and I WHOLEHEARTEDLY support the existence of this game, but I just don't have time for it myself. I am so freaking envious. I wish my normal group on Wednesdays did this. You are so lucky. :smallsmile:


I feel like I'm getting left behind and when I ask for some help in catching up I'm made to feel like a slacker.

Now that's a problem, but telling us about it is useless. You need to use those words and talk to your DM and your fellow players about how you feel that this is harming your fun in the group. They need to quit being {sausages} to you.

Now with everything so open, I really can't remember what happened 3 sessions ago when we first encountered this random, seemingly insignificant thing and how the side game resolved/complicated the situation and what history this place/NPC has that has been hinted at through the whole campaign and how all that should affect what's happening right now at the table. 1. Take notes. 2. Ask the more energetic side questers for summaries, not abuse. That's the problem. They are not keeping you up to date.

First, I'm not sure this campaign will ever be over. I think maybe this is just what we do now because our DM is having a GREAT time and could put just about anything into it and he will. I am envious. :smallsmile:


Second, I am kind of a mess, as mentioned, and I still need this connection with these guys and this is the vehicle for that connection. And any one session is still filled with good food and drink and lots of laughs, it's just this overarching feeling that I'm disappointing everyone that is irritating. I would miss the good parts terribly if I were to stop going. Discuss with the DM, so that he can keep an eye out for people are taking the game for granted.

You've got a good thing. Engage with your fellow players about how much you enjoy playing with them, and how you'd like them to help you help them.

Best wishes, and happy gaming. :smallsmile:

[Easy e]

I also have this issue with my regular in-person group. There are no side games, but a lot of out-of-game texting that I do not follow. When I am not at the table, I am busy doing other things that are also important to me.

For the most part, I don't sweat it. I show up to the game, I play my character to the best of my ability, and have fun. No need to be stressed about it, and if I need to know something about it; someone will tell me about it.

It is only as big of an issue, as you want to make it. If it starts getting in the way of your fun, then it warrants an OOC discussion.

[False God]

I'd take a much more laid back approach.

They're the guys who manage the "operations", you're the guy who does the stuff. If stuff needs done, they need to bring you up to date on whats going on and what they need you to do.

If they can't be bothered or insist you need to "sit in" on their out-of-game conversations, that's a sign you're best off leaving.

If they're willing to support you in your more laid back role while they take the lead in the management domain, I'd say stick around.

But you'll have to be honest and start by telling them you're just not able to keep up due to life/family/other obligations. You want to play, but you just don't have the time and energy outside of the game to engage in this "dungeon management" thing they're doing.

[TyGuy]

Here's my advice.
1) explain honestly and sincerely why you don't want to/ can't do the side-stuff. It is what it is, don't beat around the bush, make lame excuses, or feel like you have to defend yourself in any capacity.
2) ask that the side-stuff participants condense the progress of the side-stuff in a bullet point summary for you. It's fine if they refuse, but then they have no reason to resent your not being up to speed.
3) take the best damn notes you can in sessions. Really push yourself to improve your note taking. Review those notes after the session as soon as time allows. Scan over them just before starting each session.

As a semi forever DM I can't tell you how frustrating it was when my table didn't have one single note taker. Sometimes the group could collectively recall info from weeks ago. Sometimes they brazenly ask me to recount what their character remembers. I made it clear that they're playing their PCs, not me. They're taking notes now. The question "how do you spell that?" and the requests to slow down or repeat myself (for note taking) are music to my ears.

[Sneak Dog]

Take notes. Get a system for it.
For example, it sounds like mostly NPC's are tied to locations? So get a folder, devote a page or half of one per location in the front. In another section keep track of your current adventure, hold more time sensitive notes. Lastly keep track of overarching plots and roaming NPC's in a third section. That should probably suffice.

You could ask for a start-of-session recap. Preferably the GM, so that they could subtly skim over things that probably won't come up and mention things that will. Another player is also fine, involves some more guesswork and doesn't necessarily prime the party for what the GM has prepared, but should still work fine or even great in what appears to be a more open campaign anyway. It helps with jogging one's memory and should (must) not take more than 10 minutes. It's also nice to phase out from the pre-session chat into the actual session and getting people to mentally switch modes.

[KorvinStarmast]

As a semi forever DM I can't tell you how frustrating it was when my table didn't have one single note taker. Amen. Preach it, brother! Even though I usually take notes, and am used to being the scribe in one group, is some groups the utter lack of investment demonstrated (by players who won't take even sparse notes) is a buzz kill, particularly in on line play.

[Maus91]

Thank you all for your encouraging words! I really appreciate you all taking time to thoughtfully offer support. As I was reading over what I wrote and what you guys responded with I am seeing (and some of you definitely already saw) that these are maybe more my issues and how I deal with anxiety and personal relationships than actual external problems about keeping up. Again, I'm a mess, and I have a real problem with situations where I feel like I'm not living up to expectations and letting people down, so that's something I need to address.

Jester - Yes, definitely, this is foremost a social game and I think my group is usually pretty good about prioritizing that. I think a difference with this particular campaign is that my DM kind of put himself in a vulnerable position by entrusting us to play this. I think it's been in his mind for a while and we've all been playing together for years and it's only just now that he finally felt we were at a place where he could share this idea with us and I'm just glad I can be a part of it. His vulnerability also, understandably, came with some expectations that we would all take this seriously and respect his efforts, which we all try to do, but when I can't stay current with what's going on off the table I can see why it might appear that I'm not respecting the campaign. I think I just need to talk and clarify what I can do to make everything work for all of us.

Korvin - Notetaking! Maus's Bane! The sort of funny thing is that I consider myself a bit of a writer, so I don't have a problem with writing. My problem is that I take to long with it trying to figure out the right words and if I take that time I disengage from the game and then I miss more stuff. I think maybe I need to put out a really quick, story of what happened in each session, but I need to do it quickly after the session.
The side game! It is involved, and better than I explained it. PM me if you're interested and I can give you more details. There are spreadsheets!

e - A bit more detail is that I'm not disappointing everyone. There are others in the group not able to keep up with the off the table chatter too, I'm just the worse at compensating. I think I could recruit a sort of spotter from within the group that could help before and maybe even during each session.

False G - Thanks. I hear where you're coming from. I just don't feel I can leave, and that may be its own problem, but that's where I am. I think I can make this work better and I think I really just needed to get these thoughts out there.

Ty - I think the thing that prompted me to write the original post was that at one point I was trying to tell my group about my issues and I felt kind of shot down which was an unexpected and uncharacteristic reaction. I didn't have a response to that because I was kind of shocked. Because of my own issues though, I think maybe I wasn't direct enough and I need to try again.
There is a kind of quick recap of off-the-table stuff at the beginning of each session, but it usually doesn't give the details needed to really understand new things, e.g. Recap: our NPCs at the temple were visited by some dudes and got in a fight and killed some of them and some got away, a few of our troops also died; Session: DM-You round the corner and come to a clearing about 100m across, you see some figures at the far end. PC 1-Are they human and how many? DM-Roll Perception; PC 1-14; DM-Humanoid, maybe a little smaller, you see 5 of them; PC 2-Dwarves? This not good; Me-What?; DM-PC 2, roll Perception; PC 2-19! Can I see what they're wearing?; DM - The sun catches and you see a vaguely star-shaped sparkle hanging from their necks. PC 3-We have to engage them . . .; Me-What? Why?; PC 2-These are the guys who killed Stabby Steve!; Me-Who's Stabby Steve?; PC 1-Stabby Steve who we left in charge of the temple. I nock my bow and whisper "For Steve" . . .; All other PCs also whispering-For Steve; Me-What is happening?!

Sneak - I love your enthusiasm, but there is a LOT going on in this campaign. I really only wrote a small bit of all that's happening. Your advice is sound and I appreciate it, but keeping track of all that stuff in that way is intimidating. Like I mentioned in my first post, if I were younger and had more time, I would be relishing all this. As it is now, though, all that feels beyond me. I may try a modified version of it though.

Thanks again folks! I'm feeling somewhat better now and I think I'll be able to make something work.

[Psyren]

I can't explain all the quirks of this campaign, but there's one bit that might give you an idea of what I'm dealing with. In between sessions there's a side game some of the group plays through emails and messaging. See, when we clear a dungeon or kill a wizard, we don't just leave the lair/tower to the townsfolk or for another dragon to take over, no, we leave NPCs at each location to clean up the place and defend/manage it for us. So the side game is about what happens at those places. Sometimes our enemies attack them or our PCs go and visit and there are a lot of tables to roll from. It's actually very cool and I WHOLEHEARTEDLY support the existence of this game, but I just don't have time for it myself. This was fine until the stuff that happened in this side game started to have effects on what was going on at the table.

Again, there's a lot going on and I can't explain everything here, but increasingly because of the above and other things, I feel like I'm getting left behind and when I ask for some help in catching up I'm made to feel like a slacker. It has been a running joke during normal campaigns that me and my characters don't know what's going on most of the time, but because there was a central story, it wasn't too hard to figure out. Now with everything so open, I really can't remember what happened 3 sessions ago when we first encountered this random, seemingly insignificant thing and how the side game resolved/complicated the situation and what history this place/NPC has that has been hinted at through the whole campaign and how all that should affect what's happening right now at the table.

So it sounds like your campaign has morphed from a straightforward narrative into more of a sandbox, with a lot of revisiting older areas and keeping track of multiple concurrent plots. My understanding is that that's starting to trip you up and you're feeling a little lost.

Assuming I have that right, my question would be - why is it bad that you/your character can't keep up with all the side stuff?

I know a lot of players whose approach to D&D is "My character and I don't really know what's happening, I just let the party point me at whoever we decide the bad guy is as a group." There's nothing wrong with that playstyle, especially if your character isn't the party strategist or face. Relax and enjoy the ride in other words, and don't worry too much about the plotty plot plot stuff. Make it clear to your friends that you're just going to focus on combat and individual RP and take a step back from the big picture stuff, and assuming you're not the guy they look to for that stuff you should be in fine shape.

[Quertus]

We're about a year in, but I find myself just not keeping up.

I feel like I'm getting left behind and when I ask for some help in catching up I'm made to feel like a slacker. It has been a running joke during normal campaigns that me and my characters don't know what's going on most of the time, but because there was a central story, it wasn't too hard to figure out. Now with everything so open, I really can't remember what happened 3 sessions ago when we first encountered this random, seemingly insignificant thing and how the side game resolved/complicated the situation and what history this place/NPC has that has been hinted at through the whole campaign and how all that should affect what's happening right now at the table.

So, I'm not even sure if I'm asking for advice or what. I think I just wanted to get it out there.

Well, I’ve got a few suggestions based on my own experiences, and, senility willing, I’ll circle back and second some of the advice others have given.

#1 talk to the group. If they’re really supportive like you claim, they should be willing to help. However… much like my younger self, they may just not *get* what’s wrong (given “supportive” + “made to feel like a slacker”). So,

#0 make sure that the problem isn’t that you’re a slacker. Yes, yes, *you* may know that you’re not a slacker / that that’s not the problem, but you need to *prove* that to yourself, and *prove* to yourself what the problem is. That way, you’re walking into the conversation prepared. Not “with a chip on your shoulder”, but prepared to talk to people who are themselves coming into the conversation with unhelpful misinterpretations. If you can’t speak effectively to them, don’t bother opening your mouth. Speaking of “prepared”,

#2 ask for a recap at start of session. With emphasis on “what got covered between sessions” and “the details necessary to understand the importance of that”. That should help get you on the same page as the other players. Myself, I’d probably make such a request in terms of both my classic “darn senility”, and a “different people learn better from different techniques - this is the way that is most helpful to me”. (Personally, I *hate* “previously on…” recaps in TV shows, but it seems appropriate here).

#3 don’t care. Ok, don’t take that one seriously. What I really mean is, focus. Quertus, my signature academia mage for whom this account is named, cares about magic. If I forget the Duke’s name, or that he has a niece? Well, I guess it wasn’t important to Quertus. Shrug. But anything magical? No, I’m all over that. And I’ll share my character’s interest, asking things like, “does the casting style indicate that they’ve trained at the local academy, or elsewhere? What’s the state of their component pouch, and the components they used? Is the wear on their robes consistent with the movements necessary for the level and type of spells they’ve demonstrated, or are they holding back?” Etc.

In short, understand exactly what the problem is, and how to communicate it to their frame of mind. Look at all the ideas that we submit and that you develop, and choose a few as suggestions for your group, choosing both ones that they can help you with (like “recap”) (to help them be invested in your success), and ones you can handle on your own (like “character focus”) (that demonstrate that you’re not a slacker, and are invested in both your own improvement, and the campaign).

[Melayl]

If you're having trouble keeping up with writing notes *during* the game, you can record the audio (on your phone, laptop, e-recorder, etc), and go through it more thoroughly later. If you have time to do so, that is...